10M GP reached!

Replies

  • RTS
    415 posts Member
    Your fascination with what other people do with their money is absolutely shocking.
  • th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    So I’ve completely lost what your point/argument was in the discussion of what is a fair analogy. I think it was something along the lines that selling power is somehow unfair and overly hurts the ftp community. I guess that kinda is true if you solely focus on arena. It is definitely false if you bring in tw/Tb.

    For arena, there is no question that having more gls makes your climbs easier but no team is unbeatable and any smart/good/talented ftp player can achieve 1st every single night. There is literally a thread dedicated to those that have chosen not to spend and many have more gls and gp than many moderate to high spenders. It’s just not difficult to get 1st in arena every night without spending.

    As for Tb, whales literally only help ftp as their rosters lead to more completed waves, more deployed gp, and more stars.

    Tw is likely a wash as whales who win help their ftp guild mates that offsets the ftp members of the losing guild.

    Raids- yes at one point whales hurt their ftp guild mates in every raid, but this is offset by the rewards gained by beating the raid sooner because of these very same whales.

    Gac- roster development is far more important than money unless you’re literally a kraken but no obscene kraken is going to get matched up with ftp account.

    I can’t think of a legitimate argument that whales somehow overall impact ftp players negatively. If you aren’t happy with your progress you make in the game it likely has 99 percent to do with your choices not whales. You control whether or not you’re in a guild where you can get top 10 in hstr and top 5 in cpit. You control how much effort you put into game. There is nothing unachievable in this game if you choose to not spend money. Stop trying to point fingers at those supporting the game which allows you to decide not to spend as some form of cheaters.

    I didn't bring up the sports analogy. I just said that paying for a leg up is acceptable in gaming while everywhere else it's called bribing or cheating and Kyno asked me for a list of sports where people are not throwing money at team/organization to get an advantage. Then the discussion turned to whether athletes pay for advantages or not. I don't think it's comparable but some people argue otherwise.
    I think that buying power is pathetic - in general (not just in this game) and F2P community has nothing to do with it. This thread is about congratulating people for reaching 10 million GP. Congratulations, you have spent thousands of dollars on a mobile game. What sort of achievement is that?
    A very good point was brought up by Ragnarok_COTF - whales control the economy. As long as they pay up the high prices won't change. I sure more people would be willing to spend money if the prices were more reasonable. I don't think 300-400$ is a reasonable price for one 7* marquee character.
    I don't understand this notion that I should be thankful to the whales for allowing me to play F2P. They aren't buying cosmetics that don't affect the game. They are buying gameplay advantages for themselves. They aren't doing this out of the kindness of their hearts. This isn't some kind of charity.

    I don't care about microtransactions that don't affect gameplay. Skins, emotes etc. - you can sell those all you want. I start paying attention when you introduce time-savers and exclusive gear that affect gameplay. I was shocked when Battlefront 2 was released. I was baffled when XP boosters appeared in singleplayer games and the fact that a lot of players seem to be ok with it makes my jaw drop.

    Well okay I wanted to ignore the sports analogy but I guess I’ll wade in. I think applying it to individual athletes is indeed incorrect. However, I took it, and I’m probably wrong, as applying it to owners whether it’s the Yankees, Real Madrid or whatever wealthy team and sport you choose the big market teams buy championships by having inflated payrolls. I don’t think this diminishes their championships. As winning is hard though easier with a higher quality roster.

    I agree that the pricing is incredibly high in this game and I don’t understand those that are 5 6 figures deep into the game. I just disagree that it negatively impacts me or anyone in a significant way. Set your budget, play within in, and enjoy the game. No whale can ruin the game just because they’re a whale. As with most mobile games, you can’t “win” swgoh so the real question isn’t how much others are spending and is that fair but whether you are enjoying the game. If you are great, if you aren’t I sincerely doubt whales are the issue.

    It impacts the whole game industry. Why do you think those XP boosters appeared in the singleplayer games? Because devs saw that players are willing to pay for them. Things you take for granted today will be monetized next year. Games are being developed with flaws in mind so they can sell you the solution. Games are being built around their monetization nowadays - enjoyment comes second.
    I'm not ok with the path that game development is following. I don't understand why so many of you seem to be fine with it or even actively support it.

