What team without Grievous should I farm and gear to unlock 7 star Padme in 1-2 months (next return)

Replies

  • TVF
    25593 posts Member
    On, Grievous, he's actually worth spending shard shop currency

    Not if you planned ahead. Horribly overpriced from there.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Letareus
    103 posts Member
    Woodroward wrote: »
    There's no value disconnect.
    You talk about value disconnects like they're bad. They're not and I don't see why they would be. People don't want the same things and there's nothing wrong with that. But discussions between people with differing values will always result in conflict that can't be resolved until and unless those value differences are identified and addressed.

    But that aside, there are many instances of value disconnects between you and I that you haven't addressed and yet you deny that there are any. I suppose that many of your statements are vague enough that there's deniability. So why don't you clear up these instances once and for all? I'm numbering them so you can't just shrug them off with some blanket statement (but you probably will anyway):

    1. Do you deny that you value playtime? You talk about playtime like it's limited and valuable and that that is a rationale behind your "unlikely to get" evaluations. If you value playtime at all, then there's a value disconnect between you and me. If there's no value disconnect there, then you must agree with me that playtime is essentially unlimited and therefore limited playtime should never be a factor in any consideration.

    2. Do you deny that your primary goal in playing this game is something other than maximizing crystal income? If there's no value disconnect there, then you're saying that you, like me, are obsessively concerned with maximizing crystal income like me above all other considerations in this game. Your actions with respect to the Revan meta and taking months away from the game already answer that question fairly clearly, but I'll give you a chance to respond to this.

    3. Does doing the same thing everyone else is doing matter to you? You've clearly said that it does, but I'll give you a chance to clear it up here. If it does matter to you, then you and I clearly have a value disconnect here. I don't give a **** if I'm doing the same thing everyone else is. In fact, I'm more than happy to, because it means it's clear what I should get and what I should be doing instead of the situation being confused like a diverse arena would bring.

    4. This one I'm the least sure about: Do you try to help your guild in TB by having a higher GP and characters for platoons? I have friends and guildmates who do that. But if you do, then you and I have a value disconnect there.

    There are others but let's start with those.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    There are enough Zetas from challenges and events to get you by until then.

    Absolutely false. I may not be zeta starved right at this very minute, but there were so many times in the past and recent past when I was zeta starved and just barely got critical zetas necessary to maintain my crystal income - and that's only with the zeta income from 1800 fleet tokens per day. Like MightyWizard said, it's the difference between 1 and 3 zetas per month. Without getting those zetas WHEN I got them, I would have lost thousands of crystals. And crystals are what I'm all about.

    For example, the recent Revan zetas required 3-6 zetas to work properly, and you needed them within days of the meta flooding in, or you'll be losing crystals.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    You said you were unable to attain gg without shard shop currency and I disagreed.
    False. I never said that. You left out a critical qualifier I added every time I said I could not get gg - TIME. That I was unable to get GG in TIME to use him to get Padme the very next time she returns without shard shop currency. The time factor is a critical qualifier there that you've ignored every single time. Do you disagree? Do you think I can undoubtedly 7* grievous in less than 2 months from fleet store alone (considering that there's a fair amount of RNG involved which is beyond your control)?
    Woodroward wrote: »
    What I'm saying is ignoring characters out of the stagnant shops to get the only thing you'll be farming afterwards is jumping the gun.

    What I'm saying is the overwhelming majority of those are and will always be useless. It's rampant speculation (gambling on the future), and limited, targeted speculation is as much gambling as I'm willing to do because it comes at the cost of zetas critical to maintaining arena rank in the present. I'm not willing to lose crystals (money) for that.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I never said necessary. I never said impossible. I said unlikely. Not having gg makes it unlikely. Just like not having dengar makes chewie unlikely.

    Sure you did, right here:
    Woodroward wrote: »
    The fact that people have managed without gg doesn't mean he isn't really necessary.

    The double negative means you're saying he's really necessary, but I supose the qualifier "really" gives you room to spin it like it was a hedge. It's a stretch.

    Anyway, you said that your assessment of "unlikely" was based on limited playtime. I told you that I have effectively unlimited playtime. Does that have any effect on your assessment? Regardless, you should not assume that people have limited playtime.

    Woodroward wrote: »
    When i said number 1 contest I meant going to the bathroom. Picking on my arena rank is below the belt and means nothing to the conversation. All statements along those lines by me were explaining that. Responding to them was you continuing the #1 contest.

    Then that number 1 contest is purely in your head. I don't think I'm better than you. I think you and I don't care about the same things. If you're willing to lose thousands of dollars worth of crystals purely because you don't want to do the same thing as everyone else, we definitely don't care about the same things. If you're wiling to take a months long break from the game and lose all that crystal income (and all the other things you would get in that time), there's no way you and I can care about the same things.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    The thread is titled what team to farm to unlock padme. Not "who should i use with my roster". Not addressing you personally means that statement doesn't pertain to your roster and your protestations are out of place.

    So you're just responding to the thread title and nothing else? Thread titles are brief by necessity and cannot contain all the details and nuance necessary to accurately reflect a post. A book is not its title and neither is this (or any other) thread, except maybe the N/T posts. If you read the text of my op and subsequent posts, you would know that this thread much more than the title. It's about what I should farm to unlock 7* Padme by the very next time she shows up with multiple other conditions and qualifiers specific to my concerns and situation. The title is just a brief introduction to that inquiry. If you're just responding to the title and nothing else that would explain a lot.
  • APX_919
    2406 posts Member
    On, Grievous, he's actually worth spending shard shop currency, he's actually very good now once you finish gearing him and when we get the g12 finishers it will be even better. I decided to go all in on him and he's now g12+4 with zeta on unique, and I don't regret investing in him one bit.

    Agreed! He went from choke artist to Jedi slayer. I use him in GA and he usually holds twice...people underestimate him even now.
    "Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen...mostly"
  • Counts
    59 posts Member
    Can I get her with GG, Dooku, B2, magna, and Nute? I go back and forth between using Nute or Asajj.
    Thanks
  • Woodroward
    3742 posts Member
    Letareus wrote: »
    Woodroward wrote: »
    There's no value disconnect.
    You talk about value disconnects like they're bad. They're not and I don't see why they would be. People don't want the same things and there's nothing wrong with that. But discussions between people with differing values will always result in conflict that can't be resolved until and unless those value differences are identified and addressed.

