The Road Ahead: July 5, 2018 [MEGA]

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  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
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    Hopefully Calo Nord will make it in at some point. I thought he was pretty awesome.
    Canderous, though. Calo was pretty cool.
  • Kurrgan
    100 posts Member
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    Am I the only one who dislikes KOTOR? I have tried playing it three times and can never bring myself to finish it. The gameplay is just so repetitive and the combat is based on "behind the scenes dice rolls" so no skill is needed to play and there is no fun in combat.

    It was all about the story in my opinion. It was like a movie that dragged me in for days on end playing both sides and enjoying all the voice acting and player choices. I could've cared less about the graphics and combat. Get to train as a jedi and as a sith! It was awesome.

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    ... they can bring Darth Norris and GrandMaster Hasselhoff, but they can't negate the problems with the sith-raid...
  • Cstone812
    266 posts Member
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    Am I the only one who dislikes KOTOR? I have tried playing it three times and can never bring myself to finish it. The gameplay is just so repetitive and the combat is based on "behind the scenes dice rolls" so no skill is needed to play and there is no fun in combat.

    You are in the minority. Story is probably the best in Star Wars lore. Yea I can understand how ou wouldn’t like the combat I enjoyed it. Would rather it be like that than just mashing lightsabers against the enemy the animations actually looked realistic.
  • YaeVizsla
    3448 posts Member
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    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    I think the criticism is pretty warranted given that they are taking an already heavily RNG dependent game feature and requiring we spend more credits and resources for even more RNG dice rolls.

    Don’t get me wrong. I love the KOTOR toons. I am very happy we are getting mod management. I am not happy they are using simplicity as an excuse to exponentially increase the credit and energy sink for mods. I think I’m being pretty reasonable.
    Except they're not adding another layer of RNG to keep you away from the best mods. They're adding a reroll if you didn't get the best mod. If you rolled a C mod instead of an A mod, you have a chance to overcome that bad luck by slicing it twice. And if you already have an A mod, you don't have to slice it.
    Still not a he.
  • Monel
    2789 posts Member
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    People wetting themselves about KOTOR (I still don't really know what it is) remind me of hipsters wetting themselves about a band's "early stuff".


    Yeah yeah we get it :P you're cool.

    Wetting themselves? Again is the kind of comment a forum moderator should be making? Mod troll yet again.
  • Monel
    2789 posts Member
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    NicWester wrote: »
    It's not cool, it's nostalgia.

    Nostalgia?

    This isn't nostalgia? -

    dxcl1jk8jjak.png



    KOTOR seems modern to me.

    Depends on what you grew up with. For some people video KOTOR was an early intro for others it was Star Wars movies. Nostalgia is different for everyone. Personally I dont care about many of the characters in game. Especially from latest installment of movies that I dont care for. I did enjoy KOTOR games so I like those guys more. Would be awesome to see more from the og trilogy but for some reason they are holding back.
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    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    Ugnaught wrote: »
    Apparently I'm the only one who would prefer canon characters.
    I'm fine with any character being added, really. Star Wars is big enough and the fans are so many that every character is going to be SOMEONE'S favorite character. Hell, my favorite characters are Kit Fisto (That name! That smile!) and Zam Wessel (That name! That informing the look and mechanics of the Imperial Agent Sniper in the MMO!) and they're in, so why not make someone happy?
    You can get Kotor for like 5$ off steam. It is considered one of the greatest RPGs ever... Not just star wars... all RPGs ever. All time. It introduced a younger generation who were too young to truly enjoy the original trilogy to the depth of the star wars universe.
    Considered one of the greatest RPGs ever--by people who played it when it was relatively new. Don't underestimate the importance of context. I know enough people who have watched Ghostbusters for the first time as adults to know that old things don't age well. Even something innovative like KOTOR is going to suffer because the best bits of it have been redone and recycled into later games and done better.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't like it or trying to be a wet blanket. I'm glad the folks who are fans are getting the thing that they want. I'm just saying why there's folks who read the news and thought "Meh."

