I would say omegas are just a big a wall as zetas. If my count is accurate, I need 855 omegas to finish all my toons abilities to level 8. Then you add the ones needed for zetas on top of that. I currently have 45 zetas. At this point, I'm running low on "must have" zetas on my list. Yes, Darth Revan will probably need all three and I am finally almost done my second zeta for Traya, but my current "want" list is getting slimmer without really looking into them. Granted, every toon doesn't need all their omega abilities, but having to save omegas to finish zetas slows down the omega ability progress.
I am going to take the angle and the position that the OP had about trying everything and there is a way you can do that without being overwhelming for players I was thinking about.
What if there is a 5 Zeta mat option and a 15 Zeta mat option with every zeta?
The 5 Zeta option means you have access to use that toons Zeta in all modes aside from TW, GA, and raids. This could give you a chance to try things, at a lower value, and won’t give a player full access to the Zeta in other modes. Also could allow the player to make a decision if the Zeta is good enough to use 15 more Zeta mats to have in all modes.
The 15 Zeta option allows you to use your Zeta everywhere. Everyone is happy. You have the chance to try out Zetas without the crazy investment of a full 20 without also breaking the game too much with way too many ways to get Zeta mats.
I am going to take the angle and the position that the OP had about trying everything and there is a way you can do that without being overwhelming for players I was thinking about.
What if there is a 5 Zeta mat option and a 15 Zeta mat option with every zeta?
The 5 Zeta option means you have access to use that toons Zeta in all modes aside from TW, GA, and raids. This could give you a chance to try things, at a lower value, and won’t give a player full access to the Zeta in other modes. Also could allow the player to make a decision if the Zeta is good enough to use 15 more Zeta mats to have in all modes.
The 15 Zeta option allows you to use your Zeta everywhere. Everyone is happy. You have the chance to try out Zetas without the crazy investment of a full 20 without also breaking the game too much with way too many ways to get Zeta mats.
There are so many ways to get zetas now...GA, TW, Fleet, and the random events.
Why do people keep wanting to make the game easier...you understand that if you make zetas easier to get...everyone will get them and negate the point of having zetas. People complaint about how Jedi Revan is ruining the game but that's in part because so many people have them now.
Do your research...figure out what are the zetas you really need to get (as opposed to the ones that look cool) and focus on those.
I think CG is missing out on extra revenue by not selling zetas. Someone suggested $10 for 20 zetas. Sounds reasonable and I think there’s a definite market for it, imo.
Might sound crazy now, but as the game ages and they need new sources of income, I could see it happening.
I don’t find omegas to be a wall, more like a hill that is an occasional annoyance to climb.
I love to play this game competitively. It's the only aspect of the game that justifies the spending of money for me. I love coming up with strategies with all the different characters. And while theory crafting with different characters, and teams I realized there are tons of characters I will virtually NEVER get to fully utilize, because of the massive time wall that is zeta farming.
There are currently over 130 zeta abilities in the game, and many more fast approaching. The reality of zeta abilities (even zetas as old as Phoenix squad) is that; unless I have a test account, i will never realistically get play with these characters full potential; until after I have farmed zetas every day for over 4 years!!!
132 zetas= 8-12 days of farming= over 4 years!!! And there are many more coming.
If characters as old as Phoenix squad are going to be obstructed by this MASSIVE TIME WALL, then CG needs to create more efficient ways to farm zetas. I understand moderating player development, but this is about playing with abilities that characters were intended to have! Either the devs should turn a lot of these older zetas into omegas, or create a more efficient way to unlock these abilities (especially for the older characters).
The recent disappointing rework of the seperatist droid faction is a perfect example of why this zeta system is ridiculous. You reworked a faction, put 6 zetas on them, and then purposely made them uncompetitive in arena!? So now in order for a player to unlock the potential of this B GRADE TEAM, they would have to invest literally MONTHS worth of progress into them!?!? Please come up with a more efficient way to unlock these character abilities.
