Why has Gen Grevious gone missing from my Fleet Store?

Replies

  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    He agreed with you, so you can drop the argument now. If you read his second post carefully, you would know that.

    I know, I know, I just wanted to gamble with a gift card

    Buy a pack
  • Nihion
    2230 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    Or, “the rate is 20%, so... it’s RNG.”
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.
  • Nihion
    2230 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?
  • Nihion
    2230 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.
  • Nihion
    2230 posts Member
    edited August 6
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.
  • TVF
    17961 posts Member
    Lol I never conceded. I never said otherwise in the first place.
    TVF's guild is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    ...to me random means...

    There's the problem
  • He’s not dropping because you probably want him to drop. It’s perception usually.
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    BryantBub wrote: »
    He’s not dropping because you probably want him to drop. It’s perception usually.

    Yeah, it does always *feel* like the one you want rarely drops. Until you 7* it and then it seems it pops up all the time.
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.
  • ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    Noone is arguing that it may be weighted different. Theyre arguing that your trying to bend the word random to fit your argument. Just because the odds are different doesnt mean what you actually get isnt random.
  • Nihion
    2230 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    Random doesn't mean equally distrubuted. You're taking it to mean that it's something just occuring in the universe with no outside influence. That is true in SOME cases of randomness where all things are weighted equally.

    However even if something is given weight, and thereby influenced by some outside force, it still falls under the umbrella of random.

    Yes, it is possibly in the code to cause GG to come up less, but that doesn't make it not random.
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.

    No one in this thread agreed that GG shows up less, until I said something. TVF said it after his initial post of “it’s rng”. First time you have said that, fact.

    I would never bet on randomness, but I will definitely bet when I observe a pattern.

    GG doesn’t show up in that spot randomly, he shows up less frequently than the other chars, which is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money on.

    This thread was about GG not showing up in fleet shop and several people said, bad luck man, rng bro and I said, nope it’s not bad luck or rng, he’s weighted not to show up as often.

    It’s not rng or confirmation bias that leads people to believe GG isnt showing as much, it’s simple weighting.

    Getting 10% drop rate on a node that enough data shows is really 20% can be rng or confirmation bias, but this time, this particular instance, I believe and am willing to bet that the show rate for GG is different than the other chars in that slot, making it predictable enough and not random to make a wager on.



    You're still missing a simple fact. He's weighted less AND it's still rng. Make peace with that and you'll be much happier. :smile:
  • ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.

    No one in this thread agreed that GG shows up less, until I said something. TVF said it after his initial post of “it’s rng”. First time you have said that, fact.

    I would never bet on randomness, but I will definitely bet when I observe a pattern.

    GG doesn’t show up in that spot randomly, he shows up less frequently than the other chars, which is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money on.

    This thread was about GG not showing up in fleet shop and several people said, bad luck man, rng bro and I said, nope it’s not bad luck or rng, he’s weighted not to show up as often.

    It’s not rng or confirmation bias that leads people to believe GG isnt showing as much, it’s simple weighting.

    Getting 10% drop rate on a node that enough data shows is really 20% can be rng or confirmation bias, but this time, this particular instance, I believe and am willing to bet that the show rate for GG is different than the other chars in that slot, making it predictable enough and not random to make a wager on.



    So you would buy a scratch off but not a powerball?
  • ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.

    No one in this thread agreed that GG shows up less, until I said something. TVF said it after his initial post of “it’s rng”. First time you have said that, fact.

    I would never bet on randomness, but I will definitely bet when I observe a pattern.

    GG doesn’t show up in that spot randomly, he shows up less frequently than the other chars, which is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money on.

    This thread was about GG not showing up in fleet shop and several people said, bad luck man, rng bro and I said, nope it’s not bad luck or rng, he’s weighted not to show up as often.

    It’s not rng or confirmation bias that leads people to believe GG isnt showing as much, it’s simple weighting.

    Getting 10% drop rate on a node that enough data shows is really 20% can be rng or confirmation bias, but this time, this particular instance, I believe and am willing to bet that the show rate for GG is different than the other chars in that slot, making it predictable enough and not random to make a wager on.



