Characters speed and first turn
October 1, 2023 10:46PM
edited October 2023
WE ALL know very well how the turn manipulation mechanic works and how some teams are based on that unfun trick.
But what happens when a stronk turn manipulation team meets another? Basically the one who goes first wins. At my best knowledge, the team with that one fastest character in the battle should take first turn and allow his team to "trigger" the carousel.
Please explain why in arena his Darth Vader SPEED: 213 activated before my Moff Gideon with SPEED: 233.
His team: Leader Palpatine, Vader, Jade, Thrawn, Royal guard.
Appreciated.
But what happens when a stronk turn manipulation team meets another? Basically the one who goes first wins. At my best knowledge, the team with that one fastest character in the battle should take first turn and allow his team to "trigger" the carousel.
Please explain why in arena his Darth Vader SPEED: 213 activated before my Moff Gideon with SPEED: 233.
His team: Leader Palpatine, Vader, Jade, Thrawn, Royal guard.
Appreciated.
Post edited by Ultra on
0
This discussion has been closed.
Replies
Darth Vader 213 speed plus 8 speed for EP, plus 8 for MJ, plus 8 for Thrawn and plus 8 for RG. So DV starts with 245 speed.
245 is faster than 233.
16 speed for himself and EP (Empire and Sith). That Vader has 269 speed.
To the OP, if your opponent had the Zeta on No Escape, which grants him that bonus speed, he'll also be immune to Turn Meter Manipulation.
And that's not counting the, possible, empire/sith characters on the OP's team alongside Gideon that prolly made it even higher than 269.
Only Empire ally & Sith ally and Jedi enemy & Rebel enemy.
Yep. Always have done. That pair are worth +32 speed. Then 24 (3x8) from the others.
They have lead you down a rabbit hole of misinformation.
It’s sad that a 6 week old beginner has to be the one to give you the true correct answer.
It’s lucky for you that I stopped by this post when I did.
Your Question:
Please explain why in arena his Darth Vader SPEED: 213 activated before my Moff Gideon with SPEED: 233.
The True Correct Answer:
Because your Arena Opponent is a bad player. They are probably a beginner that doesn’t know how the team is supposed to function. They made Vader fast because they don’t know any better.
There is no way on this beautiful Green Earth that Vader should be going first.
Your opponent enemy team was:
- M.JADE
- A.THRAWN
- E.PALPATINE
- Royal Guard
Vader is the 4th slowest character on the team.
The fact your opponent got Vader faster vs. rest of his team is a remarkable achievement in itself.
What should of happened is M.Jade or A.Thrawn should of went first.
Than they should of give turn meter to E.Palpatine.
Than E.Palpatine should of did AOE Stun making your units unable to move.
At that point, Vader should of unleashed a crazy AOE hit.
The hit should of been so devastating it kills everything.
——————
So now you know the true correct answer.
It never had to do with Vader’s unique.
Vader’s unique should have never came into play.
Vader base speed is 141.
Vader, you faced had 213
72 extra speed coming from Mod’s.
A 5 dot arrow Mod at +15 can get you 30 speed.
How to get remaining 42 speed?
Speed set bonus or Speed in secondary Sub-stats or both
Speed set bonus on Vader will miss out on damage potential.
It’s bad Modding with bad team turn order.
M.Jade -> E.Palpatine AOE 2 Turn Stun -> A.Thrawn Fracture or TM Swap to Vader -> Vader
Vader doesn’t need any speed at that point.
Vader could be built as Slow Roll Closer
Critical Damage set + Critical Rate set
Offense % Arrow
C.Damage or C.Rate Triangle
Offense % Cross
Vader will unleash chaos with a build like that.
The hit will be so devastating and if he has the Zeta.
It’s just Game Over!
——————
Yeah, The OP said it best.
“Usually, the hero going first is the one which lets his team trigger the carousel.”
Vader isn’t the Carousel starter on this team.
Vader is the Closer.
TLDR: I'm new and I'm saying to ignore all the (correct) advice that the above players have given in favour of some modding advice which doesn't make a whole bunch of sense.
Your problem here is ignoring Vader's unique (which is frankly the OG "Carousel starter", from the good old days when you used your EP DV to counter Darth Traya in Arena). Vader's unique absolutely applies here as there are no caveats to getting the speed gain -
"At the start of each encounter, Darth Vader gains 8 Speed until the end of the encounter for each of the following: Empire ally, Sith ally, Jedi enemy, and Rebel enemy.
Darth Vader is immune to Turn Meter reduction and recovers 5% Health and 2% Protection whenever a Damage Over Time effect on an enemy expires. Whenever Darth Vader activates Merciless Massacre, dispel Stealth from all enemies."
Vader with 5 empire allies and 2 Sith allies is an extra 7*8 = 56 speed.
