GAC Matchmaking Mess...

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  • Options
    This is a championship, why do you want bad people to only fight bad people and good people to only fight good people? To get to kyber one should win every fight no matter who the opponent is. GA makes more sense to be fair, GA in a GAC being fair makes no sense.

    And yeah, the guy has a million more g13 than you...or 6E mods...if you have the right characters and better mods overall you have a big chance to win anyway
  • Options
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.
  • SemiGod
    3001 posts Member
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    Half the time idk if this guys trolling or not lol.
  • CCyrilS
    6732 posts Member
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    What's the point of playing if you have no chance to lose?
  • SemiGod
    3001 posts Member
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    CCyrilS wrote: »
    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    What's the point of playing if you have no chance to lose?

    I mean I'd rather be in favour of winning than losing ;D
  • CCyrilS
    6732 posts Member
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    SemiGod wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    What's the point of playing if you have no chance to lose?

    I mean I'd rather be in favour of winning than losing ;D

    Lol sure. But a game is no fun when there's no competition. I can totally school my 5yr old at 1 on 1, but i don't get too much out of it.
  • SemiGod
    3001 posts Member
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    CCyrilS wrote: »
    SemiGod wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    What's the point of playing if you have no chance to lose?

    I mean I'd rather be in favour of winning than losing ;D

    Lol sure. But a game is no fun when there's no competition. I can totally school my 5yr old at 1 on 1, but i don't get too much out of it.

    Tru but when there's a prize for winning y'know ;)
  • TVF
    36645 posts Member
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.
    If that’s the case they should just ggo be the awards out before hand so we don’t waste a week of our lives fee.

    Improve your roster and/or your tactics.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Options
    It's ridiculously hard to get matchmaking perfect.

    THIS IS WHY in GAC winners advance their leagues much more quickly and losers don't, and thus during your next round-of-8 you'll be paired up with people who, since they're from the same league are winning and losing about as much as you are.

    Start with the numbers we've got, imperfect as they are, and you get rough matches that are good for many but bad for many. The next week, the matches get better. The week after that, they get better still. By week 5, you get really good and interesting matches. Like everyone, I rarely win my round of 8 (since only 12.5% of people win their round-of-8), but I win more than my share because some people nope-out just because they don't like the game mode. Although they're signed up for free rewards, they're not actually trying and won't ever win.

    While there're certainly some things that EA/CG could do to make initial matchups a little better, nothing can tell you in advance whether someone is going to choose to nope-out. Nothing will tell you whether they're good at strategy or just bought their g12-g13 toons. So some matchups won't be good. In that first GAC, And yet, I got squashed several times in the opening round or two by people who completely outclassed me. But by week 5 I got to Aurodium and I was playing for #1 in my final round-of-8. My opponent had more g12s, but I had Revan (no Malak) and zCarth and a somewhat decent BroodAlpha geo team. Would my opponent's focus or my diversity win the day?

    It turned on strategy and my opponent was more efficient at cutting through my defenses, but in the end couldn't beat my last defensive squad. The match wasn't decided by 1 or 2 points, but it was decided by that last squad: even if it was his 58th attack that defeated them, the territory bonus would have given him the win because I had used multiple attack squads to defeat more than one of his defending groups, but he'd had enough power that the 7 battles he won, he won first try in dominating fashion. He just ran out of firepower.

    We chatted before the battle and after, and now we're allies & still chat occasionally. That was a fantastic matchup for final bragging rights. It was everything it should have been, and I ended up in that match up not just because of the battles I won, but also for the battles I lost.

    So remember: the opening battles, as mismatched as they can be sometimes, are part of the overall matchmaking process. By the time you hit week 3, you should have good matchups, and occasionally great matchups the rest of the way. In short: the 5 week format is part of how they're fixing matchmaking, so don't judge too quickly.
  • Options
    TVF wrote: »
    People shouldn't be able to win every match.
    Except for me cos I'm special. :D
  • Options
    My opinion: this is a championship. You don’t get special matchmaking cos you’re not as good. You get put in a division, and you play all the teams in that division. The teams at the top of the premier league/nba don’t just skip out the teams at the bottom. This matchmaking should have started out as being random within your division. I invested in my roster better than 95% of players, but I’m playing that top 5% so my advantage is cancelled out. Where is my reward for being better than most?

