Nightsister Zombie Rework: Begone Paper, Hello Fat [MEGA]

Replies

  • ThePegasus1979
    19 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    DyloBin wrote: »
    Hmm seems that neither CG nor a rather big part of the community understands the NS strats for Sithraid. Neither P3 nor P4 depend on a paper-Zombie. On the opposite, for P3 a fat-Zombie is preferred. Just made a P3 run with my NS team after the update and scored 21 mio dmg (level 5 of the raid). It took a bit longer to get 2 NS killed, but the 100% speed bonus for Zombie over-compensated it. P4 has zero dependency on Zombie, it’s about Bonds of Weakness+healing+turnmeter synergy. With the healing for the team on the changed 1st special of Zombie, dmg will improve, not drop.

    Would you mind sharing your gears and Speeds for your team in P3? You got about 5 million more than my best run and I want it now haha

    Talzin + Asajj + Daka at Gear 12 maxed out, all zetas, at least +80 speed. Zombie gear 9 blank, +101 speed, Initiate at gear and lvl just good enough to max out the skill upgrades/omega. Modwise (for Initiate) crit CHANCE triangle, 3 crit chance mod sets, as few additional health as possible, 0 additional protection. In general for the other 4 0 additional protection, speed/offense/crit/health for secs and primes.
  • DyloBin wrote: »
    kalidor wrote: »
    Just did p4 with zzasajj, daka, mt, talia and g8, 0 omega zombie (previously started old raid). Did a touch less damage than usual (-8%) but wasn't the greatest of runs either. Nih basic not lowering his cooldowns is definitely a welcome change.

    One thing I noticed is that the stacking speed buff, which is supposed to increase at the beginning ofher turn, doesn't always increase. I've taken several turns in a row where she stayed at +0% or +50%. Seemed very inconsistent, and not sure if it's a bug or if TM gain somehow doesn't count, or something else. (No,she didn't die in between) A little puzzling, but easy to keep a g8 zombie alive until enrage regardless.

    Did she take damage between the turns? The speed stack only happens if she took damage. If so, then yeah that would be a bug to report. I didn't see her miss any on my run in P2.

    No Daka Zeta, No TM control. Also NS gain speed from health qhich she is designed to give the entire team, but within that raid, causes a larger problem, keeping her alive. A Zombie that you have to keep alive! I digress, anyway. She will need to be hitting oftem to keep her TM up so much speed is needed
    She will recieve percentage from either Talzin, or Ventress which ever. But she need to be fast & if Not G10 for revival upgrade (making that basically an oxymoron, a g10 Tank that you have to try & make die easily) she will easily be put in a basic trans after speed reaches -100 2×.
  • DyloBin wrote: »
    Hmm seems that neither CG nor a rather big part of the community understands the NS strats for Sithraid. Neither P3 nor P4 depend on a paper-Zombie. On the opposite, for P3 a fat-Zombie is preferred. Just made a P3 run with my NS team after the update and scored 21 mio dmg (level 5 of the raid). It took a bit longer to get 2 NS killed, but the 100% speed bonus for Zombie over-compensated it. P4 has zero dependency on Zombie, it’s about Bonds of Weakness+healing+turnmeter synergy. With the healing for the team on the changed 1st special of Zombie, dmg will improve, not drop.

    Would you mind sharing your gears and Speeds for your team in P3? You got about 5 million more than my best run and I want it now haha

    Talzin + Asajj + Daka at Gear 12 maxed out, all zetas, at least +80 speed. Zombie gear 9 blank, +101 speed, Initiate at gear and lvl just good enough to max out the skill upgrades/omega. Modwise crit CHANCE triangle, 3 crit chance mod sets, as few additional health as possible, 0 additional protection.

    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
  • DyloBin wrote: »
    Hmm seems that neither CG nor a rather big part of the community understands the NS strats for Sithraid. Neither P3 nor P4 depend on a paper-Zombie. On the opposite, for P3 a fat-Zombie is preferred. Just made a P3 run with my NS team after the update and scored 21 mio dmg (level 5 of the raid). It took a bit longer to get 2 NS killed, but the 100% speed bonus for Zombie over-compensated it. P4 has zero dependency on Zombie, it’s about Bonds of Weakness+healing+turnmeter synergy. With the healing for the team on the changed 1st special of Zombie, dmg will improve, not drop.

