I'm scared of relics

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From a gameplay standpoint we needed something that's going to potentially bring new abilities to the game and allow older characters to be modernized. I don't think relics are a bad idea but of course coming at this stage in the game and introduced as g13 feature means one and only one thing: it's revenue generation.

This is why I'm scared of them, I know for a fact this is going to be a p2w thing, those who pay will get relics, those who don't will just have to grind it out and like most grinds in this game, we'll never be able to enjoy a variety of characters but we'll just have to cherry pick whoever is meta at the time and just have to forget about everyone else.

I don't think most of us will have the opportunity to enjoy most of these abilities even months or years after they come to the game, while others will just have them day 1. I wish greed was lesser with this one...

Replies

  • Or.. wait till the list of who gets what is revealed and then, pick what you want and go from there..
    My theory is that this is the devs attempt at rock/paper/scissor things.. old toons May get something useful and make them worth gearing..
  • I fear the moment when Relics are needed outside pvp, maybe for a new kind of ultra-hard events...
    Not good... :#
  • The way it is being portrayed is that it’s going to better the future of the game. For long tenured players that have accumulated thousands of worthless gear they will be able to level up relics at earlier tiers right away. Providing a stat boost based on the toons archetype. There is no one piece that does it- you can create pieces from multiple sources of useless gear.

    This means for newer players that haven’t amassed this gear will acquire them the longer they play.

    So instead of cg tweaking rewards to more important gear they made all gear have some importance. I think this is pretty smart.

    Relics are the first step to helping newer players. They are going to make more gear more accessible along with other things. This has been something the community has agreed on. Helping newer players for the long term health of the game. So if you are in the mind of - the game is dying (it’s not) this is a step of helping its future.

    Relics are supposed to be a grind. The whole game is a grind. It will never not be a grind. Paying money to alleviate the grind has always been there. It always will.

    At the higher tiers of relics require really useful gear that will bring a new ability.

    I am cautious of anything cg thinks is helpful for newer players as opposed to what the community believes is helpful. But we still do not know the all of it.

    Relics will also help some toons on your roster that serve no purpose in game right now. Wait and see what it will be and give feedback accordingly.

    TLDR- if you think the game is dying. If you are tired of mounds of gear you never use. If you are fearful of the future because of the long arduous grind for new players. If you hate that there is a bottle neck of stun guns to gear your toons. The relics seem like they are a great idea. They are a direct response to half of the threads on the forum.
  • You know they could let us upgrade 10 lower items into 1 greater one,no need for relics to use our old unused gear,or even fuse them and get 1 random item,surprise mechanics guys.

    New abilities?We allready have that,its called reworking,they can do whatever they want,heck add or remove an existing one alltogether.

    Gap between spenders and f2p?Heck yeah its gonna be huge,also i think i said it in another thread as well,devs shoot their own foot,they will never be able to make content for everyone couse the difference will be vast,only way to make balanced content for everyone is for light spenders and hell new players easier to catch up to a certain point,now we are stuck at g8.Try do geonosis tb at g8 and tell me how it'll go.
  • You know they could let us upgrade 10 lower items into 1 greater one,no need for relics to use our old unused gear,or even fuse them and get 1 random item,surprise mechanics guys.

    New abilities?We allready have that,its called reworking,they can do whatever they want,heck add or remove an existing one alltogether.

    Gap between spenders and f2p?Heck yeah its gonna be huge,also i think i said it in another thread as well,devs shoot their own foot,they will never be able to make content for everyone couse the difference will be vast,only way to make balanced content for everyone is for light spenders and hell new players easier to catch up to a certain point,now we are stuck at g8.Try do geonosis tb at g8 and tell me how it'll go.

    Hoth wasn’t even geared towards g8.
    Relics are meant to be a newer grind that doesn’t depend on one piece at similar levels.

    Gear tiers in this game are a mess.
  • The way it is being portrayed is that it’s going to better the future of the game. For long tenured players that have accumulated thousands of worthless gear they will be able to level up relics at earlier tiers right away. Providing a stat boost based on the toons archetype. There is no one piece that does it- you can create pieces from multiple sources of useless gear.

    This means for newer players that haven’t amassed this gear will acquire them the longer they play.

    So instead of cg tweaking rewards to more important gear they made all gear have some importance. I think this is pretty smart.

    Relics are the first step to helping newer players. They are going to make more gear more accessible along with other things. This has been something the community has agreed on. Helping newer players for the long term health of the game. So if you are in the mind of - the game is dying (it’s not) this is a step of helping its future.

