My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
Then I suggest they get real accounts, join real guilds and experience it for.themselves from a real player's perspective.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
Oh wow. So this is the player experience they want and were expecting? Fracturing of international guilds, nightmare scheduling and coordination, and a reward pool that is underwhelming and not flat at all with the relic material? Glad to know that they don’t care about player experience if the above is their intended goal.
Oh man talk about making it easy for me to never spend on this game again lmao. If this is how the devs want the player experience to be, they don’t deserve money from anyone at this point.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
Oh wow. So this is the player experience they want and were expecting? Fracturing of international guilds, nightmare scheduling and coordination, and a reward pool that is underwhelming and not flat at all with the relic material? Glad to know that they don’t care about player experience if the above is their intended goal.
Oh man talk about making it easy for me to never spend on this game again lmao. If this is how the devs want the player experience to be, they don’t deserve money from anyone at this point.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Paragraph 1: the player experience is quite negative for various reasons outlined throughout this thread. If they don’t know this, then what is going on? No change is ignoring our stated experience, thus monitoring is ineffective.
Paragraph 2: true, new guild events often make guilds adjust, however the coordination is new and one of the larger complaints. This isn’t an HSTR. This guild experience should be taken into account though IMO.
Paragraph 3: that is unfortunate to hear as most dislike the coordination and rewards. Difficulty could be increased to offset removing the coordination mechanic IMO so no complaint on difficulty.
Paragraph 4: how can they monitor this outside of completion rate? 3rd party apps and multiple devices are used in order to coordinate. If the tools existed in game to not need AP mode etc. then perhaps it could be a better experience. However, from this thread most guilds completing this raid still dislike the required coordination and reward pool/ratio.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Paragraph 1: the player experience is quite negative for various reasons outlined throughout this thread. If they don’t know this, then what is going on? No change is ignoring our stated experience, thus monitoring is ineffective.
Paragraph 2: true, new guild events often make guilds adjust, however the coordination is new and one of the larger complaints. This isn’t an HSTR. This guild experience should be taken into account though IMO.
Paragraph 3: that is unfortunate to hear as most dislike the coordination and rewards. Difficulty could be increased to offset removing the coordination mechanic IMO so no complaint on difficulty.
Paragraph 4: how can they monitor this outside of completion rate? 3rd party apps and multiple devices are used in order to coordinate. If the tools existed in game to not need AP mode etc. then perhaps it could be a better experience. However, from this thread most guilds completing this raid still dislike the required coordination and reward pool/ratio.
1 - monitoring can take time, especially on a low frequency event, with a low sample size of players involved. No change immediately doesnt mean it's being ignored, as monitoring is necessary to not make unnecessary or possibly "damaging changes" as the sample size increases.
2 - correct it is new and being monitored, and all factors are being taken into consideration.
3 - yes many have stated the difficulty is not the issue, the coordination seems to be a level above what anyone would expect/want from this game.
4 - feedback from the players, and other data points exist in game.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
Oh wow. So this is the player experience they want and were expecting? Fracturing of international guilds, nightmare scheduling and coordination, and a reward pool that is underwhelming and not flat at all with the relic material? Glad to know that they don’t care about player experience if the above is their intended goal.
Oh man talk about making it easy for me to never spend on this game again lmao. If this is how the devs want the player experience to be, they don’t deserve money from anyone at this point.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Everyone completing the raid still doesn't enjoy it (2/4 with my guild and I've been first and second and definitely don't enjoy it) so I'd say the player experience with raid isn't great at the moment.
The rewards are also a big issue and to state they are "what is expected" is a joke. To beat the raid people have been asked to hold off using a squad where it most beneficial to help the guild (a sacrifice). I know you can say, "well move to a stronger guild" but then it's the same issue where a guild could have 50 people getting 20mil+ and get 1 r8 piece. How is that fair? How is asking my people to sacrifice there best runs fair?
The coordination is an issue as well since this is a world wide game and CG know (since you just stated it) coordination is needed but do they understand that there are different time zones??
Your response (though it may just be conveying what they believe) is just plain wrong and adds to the frustration of the community.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
You said everything is in line with what they were expecting. You said that they have no changes planned for the rewards or the raid itself. That they are however keeping an eye on things based on player experience.
There’s no other way to read that. It’s not misinterpreted.
CG is ok with guilds needing levels of coordination never needed before.
