I Love The New Stuff - But Give Us a Breather

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ScummerAntilles
37 posts Member
edited October 2017
I really appreciate what you all have been doing.

I want to say that as much panic farming and spending pressure that's been put out, there also has been care to reward more senior players and make investments of time and energy pay off.

Making it worthwhile to farm phoenix by providing multiple benefits for doing so was great.

And I really like TB because of the way it requires coordination. Whether or not it could be improved is another topic, but providing rewards and incentives for guilds to work together and strategize rather than just produce tickets and complete raids is definitely moving in the right direction.

And I know that you have heard this a lot already, but even players like me who overall like what's been happening feel a breaking point coming.

Please keep the following suggestions in mind to avoid that breaking point as you balance your financial goals with maintaining a happy customer base:

1. Don't require separatists and GG for Talzin. I get it, the separatists killed her. But for canon purists Talzin was shown as overseeing initiations and training of night sisters. Do this one yoda style. We all expected that with the announcement of dark side territory battles that GG would be important, whether for platooning or a special mission. And I definitely think players that have him should be rewarded, not only with a special event but with a rework of the character. But either create a different event with more advanced notice or provide GG rewards in TB or both. It will still be a hard slog, requiring spending, for most players to 7* GG even if players start actively farming him now. The whales will still get their reward, but most people don't have GG for a reason: for the last year he hasn't been a valuable toon to farm while also being the toon that costs the most to farm. Rework him so that it's not just a "gotcha, guess you should have farmed a low value toon" and incentivize people to farm him based on his own merit and the need to have rare toons for TB. Again, the people who already have him will still be disproportionately (which means in this case, fairly) rewarded for having already sacrificed to get him.

Many of us took the choice of Talia as October's character a signal that the inevitable Talzin would require night sisters. For those of us following the game and playing more religiously, the level of misdirection in going outside of night sisters - especially if GG is required - would rise to the level of an insult. Don't do things that seem like dropping clues but are just misdirections. The issue is not that giving us Talia shards isn't helpful for a NS team for whoever ends up picking Talzin, the issue is whether clues are clues or just misdirections that sabotage people's decision to spend resources strategically.

2. Don't release DS TB before the new year. I know that many players want to use their DS roster. If you're going to keep doing events, weigh them heavily for the dark side and reward and keep DS players interested that way. Continue to release more DS toons to the extent you release new toons. Focus on more DS reworks to the extent you rework toons. But don't disrupt the rhythm people are just beginning to find. GIve us a more specific timeline like "no sooner than." At this moment, most players have just adjusted to a TB routine. They are able to reliably predict what kind of loot they are going to get and make plans for their rosters: how much gets reinvested in light side TB, how much goes to arena, GW, long-term farms, etc. Give us a chance to meet our shorter term LS TB goals and start factoring in strengthening and expanding our DS rosters. I promise we will appreciate it. Make ewoks farmable well before DS TB is released. The pressure to get these toons is already high, don't increase that pressure by making them farmable at the same time that the pressure to get multiple strong DS teams is the strongest (DS TB release).

3. In general, just give us a breather. Even those of us who play this game compulsively reach a point where building on past investment no longer outweighs finding hobbies that aren't stressful. Those of us who're a little bit more compulsive are the ones that make this microtransaction model work. Please believe me that as much as I love this game, and am part of that group, that myself and many others like me who appreciate the new changes are also reaching our own breaking point and we're watching carefully to see whether we're going to see more pressure or less. I promise you with less pressure we will still be spending money.

4. Give us more lead-in time about required toons. We understand that exact release dates are not going to come out until the new content is basically perfected. But it is possible to tell us information like which toons are going to be required. Even those of us that bought the new stuff totally see what's going on with the short lead-in times. I can only speak for myself here but if this becomes a regular thing, rather than a special kind of simultaneous cash grab / player reward at the start of LS TB, it is going to be too much.

5. If you are absolutely dead-set on requiring GG now, require him for the marquee night sister toons and not Talzin. Those toons are not going to be farmable soon, they are going to be pay to play toons for at least a while, and GG is a pay to play / collector's toon. The people who will be interested in buying the new toons instead of waiting heavily overlap with people who have GG. Again, we already know and have accepted that there are going to be platooning dynamics in TB that reward pay to play collectors and since they finance the whole thing I think most of us have grudgingly accepted it, especially since we can still get decent rewards in TB without being whales - whales just get a nice cherry on top. Separatists need a rework anyways - don't make this a "gotcha" release by requiring GG and separatists.

