Update on the Finn/Threepio Raid Interaction: Resulting Finn Modifications [MEGA]

Replies

  • Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?
  • I put the lead zeta on Finn well over a year ago, before 3PO or the Sith raid. Since you have now changed that leadership ability, which was completely unnecessary if you just fixed what was actually broken, then I would absolutely like my zeta back. I think the new kit looks interesting, but it's not what I paid for.
  • Kyno
    21867 posts Moderator
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.
  • Instead of trying to appeal to CG here on the forums im going to give this game 1* in the playstore and write a comment in regards to unethical switch and bait tactics of the devs. I have been playing for 9month and this change really hurts. I only have 7 7* Resistance characters. I cant run 2 full Resistance teams, if the zeta is not refunded it is wasted. This change causes me to lose a great TW/GA attack team. An easy HAAT solo (the raid is boring as hell, zFinn was a huge time saver), a great Revan counter in the arena and its not going to help me in HSTR since i already have my resistance squad in P1. By doing this sort of unethical stuff CG will lose paying customers. This is just disgusting.

    Good idea, think I might join you there. Maybe if CG doesn't actually listen to the player base then maybe hitting them in the pockets will let them know how displeased we are.

  • The fact that you nerfed his zeta ability to grant turn meter by 1000% should garuntee a refund. I would really appreciate a refund of the zeta as it is not needed anymore for Finn to be viable. You have made other changes to the other abilities that do not require a zeta. The only reason I put a zeta on him was for the turn meter gain. You have taken that away. This is disingenuous at best and blatant bait and switch at worst. You have refunded two other zetas for similar practices. Why do you consistently have to ruin things and then leave the room so as to not take responsibility. You know Finns zeta was there to start a turn meter train. You took that away and did not add anything to his zeta to make it viable. I would like you to make this right via a refund of my zeta. If I play with finn and think it necessary I will put it back on. But that should be MY choice not yours.
  • As a player that started a new account, I too would like a refund. It should be noted that I haven’t put a zeta on Finn, or unlocked him for that matter. But I did think about it, and that really should be compensated.
  • As this is not the zeta I invested in, whether it’s better or not doesn’t matter in the slightest, I should have the option of choosing whether I want this new zeta or not. Forcing me to have a zeta I did not invest time or resources in is like selling me a car and then removing the engine a year in and replacing it with bike pedals. This isn’t the flinstones. I don’t care if it’s better. Let me figure that out for myself. If people want to rezeta him that’s their prerogative but I did not spend my zeta mats on this leadership ability and therefore should have the right to change my investment if I see fit. If it’s “better” you shouldn’t have any worries people will just rezeta him. But forcing us to accept a completely different ability without the option of a refund is heresy
  • mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    While we cant test it, Revan gives tenacity up. Zfinns only tmr tactic now heavily relies on potency/tenacity. In short NewFinn cant touch him.
  • I haven't even read the full kit but when I saw 3% it's obvious that his kit is pure garbage now, He was the only character that could easily take out Traya and stood a chance against Revan (who still has barely any reliable counters besides faster Revan) and now its gone to hell because it took them 2 months to come up with a terrible solution.

    If Finn still has viability against Traya and Revan without team members needing to be 330 speed I will def apologize, but I highly doubt thats the case.
  • TLDR
    I vehemently object.
    C3PO broke your fancy raid, not Finn. Unacceptable.
  • Dhuriya24 wrote: »
    I haven't even read the full kit but when I saw 3% it's obvious that his kit is pure garbage now, He was the only character that could easily take out Traya and stood a chance against Revan (who still has barely any reliable counters besides faster Revan) and now its gone to hell because it took them 2 months to come up with a terrible solution.

    If Finn still has viability against Traya and Revan without team members needing to be 330 speed I will def apologize, but I highly doubt thats the case.

    I doubt as well. This change is garbage
  • Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.

    Right, though, here's what CG said:

    "These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP, but his changes do offer the team some additional utility and a slight improvement in their PvP presence. With ramping damage now present on Finn’s basic ability and his 2nd special ability, the longer he can stay alive and the more turns he can take, the more potent he becomes. Determination goes a long way in making this a reality, as it provides not only an additional means of spreading damage around the team by providing Finn with the ability to Taunt, but also grants him Retribution which can give him a few free hits to ramp up damage on his basic ability. While these changes haven’t brought the Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi."

    My sole interest in ZFinn is pvp, giving me a somewhat reliable and fast way of beating Revan.

