Why Light Side is the perfect decision for TB.

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  • BrtStlnd
    1094 posts Member
    edited August 2017
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    Rogee wrote: »
    I don't know about everyone else... /sarcasm/
    but my first free and unlocked characters were Light Side... the Dark Side characters came a little later.

    No need to fret, they will release a Dark Side TB in the future. And for the (I'm guessing/speculating this figure) 25% of the player base that focused on Dark Side, are the ones upset that first TB is LS.

    IF YOU were the developer, you would target the largest audience for success initially, i.e. the other 75% of the playerbase that has strong LS roster. Hence it's less impactful to upset 25% instead of the 75%.

    Once both LS and DS TB are in full effect this will be a non-issue. And the same for new players who won't have a bias that they expect the game to conform to their imposed character focus. Also, imagine the uproar from the 75% about how the required DS take much longer to farm than most of the LS. Everyone would suffer the less rewards and much longer ramp up time to be prepared for a DS TB.

    Hi @Rogee

    My point is that it wasn’t necessary to completely limit participation to LS. Give bonuses but let everyone use their characters.
  • JacenRoe
    3016 posts Member
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    Rogee wrote: »
    I don't know about everyone else... /sarcasm/
    but my first free and unlocked characters were Light Side... the Dark Side characters came a little later.

    No need to fret, they will release a Dark Side TB in the future. And for the (I'm guessing/speculating this figure) 25% of the player base that focused on Dark Side, are the ones upset that first TB is LS.

    IF YOU were the developer, you would target the largest audience for success initially, i.e. the other 75% of the playerbase that has strong LS roster. Hence it's less impactful to upset 25% instead of the 75%.

    Once both LS and DS TB are in full effect this will be a non-issue. And the same for new players who won't have a bias that they expect the game to conform to their imposed character focus. Also, imagine the uproar from the 75% about how the required DS take much longer to farm than most of the LS. Everyone would suffer the less rewards and much longer ramp up time to be prepared for a DS TB.

    Did you know that 83% of people have on at least one occasion made up completely fake stats out of thin air to prove a point?
  • Rogee
    178 posts Member
    edited August 2017
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    JacenRoe wrote: »
    Did you know that 83% of people have on at least one occasion made up completely fake stats out of thin air to prove a point?

    But I have a pie chart to give validity to my bogus claims.

    piechart-copy.jpg

  • Jinks
    50 posts Member
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    Looks more like a cake to me and everyone knows how truthful cake is.

    Yes. I am trying to hold the devs accountable. No other guild/group game mode sidelines a huge segment of a players roster. It was unnecessary to create that ban. Individual smaller activities like Assault battles have restrictions but that only impacts my personal ability to complete that small activity. The problem here is that TB is a team activity and everyone wants to do a good job to help their team/guild. A large part of that is to succeed on the battlefield. Folks who have primarily developed DS rosters have been sidelined for no good reason other than the whims/willful manipulation of the developers. It is disingenuous and unfair to make these restrictions especially after falsely advertising that you can use all of your inventory. I've been working on my LS roster all along but my DS guys are the ones that get the non swappable goodies (Zetas/Gear).

    The point that there will be a DS TB is not a solution. That will sideline the LS guys at that point. The solution should have been that they didn't sideline anyone at all. There are real reasons for creating these restrictions that have nothing whatsoever to do with theme. It doesn't even have anything to do with favoritism. It's something truly Dark Side ;)
  • JacenRoe
    3016 posts Member
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    Rogee wrote: »
    JacenRoe wrote: »
    Did you know that 83% of people have on at least one occasion made up completely fake stats out of thin air to prove a point?

    But I have a pie chart to give validity to my bogus claims.

    piechart-copy.jpg

    :D

    That's much better. I will say that if more people do have more light side it's not because they are liked by 75% of people. (It's totally anecdotal, and not firm evidence, but the guilds I have been in have been largely even splits if not more dark side friendly.) It's because they are forced on us. The Rebels get more characters than any other faction, and more time at the top of the meta, and every time we were told that it was time for Sith, or Empire to take center stage it was always accompanied by more and better Rebels being added as well.

    People feel like Rebels are being shoved down their throats, and dark side is the forgotten step child. Making it so that the newest, biggest and most important game mode doesn't even allow you to fight with any dark side characters is over the top for many long suffering dark siders who have had enough. Especially since we have no clue when a new map for TB might come out. Major game modes could take several months.