    Actually it’s not just considered one of the greatest RPGs ever by people who played it when it was relatively new. Check top RPG lists by sources like Game Informer, IGN, etc. Kotor is always on the list and always near the top. Even to this day.

    Ah yes. KOTOR 1 and 2. Still top favorites to this day. I can still remember the rage from my buddy when I decided on a "Jedi gunman" build using only pistols and refusing any upgrades to lightsaber/melee combat, and using heavy armor instead of robes.. "Jedi don't use pistols they friggin use lightsabers!" Great times
  • Cstone812
    266 posts Member
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    Gheyst1214 wrote: »
    The only reason I ask is because Kotor sits on those lists next to games like Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Diablo, Dragon Age, Dark Souls, and Mass Effect. All those games are newer release games compared to Kotor. Kotor 2 is usually not on those lists. So it’s not a matter of nostalgia. Fallout: New Vegas isn’t usually on those lists. It’s because Obsidian makes good RPGs. But companies like BioWare, Bethesda, Blizzard, and Next Software make GREAT RPGs. Don’t even get me started on the machine that’s Square Enix and Final Fantasy. And Kotor usually beats the other BioWare games I mentioned. It’s because Kotor as a RPG stands the test of time. I don’t work for any of the game review companies but I’ve got to believe it’s not just 30 something white guys who are the only ones compiling these lists. I’ve been a gamer for a long time and Kotor is still a go to when I want to take a break from the current shiny new games that are released. I feel like people should give it a try no matter what age or race or whatever they are. It’s a great game and you won’t be disappointed. I’ll get off my soapbox now.

    Definitely agree...although recently Bioware is going straight down the ****. I think Ea is changing them for the worse. I’m looking at you Mass Effect Andromeda.
  • Fives5555
    331 posts Member
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    Cstone812 wrote: »
    Am I the only one who dislikes KOTOR? I have tried playing it three times and can never bring myself to finish it. The gameplay is just so repetitive and the combat is based on "behind the scenes dice rolls" so no skill is needed to play and there is no fun in combat.

    You are in the minority. Story is probably the best in Star Wars lore. Yea I can understand how ou wouldn’t like the combat I enjoyed it. Would rather it be like that than just mashing lightsabers against the enemy the animations actually looked realistic.

    I also dislike KOTOR. The game is fun but the characters are kinda overhyped and not as good/legendary as the OT/Prequel characters
  • Fives5555
    331 posts Member
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    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    More often then not right though. They're just finding another way to monetize mods. Nothing good about it. Think mod sets is really why it took so long to revamp mods? They hold off doing good things people will enjoy until they're sure they can maximize profit.

    And yes I'm well aware it's a game and they have to make money some how yaddah yaddah but other companies are well capable of making money and still keeping the masses happy
    No one can make Star Wars fans happy.

    A lot of folks have refused to touch the property because Star Wars fans are so caustic.

    It’d make me happy as a Star Wars fan if you’d stop assuming fans can’t be happy.
  • TVF
    36747 posts Member
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    Fives5555 wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    More often then not right though. They're just finding another way to monetize mods. Nothing good about it. Think mod sets is really why it took so long to revamp mods? They hold off doing good things people will enjoy until they're sure they can maximize profit.

    And yes I'm well aware it's a game and they have to make money some how yaddah yaddah but other companies are well capable of making money and still keeping the masses happy
    No one can make Star Wars fans happy.

    A lot of folks have refused to touch the property because Star Wars fans are so caustic.

    It’d make me happy as a Star Wars fan if you’d stop assuming fans can’t be happy.

    The loudest fans can't be happy, but that's hardly exclusive to Star Wars.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
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    Omeah wrote: »
    @CoastalJames If you like Star Wars you should look it up. I strongly recommend playing it through yourself, but if you don’t have the time, you can watch a playthrough. KOTOR after many years is still the best way to experience the world of Star Wars as if you lived in a galaxy far, far away

    Good stuff, thanks for that! My comment was a tad tongue-in-cheek, I am aware of KOTOR and it certainly has seemed to have entertained and fascinated many. Which is great.

    Looking forward to new characters and things to do in the game...I find myself a bit like @TVF - I'm not overly fussed if characters are old/new, canon/non-canon or where they come from...if they're cool, fun and useful then I'm in!