    It seems that does drastically change his pvp performance. And it's not just against "one team".
  • Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi.
    [
    We think this should resolve the Finn-Threepio interaction moving forward. As our internal testing has shown that Finn matches or exceeds where he was prior to C-3PO's launch.
    [/quote]

    <<DEV POST>>[/quote]

    So my under gear 8 resistance should still be able to beat a gear 12 kru squad or a Kenobi squad? Is that what your saying? And you literally make the biggest change to a zeta ever and this is the one were you say "you gotta keep it." I already dismantled my mods on those units they'll sit on the shelf like 80 percent of my roster does now.

  • mvmss wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.

    Right, though, here's what CG said:

    "These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP, but his changes do offer the team some additional utility and a slight improvement in their PvP presence. With ramping damage now present on Finn’s basic ability and his 2nd special ability, the longer he can stay alive and the more turns he can take, the more potent he becomes. Determination goes a long way in making this a reality, as it provides not only an additional means of spreading damage around the team by providing Finn with the ability to Taunt, but also grants him Retribution which can give him a few free hits to ramp up damage on his basic ability. While these changes haven’t brought the Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi."

    My sole interest in ZFinn is pvp, giving me a somewhat reliable and fast way of beating Revan.

    It seems that does drastically change his pvp performance. And it's not just against "one team".

    Unfortunately - there’s only one team that matters in PvP - and that’s Revan.

    At least if we are talking about squad arena.
  • Shalazar
    5 posts Member
    edited February 16
    CG - “These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP”

    Lies. Less than half the TM boost (Max 15 vs 35 always). TM reduction on ONE character is nothing compared to TM boost in entire team!!! You can double/triple the TM boost per Resistance and it still nerfs the loop!!!

    Zeta Finn is the team I use to beat Revan Wall in Arena every day. That’s done! PvP screwed. Mega whale that HATES Revan mirror (paid for Revan in September). Likely to quit...
  • jayjonbeach
    662 posts Member
    edited February 16
    I don't even have the Zeta on Finn, but I think others who want a refund should get it, period. The Zeta does NOT work like it did before, it is a significant nerf to the Zeta in particular.

    I mean it's not even close to what it was before. Before, the whole team got 35%TM. Now, 3%, really, 3? LOL 3, we are talking 3 that is not a typo, 3 right??? and no refund?

    Wow, that is a low blow CG. TM is arguably the most important aspect in the game, TM > speed for crying out loud, and you nerf if from 35% gain down to THREE with no refund?

    So while the rest of his kit might be as good, or better (if true), the Zeta is NOT as good as before, simple.
  • Shalazar wrote: »
    CG - “These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP”

    Lies. Less than half the TM boost (Max 15 vs 35 always). TM reduction on ONE character is nothing compared to TM boost in entire team!!! You can double/triple the TM boost per Resistance and it still nerfs the loop!!!

    Lies is correct
  • Tell them with your wallets it’s the only thing that will work. Don’t spend a nickel on the game for a while. That will get their attention,
    Line ID: Fish Bones SH
  • Kyno
    21867 posts Moderator
    mvmss wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.

    Right, though, here's what CG said:

    "These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP, but his changes do offer the team some additional utility and a slight improvement in their PvP presence. With ramping damage now present on Finn’s basic ability and his 2nd special ability, the longer he can stay alive and the more turns he can take, the more potent he becomes. Determination goes a long way in making this a reality, as it provides not only an additional means of spreading damage around the team by providing Finn with the ability to Taunt, but also grants him Retribution which can give him a few free hits to ramp up damage on his basic ability. While these changes haven’t brought the Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi."

    My sole interest in ZFinn is pvp, giving me a somewhat reliable and fast way of beating Revan.

    It seems that does drastically change his pvp performance. And it's not just against "one team".

    There is more to PvP than arena. There are more teams used in PvP content than Revan.

    so changing the interaction with a single (or 2 teams) is not a drastic change to their PvP performance.

    I dont see him getting enough hits to make the bonus damage mean anything. I also dont see the TM gain against revan being enough to counter all the speed and TM gain on a revan team.

    I could be wrong about FO, but to get it going before you only needed Poe to be faster, now you will probably need more speed in general. so while it may be doable, its likely going to need changes to the whole team to be able to "handily dispose" of teams you could take down before.

    IMHO
  • skeptically optimistic about this rework. I will reserve judgement for when I have a chance to see it in action.
  • mvmss wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.