    I don’t understand why what you think is fair to monetize is the only way cg should make money off a game. I’d have zero interest in purchasing a skin that provides me no benefit other than looking “cool.”
  • Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    So I’ve completely lost what your point/argument was in the discussion of what is a fair analogy. I think it was something along the lines that selling power is somehow unfair and overly hurts the ftp community. I guess that kinda is true if you solely focus on arena. It is definitely false if you bring in tw/Tb.

    For arena, there is no question that having more gls makes your climbs easier but no team is unbeatable and any smart/good/talented ftp player can achieve 1st every single night. There is literally a thread dedicated to those that have chosen not to spend and many have more gls and gp than many moderate to high spenders. It’s just not difficult to get 1st in arena every night without spending.

    As for Tb, whales literally only help ftp as their rosters lead to more completed waves, more deployed gp, and more stars.

    Tw is likely a wash as whales who win help their ftp guild mates that offsets the ftp members of the losing guild.

    Raids- yes at one point whales hurt their ftp guild mates in every raid, but this is offset by the rewards gained by beating the raid sooner because of these very same whales.

    Gac- roster development is far more important than money unless you’re literally a kraken but no obscene kraken is going to get matched up with ftp account.

    I can’t think of a legitimate argument that whales somehow overall impact ftp players negatively. If you aren’t happy with your progress you make in the game it likely has 99 percent to do with your choices not whales. You control whether or not you’re in a guild where you can get top 10 in hstr and top 5 in cpit. You control how much effort you put into game. There is nothing unachievable in this game if you choose to not spend money. Stop trying to point fingers at those supporting the game which allows you to decide not to spend as some form of cheaters.

    I didn't bring up the sports analogy. I just said that paying for a leg up is acceptable in gaming while everywhere else it's called bribing or cheating and Kyno asked me for a list of sports where people are not throwing money at team/organization to get an advantage. Then the discussion turned to whether athletes pay for advantages or not. I don't think it's comparable but some people argue otherwise.
    I think that buying power is pathetic - in general (not just in this game) and F2P community has nothing to do with it. This thread is about congratulating people for reaching 10 million GP. Congratulations, you have spent thousands of dollars on a mobile game. What sort of achievement is that?
    A very good point was brought up by Ragnarok_COTF - whales control the economy. As long as they pay up the high prices won't change. I sure more people would be willing to spend money if the prices were more reasonable. I don't think 300-400$ is a reasonable price for one 7* marquee character.
    I don't understand this notion that I should be thankful to the whales for allowing me to play F2P. They aren't buying cosmetics that don't affect the game. They are buying gameplay advantages for themselves. They aren't doing this out of the kindness of their hearts. This isn't some kind of charity.

    I don't care about microtransactions that don't affect gameplay. Skins, emotes etc. - you can sell those all you want. I start paying attention when you introduce time-savers and exclusive gear that affect gameplay. I was shocked when Battlefront 2 was released. I was baffled when XP boosters appeared in singleplayer games and the fact that a lot of players seem to be ok with it makes my jaw drop.

    Well okay I wanted to ignore the sports analogy but I guess I’ll wade in. I think applying it to individual athletes is indeed incorrect. However, I took it, and I’m probably wrong, as applying it to owners whether it’s the Yankees, Real Madrid or whatever wealthy team and sport you choose the big market teams buy championships by having inflated payrolls. I don’t think this diminishes their championships. As winning is hard though easier with a higher quality roster.

    I agree that the pricing is incredibly high in this game and I don’t understand those that are 5 6 figures deep into the game. I just disagree that it negatively impacts me or anyone in a significant way. Set your budget, play within in, and enjoy the game. No whale can ruin the game just because they’re a whale. As with most mobile games, you can’t “win” swgoh so the real question isn’t how much others are spending and is that fair but whether you are enjoying the game. If you are great, if you aren’t I sincerely doubt whales are the issue.