  • SoonerJBD
    460 posts Member
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    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    I think the criticism is pretty warranted given that they are taking an already heavily RNG dependent game feature and requiring we spend more credits and resources for even more RNG dice rolls.

    Don’t get me wrong. I love the KOTOR toons. I am very happy we are getting mod management. I am not happy they are using simplicity as an excuse to exponentially increase the credit and energy sink for mods. I think I’m being pretty reasonable.
    Except they're not adding another layer of RNG to keep you away from the best mods. They're adding a reroll if you didn't get the best mod. If you rolled a C mod instead of an A mod, you have a chance to overcome that bad luck by slicing it twice. And if you already have an A mod, you don't have to slice it.

    Yes, they absolutely are. Because now, instead of a green upgrading its starting secondary stat 100 percent of the time at level 3, it will do so 25 percent of the time at level 12. Odds for improvement of starting secondary stat are also lower for blues and purples. But... now you get to play RNG with a lot more mods both by hoping speed shows up as a hidden secondary when you level a mod other than gold and improves once all secondary stats are revealed AND via slicing. They are incentivizing more pulls of the lever by offering more opportunities to hit the low-odds jackpot if you spend a lot more credits and materials (obtained via energy and probably crystals) while simultaneously disincentivizing the cheaper, higher odds alternative of acquiring a higher number of 10-12 speed mods through farming and only upgrading greens and blues to 3 and 6 respectively.

    If you are ONLY looking for the best mod, this might sound great to you. But if you have a large roster, you can’t afford to go for the jackpot every time. You need a lot of mods with passable speed to equip many squads at a time for TW and various other game modes that require multiple squads. Getting a high quantity of mods with passable speed is about to become a lot more expensive. The best analogy here is a casino. They are removing low stakes blackjack tables in favor of high stakes slot machines, and you are rejoicing because you can pull that slot machine lever more now. Meanwhile you would have a better chance of breaking even or coming out ahead via the low stakes blackjack game. Most people aren’t going to hit the progressive slot jackpot. The are going to dump a lot more credits and energy into mods for a slightly better chance at top-end speed and a lower chance per bet of a modest win (+10-14 speed you might get from leveling a lot of farmed greens and blues).
  • Atlas1
    1713 posts Member
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    Can we get an update on the release method for all the new KOTOR toons? If they’re all marquee events again, I’m probably going to be hanging it up for good after nearly 3 years. Nothing is more boring than a 3* toon sitting in purgatory for months and then having a half year, painfully slow, grind to 7* them.

    Then, you’ll need to spend $$$ to 7* them in time for Revan. You wanna kill this game? Release them like that.
  • Nihion
    3340 posts Member
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    I get the whole “We need OT characters first!” thing, but I don’t know how you can’t like TOR! If the hate the story, then focus on the cool characters!

    I know it’s really hard to tell, but I am extremely excited for these characters.

    For missing OT characters, I just have C3PO and Piett, are there more?
  • Ikky2win
    870 posts Member
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    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    SoonerJBD wrote: »
    I think the criticism is pretty warranted given that they are taking an already heavily RNG dependent game feature and requiring we spend more credits and resources for even more RNG dice rolls.

    Don’t get me wrong. I love the KOTOR toons. I am very happy we are getting mod management. I am not happy they are using simplicity as an excuse to exponentially increase the credit and energy sink for mods. I think I’m being pretty reasonable.
    Except they're not adding another layer of RNG to keep you away from the best mods. They're adding a reroll if you didn't get the best mod. If you rolled a C mod instead of an A mod, you have a chance to overcome that bad luck by slicing it twice. And if you already have an A mod, you don't have to slice it.

    Yes, they absolutely are. Because now, instead of a green upgrading its starting secondary stat 100 percent of the time at level 3, it will do so 25 percent of the time at level 12. Odds for improvement of starting secondary stat are also lower for blues and purples. But... now you get to play RNG with a lot more mods both by hoping speed shows up as a hidden secondary when you level a mod other than gold and improves once all secondary stats are revealed AND via slicing. They are incentivizing more pulls of the lever by offering more opportunities to hit the low-odds jackpot if you spend a lot more credits and materials (obtained via energy and probably crystals) while simultaneously disincentivizing the cheaper, higher odds alternative of acquiring a higher number of 10-12 speed mods through farming and only upgrading greens and blues to 3 and 6 respectively.