Replies

  • That was a lot. So ill just say more carbantis please!
  • Unfortunately, I can all-but guarantee they have already decided what the requirements will be for Talzin.
  • JAYB1RD1177
    33 posts Member
    edited October 2017
    I will just comment that it has been a really long time since I farmed any character by choice. Especially true in Cantina. Since the Phoenix farm I have been panic farming for one event or another. I think I miss making choices.

    I am choosing to set out the nightsisters though. We will see if that is a mistake.
  • I will just comment that it has been a really long time since I farmed any character by choice. Especially true in Cantina. Since the Phoenix farm I have been panic farming for one event or another. I think I miss making choices.

    I am choosing to set out the nightsisters though. We will see if that is a mistake.

    I agree about not being able to choose. In order to be competitive you need the meta. The #1 team right now is CLS, Raid Han, Thrawn, GK, R2.
    That means you need those 5 plus 5 empire, plus 5 phoenix, st han, leia, and old ben.

    The thrawn event is hard enough that you need to put more resources into phoenix than usual. Ive been wanting to work on mods and finn for months. But things keep popping up. And with Gear 12 it seems harder than ever to compete and max out your toons. Especially as a ftp player. And now if i want the best resistance team i also need the first order toons. 1 of which is only on hard nodes with a terrible drop rate!
  • Great post. A breather is a great idea. Particularly from legendary events. It really devalues the idea of a legendary event when they are happening all of the time and being extended to pretty marginal characters like Talzin - who is definitely not legendary by any reasonable definition of the word.
  • ScummerAntilles
    37 posts Member
    edited October 2017
    I don't know about what the devs can or can't do at this point requiring Talzin, especially since they haven't put a firm date on it so that they can maintain flexibility on their end - I just know for the reasons stated above and in the replies, even those of us that really appreciate the new changes do so in the hopes that the recent increase in pressure to acquire more rapidly than in the past was a temporary, brief period associated with TB: a period of hopefully high profit for the game that came with high rewards for players, but not a permanent shift in the way the game is managed.

    I also really love the night sisters outside of the game. I had the NS reasonably farmed prior to the announcement of Talia just for nostalgia purposes, and the conspicuous absence of Talzin has long signaled a legendary event for her. I don't want to start a fandom discussion - I just want to remark that the possibility of Talzin is more exciting to me than a possible Jedi Luke, and I LOVE Jedi Luke. It would be awesome if those of us that invested in a weak faction for purely lore appreciation got rewarded with a character we already love, and those left out were the people who didn't make *that* sacrifice already. Just let me note that Sidious believed Talzin was the only credible threat to the plan of the Sith and stated so in canon!

    It's just too much if night sisters are signaled through Talia after FOTFP signaled FO last month but instead a faction (separatists) that has had little farming incentive is required. Past legendary events involved factions that already had really clear value, and whether you were prepped or not just had to do with what high value factions and toons you had already *chosen* (back to the fun of choice in the game) to farm - those toons weren't as collector-oriented. If this event requires a faction with relatively little farming value that hasn't been signaled until close to release, and requires the toon with the absolute least incentive to farm when costs and benefits are weighed until precisely the time DS TB is announced - and it is a toon most players that don't have him activated likely won't even be able to activate even if DS TB is released next year unless a pack is released - which will inch things a lot closer to the breaking point. There are a lot of people that hadn't thought of farming any but a couple of separatists up until the announcement of DS TB, which just happened, because separatists provide no special benefit outside of DS TB or until a short-notice legendary possibly includes them. There are a lot better ways to manage this event, avoid hitting a breaking point on acquisition pressure, and reward collectors who already have GG and separatists. For Talzin: night sisters were signaled even though they aren't a high incentive faction so at least that's fair, Sith also fought Talzin and Jedi also fought Talzin: there's already reasonable existing incentive to have worked on those factions or acquire them outside of just being a collector and add them into your collection by purchasing packs and redirecting farming and reap additional rewards for them outside of Talzin. If separatists end up being required, at least don't require GG and throw a long-overdue separatist tag on Sidious.

    To require GG on short notice is kind of like an exaggerated form of the dynamic that has already existed over the last couple of months.

    The game has been dramatically changed, many people don't like the change but are adjusting, people like me love the changes, but my really clear sense is that there is a high level of fatigue whether or not players are excited for the future, just sticking it out to see what happens, or wanting to not let go of something they already invested in.


    Post edited by ScummerAntilles on
  • It’s a slap in the face to require GG, otherwise a useless droid, to unlock talzin.