CG is ok with requiring exponentially more work on guild officer’s part, demanding the use of 3rd party apps (which they’ve even frowned upon and banned people for).
CG is ok with players being forced to use airplane mode tying their phone up and waiting around for anywhere from a half hour to two hours to turn in a single damage run.
CG is ok with a reward pool that rewards G5 gear for this type of “end game content” that demands a minimum of R5 to even have a character be able to be used.
CG is ok with a steep drop off in the amount of their “raid exclusive” R8 material pieces rewarded. I use quotes because when you sell something day one of its release, it’s not exclusive to the raid.
CG is ok with guilds being forced to break up due to time zone differences. This isn’t HAAT, or HSTR where smaller guilds broke off because of the damage and difficulty. This is totally unrelated as there are hundreds of responses on here saying the difficulty is not what’s ruining guilds but the coordination and time zone differences.
Sorry Kyno but you and CG are wrong in this. This is not what we the players want, and if CG is ok with that, then they don’t know what their players want or the inner workings of their own game.
Our guild doesn’t even bother...we are 260 million gp guild. obviously, it is our choice and we can more than likely make it to Phase 4 with no issue. It is that no one has the time, patience and cares for this content. No one wants to coordinate and airplane mode is terrible. We are all resigned to say oh well...especially with the reward structure they way it is. We all joke it is another swing and miss by the developers...which, let’s be honest, have had a pretty low battling average over the last few years. Creativity is gone...new content is jumbled old content that is refurbished. People just play a bit then go off to play other mobile games. We just do not have enough “addicts” in our guild to make the difference.
Ravens, You and many of us hope and wish they cared. CG does not...player experience is probably fifth on their list of priorities. 1) money, 2) more money 3) even more money 4) little to no effort and 5) player experience. The longer the game is around the further down player experience goes.
How do you know this? That corporate sounding statement that Doja posted a few weeks ago conveniently did not even address or acknowledge any of our concerns about the coordination required, which makes it clear to me that they're happy to ignore it
When is the last Qol update? Two years ago...maybe three...that is all you need to know.
I believe back in Feb 2019. They claim there will be some this year but I’m not holding my breath on anything they say anymore. Everything they say is tongue in cheek to me at this point.
When they actually listen to their players for a prolonged period of time, I’ll change my stance. As of now they’ve done nothing to even come close to convincing me otherwise
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie
In game guild: TNR Uprising I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
The player experience is horrible for this raid... no one is complaining about the difficulty. In fact would be happy for you to raise the difficulty if you were to address all the other issues everyone has posted on this thread
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Did CG authorize you to speak on this or is this just your impression? Why can't the community managers step in and make an official statement?
I wonder what the beta testers feedback was on this raid, if it was even beta tested. If it was, and we have been told there is indeed beta testers, I am willing to bet that they brought this issue up to CG’s attention and they went ahead with it anyway, so that tells you all you need to know about how CG cares about the player experience.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
When there is a bug that benefits the players, it seems things get simple and straightforward in a matter of hours. Amazing.
In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie
In game guild: TNR Uprising I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Kyno, there’s a massive difference between some guilds choosing to coordinate a TW push and a raid forcing guilds into that level of coordination to participate.
Also, hstr originally forced a level of coordination in many guilds, ensuring eg. that several players didn’t enter end of phase at the same time, to avoid wasting a squad if someone else was finishing the phase.
The level of coordination mandated here is new.
Pretending otherwise is stubbornness.
Regarding changing guilds, all agree that this happens with new content. The norm however is that changes happen to find players of equal strength and ambition.
This time, it happens because players of equal strength and ambition go their separate ways to find players in similar time zone.
And yes, CG might be listening. But the horrible canned response Doja was allowed to post doesn’t really leave that impression.
In that response none of the concerns raised by the majority of people in this thread were addressed.
It was written/edited by someone who does not listen or at least doesn’t understand the points raised.
Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Again, how do you know this? As far as I'm aware, the only thing they've said about the raid since it's release is that corporate statement Doja posted that said a whole lot of nothing while completely ignoring any of the feedback around the level of coordination required.
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that a hypothetical change would take time. It's the complete lack of acknowledgement combined with a history of CG only caring about "player engagement" and not player experience that frustrates me.