    It impacts the whole game industry. Why do you think those XP boosters appeared in the singleplayer games? Because devs saw that players are willing to pay for them. Things you take for granted today will be monetized next year. Games are being developed with flaws in mind so they can sell you the solution. Games are being built around their monetization nowadays - enjoyment comes second.
    I'm not ok with the path that game development is following. I don't understand why so many of you seem to be fine with it or even actively support it.

    I don’t understand why what you think is fair to monetize is the only way cg should make money off a game. I’d have zero interest in purchasing a skin that provides me no benefit other than looking “cool.”

    I didn't see the word fair in his post. He's saying he doesn't like the direction market forces are driving gaming as a whole, I think. If so, I agree with him.
  • Nikoms565
    14213 posts Member
    The cows know how to record something by now....
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • I'm f2p, and it makes no sense to pick on p2p. Spending on swgoh is no different than spending on other consumable things. You can also spend on going to the cinema or wait for the movie to reach tv and watch it for free. Same choice. And I won't talk about other things people consume.
  • Ravens1113
    3565 posts Member
    I'm f2p, and it makes no sense to pick on p2p. Spending on swgoh is no different than spending on other consumable things. You can also spend on going to the cinema or wait for the movie to reach tv and watch it for free. Same choice. And I won't talk about other things people consume.

    I see 2 camps among those critical of whales. One is "picking on" them, and I agree that there is nothing constructive in ad hominem attacks. The other is concerned with what they've done to the market.

    To use your cinema analogy. Imagine if 1% of movie goers decided they were willing to spend an exorbitant amount of money to go to the cinema. Over time, all cinemas realize that their profit margins would be better if they catered exclusively to the cinema whales. You get priced out of the cinema because it is either beyond your means or the value of the experience is not worth the new, higher, whale costs. So you have to wait for the movie to be released to streaming services or retail. The experience of the cinema you grew up with (maybe going with your friends in Jr High/High School) no longer exists and is something you cannot experience anymore. You feel sad.

    This, and also when whales go on a forum and say “yay me look what I did”

    Not specific to this post but the “WORLDS FIRST!…..” posts were especially cringe. Like that’s cool but we are witnessing two kraken guilds see who can spend more/do more with their paid rosters.

    I don’t hate on people because they spend but if they flaunt it in our faces….different story lol
  • th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.
  • I get the pricing arguments but that was not the initial point brought up early. That was the nth level concern. His initial complaint had to do with selling an advantage and how to him it cheapens achievements and I believe pathetic was thrown around some way. Fair enough viewpoint if applied only to oneself. I’m not disagreeing that whales warp the economy and that is a point of concern.

    I don’t really like your movie analogy but get your point. Reason I don’t like it is because whales don’t price you out of enjoying the game ftp. They price you out of accelerating your goals because the price is too high.

    Which once again is a fair point but counter to the beginning of this tangent. Any advantage one could purchase was too much to him because an advantage should never be sold. But I just don’t see enough people willing to pay for skins with no gameplay benefit that it can make the game profitable.
  • @Drathuk916
    If there were a way to make a 1 time $ altercation to a character I would seriously consider it. Select 1 ability from a list that you could permanently give to Mace Windu for $10. I would consider paying for a reworked Mace. Same Mace, just my own new ability.

    Something that is not so effervescent as what $ does in this game.
  • Drathuk916
    60 posts Member
    edited July 21
    @Drathuk916
    If there were a way to make a 1 time $ altercation to a character I would seriously consider it. Select 1 ability from a list that you could permanently give to Mace Windu for $10. I would consider paying for a reworked Mace. Same Mace, just my own new ability.

    Something that is not so effervescent as what $ does in this game.

    Oh I don’t think there wouldn’t be a market for skins. Of course there would be. I just don’t see that market being large enough to be profitable.

    Edit: misread. That’s still an advantage you’re just arguing degrees.
  • Ravens1113
    3565 posts Member
    th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.

    I mean you’re taking an already pro player and making him better. If you or I did the same, we wouldn’t make it to the majors let alone be HoF. That’s more his point. Just saying lol
  • Xcien
    1474 posts Member
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.