    Knowing how they work (as history has told us) They’ll make him a requirement, release a faction pack and a shard pack for GG. If you want talzin 7 star, and don’t have GG you will have to pay

    VERY upset, talia is the daily login, I figured you would need 5 nightsisters. I’ve been spending crystals on nightsister farming. Couldn’t be more displeased with game mgmt
  • Nope. Grevious rework or else.....
  • Great post. You hit some of my frustrations with the game on the head. You missed a couple though:

    Character Cadence: Clearly a breach of trust here. Leaving Toons behind a paywall while requiring them for TB and Blatantly violating the promised Cadence is inappropriate. I personally won’t be spending a dime until EA/CG learns to tell the truth and follow through.

    Game time requirements: I am not talking when my compulsions force me to check but actual required time is constantly going up. From significantly harder GW (anyone remember when you could auto the first 9), to delays on challenges, and Raids/TB/Events this is really becoming a chore.

    Tone deaf to player base: Not all of us come here and whine incessantly. But honestly, everything is just getting out of hand. Please listen to us and address the issues. This game used to be so fun.
  • Aeternus420
    110 posts Member
    edited October 2017
    Rework Grevious before you listen to any of the prior posts please @GameDevs
  • Tranw is giving up my enjoying time at this Game . So easy before and almost imposible now. Many thx for this time but this things te todo muchas. Have fun sus
  • I don't know about what the devs can or can't do at this point. I just know as somebody who overall really likes the changes I am also fatigued, close to a breaking point, and hoping that the period of intensified acquisition pressure is behind us.

    I also really love the night sisters outside of the game and have been looking forward to Talzin for a long time. I don't want to start a fandom discussion. Talzin is one of my favorite characters in the canon, and while I don't want to divert to a fandom discussion I will just note that canon establishes Sidious believed Talzin was the only credible threat to the Grand Plan of the Sith.

    In terms of the breaking point and the skepticism that players have about the direction of the game, I feel as though going Separatist/GG would be kind of a confirmation of the exaggerated critiques of the devs. Again, in my humble opinion some critiques have been overstated. While the cost/benefit of not following the dev path has made it almost a requirement to follow, it has not all been negative incentives - and I really do appreciate that it's a lot of carrots and not just sticks. But the issue of misdirection through signaling, and not rewarding players who farmed the NS faction previously when the only incentive to do so was because you are a fan of them, and then requiring toons that are actually at odds with the format for past legendaries is too much.

    I disagree that the past legendary events are in line with the possibility of separatist/GG requirement for this one. Having Jedi and Rebels was useful prior to, during, and after the Palpatine and Yoda events - especially earlier on in the game. Legendary events had a synergy with useful toons, and how quickly you got them actually went back to the point that was made in this thread about choices. You have multiple strong, useful toons and factions in the game and depending on which one you decided to prioritize a legendary event might reward you. If you had prioritized another useful faction, you had the choice of waiting, redirecting your farming, or skipping ahead through purchases. Phoenix may have had some short notice but they were useful even if they weren't some arena meta that could unseat top 10 players. Most players will never come close to the top 10 in their shard, that is kind of the whole idea of a competitive ranking system, and I actually think the expectation that any given faction or toon should be an arena gamechanger is unreasonable as much as I'd like to see more viable and creative combinations work well. Separatists and GG are not on the same level of usefulness as other toons required to 7* an event toon, aside from a couple of toons, as any prior faction that a legendary required. STH and Leia were useful toons outside of the top 50 of arena shards prior to their rework, and Old Ben used to be - so senior players simply got a bonus. Going with separatists rather than any of the other lore-acceptable factions (Jedi or Sith) that have a really clear value in other parts of the game, or the one that was signaled (Night Sisters), to me, is actually a shift further away from a choice model that has made legendaries fun and exciting in terms of farming choices rather than "more of the same." The biggest incentive anyone has had to acquire GG and separatists for a very long time came recently in the announcement of Dark Side TB, knowing now the premium that platoons place on large collections. Even though it would still be a misdirection through signaling that cost people resources they might have put into poggle or B2, just doing separatists without GG and throwing the long overdue separatist tag on sidious would at least conform more to the legendary model up to this point (reminder: all Separatist high command reported to Sidious and they all understood him as their leader - not just Dooku).

    The game has been dramatically changed, many people don't like the change but are adjusting, people like me love the changes, but my really clear sense is that there is a high level of fatigue whether or not players are excited for the future, just sticking it out to see what happens, or wanting to not let go of something they already invested in.
  • JaggedJ
    1253 posts Member
    There are 10 separatists. If it must be separatists then we should be able to pick any 5 we want. As someone who has a 7* GG, even I think needing a 7* GG would be a disastrous requirement.
  • GG required has already been confirmed.
  • GG required has already been confirmed.

