Health: 22.398
Protection: 26.192
Speed: 140
Health Steal: %15
Physical Damage: 2.300
Special Damage: 4.000
1. Invincible Assault - basic:
Deal Physical damage to target enemy. Mace Windu has %50 chance to stagger the target (can't be resisted) enemy on critical hit .
2. Smite - special (4 turn cooldown)
Deal Special damage to all enemies and remove all positive status effects from enemies, then grants critical chance up to all allies.
3. Furious head - leader
Jedi Allies gain +25% offense, +15% critical chance. In addition Jedi allies gain %5 offense until the end of battle or Mace Windu is defeated when they score a critical hit.
4. Vaapad - unique
Mace Windu has %15 chance to evade an attack (This chance is doubled against Sith). Whenever Mace Windu evades an attack he has %50 chance to counter with %50 increased damage. Zeta: Mace Windu has %100 counter chance when he evades an attack. In addition Mace Windu's attacks against Sith can't be evaded and deals double damage.
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
'Sidious' own fury was used and redirected by Windu via the use of Vaapad'
Vapaad is unequivocally anti-Sith as it reverts an opponents fury, darkness and hate against themselves. And as I'm sure your aware, a Sith is inherently powered by darkness and hate
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
A further quote from the same book, which is also evidence that Vapaad is indeed more effective against Sith than Light Side force users...
'The Jedi, in devotion to the Force, becomes a conduit for channelling the Dark Side back at itself without internalizing or adding to its power'
It is adapted to deflect Dark Side force back against the opponent. You are correct that it uses the users inner darkness, but is also just as much uses the opponents darkness against them, therefore it is strong against Sith as they have Dark Side energy to deflect back...
I see where your coming from and are mostly correct, but for some reason you fail to acknowledge that it also deflects the opponents darkness against them
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
A further quote from the same book, which is also evidence that Vapaad is indeed more effective against Sith than Light Side force users...
'The Jedi, in devotion to the Force, becomes a conduit for channelling the Dark Side back at itself without internalizing or adding to its power'
It is adapted to deflect Dark Side force back against the opponent. You are correct that it uses the users inner darkness, but is also just as much uses the opponents darkness against them, therefore it is strong against Sith as they have Dark Side energy to deflect back...
I never said it's not effective against sith or anyone, what I'm trying to say is, by description, Vaapad is not anti-darkside or sith, I think Niman also can be very effective against sith, but that does not make it anti-sith either.
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
A further quote from the same book, which is also evidence that Vapaad is indeed more effective against Sith than Light Side force users...
'The Jedi, in devotion to the Force, becomes a conduit for channelling the Dark Side back at itself without internalizing or adding to its power'
It is adapted to deflect Dark Side force back against the opponent. You are correct that it uses the users inner darkness, but is also just as much uses the opponents darkness against them, therefore it is strong against Sith as they have Dark Side energy to deflect back...
I never said it's not effective against sith or anyone, what I'm trying to say is, by description, Vaapad is not anti-darkside or sith, I think Niman also can be very effective against sith, but that does not make it anti-sith either.
I just posted a quote, did you not read it?
It deflects Dark Side back against itself. So it is anti-Dark Side as it does more damage against them by creating a 'conducting loop', than it does vs say Obi-Wan (Light Side), as he has no dark side to deflect back.
So as a form which deflects dark side energy back against the originator, it makes sense for Mace Windu to have bonuses against Sith, as they project Dark Side energy. Which Vapaad is designed to harness and use against the originator of the dark side energy, which in this case is a Sith... A DARK SIDE user.
The inner darkness of the user is just one half of the conducting loop, harnessing the opponents darkness amplifies it and makes it more powerful. Therefore the user is more powerful when facing an opponent who uses the dark side... i.e. Sith
He's definitely top of the list for a rework. I floated this idea a while ago.
Invincible Assault - deal physical damage to the target enemy. If above 50% health, this attack does 50% more damage. If below 50% health, Mace recovers 75% of the damage dealt to his health, and restores 10% of his max protection.
Smite - deal special damage to target enemy and remove all positive status effects on them. This attack cannot be avoided or resisted. For each effect removed, increase damage by 10%.
Vapaad - Galactic Republic allies gain 30% offense and 20% critical chance, and recover 5% of their health when they land a critical hit. Zeta: All Jedi allies have a 45% chance to expose a random enemy. This effect cannot be resisted.
Shatterpoint - Mace has a 50% chance to expose the entire enemy team at the beginning of his turn. This effect cannot be resisted. For the remainder of his turn, he gains offense up and advantage. Any attack he launches cannot be avoided or resisted, and ignores taunt or stealth. Mace gains 50% TM when he attacks an enemy exposed in this way, and 25% for attacking an enemy exposed in any other way.