    And we agreed with you! But you stopped caring about what other people said I guess.

    Do you think that character farms are not RNG dependent? Because they're also weighted. It's not a 50% chance to get a shard, but that's RNG! It takes the drop rates into account and randomly decides what you get. Same with GG. He has a lower drop rate, so it will be more unlikely that he shows up because the random roll won't land on him as much. If it wasn't random, then he would have a set schedule. Weighted RNG is a type of RNG. I don't think theyre is anything in this game that is just weighted, because that's not a thing. That would be like he only shows up on Tuesdays or something.

    Like I said earlier, there was a period in time where I thought I didn't see GG for a while. And that's because it's RNG. And CG had every right to make it weighted.
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion2 wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.

    No one in this thread agreed that GG shows up less, until I said something. TVF said it after his initial post of “it’s rng”. First time you have said that, fact.

    I would never bet on randomness, but I will definitely bet when I observe a pattern.

    GG doesn’t show up in that spot randomly, he shows up less frequently than the other chars, which is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money on.

    This thread was about GG not showing up in fleet shop and several people said, bad luck man, rng bro and I said, nope it’s not bad luck or rng, he’s weighted not to show up as often.

    It’s not rng or confirmation bias that leads people to believe GG isnt showing as much, it’s simple weighting.

    Getting 10% drop rate on a node that enough data shows is really 20% can be rng or confirmation bias, but this time, this particular instance, I believe and am willing to bet that the show rate for GG is different than the other chars in that slot, making it predictable enough and not random to make a wager on.



    And we agreed with you! But you stopped caring about what other people said I guess.

    Do you think that character farms are not RNG dependent? Because they're also weighted. It's not a 50% chance to get a shard, but that's RNG! It takes the drop rates into account and randomly decides what you get. Same with GG. He has a lower drop rate, so it will be more unlikely that he shows up because the random roll won't land on him as much. If it wasn't random, then he would have a set schedule. Weighted RNG is a type of RNG. I don't think theyre is anything in this game that is just weighted, because that's not a thing. That would be like he only shows up on Tuesdays or something.

    Like I said earlier, there was a period in time where I thought I didn't see GG for a while. And that's because it's RNG. And CG had every right to make it weighted.

    Wait, so how many nihions are there? Seems this debate is weighted toward nihions.

    There are lots of areas in the game where “it’s rng bro” is correct and appropriate. This particular conversation is not one of them. GG not showing up for weeks is not bad luck or RNG, its because he’s coded not to show up very often so the swings are even bigger.

    People throw the term rng around loosely on these forums.

    If you and I grind the same amount of mods and I roll better speed on mine, thats rng. If you and I both grind the same amount of cantina energy on brood alpha for a month and I’m ahead in shard count, thats rng. GG being a freaking ghost in fleet shop vs the other chars in that slot is not bad luck or “RNG”, it’s because it’s coded for him to show less.

    Yes! It's coded AND rng. The weight doesn't make it not random!
  • CCyrilS
    3671 posts Member
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion2 wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    CCyrilS wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    However you made it sound as if RNG is the only thing affecting GGs show up rate and in that is where you and I disagree.

    I never said that though, and I don't believe it, so we can't disagree on it.

    But you only mentioned the rng part, so any respectful disagreer would infer you didn’t believe GG was weighted lower.

    That would not be a reasonable inference since RNG does not mean and has never meant that all options are weighted equally.

    I respectfully disagree. His simple statement of “Its RNG” implies that GG showing is as random as any of the others showing.



    I don't think that's how most ppl understand it. I wouldn't assume anything one way or the other.

    Let’s say there are 5 chars that show in that spot.

    GG has been coded to show 10% of the time and the other 4 are coded to show 22.5% of the time.

    That’s not random, that’s not rng

    Yes it is... you don’t know how loot boxes work, do you?

    Loot boxes are coded in several different ways.

    5 chars with each having a 20% chance of showing is as random as a seeded rng can be.

    5 chars with one having a significantly less % chance of showing is not random.



    Yes it is.