    Yeah people keep saying that and yet there's no actual link or source, and when people ask for it there's no response until the next time somebody wants to say it's confirmed. If the devs are "officially unofficially" leaking stuff you should be able to point to where, other than some other post where somebody claims it's confirmed.
  • The only reason the request for a breather resonates with so many (including me) is simply because of the gear and zeta crunch. If players had the ability to generate resources commensurate with the release of new toons, we wouldn't be requesting a breather, we would be saying, "Woohoo! This is so awesome! Mother Talzin is being released, good thing I have 10 zeta mats rolling in this week and enough gear to make my Nightsisters competitive!"

    The request for a breather is only based on the devs currently starving everyone of resources. Obviously, the point is to make people spend $$ to keep up. The game is free to play, but the point of the game is to make money. But is the balance of F2P and P2P in this game out of whack and off balance? Probably. Not sure what the solution is, as access to more resources could lower the profitability. As much as a breather sounds nice to me, I'd rather just have more resources and no breather! I love all the new toons and new content coming out, I just want the resources to keep up!
  • gflegui wrote: »
    GG is confirmed! Just because the tears spread across the galaxy! The devs now know how much money they will made because no one took the time to farm the toon eventhough he has being farmable for a very long time!
    Here is Kozi's answer.
    Where it is mentioned we require GG
    Hiya!
    I was going to save this for monday, but wanted to stave off what appears to be a rather odd bandwagon!
    There has been no mention of character requirements. And if there has, I'm fairly certain its speculative because all that's been revealed are the Nightsisters today. Or friday- pretty sure I'm bleeding into saturday as of this posting.
    Enjoy the weekend you guys. We'll have more info for you next week.


  • They know exactly what will be required and the nature of the event. So why the pretence from them? Although that they are not saying yet should hardly surprise anyone.
    Expect to see Nightsisters packs in the store very soon.
  • We want more!!!!!
  • DarthGazza wrote: »
    We want more!!!!!

    Yeah more snowtrooper in TB !!!!
  • GG rework wont happen now
    and as for everything else....bring it on
    the more the merrier
  • Atlas1
    1709 posts Member
    Nah. I love a steady stream of content. I hate feeling like I'm waiting for the next thing to drop. I play more than ever trying to keep the pace. Panic farming is fun and no, I'm not being sarcastic.
  • GG required has already been confirmed.

    No that’s not the case now quit it!

    For the latest ship pack you could’ve bought 3 or 4 decent PS4 games, the devs need to get a grip here.

    Of course people will spend, but they’ll spend more if you price reasonably. So why not drop your pack prices and reach out to more people.

  • I will just comment that it has been a really long time since I farmed any character by choice. Especially true in Cantina. Since the Phoenix farm I have been panic farming for one event or another. I think I miss making choices.
    This....and it's WAI. By requiring unused or otherwise useless character to unlock characters you want or need, CG virtually guarantees a seemingly never-ending cycle of "panic and packs" to keep money coming in.

    If you had a choice in who to farm, that would imply that you didn't feel the need to farm someone specific for fear of "missing out". Heck, there are guilds who are telling members to farm Lobot and whales to focus on Paploo fir TB platoons.

    As I said, feeling "behind" is completely working as intended.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: DeathStarVentDesigners - DVD for short.
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • GG required has already been confirmed.

    For the latest ship pack you could’ve bought 3 or 4 decent PS4 games, the devs need to get a grip here.

    Of course people will spend, but they’ll spend more if you price reasonably. So why not drop your pack prices and reach out to more people.

    Couldn't agree more. I would consider myself a dolphin, heck even a narwhal but the value of the packs over the past month or two just don't seem to be worth the cost. As such the wallet has been closed. $70 for a pack of ships where you don't get enough shards to get any ships?!? Character packs where there are not enough shards to even get 1/4 of a star unless you drop $100. The sales and devs really need to come together and consider the value otherwise more and more of us mid-range spenders will stop spending. When that happens, whales alone cannot keep a game afloat.
  • About the money and micro transations , I pre-order battlefront 2 during beta, if they mess up with that loot box thing, at least I can play a new single player story lol.
  • jwoah
    209 posts Member
    I think you started to stray a little too much into GG being required for NS, which isn’t confirmed at all. I do agree though, especially for more FTP players (I have been since the 21 day crystal booster was removed), could use a little bit of a break from the constant new releases.