I understand where you're coming from, although that is what I think makes this game so great, especially with modes like TW and GA. It's the fact that you have a choice, and not everyone has the same rosters. I heavily invested in first order and ran them in arena for months and even made it into the top 50 from time to time before traya and bastilla. Everyone has put different zetas on different characters which is what keeps modes like that interesting, we all know how stale mirror matches get. I do agree that they are going a little overboard with every new character needing a zeta but not touching old characters, it's a sense of power creep that is sad to see. I think it would be awesome to see those oddball characters get zeta's that can blow them out of the water, like kit fisto or nute gunray, something old and obsolete. Even some stronger characters like rex or general kenobi or wedge and biggs. It would be pretty sweet to see those mid range characters get kicked into over drive rather than just new marquees that we need 4 months minimum to get to 7 stars.
I think CG is missing out on extra revenue by not selling zetas. Someone suggested $10 for 20 zetas. Sounds reasonable and I think there’s a definite market for it, imo.
Might sound crazy now, but as the game ages and they need new sources of income, I could see it happening.
I don’t find omegas to be a wall, more like a hill that is an occasional annoyance to climb.
No way they would do that. You get a chance to get 9-25 Omega mats and purple mats for 1,700 crystals.
Also if they did that the whales would have everything (I am a whale) and really nothing to look forward to. Would actually hurt the game as players wouldn’t care about resources or competing in fleet areas as they can fully buy their teams.
The Zetas as they are, are the only thing keeping the bridge between P2P and F2P possible.
If there was ever a reason to sell a Zeta it would be for at least $79.99 and would be a once a year thing. That would be alright as no one extra zeta will break the community.
But $20 for 20 mats for a regular thing is too much.
Generally players get a zeta in 1-2 weeks. For Darth Revan, you will probably need 3.
3-6 weeks zeta farm for a brand new meta char isnt the end of the world.
I think you're correct, but I think OP's point is that if you want to put zetas on different factions to test out (like I have with my scoundrels) you don't really have a chance. While I'm not particularly bitter about the grind that farming zetas is, I can see his point. I have guildmates who want to zeta other factions for fun and test them out (scoundrels, nightsisters, bh, ewoks, etc) but they've been complaining about how they just spent 60 on JKR and how they need to stockpile another 60 for Darth Revan.
That's about choices.
He choose to be competitive, zeta'd tigers, and complaining about no chance to play with some rabbit's zeta that looks fun?
How about I choose to zeta all R1 char and complaining I have no chance in the arena. Seriously.
If you want to experiment with some of the niche and terrible zetas, just open a second account on an old phone and have at it.
You can zeta the Vets, Clone Wars Chewie, Young Lando, and Aurra Sing, and use them to beat the credit heist or something, as they still won't be viable anywhere else.
The 5 char you listed is a solid team in TW/GA.
Taunt, teamwide leadership, dispell (both enemy and teammate), tons of CC and good damage.
I can't help but agree with the original post. Leaving aside the viability of factions, the problem I see with zetas is that they are added to the game seemingly as fast or faster than they can be farmed. Combine that with personal backlogs, meta chasing, and power creep, and it seems that under the current system, it will never make sense to try out less competitive options. I like the idea of demoting abilities and returning mats (unlikely) or allowing a switching budget between characters within similar release dates. So I couldn't temporarily de-zeta my first order to zeta Darth revan and the newer old republic, but maybe I could move some onto my Phoenix. If you limit the number of switches monthly and control what can be switched, I think it would make the game more fun and I certainly would be trying out a lot of new ideas...
I can't help but agree with the original post. Leaving aside the viability of factions, the problem I see with zetas is that they are added to the game seemingly as fast or faster than they can be farmed. Combine that with personal backlogs, meta chasing, and power creep, and it seems that under the current system, it will never make sense to try out less competitive options. I like the idea of demoting abilities and returning mats (unlikely) or allowing a switching budget between characters within similar release dates. So I couldn't temporarily de-zeta my first order to zeta Darth revan and the newer old republic, but maybe I could move some onto my Phoenix. If you limit the number of switches monthly and control what can be switched, I think it would make the game more fun and I certainly would be trying out a lot of new ideas...
Why should it ever make sense to try out less competitive option unless you are a whale?
If you are not a whale...you cannot complain that the game has too many barrier.
Prioritize your farms, gearing, and use of mats properly and you will be fine.
