Kit Rework: HK-47

Replies

  • Gorem
    1127 posts Member
    You made HK have a requirement to have freaking Darth Revan as his leader? And also, Nerfed his lead, and REMOVED HIS AOE CRIT?

    So he can't even give himself TM on aoe anymore?

    Seriously, what on Earth?
    Ikey wrote: »
    @RuFiOHHHHH you're clearly terrible at this game if you can't see why HK had to be nerfed. Quit crying and learn the mechanics. 50% TM is ridiculously OP

    If he's terrible, you are apparently even worse since you don't understand simple game mechanics and counters. Critting all the time makes you lose against some squads before the fights begun, it would actually cause the game to have some kind of Rock paper scissors action again since it would be VERY VERY EXTREMELY easy to beat a HK led droid team before this mega nerf.


  • have always hoped that we would get a solid Droid leader to make them at least somewhat viable. Not that they need to be META, but I mean a B+ team would be great.

    Grievous is that

    Yeah, but I mean Grievous is still kind of squishy. As soon as you knock out Grievous, the whole teams falls apart pretty quickly.
    Dictated but not read, Admiral Fail.
  • Luniz
    335 posts Member
    Well there goes my anti Phoenix team :( yet another worthless faction now
  • Gifafi
    1248 posts Member
    I feel bad for the people who love their hk-led droid team, but c'mon, son.

    1. your droid team was never that good. GA, TW maybe? but let's be real.
    2. droids will get a new leader at some point imo.
    3. Since CG told us HK's lead would lead to loops and problems, and his lead only affected droids, I would expect more droids to be coming (BB9?), which should make you happy. Happier than having a meh team get nerfed, I would think.


    rtt:
    Unique 1: Self-Reconstruction
    FINAL TEXT: (ZETA) When a buff expires on an enemy, HK-47 recovers 5% Health and 5% Protection. When HK-47 uses an ability during his turn, it deals 25% more damage if the target has Deathmark or Fear.

    does "expires" include cleansed? I think I remembered that it does (Vader's DOTs iirc), so forgive me if wrong. And is it per buff? Like if someone had 3 buffs that expired, would HK get 15% prot/health?

    sorry if this has been asked/answered. I'm assuming there have been 20 posts since I started typing this lol
  • have always hoped that we would get a solid Droid leader to make them at least somewhat viable. Not that they need to be META, but I mean a B+ team would be great.

    Grievous is that

    Yeah, but I mean Grievous is still kind of squishy. As soon as you knock out Grievous, the whole teams falls apart pretty quickly.

    GG and the Seps "squishy"?





    OK.......
    Legend#6873 | YouTube | swgoh.gg
  • Nihion
    1549 posts Member
    6 abilities? Hmm...
  • CoSrenegade
    101 posts Member
    edited March 18
    @CG_SBCrumb
    How about an HK-51 with the original HK-47 specs (Lead, 50% TM gain)?
    Copy the code, rename the unit, paint him more grey than brown and done.

    Or name it "HK-47 (Inferior iteration)"

    starts at 40sec...

    ->
  • Nihion wrote: »
    6 abilities? Hmm...

    C3po has 7, your point?
    "ARE WE BLIND? DEPLOY THE GARRISON."
  • CG: Let's change HK's lead because it's way too OP with crits.

    New HK Kit: *removes crits on his aoe*

    Me: What was the point of this again? I'm sure the nerf, which has disabled half my roster, was clearly more troublesome than JKR, Traya, or DR....

    *uninstalls game*
    《Belief is not Required》
  • So they rework his lead to ensure that they don't need to work around it... And yet they specifically work around his old lead in his new kit?!?
  • CG: Let's change HK's lead because it's way too OP with crits.

    New HK Kit: *removes crits on his aoe*

    Me: What was the point of this again? I'm sure the nerf, which has disabled half my roster, was clearly more troublesome than JKR, Traya, or DR....