    Again, I'm a Jedi fan mostly, and I'm in good shape for TB, but I'm very sympathetic to the DS fans who are getting inexcusably shafted again.
  • Rogee
    178 posts Member
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    There will be a Dark Side TB right around when people start unlocking Hermit Yoda en masse. Then we will have a ton of Dark Side requirements that nobody is ready for and we will repeat the process and complaining.

    Just enjoy the new content and be happy...it's a game.
  • JohnnySteelAlpha
    2794 posts Member
    edited August 2017
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    NicWester wrote: »
    Swordd wrote: »
    There is no reason this had to be one way or the other.
    There's no reason anything has to be anything, sure. But there's plenty of reasons why you should do something, for example making this a light sode event this time.

    Light is popular. Like, way more popular. Way, way, way more popular. Star Wars is the story of the Light Side beating up the Dark Side and taking its lunch money. Sure, Dark Side is cool and edgey in a "Zach Snyder makes the best movies so dark and grin" kind of way. But it's the losing side and it's the evil side. Why wouldn't the first Battle be Light-oriented?

    Not sure I agree with this - arguably the most popular singular character is Vader. Also, the DS doesn't get routed - how many planets between the Death Star and the Starkiller base were destroyed? How many rebels were destroyed? That's some massive destruction done by the DS. Hoth Rebel Soldier, Scout -all the R1 rebels we need for TB - ... were killed by the Empire. Same for Biggs DL. How did the Empire actually end? Not at the hands of LS toons - DV was killed by EP and EP was killed by DV simultaneously. The most key Rebel and LS character in the series was going to be roasted alive by the Emperor. That's an honest commentary that the DS can't win - even when they actually defeat the LS from a personnel standpoint, the LS comes to the surface through Anakin and the connection to his son....but a traditional LS character does not kill DV or EP. Could Luke have killed DV? Yes, if he wanted to - just like DV could have killed Luke earlier. However, had he done that and still refused to join the Emperor, most likely he would have been ground in to a fine dust. The way the series presents the story mainly from the traditional hero side makes it seem like it's some curb stomp - also the ridiculousness with how incompetent some of the troopers aim is - but if you step back and start counting up what actually has happened on screen and what we know of mentioned off screen it's much more balanced.

    I think we keep getting rammed with Rebels because of Disney / marketing focus - not anything that's really based in lore. The R1 movie was Rebel-focused, the Rebels cartoon series is rebel focused - Disney pushes the good guys for profit. This game is a big commercial that we are playing.
  • Rogee
    178 posts Member
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    NicWester wrote: »
    Swordd wrote: »
    There is no reason this had to be one way or the other.
    There's no reason anything has to be anything, sure. But there's plenty of reasons why you should do something, for example making this a light sode event this time.

    Light is popular. Like, way more popular. Way, way, way more popular. Star Wars is the story of the Light Side beating up the Dark Side and taking its lunch money. Sure, Dark Side is cool and edgey in a "Zach Snyder makes the best movies so dark and grin" kind of way. But it's the losing side and it's the evil side. Why wouldn't the first Battle be Light-oriented?
    I think we keep getting rammed with Rebels because of Disney / marketing focus - not anything that's really based in lore. The R1 movie was Rebel-focused, the Rebels cartoon series is rebel focused - Disney pushes the good guys for profit. This game is a big commercial that we are playing.

    This!

    It's just like actuon figures sold from cartoons, creators would kill off, or write off characters to bring in new ones to promote selling new figurines.
  • Options
    Yes. I'm certain the good guys are pushed for profit and definitely not for any other reasons. If Rebels weren't so profitable, I am sure our favorite friendly planet-busting genocidal space n@zis would be the center stage.

    Absolutely market-driven decision with no other possible facets.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
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    I would struggle so much if they made a DS territory battle but deep down I really really really want to se a TB invasion on Dathomir........ that would be Epic to see the separatist and Sith annihilating the NightSisters and with it a General G rework a separatist Faction pass and a addition of NightSisters to level the playing field....... anybody say mother Talzin, Droideka, NightSister assassins, Hunter Droids?
  • Options
    HyperCalm1 wrote: »
    Jinks wrote: »
    One can can only hope. 2017 was the rear of the Dark Side. This message was approved by Dr. Freud.