    Would you mind sharing your gears and Speeds for your team in P3? You got about 5 million more than my best run and I want it now haha

    I just hit 14.9 mil on a bad run last night & I do not use Paper Zombie either.
  • DyloBin
    46 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    Pan2218 wrote: »
    DyloBin wrote: »
    Hmm seems that neither CG nor a rather big part of the community understands the NS strats for Sithraid. Neither P3 nor P4 depend on a paper-Zombie. On the opposite, for P3 a fat-Zombie is preferred. Just made a P3 run with my NS team after the update and scored 21 mio dmg (level 5 of the raid). It took a bit longer to get 2 NS killed, but the 100% speed bonus for Zombie over-compensated it. P4 has zero dependency on Zombie, it’s about Bonds of Weakness+healing+turnmeter synergy. With the healing for the team on the changed 1st special of Zombie, dmg will improve, not drop.

    Would you mind sharing your gears and Speeds for your team in P3? You got about 5 million more than my best run and I want it now haha

    I just hit 14.9 mil on a bad run last night & I do not use Paper Zombie either.

    We have similar numbers. I usually get around 15-16 million on a typical run in T5 with my G8 Zombie. But I anticipate my numbers dropping a bit since I decided to go for G10 and Omega-ing her new Unique. The best result for P3 would be either keeping her at G9 or taking her to G10 and not leveling her Unique so the revives are super low health and you can kill them off quickly. At least from just reading the changed kit.
  • ThePegasus1979
    19 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzin lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya. Thanks to the hmm 418 speed of Zombie (209 base +100% stack due to the new changes) those Asajj moves didn’t break the turnmeter train. As said, CG almost has zero understanding of the SR NS mechanics.
    Post edited by ThePegasus1979 on
  • Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?
  • I just fought the same NS team twice to gauge their effectiveness. From a PVP perspective, they are deadlier than they were. I normally railroad most NS teams with EP, but because of the new mechanics Plague became a major issue. The team was able to beat me the first time due to toons being weakened by plague and revivals from basics. The second time I managed to win, but plague was still an issue.

    Looks like they definitely received a buff in PVP.
  • Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    The mechanic of Death Storm involves Talzin and another Nightsister dying over and over. Having a tanky Zombie doesn't affect that at all, and in fact helps keep Daka and Ventress protected while they stack their health and damage respectively.
  • HK22 wrote: »
    I just fought the same NS team twice to gauge their effectiveness. From a PVP perspective, they are deadlier than they were. I normally railroad most NS teams with EP, but because of the new mechanics Plague became a major issue. The team was able to beat me the first time due to toons being weakened by plague and revivals from basics. The second time I managed to win, but plague was still an issue.

    Looks like they definitely received a buff in PVP.

    Most people didn’t farm these toons for pvp they got farmed for the raid and for Tb. They aren’t on my list for pvp.
  • ThePegasus1979
    19 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    As you might have figured out for sure at this point, i am not a native speaker, so i don’t know what „shot out of the water“ means. My guess is „trying to „fix“/nerf something and because someone doesn’t know how it works, he achieves the opposite“: yes, actually if ppl do upgrade, or not upgrade, the new skill, you will see much higher numbers by every player who understands the mechanics of NS in P3 and P4 of the SR.