    But that aside, there are many instances of value disconnects between you and I that you haven't addressed and yet you deny that there are any. I suppose that many of your statements are vague enough that there's deniability. So why don't you clear up these instances once and for all? I'm numbering them so you can't just shrug them off with some blanket statement (but you probably will anyway):

    1. Do you deny that you value playtime? You talk about playtime like it's limited and valuable and that that is a rationale behind your "unlikely to get" evaluations. If you value playtime at all, then there's a value disconnect between you and me. If there's no value disconnect there, then you must agree with me that playtime is essentially unlimited and therefore limited playtime should never be a factor in any consideration.

    2. Do you deny that your primary goal in playing this game is something other than maximizing crystal income? If there's no value disconnect there, then you're saying that you, like me, are obsessively concerned with maximizing crystal income like me above all other considerations in this game. Your actions with respect to the Revan meta and taking months away from the game already answer that question fairly clearly, but I'll give you a chance to respond to this.

    3. Does doing the same thing everyone else is doing matter to you? You've clearly said that it does, but I'll give you a chance to clear it up here. If it does matter to you, then you and I clearly have a value disconnect here. I don't give a **** if I'm doing the same thing everyone else is. In fact, I'm more than happy to, because it means it's clear what I should get and what I should be doing instead of the situation being confused like a diverse arena would bring.

    4. This one I'm the least sure about: Do you try to help your guild in TB by having a higher GP and characters for platoons? I have friends and guildmates who do that. But if you do, then you and I have a value disconnect there.

    There are others but let's start with those.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    There are enough Zetas from challenges and events to get you by until then.

    Absolutely false. I may not be zeta starved right at this very minute, but there were so many times in the past and recent past when I was zeta starved and just barely got critical zetas necessary to maintain my crystal income - and that's only with the zeta income from 1800 fleet tokens per day. Like MightyWizard said, it's the difference between 1 and 3 zetas per month. Without getting those zetas WHEN I got them, I would have lost thousands of crystals. And crystals are what I'm all about.

    For example, the recent Revan zetas required 3-6 zetas to work properly, and you needed them within days of the meta flooding in, or you'll be losing crystals.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    You said you were unable to attain gg without shard shop currency and I disagreed.
    False. I never said that. You left out a critical qualifier I added every time I said I could not get gg - TIME. That I was unable to get GG in TIME to use him to get Padme the very next time she returns without shard shop currency. The time factor is a critical qualifier there that you've ignored every single time. Do you disagree? Do you think I can undoubtedly 7* grievous in less than 2 months from fleet store alone (considering that there's a fair amount of RNG involved which is beyond your control)?
    Woodroward wrote: »
    What I'm saying is ignoring characters out of the stagnant shops to get the only thing you'll be farming afterwards is jumping the gun.

    What I'm saying is the overwhelming majority of those are and will always be useless. It's rampant speculation (gambling on the future), and limited, targeted speculation is as much gambling as I'm willing to do because it comes at the cost of zetas critical to maintaining arena rank in the present. I'm not willing to lose crystals (money) for that.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I never said necessary. I never said impossible. I said unlikely. Not having gg makes it unlikely. Just like not having dengar makes chewie unlikely.

    Sure you did, right here:
    Woodroward wrote: »
    The fact that people have managed without gg doesn't mean he isn't really necessary.

    The double negative means you're saying he's really necessary, but I supose the qualifier "really" gives you room to spin it like it was a hedge. It's a stretch.

    Anyway, you said that your assessment of "unlikely" was based on limited playtime. I told you that I have effectively unlimited playtime. Does that have any effect on your assessment? Regardless, you should not assume that people have limited playtime.

    Woodroward wrote: »
    When i said number 1 contest I meant going to the bathroom. Picking on my arena rank is below the belt and means nothing to the conversation. All statements along those lines by me were explaining that. Responding to them was you continuing the #1 contest.

    Then that number 1 contest is purely in your head. I don't think I'm better than you. I think you and I don't care about the same things. If you're willing to lose thousands of dollars worth of crystals purely because you don't want to do the same thing as everyone else, we definitely don't care about the same things. If you're wiling to take a months long break from the game and lose all that crystal income (and all the other things you would get in that time), there's no way you and I can care about the same things.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    The thread is titled what team to farm to unlock padme. Not "who should i use with my roster". Not addressing you personally means that statement doesn't pertain to your roster and your protestations are out of place.

    So you're just responding to the thread title and nothing else? Thread titles are brief by necessity and cannot contain all the details and nuance necessary to accurately reflect a post. A book is not its title and neither is this (or any other) thread, except maybe the N/T posts. If you read the text of my op and subsequent posts, you would know that this thread much more than the title. It's about what I should farm to unlock 7* Padme by the very next time she shows up with multiple other conditions and qualifiers specific to my concerns and situation. The title is just a brief introduction to that inquiry. If you're just responding to the title and nothing else that would explain a lot.

    All I am reading is me me me. There's nothing to discuss or argue here. I've made my points, they're solid.

    Since you insist upon rewriting what I have said into something other that what it was despite my repeated corrections, I'll have no choice but to lose all respect for you if you respond in the same vein again.
  • Counts wrote: »
    Can I get her with GG, Dooku, B2, magna, and Nute? I go back and forth between using Nute or Asajj.
    Thanks

    Yes almost certainly. And I'd use both Nute and Asajj, then leave out Magna.
  • LOL - a year for GG - I have one account started in March 2017 that's still looking at a 5* GG. I think he drops more from GW than he shows up in the shop. Maybe I've just stopped taking the 2 seconds to scroll down. Who knows. Either that or he and Logray are having some odd inter-species love tryst which is why I never see either of them.
  • Letareus
    103 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    Woodroward wrote: »
    All I am reading is me me me.

    Then you are misreading or not reading at all. Of course, this statement is a bit vague in itself. If you're saying that I'm making this thread purely about my situation and my concerns then you are right - this thread is NOT a generic thread about what team to farm to unlock 7 star Padme - it is a thread specificially about me. Could the title have been more precise? In hindsight, yes, but I wouldn't in a million years have imagined that it would be an issue. I fixed the title now becuase you can't get past it.

