GAC division 2, how is this happening

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InvMars
72 posts Member
edited August 2020
to begin with, i am not here to report a cheater, i am simple want to point out cg should do their job properly

i am at GAC division 2

i am doing my GAC early today so i am able to getting in to top ten in a very brief moment and that make me wonder how far off i am away from the top, i was expecting a GL or two

turn out i am wrong and so wrong, the number one player of division 2 is having a roster with no zeta on any character and the strong character is a purple gear fallen bastila shan at 17292 gp

this is the third week of the current GAC and this is the kyber, i checked a few more time before making this post

there is only three possible reasons

First, a bug which cg fail to debug after over 1 year of initial launching of GAC, which is cg job

Second, cheating, which cg fail to spot and they shouldn’t not rely on player to report such obvious cheating

Third, no G12 and zeta is needed to stay competitive, all you need is skill and rng, but if rng is the main factor in a competitive mode, something should be changed

All three should be cg job, so please cg do you job

edit:typo
Post edited by Kyno on

Replies

  • wrowh6b7gczw.png
    here the cap screen if anyone curious
  • InvMars wrote: »
    wrowh6b7gczw.png
    here the cap screen if anyone curious

    How is this a division 2 roster, and who the heck is this guy fighting against and winning

    tbh i am quite impressed that no zeta and g12 and yet managed to reach 4.1m
  • The_Indomitable
    91 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    InvMars wrote: »
    wrowh6b7gczw.png
    here the cap screen if anyone curious

    This happens all the time. You just haven't noticed because you're not usually looking. It's called a bye.

    Let me try to explain: GA starts with 8 players per group. When the matchmaking has an incomplete group, a random player(s) automatically receives a max score plus all the GAC points for winning round 1 even though the round hasn't finished yet.

    Don't worry, if you win your round there's a good chance you'll rank higher in the end.
  • InvMars wrote: »
    wrowh6b7gczw.png
    here the cap screen if anyone curious

    This happens all the time. You just haven't noticed because you're not usually looking. It's called a bye.

    Let me try to explain: GA starts with 8 players per group. When the matchmaking has an incomplete group, a random player(s) automatically receives a max score plus all the GAC points for winning round 1 even though the round hasn't finished yet.

    Don't worry, if you win your round there's a good chance you'll rank higher in the end.

    you are talking about this player is lucky enough to get bye every single time, and win the pass two week GAC and that make it 7 GAC without match a single opponent which is possible but unlikely

    if this is in fact the reason, then this match my third point which cg should improve the system
  • InvMars wrote: »
    wrowh6b7gczw.png
    here the cap screen if anyone curious

    This happens all the time. You just haven't noticed because you're not usually looking. It's called a bye.

    Let me try to explain: GA starts with 8 players per group. When the matchmaking has an incomplete group, a random player(s) automatically receives a max score plus all the GAC points for winning round 1 even though the round hasn't finished yet.

    Don't worry, if you win your round there's a good chance you'll rank higher in the end.

    With a roster like that a bye is not going to put you at the top of div 2 in the final week of the GAC.

    Week 1 maybe, not week 4.
    DISCLAIMER: Post is subject to change.
  • He isn’t cheating in this case and it’s not because of a “bye”. Remember the system tries to pair us using your top 80 toons. Old mate you’re talking about will have a low average power rating for their top 80, but they are in Div 2 because they have over 4mil GP. So more than likely they haven’t had to go against your “typical” 4mil+ roster. CG wouldn’t have thought about this happening or just didn’t care because it was deemed not likely to happen......who would not strive to have Meta and Relic toons :)
  • The_Indomitable
    91 posts Member
    edited August 2020
  • thx for your work, those posts only explain what a bye is, but getting bye multiple time on tier 2 and sound unreal and unfair. i don’t think the system work
  • Then I'm confused. What do you mean by tier 2? and what makes you think multiple byes?
  • Then I'm confused. What do you mean by tier 2? and what makes you think multiple byes?

    division 2, kyber
  • He isn’t cheating in this case and it’s not because of a “bye”. Remember the system tries to pair us using your top 80 toons. Old mate you’re talking about will have a low average power rating for their top 80, but they are in Div 2 because they have over 4mil GP. So more than likely they haven’t had to go against your “typical” 4mil+ roster. CG wouldn’t have thought about this happening or just didn’t care because it was deemed not likely to happen......who would not strive to have Meta and Relic toons :)

    i believe this should be the answer, thanks

    so the new advise is instead of super focus on meta team, go as board as possible and you don’t even have to fight to get number one, how counter intuitive this is.
  • I explained it briefly in that other post...