I like these ideas, but something that has always irritates me about Mace Windu is that he has no Anti-Sith abilities. I think Vapaad should be an anti-dark-side uniqur (I mean that's what Vapaad is) Some ideas:
- Windu has counter chance against Sith enemies
- When Windu survives an attack from a dark side user he gains turn meter and his next attack deals some percent more damage (this could be the answer to Maul's passive giving him excessive damage against Jedi)
-
Vaapad has nothing to do against Sith in particular, it's an aggressive form, closer to Sith in combat, not the other way around.
"I created Vaapad to answer my weakness: it channels my own darkness into a weapon of the light." - Mace Windu
Vaapad specifically draws strength from the Dark Side. It channels the user's inner darkness as well as their opponent's strength /fury into power for the user.
Yes, I completely agree with that, that's what I was trying to say, I don't understand why people are trying make it an anti-sith form. Also Windu used Force Crush in Clone Wars animated movie, he uses the dark side of the force, which does not make it anti-dark side or sith, Makes it closer to sith.
I think we fundamentally agree... I get that Windu's abilities are similar to Sith, but in regard to Vaapad, it is effective at channeling dark side energy and turning it to a weapon of the light. Which means that if your opponent is using the dark side, you can draw more power from their energy than you could if your opponent was using only light side energy. I'm just going to leave this quote from the wiki because it is what I am basing my ideas for the Vaapad unique on: "The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent."
So it seems that the more powerful in the dark your opponent is, the more powerful your use of Vaapad becomes.
Well I agree in general, but as you stated above, Vaapad uses the inner darkness of the user, not the opponent's, so I don't see anything anti-darkside or anti sith. And also In the Clone Wars comics (I guess they were official) Master Sora Bulq, the other Vaapad master, was fallen to the dark side, so it draws to user to dark side.
Amateurs evening i see.
Vaapad was formed round two stepping stones: 1) accepting the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, 2) the other half being the power of darkness inherent in their opponent. It is very well laid out in the The essential guide to the Force - Jedi vs Sith
Is amateur supposed to be an insult? What are you? Professional? Gaining money from light-saber form instructions? Vaapad has nothing to do against sith, WIndu and Bulq were not even aware sith still existed while creating the form based on Juyo. The only reason people are asking this may be because they want to deal more damage to sith in this game. And it's a pathetic attempt.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
A further quote from the same book, which is also evidence that Vapaad is indeed more effective against Sith than Light Side force users...
'The Jedi, in devotion to the Force, becomes a conduit for channelling the Dark Side back at itself without internalizing or adding to its power'
It is adapted to deflect Dark Side force back against the opponent. You are correct that it uses the users inner darkness, but is also just as much uses the opponents darkness against them, therefore it is strong against Sith as they have Dark Side energy to deflect back...
I never said it's not effective against sith or anyone, what I'm trying to say is, by description, Vaapad is not anti-darkside or sith, I think Niman also can be very effective against sith, but that does not make it anti-sith either.
I just posted a quote, did you not read it?
It deflects Dark Side back against itself. So it is anti-Dark Side as it does more damage against them by creating a 'conducting loop', than it does vs say Obi-Wan (Light Side), as he has no dark side to deflect back.
So as a form which deflects dark side energy back against the originator, it makes sense for Mace Windu to have bonuses against Sith, as they project Dark Side energy. Which Vapaad is designed to harness and use against the originator of the dark side energy, which in this case is a Sith... A DARK SIDE user.
The inner darkness of the user is just one half of the conducting loop, harnessing the opponents darkness amplifies it and makes it more powerful...
Yes, it's effective against a dark side user, no one can deny it, it's aggressive nature can match a sith in combat, but imho, that's not because it's anti dark-side, but because it's closer to it, Windu also used Force Crush against Grievous, he uses the dark side of the force against his opponents to match their aggression. That's what I'm trying to say, Vaapad design in the game should grant Windu and Jedi deal more damage, gain TM and extra attacks, but not just to sith in particular, in general. That's all I'm trying to say.
Replies
Health: 22.398
Protection: 26.192
Speed: 140
Health Steal: %15
Physical Damage: 2.300
Special Damage: 4.000
1. Invincible Assault - basic:
Deal Physical damage to target enemy. Mace Windu has %50 chance to stagger the target (can't be resisted) enemy on critical hit .
2. Smite - special (4 turn cooldown)
Deal Special damage to all enemies and remove all positive status effects from enemies, then grants critical chance up to all allies.
3. Furious head - leader
Jedi Allies gain +25% offense, +15% critical chance. In addition Jedi allies gain %5 offense until the end of battle or Mace Windu is defeated when they score a critical hit.
4. Vaapad - unique
Mace Windu has %15 chance to evade an attack (This chance is doubled against Sith). Whenever Mace Windu evades an attack he has %50 chance to counter with %50 increased damage.
Zeta: Mace Windu has %100 counter chance when he evades an attack. In addition Mace Windu's attacks against Sith can't be evaded and deals double damage.