I think it would make the game more fun and I certainly would be trying out a lot of new ideas...
Fun doesn't equal money for them. Massive bottlenecks do.
They don't want you to try new ideas out at no cost.... Even if it is just playing around with old squads.
Doesnt fun mean different things for different people? Some people like chasing challenges and latest meta while others like collecting pokemons...the devs have to make a choice as to how this game proceeds
If you want to experiment with some of the niche and terrible zetas, just open a second account on an old phone and have at it.
You can zeta the Vets, Clone Wars Chewie, Young Lando, and Aurra Sing, and use them to beat the credit heist or something, as they still won't be viable anywhere else.
The 5 char you listed is a solid team in TW/GA.
Taunt, teamwide leadership, dispell (both enemy and teammate), tons of CC and good damage.
I mean, I can't see a world where that team would be in my top 15 options, but yes, I deliberately gave that example because it was all scoundrels and not just 5 random characters. It's not categorically awful, but it's certainly not good either.
That said, the zetas don't really add much to the upside you've listed. Aurra's unique zeta is only good in raids and the Vet Chewie and Clone Wars Chewie zetas are among the worst in the game.
I suppose you could construct an interesting team using Aurra's leadership, Young Lando's stealth-granting/prepared mechanic, and Vet Han's stacking Armor Penetration, but you can also have much better teams for TW/GA for a single zeta investment (like a Scoundrel team with the Vandor Chewbacca zeta).
I'd love to see more game modes that used obscure and underutilized characters, but that doesn't seem to be much of a financial driver, so alas, we'll all just be doing Revan mirror matches until the end of time.
If you want to experiment with some of the niche and terrible zetas, just open a second account on an old phone and have at it.
You can zeta the Vets, Clone Wars Chewie, Young Lando, and Aurra Sing, and use them to beat the credit heist or something, as they still won't be viable anywhere else.
The 5 char you listed is a solid team in TW/GA.
Taunt, teamwide leadership, dispell (both enemy and teammate), tons of CC and good damage.
I mean, I can't see a world where that team would be in my top 15 options, but yes, I deliberately gave that example because it was all scoundrels and not just 5 random characters. It's not categorically awful, but it's certainly not good either.
That said, the zetas don't really add much to the upside you've listed. Aurra's unique zeta is only good in raids and the Vet Chewie and Clone Wars Chewie zetas are among the worst in the game.
I suppose you could construct an interesting team using Aurra's leadership, Young Lando's stealth-granting/prepared mechanic, and Vet Han's stacking Armor Penetration, but you can also have much better teams for TW/GA for a single zeta investment (like a Scoundrel team with the Vandor Chewbacca zeta).
I'd love to see more game modes that used obscure and underutilized characters, but that doesn't seem to be much of a financial driver, so alas, we'll all just be doing Revan mirror matches until the end of time.
Like I said again, that's your choice(s).
You choose to be competitive, you choose revan mirror match.
Its not just about zeta, also gears. Characters with zeta but without gear is useless too.
Competitive players also earned more than "fun players" due to their arena ranks. More crystals more gears to test out new chars. What's wrong with that?
My main thing about Zetas is some of the old ones need a buff, or converted to omegas.
There are a few really poor zetas which will never get done, but to complete a character an omega should be fine. Qui Gons leadership for example isn't Zeta worthy, but would be nice to be able to max it with an omega.
All old characters should get this treatment, while it sucks if you've spent zetas on them in the past - handing out zetas for everybody en mass isn't good for the game either. I have zetas I'd like refunded but I'll take the ability to max older toons I've not yet zeta'd over nothing.
This is something that I would like to see. At least change some of the less significant older zetas into omegas so players will actually get a chance to use them. Especially now when players are needing to get the full potential out of their rosters for TW w/bonuses, and GA. I get that you want them to be special, and hard to get but my main point is I will realistically never get a chance to try those older abilities that aren't really zeta worthy.
I am going to take the angle and the position that the OP had about trying everything and there is a way you can do that without being overwhelming for players I was thinking about.
What if there is a 5 Zeta mat option and a 15 Zeta mat option with every zeta?