    If you are ONLY looking for the best mod, this might sound great to you. But if you have a large roster, you can’t afford to go for the jackpot every time. You need a lot of mods with passable speed to equip many squads at a time for TW and various other game modes that require multiple squads. Getting a high quantity of mods with passable speed is about to become a lot more expensive. The best analogy here is a casino. They are removing low stakes blackjack tables in favor of high stakes slot machines, and you are rejoicing because you can pull that slot machine lever more now. Meanwhile you would have a better chance of breaking even or coming out ahead via the low stakes blackjack game. Most people aren’t going to hit the progressive slot jackpot. The are going to dump a lot more credits and energy into mods for a slightly better chance at top-end speed and a lower chance per bet of a modest win (+10-14 speed you might get from leveling a lot of farmed greens and blues).

    As much as it pains me to say it, SoonerBryn is absolutely correct. The chance for upgrading speed on a mod that has a speed secondary currently is as follows:

    Green - 100% at level 3
    Blue - 50% at level 3 and 50% at level 6
    Purple - 33% at level 3, 33% at level 6, 33% at level 9

    Now here is how it will be with the new system:
    Green - 25% at level 12
    Blue - 25% at level 9 and 25% at level 12
    Purple - 25% at level 6, 25% at level 9, 25% at level 12

    As you can see it’s going to be a static 25% with the new version and you’re going to have to level them up higher to see if they actually upgrade. Then after that’s all said and done you can slice.
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    I’m going to let the odds speak for themselves. Your chances right now of getting a gold mod to upgrade secondary speed four times are 0.39 percent. What they are “giving” you is the opportunity to take the 0.39 percent gamble with every mod at the cost of a lot more resources. Meanwhile they are taking away the 100 percent odds for a green to upgrade starting secondary stat once at a cost of 13k credits, and the 75/25 percent chance of a blue mod upgrading once or twice for 36k credits. You will now have to spend 168k for a 25 percent chance a green upgrades once and a 43.75/6.25 percent chance of a blue upgrading once/twice. Then they are “giving” you the chance to spend farmed or purchased slicing materials to chase similarly low odds for more improvements on those stats. If you don’t understand why this is a net negative, please spend some time reading up on statistics and probability.
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    A lot of the Marquee toons they are releasing these days are viable without being 7*. Zeta abilities good kit and some mods good to go. I don't .ind that I can't use certain characters in raids just yet.. that said, 8 attempts was really where we should have stayed on all of these single hm toons. Since the switch back my shard drop rate has gotten ridiculously bad. It's a huge bummer and if I do quit that will be the reason why.

    Regarding mods, I totally agree that slicing is a direct statement that 6 dot mods are coming likely as some **** reward for things most of the player base can't handle and they're throwing us a few more chances to make our current mods at least hang around and not completely useless.

    We will see how that goes but if you've been playing this game even for a little bit you know everything is about the game having more and more ways and reasons for people to spend. Lmao at people who think the sith raid will change or even be addressed. This thread is them saying pay up or do hstr next year, we've moved on to the next idea the marketing Dept cooked up.
  • Ikky2win
    870 posts Member
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    One other thing worth mentioning is that these odds are based upon us assuming cg hasn’t put a negative modifier on upgrading speed already. We’re assuming that when you get a blue mod with speed and defense as the secondaries there is an equal chance of upgrading speed as there is defense. It’s quite possible, that CG has made it so that you actually have something like a 75% chance to upgrade defense and 25% chance to upgrade speed. From CG’s perspective this would make sense as it would keep you farming mods longer.
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    I was kind of hoping they would also remove the mod removal cost. I feel it's an unneeded burden.
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    People just don’t understand probability and the ever shrinking odds of hitting low percentage rolls repeatedly. I’m sure someone will jump in and tell me that my numbers are wrong since you will have two chances at a 25 percent roll to upgrade secondary stat on a blue and 25 percent plus 25 percent = 50 percent, right? Wrong. Math, suckers.
  • Ravens1113
    5215 posts Member
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    ReyCharles wrote: »
    A lot of the Marquee toons they are releasing these days are viable without being 7*. Zeta abilities good kit and some mods good to go. I don't .ind that I can't use certain characters in raids just yet.. that said, 8 attempts was really where we should have stayed on all of these single hm toons. Since the switch back my shard drop rate has gotten ridiculously bad. It's a huge bummer and if I do quit that will be the reason why.