    Right, though, here's what CG said:

    "These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP, but his changes do offer the team some additional utility and a slight improvement in their PvP presence. With ramping damage now present on Finn’s basic ability and his 2nd special ability, the longer he can stay alive and the more turns he can take, the more potent he becomes. Determination goes a long way in making this a reality, as it provides not only an additional means of spreading damage around the team by providing Finn with the ability to Taunt, but also grants him Retribution which can give him a few free hits to ramp up damage on his basic ability. While these changes haven’t brought the Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi."

    My sole interest in ZFinn is pvp, giving me a somewhat reliable and fast way of beating Revan.

    It seems that does drastically change his pvp performance. And it's not just against "one team".

    Unfortunately - there’s only one team that matters in PvP - and that’s Revan.

    At least if we are talking about squad arena.

    Not only squad arena, but also Revan walls on TW and on GA.

    Traya is a great character, but I see very little reason to make her less accessible to those who still don't have her or have a hard time beating HSTR because, you know, some ppl stick to a guild where friendship was built over the years of playing the game.
  • Wow, is 1 phase of an old raid that precious? Seriously, the Sith raid is terrible. Finn made it suck less.
  • Shalazar wrote: »
    CG - “These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP”

    Lies.

    Maybe wait until the thing goes live before saying something is a lie?

    They've done two months of looking at this, you've done two seconds.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • @bulldog1205 i eagerly await your follow up video!
    @CG_TopHat so the 20% p3 of sith raid team is still using 3po but with other resistance?
    Im sad to see the change, but it was leading to a lot of weirdness regarding the sith raid, we have 8 c3pos, but decided not to use the cheese just because we knew this change was coming.
    Anyway, Finn getting a taunt if Poe goes under 50% health is great and the increased damage is also a good deal.
    The part regarding his viability against general kenobi lead is laughable and out of touch.
  • Lrrr
    112 posts Member
    The kit seems great and all, but I’m still confused by the last line. Shouldn’t refunding a Zeta be standard protocol when making drastic changes to a character?

    If you invested a Zeta in Finn, for the 35% boost, then this is a nerf.

    I would probably re-Zeta him like I did Daka and Berris back in the day, but I for one, think with the time commitment and the dollar value of the Zeta/omegas required, anytime you make drastic changes to a kit, it should be a zeta refund, automatically, even if you think you improved the kit.
  • Shalazar
    5 posts Member
    edited February 16
    Everyone saying Finn doesn’t matter in Arena doesn’t know how C-3PO works with him. I climb the mountain of Revans EVERY SINGLE DAY with zFinn, C-3PO, Nest, Han, Chewie. Chewie Tenacity down and Nest basic cleanse Tenacity. I’ve full cleared without them taking a turn. CG doesn’t know how to even play their own game...
  • Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Does the rework beat Revan?

    That is all I'm interested in and I couldn't care less about Finn in raids (HAAT, srsly???).

    Yes, I do have Revan and I think Revan mirror matches are probably the worst since I started playing this game, long ago.

    So, the question is, does the new Finn beat Revan?

    no. they are too fast and will resist TMR.

    even against FO, it looks questionable due to the speed they have.

    Right, though, here's what CG said:

    "These changes do not drastically alter the performance of the Finn-led Resistance squad in PvP, but his changes do offer the team some additional utility and a slight improvement in their PvP presence. With ramping damage now present on Finn’s basic ability and his 2nd special ability, the longer he can stay alive and the more turns he can take, the more potent he becomes. Determination goes a long way in making this a reality, as it provides not only an additional means of spreading damage around the team by providing Finn with the ability to Taunt, but also grants him Retribution which can give him a few free hits to ramp up damage on his basic ability. While these changes haven’t brought the Resistance squad into the current competitive meta, they can more handily dispose of teams such as Kylo Ren (Unmasked)-led First Order and General Kenobi-led Jedi."

    My sole interest in ZFinn is pvp, giving me a somewhat reliable and fast way of beating Revan.

    It seems that does drastically change his pvp performance. And it's not just against "one team".

    There is more to PvP than arena. There are more teams used in PvP content than Revan.

    so changing the interaction with a single (or 2 teams) is not a drastic change to their PvP performance.

    I dont see him getting enough hits to make the bonus damage mean anything. I also dont see the TM gain against revan being enough to counter all the speed and TM gain on a revan team.

    I could be wrong about FO, but to get it going before you only needed Poe to be faster, now you will probably need more speed in general. so while it may be doable, its likely going to need changes to the whole team to be able to "handily dispose" of teams you could take down before.

    IMHO

    If Revan wasnt meta , you'd have a valid point , but changing the way a team interacts with the Meta , absolutely affects their pvp usage, im sorry.
This discussion has been closed.