The pointing direcction after the last releases (not only DR/Malak)

DeepChu
185 posts Member
Hi all,

I just wanted to share a little concern about the direction is taking the game.

I've been playing from almost the beginning (2 month and half after release), and this is a game I truly enjoy.

I have playe as F2P and since chaze release, managed to get to the top positions on my shard, which gave me the chance to be truly competitive. I have missed some major releases the first time (JTR or JKR) but I always keep the track and got them 2nd round they came back.

Point is, for all the factions, releases, stuff, we could chose the toons of the faction to use/get while focusing on finishing other teams in the meantime (when Thrawn, for example, the strecher one, you had 6 phoenix)

You could manage to share your resources between being prepared for the new meta and develop other teams you liked / needed, just with the resources of being in a top guild and getting top 3 on both arenas (no money spent).

Even with chewie, c3po events, where there were some mandatory toons to do the event, you could manage to do it with others, even if it were much more difficult (I could manage to do c3po one without Paploo, although it was hard as hell).

But since Old republic toons arrived this has changed. We needed the 5 released OR toons to get JKR (all 5, only 5, no choices here) Ok, it is a hero's journey event, so you would need 5 fixed toons anyway, but the point is, there were no more OR toons. Ok, next one was DR, where you needed another 5 OR/Sith empire toons (same as before, the 5 that just were released). So the 10 new released toons were needed to get the 2 new shiny toys, and this just went worse when we were forced to (almost) g12 those toons (first time this happen) to get Malak, the next unnanounced and shortest event release shiny toon.

I almost lose it because I focused on Greedo in the middle to finish my BH team.

Point is, for first time, I need to use all my resources to keep on track to the meta. I am forced to unlock/gear all the toons CG/EA want me to unlock/gear if I want to keep on track with the meta, and being in top spots (which allwos me to get the crystals to be on track)

I cannot focus in other toons I would like to have to finish teams or help my guild or wathever I want, and in my opinion this is taking a lot of fun from the game.

This is just my case and my opinion, but I think that if me, as a F2P player who gets 800+ crystals daily can barely compete to stay on meta without spending, the gap between us and players outside top20 which don't spend will be huge very fast (huger and faster than it was) which will lead to not even try to spend for them because they will never get on top.

ASnd for the top players, if you are forced to play the game only as EA/CG wants and not like you want it, yeah, it is not gonna last long.

Well, that's it. I truly enjoy the game, but if it continues this way, I don't think this is gonna last.

See you on the holotables and let's see how the new stuff is.

Replies

  • DeepChu wrote: »
    But since Old republic toons arrived this has changed. We needed the 5 released OR toons to get JKR (all 5, only 5, no choices here) Ok, it is a hero's journey event, so you would need 5 fixed toons anyway, but the point is, there were no more OR toons. Ok, next one was DR, where you needed another 5 OR/Sith empire toons (same as before, the 5 that just were released). So the 10 new released toons were needed to get the 2 new shiny toys...
    Well, actually 9, HK-47 was realeased long before Darth Revan.
  • And that will probably be going forward where legendary events will require a new tag so u dont get a whole faction like jedi galactic republic empire ect even if they are oart of it to limit the event to the 5 or 6 new toons for the event and heroes journey types are always going to require 5 specific toons but probably wont see many needing older toon but only the newer ones going forward. 1 reason is theres no money in useing older toons they are a business so they will come first 99% of the time. 2 it reduces the stress of farming new toons which causes panic spending (yes kinda like the 1st one) cause u all ready got them. 3 if they do use toons that we have they will probably be similar to chewy/c3po or even like the malak toons depending on how exclusive/pay wall they want the toon.

    I definitely see going forward no new legendary/heros journey toons will be available 1st go around as a ftp if u are not well prepared saved crystals/gear or even predict the event to a degree.
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
    And that will probably be going forward where legendary events will require a new tag so u dont get a whole faction like jedi galactic republic empire ect even if they are oart of it to limit the event to the 5 or 6 new toons for the event and heroes journey types are always going to require 5 specific toons but probably wont see many needing older toon but only the newer ones going forward. 1 reason is theres no money in useing older toons they are a business so they will come first 99% of the time. 2 it reduces the stress of farming new toons which causes panic spending (yes kinda like the 1st one) cause u all ready got them. 3 if they do use toons that we have they will probably be similar to chewy/c3po or even like the malak toons depending on how exclusive/pay wall they want the toon.