‘Vaapad was described as more than a fighting style; it was a state of mind that led through the penumbra of the dark side, requiring the user to enjoy the fight, and relish the satisfaction of winning. The practitioner of Vaapad would accept the fury of their opponent, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
- Jedi v Sith, The Essential Guide to the Force
DJ Ravean is absolutely correct. Vapaad is EQUALLY as much about deriving combative strength and power from the darkness of the user as it is the opponent. This quote, from a published Star Wars Source which considers the nature of a number of lightsaber forms IN DEPTH, indeed states that the user forms only ONE part of a conducting loop and that the other half is ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent’
Sith use their darkness, rage and hatred to fuel their own power, and Vapaad can and does, as evidenced by the quote, use the opponents rage to fuel their power.
I will repeat the quote again:
‘…accept the fury of their OPPONENT, transforming themselves into one half of a superconducting loop, with the other half being the power of darkness inherent in the OPPONENT’
Furthermore, the same book acknowledges that:
‘In order to combat Sidious' furious technique, Windu gave himself completely over to Vaapad. He allowed it to fully channel his own inner darkness, as well as accepting and USING THE DARKNESS OF SIDIOUS AGAINST HIM’
Henceforth, as stated by an official source, which I’m sure in your arrogance you will deny, Vapaad does use the darkness of the enemy, and is therefore perfectly adapted to be anti-Sith by looping their darkness back against them as their rage only makes the Vapaad user stronger, and a Siths power is derived from darkness and hate
I implore you therefore, to please research and consider your responses and stop misinforming people with your unsubstantiated nonsense. Also please refrain from calling people ‘pathetic’ as they are perfectly well founded in their reasoning…
Vapaad does indeed combat Sith by allowing the user to use ‘the power of darkness inherent in the opponent to fuel their own power’. And this isn’t just some rudely stated nonsense like yours was towards DJRavean, this is from an Official AND Published Star Wars source
So it does make sense that Vapaad is anti-Sith because it is, so people are not ‘pathetic’for incorporating this into Mace Windus design.
For further information, please also read the Revenge of the Sith novelisation, which describes in depth Mace Windu using Vapaad to harness Sidious’s inner darkness and turn it into his own offensive power.
'Sidious' own fury was used and redirected by Windu via the use of Vaapad'
Vapaad is unequivocally anti-Sith as it reverts an opponents fury, darkness and hate against themselves. And as I'm sure your aware, a Sith is inherently powered by darkness and hate
I just say two things in all this, which really proves the level of understanding, about the comment which included "pathetic attempt", there, pathetic is an adjective describing the attempt, it does not mean an "attempt of pathetic people" as you misunderstand. Grammar helps in a conversation, some may try to learn it. As for Vaapad, anyone is free to make any assumptions, but one thing is clear, it is not ever described as anti-sith anywhere. By your example about Sidious, you may consider also Windu was very effective against Jango, but that does not make his style anti-bountyhunter. It's just a proof that he uses an aggressive technique, which Yoda describes as dangerous to the user as well as the opponent, because it draws to the darkside, giving in to the rage and aggression of the opponent is not anti-darkside, it's what Palpatine and Vader wanted exactly from Luke, and they did not want it because it would give him an advantage against the dark side.
A further quote from the same book, which is also evidence that Vapaad is indeed more effective against Sith than Light Side force users...
'The Jedi, in devotion to the Force, becomes a conduit for channelling the Dark Side back at itself without internalizing or adding to its power'
It is adapted to deflect Dark Side force back against the opponent. You are correct that it uses the users inner darkness, but is also just as much uses the opponents darkness against them, therefore it is strong against Sith as they have Dark Side energy to deflect back...
I see where your coming from and are mostly correct, but for some reason you fail to acknowledge that it also deflects the opponents darkness against them
'Sidious' own fury was used and redirected by Windu via the use of Vaapad'
It loops an opponents inner darkness against them. Therefore is inherently anti-Sith, as the Sith are fuelled by fury and darkness
I never said it's not effective against sith or anyone, what I'm trying to say is, by description, Vaapad is not anti-darkside or sith, I think Niman also can be very effective against sith, but that does not make it anti-sith either.
I just posted a quote, did you not read it?
It deflects Dark Side back against itself. So it is anti-Dark Side as it does more damage against them by creating a 'conducting loop', than it does vs say Obi-Wan (Light Side), as he has no dark side to deflect back.
So as a form which deflects dark side energy back against the originator, it makes sense for Mace Windu to have bonuses against Sith, as they project Dark Side energy. Which Vapaad is designed to harness and use against the originator of the dark side energy, which in this case is a Sith... A DARK SIDE user.
The inner darkness of the user is just one half of the conducting loop, harnessing the opponents darkness amplifies it and makes it more powerful. Therefore the user is more powerful when facing an opponent who uses the dark side... i.e. Sith
Yes, it's effective against a dark side user, no one can deny it, it's aggressive nature can match a sith in combat, but imho, that's not because it's anti dark-side, but because it's closer to it, Windu also used Force Crush against Grievous, he uses the dark side of the force against his opponents to match their aggression. That's what I'm trying to say, Vaapad design in the game should grant Windu and Jedi deal more damage, gain TM and extra attacks, but not just to sith in particular, in general. That's all I'm trying to say.