So CG Admitted that CLS Was A Little Too OP...

There was the interview with a dev a while back (I believe it was KRAJ) - who basically stated that that they realized they overdid it a bit with CLS, and that he was a little too strong. It was also suggested that they learned from that and wouldn't release characters like that anymore.

But if one simply looks at the meta report on swgoh.gg (specifically the Leaders for #1 or even top 10 teams) - it's clear that they did the exact same thing with JTR, as she is now the lead for almost 50% of all teams.

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Incidentally, CLS is 2nd...and Talzin (also released after CLS) is third. It seems like they either didn't learn very well, aren't trying very hard not to blow up the meta everytime they release someone or were being a bit misleading.

Not sure which.

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In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*

Replies

  • Liath
    3463 posts Member
    I think you are taking that comment out of context. As I recall it, what he said was that they intended for JTRey to be comparable in power to CLS, but that what they wanted to avoid repeating was making such a powerful character that could just be thrown into any team and make that team better. So they designed JTRey to be very good, but only with the right team around her. She wouldn’t just be tossed into existing CLS teams - and she wasn’t. So they were successful at that.

    The funny thing about it is that a whole ton of people thought those videos were just sales pitches to get people to invest in an underwhelming character that would never be meta. At the time people were clamoring to have JTRey buffed because she was going to be too weak.
  • Naraic
    2198 posts Member
    Also what the op doesn't mention is that CLS is amazing in all areas of the game, jtr isn't really an amazing first rate character in for example raids.
  • Do you really expect all the leaders to take equal parts of the pie chart?

    Naraic wrote: »
    Also what the op doesn't mention is that CLS is amazing in all areas of the game, jtr isn't really an amazing first rate character in for example raids.

    Dude, please don't give him a chance to counter with his arguments. She *is* amazing in raids fyi.
  • Naraic
    2198 posts Member
    Do you really expect all the leaders to take equal parts of the pie chart?

    Naraic wrote: »
    Also what the op doesn't mention is that CLS is amazing in all areas of the game, jtr isn't really an amazing first rate character in for example raids.

    Dude, please don't give him a chance to counter with his arguments. She *is* amazing in raids fyi.

    Is she. I withdraw my comment then. I don't have her but I remember a lot of people being underwhelmed in raids.
  • TVF
    10577 posts Member
    There's plenty of videos of JTR teams doing lots of damage in HAAT.

    Hell I can almost solo P3 with JTR BB8 R2 CLS Han and that's with BB8 at G9 and JTR at G8 (lol). She's not plug-and-play in any team like CLS is, but she's useful in just about every phase of the game with the right team around her.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • RJT is amazing for me. I have her at G12 (and a half) with two zetas (not on her leader one yet) and she wreaks shop for me.

    Raids: I can solo heroic Pit with RJT lead, BB8, R2, Zinn and CLS. No problem at all (I know I could solo that same raid with a CLS lead Rebels squad too, might try that tonight :P ).

    Tank raid that same squad can do serious damage, but my guild has not completed HAAT yet so I cannot speak on the viability there, although I'm told that a Resistance team with her lead can solo P3 and do about 35% of damage on P4.
    TVF wrote: »
    Hell I can almost solo P3 with JTR BB8 R2 CLS Han and that's with BB8 at G9 and JTR at G8 (lol).

    Who are you running with her? My squad listed above is my Arena squad as well and I'm wondering if CLS or Zinn should be on the outs soon. I'm working on Thrawn and Raid Han Solo now for that purpose, but without GK I'm thinking I might should gear up Old Ben instead.

    Also, despite our previous Chopper disagreement, I have started gearing him up too. I have seen RJT, R2, BB8, Chopper and Thrawn on a few squads in my shard above me (I'm fighting hard to stay top 50 everyday).
  • Liath
    3463 posts Member
    RJT is amazing for me. I have her at G12 (and a half) with two zetas (not on her leader one yet) and she wreaks shop for me.

    Raids: I can solo heroic Pit with RJT lead, BB8, R2, Zinn and CLS. No problem at all (I know I could solo that same raid with a CLS lead Rebels squad too, might try that tonight :P ).

    Tank raid that same squad can do serious damage, but my guild has not completed HAAT yet so I cannot speak on the viability there, although I'm told that a Resistance team with her lead can solo P3 and do about 35% of damage on P4.
    TVF wrote: »
    Hell I can almost solo P3 with JTR BB8 R2 CLS Han and that's with BB8 at G9 and JTR at G8 (lol).

    Who are you running with her? My squad listed above is my Arena squad as well and I'm wondering if CLS or Zinn should be on the outs soon. I'm working on Thrawn and Raid Han Solo now for that purpose, but without GK I'm thinking I might should gear up Old Ben instead.

    Also, despite our previous Chopper disagreement, I have started gearing him up too. I have seen RJT, R2, BB8, Chopper and Thrawn on a few squads in my shard above me (I'm fighting hard to stay top 50 everyday).

    The post you quoted said who he was running her with. ;) Thrawn makes things a bit easier than Han IME, since he can also regain protection and reduce counters. Finn is worth replacing in both places (and being Zinn doesn’t matter since he’s not lead). In tank, it lets you run a second resistance team as well.
  • Naraic wrote: »
    Do you really expect all the leaders to take equal parts of the pie chart?

    Naraic wrote: »
    Also what the op doesn't mention is that CLS is amazing in all areas of the game, jtr isn't really an amazing first rate character in for example raids.

    Dude, please don't give him a chance to counter with his arguments. She *is* amazing in raids fyi.