    I definitely see going forward no new legendary/heros journey toons will be available 1st go around as a ftp if u are not well prepared saved crystals/gear or even predict the event to a degree.

    Not true, given the recent-ish examples. We got two Journey events - JKR and DR - that required specific characters. We also got three Legendaries - Chewie, C-3PO, Mil F - that required anything from a given faction (Mil F being an outlier due to general lack of ships). So if anything, it seems that the model stays the same and they are just upping the gear requirements for Legendaries.
  • DeepChu
    185 posts Member
    _Reaper_ wrote: »
    DeepChu wrote: »
    But since Old republic toons arrived this has changed. We needed the 5 released OR toons to get JKR (all 5, only 5, no choices here) Ok, it is a hero's journey event, so you would need 5 fixed toons anyway, but the point is, there were no more OR toons. Ok, next one was DR, where you needed another 5 OR/Sith empire toons (same as before, the 5 that just were released). So the 10 new released toons were needed to get the 2 new shiny toys...
    Well, actually 9, HK-47 was realeased long before Darth Revan.

    True, he just got the OR tag with an update, but the point is still valid. You needed all OR toons.
  • Nauros wrote: »
    And that will probably be going forward where legendary events will require a new tag so u dont get a whole faction like jedi galactic republic empire ect even if they are oart of it to limit the event to the 5 or 6 new toons for the event and heroes journey types are always going to require 5 specific toons but probably wont see many needing older toon but only the newer ones going forward. 1 reason is theres no money in useing older toons they are a business so they will come first 99% of the time. 2 it reduces the stress of farming new toons which causes panic spending (yes kinda like the 1st one) cause u all ready got them. 3 if they do use toons that we have they will probably be similar to chewy/c3po or even like the malak toons depending on how exclusive/pay wall they want the toon.

    I definitely see going forward no new legendary/heros journey toons will be available 1st go around as a ftp if u are not well prepared saved crystals/gear or even predict the event to a degree.

    Not true, given the recent-ish examples. We got two Journey events - JKR and DR - that required specific characters. We also got three Legendaries - Chewie, C-3PO, Mil F - that required anything from a given faction (Mil F being an outlier due to general lack of ships). So if anything, it seems that the model stays the same and they are just upping the gear requirements for Legendaries.

    Read my 3 it says if they use toons that we have it will be like chewy/c3po or malak events
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    So what you're saying is that "we" can't gear/farm any side projects anymore if "we" want to keep unlocking the latest and greatest (legendary/journey toons), even if we're getting 800 daily from the arena's.
    Please correct me if that's not what you're saying.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • leef wrote: »
    So what you're saying is that "we" can't gear/farm any side projects anymore if "we" want to keep unlocking the latest and greatest (legendary/journey toons), even if we're getting 800 daily from the arena's.
    Please correct me if that's not what you're saying.

    Not exactly cause it depends on if there is down time or not and depending on how hard u want to farm side projects but probably wont be qble to as much as a few would want to with the speed they want but if u want all the new toons just incase u would probably be very limited especially if u dont do the 3x 50 refreshes on ls/ds energy
  • leef wrote: »
    So what you're saying is that "we" can't gear/farm any side projects anymore if "we" want to keep unlocking the latest and greatest (legendary/journey toons), even if we're getting 800 daily from the arena's.
    Please correct me if that's not what you're saying.

    I am pointing that way, yes. I said it was only my opinion, but lately the resources needed to keep on track with the meta are bigger and bigger. One year ago you could chase the meta and do other projects with top resources and now you need to focus all on chasing the meta.

    Of course not chaising it is an entirely valid option, but that won't be good for CG/EA interest as it doesn't give profit.

    And for me, i like to stay competitive on top, and if I can't stay there with all the F2P resources then my interest in the game will diminish.

