Unaligned Force User sounds really bad, it should be Neutral Force User.
Maybe they didnt want it to be confused with the neutral tag.
But I also agree that neutral isnt really the "other option" between jedi and sith.
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
Unaligned Force User sounds really bad, it should be Neutral Force User.
Maybe they didnt want it to be confused with the neutral tag.
But I also agree that neutral isnt really the "other option" between jedi and sith.
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
Unaligned Force User sounds really bad, it should be Neutral Force User.
Maybe they didnt want it to be confused with the neutral tag.
But I also agree that neutral isnt really the "other option" between jedi and sith.
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
That doesnt mean they will not use it.
Weren't there some problems with it the last time it came up?
So you are saying that Mando, Greef and the RC should be darkside? I think that Bounty Hunters as a whole fit the neutral tag, but LS/DS is based on their choices.
Unaligned Force User sounds really bad, it should be Neutral Force User.
Maybe they didnt want it to be confused with the neutral tag.
But I also agree that neutral isnt really the "other option" between jedi and sith.
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
That doesnt mean they will not use it.
Weren't there some problems with it the last time it came up?
Yes, and at this point, I believe that issue is not an issue any more.
He was a receiver, not really a user. He could only sense it, but not actually use it.
Scavenger Rey could do both which is what makes her a user.
Chirrut uses the force to tune his senses and his perception, and to guide his actions. He achieves things that a non-force user couldn’t do. That is using the force just as much as swinging laser swords and lifting rocks.
We debate whether Finn was using the force, but we were never quite sure. There’s no debate with Chirrut. He wasn’t a Jedi. But he was one heck of an unaligned force user.
Unaligned Force User sounds really bad, it should be Neutral Force User.
Maybe they didnt want it to be confused with the neutral tag.
But I also agree that neutral isnt really the "other option" between jedi and sith.
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
Bounty Hunters are probably the only faction that isn't invested in any kind of alignment. They don't care if the mark is a good or evil person or the moral consequences of their actions.
If you take the Mandalorian as an example, the moment he decided to renege on the contract and not kill the Baby, was the moment he stopped being a Bounty Hunter and became a hero.
Neutrality in game terms is probably more easily defined as Pragmatism and there's a ton of characters who fit that profile in the SW universe. Beckett from Solo, Hondo from Rebels, DJ (Benecio Del Toro's character in TLJ) That's a discussion for a different thread though.
I thought it was pretty obvious that Rogue One inferred Chirrut was in tune with the Force, considering the fact he was blind. Using (jedi) prescience to feel the flow of the force and "see" events in the future. He was effectively using the force to see instead of using his eyes.
He was a receiver, not really a user. He could only sense it, but not actually use it.
Scavenger Rey could do both which is what makes her a user.
Chirrut uses the force to tune his senses and his perception, and to guide his actions. He achieves things that a non-force user couldn’t do. That is using the force just as much as swinging laser swords and lifting rocks.
We debate whether Finn was using the force, but we were never quite sure. There’s no debate with Chirrut. He wasn’t a Jedi. But he was one heck of an unaligned force user.
Being force sensetive and being able to receive the sense, is different than being able to manipulate things using the force. Using the force to me is the ability to both in and out. (Nothing to do with a lightsaber)
Some people are force sensetive, they are input only. I wouldnt consider them a user, as they cannot output control of the force.
Some people are force sensetive, they are input only. I wouldnt consider them a user, as they cannot output control of the force.
George Lucas defined any and all kind of aptitude with the Force as a product of midichlorians.
Anyone with a high midichlorian count has the potential to be able to "output", it's just a case of them being trained or naturally gifted example: Baby Yoda.
So I don't think we should have such a narrow perspective on who should be given this tag
Being force sensetive and being able to receive the sense, is different than being able to manipulate things using the force. Using the force to me is the ability to both in and out. (Nothing to do with a lightsaber)
Some people are force sensetive, they are input only. I wouldnt consider them a user, as they cannot output control of the force.
When Luke turns off the targeting computer and reaches out with his feelings to know where to aim his missile, and when to press the button to blow up the Death Star, what does Obi Wan tell him he is doing?
Some people are force sensetive, they are input only. I wouldnt consider them a user, as they cannot output control of the force.
George Lucas defined any and all kind of aptitude with the Force as a product of midichlorians.
Anyone with a high midichlorian count has the potential to be able to "output", it's just a case of them being trained or naturally gifted example: Baby Yoda.