    Or, perhaps this is related to the perceived slight from my comparing my record to yours. As I said, and I'm saying it again, it was not, as you believe, an attempt by me to start a "#1 contest" or to say that I'm better than you. In fact, it's my personal belief that nobody can be better than anyone else in anything without a prior agreement about criteria for evaluation. Honestly, it's surprising that you're offended because clearly you don't care about your arena performance. The comparison was an attempt to illustrate that you don't care about the same things I do.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I've made my points, they're solid.

    Many of your points are not solid. I refuted them one by one with specifity and detail. You did not respond to those refutations to defend your points. Instead, you're just dismissing them with a completely unsupported blanket statement.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    Since you insist upon rewriting what I have said into something other that what it was despite my repeated corrections, I'll have no choice but to lose all respect for you if you respond in the same vein again.

    It may be true that I may have initially interpreted SOME (not all) of the things you've said. Part of this is because of your vague and imprecise wording and that those statements could be interpreted in many ways. But I have no problem with shouldering some of the responsibility for those initial misinterpretations.

    But after your clarifications I responded to the correct interpretations of those assertions. And you made many other points which I never misinterpreted. Perhaps you're seizing on my INITIAL misinterpretations of one or two things as a way to dismiss all of my arguments.

    Also, there is hypocrisy here because you have misinterpreted and rewritten things I've said despite my repeated corrections. For example, you repeatedly mischaracterized my statement that I can't get GG via fleet store alone by the very next time Padme returns by conveniently omitting the "by the very next time Padme returns" part. And your conjuring up a "#1 contest" where none exists.
    LOL - a year for GG - I have one account started in March 2017 that's still looking at a 5* GG. I think he drops more from GW than he shows up in the shop. Maybe I've just stopped taking the 2 seconds to scroll down. Who knows. Either that or he and Logray are having some odd inter-species love tryst which is why I never see either of them.

    There you go, this is why it's stupid to rely on fleet store for GG. It's so random and so inconsistent. There's nothing in the world I hate more than gambling and RNG. Say I did make GG part of my team, then Padme returns and I'm still far short of the necessary shards due to bad fleet store RNG for a few months, there wouldn't be a backup - I have 4/5 characters necessary. GG, pun intended.
  • Woodroward
    3742 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    Letareus wrote: »
    Woodroward wrote: »
    All I am reading is me me me.

    Then you are misreading or not reading at all. Of course, this statement is a bit vague in itself. If you're saying that I'm making this thread purely about my situation and my concerns then you are right - this thread is NOT a generic thread about what team to farm to unlock 7 star Padme - it is a thread specificially about me. Could the title have been more precise? In hindsight, yes, but I wouldn't in a million years have imagined that it would be an issue. I fixed the title now becuase you can't get past it.

    Or, perhaps this is related to the perceived slight from my comparing my record to yours. As I said, and I'm saying it again, it was not, as you believe, an attempt by me to start a "#1 contest" or to say that I'm better than you. In fact, it's my personal belief that nobody can be better than anyone else in anything without a prior agreement about criteria for evaluation. Honestly, it's surprising that you're offended because clearly you don't care about your arena performance. The comparison was an attempt to illustrate that you don't care about the same things I do.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I've made my points, they're solid.

    Many of your points are not solid. I refuted them one by one with specifity and detail. You did not respond to those refutations to defend your points. Instead, you're just dismissing them with a completely unsupported blanket statement.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    Since you insist upon rewriting what I have said into something other that what it was despite my repeated corrections, I'll have no choice but to lose all respect for you if you respond in the same vein again.

    It may be true that I may have initially interpreted SOME (not all) of the things you've said. Part of this is because of your vague and imprecise wording and that those statements could be interpreted in many ways. But I have no problem with shouldering some of the responsibility for those initial misinterpretations.

    But after your clarifications I responded to the correct interpretations of those assertions. And you made many other points which I never misinterpreted. Perhaps you're seizing on my INITIAL misinterpretations of one or two things as a way to dismiss all of my arguments.

    Also, there is hypocrisy here because you have misinterpreted and rewritten things I've said despite my repeated corrections. For example, you repeatedly mischaracterized my statement that I can't get GG via fleet store alone by the very next time Padme returns by conveniently omitting the "by the very next time Padme returns" part. And your conjuring up a "#1 contest" where none exists.
    LOL - a year for GG - I have one account started in March 2017 that's still looking at a 5* GG. I think he drops more from GW than he shows up in the shop. Maybe I've just stopped taking the 2 seconds to scroll down. Who knows. Either that or he and Logray are having some odd inter-species love tryst which is why I never see either of them.

    There you go, this is why it's stupid to rely on fleet store for GG. It's so random and so inconsistent. There's nothing in the world I hate more than gambling and RNG. Say I did make GG part of my team, then Padme returns and I'm still far short of the necessary shards due to bad fleet store RNG for a few months, there wouldn't be a backup - I have 4/5 characters necessary. GG, pun intended.

    All of your valid points about my points were semantics. For instance, you were the one who really started using the word necessary, not I. So you take my one rephrasing of you putting words in my mouth as me having said it so you could continue in the same vein.

    It's disingenuous and on top of it it's ignoring what I meant by what I said.

    You assume that you can't get him in 2 months. You could. You could also not. If you said i don't know if i can get him I'd not have said what I said.

    I don't have to reiterate every inch of your statement to be addressing it. The part you insist on pointing out makes no change to what I'm saying.

    And you still insist upon arguing against the comments that weren't directed towards you as though every comment in this thread should only be about you.

    No. Once a thread is made anyone who comments becomes as much a part of the thread as the original poster and they don't have to be addressing the op to be on topic.
  • NicWester
    7470 posts Member
    Just wanted to say that it took me less than a year to farm Greivous to 7* and that was largely BEFORE Fleet was even an option. Even once Fleet started up, I still only bought four or five shipments of him from it, the rest still came from shard shop.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
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  • Letareus
    103 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    NicWester wrote: »
    Just wanted to say that it took me less than a year to farm Greivous to 7* and that was largely BEFORE Fleet was even an option. Even once Fleet started up, I still only bought four or five shipments of him from it, the rest still came from shard shop.

