New raid structure?

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Citadel_of_Ricks
151 posts Member
edited May 18
Someone might have suggested this before, sorry if it is a rehashed idea, I haven't seen it yet. I was having a discussion in my guild about someone soloing the Rancor and whether it matters. I was thinking to myself, it's kind of counterintuitive that we have a game mode where we are essentially competing against our own guildmates. It's not the end of the world, but I think there might be a better way.

What if we had a new raid where the awards/prizes increased the more total damage a guild could do over a set period of time? So everyone gives it their all for 2 days or whatever the time is and then prize ranks are based on damage, but the prize tiers also increase as the guild as a whole does more damage. You get better prizes the more damage you do relative to other guildmates, but you also all get better prizes the more damage everyone does. Win-win.

Before you say that is territory battles, it really isn't. TB, you end up deploying a ton of good teams that do no damage and once you complete a mission, you're done, you don't get to hit until your team is defeated.

Replies

  • Yeah this has been proposed ever since the rancor got released. It's old news. I don't think the devs ever talked about it, so I assume the raid structure will stay the same. But I'd definitely like a change.
  • Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    Ok, limit it to your 10 best teams over 2 days.
  • Monel
    1476 posts Member
    Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    Ok, limit it to your 10 best teams over 2 days.

    The problem is the battle doesn't change, that's where it gets boring. Plus you never win, ever see Karate Kid 2 that dude was chopping at the same piece of drift wood for over 50 years. I mean that at least had symbolism, you are proposing boredom after fight 3. The game gets stale enough even when there are rounds like GA and TB. But when you just pound the same object even only 10 times and what's the point.

    I like where your head is about not competing against your own guild for rewards but that can be fixed just by balancing the rewards the way they did with raid sims for Rancor.
  • Monel wrote: »
    Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    Ok, limit it to your 10 best teams over 2 days.

    The problem is the battle doesn't change, that's where it gets boring. Plus you never win, ever see Karate Kid 2 that dude was chopping at the same piece of drift wood for over 50 years. I mean that at least had symbolism, you are proposing boredom after fight 3. The game gets stale enough even when there are rounds like GA and TB. But when you just pound the same object even only 10 times and what's the point.

    I like where your head is about not competing against your own guild for rewards but that can be fixed just by balancing the rewards the way they did with raid sims for Rancor.

    You are definitely entitled to your take. I think for me it would be interesting to try to hit new levels personally and as a guild (it's a game, we never really "accomplish" anything), especially if the new levels came with solid rewards. Also, the battle changes as you try different teams and compositions, just like every other part of this game.

    I suspect you play arena with 5 of your 173 7* characters, are you saying that is not akin to hitting "meta driftwood" over and over and doing the same thing every day? Maybe it only happens twice a month or something. Fighting Traya over and over with the same five teams doesn't fit your driftwood metaphor, as well?

    In the proposed version, everyone gets to play, everyone gets rewards based on their guild's overall performance and everyone gets rewards based on their personal performance.
  • Kernal
    3 posts Member
    Add a mythic raid tier:
    Each phase lasts 24 hours
    Each player gets N attempts (3? 5?)
    Everyone gets rewards based on guild total damage
    Everyone gets rewards based on individual contribution.
  • Hantal86
    216 posts Member
    The reward system does need looking at as the top ten are never being caught by the lower due to better gearing, but I don’t think a non beatable battle is the answer
  • Malachi
    60 posts Member
    I think OP's idea is awesome. DPS is fun. DPS bonuses are fun. We all know that the bottom 50% of your roster wouldn't do any damage anyway, so you could only really hit hard for what.. 5-10 teams with a higher GP? I think character power level requirement would be a good standard, set for around 4/5 stars and gear 7/8.

    Seriously, great idea for a fun raid!
  • Malachi
    60 posts Member
    What would REALLY make the raid great is if they planned on every mechanic to work as intended so we can actually use the roster we build up. Turn meter removal, debuffs, fracture, the whole thing. Less annihilate of course! They could even rework the old school high DPS toons and get newer players to invest in them.. Lando, Wiggs, Leia. Come out with a few new high DPS characters/leads. I'd like to see Saw Gerrera in game.. 😁
  • Monel
    1476 posts Member
    Malachi wrote: »
    I think OP's idea is awesome. DPS is fun. DPS bonuses are fun. We all know that the bottom 50% of your roster wouldn't do any damage anyway, so you could only really hit hard for what.. 5-10 teams with a higher GP? I think character power level requirement would be a good standard, set for around 4/5 stars and gear 7/8.