    *uninstalls game*

    But that AOE can potentially doe like 700% damage that ignores all armor.
  • Charlo999
    138 posts Member
    edited March 18
    Ikey wrote: »
    @RuFiOHHHHH you're clearly terrible at this game if you can't see why HK had to be nerfed. Quit crying and learn the mechanics. 50% TM is ridiculously OP

    Still searching for the “HK lead is too OP please nerf” threads.......
    “Clearly” 100% of the player base have been terrible since the game began. Even when droid/Poe were meta.


    Just tried HK lead droids against revan and got my **** handed to me. Funny that 50TM didn’t feel OP.
  • Nihion
    1549 posts Member
    Riffinator wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    6 abilities? Hmm...

    C3po has 7, your point?

    Just reminiscing. I remember the days when 5 abilities was a lot...
  • Gorem
    1127 posts Member
    Not only did they remove the ability for his aoe to crit, which already contradicts his own lead, but they gave him an ability that again, contradicts using him in the leader slot since it requires another character there instead of HK.

    Honestly I love how they are only refunding the mats for his lead, because they know how terrible it is, and since it was not a zeta, they don't have to give us zeta mats. Almost feels like there is not point to that lead being there.

    Really, if they were going to gut HK like this for Droids, making the entire faction worse, they should have given us another lead, and reworked other droids at the same time as this HK gutting.
  • Xel
    7 posts Member
    This rework is amazing...and follows lore! Trade off a leadership that makes HK 47 VERY relevant in a Sith Empire team. His leadership is still great, just reduced. I have all the droids to gear 12 and love droids. I fully support this rework. What a bunch of complainers! Developers did say they WANT to make better droids but are limited to the potential results due to a leadership. Give it time ....who knows what’s being planned. If a 40% turnmeter reduction is the worst thing to happen to you this year, consider yourself very blessed! Perspective people!
  • Xel wrote: »
    This rework is amazing...and follows lore! Trade off a leadership that makes HK 47 VERY relevant in a Sith Empire team. His leadership is still great, just reduced. I have all the droids to gear 12 and love droids. I fully support this rework. What a bunch of complainers! Developers did say they WANT to make better droids but are limited to the potential results due to a leadership. Give it time ....who knows what’s being planned. If a 40% turnmeter reduction is the worst thing to happen to you this year, consider yourself very blessed! Perspective people!
    Can’t tell if you are being sarcastic. They said that HK was the reason that the recent droids could not score critical hits. But they still made sure that HK could not score crits on his AOE after fixing what was supposedly limiting the droid’s crit capabilities. They are not going to rework any of the droids released over the years, all of which were either designed to work with HK’s lead or work against it, which greatly harms the entire faction now that HK’s lead is gone.
  • YaeVizsla
    2512 posts Member
    edited March 18
    SmurfLAX28 wrote: »
    So they rework his lead to ensure that they don't need to work around it... And yet they specifically work around his old lead in his new kit?!?
    No, they didn't. HK using his own AoE to get another turn was not the issue. The issue with his lead was that it limited design space for other characters. Not letting HK's AOE crit doesn't affect TM from IG-88, B2, Grievous, Magnaguard, R2, or T3-M4's AoE, nor from IG-86, Chopper, 3PO, or BB-8's assists, nor from BB-8, Magnaguard, K2-SO, or L3's counter attacks, nor from any interactions that may come from future units who HK-47 hinders the design space of. HK-47's lead is likely a large contributing factor to why so many droid attackers are just bad. And why the only two we've gotten in a very long time can't crit.

    Removing crits from HK-47's lead did not "fix" anything. It would still have to change.

    And while I am not fond of how they changed that lead, it did need to change. Just... not necessarily this much.

    Though honestly, it's almost arbitrary. With this rework, even if HK's lead didn't change, he'd join R2, BB-8, a substantial number of the separatist droids, and L3-37 in the club of droids who are too important to other factions/teams for it to be really worthwhile to use them on an HK led droids squad.