    I mean you’re taking an already pro player and making him better. If you or I did the same, we wouldn’t make it to the majors let alone be HoF. That’s more his point. Just saying lol

    You still need strategy to succeed in SWGoH as well. You can spend thousands of dollars, but you aren’t guaranteed success, even more so if you don’t use strategy. Sure, you have a better chance at success if you spend, but F2Ps can still beat you.
    To sum it up, even if you spend, you aren’t guaranteed success.
    "Thank you for evaluating."
  • th3evo
    288 posts Member
    th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.

    Ravens1113 took words out of my mouth so I'm just going to quote him. Also illegal substances are banned - mictrotransactions are not.
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    I mean you’re taking an already pro player and making him better. If you or I did the same, we wouldn’t make it to the majors let alone be HoF. That’s more his point. Just saying lol

  • th3evo
    288 posts Member
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    I get the pricing arguments but that was not the initial point brought up early. That was the nth level concern. His initial complaint had to do with selling an advantage and how to him it cheapens achievements and I believe pathetic was thrown around some way. Fair enough viewpoint if applied only to oneself. I’m not disagreeing that whales warp the economy and that is a point of concern.

    I don’t really like your movie analogy but get your point. Reason I don’t like it is because whales don’t price you out of enjoying the game ftp. They price you out of accelerating your goals because the price is too high.

    Which once again is a fair point but counter to the beginning of this tangent. Any advantage one could purchase was too much to him because an advantage should never be sold. But I just don’t see enough people willing to pay for skins with no gameplay benefit that it can make the game profitable.

    I think I'm allowed to have more than one argument against certain topic.
    Like I said - games are built around their monetization. Skins and stuff would not work in this game right now. However it works just fine in other games. Perhaps you have heard of Apex Legends or it's competition.
  • th3evo
    288 posts Member
    Xcien wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.

    I mean you’re taking an already pro player and making him better. If you or I did the same, we wouldn’t make it to the majors let alone be HoF. That’s more his point. Just saying lol

    You still need strategy to succeed in SWGoH as well. You can spend thousands of dollars, but you aren’t guaranteed success, even more so if you don’t use strategy. Sure, you have a better chance at success if you spend, but F2Ps can still beat you.
    To sum it up, even if you spend, you aren’t guaranteed success.

    I argued that it is incomparably easier to become successful in games like SWGoH than it is in sports. Kyno argued that since it's an analogy we should assume same natural ability for games and sports.
    I shouldn't have used the word guaranteed. Several people already pointed that out and focused on that to counter my argument.
  • Crayons wrote: »
    Every game has a ptp and ptw element. You think other games just have skins?

    They don’t sell unique weapons and equipment? In game currency packs for buying equipment others can’t afford? Faster levelling XP point packs that put you ahead of ftp?

    I can’t understand your anger at people who fund a game you are playing for free.

    What? Literally no game (serious game, WoW, FFXIV, BDO, etc is PTW. Any game that offers XP boosts such as WoWs catch up mechanics (boost to 58 as level cap is raised to 70 for example) is a catch up mechanic. A proper analogy would be if one of these AAA mmos put a specific class or weapons that outclassed everything else in the game behind a ridiculous pay wall (but your BiS gear on raid release for 999.99 or better yet your BiS Pvp gear at the beginning of an arena season! Lol). That doesn’t exist so please don’t infer as all games do this.
    Crayons wrote: »
    Most people don’t mind. It’s been a part of the online side of gaming since it’s inception. When I started played WoW a very long time ago, I whaled on a bunch of XP packs. I had 4 usable raid characters in the time most would have 1.

    Paying to get a leg up is part of MMO! It always has been.

    I’ve played WoW from nov 24th 2004 until just recently 9.1 releasing. I also play TBC classic and other than their level boosts there has literally been no “XP” boosts. All of their level boosts came around the MoP/WoD time, are always pre next exp release for new players to catch up to current friends. So yea…
    Crayons wrote: »
    And finally. Last of all, if you invest nothing in this game, do nothing to help it stay alive, why should you be at a level playing field as those who do?

