Don't you just love this response:" they have counters" ?
It is a magical one, the answer to all possible complains about any toon, no matter how OP. Try it, it's fun!
For example: the toon is over used in the arena.
Yeah but he has counters!
They have half of the abilities on the game in just 2 toons. Yeah but they have counters!
It works for anything!, 3 little words have just made everything you posted invalid
But it's true.
This game can be frustrating at times yes. Many combos and teams have shown up along the way that have been really difficult to deal with.
People have invested an incredible amount of time and sometimes a lot of real world resources to develop these toons you're screaming to be nerfed. It would create huge backlash among long term established players. R2 is an example of the flow of this game.... It ebbs and it flows and I highly recommend doing your research before you invest valuable time and game resources if you don't want to be completely frustrated.
What your are suggesting would be indigestible for people who have invested so much time and energy into their toons.
It's simple. Nobody takes in consideration how good those counters actually are as standalone toons, how much they bring to the team besides countering other toon or how available are they. Their simple existance is reason enough to put everything you want, even gamebreaking, into a toon. The fact the GSpy exist is enough to Say Baze is not OP.
I have found that the counters themselves are excellent toons. This is true.
Baze: pretaunt and autotaunt, retribution, dispel, expose + great sinergy and anti faction abilities.
B2: dispel, sometimes buff imunity.
But B2 existing is reason enough that Baze should stay as he is.
How many of this counters are truly excellent, is there even one counter even close to power or utility to the toon is countering.
Also do this counters have sinergies between them? this is not a vacuum, a 1 vs 1 battle between toon and counter.
Let's see. DN, EP, Boba, troopers, Zader, yep.... Pretty good toons
Are you sure?
Zader counters the HoT with DoT, has unavoidable Cull with damage multiplier for debuffs.
DNihilus counters buffs by dispelling them, and annihilates someone after 3-4 turns.
Boba Fett counters buffs/debuffs stacks with Execute. Bounty Hunter Resolve allows targeting outside taunts.
Together in a team, provide 3 types of insta-kill.
As for individual toons: Zooku, Zkylo and Zavage would be able to beat Chirrut or Baze 1-on-1.
You don't have any of the counter toons above? Oh NO! Well how about spending the next 2 months farming and building them like I did to counter the Rex + Chaze teams. I did this 3 months ago and haven't spent a cent on swgoh.
Using the argument that something has a counter means it is balanced implies that balance is binary. It is either so broken that nothing can beat it, or it is fine.
Imagine a physical balance that you use to compare weights. The above logic would say that unless one side is all the down way it is balanced, yet actually if it is leaning one way or the other at all it isn't balanced.
It may be unreasonable to expect everything to be perfectly balanced, but i don't think we have to wait until something hits the floor on one side to say it isn't balanced.
But the counters have their own counters !
So what are you saying? it will blow over, just like rey, wiggs, maul?
I think it should be very easy to understand: having a counter and being op are not in contrast. A toon can be op while having a counter.
Counters are bad design choices to other bad design choices
Obviously some toons are bound to be better than others, that doesn't mean they are automatically op. Rey has been great for a long time, never op. Same with palpatine. Other toons... not so much
It's about calling a team balanced when it can be beaten, which is a very weird view on game balance.
Argument: X team can be beaten so it's fine to leave it as it is. If a team can be beaten, then it's balanced.
Reality: X team can ONLY be beaten by very specific characters. Any team that doesn't include these characters can't be used in Arena. The whole game suffers from a lack of diversity.
Zaul could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any team that relies on Assists/TM gain/Counter
Chaze could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any team with no mass/regular dispell.
ZVader could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any team with no cleanse.
Wiggs could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any team without a pre-taunter.
Evasion teams could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any player that had poor RNG.
Poe teams could be beaten, but still pushed out of the meta any team without Poe.
Barris/healing teams could be beaten but still pushed out of the meta any team without Sidious.
CAN BE BEATEN =/= BALANCED
If you think so, you have very poor knowledge in game design, game balance, and poor basic logic.
Ironically, since Baze and Chirrut are good at
- Inflicting debuffs and dispelling buffs on the enemy team
- Cleansing debuffs and giving buffs to your team
The only counter to Chaze is... Chaze.
Gosh, another of these.
@BentWookiee please close this, before the troll dies of overeating.
If that's all you think B2 does, you don't understand B2. He dispells faster than a triple cleanse team cleanses. He doesn't need speed so you can load him with accuracy and he has anti evasion on basic. He's perfect against zaul, triple cleanse Rex, and double foresight Jedi teams. What more do you want from the little guy in this meta?
B2's unique allows him to buff wipe all the time.
have you heard of Boba, Sun Fac, Nihilus, or Jyn/Cassian?
I'dont think so!
An good moddet zKrooper Duo has good cards to deal with Chase in an 2 vs 2 Match because of the bad KI the anti-rebel-synergies and Krennics Leadskill.
After Chirut first Turm, DT debuffs and inflicts Healing immunity, then DK uses his AOE calling DT to assist inflicting Daze and Stun on Chirrut. Next Baze maybe is doing minor Damage before Chirrut loses his stun. He is then abbillity blocked or stunned (or both) again by DT. Krennic will inflict buffblock on Baze and from this point on it's game Over for the Rebels
The main problem ... its all theory, there are no 2 vs 2 Matches and RNG sucks. ^^