    Let’s go back to percentages in math. Dice are always random. If you roll a die, every side has the same chance of being rolled correct? So let’s say we still have six sides, but the number one occupies one side, the number two occupies two sides, and the number three occupies three sides. The die has a bigger chance of landing on three, but it still has to roll, making the end result: random. Just because it’s weighted doesn’t change the fact that it’s random. It’s not a set figure; which means you could roll the one a hundred times in a row.

    Ok, putting aside true randomness of a seeded computer generated number vs dice or cards, to me random means an equal chance of happening in the context of this discussion.

    If I were to tell someone it’s random that GG shows up in a slot with 4 other chars, that person could reasonably assume that GG had a 20% chance of showing up.

    If in fact GG only had a 10% chance of showing up in that scenario, then telling that person It’s random when GG shows up, I wouldn’t be telling the whole truth.

    Doesn’t matter, TVF conceded that most likely GG is weighted to show up less often than the other chars in that spot.

    1.
    made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

    Googles definition of random. The outcomes aren’t required to be of equal standing.

    I’ll make this easy. It’s still RNG because “weighted” is a form of RNG.

    I’ll make it even easier.

    You take GG and I’ll take Tarkin.

    I’ll track with screenshots 3x a day for the next year in ship shop that spot.

    Every time GG shows I’ll pay you $1 and every time Tarkin shows, you pay me $1.

    If it’s random, we’ll probably break close to even, but if it’s not random and I have found a pattern in my favor, then you’ll be paying me at the end of a year.

    No!
    Not true at all, because they may be weighted differently, even though they are RANDOM.

    Fine by me if you want to call it random.

    I happen to believe there is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money behind.

    Same bet as I offered nihion, please take it.

    We all agree that GG shows up less. No one will take that bet. We’ve established that.

    RNG can be weighted, but it is still RNG, REGARDLESS. “Random” means “roll of the dice”, or “spin the wheel”, you name it. It can be weighted, but it doesn’t change the fact that it’s random.

    No one in this thread agreed that GG shows up less, until I said something. TVF said it after his initial post of “it’s rng”. First time you have said that, fact.

    I would never bet on randomness, but I will definitely bet when I observe a pattern.

    GG doesn’t show up in that spot randomly, he shows up less frequently than the other chars, which is an identifiable pattern that I’m willing to put my money on.

    This thread was about GG not showing up in fleet shop and several people said, bad luck man, rng bro and I said, nope it’s not bad luck or rng, he’s weighted not to show up as often.

    It’s not rng or confirmation bias that leads people to believe GG isnt showing as much, it’s simple weighting.

    Getting 10% drop rate on a node that enough data shows is really 20% can be rng or confirmation bias, but this time, this particular instance, I believe and am willing to bet that the show rate for GG is different than the other chars in that slot, making it predictable enough and not random to make a wager on.



    And we agreed with you! But you stopped caring about what other people said I guess.

    Do you think that character farms are not RNG dependent? Because they're also weighted. It's not a 50% chance to get a shard, but that's RNG! It takes the drop rates into account and randomly decides what you get. Same with GG. He has a lower drop rate, so it will be more unlikely that he shows up because the random roll won't land on him as much. If it wasn't random, then he would have a set schedule. Weighted RNG is a type of RNG. I don't think theyre is anything in this game that is just weighted, because that's not a thing. That would be like he only shows up on Tuesdays or something.

    Like I said earlier, there was a period in time where I thought I didn't see GG for a while. And that's because it's RNG. And CG had every right to make it weighted.

    Wait, so how many nihions are there? Seems this debate is weighted toward nihions.

    There are lots of areas in the game where “it’s rng bro” is correct and appropriate. This particular conversation is not one of them. GG not showing up for weeks is not bad luck or RNG, its because he’s coded not to show up very often so the swings are even bigger.

    People throw the term rng around loosely on these forums.

    If you and I grind the same amount of mods and I roll better speed on mine, thats rng. If you and I both grind the same amount of cantina energy on brood alpha for a month and I’m ahead in shard count, thats rng. GG being a freaking ghost in fleet shop vs the other chars in that slot is not bad luck or “RNG”, it’s because it’s coded for him to show less.

    Yes! It's coded AND rng. The weight doesn't make it not random!

    The weight is what makes it not random.

    WRONG
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