    That said, in the case of this game, after a while of records being established, your record should be factored in (but not solely relied on), so it can be decided who is best/who is middle/who is worst, rather than the top players beating the bottom players every time. When my record is amazing, I should get a group with 1 or 2 really strong players, for it to be competitive, and be above the rest. Before that I should be dominating.
  • Akenno
    538 posts Member
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    They only need to pair us up with people who got the same points...
    It is fair and if you are #1 you can really say that you are one of the best inside your division.

    Right now the matchmaking is just luck based... Just get a weak opponent with 0 points who doesn't even care about GA and you win or even get a free round...
  • Options
    Akenno wrote: »
    They only need to pair us up with people who got the same points...
    It is fair and if you are #1 you can really say that you are one of the best inside your division.

    Right now the matchmaking is just luck based... Just get a weak opponent with 0 points who doesn't even care about GA and you win or even get a free round...

    I basically agree but there should be some reward for having a better roster than 90% of your division, rather than just facing your exact level no matter how good or bad you are
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @TVF you don’t think people should be able to win every match? What’s the point of playing if you have no chance to win? It’s a waste of time.
    I think every match should be winnable, I think you shouldn’t be matched against someone if you can’t win. It’s a huge waste of time if you’re unable to win.

    Not a waste of time. An incentive to do better and improve your roster in-between GACs. That's a major part of the game and for many players a fun part.
  • Options
    @Cardiff0 this is not the nba, this is a mobile game. But, to your point, in the nba teams can have an off night, players get hurt, just not Interested. There’s always a chance. In this mobile game, there’s not always a chance to win every game. You can be matched with someone and have a zero chance of beating them. There’s no competitiveness there. I don’t think that’s fun for either party
  • Options
    @Waqui I agree with you. Everyone should be looking to improve their roster between GAC. That’s more or less the only point to this game, right? The only problem is, when you’re out against teams you can’t beat, it takes the fun away from getting ready.
    Right now everyone has to have the same cookie cutter teams, or you can’t compete. I see the same teams every GAC. Everyone places the same teams on defense, I know what I’m facing. For me, the only trouble is, do they place Malak on defense, or not. If they do, I’ve most likely lost, if they don’t, I most likely win.

    I think that’s an issue. I don’t feel like one team should be able to control an outcome of an entire match. Is it my fault for not farming them right away, or putting money into to get them faster? Yes it is, but I don’t really care for those characters so I did t want to spends months farming them.

    Also, putting people in with people they have no shot at beating isn’t fun. You can try to improve between GAC, but the next one you’ll just be in with someone better. My opponent this week( I’ve been in both sides f this FYI) has 16 gear 13 toons, plus the meta team. I’ve got 4 gear 13 , no Dr, no Malak. Is that a fair matchup ? Is that something I can change between now and next GAC? No lol I’m sure I’ll get more gear 13, but I’ll just be in with a better opponent, or I could be the one next time that is built better.

    I just don’t think you should be in unwinnable matches. If this is a strategy game there should be a strategy to win every match.
  • TVF
    36645 posts Member
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    It's up to you to improve so that your matches aren't unwinnable.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • No_Try
    4051 posts Member
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    TVF wrote: »
    It's up to you to improve so that your matches aren't unwinnable.

    He doesn't care for some characters though, improving won't work. Thus there needs to be created a situation the ones he doesn't care for has to be counted out. Or he may go looking for a role playing game too.
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
    edited August 2019
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @Waqui I agree with you. Everyone should be looking to improve their roster between GAC. That’s more or less the only point to this game, right? The only problem is, when you’re out against teams you can’t beat, it takes the fun away from getting ready.

    Right now everyone has to have the same cookie cutter teams, or you can’t compete. I see the same teams every GAC. Everyone places the same teams on defense, I know what I’m facing. For me, the only trouble is, do they place Malak on defense, or not. If they do, I’ve most likely lost, if they don’t, I most likely win.

    You know what to prepare for, then. You know which teams you need to be able to counter. If you can't counter DR yet, work on a team that counters it. Until you have a counter, you will have trouble.
    I think that’s an issue. I don’t feel like one team should be able to control an outcome of an entire match.

    Your own roster controls just as much. No DR counter.
    Is it my fault for not farming them right away, or putting money into to get them faster? Yes it is, but I don’t really care for those characters so I did t want to spends months farming them.