    Is she. I withdraw my comment then. I don't have her but I remember a lot of people being underwhelmed in raids.

    "those people" aren't using her correctly. JTR, BB8, R2D2, Thrawn, and CLS. Hit Auto in P3 and come back 10 minutes later to see it all dead.
  • Yet they refuse to give the Vets a Resistance rag for “balance” reasons.
  • For those saying CLS is pretty much "plug and play" - many of you have apparently not run him in high level arena teams where he is NOT the lead. He is not nearly as effective if he is not in the lead and surrounded by countering Rebels and R2 to stun everyone for him. Yes, if he is in the lead with Raid and R2 at his side, you can pretty much throw anyone else in the other two slots and compete (GK, Thrawn, Chaze, even zLeia). But I've seen him in JTR teams and he's not a problem there...she and BB8 are, but not CLS.

    And JTR wouldn't still be sitting atop the meta if she didn't pretty much handle all the other teams well. Does she need a specific team? Sure - as long as that team has BB-8 and R2 you can pretty much swap in GK, OB, Chopper, ScavRey, Thrawn, Poe, etc. - same as CLS.

    Honestly, I don't care that much - just found it ironic.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • CLS still remains the most powerful character in the game.
    Yes, the devs admitted they made him too OP (Which is good! Own up to your mistakes!).
    JRey is not as powerful as CLS, but almost, which is what they intended. As others have said, if you stick her by herself, she's not very good, vs CLS who can do a ridiculous number of things without needing anyone else. The devs did make sure to improve her AI, which is probably why she's used a lot in arena.
    #CloneHelmets4Life...VICTORY!!!! :smiley: "I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere."
  • leef
    11987 posts Member
    edited February 2018
    i dunno man, i still think britney is hot.
    As for arena diversity, it's either OP or extremely bad on defence according to the forum, wich translates nicely in to the swgoh.gg meta report.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    Yeah but bb8 is useless without a specific team around him, so it's not like you can put him with ns and make them OP
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    Yeah but bb8 is useless without a specific team around him, so it's not like you can put him with ns and make them OP

    Lol. There is a JTRey team in the top 10 of my arena shard with MT on it. It's just silly to see her get a boost from BB8.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build

    That's cool. It bothers my Star Wars sensibilities just a bit to see Mother Talzin fighting alongside Thrawn, JTRey, BB8 and R2 - but if you're cool with that, that's fine.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Yea, they said that AFTER cls become old char. So that people lose interest in cls, and chase the new meta.
  • Waqui
    5034 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    .

    But if one simply looks at the meta report on swgoh.gg (specifically the Leaders for #1 or even top 10 teams) - it's clear that they did the exact same thing with JTR, as she is now the lead for almost 50% of all teams.

    A popular and widely used toon is not necessarily an overpowered toon. People like to use their new shiny toons.
  • It's the power creep, no one will pay for subpar characters. Take a look at some old characters with leadership abilities, old ones will read like this; "allies gain 40 defense".. new character's leadership ability; "a GIANT paragraph" with like 3 or 4 stipulations and situations which it would apply
  • Mr_Sausage wrote: »
    Yet they refuse to give the Vets a Resistance rag for “balance” reasons.

    this is actually the most bothersome fact for me. especially since its probably due to AOE against expose, yet then they go and make holdo...
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build

    That's cool. It bothers my Star Wars sensibilities just a bit to see Mother Talzin fighting alongside Thrawn, JTRey, BB8 and R2 - but if you're cool with that, that's fine.

    Why is it ok to have thrawn with jtrey but not Mt?
  • ProximaB1_ wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build

    That's cool. It bothers my Star Wars sensibilities just a bit to see Mother Talzin fighting alongside Thrawn, JTRey, BB8 and R2 - but if you're cool with that, that's fine.

    Why is it ok to have thrawn with jtrey but not Mt?

    It's not. I think you missed the point there Sparky.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Ok
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build

    That's cool. It bothers my Star Wars sensibilities just a bit to see Mother Talzin fighting alongside Thrawn, JTRey, BB8 and R2 - but if you're cool with that, that's fine.

    It's a holotable game and you're just a random guy on a cantina playing with holograms that represent people that once existed. So.... it's not like your toons were conscious about it.

    That, and the fact that it's a game and it shouldn't be put too much thinking into it.
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Oh - random thought - it's all silly that with all of the recent attempts for strong buffs to be faction-specific (so as to encourage arena teams to be more synergy dependent based on their faction) it seem ridiculously silly that BB8's Illuminated Destiny (arguably the most powerful ability in the game) benefits "all allies" (which can include MT, Thrawn, GK, etc.), when even the recent Vader/Palp reworks still only benefit Sith and Empire.

    Whatever. I get it. CG's game, their rules. But some of the complete disregard for consistency is baffling on occasion.

    I like having characters that benefit everybody. Allows you to be more creative with the teams you build

    That's cool. It bothers my Star Wars sensibilities just a bit to see Mother Talzin fighting alongside Thrawn, JTRey, BB8 and R2 - but if you're cool with that, that's fine.

    It's a holotable game and you're just a random guy on a cantina playing with holograms that represent people that once existed. So.... it's not like your toons were conscious about it.

    That, and the fact that it's a game and it shouldn't be put too much thinking into it.

    Yep. That's why I said "just a bit." ;)
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Having MT fight along side Thrawn and CLS etc is what makes this game fun... Remember when chirpa and palp was a thing in haat so random but it's cool as it could never happen in the movies, same as a wampa ruling the game, just plain weird but also makes it more fun :)

    I like mismatch teams you can find some gems whilst working towards end game characters
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