The 5 Zeta option means you have access to use that toons Zeta in all modes aside from TW, GA, and raids. This could give you a chance to try things, at a lower value, and won’t give a player full access to the Zeta in other modes. Also could allow the player to make a decision if the Zeta is good enough to use 15 more Zeta mats to have in all modes.
The 15 Zeta option allows you to use your Zeta everywhere. Everyone is happy. You have the chance to try out Zetas without the crazy investment of a full 20 without also breaking the game too much with way too many ways to get Zeta mats.
Half agree with this idea. Maybe have the less significant zeta abilities require less zeta mats, I would be happy with that..
I think CG is missing out on extra revenue by not selling zetas. Someone suggested $10 for 20 zetas. Sounds reasonable and I think there’s a definite market for it, imo.
Might sound crazy now, but as the game ages and they need new sources of income, I could see it happening.
I don’t find omegas to be a wall, more like a hill that is an occasional annoyance to climb.
No way they would do that. You get a chance to get 9-25 Omega mats and purple mats for 1,700 crystals.
Also if they did that the whales would have everything (I am a whale) and really nothing to look forward to. Would actually hurt the game as players wouldn’t care about resources or competing in fleet areas as they can fully buy their teams.
The Zetas as they are, are the only thing keeping the bridge between P2P and F2P
You have a good point, glad you posted here. Because let's be real CG had made it super clear that appeasing whales is their #1 priority. I was thinking of that instead of putting these massive time walls in front if every characters abilities, to shift this wall to "Extra special Gear". There is currently a specific spot already there that tells you new gear pieces are coming anyway. And as an additional challenge these gear pieces could be extremely hard to farm, then each of the special gear pieces could be specially designed to sure up a characters inherent weakness. As an example this special gear piece would give yoda extra armor, and health or palpatine a huge boost in damage output etc...
I think CG is missing out on extra revenue by not selling zetas. Someone suggested $10 for 20 zetas. Sounds reasonable and I think there’s a definite market for it, imo.
Might sound crazy now, but as the game ages and they need new sources of income, I could see it happening.
I don’t find omegas to be a wall, more like a hill that is an occasional annoyance to climb.
No way they would do that. You get a chance to get 9-25 Omega mats and purple mats for 1,700 crystals.
Also if they did that the whales would have everything (I am a whale) and really nothing to look forward to. Would actually hurt the game as players wouldn’t care about resources or competing in fleet areas as they can fully buy their teams.
The Zetas as they are, are the only thing keeping the bridge between P2P and F2P possible.
You have a good point, glad you posted here. Because let's be real CG had made it super clear that appeasing whales is their #1 priority. I was thinking of that instead of putting these massive time walls in front if every characters abilities, to shift this wall to "Extra special Gear". There is currently a specific spot already there that tells you new gear pieces are coming anyway. And as an additional challenge these gear pieces could be extremely hard to farm, then each of the special gear pieces could be specially designed to sure up a characters inherent weakness. As an example this special gear piece would give yoda extra armor, and health or palpatine a huge boost in damage output etc
Replies
What if there is a 5 Zeta mat option and a 15 Zeta mat option with every zeta?
The 5 Zeta option means you have access to use that toons Zeta in all modes aside from TW, GA, and raids. This could give you a chance to try things, at a lower value, and won’t give a player full access to the Zeta in other modes. Also could allow the player to make a decision if the Zeta is good enough to use 15 more Zeta mats to have in all modes.
The 15 Zeta option allows you to use your Zeta everywhere. Everyone is happy. You have the chance to try out Zetas without the crazy investment of a full 20 without also breaking the game too much with way too many ways to get Zeta mats.
There are so many ways to get zetas now...GA, TW, Fleet, and the random events.
Why do people keep wanting to make the game easier...you understand that if you make zetas easier to get...everyone will get them and negate the point of having zetas. People complaint about how Jedi Revan is ruining the game but that's in part because so many people have them now.
Do your research...figure out what are the zetas you really need to get (as opposed to the ones that look cool) and focus on those.
Might sound crazy now, but as the game ages and they need new sources of income, I could see it happening.
I don’t find omegas to be a wall, more like a hill that is an occasional annoyance to climb.