    In a few months, when Devan round 2 comes around, most of the people who've been around long enough that they either have a leftover droid meta team or have had the extra zots to kit an HK droids C team will get their hands on Devan, and HK-47 looks to be an integral part of the Devan lineup, making him too valuable to keep on that C list team, and it would fold anyways to the point where the only thing that would bring it back is a major exploit loop that should be fixed anyways.

    It's unfortunate, but honestly arbitrary.
  • Gorem wrote: »
    Not only did they remove the ability for his aoe to crit, which already contradicts his own lead, but they gave him an ability that again, contradicts using him in the leader slot since it requires another character there instead of HK.

    The non-crit/true damage function of that ability is likely on purpose not just a random mistake like people seem to be implying - maybe it's a specific attempt to combat jolee/GK's defence/anti-crit? Or maybe it's simply because the ability multiplies from the first hit (the number of debuffs) for the secondary hits - and they wanted to avoid crazy variances between a hit or a crit being multiplied a dozen times for wildly different results (especially under his own lead with bonus crit damage)

    As for the extra ability - HK47 isn't just a droid, he's Revan's droid :)
    Gorem wrote: »
    Really, if they were going to gut HK like this for Droids, making the entire faction worse, they should have given us another lead, and reworked other droids at the same time as this HK gutting.

    I do agree there isn't much in the way of other options for other droid leads, considering how many droids we have now. Another droid or two getting some mid-tier leaderships (e.g. carth-level maybe) would be great, although they've probably been a little busy recently so you may have to wait!

  • HK's leadership was one of the only droid leaderships in the game. Now it is relegated to marginality like many of the other existing droid leaderships in the game.

    I remember seeing another poster write that it is unbelievable that a horribly broken and overpowered leadership like Jedi Knight Revan hasn't been balanced and yet HK's leadership is somehow more of a problem?

    Seriously CG needs to give those of us who now have wasted gear and mats in droids those items back. HK's leadership was still useful and not broken but after this rework it will be pointless. After the slap in the face with the joke of a General Grievous rework those of us who like droids are stuck with no real leadership options now?
  • Ultra
    3106 posts Member
    I'm really liking the new basic, and special.

    Assassination Protocol is a hit and miss for me, the cooldown is greater than Darth Nihilus' Annihilate and harder to reduce, whereas the other guy can one-shot anyone. I'm glad we are staying away from that level of power. I hope it hits very hard to justify it and that the AI prefers to use it on Deathmarked or fear targets

    I really love the Self-Reconstruction rework.

    Dislikes:
    -Relies on Darth Revan to be on the leader slot. I understand the counter to power creep is to make toons super weak outside leader slot and just painstakingly powerful as leaders but it only gives toons like HK a short term longevity. Would've been nice if HK had some of those bonuses without Darth Revan and it was doubled or tripled if DR was present (to its current zeta stats) rather than only applicable if DR is present and in leader slot

    -TM gain from leader is very insignicant. 10% is just very bad but I don't care about his lead so its meh
    -Assassination Protocol requires fear or deathmark for CD decrease and his kit doesn't have any means to do so on its own. Would've been nice if he was more flexible enough to work with T3, or other Old Republic allies.

    As others pointed out he is only useful if Darth Revan is present and not that impressive in other teams. Like others, I was hoping he was useful in a Carth led OR team
  • They should’ve added something else to HK’s lead besides 20% CD. Something like ‘Droid allies recover 15% health whenever they score a critical hit and while HK is active enemies with target lock immediately regain target lock for 2 turns whenever it expires on them’. Wouldn’t have been OP or anything but it would’ve at least kept his leader somewhat useful.
  • Nah, not good enough CG,

    You nerf a leader too. That we built around you need to refund that reworked toon AND every toon we built to go around them. So my IG86, IG88, IG100, B2, and JE.