    I have 4 characters to gear for the event. If I did shard shop for Grievous, I probably wouldn't be able to gear all my characters in time for the event, since I get about 10-30% of my gear from shard shop. That's why I don't consider shard shop an option in this instance. Also, my time frame here is far less than a year - it's about 2 months.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    And you still insist upon arguing against the comments that weren't directed towards you as though every comment in this thread should only be about you. No. Once a thread is made anyone who comments becomes as much a part of the thread as the original poster and they don't have to be addressing the op to be on topic.

    Even if something you say is not specifically directed toward me, they still reflect your beliefs, ideas, and values and in most cases that is what I was responding to.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    All of your valid points about my points were semantics. For instance, you were the one who really started using the word necessary, not I. So you take my one rephrasing of you putting words in my mouth as me having said it so you could continue in the same vein. It's disingenuous and on top of it it's ignoring what I meant by what I said.

    My valid points were not only about semantics. The one example you reference is semantic but it's a bit of a straw man because that could be considered my weakest argument. Note that I did hedge on it a bit even when I made it. But most of my valid points are not semantic like that one. I made a list at the bottom of this post.

    I know I risk putting undue emphasis on this trivial point by addressing this. But I first used the word necessary in the form of "unnecessary," and only once, before you responded with your vague statement that it "doesn't mean he isn't really necessary." Which I read as implying (though not stating categorically) that he is necessary, and it still looks that way to me.

    But regardless of which way you read that, you were saying that he is either necessary or close to necessary, which is also what your likely/unlikely statements amount to. When I said that you said that Grievous is needed/necessary, would it have made that much of a difference if I had said "pretty much needed" or "close to necessary" instead?

    And I did in fact address your main point about Grievous (which you did not respond to) but maybe that's because I did not clearly link it to this issue. So I'll make it again. Your point about Grievous was based on limited playtime - I hope I'm interpreting you correctly there. I said that I do not have limited playtime. I have effectively unlimited playtime.

    So in light of that, I think your point about a lack of Grievous making it unlikely that I'll 7* Padme does not apply to me. InRevanWeTrust posted that he did it in only 2-3 hours without Grievous. 2-3 hours is a very short period of time from my perspective and doesn't even begin to take advantage of the effectively unlimited playtime I have at my disposal. And he didn't have the benefit of Droideka (which I will not zeta) or the reworked Nute Gunray (though I'm still not sure how effective reworked Nute will be as a leader or character - and that is my biggest point of worry).
    Woodroward wrote: »
    You assume that you can't get him in 2 months. You could. You could also not. If you said i don't know if i can get him I'd not have said what I said.

    Because of my attitude towards RNG I generally assume extremely bad RNG or the worst possible RNG. In this instance, I wouldn't even have to go that far. I would guess that I would have to be extremely lucky to get Grievous in 2 months from the fleet store alone. And I don't think anyone should be giving advice that is predicated on good luck.

    BTW, you should have written your sentence: "If you had said, 'I don't know if I can get him,' then I'd not have said what I said." I had to read that sentence several times before I got that. It's part of a pattern with you of sloppy, vague, or confusing writing. If I am misinterpreting you in some cases that's partly to blame. And I said it before, I take some of the blame as well.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I don't have to reiterate every inch of your statement to be addressing it.

    It's not clear exactly what you're referring to here. Anyway, I'm not responding directly to that quote here (or maybe I am, since it's unclear). I mainly wanted something to separate this from the previous section. Here are some of the main outstanding points (besides the one above about my unlimited playtime making your Grievous advice irrelevant) which you did not address which are not semantic or a result of misinterpretation:

    1. It's a bad idea to get everything in the fleet shop before getting zetas. The majority of the characters and ships in the shop that I don't already have maxed out are and will probably always be useless. And zetas are for more important to me. I still regret all the fleet currency I wasted on Chirrut and Rex. Yes, I know how good Chaze can be and maybe Rex will get a rework soon. But I 7*'d them both about a year ago and they haven't benefited me one bit (mainly because I haven't had time/resources to spare to gear them). From my perspective, that currency was badly wasted. They might be used to unlock something good one day but that's unlikely and I really hate gambling/speculating on the future and only recently and very reluctantly started limited targeted speculation. In fact, this entire Padme adventure is already pushing my limits on speculation (I'm only getting her because of what she might be used to unlock) and I'm thus very reluctant to spend more than necessary on it.
    2. There are absolutely NOT enough zetas from challenges and events without also buying them with fleet currency. Of course, how many zetas are enough and what "getting by" means is highly subjective, which is why differences in values matter.

    To me, if I am unable to get first in both arenas almost every single day, I've lost the game and I might as well stop playing. I know that's a very extreme attitude and nobody else I know shares it. As I said, from personal experience, there were many critical times when I just barely had enough zetas to maintain first in arena (usually in the days after a new meta arrives) and that's with me spending all my fleet currency on zetas (at that time).
    3. There are major differences in our goals, attittudes, and values with respect to playing this game (and possibly beyond that). You actually said "There's no value disconnect." If that were true then you and I would have the same goals, values, and attitudes with respect to playing this game. But how can that be when you're willing to take months away from this game, which I would never do, when you don't like doing the same thing everyone else is doing and are willing to give up thousands of dollars in crystals for that, or when limited playtime even enters your head as a consideration when it never enters into mine?
  • Woodroward
    3742 posts Member
    Letareus wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Just wanted to say that it took me less than a year to farm Greivous to 7* and that was largely BEFORE Fleet was even an option. Even once Fleet started up, I still only bought four or five shipments of him from it, the rest still came from shard shop.

    I have 4 characters to gear for the event. If I did shard shop for Grievous, I probably wouldn't be able to gear all my characters in time for the event, since I get about 10-30% of my gear from shard shop. That's why I don't consider shard shop an option in this instance. Also, my time frame here is far less than a year - it's about 2 months.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    And you still insist upon arguing against the comments that weren't directed towards you as though every comment in this thread should only be about you. No. Once a thread is made anyone who comments becomes as much a part of the thread as the original poster and they don't have to be addressing the op to be on topic.