    Seriously, great idea for a fun raid!

    But if the goal was to see how much you could hit, you would use the bottom the of your roster everytime to try and improve.
  • Monel
    1476 posts Member
    Monel wrote: »
    Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    Ok, limit it to your 10 best teams over 2 days.

    The problem is the battle doesn't change, that's where it gets boring. Plus you never win, ever see Karate Kid 2 that dude was chopping at the same piece of drift wood for over 50 years. I mean that at least had symbolism, you are proposing boredom after fight 3. The game gets stale enough even when there are rounds like GA and TB. But when you just pound the same object even only 10 times and what's the point.

    I like where your head is about not competing against your own guild for rewards but that can be fixed just by balancing the rewards the way they did with raid sims for Rancor.

    You are definitely entitled to your take. I think for me it would be interesting to try to hit new levels personally and as a guild (it's a game, we never really "accomplish" anything), especially if the new levels came with solid rewards. Also, the battle changes as you try different teams and compositions, just like every other part of this game.

    I suspect you play arena with 5 of your 173 7* characters, are you saying that is not akin to hitting "meta driftwood" over and over and doing the same thing every day? Maybe it only happens twice a month or something. Fighting Traya over and over with the same five teams doesn't fit your driftwood metaphor, as well?

    In the proposed version, everyone gets to play, everyone gets rewards based on their guild's overall performance and everyone gets rewards based on their personal performance.

    I do feel arena is meta driftwood and more often than not I only do 2 attacks per day for this very reason. Also I almost never do an attack in raids anymore for the same reason. I mostly play to collect, and hang with my guild.

    Your proposed version of rewards is great, just dont need another beat my head against the wall scenario especially when I literally can never win.
  • Malachi
    60 posts Member
    Look, NO one is going to play an event 35 times. Even when I was a newer player, I understood that a character wasn't viable until they were at gear 8. If the idea is to do damage, I'm not going to put in a 3 star gear 5 team to get 1000 more damage in a multi-million scored raid. So minimum requirements make sense. Not high requirements, just something to keep the player base from going crazy.
  • Monel
    1476 posts Member
    Malachi wrote: »
    Look, NO one is going to play an event 35 times. Even when I was a newer player, I understood that a character wasn't viable until they were at gear 8. If the idea is to do damage, I'm not going to put in a 3 star gear 5 team to get 1000 more damage in a multi-million scored raid. So minimum requirements make sense. Not high requirements, just something to keep the player base from going crazy.

    Agree to disagree.
  • evoluza
    2289 posts Member
    Sure they change it at some point.
    They can't force guild's in that reward battle for ever. These rewards are actually destroying competitive guild's
  • Rockmover67
    2 posts Member
    edited May 18
    Best idea for something like this would be pitting lower level guildmates (say below level 70) against each other with rewards structured as they are while giving each high level guildmate their own Rancor. High level players get rewards for completing and put their scores in a pool for guild wide rewards. The more high level players a guild has the more benefits the guild as a whole receives. Or just have solo and participate buttons, if you can solo the raid then your score is pooled for the grand prize, if you cannot then you wittle it down until you can.
  • Waqui
    6025 posts Member
    I was thinking to myself, it's kind of counterintuitive that we have a game mode where we are essentially competing against our own guildmates.

    From a guild perspective it's completely irrelevant which member wins rank 1 prize and which member wins rank 50 prize. The guild as a whole wins the same amount of prizes disregarding what order the members are ranked.
    What if we had a new raid where the awards/prizes increased the more total damage a guild could do over a set period of time? So everyone gives it their all for 2 days or whatever the time is and then prize ranks are based on damage, but the prize tiers also increase as the guild as a whole does more damage.

    No, thank you. The game consumes enough time as it is. I like that some players can sit out without hurting the guild (as long as the raid is on farm).
  • NicWester
    6732 posts Member
    I was thinking to myself, it's kind of counterintuitive that we have a game mode where we are essentially competing against our own guildmates.

    That's not an unreasonable thing to think. But the answer to this was Territory Wars and Battles, where the entire guild works together to get equal rewards independent of individual contribution.

    Sometimes the answer to an incongruous game mode isn't to change the mode, but to introduce something congruous.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • Sith raid aside, there are teams that render Rancor and haat to a never-ending battle. Unless it’s a timed event, there would be teams that could score infinite points on auto, especially on Rancor.
  • Monel
    1476 posts Member
    Sith raid aside, there are teams that render Rancor and haat to a never-ending battle. Unless it’s a timed event, there would be teams that could score infinite points on auto, especially on Rancor.