    Again this is only my opinion.
  • The inflation is much too high and there is no more need for spending money. Only if you are a whale you can stay competitive.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    DeepChu wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    So what you're saying is that "we" can't gear/farm any side projects anymore if "we" want to keep unlocking the latest and greatest (legendary/journey toons), even if we're getting 800 daily from the arena's.
    Please correct me if that's not what you're saying.

    I am pointing that way, yes. I said it was only my opinion, but lately the resources needed to keep on track with the meta are bigger and bigger. One year ago you could chase the meta and do other projects with top resources and now you need to focus all on chasing the meta.

    Of course not chaising it is an entirely valid option, but that won't be good for CG/EA interest as it doesn't give profit.

    And for me, i like to stay competitive on top, and if I can't stay there with all the F2P resources then my interest in the game will diminish.

    Again this is only my opinion.

    I personally haven't really felt that way, but i have to admit that i skipped gearing alot of toons i kinda wanted to gear just to hoard and be ready for anything.
    Also, the side project i did invest resources in so happened to be Carth & co, so i got rather lucky on that one.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • In my opinion, CG has pretty much shot themselves in the foot with how things have developed in this game. Quite a few people are actually quitting because of how CG is handling the release of these latest characters. Maybe their intent is to start weeding out the F2P / minnows / Dolphins and if so, congratulations, because it's working.

    Also, instead of dangling a carrot to be just out of reach of your F2P / minnow player that they need to spend a little money to get it, they've made it so that carrot is so far out of reach that it is discouraging them to spend anything. I would consider myself a minnow and I know that I won't spend anything anytime soon because there's no point. It's turned into an all or nothing game when it comes to spending and call me crazy, but I'm just not willing to get a second mortgage on my home to keep up.

    If you want this game to turn into a Game of Whales, keep it up, CG. But without some dolphins or minnows for those whales to feed on, this game will soon become an empty husk.
  • WookieWookie
    1460 posts Member
    edited April 2019
    IMHO, Darth Revan was too easy to acquire, due to the delay of his release and the extra ~2 weeks players had to farm only 4 new characters (as opposed to 5 for JKR), which is why EA/CG wanted other ways of monetizing (new gear, Malak) what their development team spent so much time and passion on getting right (DR was a good way to add diversity without the crazy power creep of JKR).

    For F2P, this is the best of both worlds, as anyone with any pulse on the forums or the game direction should have been farming the second set of OR toons, and likely has DR, even if they missed Malak, but given that even the whales (save for those who somehow had ~70k Guild Event Currency) will be waiting 2+ months to get him 7*, so F2P will only be missing a couple of months of playing with 7* G12 DR over whales, and in the mean time while they prepare for the event, will be able to hoard the currency needed to rush him from 5* to 7*, as well as slow-farm the gear pieces rather than buy them from shipments if they chose to.

    IMHO, this was the best possible outcome for EA/CG to make their quarter profits while F2P had access to at least DR, even if they missed Malak this time around.

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  • I think it’s certainly a problem.

    There’s simply too much content and teams take far too long to farm for most to catch up.

    Of course p2p are going to get teams sooner that’s fine. However I think it takes far too long to build a team up from base to be useable.

    I’ve been putting together Nightsisters for 6 months. 6 MONTHS!

    The grind is oppressive.
  • As a former minnow, spent $50-&80 a month, I learned this lesson back with JKR. Buying the marquee packs and some crystals last summer I expected with farming and refreshes I would be ready. Nope. Was gonna cost me another $400 in the end to get JKR. The $120 I had spent in preparation was wasted. CG made it abundantly clear that unless you’re gonna whale out then it’s not worth it. Went FTP from then on. Sad to see really, game was really fun. Now seems likes it’s on a downward spiral, with people leaving.
  • Javin37
    367 posts Member
    I’ve been putting together Nightsisters for 6 months. 6 MONTHS!

    The grind is oppressive.

    Took me a year...year and half to finish spirit.
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
    I think it’s certainly a problem.

    There’s simply too much content and teams take far too long to farm for most to catch up.

    Of course p2p are going to get teams sooner that’s fine. However I think it takes far too long to build a team up from base to be useable.