    That's an entire TW/TB/GA team down the drain. They usually run about 4-6 battles on defense too, and now they won't survive one battle...feeling completed cheated about the rework so that another new, shiny toon gets the spotlight.

    Seems to be a pattern....Finn, Nute Gunray, NS Zombie, now HK...
  • Tbirds01
    1235 posts Member
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Dagobond wrote: »
    I remember seeing another poster write that it is unbelievable that a horribly broken and overpowered leadership like Jedi Knight Revan hasn't been balanced and yet HK's leadership is somehow more of a problem?
    Action economy is king.

    HK-47 lead interacts with action economy in an outright insane fashion that limits design space.

    Revan's lead is not particularly crazy. It's very good, don't get me wrong, but it's the layers of synergy that make Revan the dominant meta right now, not a crazy lead. It does a variety of things, but it's pretty finite and manageable, and it's one of the few good leads that doesn't come with a turn meter engine of any sort.

    Revan's lead is actually well-designed. It's an aggressive assists lead, and rewards being good at assists, and lets the faction be good at assists without necessarily breaking. The problem comes not from the lead, but from the confluence of Yoda hitting like a meteor with his own TM engine, Revan's extra life unique combining with Jolee's mass revive on top of his being a brick wall, Bastila's pile o' buffs, and Yoda's ability to proliferate those buffs. It's synergy to an unprecedented degree in the game, but remove either of the linchpins- Jolee or Yoda- and the team isn't really an issue.

    A badly designed lead, on the other hand, is one where the faction has to be bad at their gimmick to avoid breaking the game. Droids are not allowed to be good at getting lots of crits because they gain 50% TM per crit. Resistance has to be bad at exposes because they get a total of 175% TM for every bubble popped plus another 55% for every bubble landed and if they can land and pop a bubble every 2-3 turns, they will never stop.

    So yes, saying HK-47 lead was a problem but Revan lead was not is a reasonable statement.

    How can you say it’s not crazy when it’s 5,000 pages long?😂
    Tag me if you reply to my comment so I know I should answer you!😀 My roster: https://swgoh.gg/p/842694912/
  • Riffinator wrote: »
    This is the absolute worst rework ever.

    Worse than Finn?

    Only because I really like droids and scoundrels. It's like a knife through my soul.
  • YaeVizsla wrote: »
    Dagobond wrote: »
    I remember seeing another poster write that it is unbelievable that a horribly broken and overpowered leadership like Jedi Knight Revan hasn't been balanced and yet HK's leadership is somehow more of a problem?
    Action economy is king.

    HK-47 lead interacts with action economy in an outright insane fashion that limits design space.

    Revan's lead is not particularly crazy. It's very good, don't get me wrong, but it's the layers of synergy that make Revan the dominant meta right now, not a crazy lead. It does a variety of things, but it's pretty finite and manageable, and it's one of the few good leads that doesn't come with a turn meter engine of any sort.

    Revan's lead is actually well-designed. It's an aggressive assists lead, and rewards being good at assists, and lets the faction be good at assists without necessarily breaking. The problem comes not from the lead, but from the confluence of Yoda hitting like a meteor with his own TM engine, Revan's extra life unique combining with Jolee's mass revive on top of his being a brick wall, Bastila's pile o' buffs, and Yoda's ability to proliferate those buffs. It's synergy to an unprecedented degree in the game, but remove either of the linchpins- Jolee or Yoda- and the team isn't really an issue.

    A badly designed lead, on the other hand, is one where the faction has to be bad at their gimmick to avoid breaking the game. Droids are not allowed to be good at getting lots of crits because they gain 50% TM per crit. Resistance has to be bad at exposes because they get a total of 175% TM for every bubble popped plus another 55% for every bubble landed and if they can land and pop a bubble every 2-3 turns, they will never stop.

    So yes, saying HK-47 lead was a problem but Revan lead was not is a reasonable statement.

    Amen.
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