    Good point, so basically TM bonuses would have to be removed or limited.
  • DrowningFerret
    102 posts Member
    edited May 19
    Fate/Grand Order kind of does this. They handled it as an all player combined event (the game was lacking in guilds and pvp). I think it was handled as with every toon can attack once per day, you get event currency for doing damage, and the store to spend the currency got better as server wide damage thresholds we're met. There may have been more to it than that was well.
  • burby888
    42 posts Member
    Nice idea thinking outside the box but you would have people picking the squad to auto solo it and just plug your phone in a leave it lol. 24-48hrs of CLS and Raid Han kicking the crap out of the rancor.
  • burby888 wrote: »
    Nice idea thinking outside the box but you would have people picking the squad to auto solo it and just plug your phone in a leave it lol. 24-48hrs of CLS and Raid Han kicking the crap out of the rancor.

    Exactly what I said 3 comments above yours.
  • Dk_rek
    3180 posts Member
    edited May 19
    Monel wrote: »
    Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    Ok, limit it to your 10 best teams over 2 days.

    The problem is the battle doesn't change, that's where it gets boring. Plus you never win, ever see Karate Kid 2 that dude was chopping at the same piece of drift wood for over 50 years. .

    And miyagi OHKO’s the thing. Sato should give him 10 million for not killing him in 30 seconds 50 yrs prior
  • Monel wrote: »
    There are 173 characters in game right now, that would mean I need to do the same battle 35 times to deliver max damage for max rewards. Nice thinking but no thanks.

    I would have to agree. That said, an easy way to reward big damage is to keep the raid gameplay exactly like it is, but any "bonus" damage done would increase the chance to get better gear. That way you wouldn't have to play any longer than normal to solo, but the more people that solo it, the better the rewards.
    I would do something like this: Reward rank = Normal reward rank - (Total damge / total health - 1).
    If you did twice as much damage as you needed, then the player that ranked 11 would rank 10, and so on. The advantage to this would be that anyone who soloed the raid would be guaranteed a #1 slot, and the more people that soloed the better everyone else's rewards would be (though still not as good as for those that put in all the effort).
  • SemiGod
    1925 posts Member
    Someone might have suggested this before, sorry if it is a rehashed idea, I haven't seen it yet. I was having a discussion in my guild about someone soloing the Rancor and whether it matters. I was thinking to myself, it's kind of counterintuitive that we have a game mode where we are essentially competing against our own guildmates. It's not the end of the world, but I think there might be a better way.

    What if we had a new raid where the awards/prizes increased the more total damage a guild could do over a set period of time? So everyone gives it their all for 2 days or whatever the time is and then prize ranks are based on damage, but the prize tiers also increase as the guild as a whole does more damage. You get better prizes the more damage you do relative to other guildmates, but you also all get better prizes the more damage everyone does. Win-win.

    Before you say that is territory battles, it really isn't. TB, you end up deploying a ton of good teams that do no damage and once you complete a mission, you're done, you don't get to hit until your team is defeated.

    Heh what happens if theres an infinite loop glitch and someone deals 100m ex(traya & old finn) I guess the rewards would be pre nice then. Lol 300000 stun guns.
  • Just gimme my death star raid, but Instead of only ships do something like phase 1 dark side trying to stop the ewoks/rebels on endor, phase 2 light side fighting the empire, phase 3 DS ships trying to stop the attack on the death star, phase 4 LS ships attacking the death star boom yay everyone gets Luke's x wing shards.
  • TheRealSiaGranta
    24 posts Member
    edited May 20
    Change the pit and the Haat to 2 day time limit where damage is not shared amongst the guild (after you have completed it x times). Everyone in the guild has 48 hours to either solo it or do as much damage as they like. Everyone that does solo it gets = 1st. Problem solved.
  • Jarvind
    2747 posts Member
    I like the idea of an "unwinnable" battle where you just slug it out as hard as you can, but I don't think it makes sense as a replacement for current raid mechanics. More like a new game mode entirely.
  • TVF
    17230 posts Member
    Jarvind wrote: »
    I like the idea of an "unwinnable" battle

    Then you should be asking CG to put you up against me in GA ;)
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Jarvind
    2747 posts Member
    TVF wrote: »
    Jarvind wrote: »
    I like the idea of an "unwinnable" battle

    Then you should be asking CG to put you up against me in GA ;)

    I would love this but your GP is about 500k higher than mine. Put your progression on hold for a couple months, k?
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