    Regarding mods, I totally agree that slicing is a direct statement that 6 dot mods are coming likely as some **** reward for things most of the player base can't handle and they're throwing us a few more chances to make our current mods at least hang around and not completely useless.

    We will see how that goes but if you've been playing this game even for a little bit you know everything is about the game having more and more ways and reasons for people to spend. Lmao at people who think the sith raid will change or even be addressed. This thread is them saying pay up or do hstr next year, we've moved on to the next idea the marketing Dept cooked up.

    I said that on the first page. It won’t matter if these are all marquee releases. Now it would be nice to be thrown a bone and get one to farm somewhere relatively accessible but I don’t call the shots.

    I think marquee of fine the majority of the time but if they don’t break up releases to include legendary events or even farmable on nodes then you’re just going to do the exact opposite of what you intend to do.
  • Edward
    651 posts Member
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    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    YaeVizsla wrote: »
    More often then not right though. They're just finding another way to monetize mods. Nothing good about it. Think mod sets is really why it took so long to revamp mods? They hold off doing good things people will enjoy until they're sure they can maximize profit.

    And yes I'm well aware it's a game and they have to make money some how yaddah yaddah but other companies are well capable of making money and still keeping the masses happy
    No one can make Star Wars fans happy.

    A lot of folks have refused to touch the property because Star Wars fans are so caustic.

    Slow your roll there, Sparky. There had been a great many things to be enjoyed in the updates and improvements in the game in 2016 & 2017 - the introduction of guilds, raids, mods (which actually made tanks viable again) and ships. It wasn't until late 2017/early 2018 with the drop of HST raid and Ships 2.0 that things have really gone south.

    I also think painting all Star Wars fans with such a broad brush is extremely unfair.

    Good summary, couldn’t agree more but I think this game will continue that way until you know what.
  • Edward
    651 posts Member
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    NicWester wrote: »
    It's not cool, it's nostalgia.

    Nostalgia?

    This isn't nostalgia? -

    dxcl1jk8jjak.png



    KOTOR seems modern to me.

    If you compare Star Wars movies to some very popular superhero movies, you will see what’s real modern unless they don’t watch any of them.

    It’s hard not to compare and they have games too, it’s hard not to compare since I’ve played both.
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    Ikky2win wrote: »
    One other thing worth mentioning is that these odds are based upon us assuming cg hasn’t put a negative modifier on upgrading speed already. We’re assuming that when you get a blue mod with speed and defense as the secondaries there is an equal chance of upgrading speed as there is defense. It’s quite possible, that CG has made it so that you actually have something like a 75% chance to upgrade defense and 25% chance to upgrade speed. From CG’s perspective this would make sense as it would keep you farming mods longer.

    That would be a very very gnarly move, even from CG.
    It wouldn't surprise me tough.

  • TAZZZOOO
    245 posts Member
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    Does it make me an ignorant person for wanting to ask for dates for all of this?
  • TVF
    36747 posts Member
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    TAZZZOOO wrote: »
    Does it make me an ignorant person for wanting to ask for dates for all of this?

    Ignorant? No.

    But they won't give dates. The Road Ahead posts rarely (never?) do.
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
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    NicWester wrote: »
    It's not cool, it's nostalgia.

    Nostalgia?

    This isn't nostalgia? -

    dxcl1jk8jjak.png



    KOTOR seems modern to me.

    Who's that hairy fella? And that golden thing?

    Nevermind. Just had a silly thought for a second there about adding characters that are in the actual movies first...
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