    You made a choice, then, and you were aware of the possible outcome.
    Also, putting people in with people they have no shot at beating isn’t fun.

    This is only the first round in a GAC. Players will advance through the leagues at different paces. Matches will become more and more even (since league proression is based on performance). It's a championship. A competition. Stronger players have a higher chance of advancing faster. I see no problem here.
    You can try to improve between GAC, but the next one you’ll just be in with someone better. My opponent this week( I’ve been in both sides f this FYI) has 16 gear 13 toons, plus the meta team. I’ve got 4 gear 13 , no Dr, no Malak. Is that a fair matchup ? Is that something I can change between now and next GAC?

    You can begin the transformation today. It's all up to you.
    No lol I’m sure I’ll get more gear 13, but I’ll just be in with a better opponent, or I could be the one next time that is built better.

    You seem to understand. Great.
    I just don’t think you should be in unwinnable matches. If this is a strategy game there should be a strategy to win every match.

    Improving your roster in-between matches is part of this strategy.
  • TVF
    36645 posts Member
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    Cardiff0 wrote: »
    Stop crying about it and just pay the cash or quit. Either way, we don't really care.

    What’s the point when you will just be matched with someone better, cancelling it ou?

    You've never won a single match?
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • kalidor
    2121 posts Member
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    I suspect the tweak to g13 matchmaking is actually coming with the next update in the form of relics. You have to be g13 to have one, and it'll likely give a healthy gp boost. The problem right now is that a zeta bumps you by 2406, wo having 1 more zeta in your top 80 allows for a lot more g12 slots to be filled on your opponent since they're only worth a tad over 200gp. I know I've got a few zetas I'd rather not have now that were good at the time (eg. Gmy, Thrawn, vader leads).
    That being said, despite that I haven't had terrible matches in Div1.
    xSWCr - Nov '15 shard - swgoh.gg kalidor-m
  • Options
    @Waqui I do have a counter for Dr and Malak, they’re not quite there to challenge all gear 13 meta team version of it yet, but I have one. That’s not the point. I’m going to use my current match as an example, also keep in mind I now my place in the game and none of it matters because there’s other areas I put more time into than just GAC.
    My current opponent is pretty solid. He has 16 gear 13 toons, I have 4. That alone isn’t enough to really be too concerned about, because depending on who he has at gear 13 most counters are good enough to overcome a lot.

    One of the main issues is how OP the meta is currently. I could use my counter team, I won’t win, but I could use them. Say I lose, I could use GG to have another shot, probably won’t win there either, he’s built this team to be really good and that’s awesome.

    My thought is if there’s no one on my roster then I probably don’t belong in a match with them. It’s a strategy game so there should be some strategy to putting something together to beat them. That’s just my opinion, there should always be a way to win a match. Currently I could use my roster and not make a dent in their arena team, because there’s only a handful of counters atm. So after Padme and GG I don’t have much left to offer. In my opinion I should be able to whittle that team down enough to beat them with as many gear 12 toons as I have. Idk if I’m explaining that the way I mean it.
    As far as building rosters a decent percentage will always be chasing a meta, right? That’s part of the point of the game. I understand that. I just think people shouldn’t be placed against people when there isn’t a chance to win. I don’t mind a challenge but I do want to have a chance at least. Competitiveness is always good.
    People work hard to build rosters, most love Star Wars and probably have people they prefer to use and not just who we’re almost forced to farm. The people that go a different route should have a fun option and have an ability to succeed in GAC and not just be lambs to slaughter. Again, I’m not really talking about myself here, because I don’t focus on GAC all that much. But I see a lot of posts about this so it seems to be an issue.
  • Options
    @TVF @No_Try I think you were taking to me. People can build their rosters , but they can only do so much. If people are behind it’s difficult to catch up. Especially when toons they need only come around so often. I would expect someone to play a game for a year just to be able to maybe have a chance to win.
    I just threw a year out there because you have to farm a couple teams, gear them up, and wait for the event to come around again. That time frame could be higher or lower idk lol
    I just think that’s asking for a huge investment just to even be in the realm of winning. So why not have them be put against people they have a chance to beat until that timed then once they have those guys then throw them in to the big guns.
    I do
    Maybe I’m putting too much thought into it. I’m just seeing the same complaints all the time about GAC. I’m sure some are sore losers who just want a freebie. But some have legit complaints where they can’t win a match no matter what they do. I don’t think that’s cool. You should always have a chance.

