The thing that confuses me is why they introduced a gear wall at g8/9 and didn't make DR instantly meta. There is no way I'm buy those pieces from shipments now. They could have made so much more money.
Very well typed out post. However, I’d have to disagree with you on Grievous (partly).
I agree that he takes b1 down too quickly. B1 is there, then he’s gone. You absolutely need the zeta, and even then if you get lucky you end the battle with about 40 stacks left, mainly from Grievous unique. However, I’d have to disagree on the part where you say it isn’t fun. I recently have switched to Grievous lead in arena with a full separatist droid army at my beck and call and honestly with GG unique zeta have never had so much fun. I can beat a huge variety of teams now (note that I’m not in the top 100 where revans are anything you fight) and have also beaten a few revan teams now. So in my opinion they are extremely fun to play, one of my favorite teams.
And for drevan, I think we need to wait for malak (who was basically confirmed) for drevan defense to be possible.
Just my thoughts.
Jedi Knight Revan was a serious problem the moment he came into this game.
I’ve never whaled so hard as I did on DR, his gear alone was over 30k crystals. Not to mention we’ve pumped all our zetas etc into him, hoping we can Bypass the insanely boring JKR meta. But Sith empire isn’t what we hoped it would be, the squad has serious weaknesses and even on offense it loses to JKR more reliably than the mirror match.
Finn beats it in approx 45 seconds and cls beats it in under 90 seconds.
The team needs a buff, seriously regret spending a penny on this character. Anyone stuck at g8 my advice would be save your crystals because even at g12 and 315 speed he is awful.
Prepare for another 6 months of JKR, the devs won’t nerf it even thought it drastically needs one, yet they’ve nerfed a dozen other characters in the past which wasn’t game breaking.
Yeah not gonna lie, DRevan seems really weak. I don't mean he himself seems weak, but as leader he seems pretty weak. No speed boosts, no synergy with anything outside of sith empire, no survivability.
Honestly Sith empire are very underwhelming, and something needs to be buffed or changed.
I don't know if where missing a piece of the puzzle, maybe Darth Malak.
But for now, DRevan teams are just incredibly weak and underwhelming.
Having nothing to heal your squad, nothing to Revive anyone, having no anti mark synergy (besides DR) and having zero synergy with any better sith is just detrimental when fighting or defending against JKR and something needs to be done.
I'll answer what I think OP's original question was and say that in genetal I am not a fan of hurting yourself, unless it's some reasonable balance and more teams had that built in so it seemed like a balancing norm rather than something unique for a few teams.
We had Anakin exposing himself, but even that was a percent chance. Then we had Traya damaging allies, but it doesn't seem like it's a whole lot.
But then along came Grievous, and whatever you say about the amount of damage done, it creates a direct anti-synergy with b1, who came out for that rework.
When I read the sacrifice of defense in Darth Revan's kit, I was really uneasy. But not just the offense, but the insane speed increase and cleansing of all foresight seemed to make up for it. That may still be true if they can get the Ferocity train rolling, it just seems that it's too easy to take them out before that. And since it's such a huge amount of percentage-based defense loss, mods can only help you before they take a turn, as they effectively will have 0 defense after they start gaining stacks.
Here's another alternative. If they feel that the Anti-Assist Zeta applying to all Sith Empire is too strong (it's not, with Ferocity)...make it apply to him and Bastila only, maybe HK too. They certainly have plenty of chemistry so this is just one more piece of that.
There's two issues right now that are severely limiting DR/Sith empire. The first is the bonus speed that JKR's lead gives to Jedi/OR. That 30-40+ speed is too much for DR to overcome at the beginning of the battle. The second is the Sith Empire missing a Jolee equivalent toon that can revive. Malak may be that toon... But how long do we have to wait for that???
If Darth Revan had in his leader ability "Jedi can't gain bonus speed from leader abilities" or "Jedi have -30 to -40 speed" that could potentially help this team. We should not have to wait for Malak to make this Journey toon arena viable.
I think the biggest problem is limited synergy, tbh. I understand making his lead affect all Sith might be OP, but JKR gets exactly that with all Jedi.
Imagine the JKR team without GMY or Kenobi... that's basically Darth Revan.
