Scouting g12 Revan team with no mods

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I scout a top g12 team and there are no mods on them but then you fight them and they out speed your plus 100 speed modded Meta team. then I look and all of this guys teams have no mods in tw scouting.

Is this cheating or just a failure by the game to load the stats.

Several max g12 enemy teams have no mods but they seem to have 150 or 200 speed bonus from something... The middle of the road teams all have mods.

If you scout a g12 Revan team without any mods does that mean the setting player moved his mods to another team after registering for the tw?

His characters seem to be really fast... Maybe the game isn't loading all the data?

Anyone else run into this

Replies

  • Sounds like they’ve got preloaded turn meter from a previous battle.
  • KalHorn
    102 posts Member
    Are you scouting his roster or the squad set in the GA arena itself?

    If the former he could be removing all his modsets to conceal a competitive advantage. However this would also make exploiting the GA mod lock bug that much easier and maybe he should be reported.

    If the latter then that doesn’t make any sense and he should definitely be reported.
  • The squad set in GA like before the battle the screen where you can cluck and holden the face to see his character.

    Some have mods others have nothing
  • BobcatSkywalker
    2194 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    It's just odd to me that someone would remove all mods completely from their tw defense teams. His g12 JTR no mods. His g12 Revan no mods. I fought both teams and they were pretty fast.
  • Was at 0 battles so not preloaded tm.
  • That sounds like exploiting the mod bug.
  • So when someone is exploiting the mod bug their units appear without any mods? Is that true?
  • Not necessarily. But sounds like this person has stripped mods off good teams for 2 reasons.

    1) so they can put them back on for unsuspecting TW opponents to get wiped.

    2) so they had lower GP at GA lock time and can do exactly the same thing to those opponents.
  • Shaddes wrote: »
    He could just be moving mods around for raids and other stuff, no need to report someone for that
    Report it. If you are seeing a players locked screen and there are no mods that is generally someone exploiting the cheat not “just moving mods around”
  • It cant have anything to do with him just happening to be moving mods around for a raid or summin since the mods lock how he had them at time of tw or ga lock so at tht point his team would have no mods for rest of the battles. Even if he puts mods back on them after the lock to use in arena or raid the team in tw/ga is stil locked with no mods. So u should look at his spd an then yours n see who is supposed to go first an then if any char goes first than wht u had determined then theres funny business goin on but if ur char tht u determined to go first ends up goin first an then his chars just seem fast during course of battle its prob just the tm gain from leadership. If u have to take pics as proof of everyone’s spd b4 the start of battle do so an then when u start the battle either record it or slow it down n take a pic so u have proof to back up ur claim. If ur gonna report someone an possibly have them banned be sure they are cheating.
  • KalHorn
    102 posts Member
    Agreed
  • TVF
    36524 posts Member
    Shaddes wrote: »
    He could just be moving mods around for raids and other stuff, no need to report someone for that
    Report it. If you are seeing a players locked screen and there are no mods that is generally someone exploiting the cheat not “just moving mods around”

    I don't understand this. If I'm running a raid when lock occurs, there's a good chance my best mods are not on my best team. And that's what you'll see the whole event, my raid state of mods.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF wrote: »
    Shaddes wrote: »
    He could just be moving mods around for raids and other stuff, no need to report someone for that
    Report it. If you are seeing a players locked screen and there are no mods that is generally someone exploiting the cheat not “just moving mods around”

    I don't understand this. If I'm running a raid when lock occurs, there's a good chance my best mods are not on my best team. And that's what you'll see the whole event, my raid state of mods.
    Error on their part where mods don't lock
  • TVF
    36524 posts Member
    SmurfLAX28 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Shaddes wrote: »
    He could just be moving mods around for raids and other stuff, no need to report someone for that
    Report it. If you are seeing a players locked screen and there are no mods that is generally someone exploiting the cheat not “just moving mods around”

    I don't understand this. If I'm running a raid when lock occurs, there's a good chance my best mods are not on my best team. And that's what you'll see the whole event, my raid state of mods.
    Error on their part where mods don't lock

    Yeah but I just told you why my mods would look like that. No exploit needed.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • These guys were so overmatched verus us I don't blame him for doing whatever the game permits...

    we won the tw like always since we sandbag quite a bit of GP for the 3rd zeta guarantee so I'd feel bad if we also report them and get them banned for losing... That's just cold...

    Im actually of the personal belief that devs should control the game by mechanics and players should never be punished for manipulating the game they are given.

    Was curious about the appearance of no mods and what that meant / if anyone else ran into this etc... Thanks for the input...

    If we ever do lose a tw I'll look for guys without mods to report for revenge :)
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced. The amount of "punishment" comparatively would be much less significant than the advantage currently gained by those gaming the system.

