Han apparently shot fifth?!?

Replies

  • Ltswb1
    550 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    Thanks for the response, @CG_SBCrumb . I’m not sure I agree that it’s the way it should work, though. Han should always go first. And as has been mentioned above, the devs even pointed out that he should always go first unless facing another Han with more speed. Also, by changing this mechanic, several events are now going to be significantly harder to complete than they were prior to the update.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Thanks for the response, CG_SBCrumb . I’m not sure I agree that it’s the way it should work, though. Han should always go first. And as has been mentioned above, the devs even pointed out that he should always go first unless facing another Han with more speed. Also, by changing this mechanic, several events are now going to be significantly harder to complete than they were prior to the update.

    Which events?
    @Ltswb1
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Thanks for the response, CG_SBCrumb . I’m not sure I agree that it’s the way it should work, though. Han should always go first. And as has been mentioned above, the devs even pointed out that he should always go first unless facing another Han with more speed. Also, by changing this mechanic, several events are now going to be significantly harder to complete than they were prior to the update.

    Which events?
    @Ltswb1

    How about the assault battles, for starters?
  • Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?

    Most of the older events have "bonus turns" at the beginning of the event. Most players call it TM loading, but they are 2 different things, and I dont recall which events have which.

    The T3 of the assault battles were added recently and I dont think contain this mechanism.

    We can ask, but the point still stands, it's not several events, and we dont even know for sure if it does effect the one other event were this may arise.
  • Find out in September I guess? Cool.
  • Gifafi
    6017 posts Member
    CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi folks, as Kyno mention, these units are also being granted a Bonus Turn. Which means the unit that will go first will have the highest amount of Turn Meter, then highest speed if tied for TM, then randomly selected if tied for speed as well. The new system for turn order specifically prioritizes all the units with bonus turns over any other units.

    In this case, the enemies in Tiers 3 and 4 of the Smuggler's Run event are being granted a bonus turn as part of their event buffs. If Han Solo has no Turn Meter at the end of an encounter, it is possible for the enemies to go before him if they have more Speed than he does.

    So..."Han Shoots First"..except here?

    Will this affect Han shooting first (vs anyone other than a faster Han) in any other aspect of the game?
    Maybe End Game isn't for you
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?

    Most of the older events have "bonus turns" at the beginning of the event. Most players call it TM loading, but they are 2 different things, and I dont recall which events have which.

    The T3 of the assault battles were added recently and I dont think contain this mechanism.

    We can ask, but the point still stands, it's not several events, and we dont even know for sure if it does effect the one other event were this may arise.

    I’m sorry, but you just said that most of the older events give bonus turns, and then said that it’s NOT several events that will be affected. Which is it? If most of the older events give bonus turns, then they will be affected. And you admit that “we” don’t even know if it will affect the new ones. That’s an issue. It also still doesn’t fit with the devs own words that Han will always go first unless facing a faster Han. Was that a lie, mistake, or is this not WAI?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?

    Most of the older events have "bonus turns" at the beginning of the event. Most players call it TM loading, but they are 2 different things, and I dont recall which events have which.

    The T3 of the assault battles were added recently and I dont think contain this mechanism.

    We can ask, but the point still stands, it's not several events, and we dont even know for sure if it does effect the one other event were this may arise.

    I’m sorry, but you just said that most of the older events give bonus turns, and then said that it’s NOT several events that will be affected. Which is it? If most of the older events give bonus turns, then they will be affected. And you admit that “we” don’t even know if it will affect the new ones. That’s an issue. It also still doesn’t fit with the devs own words that Han will always go first unless facing a faster Han. Was that a lie, mistake, or is this not WAI?

    Event having bonus turns doesn't run into this issue, unless you are using rebels.

  • Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?

    Most of the older events have "bonus turns" at the beginning of the event. Most players call it TM loading, but they are 2 different things, and I dont recall which events have which.

    The T3 of the assault battles were added recently and I dont think contain this mechanism.

    We can ask, but the point still stands, it's not several events, and we dont even know for sure if it does effect the one other event were this may arise.

    I’m sorry, but you just said that most of the older events give bonus turns, and then said that it’s NOT several events that will be affected. Which is it? If most of the older events give bonus turns, then they will be affected. And you admit that “we” don’t even know if it will affect the new ones. That’s an issue. It also still doesn’t fit with the devs own words that Han will always go first unless facing a faster Han. Was that a lie, mistake, or is this not WAI?