I understand where you're coming from, although that is what I think makes this game so great, especially with modes like TW and GA. It's the fact that you have a choice, and not everyone has the same rosters. I heavily invested in first order and ran them in arena for months and even made it into the top 50 from time to time before traya and bastilla. Everyone has put different zetas on different characters which is what keeps modes like that interesting, we all know how stale mirror matches get. I do agree that they are going a little overboard with every new character needing a zeta but not touching old characters, it's a sense of power creep that is sad to see. I think it would be awesome to see those oddball characters get zeta's that can blow them out of the water, like kit fisto or nute gunray, something old and obsolete. Even some stronger characters like rex or general kenobi or wedge and biggs. It would be pretty sweet to see those mid range characters get kicked into over drive rather than just new marquees that we need 4 months minimum to get to 7 stars.
No way they would do that. You get a chance to get 9-25 Omega mats and purple mats for 1,700 crystals.
Also if they did that the whales would have everything (I am a whale) and really nothing to look forward to. Would actually hurt the game as players wouldn’t care about resources or competing in fleet areas as they can fully buy their teams.
The Zetas as they are, are the only thing keeping the bridge between P2P and F2P possible.
But $20 for 20 mats for a regular thing is too much.
OK maybe not CW Chewie.
That's about choices.
He choose to be competitive, zeta'd tigers, and complaining about no chance to play with some rabbit's zeta that looks fun?
How about I choose to zeta all R1 char and complaining I have no chance in the arena. Seriously.
The 5 char you listed is a solid team in TW/GA.
Taunt, teamwide leadership, dispell (both enemy and teammate), tons of CC and good damage.
Why should it ever make sense to try out less competitive option unless you are a whale?
If you are not a whale...you cannot complain that the game has too many barrier.
Prioritize your farms, gearing, and use of mats properly and you will be fine.
Fun doesn't equal money for them. Massive bottlenecks do.
They don't want you to try new ideas out at no cost.... Even if it is just playing around with old squads.
Doesnt fun mean different things for different people? Some people like chasing challenges and latest meta while others like collecting pokemons...the devs have to make a choice as to how this game proceeds
I mean, I can't see a world where that team would be in my top 15 options, but yes, I deliberately gave that example because it was all scoundrels and not just 5 random characters. It's not categorically awful, but it's certainly not good either.
That said, the zetas don't really add much to the upside you've listed. Aurra's unique zeta is only good in raids and the Vet Chewie and Clone Wars Chewie zetas are among the worst in the game.
I suppose you could construct an interesting team using Aurra's leadership, Young Lando's stealth-granting/prepared mechanic, and Vet Han's stacking Armor Penetration, but you can also have much better teams for TW/GA for a single zeta investment (like a Scoundrel team with the Vandor Chewbacca zeta).
I'd love to see more game modes that used obscure and underutilized characters, but that doesn't seem to be much of a financial driver, so alas, we'll all just be doing Revan mirror matches until the end of time.
Like I said again, that's your choice(s).
You choose to be competitive, you choose revan mirror match.
Its not just about zeta, also gears. Characters with zeta but without gear is useless too.
Competitive players also earned more than "fun players" due to their arena ranks. More crystals more gears to test out new chars. What's wrong with that?
This is something that I would like to see. At least change some of the less significant older zetas into omegas so players will actually get a chance to use them. Especially now when players are needing to get the full potential out of their rosters for TW w/bonuses, and GA. I get that you want them to be special, and hard to get but my main point is I will realistically never get a chance to try those older abilities that aren't really zeta worthy.
Half agree with this idea. Maybe have the less significant zeta abilities require less zeta mats, I would be happy with that..
You have a good point, glad you posted here. Because let's be real CG had made it super clear that appeasing whales is their #1 priority. I was thinking of that instead of putting these massive time walls in front if every characters abilities, to shift this wall to "Extra special Gear". There is currently a specific spot already there that tells you new gear pieces are coming anyway. And as an additional challenge these gear pieces could be extremely hard to farm, then each of the special gear pieces could be specially designed to sure up a characters inherent weakness. As an example this special gear piece would give yoda extra armor, and health or palpatine a huge boost in damage output etc