    I always wished that Zombie‘s first special would heal the team (especially for P4), as that would soloing P4 much easier. And CG „nerf“...introduces exact that feature. A clearer sign of pure and utter incompetence of understanding the own product has not been seen in the software industry for decades.
  • Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    As you might have figured out for sure at this point, i am not a native speaker, so i don’t know what „shot out of the water“ means. My guess is „trying to „fix“/nerf something and because someone doesn’t know how it works, he achieves the opposite“: yes, actually if ppl do upgrade, or not upgrade, the new skill, you will see much higher numbers by every player who understands the mechanics of NS in P3 and P4 of the SR.
    You said your zombie never died. If it never dies than the mechanic which drives the night sisters being deaths on the field is basically ruined. If your zombie didn’t die then the Nightsisters as a faction received a nerf due to this rework.
  • DyloBin
    46 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    As you might have figured out for sure at this point, i am not a native speaker, so i don’t know what „shot out of the water“ means. My guess is „trying to „fix“/nerf something and because someone doesn’t know how it works, he achieves the opposite“: yes, actually if ppl do upgrade, or not upgrade, the new skill, you will see much higher numbers by every player who understands the mechanics of NS in P3 and P4 of the SR.
    You said your zombie never died. If it never dies than the mechanic which drives the night sisters being deaths on the field is basically ruined. If your zombie didn’t die then the Nightsisters as a faction received a nerf due to this rework.

    No, he is saying he intentionally made decisions to keep his Zombie alive so as to best maintain her stacking speed and not deal with loss of speed. AND likely to soak up Isolate. Talzin and Initiate still continued to die over and over to benefit the team and maintain deaths and revives powering the Nightsisters.
  • @CG_TopHat or whoever. Does the damage from stacks of pain in p4 equate to +50% speed, assuming zombie doesn’t suffer a death, at the start of her next turn?
  • ThePegasus1979
    19 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    You said your zombie never died. If it never dies than the mechanic which drives the night sisters being deaths on the field is basically ruined. If your zombie didn’t die then the Nightsisters as a faction received a nerf due to this rework.

    Nope, P3 done right always relied on Zombie NOT dying but soaking up Isolation reliably. P3, done right, relies on everyone dying fast besides Asajj, Zombie and Daka. With the changes: just don’t get fooled/trapped by the new special. ;) P4...nope, never was about Zombie dying. Zombie dying helped, but was not even close to be a relevant part of the soloing strat. The changes with speed up massively fuels up P3 strat, and the team heal on the first special massively fuels up the P4 strat.
  • yohann269 wrote: »
    Pan2218 wrote: »
    yohann269 wrote: »
    WOW. Just came on a few minutes ago and there were 205 comments from when I last checked THIS MORNING!! You guys need to calm down a bit and just wait for the rework to happen and try it instead of blowing up a chat with either positive or negative comments.

    I agree

    Why would you wait for what you know? All of the information anybody that uses them for the STR should know by reading & time spent in game. & dont try to tell me to enjoy my cherrios while everybody else is eating coco puffs! No do not tell people to calm down!!! This is flat insult

    you have no idea what you are talking about :)

    Apparently somebody doesnt. But go ahead guy, what's up then? Bring it, what exactly don't I know?
  • DyloBin wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    As you might have figured out for sure at this point, i am not a native speaker, so i don’t know what „shot out of the water“ means. My guess is „trying to „fix“/nerf something and because someone doesn’t know how it works, he achieves the opposite“: yes, actually if ppl do upgrade, or not upgrade, the new skill, you will see much higher numbers by every player who understands the mechanics of NS in P3 and P4 of the SR.
    You said your zombie never died. If it never dies than the mechanic which drives the night sisters being deaths on the field is basically ruined. If your zombie didn’t die then the Nightsisters as a faction received a nerf due to this rework.

    No, he is saying he intentionally made decisions to keep his Zombie alive so as to best maintain her stacking speed and not deal with loss of speed. Talzin and Initiate still continued to die over and over to benefit the team and maintain deaths and revives powering the Nightsisters.

    From what he said it looks like it didn’t work that way at all I think you’d better reread it because he’s saying that CG has no understanding of the mechanics
  • Pan2218 wrote: »
    yohann269 wrote: »
    Pan2218 wrote: »
    yohann269 wrote: »
    WOW. Just came on a few minutes ago and there were 205 comments from when I last checked THIS MORNING!! You guys need to calm down a bit and just wait for the rework to happen and try it instead of blowing up a chat with either positive or negative comments.