    I’ve been putting together Nightsisters for 6 months. 6 MONTHS!

    The grind is oppressive.

    Yeah, the consequences of killing the stores are showing. We desperately need another step in the release cadence where characters get added to some really easy location after, say, a year they have been out.
  • This is so true. I’m a day one player that never miss anything. I do all the events, challenge, raids, TW, GA. Everything every day. I’ve been first in both arenas almost every day for over a year. I never, ever hoarded in this game and I missed Thrawn first time, same with JTR and Revan. After Revan I felt that I should hoard for next time around. Since then most of my focus has gone for Revan and his team, **** and the team, DR and Malak. I had 18 k crystals when the farm for DR started, bought the new gear for him and was 100% ready for Malak and bought his gear too. Now I have 1100 crystals and haven’t done much outside just Revan, DR, **** and Malak for 6 months. I like having those, but I want to work on other teams too, but now I have to put second zeta on Malak, then hoard 15 k crystals, 2 zetas and enough gear for a new toon G12 before I can even think of putting anything in another team. So if we get a new toon/rework/demand within 1 month it’s no way for me to spend anything. Because as a F2P getting top 10 in Sith and first in arenas it’s not an option to slack behind. And now I feel the stress of a meta change in Fleet, one that probably will be like Mace/BH, something that was hard to beat and when a F2P farmed it a wasted effort due to meta change. Game lacks diversity, the meta and close to meta in arenas and GA/TW is uniform to say the least. EA/CG says “use this team or lose”
  • I agree completely. I've been playing a little over a year, and I've always had a nice balance between farming the toons I want vs. farming the toons I need. But that changed completely in the last 3 months or so––it seems like I have to exclusively farm the stuff I need and there's nothing left for the stuff I want. If that makes sense.
  • Kotor junk ruined a fun star wars game.

    Played for years but i dont want to see the SW characters i know and love to collect getting steamrolled by 2 versions of somebody who means nothing to me (revan) and his nemesis (malak)...

    Zero interest in collecting or using any of the above 3 characters. Zero interest in collecting or using any of the other "off brand" old republic characters

    Instead of giving us Dryden Vos we get malak? Who the kitten is malak? Why the hell would i care about collecting some character i have never heard of.. hes not in any movie..hes not even a bit-part, hes the villian in a random videogame most of us never even played. (And i play a LOT of videogames..)

    Giving the kotor fans some kotor content in SWGOH was never a problem. Making kotor content META defineing must-have characters that dominate the arena with a 90% marketshare for months IS A PROBLEM and you are losing customers because of it.
  • DeepChu
    185 posts Member
    DarthWok wrote: »
    Kotor junk ruined a fun star wars game.

    KoToR stuff is fine. The way they are releasing it... not so much. Also there is a ton of people who love KoToR and they also deserve to have their hero's on meta :smile:

    New metas will come and replace KoToR, but if they continue to release them like this, very few will be there to get them...
  • AnnerDoon
    1353 posts Member
    DeepChu wrote: »
    DarthWok wrote: »
    Kotor junk ruined a fun star wars game.

    KoToR stuff is fine. The way they are releasing it... not so much. Also there is a ton of people who love KoToR and they also deserve to have their hero's on meta :smile:

    I’m more into kit assessment and theory crafting than specific characters, so it doesn’t really matter to me if I’m looking at Revan’s kit or Bistan’s kit. I’ll make my gameplay decisions based on how I can best use a given character. But, if people really want KOTOR stuff, they can play KOTOR. They don’t ‘deserve’ to have those characters dominate the meta any more than those that prefer Rogue One or Clone Wars characters.
  • DeepChu
    185 posts Member
    AnnerDoon wrote: »
    DeepChu wrote: »
    DarthWok wrote: »
    Kotor junk ruined a fun star wars game.

    KoToR stuff is fine. The way they are releasing it... not so much. Also there is a ton of people who love KoToR and they also deserve to have their hero's on meta :smile:

    I’m more into kit assessment and theory crafting than specific characters, so it doesn’t really matter to me if I’m looking at Revan’s kit or Bistan’s kit. I’ll make my gameplay decisions based on how I can best use a given character. But, if people really want KOTOR stuff, they can play KOTOR. They don’t ‘deserve’ to have those characters dominate the meta any more than those that prefer Rogue One or Clone Wars characters.