    Even if something you say is not specifically directed toward me, they still reflect your beliefs, ideas, and values and in most cases that is what I was responding to.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    All of your valid points about my points were semantics. For instance, you were the one who really started using the word necessary, not I. So you take my one rephrasing of you putting words in my mouth as me having said it so you could continue in the same vein. It's disingenuous and on top of it it's ignoring what I meant by what I said.

    My valid points were not only about semantics. The one example you reference is semantic but it's a bit of a straw man because that could be considered my weakest argument. Note that I did hedge on it a bit even when I made it. But most of my valid points are not semantic like that one. I made a list at the bottom of this post.

    I know I risk putting undue emphasis on this trivial point by addressing this. But I first used the word necessary in the form of "unnecessary," and only once, before you responded with your vague statement that it "doesn't mean he isn't really necessary." Which I read as implying (though not stating categorically) that he is necessary, and it still looks that way to me.

    But regardless of which way you read that, you were saying that he is either necessary or close to necessary, which is also what your likely/unlikely statements amount to. When I said that you said that Grievous is needed/necessary, would it have made that much of a difference if I had said "pretty much needed" or "close to necessary" instead?

    And I did in fact address your main point about Grievous (which you did not respond to) but maybe that's because I did not clearly link it to this issue. So I'll make it again. Your point about Grievous was based on limited playtime - I hope I'm interpreting you correctly there. I said that I do not have limited playtime. I have effectively unlimited playtime.

    So in light of that, I think your point about a lack of Grievous making it unlikely that I'll 7* Padme does not apply to me. InRevanWeTrust posted that he did it in only 2-3 hours without Grievous. 2-3 hours is a very short period of time from my perspective and doesn't even begin to take advantage of the effectively unlimited playtime I have at my disposal. And he didn't have the benefit of Droideka (which I will not zeta) or the reworked Nute Gunray (though I'm still not sure how effective reworked Nute will be as a leader or character - and that is my biggest point of worry).
    Woodroward wrote: »
    You assume that you can't get him in 2 months. You could. You could also not. If you said i don't know if i can get him I'd not have said what I said.

    Because of my attitude towards RNG I generally assume extremely bad RNG or the worst possible RNG. In this instance, I wouldn't even have to go that far. I would guess that I would have to be extremely lucky to get Grievous in 2 months from the fleet store alone. And I don't think anyone should be giving advice that is predicated on good luck.

    BTW, you should have written your sentence: "If you had said, 'I don't know if I can get him,' then I'd not have said what I said." I had to read that sentence several times before I got that. It's part of a pattern with you of sloppy, vague, or confusing writing. If I am misinterpreting you in some cases that's partly to blame. And I said it before, I take some of the blame as well.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    I don't have to reiterate every inch of your statement to be addressing it.

    It's not clear exactly what you're referring to here. Anyway, I'm not responding directly to that quote here (or maybe I am, since it's unclear). I mainly wanted something to separate this from the previous section. Here are some of the main outstanding points (besides the one above about my unlimited playtime making your Grievous advice irrelevant) which you did not address which are not semantic or a result of misinterpretation:

    1. It's a bad idea to get everything in the fleet shop before getting zetas. The majority of the characters and ships in the shop that I don't already have maxed out are and will probably always be useless. And zetas are for more important to me. I still regret all the fleet currency I wasted on Chirrut and Rex. Yes, I know how good Chaze can be and maybe Rex will get a rework soon. But I 7*'d them both about a year ago and they haven't benefited me one bit (mainly because I haven't had time/resources to spare to gear them). From my perspective, that currency was badly wasted. They might be used to unlock something good one day but that's unlikely and I really hate gambling/speculating on the future and only recently and very reluctantly started limited targeted speculation. In fact, this entire Padme adventure is already pushing my limits on speculation (I'm only getting her because of what she might be used to unlock) and I'm thus very reluctant to spend more than necessary on it.
    2. There are absolutely NOT enough zetas from challenges and events without also buying them with fleet currency. Of course, how many zetas are enough and what "getting by" means is highly subjective, which is why differences in values matter.

    To me, if I am unable to get first in both arenas almost every single day, I've lost the game and I might as well stop playing. I know that's a very extreme attitude and nobody else I know shares it. As I said, from personal experience, there were many critical times when I just barely had enough zetas to maintain first in arena (usually in the days after a new meta arrives) and that's with me spending all my fleet currency on zetas (at that time).
    3. There are major differences in our goals, attittudes, and values with respect to playing this game (and possibly beyond that). You actually said "There's no value disconnect." If that were true then you and I would have the same goals, values, and attitudes with respect to playing this game. But how can that be when you're willing to take months away from this game, which I would never do, when you don't like doing the same thing everyone else is doing and are willing to give up thousands of dollars in crystals for that, or when limited playtime even enters your head as a consideration when it never enters into mine?

    My God you're very persistent in not taking a hint. Well this will be my last response to you. Thanks for giving me a headache.
  • NicWester
    7470 posts Member
    Aaaaaanyway......... I suggest farming Greivous anyway. True, it's a drain on your shard shop tokens, but he's a really good character and you're going to need him anyway. I get why you're reluctant, but I really think he's worth it in the long run and the sooner you get started the sooner you get finished.

    Good luck!
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • Pulsehammer
    153 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    First and foremost...my God — what on earth inspired you two to mutually fixate on each other? Reading that exchange was disturbing (albeit a bit fascinating at first).

    So, allow me to offer a dissenting opinion on 7* Padme without GG. I have STRONG G12+ bugs, Ventress at G12 with rampage, even got B2 to a high G11. I threw arena mods on them. I tweaked. I fought countless times throughout the event — probably to the tune of over twenty hours of gameplay.

    The highest I could get was 6*. This was maddening, as I dropped about $115 on various panic-packs to get her to 7* only to get sent home with a free toaster.

    Not spending shard store currency to get Grievous — good luck with that. I hope you enjoy having him when you’re 90. Just like a farm for Wampa or Hoda, you make a sacrifice to get the toons you need.