Remember back when relics were released, and there was an overwhelmingly negative response? But apparently, according to CG, it was all good because we were engaging with relics after they were released. Well obviously we needed to engage with relics, otherwise we'd fall behind everyone else! So I'm fully expecting that nothing will change with this raid because people will continue to "engage" with it to get relic 8 materials and avoid falling behind, and that's good enough for the devs.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Asking people to make a push on totally separate attacks for a few minutes is not the same as having to hold damage for up to two hours, with your phone on airplane mode and hope it doesn’t crash if you dare back out of the app, thus ruining your run and potentially the whole raid run.
Not to mention G5 gear in the reward pool lol. I thought blue tank gear as a reward from HSTR was bad, imagine getting mk7 armor mod salvage lol...
Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Again, how do you know this? As far as I'm aware, the only thing they've said about the raid since it's release is that corporate statement Doja posted that said a whole lot of nothing while completely ignoring any of the feedback around the level of coordination required.
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that a hypothetical change would take time. It's the complete lack of acknowledgement combined with a history of CG only caring about "player engagement" and not player experience that frustrates me.
Remember back when relics were released, and there was an overwhelmingly negative response? But apparently, according to CG, it was all good because we were engaging with relics after they were released. Well obviously we needed to engage with relics, otherwise we'd fall behind everyone else! So I'm fully expecting that nothing will change with this raid because people will continue to "engage" with it to get relic 8 materials and avoid falling behind, and that's good enough for the devs.
Most of my comments on topics like this are a culmination of posts here, conversations with them, and history of what has happened in game.
They will always take time to look at and discuss where things are in soft issues, and that will take more time than hard issues like bugs ( @Nikoms565 ). Yes things do not always change, but that doesnt mean it cant and ot doesnt mean they are not weighing things like player experience and feedback when they are discussing points.
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
My only issues is the co-ordination required and the reward pool which is unaddressed, and keeps getting dismissed
I wish we had much better tools in-game for co-ordination if they are going to keep the stacking thresholds (like damage isn't posted until X time and you can submit your run whenever you want) rather than using third party apps for management. Doesn't really make sense to require 50 players to attack at the same time without providing the tools to do so within the game
Reward pool is pretty bad for a lot of reasons and we haven't had any response to that
EDIT: My guild completes the raid in 40 minutes, I'm just concerned for the larger playerbase regarding the co-ordination aspect, and future raids. And its pretty annoying to remain active on discord constantly for updates on when its ok to post damage
CG_Doja_Fett
Would you mind sending this one up the tree? This is what we’ve been saying for several weeks now.
Everything is in line with what they were expecting.
They are keeping an eye on what's going on with a mindset of " Is this the player experience they want".
There are currently no planned changes to the raid or rewards table at this moment.
So the "player experience they want" is to wreck multi-national guilds, force people to play in airplane mode, tie up their phone for half an hour+, communicate via 3rd party apps, have access to two devices, create scheduling nightmares for guild officers, increase guild friction, have players spend more time coordinating and scheduling than actually playing the game, etc.?
So the "fun" for getting to end-game content is a scheduling nightmare that's a huge time suck for minimal rewards?
This is all WAI? Alright then. Good to know.
????
No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Asking people to make a push on totally separate attacks for a few minutes is not the same as having to hold damage for up to two hours, with your phone on airplane mode and hope it doesn’t crash if you dare back out of the app, thus ruining your run and potentially the whole raid run.
Not to mention G5 gear in the reward pool lol. I thought blue tank gear as a reward from HSTR was bad, imagine getting mk7 armor mod salvage lol...
I didnt say it was, I was replying to the point of having X number of players online at the same time, and yes even for roughly an hour.
And as i said i wasn't comparing that actions, I was responding to having people logged in at a certain time.
Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
Again, how do you know this? As far as I'm aware, the only thing they've said about the raid since it's release is that corporate statement Doja posted that said a whole lot of nothing while completely ignoring any of the feedback around the level of coordination required.
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that a hypothetical change would take time. It's the complete lack of acknowledgement combined with a history of CG only caring about "player engagement" and not player experience that frustrates me.
Remember back when relics were released, and there was an overwhelmingly negative response? But apparently, according to CG, it was all good because we were engaging with relics after they were released. Well obviously we needed to engage with relics, otherwise we'd fall behind everyone else! So I'm fully expecting that nothing will change with this raid because people will continue to "engage" with it to get relic 8 materials and avoid falling behind, and that's good enough for the devs.
Most of my comments on topics like this are a culmination of posts here, conversations with them, and history of what has happened in game.