    Event having bonus turns doesn't run into this issue, unless you are using rebels.

    Lmao. Seriously? That’s your argument? Just don’t use Rebels? We also won’t run into it if we quit the game. But I’m not sure that’s really the answer we all want.
  • 0iw1fc4s4c0f.jpeg

    This was said just 2 weeks ago. They know that he should always go first. I took him to R6 with that assertion in mind. He’s now been devalued by the update that promised that he wouldn’t be devalued. It’s not WAI
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Bonus Tier 3 is extremely difficult as is. Not being able to stun a toon with Han’s ability to open every phase is a significant disadvantage. Especially p4 and p8

    Do they get bonus turns in T3 of that assault battle?

    Who knows? Until today, I don’t think anyone besides the devs knew that they got a bonus turn in this event. And p4 of that event is the exact same toons as seen here. So how many pve events give hidden bonus turns to enemy toons? Will we only find out when we attempt those events?

    Most of the older events have "bonus turns" at the beginning of the event. Most players call it TM loading, but they are 2 different things, and I dont recall which events have which.

    The T3 of the assault battles were added recently and I dont think contain this mechanism.

    We can ask, but the point still stands, it's not several events, and we dont even know for sure if it does effect the one other event were this may arise.

    I’m sorry, but you just said that most of the older events give bonus turns, and then said that it’s NOT several events that will be affected. Which is it? If most of the older events give bonus turns, then they will be affected. And you admit that “we” don’t even know if it will affect the new ones. That’s an issue. It also still doesn’t fit with the devs own words that Han will always go first unless facing a faster Han. Was that a lie, mistake, or is this not WAI?

    Event having bonus turns doesn't run into this issue, unless you are using rebels.

    Lmao. Seriously? That’s your argument? Just don’t use Rebels? We also won’t run into it if we quit the game. But I’m not sure that’s really the answer we all want.

    Many of the events are faction specific, so it's not an option.

    Which is why I asked you to list the events you see this being an issue, and I can ask of they have this bonus turn issue. I cant think of many events where this is an issue, but you were saying many.
  • they are looking into it. at first glance this seems to be WAI.

    Then their intentions are off.

    Han shoots first. Period. That's the point.

    If they don't like how that affects difficulty, then can change any number of things to compensate, but Han shoots first.

    Separately...

    You see to say that this is working as coded, meaning the the rules for determining bonus turn order are being followed.

    However, as coded and as intended are not at all the same thing. I would be very careful of saying that this is as intended until you confirm that CG no longer wishes Han to shoot first in every encounter. Because if they still wish Han to shoot first, then this might not be a bug, but it's not working as intended either.

    Me, I have the hope that they never intended for Han to shoot anything other than first, and simply failed to code Han's unique into the new turn-order system.
  • PVE. Places we can use Han. And remember, this affects everyone at every level. So even though some of these events are very easy to beat for end game users. Not all users are end game.

    Assault battles
    Galactic challenges - all of them
    Smugglers run
    Omega battles
    Every heroic and mythic level that doesn’t require a specific team
    Daily challenges.
    Galactic war
    Light and dark side battles
    Cantina battles
    Mod battles and challenges
    Raids.

    That’s several places. How many of those have enemy toons that get secret bonus turns?

  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    edited August 2020
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    PVE. Places we can use Han. And remember, this affects everyone at every level. So even though some of these events are very easy to beat for end game users. Not all users are end game.

    Assault battles
    Galactic challenges - all of them
    Smugglers run
    Omega battles
    Every heroic and mythic level that doesn’t require a specific team
    Daily challenges.
    Galactic war
    Light and dark side battles
    Cantina battles
    Mod battles and challenges
    Raids.

    That’s several places. How many of those have enemy toons that get secret bonus turns?

    So of this list the only ones effected by this that I can see, meaning they have bonus turns at the start of a wave, and you can use Han:

    Possibly one assault battle
    GCs (for all but 1, it's a choice)

    I don't believe anything else on that list is affected.
  • Ltswb1
    550 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    PVE. Places we can use Han. And remember, this affects everyone at every level. So even though some of these events are very easy to beat for end game users. Not all users are end game.

    Assault battles
    Galactic challenges - all of them
    Smugglers run
    Omega battles
    Every heroic and mythic level that doesn’t require a specific team
    Daily challenges.
    Galactic war
    Light and dark side battles
    Cantina battles
    Mod battles and challenges
    Raids.

    That’s several places. How many of those have enemy toons that get secret bonus turns?