So I don't think we should have such a narrow perspective on who should be given this tag
Who does this George fellow think he is.... haha. (Do you have a link, personal edification, so no big deal of you do not)
Baby Yoda was trained, so not sure on that example.
The tag is narrow for game balance purposes, it doesnt really matter what conclusions we come to.
There is a marker for technology development that has a step at controlling the weather. We are not there, but we can see and model and even predict weather. That means nothing because we cannot exert control, and its meaningless that we could get there through development "at some point", we are not there.
That is why I see the distinction between being at one stage in the skills of the force, and still not a force user. Sure they have some level of awareness and even usage in being able to sense things with it using that to guide their actions, but they cannot exert control over it, that is a big step, and IMO the necessary one to classify them as a user. Again just my opinion.
I hope we get unaligned force user through Maul, either a legendary, EC, conquest or possibly a GL release and have him have mandalorian synergy from the time he ruled mandolore.
They absolutely are. They go where the money is - if the rebels had paid them appropriately then they would have been doing stuff for the rebels.
BH are realistically as neutral as it gets among title characters.
Greed and a lack of moral conviction doesn't make one neutral.
I would argue the opposite. Greed makes it so that you just don’t care. Zam Wesell says her attempt to kill Padme was “just a job”. Just because someone is paying you for one job, doesn’t mean they won’t follow the money. If the Rebels paid better than the Empire or Jabba, you can bet that Boba would be shadowing Han WHEREVER HE WENT. Playing both sides makes you Neutral in any sense of the word.
They absolutely are. They go where the money is - if the rebels had paid them appropriately then they would have been doing stuff for the rebels.
BH are realistically as neutral as it gets among title characters.
Greed and a lack of moral conviction doesn't make one neutral.
I would argue the opposite. Greed makes it so that you just don’t care. Zam Wesell says her attempt to kill Padme was “just a job”. Just because someone is paying you for one job, doesn’t mean they won’t follow the money. If the Rebels paid better than the Empire or Jabba, you can bet that Boba would be shadowing Han WHEREVER HE WENT. Playing both sides makes you Neutral in any sense of the word.
The light side is about collective strength, the dark side is about thw strength of the individual. Playing both sides, in this case, is about nihilism. Say what you want about the narcissim of the sith, but at least it's an ethos... Neutrality, by your terms, is just greed over any sense of morality.
They absolutely are. They go where the money is - if the rebels had paid them appropriately then they would have been doing stuff for the rebels.
BH are realistically as neutral as it gets among title characters.
Greed and a lack of moral conviction doesn't make one neutral.
Presumptuous statement
How so? He's defining neutrality as self-interest. You fight for one side until the other pays you more, so you believe in cash more than you believe in the sith code or the rebellion. Greed and not believing in anything enough to actually commit. What would you call it?
Keep in mind, I'm not saying this means bounty hunters are all dark side by necessity. Bounty hunting is just a job. The Mandalorian and Greef, they're light side for a reason. What I'm responding to is the faulty logic of people saying Boba Fett is neutral because he would betray anyone if offered a better price.
Who does this George fellow think he is.... haha. (Do you have a link, personal edification, so no big deal of you do not)
Sure, I thought it was basic Star Wars knowledge but from starwars.fandom.com on the Wookiepedia page for Midi-Chlorians:
"Without the midi-chlorians, life could not exist, and we would have no knowledge of the Force. They continually speak to us, telling us the will of the Force. When you learn to quiet your mind, you'll hear them speaking to you."
―Qui-Gon Jinn, to Anakin Skywalker[src]
Who does this George fellow think he is.... haha. (Do you have a link, personal edification, so no big deal of you do not)
Sure, I thought it was basic Star Wars knowledge but from starwars.fandom.com on the Wookiepedia page for Midi-Chlorians:
"Without the midi-chlorians, life could not exist, and we would have no knowledge of the Force. They continually speak to us, telling us the will of the Force. When you learn to quiet your mind, you'll hear them speaking to you."
―Qui-Gon Jinn, to Anakin Skywalker[src]
I thought you meant a clarifying statement from Lucus, like he has done on certain things.
The force being connected to midi-chlorians doesnt really change anything in this conversation.
Replies
The tag no one is using?
For a second this morning I thought you guys removed it. Guess I never realized that it was in the section of filters before the alphabetical part.
That doesnt mean they will not use it.
Weren't there some problems with it the last time it came up?
I said they aren't neutral, not dark side
Yes, and at this point, I believe that issue is not an issue any more.