They will always take time to look at and discuss where things are in soft issues, and that will take more time than hard issues like bugs ( @Nikoms565 ). Yes things do not always change, but that doesnt mean it cant and ot doesnt mean they are not weighing things like player experience and feedback when they are discussing points.
Please let us know when it's not a culmination of things, but rather pertains to your conversations with them AND regarding the specific topic at hand. Believe me, you make this rarely clear which confuses many even more.
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No, that's actually not what that statement says, in fact it says the opposite, as they are watching what happens to see if "what is happening" is the player experience they "wanted".
Guilds breaking up turning over and moving around happens ever time new guild content happens. Please dont act like this is a new thing and only effecting certain guilds.
Sorry, I misspoke (and you are taking everything, a little out of context), they knew this would and stated this would require coordination, yes. The rewards, perceived difficulty, and competition rate, are as expected.
The level to which guilds are coordinating vs say developing to overcome the game mode is what they are looking at as the "player experience".
Oh wow. So this is the player experience they want and were expecting? Fracturing of international guilds, nightmare scheduling and coordination, and a reward pool that is underwhelming and not flat at all with the relic material? Glad to know that they don’t care about player experience if the above is their intended goal.
Oh man talk about making it easy for me to never spend on this game again lmao. If this is how the devs want the player experience to be, they don’t deserve money from anyone at this point.
Paragraph 1: the player experience is quite negative for various reasons outlined throughout this thread. If they don’t know this, then what is going on? No change is ignoring our stated experience, thus monitoring is ineffective.
Paragraph 2: true, new guild events often make guilds adjust, however the coordination is new and one of the larger complaints. This isn’t an HSTR. This guild experience should be taken into account though IMO.
Paragraph 3: that is unfortunate to hear as most dislike the coordination and rewards. Difficulty could be increased to offset removing the coordination mechanic IMO so no complaint on difficulty.
Paragraph 4: how can they monitor this outside of completion rate? 3rd party apps and multiple devices are used in order to coordinate. If the tools existed in game to not need AP mode etc. then perhaps it could be a better experience. However, from this thread most guilds completing this raid still dislike the required coordination and reward pool/ratio.
1 - monitoring can take time, especially on a low frequency event, with a low sample size of players involved. No change immediately doesnt mean it's being ignored, as monitoring is necessary to not make unnecessary or possibly "damaging changes" as the sample size increases.
2 - correct it is new and being monitored, and all factors are being taken into consideration.
3 - yes many have stated the difficulty is not the issue, the coordination seems to be a level above what anyone would expect/want from this game.
4 - feedback from the players, and other data points exist in game.
Everyone completing the raid still doesn't enjoy it (2/4 with my guild and I've been first and second and definitely don't enjoy it) so I'd say the player experience with raid isn't great at the moment.
The rewards are also a big issue and to state they are "what is expected" is a joke. To beat the raid people have been asked to hold off using a squad where it most beneficial to help the guild (a sacrifice). I know you can say, "well move to a stronger guild" but then it's the same issue where a guild could have 50 people getting 20mil+ and get 1 r8 piece. How is that fair? How is asking my people to sacrifice there best runs fair?
The coordination is an issue as well since this is a world wide game and CG know (since you just stated it) coordination is needed but do they understand that there are different time zones??
Your response (though it may just be conveying what they believe) is just plain wrong and adds to the frustration of the community.
You said everything is in line with what they were expecting. You said that they have no changes planned for the rewards or the raid itself. That they are however keeping an eye on things based on player experience.
There’s no other way to read that. It’s not misinterpreted.
CG is ok with guilds needing levels of coordination never needed before.
CG is ok with requiring exponentially more work on guild officer’s part, demanding the use of 3rd party apps (which they’ve even frowned upon and banned people for).
CG is ok with players being forced to use airplane mode tying their phone up and waiting around for anywhere from a half hour to two hours to turn in a single damage run.
CG is ok with a reward pool that rewards G5 gear for this type of “end game content” that demands a minimum of R5 to even have a character be able to be used.
CG is ok with a steep drop off in the amount of their “raid exclusive” R8 material pieces rewarded. I use quotes because when you sell something day one of its release, it’s not exclusive to the raid.
CG is ok with guilds being forced to break up due to time zone differences. This isn’t HAAT, or HSTR where smaller guilds broke off because of the damage and difficulty. This is totally unrelated as there are hundreds of responses on here saying the difficulty is not what’s ruining guilds but the coordination and time zone differences.