    Basically there's no way of knowing how many byes the player received but it's clear he got one now. It shouldn't be possible to get 2 in a row but he could have received others in the previous weeks, though that is unlikely.

    A bye is a blessing and a curse because you receive a lot of points but you miss out on opportunities to accomplish feats. It works out to be a detriment compared to the top players and huge fortune compared to the worst.

    How is the player in Kyber? Skill. He wins. The matchmaking pairs him with similar rosters the same way it does for you.

    Plus: when he doesn't have a bye, the feats should be pretty easy with a roster like that.
  • InvMars wrote: »
    He isn’t cheating in this case and it’s not because of a “bye”. Remember the system tries to pair us using your top 80 toons. Old mate you’re talking about will have a low average power rating for their top 80, but they are in Div 2 because they have over 4mil GP. So more than likely they haven’t had to go against your “typical” 4mil+ roster. CG wouldn’t have thought about this happening or just didn’t care because it was deemed not likely to happen......who would not strive to have Meta and Relic toons :)

    i believe this should be the answer, thanks

    so the new advise is instead of super focus on meta team, go as board as possible and you don’t even have to fight to get number one, how counter intuitive this is.

    A broad roster has major disadvantages. I'm not sure you're getting the big picture yet. What makes you think a broad roster takes away the fight? It would actually make things harder in a lot of ways.
  • That is a very strange roster: lots of starred and leveled characters and ships but no g12+ characters and not a single zeta.

    Kinda looks like the player is a collector, possibly in a guild of one going by the player name & guild name and apparent lack of higher level gear.

    Also weird to see a bunch of powerful characters undeveloped at the bottom of the roster, possibly because they are lower starred.

    Such a roster could potentially be a corner case, getting repeated byes by being the weakest in a division + league.
  • InvMars wrote: »
    He isn’t cheating in this case and it’s not because of a “bye”. Remember the system tries to pair us using your top 80 toons. Old mate you’re talking about will have a low average power rating for their top 80, but they are in Div 2 because they have over 4mil GP. So more than likely they haven’t had to go against your “typical” 4mil+ roster. CG wouldn’t have thought about this happening or just didn’t care because it was deemed not likely to happen......who would not strive to have Meta and Relic toons :)

    i believe this should be the answer, thanks

    so the new advise is instead of super focus on meta team, go as board as possible and you don’t even have to fight to get number one, how counter intuitive this is.

    A broad roster has major disadvantages. I'm not sure you're getting the big picture yet. What makes you think a broad roster takes away the fight? It would actually make things harder in a lot of ways.

    i am sure that would bring a major disadvantage in other game mode, however in GAC, this roster would bring you maximum reward with minimum effort. you don’t even need to chase after the next meta to stay on the top
  • Given we are in week 4 , you can review his previous 3 weeks history on swgoh.gg and see if he / she got any byes and or who they fought , and the scores.
  • Waqui
    8548 posts Member
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.

  • Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.

    A bye. One bye. Not 10.

    When you get a bye, there's no offense to play.

    The player isn't ranked 1st anymore, which was my point too: it's hard to observe byes because they often get overtaken in the rankings (except for R1, Week1).
    Basically there's no way of knowing how many byes the player received but it's clear he got one now. It shouldn't be possible to get 2 in a row but he could have received others in the previous weeks, though that is unlikely.

    What? I said that?