    I agree

    Why would you wait for what you know? All of the information anybody that uses them for the STR should know by reading & time spent in game. & dont try to tell me to enjoy my cherrios while everybody else is eating coco puffs! No do not tell people to calm down!!! This is flat insult

    you have no idea what you are talking about :)

    Apparently somebody doesnt. But go ahead guy, what's up then? Bring it, what exactly don't I know?

    We really just need you to go test your team out. So far everyone that has come back to this thread to share how the STR is going for them has seen everything working similarly to how it always has. Some have had small increases to their damage and some have had small decreases to their damage. Overall, it truly seems the rally cry against this change is unfounded at this time.
  • Chewy88 wrote: »
    DyloBin wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    Thanks! Did you find it at all difficult to maintain Zombie stacking her speed between deaths?
    Zombie never died, if it was low on HP I just used Asajj‘s first special, which heals. And due to the Talzon lead mechanic I could do up 3 heals per errm „downs“ of Treya.

    So basically you’re saying her whole mechanic is shot out of the water?

    As you might have figured out for sure at this point, i am not a native speaker, so i don’t know what „shot out of the water“ means. My guess is „trying to „fix“/nerf something and because someone doesn’t know how it works, he achieves the opposite“: yes, actually if ppl do upgrade, or not upgrade, the new skill, you will see much higher numbers by every player who understands the mechanics of NS in P3 and P4 of the SR.
    You said your zombie never died. If it never dies than the mechanic which drives the night sisters being deaths on the field is basically ruined. If your zombie didn’t die then the Nightsisters as a faction received a nerf due to this rework.

    No, he is saying he intentionally made decisions to keep his Zombie alive so as to best maintain her stacking speed and not deal with loss of speed. Talzin and Initiate still continued to die over and over to benefit the team and maintain deaths and revives powering the Nightsisters.

    From what he said it looks like it didn’t work that way at all I think you’d better reread it because he’s saying that CG has no understanding of the mechanics

    He said that because CG seemed to think Paper Zombie was a key to P3 success. And it isn't at all.
  • ThePegasus1979
    19 posts Member
    edited September 2018
    He said that because CG seemed to think Paper Zombie was a key to P3 success. And it isn't at all.

    Thank you! Exactly! Paper Zombie only was „good“ for phase 1, if you want to use NS for that phase 1. A durable, now very very fast Zombie is pure gold for phase 3, and a very very fast Zombie that heals the team so that Bonds of Weakness + HP based turnmeter train keeps going is gold for phase 4. Just ignore the new unique skill ^^
  • He never said any other toons died or didn’t die but he specifically said zombie didn’t die. Which is what CG was trying to stop which is in fact a nerf. The more the toons died the more asaj gets wound up.
  • DyloBin wrote: »
    Pan2218 wrote: »
    yohann269 wrote: »
    WOW. Just came on a few minutes ago and there were 205 comments from when I last checked THIS MORNING!! You guys need to calm down a bit and just wait for the rework to happen and try it instead of blowing up a chat with either positive or negative comments.

    I agree

    Why would you wait for what you know? All of the information anybody that uses them for the STR should know by reading & time spent in game. & dont try to tell me to enjoy my cherrios while everybody else is eating coco puffs! No do not tell people to calm down!!! This is flat insult

    So far things seems to be working out just fine for people that are actively testing the changes in the STR. Slight ups and downs in this thread. Maybe take your team into it and see how it goes. I believe in you!

    They sent a patch lowering the difficulty of all Tiers except heroic. I don't believe for 1 second that shie in Viable againt a heavy RNG & very unpredictable Nihilus with Traya pushing Bonds of Weakness. Her write up targets the areas & with no TM control. The Sisters are just fodder. I want nothing to do with them
  • Pan2218 wrote: »
    DyloBin wrote: »
    Pan2218 wrote: »
    yohann269 wrote: »
    WOW. Just came on a few minutes ago and there were 205 comments from when I last checked THIS MORNING!! You guys need to calm down a bit and just wait for the rework to happen and try it instead of blowing up a chat with either positive or negative comments.

