New balance issue: On-death abilities almost useless since update

Nonemo
1656 posts Member
A battle that used to last maybe four-five actions per character can now last easily double that. I believe that this is a good thing since it allows for more strategy to enter play during a battle.

But there is a problem. Skills that activate on character deaths will be active for a much smaller percentage of the whole battle when the toons are harder to kill and the battles thus last longer. For toons like Snowtrooper and Ventress, who need to score a kill with their AOE to gain their on-kill benefits, this latest update seems downright unforgiving, as AOE's have been toned down a lot. It's harder than ever to activate their respective benefits.

The same goes for Maul. With extremely low speed, health and protection stats, his only real selling point is his 100% turn meter gain on a kill. With all abilities doing less damage and Maul acting relatively rarely due to his poor speed, it's a rare thing to hit that sweet spot where an opponent goes into low health at exactly the moment when Maul is coming up next to claim the kill - and you can't just leave enemies around waiting for Maul to go, with the risk of health steal, heals, turn meter manipulation, assists and so on. You usually need to go for the kill as soon as possible, making it extremely hard to reserve certain kills for later.

At moderate health, even Jedi often survive Maul nowadays, where before the update he could be a machine, one-shotting several Jedi in a row. But even back then, nobody would use him since he's so extremely easy to kill.

Other characters with on-death abilities include Anakin, Boba Fett (a measly 30% turn meter gain if he manages to kill anybody with his very weak basic attack), Vader, Tusken Shaman, Nightsister Acolyte (gives great benefits on a killing blow but has unreliable attack power, so just like with Maul it's hard to hit that situation where an enemy toon is at low health exactly when Acolyte gets to go) and of course Savage Oppress. Some of these have abilities that work better than others. But the common denominator is that you don't see many of them around in the Arena.

A whole genre of abilities has been put at a disadvantage and I can't see that the characters with these abilities haven't been balanced to account for it. As a result, many fan favourites like Ventress, Boba Fett and Anakin are warming the benches. I believe that this needs to be addressed.

tl;dr - On death abilities suck now and they need to be rebalanced.

Replies

  • Options
    I agree!...
  • gobears21
    1265 posts Member
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    I think it is OK that some toons are below average.... others are above average and others yet are average.... having all the same abilities /attacks with just different pictures (which seems to be what people constantly ask for with all the nerfs and buffs they want) would be terrible.
  • Qleak
    420 posts Member
    Options
    Hoth scout is a pretty good arena toon, his on death ability is more useful in challenges though
  • Nonemo
    1656 posts Member
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    gobears21 wrote: »
    I think it is OK that some toons are below average.... others are above average and others yet are average.... having all the same abilities /attacks with just different pictures (which seems to be what people constantly ask for with all the nerfs and buffs they want) would be terrible.

    I believe in balancing toons and creating several different, viable concepts with different strengths and weaknesses. A tanky team can be good, but so should a team that focuses on multiple attacks, turn manipulation, buff bonanza, chain stuns, AoE spamming, crit fests, counter attackers and debuffers. They should all fit into different, viable styles of play, and shouldn't be "above or below average" per se. Here I am identifying a strategy that just doesn't work anymore - the on-death abilities.
  • SlyGambit
    1246 posts Member
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    You left off Old Ben. Who hasn't been one of the first four to die in every game he's been in for about 3 months now.

    Good thing he got a nice boost of protection to prevent him from being able to die...
  • Options
    Yeah I was about to say...you can't forget the worst on death ability in the game, Old Ben's never procures.
  • Options
    Give old ben a taunt..........
    “Lost a planet Master Obi-Wan has. How embarrassing …”

    – Yoda
  • Nonemo
    1656 posts Member
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    While it is true that old Ben is now harder to kill than ever, Old Ben's useless ability has already been discussed on multiple threads. The concern I'm raising here is bigger, and one I haven't seen brought up anywhere else at this point.

    I'd also like to point out how utterly useless a character like Maul will be in the Raids, where the opportunity to deal killing strikes to enemies is even more rare.
  • Options
    Old Ben's on death ability is not the same as the rest of characters that the thread is aimed towards. Old Ben's tank function is to punish the enemy attacking him, and to punish by not attacking him. However, aside from his 5 turn CD mind trick, he does not pose a threat, so deciding to attack him or not is usually an easy decision. IG100 is similar, he is a tank without a taunt, if you don't hit him, he gets buffs that make him more annoying. There are plenty of other toons that need larger adjustments than Old Ben, in my opinion.
  • Thire
    111 posts Member
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    I've really felt this with Anakin (he's the only one of these I use very frequently). No one's asking for every character to be the same, we're just asking that no one has completely useless abilities
  • Options
    Another great post nonemo.

    Personally, i'd avoided toons with upon death abilities even prior to this update, but, you're right, their viability has significantly worsened with longer exchanges. Maul is probably the worse case scenario because, as you say, he is always the first target. Savage, arguably, is the only one who isn't entirely let down by the extra health simply because he is the last to go. That said, for a slow toon, he still hits way too weak IMO.

    I'd be surprised if they weren't going to work on tweaks like this at some point, once guilds have settled down. Time will tell :)
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