    After gloriously whiffing on Padme, I became hyper-focused on being ready the next cycle. Grievous is 7*/nearly G12 with the leadership Zeta (mistake on my part, I’ll get the unique on). Nute was already 7*, but now has his Zeta with gear rising. B2 is at G12 and Magna will likely be next. We’ll see if that motley crew with Ventress can get the job done next time.
  • First and foremost...my God — what on earth inspired you two to mutually fixate on each other? Reading that exchange was disturbing (albeit a bit fascinating at first).

    So, allow me to offer a dissenting opinion on 7* Padme without GG. I have STRONG G12+ bugs, Ventress at G12 with rampage, even got B2 to a high G11. I threw arena mods on them. I tweaked. I fought countless times throughout the event — probably to the tune of over twenty hours of gameplay.

    The highest I could get was 6*. This was maddening, as I dropped about $115 on various panic-packs to get her to 7* only to get sent home with a free toaster.

    Not spending shard store currency to get Grievous — good luck with that. I hope you enjoy having him when you’re 90. Just like a farm for Wampa or Hoda, you make a sacrifice to get the toons you need.

    After gloriously whiffing on Padme, I became hyper-focused on being ready the next cycle. Grievous is 7*/nearly G12 with the leadership Zeta (mistake on my part, I’ll get the unique on). Nute was already 7*, but now has his Zeta with gear rising. B2 is at G12 and Magna will likely be next. We’ll see if that motley crew with Ventress can get the job done next time.

    Um. He fixated on me. I told him I wasn't addressing him and he shouldn't respond to me numerous times yet he persisted relentlessly as though I was the one not getting it.
  • First and foremost...my God — what on earth inspired you two to mutually fixate on each other? Reading that exchange was disturbing (albeit a bit fascinating at first).

    So, allow me to offer a dissenting opinion on 7* Padme without GG. I have STRONG G12+ bugs, Ventress at G12 with rampage, even got B2 to a high G11. I threw arena mods on them. I tweaked. I fought countless times throughout the event — probably to the tune of over twenty hours of gameplay.

    The highest I could get was 6*. This was maddening, as I dropped about $115 on various panic-packs to get her to 7* only to get sent home with a free toaster.

    Not spending shard store currency to get Grievous — good luck with that. I hope you enjoy having him when you’re 90. Just like a farm for Wampa or Hoda, you make a sacrifice to get the toons you need.

    After gloriously whiffing on Padme, I became hyper-focused on being ready the next cycle. Grievous is 7*/nearly G12 with the leadership Zeta (mistake on my part, I’ll get the unique on). Nute was already 7*, but now has his Zeta with gear rising. B2 is at G12 and Magna will likely be next. We’ll see if that motley crew with Ventress can get the job done next time.

    You shouldn't forget about Dooku, he brings his anti GR kit.
  • Woodroward
    3742 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    You shouldn't forget about Dooku, he brings his anti GR kit.

    I still wouldn't use him in this event. Whether he can hit past protection or not, he still will generate a lot of protection up that can't be dispelled making it harder for the rest of your team to do anything.

  • Woodroward wrote: »
    You shouldn't forget about Dooku, he brings his anti GR kit.

    I still wouldn't use him in this event. Whether he can hit past protection or not, he still will generate a lot of protection up that can't be dispelled making it harder for the rest of your team to do anything.

    No that was an issue before he got his rework, an people unlocked padme with Dooku on the team even then. I don't think protection up will be an issue, not when his kit is like it is now. We'll see once the event returns I guess I will be using him.
  • Dryff
    672 posts Member
    This thread sidetracked, so I'll get back on topic here...

    Would this team be able to do it, and which leader ability should be used?

    G12zzAsajj, G12zGG, G12Dooku, G11 Nute, G8 B2 (working on gearing B2 before the event rolls around).
  • Dryff wrote: »
    This thread sidetracked, so I'll get back on topic here...

    Would this team be able to do it, and which leader ability should be used?

    G12zzAsajj, G12zGG, G12Dooku, G11 Nute, G8 B2 (working on gearing B2 before the event rolls around).

    My guess would be yes assuming G11 or higher on B2. A Couple more zetas wouldn’t hurt for insurance.
  • EdSolo
    187 posts Member
    Unfortunately, we are really guessing what will work at this point due to the reworks. I barely got a 6* Padme the last time. I finally managed it in the last five minutes of the event so I only got a quick run or two at 7* just to see what it was like. I really didn't have the best team since I never really concentrated on separatists. I believe my team was G12 zzAssaj lead, G12 Sun Fac, G11 Geo Spy, G8 B2, G10 Poggle. Of course everyone is waiting on Stun Guns which I have maybe three stashed for the return of DR in case I need to either gear up DR once I get him or any associated toon if I can't get through the event. I have Grievous no zetas at g10 just missing a stun gun. B2 is just missing a stun gun for G9. I have Nute at G9, but no zeta. I have the gear to get him to G10, but I'm holding it for now. Dooku is G9, also ready for G10, but again, holding the gear for now. I need 90 omegas to finish all the separatists skills to level 8, but again are holding those for DR.

    I figure gearing/leveling the faction won't hurt due to the new TB. It may just be best to hoard gear and resources until the event returns just to see what works and go from there.
  • Woodroward
    3742 posts Member
    Woodroward wrote: »
    You shouldn't forget about Dooku, he brings his anti GR kit.

    I still wouldn't use him in this event. Whether he can hit past protection or not, he still will generate a lot of protection up that can't be dispelled making it harder for the rest of your team to do anything.

    No that was an issue before he got his rework, an people unlocked padme with Dooku on the team even then. I don't think protection up will be an issue, not when his kit is like it is now. We'll see once the event returns I guess I will be using him.

    I think it depends. The indispellable protection up doesn't seem to prevent any debuffs. If this is wai, then he'll be fine. If it is supposed to prevent them and it's fixed the next time around, I wouldn't even try it with any counter attackers or assisters.
  • Letareus
    103 posts Member
    Finally back home in front of my PC.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    My God you're very persistent in not taking a hint. Well this will be my last response to you. Thanks for giving me a headache.