Look I run ep mara thrawn Vader and my last spot changes. But vaders unique comes into effect no matter what is going on in the battle, so a 213 Vader is actually a 269 Vader
I run my Vader faster with higher relics and mods
Mara is always second to go if theirs Vader. Unless your Mara is reliced.
But those other posts from veteran players give wrong answers and misinformation!
I have no problem with 6 week players. I don’t have a big problem with 6 week players contributing to threads.
But I have a big problem with comments like
To decry the proper explanations of what OP is asking about as misinformation, then to insist that OP is “lucky” to read the complete garbage that follows is downright dangerous. And I’ll call it out whenever I see it.
Do you use Speed Primary Arrow on your Vader?
If you do, Than your Vader isn’t built right.
Thus, you run into the problem of Mara Jade going 2nd.
Your Mara Jade should go 1st.
Than Palpatine 2nd
Try running:
Arrow - Offense % Arrow
Triangle - C.DMG or C.Rate
Cross - Offense % or Potency
If your going for pure Damage, than Offense % Cross is better.
If your going for Damage Over Time, than Potency Cross can be better.
Just depends on what your going for.
So I am not going to edit, I just want to clarify when I say Pure Damages. I don’t mean Pure Damages.
It was bad wording. What I meant was having 2 Offense % primaries will make Vader hit crazy hard, but he might not land his Damage over time.
So it is a trade off.
I forgot that this game does have a Pure Damage mechanic which is different from what I’m trying to mean
Then you add whatever unique abilities may add speed and speed added from leadership abilities.
Combined is what the actual speed of the character would be once you enter battle. That’s pretty much as simple as I can put it.
I have no idea what PlayerJ is talking about so try to ignore that…
If you think my comments are irrelevant to this threads discussion, than you have failed to comprehend what I have said.
You may have read my post, but you didn’t fully understand it.
The OP asked the question:
Please explain why in arena Darth Vader SPEED: 213 activated before my Moff Gideon with SPEED: 233.
My answer:
Because the Darth Vader has been built poorly!
Vader shouldn’t be going 1st!
Mara Jade or Thrawn move 1st on that team
That is not remotely the answer the OP is looking for…
He’s asking why his opponent’s 213 speed Darth Vader is outspeeding his own 233 Moff Gideon. He’s not asking why Darth Vader is the first character on the enemy team to take a turn…
fify
You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and you are completely dangerous to anyone you give advice to.
Mara isn't even mentioned in the OP first of all, and second of all, you would use Mara on a Palp lead team.
Actually, you don’t know what answer the OP is looking for because your not the OP.
You are assuming the OP doesn’t know about Vader Unique.
What if the OP does know about Vader’s Unique?
If the OP does know about Vader’s Unique, It changes the nature of the OP question.
The question no longer applies to the individual characters (Vader & Gideon).
The question becomes a broad question where upon a person needs to know the team composition of enemy in order to decipher how the enemy team is supposed to function.
If the OP was only talking about Vader & Gideon, The OP wouldn’t have needed to add in the opponent team composition.
The OP did add in enemy team composition.
The OP could know about Vader unique.
Which means the OP question is a complex question which people are pass off with a simplistic answer.
The answer I gave is a complex answer.
Maybe, Just maybe
I really am the only one who seems to fully understand what the OP is asking.
Perhaps, you should take a moment to dig a little deeper into the OP question.
It speaks volumes that they joined the forums and asked the question on 01/10, had it correctly answered on 02/10 and have been inactive since.
Question asked and answered. Nothing further to see.
@Nicestorybro I hope you got the answers you wanted.
Then OP would need
To be dumb as you to phrase
The question like this:
Or maybe, just maybe, you should look at the team the OP posted along with the question they asked and answer accordingly or don't answer at all... I am leaning heavily towards door #2
Not necessarily!
What if the OP is a Veteran player who has played the game for many years and has decided to do a restart account.
Sometimes, Veteran players create new accounts for fun to experience game as new again.
Than while the OP was playing in Arena he ran across a player who had a Vader faster vs. his Gideon and became shell shocked.
As Veteran player who has played many years vs. good players, He may have been discombobulated by the enemy team running a fast Vader.
He could at that point be questioning whether or not the opponent team with a fast Vader is completely brilliant or totally bad.
Thus, the above confusion could of lead the OP to ask question here, He could be asking the question to get reassurance that Vader isn’t supposed to be going first in that situation.
Again, We don’t know the context of the post or the extent of knowledge the OP has.
Telling the OP Vader unique is the reason Vader is faster vs. Gideon could be seen as insulting.
You are insulting the OP intelligence by assuming he doesn’t know about the unique.
Nothing the OP said would indicate he is a Beginner.
The OP explained the games speed mechanic which would indicate he has knowledge.
The OP also gave us enough context clues to lead us into thinking the question is a complex question.
You are assuming the OP asked the question and got a suitable answer.
The OP could of asked the question.
Than came to the thread and got upset by the answers people gave him.
Than has not decided to come back due to thinking the people in the forums is rude.