If Darth Revan had in his leader ability "Jedi can't gain bonus speed from leader abilities" or "Jedi have -30 to -40 speed" that could potentially help this team. We should not have to wait for Malak to make this Journey toon arena viable.
If Fallen Bastila’s (currently useless) zeta would grant 1 turn Stealth instead of (or in addition to) Foresight - or maybe even something akin to the Outmanoeuver buff that Han’s Millennium Falcon has - it’d make the zeta investment actually worth something and also give DR a bit more survivability against the inevitable JKR Mark at the beginning of the match. I don’t know if that would be enough to fix the balance, but just something to think of...
JKR isnt really the problem the problem is Jolee. In mirror matches I can mark him and throw everything I have at him and if he gets counter you are totally screwed. Every once in a while I will see a JKR team that doesnt have Jolee in arena and they are total pushovers.
Yes JKR teams are a problem, but I really have no interest in a nerf thread. Even is his absence it isn't fun when your own team damages you too much. Does anyone agree or disagree with that?
Agree 100%. I don't think it's fun when a character is dealing significant damage to their own teammates on a consistent basis. I think it's a terrible mechanic. I haven't used D Revan yet so I can't comment on that, but GG's damage to his teammates is what makes that team so disappointing.
How I would fix it... add this to assassination protocol.
"Whenever a Sith empire ally is marked, or death marked, HK47 gains 100% TM and the cooldown of this ability is reset. Applies healing immunity if target is Jedi. This cannot be resisted"
Yes JKR teams are a problem, but I really have no interest in a nerf thread. Even is his absence it isn't fun when your own team damages you too much. Does anyone agree or disagree with that?
Agree 100%. I don't think it's fun when a character is dealing significant damage to their own teammates on a consistent basis. I think it's a terrible mechanic. I haven't used D Revan yet so I can't comment on that, but GG's damage to his teammates is what makes that team so disappointing.
It also has 0 to do with anything canon involving Darth Revan or KOTOR... at least with GG it made sense.
The downsides are meant to balance out the upsides of each of the kits: They're balanced characters. If DRevan didn't have the reduced defense, he'd just be unkillable flat out. If Grievous didn't take away health, the other droids would build up too fast and become an unstoppable force.
It's the fact that Jedi Knight Revan has absolutely no downsides that's the problem. He's just give give give to his entire team with little thought behind how it would affect anything, and now nearly six months down the line we're still at the same place we were when he was released.
Of course, one might argue that the fact a character needs some kind of downside to make a character 'balanced' is a bad thing, but where's the fun in that though? You're limiting yourself doing that, so debuffs and reducing mechanics are an interesting way to go.
I never said there should be no downside. I think the concept of gaining a powerful buff at a cost is good. I think the downsides in the game are too severe. Especially for GG.
If Malak is necessary to make DR work then he should have really been released first. Although I am not really sure DR has a problem atm since I see plenty in the top 50 on my Arena, have to wait a few days to see how things shake out.
You people should check out mobilegamers testing stream. A fully geared DR team couldn't be beat with sith assassin and marauder. They we're just blowing up teams when they were on defense.
There's two issues right now that are severely limiting DR/Sith empire. The first is the bonus speed that JKR's lead gives to Jedi/OR. That 30-40+ speed is too much for DR to overcome at the beginning of the battle. The second is the Sith Empire missing a Jolee equivalent toon that can revive. Malak may be that toon... But how long do we have to wait for that???
If Darth Revan had in his leader ability "Jedi can't gain bonus speed from leader abilities" or "Jedi have -30 to -40 speed" that could potentially help this team. We should not have to wait for Malak to make this Journey toon arena viable.
Highly possible that malak is that toon. He keeps eating jedis in bacta tanks in the final fight of KOTOR
Replies
He can't, because rhetoric and sarcasm rules the day in this age. Reason need not apply with some folks.
I agree that he takes b1 down too quickly. B1 is there, then he’s gone. You absolutely need the zeta, and even then if you get lucky you end the battle with about 40 stacks left, mainly from Grievous unique. However, I’d have to disagree on the part where you say it isn’t fun. I recently have switched to Grievous lead in arena with a full separatist droid army at my beck and call and honestly with GG unique zeta have never had so much fun. I can beat a huge variety of teams now (note that I’m not in the top 100 where revans are anything you fight) and have also beaten a few revan teams now. So in my opinion they are extremely fun to play, one of my favorite teams.
