Irresistible uncleansable AB is a really dumb mechanic... and while triple cleanse is atrocious, this is not a solution. It's just dumb.
if this is the case then... Irresistible triple cleanse is also a really dumb mechanic...
Huh? Cleanse is a positive effect, removing debuffs from your own toons. Who is supposed to resist/counter. There are unremovable debuffs, and they are borderline OP (Vader dots, Sabine's armor down).
If you're complaining about offensive dispells, I agree that they should go through a tenacity check. It's a bit nonsense that there's no way of stopping Baze or Nilly from dispelling your toons.
And yes, it's the same toons that are problematic... It's always the same set of toons, because Chaze is **** OP. And Nilly is the only toon that counters then, but is in turn, OP in his own right.
Got it make Rex even better. Dispel used to go thru a tenacity check it was horrid.
It's great news, I'm glad Chaze users' misdirection did not work, thanks to the devs!...
The majority of chaze users also run DN though...
Yes they do, they were just trying to distract the attention, as if DN was the problem, not Chaze.
why exactly is chaze the problem, not DN?
(for the record: i'm fine with both)
well there were numerous threads of how 2 characters have the kit of abilities of 8 other characters for starters, you can search them in the discussions board.
i've read a couple of them, most reasons given in those threads also apply to DN. Hence my question.
DN's kit is really balanced, a chain cooldown of abilities to be able to use the other, and you can use annihilate once in a counter. It was designed against timeout teams and works perfectly well as it's designed. Chaze however, is totally unbalanced, having almost all the possible abilities in a team on just 2 characters is breaking the game strategy. But you already know all of this, no doubt.
this was the response i was hoping for. Calling DN "really balanced", but chaze "totally unbalanced" is funny to me. thanks
It's great news, I'm glad Chaze users' misdirection did not work, thanks to the devs!...
The majority of chaze users also run DN though...
Yes they do, they were just trying to distract the attention, as if DN was the problem, not Chaze.
why exactly is chaze the problem, not DN?
(for the record: i'm fine with both)
well there were numerous threads of how 2 characters have the kit of abilities of 8 other characters for starters, you can search them in the discussions board.
i've read a couple of them, most reasons given in those threads also apply to DN. Hence my question.
DN's kit is really balanced, a chain cooldown of abilities to be able to use the other, and you can use annihilate once in a counter. It was designed against timeout teams and works perfectly well as it's designed. Chaze however, is totally unbalanced, having almost all the possible abilities in a team on just 2 characters is breaking the game strategy. But you already know all of this, no doubt.
this was the response i was hoping for. Calling DN "really balanced", but chaze "totally unbalanced" is funny to me. thanks
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down) counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from RT, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
I agree with this. DN is a strong kit - but not nearly as strong as Chaze. The fact that many people have to run two taunters just to protect Nihilus tells you all you need to know about his weaknesses.
Add to all of that the fact that Chaze synergizes with arguably the most powerful faction in the game right now, while DN synergizes with a pseudo-meta that is already been wiped from existence. Sure, people still run DN - but the DN now is not nearly as powerful as he was when he was sped up by Zual and protected by stealth under Zaul lead.
In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie
In game guild: TNR Uprising I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
Also DN ran with a mediocre team beacomes mediocre himself, while Chaze are as good no matter who you run them with ( themselves as toons, not their team)
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
Yes I did not count Nihilus' DoTs and Health Down (which is a zeta ability btw, so not that common) but also forgot mass cleanse for Chaze . The fact that people are using Nihilus much is not because it's OP. They also did it with Boba and EP, which were designed as counters for rebels, but we saw them in the rebel teams. It's nothing different, people use them to nullify the opponents counter value. As I said before, Nihilus was perfectly designed against timeout teams, but those timeout teams started to use him instead of Bariss and evolved into triple cleanse + DN. The devs are designing good characters, some are OP, with which I have no problem, who would want to see an insignificant toon to be as powerful as an iconic character in SW universe. (That's why I hate Biggs and nowadays Resistance Trooper is also getting there )I don't want Chaze to be nerfed, but the fact is they are totally unbalanced, which is really breaking the game strategy. And the truth is truth. DN is not so hard to deal with even with his strong kit, but Chaze have too many unfair advantages, which is completely unfair.
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
Yes I did not count Nihilus' DoTs and Health Down (which is a zeta ability btw, so not that common) but also forgot mass cleanse for Chaze . The fact that people are using Nihilus much is not because it's OP. They also did it with Boba and EP, which were designed as counters for rebels, but we saw them in the rebel teams. It's nothing different, people use them to nullify the opponents counter value. As I said before, Nihilus was perfectly designed against timeout teams, but those timeout teams started to use him instead of Bariss and evolved into triple cleanse + DN. The devs are designing good characters, some are OP, with which I have no problem, who would want to see an insignificant toon to be as powerful as an iconic character in SW universe. (That's why I hate Biggs and nowadays Resistance Trooper is also getting there )I don't want Chaze to be nerfed, but the fact is they are totally unbalanced, which is really breaking the game strategy. And the truth is truth. DN is not so hard to deal with even with his strong kit, but Chaze have too many unfair advantages, which is completely unfair.