    How would you feel if your hard earned went in and someone who didn’t had the exact same stuff? What **** is this?

    You realize you are LITERALLY saying your level of wealth makes you better than everyone else. How is that hard “earned” from a gaming standpoint? And this is exactly why real games don’t adopt this.

    Your posts are pretty entitled and cringe actually.
  • None of my post was to, in any way, demean the system, or those spending money. Just making sure it’s called what it is.
  • Ravens1113
    3565 posts Member
    Xcien wrote: »
    Ravens1113 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Steroids / performance enhancing drugs seem to have done the trick in the past.

    Those things don't guarantee success. You still need talent even if you use illegal substances.
    No matter how many I take I won't become the next Wayne Gretzky, Lionel Messi, Tony Hawk etc.
    However if I (or you or anyone else) spend enough money I can become one of the top players in this game. It's even easier in other games.

    You are so wrong about that. There have been numerous examples across multiple sports over the years where the #1 admitted to using illegal performance enhancers: Jose Canseco, Lance Armstrong, Mark Mcquire, etc...
    I can name more, but Mark McGwire is the most obvious example counterpoint. He had a 10 year career of above average before exploding performance-wise for another 5 years as a homerun superhero. Oh yeah, he also gained 40 pounds of muscle along with that boost. I guess he changed his diet.

    All 3 of them have publicly admitted to their use of illegal enhancers and the effects they had. There are more examples of #1 athletes doing this and admitting it.

    You. Are. Wrong.

    I mean you’re taking an already pro player and making him better. If you or I did the same, we wouldn’t make it to the majors let alone be HoF. That’s more his point. Just saying lol

    You still need strategy to succeed in SWGoH as well. You can spend thousands of dollars, but you aren’t guaranteed success, even more so if you don’t use strategy. Sure, you have a better chance at success if you spend, but F2Ps can still beat you.
    To sum it up, even if you spend, you aren’t guaranteed success.

    This is very true, but paying for more relics gives you access to more GL’s and by extension theory craft counters. I watch lots of GC videos and their streams and learned a lot about counters and team comps for things like GAC and TB. However I just don’t have the resources for those teams.

    For example in my current GAC matchup my opponent and I implemented similar strategies. We are similar in overall GP but he has more teams available that are fully relic. If for example my imps were relic as his were, I may be able to break his GL wall. Did he spend more? Idk. But spending gets you stronger teams, which can trump strategy.

    Another example is me going against Ahnald. I’ve adapted his strategies as well as other GC’s but his massive spending puts him over the top against me and others.

    So while spending alone doesn’t guarantee success, it makes up a fairly large chunk. I mean my g12 imps that are modded properly could probably handle relic tuskens modded poorly lol
  • th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?
  • Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?

    They are used purely to show one's personal style.
  • I don't think it is buying an advantage at all. I think you are simply compressing time when you spend money.

    When you spend $$$, you are moving days/week/months further along. You are just buying stuff that would have taken longer to earn FTP. It would be an advantage if I spent $500 and played the same person tomorrow with my stronger roster. But I wont be playing the same person, I'll be playing someone slightly more advanced.

    Spending the money has a net effect of 0 as far as advantage in battle goes, it just changes the tools with which you fight..



  • Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?

    They are used purely to show one's personal style.

    I gathered that after doing some reading. It’s an interesting business model. One I’m not sure could work for swgoh. Even though they chose a business model that doesn’t sell advantages they still deal with complaints on their monetization. Which is odd to me.
  • Starslayer
    964 posts Member
    edited July 21
    Dkfusion wrote: »
    Crayons wrote: »
    Every game has a ptp and ptw element. You think other games just have skins?

    They don’t sell unique weapons and equipment? In game currency packs for buying equipment others can’t afford? Faster levelling XP point packs that put you ahead of ftp?

    I can’t understand your anger at people who fund a game you are playing for free.