    Sure, that is what i said they ALSO deserve, next meta will be for Resistance lovers, or First Order, or clone wars related, who knows. Every main faction will have its time, eventually.
  • AnnerDoon wrote: »
    DeepChu wrote: »
    DarthWok wrote: »
    Kotor junk ruined a fun star wars game.

    KoToR stuff is fine. The way they are releasing it... not so much. Also there is a ton of people who love KoToR and they also deserve to have their hero's on meta :smile:

    I’m more into kit assessment and theory crafting than specific characters, so it doesn’t really matter to me if I’m looking at Revan’s kit or Bistan’s kit. I’ll make my gameplay decisions based on how I can best use a given character. But, if people really want KOTOR stuff, they can play KOTOR. They don’t ‘deserve’ to have those characters dominate the meta any more than those that prefer Rogue One or Clone Wars characters.

    Um, people who pay do actually deserve to have a better team than those who dont pay.
    You know, they fund this game, and you must give some incentive for them to spend.

    Theorycrafting is fine, and if you enjoy it, do it, by all means, but it should allow you to break top50, and not nr 1, in my opinion.
  • I disagree. No victory should be determined solely by how thick one’s wallet is.
  • AnnerDoon wrote: »
    I disagree. No victory should be determined solely by how thick one’s wallet is.

    Ever learnt history?
    Basically all victories were determined solely by how thick one's 'wallet' was.
  • Nauros
    5429 posts Member
    AnnerDoon wrote: »
    I disagree. No victory should be determined solely by how thick one’s wallet is.

    Ever learnt history?
    Basically all victories were determined solely by how thick one's 'wallet' was.

    You know your arguments are thin when you have to stretch a debate about a mobile game this far...
  • CG obviously can't be interested in designing a game where a lot of F2P players can stay competitive in all aspects of it (both arenas, HSR, GA, etc.). That would simply violate their business model and disencourage a lot of people that are spending and thereby keeping the game alive. Don't get me wrong, there'll always be a few F2P players that "beat the system" by either being very disciplined with hoarding gear and crystals and/or predicting the next meta, which is perfectly fine but there simply cannot or should not be very many of them. For the record, I did spend some money on the game but didn't get JKR or Malak upon 1st release. From my perspective there are basically two problems.
    The first problem so to speak is that we had a rather long period last year where the game was very F2P friendly with the EP meta that was still good enough to get top spots after more and more Traya squads started to show up. A lot of F2P or minnows were getting used to top5 spots at payout but those who didn't hoard a lot of crystals and gear were disappointed as they couldn't get or compete with JKR when he was released. Most of them farmed the OR toons to get him the 2nd time but were then finding themselves in a pond full of JKRs where everyone could beat the other so they had to refresh once or twice to reach top5. And now there is Malak entering the meta who is one of the most difficult / expensive to unlock in the history of the game. So in the end a lot of people think the game is getting worse simply because they compare it to more F2P friendly times.
    The second problem is the combination of (lack of) communication, kit releases and multiple reworks to fix "loopholes" by CG that makes them look like a bunch of amateurs. I was happy to see that DR was actually bringing rock paper scissors to the meta with a huge variety of teams inside top20 but then had to realise that it obviously happend inadvertently. They simply overlooked how previous metas toons were fitting into the scheme.
    Unfortunatley, both problems look like they are here to stay. Most players won't change their mind and always complain that the game is getting worse if they can't keep their level of competitiveness that they were getting used to. I also have little hope that CG will avoid those mistakes in future as we are getting more and more toons with more complex kits that will make it almost impossible to foresee all possible interactions. CG will also never be so honest to say that throughout a year they do need certain paywalls in the game and one that temporarily locks top spots of squad arena is by far the most profitable one. On the other hand, they shouldn't even have to say that as it is common sense but a lot of players are simply too naive to realize it or keep telling themselves that there must be other ways to fund the game (yes, there are but they might generate less turnover).
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