Chirrut uses the force to tune his senses and his perception, and to guide his actions. He achieves things that a non-force user couldn’t do. That is using the force just as much as swinging laser swords and lifting rocks.
We debate whether Finn was using the force, but we were never quite sure. There’s no debate with Chirrut. He wasn’t a Jedi. But he was one heck of an unaligned force user.
They absolutely are. They go where the money is - if the rebels had paid them appropriately then they would have been doing stuff for the rebels.
BH are realistically as neutral as it gets among title characters.
Soon™
If you take the Mandalorian as an example, the moment he decided to renege on the contract and not kill the Baby, was the moment he stopped being a Bounty Hunter and became a hero.
Neutrality in game terms is probably more easily defined as Pragmatism and there's a ton of characters who fit that profile in the SW universe. Beckett from Solo, Hondo from Rebels, DJ (Benecio Del Toro's character in TLJ) That's a discussion for a different thread though.
I thought it was pretty obvious that Rogue One inferred Chirrut was in tune with the Force, considering the fact he was blind. Using (jedi) prescience to feel the flow of the force and "see" events in the future. He was effectively using the force to see instead of using his eyes.
Being force sensetive and being able to receive the sense, is different than being able to manipulate things using the force. Using the force to me is the ability to both in and out. (Nothing to do with a lightsaber)
Some people are force sensetive, they are input only. I wouldnt consider them a user, as they cannot output control of the force.
George Lucas defined any and all kind of aptitude with the Force as a product of midichlorians.
Anyone with a high midichlorian count has the potential to be able to "output", it's just a case of them being trained or naturally gifted example: Baby Yoda.
So I don't think we should have such a narrow perspective on who should be given this tag
When Luke turns off the targeting computer and reaches out with his feelings to know where to aim his missile, and when to press the button to blow up the Death Star, what does Obi Wan tell him he is doing?
Who does this George fellow think he is.... haha. (Do you have a link, personal edification, so no big deal of you do not)
Baby Yoda was trained, so not sure on that example.
The tag is narrow for game balance purposes, it doesnt really matter what conclusions we come to.
There is a marker for technology development that has a step at controlling the weather. We are not there, but we can see and model and even predict weather. That means nothing because we cannot exert control, and its meaningless that we could get there through development "at some point", we are not there.
That is why I see the distinction between being at one stage in the skills of the force, and still not a force user. Sure they have some level of awareness and even usage in being able to sense things with it using that to guide their actions, but they cannot exert control over it, that is a big step, and IMO the necessary one to classify them as a user. Again just my opinion.
Greed and a lack of moral conviction doesn't make one neutral.
You mean when he pulled the lever physically with his hand and didn’t manipulate it with the Force?
Shield Droids from some of the Assault Battles, in case anyone is wondering.
I would argue the opposite. Greed makes it so that you just don’t care. Zam Wesell says her attempt to kill Padme was “just a job”. Just because someone is paying you for one job, doesn’t mean they won’t follow the money. If the Rebels paid better than the Empire or Jabba, you can bet that Boba would be shadowing Han WHEREVER HE WENT. Playing both sides makes you Neutral in any sense of the word.
The ones in Ground War that give Overcharge? Those are neutral?
Presumptuous statement
The light side is about collective strength, the dark side is about thw strength of the individual. Playing both sides, in this case, is about nihilism. Say what you want about the narcissim of the sith, but at least it's an ethos... Neutrality, by your terms, is just greed over any sense of morality.
How so? He's defining neutrality as self-interest. You fight for one side until the other pays you more, so you believe in cash more than you believe in the sith code or the rebellion. Greed and not believing in anything enough to actually commit. What would you call it?
Keep in mind, I'm not saying this means bounty hunters are all dark side by necessity. Bounty hunting is just a job. The Mandalorian and Greef, they're light side for a reason. What I'm responding to is the faulty logic of people saying Boba Fett is neutral because he would betray anyone if offered a better price.
Sure, I thought it was basic Star Wars knowledge but from starwars.fandom.com on the Wookiepedia page for Midi-Chlorians:
"Without the midi-chlorians, life could not exist, and we would have no knowledge of the Force. They continually speak to us, telling us the will of the Force. When you learn to quiet your mind, you'll hear them speaking to you."
―Qui-Gon Jinn, to Anakin Skywalker[src]
I thought you meant a clarifying statement from Lucus, like he has done on certain things.
The force being connected to midi-chlorians doesnt really change anything in this conversation.