    I will never stop correcting the record on mischaracterizations of my statements. And thank you for not responding to me anymore, I only wish you had stopped sooner. When I first said that you were giving bad advice what I wanted was for you to stop posting here. All the noise has made it difficult for me to get any real advice. Unfortunately, simply not responding to me is not enough since you keep on posting here like it's some general advice thread on Padme or something. Why don't you make your own general advice thread? Or I might need to make another thread specifically for my case. I doubt you'd have posted as you have if this was but one of 10-20 similar threads in a Padme forum. But that's exactly what this thread was supposed to be.

    I can't say you're completely at fault in seeing this as a general advice thread because a few other people also saw it that way, although the overwhelming majority of responses understood that this was a thread about my case and were direct responses to me. Part of it may also have been the hastily written and imprecise initial title (since fixed).

    But I think I finally figured out why a few people have been coming here and treating it like a general Padme advice thread. When I started this thread I wrote it as if it were one of many similar threads on the Padme forum that should exist. I put it here because there was no better place to put it. I now suspect that the very lack of a Padme forum may be why a few people have come to this thread for advice - it's become a de facto Padme forum for them and you also saw it that way.

    Well, my case is highly idiosyncratic and I need specific and nuanced advice for my case. So I want a thread specifically for my case whether you recognize it as such or not. If this becomes a general Padme thread I would need another thread specifically for my case.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    Um. He fixated on me. I told him I wasn't addressing him and he shouldn't respond to me numerous times yet he persisted relentlessly as though I was the one not getting it.

    That is so wrong. I can't tell if he's lying, delusional, or just bad at reading comprehension there. Every single one of the main points I responded to were in posts he made in direct response to me - in which he quoted me and no one else. I used some supporting evidence/points from a couple of the posts he made in response to others because things a person says sincerely reflect their beliefs/values no matter who they're responding to. It's similar to what they teach you to do in an English class for an essay - make a contention about someone and support it with references to things that person has written, sometimes from a variety of different works or contexts. None of them are addressed to the essay writer.

    He then seized on those very valid supporting citations and used the fact that I referenced them to falsely claim that my main points were somehow not about things he said to me directly (the main ones were 1. GG is "basically required" for this event - direct quote from him, 2. farm everything in the fleet store to max before you get any zetas, 3. he has the same goals/values that I have, and 4. you get enough zetas from other sources that you don't need zetas from fleet store (this is highly dependent on 3 b/c enough zetas is highly subjective).

    He also repeatedly misrepresented many of the things I said - whether intentionally or because he misunderstood I don't know. He then accused me of doing the same thing to him. I may have misread or overspeculated based on one or two of the things he said and admitted fault there (something he has never done), but I didn't do that with most of the rest the things he said or what I wrote. Straw man - I may have made a couple of small errors and he uses that to dismiss everything else I said. It may not have been deliberate - maybe those small things enraged him too much for him to see the bigger picture clearly.
    First and foremost...my God — what on earth inspired you two to mutually fixate on each other? Reading that exchange was disturbing (albeit a bit fascinating at first).

    Here's the whole story. From my perspective, he was the one who made this into a spat or fixation albeit I did say something he took the wrong way which may have caused him to do that. This started because he gave me two pieces of bad advice (1. GG is "basically required" for this event - direct quote from him, 2. farm everything in the fleet store to max before you get any zetas).

    I explained why I did not feel his advice applied to me. But he persisted and doubled or tripled down on them over the course of several posts. So I had to more forcefully dismiss his advice and hopefully send a message that his advice was no longer desired. Maybe I went a bit too far. But I prefaced what I said with a disclaimer that we just have different values and that what was to follow was not personal but simply a reflection of that.

    So I linked his SWGOH profile and mine as an attempt to both illustrate that and try to introduce some sort of objective measure of how qualified he is to give advice (admittedly it's far from determinative and far from ideal, but nothing else is available). Instead of going away he didn't take it too well . He took it personally and overreacted (albeit understandably). He misinterpreted it as a "#1 contest" between us which was not my intent. I wasn't trying to imply that I was extraordinary or great. It was more something like: he had flunked a class everyone else here had passed so maybe he shouldn't be so confident in his advice. That may be a bit harsh but it reflects the lack of soundness of the two arguments he made and persisted in pushing over and over.

    In the post I first made this point in, the direct quote I had above it was in fact one of his responses to another person (because I wanted to refer to something in it as a supporting point) even though the crux of what I was writing was in response to his main points made over the course of several posts. Maybe that's why he's been going on and on about me responding to things he was saying to other people. In retrospect, I should have put a different quote there, or an additional quote, or maybe no quote at all, though everything I wrote would have
    been exactly the same.
    Woodroward wrote: »
    The 3 characters that are basically required to win are GG, Asaji, and B2. the other 2 can be whoever, but Dooku, B1. Droideka, Magna, Sun Fac, and GeoSol should all be avoided.

    Also, it is a bad idea to spend your fleet currency on anything but characters and ships before you have all the characters and ships (don't buy zetas if you don't have everything else in the store), so you really have no reason not to farm GG.

    That was the post I should have quoted in my post dated June 4, 2019 at 10:02PM instead of or in addition to the second quote (to preface the section where I began by saying "So I'll begin by saying...") and likely the source of all his confusion. It wouldn't have changed what I wrote one bit. The above quote was indisputably addressed to me, not that it matters.

    Also, I have to retract a concession I made previously. Previously I conceded that maybe he wasn't exactly the one who started calling GG necessary. I had missed this post when I reviewed the thread but it was obviously what I was responding to at the time. He clearly calls GG necessary here, along with Ventress and B2. Basically required = Necessary. The "basically" hedge doesn't change the essence of what he or I were saying.
    NicWester wrote: »
    Aaaaaanyway......... I suggest farming Greivous anyway. True, it's a drain on your shard shop tokens, but he's a really good character and you're going to need him anyway.

    I started farming Grievous (from the fleet store only) right before I started this thread and never stopped. Like you said, I'll need him eventually as a member of the separatist team for GA/TW because Ventress is committed to the Nightsister team, obviously. But I can't and won't count on him as a member of my Padme team because it's highly unlikely I'll 7 star him in time for Padme's next return. And I cannot afford (in terms of time and resources) to farm and gear a 6 member team.

    So why won't I spend shard store shards on Grievous? See below.
    Not spending shard store currency to get Grievous — good luck with that. I hope you enjoy having him when you’re 90.