    A single set of 6 dot mods on one character is worth almost 2k in GP. People gaming the system are pulling off full teams' worth of 6 dot mods - in effect creating space for a full extra maxed character or two. That's part of the reason some GA matchups seem inequitable (DR/Malak owners vs. players who have neither, JKR owners vs a player who doesn't have him, etc.)
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced.

    I have no clue what you are basing this on. In order to game the mod system a person by necessity must have room under the mod cap to store those mods while they are removed. That person must therefore have fewer mods than somebody who always sits at the mod cap.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced. The amount of "punishment" comparatively would be much less significant than the advantage currently gained by those gaming the system.

    A single set of 6 dot mods on one character is worth almost 2k in GP. People gaming the system are pulling off full teams' worth of 6 dot mods - in effect creating space for a full extra maxed character or two. That's part of the reason some GA matchups seem inequitable (DR/Malak owners vs. players who have neither, JKR owners vs a player who doesn't have him, etc.)

    Maybe we're talking about different things, because i truly don't understand why you're suggesting to include unassigned mods in matchmaking to counter the mod bug abuse.
    Seems to me they can just fix the roster lock and the problem is solved. Why would anyone take of his arena mods to get a more favourable match if that results in him being unable to use said arena mods in TW/GA?
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced. The amount of "punishment" comparatively would be much less significant than the advantage currently gained by those gaming the system.

    A single set of 6 dot mods on one character is worth almost 2k in GP. People gaming the system are pulling off full teams' worth of 6 dot mods - in effect creating space for a full extra maxed character or two. That's part of the reason some GA matchups seem inequitable (DR/Malak owners vs. players who have neither, JKR owners vs a player who doesn't have him, etc.)

    Maybe we're talking about different things, because i truly don't understand why you're suggesting to include unassigned mods in matchmaking to counter the mod bug abuse.
    Seems to me they can just fix the roster lock and the problem is solved. Why would anyone take of his arena mods to get a more favourable match if that results in him being unable to use said arena mods in TW/GA?

    This discussion predates the mod lock bug (edit: I mean predates it being a widely known issue) and relates to a belief that some people are sandbagging GP by removing mods from characters they don’t expect to use.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced. The amount of "punishment" comparatively would be much less significant than the advantage currently gained by those gaming the system.

    A single set of 6 dot mods on one character is worth almost 2k in GP. People gaming the system are pulling off full teams' worth of 6 dot mods - in effect creating space for a full extra maxed character or two. That's part of the reason some GA matchups seem inequitable (DR/Malak owners vs. players who have neither, JKR owners vs a player who doesn't have him, etc.)

    Maybe we're talking about different things, because i truly don't understand why you're suggesting to include unassigned mods in matchmaking to counter the mod bug abuse.
    Seems to me they can just fix the roster lock and the problem is solved. Why would anyone take of his arena mods to get a more favourable match if that results in him being unable to use said arena mods in TW/GA?

    This discussion predates the mod lock bug (edit: I mean predates it being a widely known issue) and relates to a belief that some people are sandbagging GP by removing mods from characters they don’t expect to use.

    I'd love to be sandbagged by players who remove their mods from toons like JKR.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    edited May 2019
    Liath wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced.

    I have no clue what you are basing this on. In order to game the mod system a person by necessity must have room under the mod cap to store those mods while they are removed. That person must therefore have fewer mods than somebody who always sits at the mod cap.

    In order to address both your and Leef's confusion, let me start by saying that there are players who are using "mod stripping" as a way to artificially lower there over GP before GA lock. Even if they aren't putting those mods back on after lock (i.e. taking advantage of the bug) - they are still using mod manipulation to try to gain a GP advantage. As I'll mention later, Crumb addressed this in his GA Improvements post.

    The average player does not have 6 dot mods sitting around unassigned. Most of us have unassigned blue or green mods from various events or old 4 dot grey mods that are unleveled, etc.

    Many of the players I have seen attempting to "game the system" have characters they no longer use regularly (i.e. g12 geos since they are no longer fleet viable, g12 Seps since the Padme event isn't up - or g12 Finn/Poe) that are stripped of mods. Those characters (mine included) have or would likely have had 6 dot mods - or at least full sets of gold mods. As I've already pointed out, pulling a set of 6 star mods off of even a single 5 character squad would give a player almost 10k advantage. 2 or 3 teams = 1 or 2 maxed characters.

    Incidentally, I think this kind of "mod stripping" is precisely what Crumb referenced in the "Improvements to GA Matchups" post when he said "but it has also led to a bit of a disconnect in some players’ expectations, and resulted in some degenerative behavior patterns as a result.". CG has repeatedly stated - and taken action to make sure it doesn't happen - that it is against the spirit of the game to "weaken" your characters (or deliberately keep them weak to gain an advantage). Mod stripping seems to be the "degenerative behavior pattern" he refers to.