    Relics are supposed to be a grind. The whole game is a grind. It will never not be a grind. Paying money to alleviate the grind has always been there. It always will.

    At the higher tiers of relics require really useful gear that will bring a new ability.

    I am cautious of anything cg thinks is helpful for newer players as opposed to what the community believes is helpful. But we still do not know the all of it.

    Relics will also help some toons on your roster that serve no purpose in game right now. Wait and see what it will be and give feedback accordingly.

    TLDR- if you think the game is dying. If you are tired of mounds of gear you never use. If you are fearful of the future because of the long arduous grind for new players. If you hate that there is a bottle neck of stun guns to gear your toons. The relics seem like they are a great idea. They are a direct response to half of the threads on the forum.

    Relics as help for new players? That's the most absurd thing I've EVER heard, you need to get a character to g13 to even be able to give them relics. If a new player is in position to have g13s then they aren't new players.

    It's not just gear that we've have thousands off, it's mixed in with gear that we're short of so it's basically the same thing. Who says we won't have a relic level that requires a bunch of gear we have thousands of but also requires 50 carbantis? I think it's all an illusion to allow this system to slip into the game, and then after it's slipped and a bunch of people have spent thousands of dollars in it, then they'll say that it's too late now to pull out because too many players have already invested in it. Same shenanigans they've always pulled with stuff like this.

    The gap between p2p and f2p is already big enough in this game, making it even wider is not a wise decision.

    Allow me to clarify - once they implement relics they will focus on speeding up the process of newer players.

    The only way I can see a huge gap of paying players and totally ftp is in arena.

    GAC is more even than it was before. Fleet is the same meta it has been since the falcon was brought in. JKR, dr, malak have been cycled in multiple times. There is a good droid team that helps against malak.

    I will say tw can be flawed in its match making or if guilds sandbag players into not joining.

    Yes for sure relics will require needed gear too. I’m not saying I think it’s the best thing since sliced pita bread... I think it’s a smart move by cg for cg and directly addresses many complaints that have been in the forums for a long time.

    I just don’t understand what the expectation is? There has always been a progression in this game. Why would that stop? We started with 0 raids we have 3 now and working towards a 4th. That’s not to say I think raids are the best or most relevant but there is always a push for more progression.
  • You know they could let us upgrade 10 lower items into 1 greater one,no need for relics to use our old unused gear,or even fuse them and get 1 random item,surprise mechanics guys.

    New abilities?We allready have that,its called reworking,they can do whatever they want,heck add or remove an existing one alltogether.

    Gap between spenders and f2p?Heck yeah its gonna be huge,also i think i said it in another thread as well,devs shoot their own foot,they will never be able to make content for everyone couse the difference will be vast,only way to make balanced content for everyone is for light spenders and hell new players easier to catch up to a certain point,now we are stuck at g8.Try do geonosis tb at g8 and tell me how it'll go.

    Hoth wasn’t even geared towards g8.
    Relics are meant to be a newer grind that doesn’t depend on one piece at similar levels.

    Gear tiers in this game are a mess.

    Gear tiers in this game are a mess because like I've said many times before, the entire system is bad design. It uses the same pieces to craft gear from gear level 7 up to g12++ and even g13 finishers. It's unacceptable to require the same piece for a g8 character and a g12+ character, because it gets to the point where you gotta make choices and who in their right mind will gear a g8 over a g12? This means many characters will be stuck at g8 basically from now till the end of time because people can't afford to spare a carbanti or a stun gun on a character who isn't meta in some game mode. Then they end up reworking alot of these characters and making them alot better but this creates a situation where p2p get the too teams instantly while f2p struggle to get past g8.

    I fail to see how relics will not force us into more of these hard choices, like use 59 carbantis to get a character to g9 or use it to get your relic upgraded? Who's gonna not pick the relic? Thus condemning more characters to eternal damnation. Unless you spend 20 bucks for a gear level, and another 20-40 on the next and the next and the next.

    Yes. Gear tiers are a mess. I am hoping that throughout all relic tiers they allow you to craft gear from multiple sources but I don’t think all tiers will be easy with no grind.

    Imagine if you didn’t have to spend anything and every toon was easy to gear??
  • Kyno
    21295 posts Moderator
    From a gameplay standpoint we needed something that's going to potentially bring new abilities to the game and allow older characters to be modernized....

    .

    This is literally what they dev team has stated it will be used for.