    What? Literally no game (serious game, WoW, FFXIV, BDO, etc is PTW. Any game that offers XP boosts such as WoWs catch up mechanics (boost to 58 as level cap is raised to 70 for example) is a catch up mechanic. A proper analogy would be if one of these AAA mmos put a specific class or weapons that outclassed everything else in the game behind a ridiculous pay wall (but your BiS gear on raid release for 999.99 or better yet your BiS Pvp gear at the beginning of an arena season! Lol). That doesn’t exist so please don’t infer as all games do this.
    Crayons wrote: »
    Most people don’t mind. It’s been a part of the online side of gaming since it’s inception. When I started played WoW a very long time ago, I whaled on a bunch of XP packs. I had 4 usable raid characters in the time most would have 1.

    Paying to get a leg up is part of MMO! It always has been.

    I’ve played WoW from nov 24th 2004 until just recently 9.1 releasing. I also play TBC classic and other than their level boosts there has literally been no “XP” boosts. All of their level boosts came around the MoP/WoD time, are always pre next exp release for new players to catch up to current friends. So yea…
    Crayons wrote: »
    And finally. Last of all, if you invest nothing in this game, do nothing to help it stay alive, why should you be at a level playing field as those who do?

    How would you feel if your hard earned went in and someone who didn’t had the exact same stuff? What **** is this?

    You realize you are LITERALLY saying your level of wealth makes you better than everyone else. How is that hard “earned” from a gaming standpoint? And this is exactly why real games don’t adopt this.

    Your posts are pretty entitled and cringe actually.

    Edit: seems the arguments in my,post were used before. Don’t bother ^^

    As we’re talking about the impact on competition, seems fair to only talking about the impact on pvp.

    Gac, tw and arena.

    Gac and tw both use matchmaking, so it doesn’t matter if you bought your gear or farmed it.

    Arena is meta. It’s far easier to keep up with the meta with money, but it’s not mandatory.

    The main difference is during early days of an account imo; it takes a whole lot of time to catch up in arena with those who did pay to improve their roster waaaay faster. So basically, where money really matters, it’s kinda catch-up mechanism, as it allows you to attain endgame level faster. But once you reach endgame, there is a glass ceiling, and that what allows ftp to compete in arena. They need quite some time to do so, no argument there.
  • th3evo
    288 posts Member
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?

    Of course it sets the tone. I don't like this type of monetization that should be obvious.
    I don't think it is buying an advantage at all. I think you are simply compressing time when you spend money.

    When you spend $$$, you are moving days/week/months further along. You are just buying stuff that would have taken longer to earn FTP. It would be an advantage if I spent $500 and played the same person tomorrow with my stronger roster. But I wont be playing the same person, I'll be playing someone slightly more advanced.

    Spending the money has a net effect of 0 as far as advantage in battle goes, it just changes the tools with which you fight..
    Your arena shard stays the same.
    Drathuk916 wrote: »

    I gathered that after doing some reading. It’s an interesting business model. One I’m not sure could work for swgoh. Even though they chose a business model that doesn’t sell advantages they still deal with complaints on their monetization. Which is odd to me.

    I already said that games are built around their monetization and that this type wouldn't work for SWGoH right now..
  • th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?

    Of course it sets the tone. I don't like this type of monetization that should be obvious.
    I don't think it is buying an advantage at all. I think you are simply compressing time when you spend money.

    When you spend $$$, you are moving days/week/months further along. You are just buying stuff that would have taken longer to earn FTP. It would be an advantage if I spent $500 and played the same person tomorrow with my stronger roster. But I wont be playing the same person, I'll be playing someone slightly more advanced.

    Spending the money has a net effect of 0 as far as advantage in battle goes, it just changes the tools with which you fight..
    Your arena shard stays the same.
    Drathuk916 wrote: »

    I gathered that after doing some reading. It’s an interesting business model. One I’m not sure could work for swgoh. Even though they chose a business model that doesn’t sell advantages they still deal with complaints on their monetization. Which is odd to me.

    I already said that games are built around their monetization and that this type wouldn't work for SWGoH right now..