    We don't have to get into our tired debate about whether or not this should be the case either, as Crumb also went on to very clearly state "players will still be rewarded for their strategy in Grand Arena, but they’ll be matched up against someone who looks more like them." - again, indicating the intent of GA is to match up players with rosters as similar as possible (at least more similar than has been the case).

    Is possibly "punishing" players for having extra mods laying round ideal? No. But to me it's a far more equitable solution than allowing players to use mod stripping as a way to manipulate their GP to gain favorable match ups. And judging by the undesired "degenerative behavior patterns" comment, CG seems to agree.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    The average player does not have 6 dot mods sitting around unassigned.

    The average player also doesn’t have 6* mods sitting on useless characters that they can freely remove to drop GP. Those are their best mods and they’re using them on characters that matter regardless of whether they keep mods on JKG and Lobot or not.
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    The average player does not have 6 dot mods sitting around unassigned.

    The average player also doesn’t have 6* mods sitting on useless characters that they can freely remove to drop GP. Those are their best mods and they’re using them on characters that matter regardless of whether they keep mods on JKG and Lobot or not.

    I gave examples of several teams that would have or would have had 6 dot mods on them. Separatists for the Padme event, Geos for fleet (and the Padme event), Finn/Poe for raids (and pre-nerf counter teams), T3/Carth for the DR event. Half of those I just listed, I could pull off to gain favorable matchups in GA. And I'm no whale. I'm sure there are players who have g12 Phoenix that had 6 dot mods they don't need or Ewoks that they used for the 3PO event, etc.

    You are both long time players and smart ones. I'm not sure why you're suddenly pretending that this doesn't happen.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    leef wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Having unassigned mods count toward total character GP would go a long way to preventing/mitigating the silly "mod manipulation" game that takes place in both TW and GA.

    yea, and punish players who aren't manipulationg anything, but do have alot of unassigned mods...

    Except most players who aren't trying to manipulate things, probably have about the same number of unassigned mods - and many of those unassigned mods are probably not going much toward GP because they are un leveled or unlsiced. The amount of "punishment" comparatively would be much less significant than the advantage currently gained by those gaming the system.

    A single set of 6 dot mods on one character is worth almost 2k in GP. People gaming the system are pulling off full teams' worth of 6 dot mods - in effect creating space for a full extra maxed character or two. That's part of the reason some GA matchups seem inequitable (DR/Malak owners vs. players who have neither, JKR owners vs a player who doesn't have him, etc.)

    Maybe we're talking about different things, because i truly don't understand why you're suggesting to include unassigned mods in matchmaking to counter the mod bug abuse.
    Seems to me they can just fix the roster lock and the problem is solved. Why would anyone take of his arena mods to get a more favourable match if that results in him being unable to use said arena mods in TW/GA?

    This discussion predates the mod lock bug (edit: I mean predates it being a widely known issue) and relates to a belief that some people are sandbagging GP by removing mods from characters they don’t expect to use.

    Precisely.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    The average player does not have 6 dot mods sitting around unassigned.

    The average player also doesn’t have 6* mods sitting on useless characters that they can freely remove to drop GP. Those are their best mods and they’re using them on characters that matter regardless of whether they keep mods on JKG and Lobot or not.

    I gave examples of several teams that would have or would have had 6 dot mods on them. Separatists for the Padme event, Geos for fleet (and the Padme event), Finn/Poe for raids (and pre-nerf counter teams), T3/Carth for the DR event. Half of those I just listed, I could pull off to gain favorable matchups in GA. And I'm no whale. I'm sure there are players who have g12 Phoenix that had 6 dot mods they don't need or Ewoks that they used for the 3PO event, etc.

    You are both long time players and smart ones. I'm not sure why you're suddenly pretending that this doesn't happen.

    Those examples are temporary. Do you think people hand out 6* mods and then just leave them there forever? If you put 6* mods on somebody at one time because you needed them for an event or a prior meta or whatever, when the reason changes a normal player is going to move those mods to somebody else that needs them more on a regular basis. I’m not going to leave 6* mods on geos when I switch to rebels, I’m going to move the 6* mods to the rebels I’m now using.

    If you just 6* whatever mods happen to be on Ewoks when you are trying for c3 and then leave them there then ok, I guess? Most of us moved the good mods we already had to the Ewoks, did the event, and then moved them back.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    Right, we were talking about two different things. In relation to the OP, i dont think what you're saying applies there.
    As for removing mods to lower your GP, i removed all mods from characters i never use. Sold most of them because they were mostly trash (i only eqiuped them to get more GP for TB).
    Regardless, it seems like a makeshift fix that has unintended side effects for players who don't sell their mods often. On top of that, while not exactly in the same catagory, having less mods in your inventory being favourable for matchmaking does have that "degenerative behavior patterns" feel to it. Being punished for having more mods equiped is kinda the same thing as being punished for having more mods in your inventory.
    Ofcourse, it does make removing mods from characters less favourable if you're not going to sell them, but still.
    Save water, drink champagne!
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