    No it will not happen in the timeframe you want.
    ...I don't think relics are a bad idea but of course coming at this stage in the game and introduced as g13 feature means one and only one thing: it's revenue generation.

    ....

    Correct, this game is run as by a business that is making a profit, and has a goal of making a profit. Everything they do is in some way designed to make them money. This is in no way a secret or surprising. This in no way means they do not designed everything to add to or enhance the game for all players.

    Its proximity to G13 has nothing to do with anything, this is just the groundwork they are trying to lay to help progression for future content.


    This game is in no way P2W, it is P2P. There is no permanent advantage to $$, everything can be gained by any player. $$ get you there faster, but by no means keeps you there. You should try to understand the difference if you are going to continue to describe everything in those terms.

    Your timelines of what other people will enjoy are vastly biased by your negative view of the company/game and are also incorrect. Players in almost every thread you have made have posted to show this to be true, and you may want to take some time to appreciate the help the community has offered to help you with this understanding.
  • I don't think the relics will be that bad. I believe the purpose is twofold(though I could be wrong)

    1. Increase the ceiling of end game to make purple gear up to G12 much easier to obtain. By providing relics, the devs are now free to make the gear crunch in the below gear tiers easier if they so choose(this has been hinted at in multiple posts and interviews as something they want to implement)
    2. It rewards F2P very old veteran players like me who don't spend a very large amount but have spent some(dolphin level) and been loyal to the game. We have thousands upon thousands of unused scrap gear, and this allows us to compete on some level with the whales in the game. The whales will always have some advantage as they should, but I see this as lessening the gap.

    Side Note: I don't see why newer players would worry too much. If the devs alleviate the G12 gear crunch that lessens the P2W capability of newer whales that started the game at the same time as the F2P newer player. Newer players won't have the same gear crunch as older players, and paying for gear won't give you as much as an edge as it used to since the gear is more abundant, while at the same time, both F2P and whales will need to grind the useless gear at the same to get to the end game ceiling.

    The only thing that would change my mind on this is if the devs didn't implement something to rework the accessibility of older gear, something that's completely possible, though I would be disappointing if they didn't take this golden opportunity to smooth out the current gear pain in the game.

    Honestly, I do think the relics will be helpful for longevity of the game and will allow the devs to pave toward newer content as well for the player base to tackle with the new power of the relics system.
  • It would be cool if relics would make the meta more diverse.
    Meaning, that also unusual/unused teams with full relics could compete with the meta (Jawas, Tusken or whatever), nowadays if you haven't Malak or the suicide squad you're not really able to compete in the meta.
    Would be funny, but probably not "spending-whale friendly", so i guess it won't happen, was just thinking :#
    Swiss Garde Officer, drop me a message if you're interested joining
  • You will be. You will be.
  • I don't mind the relics. The gear climb was getting old and what would they require for tier 13? 500 of each item? They had to come up with something new to change the system a bit at the top end. I just wish all these changes would slow down. So much to keep up with.
  • I just don't see it being that big of a deal.

    I'm ftp and do well in arena. My arena team is g13 except for malak, he's g11 waiting on stars. So when relics drop, I'll take them up to as high as I can (the devs said the first 3 or 4 levels will be easy for most veteran players. The whales will get them maxed out slightly quicker but catching up one team won't take long. G13 was pretty much the same. And worse case, I'll use some stashed crystals to keep the gap manageable.

    Grand arena is already adjusted for power so whales that go all out will face other whales that do the same. No problem there.

    TW won't change a lot. Guilds that are full of whales will face other guilds full of whales. For long time players it'll inflate guild gp to higher reward tiers as players use the old gear to take 10 g13 to relic level 3 almost instantly.

    The added strength of a team and added gp will make tb easier.

    It'll make raids easier and quicker. I'm guessing it won't change the people that do the best. G13 didn't really change that too much.
  • bt51nt02ymam.jpg
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Correct, this game is run as by a business that is making a profit, and has a goal of making a profit. Everything they do is in some way designed to make them money. This is in no way a secret or surprising.

    Game design is an art; and like all art, sometimes designed for the sake of the experience, where revenue is a necessary means of supporting the experience. Other art is created more as a product; the goal of the product is solely revenue, the experience is only needs to be good enough to keep people spending. I do love this game, but I (like many others) feel that some design decisions are made with the later in mind, rather than the former.
    Kyno wrote: »
    This game is in no way P2W, it is P2P. There is no permanent advantage to $$, everything can be gained by any player. $$ get you there faster, but by no means keeps you there. You should try to understand the difference if you are going to continue to describe everything in those terms.