  • No_Try
    4051 posts Member
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    It's not the same complaint as there are a variety of complaints where some are incompatible with eachother as people are pulling it any direction. Some are reasonable, some are absurd and some CG is not willing to consider. Your variety of toon related complaints is addressed in the last Q/A. They are not considering it -at this time-. Naturally they fully understand what it's about and want to leave toon related advantage/disadvantages as is.

    Here you go:

    8j4y6lkr5peg.png

    And the g13

    viuxsjwqolcc.png


    I remember pretty well discussing about your malak issue in length. He came around for the 2nd time and you are still bringing up the same...with absurd reasoning such as "I don't like the character" in a strategy game...meanwhile also saying you simply couldn't catch it up. Contradictory narratives.

    Either case everyone understands what the toon power differences talk is about and we also know it's not gonna chance in the near future...if it changes at all. Regurtating same narrative over and over won't make it change or your point stronger, it just bores everyone and creates a noise in a field with elements we may be able to change, that are still in grey territory.

    You can make an informed decision using that. Quit, try to adjust or just let go of what you can't win/see the matches you can. Under no matchmaking paradigm everyone can make it to kyber by the nature of it being a competition.
  • Options
    @CCyrilS you should have a chance to lose. But you should have a chance to win too. I’m competitive so I don’t want give a me, I want to have to put some thought into my battles. That goes both ways. Maybe I’m asking too much, but I want some strategy in a strategy game, a chance to win, a chance to lose.
  • Waqui
    8802 posts Member
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    OBoogieIII wrote: »
    @Waqui I do have a counter for Dr and Malak, they’re not quite there to challenge all gear 13 meta team version of it yet, but I have one. That’s not the point.

    If that's not the point, why did you drag DR/Malak into the discussion and tellings that wether that team was on offense or defense was the decisive factor in your matches?
    One of the main issues is how OP the meta is currently. I could use my counter team, I won’t win, but I could use them. Say I lose, I could use GG to have another shot, probably won’t win there either, he’s built this team to be really good and that’s awesome.

    Now you drag DR/Malak into the discussion again. What's your point?

    A counter team is not much good if you can't win with it. Not really a counter. But again: Now you know, what to work on.
    My thought is if there’s no one on my roster then I probably don’t belong in a match with them.
    Why not? Why should you have easier opponents and an easier path to progress to the higher leagues? I think you and I understand the purpose of the leagues differently. There's a selection of who ends up in Khyber, Aurodium etc.

    Yes, the Sith Empire team is strong. Why should players with that team be at a disadvantage during matchmaking? Why should you only have opponents with no SE team, just because you don't have a counter? Where's the 'championship' aspect in that?
    It’s a strategy game so there should be some strategy to putting something together to beat them. That’s just my opinion, there should always be a way to win a match.

    There is. If you lack a counter to Sith Empire teams, build one. That's strategy as well.

    If you want even matches, just be patient. AS the effect of leagues kicks in later in this championship, you will be matched with players, with a similar success rate in that GAC. Matches are less even in the early rounds. Of course they are.
    Currently I could use my roster and not make a dent in their arena team, because there’s only a handful of counters atm.

    Don't you wish to be able to beat the team? Don't you want to build a team to counter sith empire teams?
    So after Padme and GG I don’t have much left to offer.
    Improve those teams then, until you'reable to win those battles.
    In my opinion I should be able to whittle that team down enough to beat them with as many gear 12 toons as I have.

    I'm sure many players felt the same way when they first encountered a NS team or a JR team with Jolee. However, That's not quite how it works.
    I just think people shouldn’t be placed against people when there isn’t a chance to win.
    I understand that. But I don't agree. This is the first round only. Uneven matches will happen.
    I don’t mind a challenge but I do want to have a chance at least.

    Ooooh! Incentive to build a stronger roster, I sense.
    Competitiveness is always good.
    People work hard to build rosters, most love Star Wars and probably have people they prefer to use and not just who we’re almost forced to farm. The people that go a different route should have a fun option and have an ability to succeed in GAC and not just be lambs to slaughter.

    Fun? Of course! Let them farm whoever they find more fun to play.
    Ability to succeed in GAC? How you build your roster of course influences that ability - and that's fine.
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