And for drevan, I think we need to wait for malak (who was basically confirmed) for drevan defense to be possible.
Just my thoughts.
I’ve never whaled so hard as I did on DR, his gear alone was over 30k crystals. Not to mention we’ve pumped all our zetas etc into him, hoping we can Bypass the insanely boring JKR meta. But Sith empire isn’t what we hoped it would be, the squad has serious weaknesses and even on offense it loses to JKR more reliably than the mirror match.
Finn beats it in approx 45 seconds and cls beats it in under 90 seconds.
The team needs a buff, seriously regret spending a penny on this character. Anyone stuck at g8 my advice would be save your crystals because even at g12 and 315 speed he is awful.
Prepare for another 6 months of JKR, the devs won’t nerf it even thought it drastically needs one, yet they’ve nerfed a dozen other characters in the past which wasn’t game breaking.
Honestly Sith empire are very underwhelming, and something needs to be buffed or changed.
I don't know if where missing a piece of the puzzle, maybe Darth Malak.
But for now, DRevan teams are just incredibly weak and underwhelming.
Having nothing to heal your squad, nothing to Revive anyone, having no anti mark synergy (besides DR) and having zero synergy with any better sith is just detrimental when fighting or defending against JKR and something needs to be done.
We had Anakin exposing himself, but even that was a percent chance. Then we had Traya damaging allies, but it doesn't seem like it's a whole lot.
But then along came Grievous, and whatever you say about the amount of damage done, it creates a direct anti-synergy with b1, who came out for that rework.
When I read the sacrifice of defense in Darth Revan's kit, I was really uneasy. But not just the offense, but the insane speed increase and cleansing of all foresight seemed to make up for it. That may still be true if they can get the Ferocity train rolling, it just seems that it's too easy to take them out before that. And since it's such a huge amount of percentage-based defense loss, mods can only help you before they take a turn, as they effectively will have 0 defense after they start gaining stacks.
I think testers should be mired.
Here's another alternative. If they feel that the Anti-Assist Zeta applying to all Sith Empire is too strong (it's not, with Ferocity)...make it apply to him and Bastila only, maybe HK too. They certainly have plenty of chemistry so this is just one more piece of that.
If Darth Revan had in his leader ability "Jedi can't gain bonus speed from leader abilities" or "Jedi have -30 to -40 speed" that could potentially help this team. We should not have to wait for Malak to make this Journey toon arena viable.
I farmed and spent crystals like candy for this?
Won't make this mistake again, that's for **** sure
Imagine the JKR team without GMY or Kenobi... that's basically Darth Revan.
This really sucks
This is another great alternative suggestion!
That could have been BSF's zeta ability.
The revan would use his saber throw TM swap first to cleanse and swap TM, but they're all so fast youd have the same result
Agree 100%. I don't think it's fun when a character is dealing significant damage to their own teammates on a consistent basis. I think it's a terrible mechanic. I haven't used D Revan yet so I can't comment on that, but GG's damage to his teammates is what makes that team so disappointing.
"Whenever a Sith empire ally is marked, or death marked, HK47 gains 100% TM and the cooldown of this ability is reset. Applies healing immunity if target is Jedi. This cannot be resisted"
It also has 0 to do with anything canon involving Darth Revan or KOTOR... at least with GG it made sense.
You make it so it stay in effect until BSF takes her turn. There are simple fixes there.
DKR is good in killing JKR but the issue is that DSR squad too squishy...you lose either HK or FSB...you lose.
Honestly, DKR should have had DN like skills with drains and annihilate.
Yeah the Sith Empire team desperately needs a healer or healing mechanic.
I never said there should be no downside. I think the concept of gaining a powerful buff at a cost is good. I think the downsides in the game are too severe. Especially for GG.
Highly possible that malak is that toon. He keeps eating jedis in bacta tanks in the final fight of KOTOR
agreed...like bb8 with JTR or r2 with CLS.