lets just agree to disagree, you see it your way, i see it differently.
atleast we're both happy about the CD increase not being resistable
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
Yes I did not count Nihilus' DoTs and Health Down (which is a zeta ability btw, so not that common) but also forgot mass cleanse for Chaze . The fact that people are using Nihilus much is not because it's OP. They also did it with Boba and EP, which were designed as counters for rebels, but we saw them in the rebel teams. It's nothing different, people use them to nullify the opponents counter value. As I said before, Nihilus was perfectly designed against timeout teams, but those timeout teams started to use him instead of Bariss and evolved into triple cleanse + DN. The devs are designing good characters, some are OP, with which I have no problem, who would want to see an insignificant toon to be as powerful as an iconic character in SW universe. (That's why I hate Biggs and nowadays Resistance Trooper is also getting there )I don't want Chaze to be nerfed, but the fact is they are totally unbalanced, which is really breaking the game strategy. And the truth is truth. DN is not so hard to deal with even with his strong kit, but Chaze have too many unfair advantages, which is completely unfair.
lets just agree to disagree, you see it your way, i see it differently.
atleast we're both happy about the CD increase not being resistable
So the Dev post that y'all are quoting isn't showing up for me? Did they take it down? I mean, when I click on the link I can see it and read it, but when I navigate to the 'Developer Updates' page isn't there?
So the Dev post that y'all are quoting isn't showing up for me? Did they take it down? I mean, when I click on the link I can see it and read it, but when I navigate to the 'Developer Updates' page isn't there?
For some reason, it was way down the list of dev updates. I'll check it again and point you in the right direction.
So the Dev post that y'all are quoting isn't showing up for me? Did they take it down? I mean, when I click on the link I can see it and read it, but when I navigate to the 'Developer Updates' page isn't there?
It's past some of the 2016 posts. Right after "Current Raid bugs and fixes".
The reason why DN is used significantly more than Chaze is because he was given away for free; Chaze was in tournaments and then Baze was slotted into a hard node. I don't care either way for the DN vs Chaze levels of OP argument, but it annoys me to see people quote the meta report as proof that one character is more OP than another.
If CG released a character that cost $100,000 to get onto your roster and said character had an AOE annihilate with no cooldown, would people not agree that the meta report is a very bad indication of the strength of the character?
The reason why DN is used significantly more than Chaze is because he was given away for free; Chaze was in tournaments and then Baze was slotted into a hard node. I don't care either way for the DN vs Chaze levels of OP argument, but it annoys me to see people quote the meta report as proof that one character is more OP than another.
If CG released a character that cost $100,000 to get onto your roster and said character had an AOE annihilate with no cooldown, would people not agree that the meta report is a very bad indication of the strength of the character?
I was only using the same arguments as used in chaze is OP threads. However, i do think it says something about a character's strenght if he is used by alot of players. We also got all the phoenix characters for free, yet no one is using them. I didn't mean to imply that i think DN is more OP than chaze because he is used more, i don't think DN is more OP than chaze at all actually.
The point i was trying to make is that if you think chaze is OP, you surely also must think DN is OP, but people don't think that for some reason. Then everyone just starts to compare DN to chaze, when i was comparing chaze to everyone else, and nihilus to everyone else. I came to the conclusion that if the one is OP, the other is aswell. Nothing more, nothing less.
in case anyone missed my first comment in this thread; i think both chaze and nihilus are fine as is.
I edited my post because of spelling errors and it seems vanished, waiting for the approval, so I post it again:
You're welcome . Comparing 3 abilities (dispel enemy buffs, increase cooldowns and annihilate) on a slow DN (120 base speed) and 12-13 on Chaze, (taunt, retribution, mass dispel, gain max health, give unlimited HoTs, Tenacity up, dispel on 2 special abilities on Baze, huge dmg, TM gain. inflict speed down, counter even without retribution, 2 asssist calls on eachother) With a fast Chirrut (160 base speed). One is balanced and the other is totally unbalanced, not to mention the additional max health an critical chance from R2, TM and healing from Wedge, etc. DN is balanced and Chaze is definitely unbalanced.
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
Yes I did not count Nihilus' DoTs and Health Down (which is a zeta ability btw, so not that common) but also forgot mass cleanse for Chaze . The fact that people are using Nihilus much is not because it's OP. They also did it with Boba and EP, which were designed as counters for rebels, but we saw them in the rebel teams. It's nothing different, people use them to nullify the opponents counter value. As I said before, Nihilus was perfectly designed against timeout teams, but those timeout teams started to use him instead of Bariss and evolved into triple cleanse + DN. The devs are designing good characters, some are OP, with which I have no problem, who would want to see an insignificant toon to be as powerful as an iconic character in SW universe. (That's why I hate Biggs and nowadays Resistance Trooper is also getting there )I don't want Chaze to be nerfed, but the fact is they are totally unbalanced, which is really breaking the game strategy. And the truth is truth. DN is not so hard to deal with even with his strong kit, but Chaze have too many unfair advantages, which is completely unfair.