Sorry Kyno but you and CG are wrong in this. This is not what we the players want, and if CG is ok with that, then they don’t know what their players want or the inner workings of their own game.
How do you know this? That corporate sounding statement that Doja posted a few weeks ago conveniently did not even address or acknowledge any of our concerns about the coordination required, which makes it clear to me that they're happy to ignore it
I believe back in Feb 2019. They claim there will be some this year but I’m not holding my breath on anything they say anymore. Everything they say is tongue in cheek to me at this point.
When they actually listen to their players for a prolonged period of time, I’ll change my stance. As of now they’ve done nothing to even come close to convincing me otherwise
Requiring 10+ guild members to all be on at the exact same time certainly is a new thing, please don't pretend that it's not. I repeat - this has nothing to do with difficulty. . The reasons people are quitting guilds (and the game) this time are unique. CG pretending that they aren't is part of the problem - and the proof that they are not listening.
And CG saying in advance that this raid requires coordination is like saying becoming a Nobel prize winning physicist requires some math classes.
In game guild: TNR Uprising
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
Where was this
December state of the galaxy. I’ll believe it when I see it though.
Did CG authorize you to speak on this or is this just your impression? Why can't the community managers step in and make an official statement?
We can agree to disagree, but I have been in guilds who organized TW pushes that were asking to get 10-20 members online at the same time. No i do not think that is the same level of coordination required for the raid, but guilds definitely do operate like that.
People changing guilds is not unique to this raid, and it happens every time guild events are released.
You dont need proof they are not listening to think that, many players do. That's ok, but it's not the reality. Things dont always change at the pace the players would like, but they are listening and looking at what's going on. It's just never as simple or straightforward as the player base thinks it is.
When there is a bug that benefits the players, it seems things get simple and straightforward in a matter of hours. Amazing.
In game guild: TNR Uprising
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
Kyno, there’s a massive difference between some guilds choosing to coordinate a TW push and a raid forcing guilds into that level of coordination to participate.
Also, hstr originally forced a level of coordination in many guilds, ensuring eg. that several players didn’t enter end of phase at the same time, to avoid wasting a squad if someone else was finishing the phase.
The level of coordination mandated here is new.
Pretending otherwise is stubbornness.
Regarding changing guilds, all agree that this happens with new content. The norm however is that changes happen to find players of equal strength and ambition.
This time, it happens because players of equal strength and ambition go their separate ways to find players in similar time zone.
And yes, CG might be listening. But the horrible canned response Doja was allowed to post doesn’t really leave that impression.
In that response none of the concerns raised by the majority of people in this thread were addressed.
It was written/edited by someone who does not listen or at least doesn’t understand the points raised.
Again, how do you know this? As far as I'm aware, the only thing they've said about the raid since it's release is that corporate statement Doja posted that said a whole lot of nothing while completely ignoring any of the feedback around the level of coordination required.
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that a hypothetical change would take time. It's the complete lack of acknowledgement combined with a history of CG only caring about "player engagement" and not player experience that frustrates me.
Remember back when relics were released, and there was an overwhelmingly negative response? But apparently, according to CG, it was all good because we were engaging with relics after they were released. Well obviously we needed to engage with relics, otherwise we'd fall behind everyone else! So I'm fully expecting that nothing will change with this raid because people will continue to "engage" with it to get relic 8 materials and avoid falling behind, and that's good enough for the devs.
Asking people to make a push on totally separate attacks for a few minutes is not the same as having to hold damage for up to two hours, with your phone on airplane mode and hope it doesn’t crash if you dare back out of the app, thus ruining your run and potentially the whole raid run.
Not to mention G5 gear in the reward pool lol. I thought blue tank gear as a reward from HSTR was bad, imagine getting mk7 armor mod salvage lol...
Most of my comments on topics like this are a culmination of posts here, conversations with them, and history of what has happened in game.
They will always take time to look at and discuss where things are in soft issues, and that will take more time than hard issues like bugs ( @Nikoms565 ). Yes things do not always change, but that doesnt mean it cant and ot doesnt mean they are not weighing things like player experience and feedback when they are discussing points.
I didnt say it was, I was replying to the point of having X number of players online at the same time, and yes even for roughly an hour.
And as i said i wasn't comparing that actions, I was responding to having people logged in at a certain time.
Please let us know when it's not a culmination of things, but rather pertains to your conversations with them AND regarding the specific topic at hand. Believe me, you make this rarely clear which confuses many even more.