    So of this list the only ones effected by this that I can see, meaning they have bonus turns at the start of a wave, and you can use Han:

    Possibly one assault battle
    GCs (for all but 1, it's a choice)

    I don't believe anything else on that list is affected.

    And obviously smugglers run.
    What about Geo lstb or Hoth?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    edited August 2020
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    PVE. Places we can use Han. And remember, this affects everyone at every level. So even though some of these events are very easy to beat for end game users. Not all users are end game.

    Assault battles
    Galactic challenges - all of them
    Smugglers run
    Omega battles
    Every heroic and mythic level that doesn’t require a specific team
    Daily challenges.
    Galactic war
    Light and dark side battles
    Cantina battles
    Mod battles and challenges
    Raids.

    That’s several places. How many of those have enemy toons that get secret bonus turns?

    So of this list the only ones effected by this that I can see, meaning they have bonus turns at the start of a wave, and you can use Han:

    Possibly one assault battle
    GCs (for all but 1, it's a choice)

    I don't believe anything else on that list is affected.

    And obviously smugglers run.
    What about lstb or Hoth?

    Yeah, obviously. Sorry I missed that one.

    Nope those shouldn't have any issues

    Also rebels kind of stink in LSGeo
  • Ok. I hope you’re right. Thanks for responding
  • So because they stink let them stink worse because a mechanic was messed up by their tinkering?

    Throw TAC in there and see how they do.
  • CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi folks, as Kyno mention, these units are also being granted a Bonus Turn. Which means the unit that will go first will have the highest amount of Turn Meter, then highest speed if tied for TM, then randomly selected if tied for speed as well. The new system for turn order specifically prioritizes all the units with bonus turns over any other units.

    In this case, the enemies in Tiers 3 and 4 of the Smuggler's Run event are being granted a bonus turn as part of their event buffs. If Han Solo has no Turn Meter at the end of an encounter, it is possible for the enemies to go before him if they have more Speed than he does.

    I’m sorry but This sounds a little like a cop out ... han shoots first, that’s the point.. you guys even said it when you mentioned it in the new TM system...... your response makes me believe that you guys just don’t want to deal with something that looks like a glitch. Real nice
  • They've said it's an unintended interaction and they're looking it, right?
  • Ltswb1
    550 posts Member
    No.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Ltswb1 wrote: »
    Ok. I hope you’re right. Thanks for responding

    No problem, I'm not saying it's not an issue, just trying to keep things in perspective.
  • ShaggyB
    2390 posts Member
    edited August 2020
    CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi folks, as Kyno mention, these units are also being granted a Bonus Turn. Which means the unit that will go first will have the highest amount of Turn Meter, then highest speed if tied for TM, then randomly selected if tied for speed as well. The new system for turn order specifically prioritizes all the units with bonus turns over any other units.

    In this case, the enemies in Tiers 3 and 4 of the Smuggler's Run event are being granted a bonus turn as part of their event buffs. If Han Solo has no Turn Meter at the end of an encounter, it is possible for the enemies to go before him if they have more Speed than he does.

    Then han isnt shooting first is he?

    v1tgl72hlo3s.jpg

    That doesnt say but only if he had more turn meter than everyone else thats being granted a bonus turn.

    I would only expect another han to out gun sling him.

    If thats not the case then hans shoots first ability is all kinds of misleading

    Seems like your fix is to reset hans turn meter every round. If he atill doesnt go first then you need to give him bonus turn as well
  • CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi folks, as Kyno mention, these units are also being granted a Bonus Turn. Which means the unit that will go first will have the highest amount of Turn Meter, then highest speed if tied for TM, then randomly selected if tied for speed as well. The new system for turn order specifically prioritizes all the units with bonus turns over any other units.

    In this case, the enemies in Tiers 3 and 4 of the Smuggler's Run event are being granted a bonus turn as part of their event buffs. If Han Solo has no Turn Meter at the end of an encounter, it is possible for the enemies to go before him if they have more Speed than he does.

    So, what happened to “Han Solo will always shoot first (as he should!)”?
  • Also, and I could be wrong here, if the old way was Han and the enemy squad all had bonus turns at the start of the round, wasn’t a coin flip mechanic in place? If so, Han never, ever losing that coin flip over millions of rounds played makes this seem sketchy.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    @Ltswb1 I got confirmation that in the Military Might assault battle should not have an issue, Han will go first.
  • @Kyno thanks for the quick update!
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