    I’ve read on these forums about how a lot of people, me included, have only been farming legendary/TB specific toons since Phoenix was required for thrawn, with some tacking on an extra month farming for R2. That’s 3-4 months of farming specific characters whose main, some their only, use will be unlocking one more powerful toon.

    Mother Talzin’s kit looks really awesome, and with a DS TB on the horizon, I’m gonna need to start building up these DS squads to best benefit my guild. My DS galactic power is almost half the size of my LS galactic power, so it doesn’t help that the special mission requirements for the DS TB are a mystery. If it’s NS and FO (going only off login toons), they will both become huge priorities for people who want to boost theirs and their guild mate’s token intake ASAP (platoons requirements and special missions will most likely be more than just empire since they don’t have the numbers like rebels do). An empire base (like rebels for hoth) seems most likely since it’s the largest DS faction, but I’m just speculating.

    I would love to have some time to finish up finn (1/100) and then begin some heavy mod farming, but too many legendary characters have forced me to put that on the back burner. I already slacked on thrawn (Hera is only 6*), my old Ben is 20/100, and I had just gotten CHS to 5* before I began going all in on to finish Ben. Even before that I was farming TFP for the R2 event. I got to skip Kyle since he’s already maxed for me, but not everyone farmed him early like I did. It felt like I was actually catching up, but now Mother Talzin looks like the next must need toon. Since talia is my only unlocked NS, if I want to 7* Talzin, another 310 shards using that same cantina energy will be needed for nightsister acolyte. That’s roughly 3 more weeks of farming a toon whose only use will be for MT. Yes it’s my choice on who I want and don’t want to farm, but her kit looks looks very versatile, maybe even arena worthy, so if I’m not actively pursuing her, I could be missing out on hundreds of gems depending on how much she can help.

    I’d rather the next few toons added to be solely through marquee events; I don’t want to be forced to again farm and gear a full faction just to unlock 1 toon. Farming a whole team to 7*, sometimes from scratch, takes a lot of time and resources to accomplish. The legendaries released this year need their own teams from factions with less variety needed for the first 2; Those even got to rotate bimonthly for nearly a year before more legendaries were added, and this time 4 in 5 months have been added. Two of those factions only even have 5 toons, so there’s no variety between players, those are the 5 you need to farm. I don’t want to speak for everyone, but I would be happy if there were no character releases in November. Why not prepare for the new movie with a nice QOL update instead? We could definitely use one; it’s a win-win for your players, a month to catch up without new “distracting” toons sounds great right now. Ive farmed half of the store’s toons to max and instead of having to add another toon to each store’s queue, converting some to shard shop currency so I can actually gear these toons would be nice. I have enough weak G7 toons; G9 is starting the become the base gear needed to really have some use.

    Ships are now uber important as well. I worked on them a lot before, so I’m able to push top 10 almost daily. Fleet arena is now my best source for more daily gems(amazing change btw), so it’s my highest priority. I began gearing some toons exclusively to boost their ship power, so resources are stretched pretty thin. The extra daily gems are amazing for that; I can now spend 350 crystals a day for refreshes instead of only 250 previously, and it continues to builds a stockpile, especially if I push for top 5.

    TLDR; Give everyone some time from the recent panic farming meta that has been with us since June/July. Let some of the people who are only able to spend $10 or $20 per month catch up a bit. I think it would be widely appreciated from the majority of players, especially if some major QOL issues were fixed in its place. Better public relations is always good for business, especially to retaining current customers; The more people that play, and don’t quit, can be considered free advertising. You never know how many people someone might tell about and a glowing “word of mouth” from someone you know is the best way to get the new players to stay (one of those players might even be that whale looking for a new game to use his money).

    PS: Wow, I’m sorry for all the text, I have a lot of input on this topic. Saying all this about characters though, it’s the opposite with ships. I welcome the addition of more ships; I hope that with these high end arena ship reward changes, more focus is put on ships in general. There are still so few ships currently in game and the arena is a bit stale since there’s so little versatility. I’m excited for in a couple months, we’ll start seeing the previously unfarmable ships pop up in arena. Its gonna be fun finally learning some new tactics to best these ships (especially the Falcon, the kit looks beastly). Thank you devs and mods, reading the constant threads about these ships; Hell ive written a post asking if they’ll ever get released. Finally though, yes these 4 ships were technically in the game already, but making them farmable was, IMO, a better decision than if 4 other ships were added instead. Now the cadence isnt backlogged and can more easily be applied to all new releases. No more of the limbo ship questions riddling the forum, as all non legendary ships and toons will follow that 6-8 week release schedule.
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