    That's exactly why I don't think I'll get him in time for Padme's return. Woodroward was the one arguing that I farm Grievous with fleet store currency and that I didn't need to spend shard store currency on him (though he was vague on the time frame even though I specifically said many times this has to be for Padme's very next return). I have no expectation that I'll get Grievous in time for Padme's return, which is why I'm not inlcuding him in my planned team. As I said above, I am getting Grievous (ironically, with exactly the farming plan that
    Woodroward recommended, which I was already doing before he recommended it). But I'm not stupid and I know that has nothing to do with this event.

    So why won't I spend shard store currency on Grievous? The shard store represents approximately 15-30% of my gear income. I had 4 characters to gear from scratch (just got B2 to 7* and G11 so 3 more to go). If I spend shard store currency on Grievous, it is my estimation that I won't be able to gear my entire team in time for Padme's next return (I believe I'll fall far short), which defeats the entire point.
    So, allow me to offer a dissenting opinion on 7* Padme without GG. I have STRONG G12+ bugs, Ventress at G12 with rampage, even got B2 to a high G11. I threw arena mods on them. I tweaked. I fought countless times throughout the event — probably to the tune of over twenty hours of gameplay.

    People have done it with your team but they had g12 B2 which may make the difference. Anyway, I'll have the benefit of G12 B2 (so my B2 will have the benefit of arena mods where you did not last time) and Droideka as well as reworked Nute. Maybe I'll put Dooku in there but I'm not sure yet and not sure who he'd replace. Like I said, I couldn't include Grievous in the mix if I wanted to - if I got him I basically would be unable to gear the entire team adequately in time.

    Getting Grievous means I'll probably be doing the event with an undergeared team - I believe I'll have a better chance with a fully geared team without Grievous than with a poorly geared (I estimate G7-G10 except Ventress at G12 and B2 which is already G11) team with Grievous. Also, only Ventress can have arena mods in that case. I believe the guides that include Grievous in the team require a G11-G12 team but I'm not 100% sure. If having Grievous means you can 7* the event with 3 characters (including Grievous himself) having almost no gear (to me, G7-G9 means almost no gear) more easily than a fully geared team without Grievous, then I would consider it.
  • TVF
    25593 posts Member
    That was....long.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF wrote: »
    That was....long.

    Yeah, sorry. Had a lot to get off my chest / respond to after being away a week. You should see the extended director's cut!

    But really, if we can avoid any more unwelcome noise/distractions, what I would like to know now is how I can wirj Dooku into my current team since it's looking like he could be useful or possibly a better pick. My current team is Nute Gunray (Leader), Ventress, B2, Droideka, and Sun Fac. Only Ventress and B2 are geared so far so the others aren't too hard to swap out.
  • MasterSeedy
    2374 posts Member
    edited June 2019
    @Woodroward

    You said:
    The fact that people have managed without gg doesn't mean he isn't really necessary.

    First - you're wrong. That's exactly what it means. If you can do it without him, he isn't necessary. He's just very helpful.

    Then you said:
    I never said necessary.

    That's exactly what you said. There's the word. Spelled the same. "doesn't mean he isn't" = "does mean he is".

    You're not only wrong that he's necessary. You're wrong that you never said "necessary". You did. Is there a reason people should be taking your advice when you don't even know what you said earlier in the same thread?

    @ Everyone:

    People are forgetting that we've had reworks since the first Padme event. This is what you should farm, if you're in a rush:
    Nute (+ zeta) should be very, very effective against Padme, both in her event and generally in the game. Nute is also an easy farm. Zeta Nute is also intended to be necessary in Geo TB, so long term, this is definitely not a wasted zeta. Whether or not it's a zeta you want to prioritize right now (if you have other things you want to use a zeta on), that's up to you. But it's a good move overall, and if you're rushing to get 7* Padme there's no reason not to prioritize this zeta.

    Ventress is very effective in the event, for dispel and for TM jumping as people die and get resurrected.

    Geo Spy does massive extra damage while dispelling buffs (similar to Boba's execute, though without preventing revive).

    B2 prevents the endless bonus protection from accruing in the first place with his Buff Immunity.

    Those 4 toons should be mandatory for someone who doesn't have separatists now and needs rush farms. Other toons might take too long to reach 7*.

    Candidates for 5th toon include (in alphabetical order):
    Dooku: If you pick Dooku, you have to put stack speed on him and put shock on Padme right away so she can't gain bonus protection. Because of his out-of-turn attacks, he's not a great choice, but with a lot of speed and potency and some good luck landing shock at the beginning of a battle, he can be a solid piece of a winning team. Just be prepared for multiple restarts to get shock on Padme before her protection/tenacity train gets going.

    Geo Soldier: Not a good kit for this event. He just doesn't hit hard enough on basic, and his special is an assist call. However, if you need a 5th toon, he's an easy farm and you probably have him already.

    Jango: Jango isn't necessarily an easy farm, but he's a very good toon and when you said you didn't have separatists, please pay attention to the fact that Jango isn't a separatist right now, but that tag is being added to his kit in the next couple of weeks - long before the Padme event comes back.

    Poggle: Not a difficult farm, and you might have him already anyway. He's not a great toon, but he makes the other separatists better without counter-attacking or calling assists.




    Difficult toons to panic farm that are useful for the event, but only if you've already farmed them most of the way:
    General Grievous

    Droideka

    Jango (he's also above, but only b/c some people might have him already without realizing he will probably - not certainly - be a Separatist before the event returns. But he's absolutely a slow farm - just one hard node. So if you don't have him at 6* already, he's not a good choice.


    Toons to avoid:
    IG-100

    Sun Fac


    Obviously some people have made it through he event with counterattackers like Dooku & Sun Fac, but they do make it more difficult. If you absolutely have to have one of these last two, Sun Fac is much better because of the dispel.

    As a last note, I'm not sure about B-1. I think that you should avoid him. he's been useful to some people, but as I understand it, he's only useful under a General Grievous lead, which you won't have.

    My best guess for a #5 for you is Jango Fett, but I didn't check your inventory to see where you were on that farm.
    Post edited by MasterSeedy on
  • Gifafi
    4993 posts Member
    you can always tell who is on comp vs mobile lol
    Maybe End Game isn't for you
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