    Hmm, it's true that the meta is always changing and that player power is always trending upward. However, $$ absolutely have a permanent advantage. If I spend $50 on gear to increase the power of a toon, that power doesn't go away. The toon is forever stronger than it would have been, had I not spent that money.
  • Liath
    4311 posts Member
    Nizuya wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Correct, this game is run as by a business that is making a profit, and has a goal of making a profit. Everything they do is in some way designed to make them money. This is in no way a secret or surprising.

    Game design is an art; and like all art, sometimes designed for the sake of the experience, where revenue is a necessary means of supporting the experience. Other art is created more as a product; the goal of the product is solely revenue, the experience is only needs to be good enough to keep people spending. I do love this game, but I (like many others) feel that some design decisions are made with the later in mind, rather than the former.
    Kyno wrote: »
    This game is in no way P2W, it is P2P. There is no permanent advantage to $$, everything can be gained by any player. $$ get you there faster, but by no means keeps you there. You should try to understand the difference if you are going to continue to describe everything in those terms.

    Hmm, it's true that the meta is always changing and that player power is always trending upward. However, $$ absolutely have a permanent advantage. If I spend $50 on gear to increase the power of a toon, that power doesn't go away. The toon is forever stronger than it would have been, had I not spent that money.

    You always have that gear piece but it may or may not provide any actual advantage depending on whether you are still using that character for anything meaningful. If you spent that money on IGD back when tank came out for the phase 1 counter team, you might not be getting any use out of that power at this moment.

    It’s certainly not the case that you are getting a permanent advantage in any PvP game mode, which is where the “P2W” rhetoric generally comes into play.
  • I'm not scared at all. Just another thing to grind.
  • If it wasn't relics, it would be G13+5. I'd rather be able to use a variety of excess gear to get some Relic levels rather than have to run countless raids to hope to get lucky on G13+5 gear drops.
  • Wampa wrote: »
    bt51nt02ymam.jpg

    My eyes hurt
  • ZAP
    390 posts Member
    The darkside characters look like they’re being born.
  • ZAP wrote: »
    The darkside characters look like they’re being born.

    Now I can't unsee it... lol
  • ZAP wrote: »
    The darkside characters look like they’re being born.

    Thanks! I hate it
    #MakeTuskensGreat
    tenor.gif
  • At this point I know I won't stop this relic gear bottleneck from coming to the game, all I can do is ask for the devs to have a reasonable price point... I have posted twice already about the price of kyros and how they should be half of what they cost.

    The typical argument is that it's too late to change their price because people already invested in them and it would devalue the money they soent. The same thing will happen with relics, the second a single player goes ham with the upgrades we will be told the same thing, it's too late to be reasonable about their costs. So I'm putting this out there now while relics are not in the game yet. Please be reasonable with the cost of leveling them up, this game isn't only for the whales...
  • Kyno wrote: »
    From a gameplay standpoint we needed something that's going to potentially bring new abilities to the game and allow older characters to be modernized....

    .

    This is literally what they dev team has stated it will be used for.

    No it will not happen in the timeframe you want.
    ...I don't think relics are a bad idea but of course coming at this stage in the game and introduced as g13 feature means one and only one thing: it's revenue generation.

    ....

    Correct, this game is run as by a business that is making a profit, and has a goal of making a profit. Everything they do is in some way designed to make them money. This is in no way a secret or surprising. This in no way means they do not designed everything to add to or enhance the game for all players.

    Its proximity to G13 has nothing to do with anything, this is just the groundwork they are trying to lay to help progression for future content.


    This game is in no way P2W, it is P2P. There is no permanent advantage to $$, everything can be gained by any player. $$ get you there faster, but by no means keeps you there. You should try to understand the difference if you are going to continue to describe everything in those terms.

    Your timelines of what other people will enjoy are vastly biased by your negative view of the company/game and are also incorrect. Players in almost every thread you have made have posted to show this to be true, and you may want to take some time to appreciate the help the community has offered to help you with this understanding.

    The First quote you made,i allready answered this,its called reworking,we dont need no NEW relics for it.

    Also a serious question,dont you have a pride in yourself?Do you have to be a yes man to cg just to stay a moderator?They make 400 mil a year,what do you make to be a yes man?I was reading your posts before even i made an account here and i would feel ashamed of myself to be a yes man all the time.

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