    We’re clearly at an impasse. I get that your discussing issues larger than swgoh but I just respectfully disagree. Mostly because I don’t think eliminating the selling of crystals, character shards, hyperdrive bundle or any advantage would increase a ftpers ability to obtain first in the arena. Nor do I think the gaming industry is headed in downward trend. There are just so many options for your gaming time.

    You benefit in ways you don’t realize by those that spend (in game not just cause cg decides to keep the lights on) and I imagine our hurt by the krakens in your shard far less than you think. Changing the progress equation from Time + money + development choices to just time + development choices doesn’t mean guaranteed greater success for those that currently don’t spend in the arena. But I do get I’ll never convince you otherwise whether we are speaking about swgoh or the gaming industry as a whole.
  • Ravens1113
    3565 posts Member
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Drathuk916 wrote: »
    th3evo wrote: »
    Kyno is right, we are all free-to-pay here.
    I think buying an advantage in a game is kinda pathetic but to each their own.

    This is your first comment on this thread. It certainly sets the tone.

    As for apex legends. Never heard of it nor played it. Question on the cosmetics they do sell. Are they used purely to show ones own personal style or are the cosmetics ever used to help in camouflage or to make it easier for squad mates to identify their team members?

    Of course it sets the tone. I don't like this type of monetization that should be obvious.
    I don't think it is buying an advantage at all. I think you are simply compressing time when you spend money.

    When you spend $$$, you are moving days/week/months further along. You are just buying stuff that would have taken longer to earn FTP. It would be an advantage if I spent $500 and played the same person tomorrow with my stronger roster. But I wont be playing the same person, I'll be playing someone slightly more advanced.

    Spending the money has a net effect of 0 as far as advantage in battle goes, it just changes the tools with which you fight..
    Your arena shard stays the same.
    Drathuk916 wrote: »

    I gathered that after doing some reading. It’s an interesting business model. One I’m not sure could work for swgoh. Even though they chose a business model that doesn’t sell advantages they still deal with complaints on their monetization. Which is odd to me.

    I already said that games are built around their monetization and that this type wouldn't work for SWGoH right now..

    We’re clearly at an impasse. I get that your discussing issues larger than swgoh but I just respectfully disagree. Mostly because I don’t think eliminating the selling of crystals, character shards, hyperdrive bundle or any advantage would increase a ftpers ability to obtain first in the arena. Nor do I think the gaming industry is headed in downward trend. There are just so many options for your gaming time.

    You benefit in ways you don’t realize by those that spend (in game not just cause cg decides to keep the lights on) and I imagine our hurt by the krakens in your shard far less than you think. Changing the progress equation from Time + money + development choices to just time + development choices doesn’t mean guaranteed greater success for those that currently don’t spend in the arena. But I do get I’ll never convince you otherwise whether we are speaking about swgoh or the gaming industry as a whole.

    Speaking about games like SWGOH and SWGOH itself, spending certainly gives you an edge. How much is up for discussion, but if two say started the game today, and one bought the hyperdrive bundle and the other didnt, that gives them an insane edge of starting level, roster and more importantly time (farming, leveling, energy, resources, you name it)

    Now if you do differently and neither buys the hyperdrive and instead one is pure F2P while the other buys a vault of crystals, there’s still a tangible advantage based on what those crystals buy.

    Does spending need to stop? Is it unfair? Well no. If someone’s paying for an edge, that’s fine. The issue of that lies with CG. How much of an edge are they willing to give spenders? How much value are they taking away from their packs and purchasable content to force even more spending, thus widening the power gap between whale and F2P.

    There’s tons of layers to it, business and entertainment wise. It needs balance. But the bottom line is spending does give an advantage. The worst thing about big spending is either CG getting greedy and taking value from their packs, or players gloating about how much they spend. It’s like a certain billionaire taking a rocket shaped like the one from Austin Powers to space, then gloating about it cause he could because of how rich he is….
  • TVF
    30032 posts Member
    Gloating has no effect on game play.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Kyno
    30501 posts Moderator
    TVF wrote: »
    Gloating has no effect on game play.

    Or does it.


    SOAP may have some data on this.
  • TVF wrote: »
    Gloating has no effect on game play.

    Who said it did?
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