lets just agree to disagree, you see it your way, i see it differently.
atleast we're both happy about the CD increase not being resistable
Taunt, counter, health gain, hot's gain, clean, aoe dispell, tm gain
Tenacity up, mutal assitance, turn buff into debuffs, f.. hard hits and REALLY good speed (chirrut)
What about this idea, might fix alot of complaints in 1 stroke https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/115196/too-many-tags#latest
Nevermind if chirrut plus baze are op, their kit is strong enough that it makes tags irrelevant, this idea would let other combos enter the frey, at the very least all the threads would change from "chaze is op" to a more diverse and refreshing "x + x is op"
Anyone who was expecting Nihilus to get nerfed was living in a fantasy world. Glad that the devs have clarified this so that people will hopefully stop giving out misleading information about Nihilus' continued viability.
I like Nihilus, and use him.
But I think everyone should remember that they implemented Protection to "prevent people from getting killed in 1 hit". There should not be a kill button.
I like Nihilus, and use him.
But I think everyone should remember that they implemented Protection to "prevent people from getting killed in 1 hit". There should not be a kill button.
They introduced protection to stop characters being killed in 1 hit on the first turn. They said specifically that it would not stop skills that required set up to deal massive damage where they then mentioned Vader's culling blade. Nihilus's annihilate requires a bit more set up than culling blade does as it can't be set up by another teammate, it requires Nihilus to drain the cooldowns himself, whereas culling blade you can stack debuffs with the rest of your team and have Vader go on his first turn and kill someone.
Replies
Got it make Rex even better. Dispel used to go thru a tenacity check it was horrid.
I agree with this. DN is a strong kit - but not nearly as strong as Chaze. The fact that many people have to run two taunters just to protect Nihilus tells you all you need to know about his weaknesses.
Add to all of that the fact that Chaze synergizes with arguably the most powerful faction in the game right now, while DN synergizes with a pseudo-meta that is already been wiped from existence. Sure, people still run DN - but the DN now is not nearly as powerful as he was when he was sped up by Zual and protected by stealth under Zaul lead.
In game guild: TNR Uprising
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
You're welcome
It's time guys, let the Chaze go
i asumed that had happened, it's anoying.
point is, DN is also far superior to pretty much all characters. People hate chaze, i can see why, but i don't understand why DN is somehow "okay" using the same arguments used by people to call chaze OP.
- viable at low stars
- very common in arena, more common than chaze. (according to swgoh.gg)
- useable in any squad
- alot of abilities packed into 1 character (you left out DoT and health down debuffs)
Would he also be unbalanced? maybe not as unbalanced as chaze, i'm not debating that point.
I personally like that the game is unbalanced. I love DN. I'm using him in my arena team. I'm happy they didn't make his CD increase resistable. But i also don't mind chaze being as powerfull as they are.
Yes I did not count Nihilus' DoTs and Health Down (which is a zeta ability btw, so not that common) but also forgot mass cleanse for Chaze
lets just agree to disagree, you see it your way, i see it differently.
atleast we're both happy about the CD increase not being resistable
Yes, let's agree on at least one thing
If CG released a character that cost $100,000 to get onto your roster and said character had an AOE annihilate with no cooldown, would people not agree that the meta report is a very bad indication of the strength of the character?
I was only using the same arguments as used in chaze is OP threads. However, i do think it says something about a character's strenght if he is used by alot of players. We also got all the phoenix characters for free, yet no one is using them. I didn't mean to imply that i think DN is more OP than chaze because he is used more, i don't think DN is more OP than chaze at all actually.
The point i was trying to make is that if you think chaze is OP, you surely also must think DN is OP, but people don't think that for some reason. Then everyone just starts to compare DN to chaze, when i was comparing chaze to everyone else, and nihilus to everyone else. I came to the conclusion that if the one is OP, the other is aswell. Nothing more, nothing less.
in case anyone missed my first comment in this thread; i think both chaze and nihilus are fine as is.
I haven't laughed so hard in a long time!!! Thanks!!
Tenacity up, mutal assitance, turn buff into debuffs, f.. hard hits and REALLY good speed (chirrut)
https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/115196/too-many-tags#latest
Nevermind if chirrut plus baze are op, their kit is strong enough that it makes tags irrelevant, this idea would let other combos enter the frey, at the very least all the threads would change from "chaze is op" to a more diverse and refreshing "x + x is op"
But I think everyone should remember that they implemented Protection to "prevent people from getting killed in 1 hit". There should not be a kill button.
They introduced protection to stop characters being killed in 1 hit on the first turn. They said specifically that it would not stop skills that required set up to deal massive damage where they then mentioned Vader's culling blade. Nihilus's annihilate requires a bit more set up than culling blade does as it can't be set up by another teammate, it requires Nihilus to drain the cooldowns himself, whereas culling blade you can stack debuffs with the rest of your team and have Vader go on his first turn and kill someone.