    @wildnz is right, you could see by checking match history. In my experience, players like this aren't registered on swgoh.gg. But you can always try it.
  • Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.
    Though unlikely, it is theoretically possible. His roster is weak enough that it could be have lowest matchmaking GP in his division. That could lead to him being in a bracket of one after each matchmaking within the GAC. In such a case, he would have to be awarded byes for all of his matches.
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.
    Though unlikely, it is theoretically possible. His roster is weak enough that it could be have lowest matchmaking GP in his division. That could lead to him being in a bracket of one after each matchmaking within the GAC. In such a case, he would have to be awarded byes for all of his matches.

    But again, being able to explain how it happened <> it's a good system.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • This player is currently Div 2 Kyber rank #8 and falling. Arena rank #1829, fleet rank #169 ... nothing there supports your claim of cheating. Stats show only 614 squad arena and 268 fleet arena wins, 52 raids beaten. Call it a relatively new player who scored well in GAC and do not worry about it. In fact, I submit you should be giving them kudos for gathering so many GAC points with the roster they have. Good for them, I say.
  • This player is currently Div 2 Kyber rank #8 and falling. Arena rank #1829, fleet rank #169 ... nothing there supports your claim of cheating. Stats show only 614 squad arena and 268 fleet arena wins, 52 raids beaten. Call it a relatively new player who scored well in GAC and do not worry about it. In fact, I submit you should be giving them kudos for gathering so many GAC points with the roster they have. Good for them, I say.

    Due to the bye, his current GAC score is temporarily inflated by the 2000 GAC points for winning (3v3). The players around him that also win won't get those 2000 points until the round ends. I doubt you'll find him in the top 50 tomorrow.
  • Waqui
    8548 posts Member
    Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.

    A bye. One bye. Not 10.

    So you agree, that one or more byes can't be the full explanation 10 rounds in, right?

  • Waqui
    8548 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.
    Though unlikely, it is theoretically possible. His roster is weak enough that it could be have lowest matchmaking GP in his division. That could lead to him being in a bracket of one after each matchmaking within the GAC. In such a case, he would have to be awarded byes for all of his matches.

    I highly doubt that groups are organised so that a single player can have 3 byes in a GA. I highly doubt that groups of only 1 player will be created. In groups of 3 or more players nobody will have 3 byes. That's impossible with the current matchmaking within a group of 8 (matching by number of wins so far).
    Post edited by Waqui on
  • Waqui wrote: »
    Rath_Tarr wrote: »
    Waqui wrote: »
    Hmmm.... My lengthy response was flagged for review. It may show up eventually.

    All evidence points to a bye.

    We are 9-10 rounds in. The player ranking 1st has won 9 rounds and already played his offense in round 10. He may have gotten a bye at some point, but he didn't get 10 byes.
    Though unlikely, it is theoretically possible. His roster is weak enough that it could be have lowest matchmaking GP in his division. That could lead to him being in a bracket of one after each matchmaking within the GAC. In such a case, he would have to be awarded byes for all of his matches.

    I highly doubt that groups are organised so that a single player can have 3 byes in a GA. I highly doubt that groups of only 1 player will be created. In groups of 3 or more players nobody will have 3 byes. That's impossible with the current matchmaking with a group of 8 (matching by number of wins so far).
    Depends how sophisticated the algorithm is.

    Consider splitting a sorted list of 10 into groups of 3 with the aim of producing the best matches. The simplest approach would be:
    (10, 9, 8) (7, 6, 5) (4, 3, 2) (1)

    With a little more sophistication you could make:
    (10, 9, 8) (7, 6, 5) (4, 3,) (2,1)

    Trading one player with 2 byes for four players with 1 bye each.

    Matching is constrained by division & league and for each pairing there is a 1 in 8 chance that when you divide the number of players by 8 the remainder is 1 player
  • This player is currently Div 2 Kyber rank #8 and falling. Arena rank #1829, fleet rank #169 ... nothing there supports your claim of cheating. Stats show only 614 squad arena and 268 fleet arena wins, 52 raids beaten. Call it a relatively new player who scored well in GAC and do not worry about it. In fact, I submit you should be giving them kudos for gathering so many GAC points with the roster they have. Good for them, I say.

    Due to the bye, his current GAC score is temporarily inflated by the 2000 GAC points for winning (3v3). The players around him that also win won't get those 2000 points until the round ends. I doubt you'll find him in the top 50 tomorrow.

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