    I agree

    Why would you wait for what you know? All of the information anybody that uses them for the STR should know by reading & time spent in game. & dont try to tell me to enjoy my cherrios while everybody else is eating coco puffs! No do not tell people to calm down!!! This is flat insult

    So far things seems to be working out just fine for people that are actively testing the changes in the STR. Slight ups and downs in this thread. Maybe take your team into it and see how it goes. I believe in you!

    They sent a patch lowering the difficulty of all Tiers except heroic. I don't believe for 1 second that shie in Viable againt a heavy RNG & very unpredictable Nihilus with Traya pushing Bonds of Weakness. Her write up targets the areas & with no TM control. The Sisters are just fodder. I want nothing to do with them

    Thank you for the optimism however
  • I love this thank you guys for all the hard work...I'm still a little disappointed about acolyte but it is what it is. Paper zombie has been totally obliterated.
  • Ü
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    He never said any other toons died or didn’t die but he specifically said zombie didn’t die. Which is what CG was trying to stop which is in fact a nerf. The more the toons died the more asaj gets wound up.

    Yeah sorry, i took it for granted that ppl know that Talzin and Initiate need to die fast and early, how I described in my first post.... And the wound up of Asajj is not based on „dying“ chars, but on chars that get temporarily revived due to Talzind unique, and as they don’t kill anything, disappear again. Which is counted as dying and fuels Asajj‘s „Rampage“.
  • Chewy88 wrote: »
    You totally destroyed her kit and I want a refund for asaj lead because now you destroyed that too and while you’re at it I think talzin lead as well since she can’t revive even with the basics

    She's better in arena. What's your problem? Paper zombie shouldn't be a strategy...
  • IE4TAPPL3S wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    You totally destroyed her kit and I want a refund for asaj lead because now you destroyed that too and while you’re at it I think talzin lead as well since she can’t revive even with the basics

    She's better in arena. What's your problem? Paper zombie shouldn't be a strategy...

    Her is the deal..... Having thought about it, I have no issue that a toon should get better with higher gear.....

    What I have issue with, is that, not only did they nerf her, but to get her viable they introduced a new ability...... Then they hid that ability behind a gear wall higher than any other toon in this game.....

    Then, on top of that, they have the audacity to offer a pack you can pay for that will help you get the toon you farmed on a 20 energy hard node almost as good as it was before.....

    This is absolutely greedy and disgusting.....
  • BubbaFett wrote: »
    IE4TAPPL3S wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    You totally destroyed her kit and I want a refund for asaj lead because now you destroyed that too and while you’re at it I think talzin lead as well since she can’t revive even with the basics

    She's better in arena. What's your problem? Paper zombie shouldn't be a strategy...

    Her is the deal..... Having thought about it, I have no issue that a toon should get better with higher gear.....

    What I have issue with, is that, not only did they nerf her, but to get her viable they introduced a new ability...... Then they hid that ability behind a gear wall higher than any other toon in this game.....

    Then, on top of that, they have the audacity to offer a pack you can pay for that will help you get the toon you farmed on a 20 energy hard node almost as good as it was before.....

    This is absolutely greedy and disgusting.....

    The pack only gets you to Gear 5 so I am not sure what you are talking about. It is mainly just for the shards.
  • BubbaFett wrote: »
    IE4TAPPL3S wrote: »
    Chewy88 wrote: »
    You totally destroyed her kit and I want a refund for asaj lead because now you destroyed that too and while you’re at it I think talzin lead as well since she can’t revive even with the basics

    She's better in arena. What's your problem? Paper zombie shouldn't be a strategy...

    Her is the deal..... Having thought about it, I have no issue that a toon should get better with higher gear.....

    What I have issue with, is that, not only did they nerf her, but to get her viable they introduced a new ability...... Then they hid that ability behind a gear wall higher than any other toon in this game.....

    Then, on top of that, they have the audacity to offer a pack you can pay for that will help you get the toon you farmed on a 20 energy hard node almost as good as it was before.....

    This is absolutely greedy and disgusting.....

    The pack only gets you to Gear 5 so I am not sure what you are talking about. It is mainly just for the shards.
    Yeah that pack should be free and push you up to g10 if they want to make things equitable. But that’s not really CGs priority
Sign In or Register to comment.