    Yeah because Nihilus and Thrawn are obviously no good.

    You say that like they make up for the lightside imbalance lmao.

    DN is one of the best darkside toons and is the only
    Darkside toon that is viable in top arena play meta consistently other than thrawn but thrawn has only been present in the meta since June which is only the thrAwn meta and the current CL.


    May I remind you that on A EMPIRE REWORK PASS they introduced 2 rebels lmao.

    And you mentioned thrawn and DN like we should be grateful and they somehow magically balance the imbalance when lightside has

    Rex ( top meta since like ever)
    GK ( top meta since release)
    Chaze (top meta since release)
    R2 (top meta since release)


    Ohh btw don't try to mention toons like palp or Vader who's time was very short lived and put back on the shelf. And do you know why? Guessssssss what?!?! Rebels! Rebels rebels!

  • Options
    If they keep pushing the LS toons, at least give me 8 yr old Anakin and Jar Jar so I can alternate feeding them to the Rancor for my zero post.
  • Options
    I would've preferred if they were going to do an LS focused TB if wouldn't be Hoth.

    Pretty much the only on screen battle in history where the DS won, they could've waited and done Hoth second and made it DS focused.

    What TB are we going to have in the future that is DS focused when the best option is already taken.

    As mention above not sure why it isn't mixed (though I guess it could be and we just haven't seen the one or two parts of the TB that need them.

    In my opinion, Hoth should've either been mixed - some LS battles that need HRS's and such, but also battles that need GV, DV, Snowtrooper, etc. or been strictly DS.

    @Tromedlov13 The DS one will be "Save our Star", with a mostly in-space X-Wing shoot-them-up that ends in a race against time to shoot Luke in that trench and prevent him to launch that bomb.
    ☮ Consular ☮ - https://swgoh.gg/u/tiggus/
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    xReDeMpx wrote: »
    HyperCalm1 wrote: »
    Jinks wrote: »
    One can can only hope. 2017 was the rear of the Dark Side. This message was approved by Dr. Freud.

    Yeah because Nihilus and Thrawn are obviously no good.

    You say that like they make up for the lightside imbalance lmao. Bla bla bla, meta meta meta, bla....

    Please remind me and tell me what not to mention. My favorite faction is Bounty Hunters so don't tell me or remind me of anything. I like this game and I'm trying to enjoy all of the content. Anyone that has played more than a few months knows not to focus solely on one thing. I care about more than meta. LYAO all you want.
  • Options
    NicWester wrote: »
    Yes. I'm certain the good guys are pushed for profit and definitely not for any other reasons. If Rebels weren't so profitable, I am sure our favorite friendly planet-busting genocidal space n@zis would be the center stage.

    Absolutely market-driven decision with no other possible facets.

    Disney is not going to create a dark-side focused story targeted at little kids like Rebels. The rebel focus isn't because in the story lore-wise they are OP or whipping up the Empire, it's because of target demographic and marketing decisions. That then gets reflected in this game naturally since Disney wants it to fit with their overall branding and marketing strategy. Disney just whipped up the Rebles series out of nowhere - they have full power to continue to bend the series anyway they want and given what Disney is, that will surely be a light side biased perspective.

    See canon approved series below for even younger audiences - no dark side here either.

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_Forces_of_Destiny

    Ventress has a pretty interesting story arc from Clone Wars - why not bring in her as a female? Doesn't fit the marketing plan to hook the kids. It's just more marketing-based focus of LS characters that really doesn't have anything to do with the story and lore overall.

    Many of the rebels we see in arena ... actually were killed by the Empire. Chaze wasn't even killed by force wielding Empire. The rebels really didn't win - the light side of the force and the good still left in Anakin is what won ultimately.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
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    leef wrote: »
    yup, it's a blessing (in disguise for some).

    correction: in disguise for most ;)
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Mzee
    1777 posts Member
    edited August 2017
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    It was poor timing. Dark side already are getting stomped on, and this makes it worse. Dark Side are inferior in every aspect of the game already, and dark side users in my guild (including me) are understandably very upset.

    And, for everyone saying DS will get their event in the future, it seems likely, but there is no guarantee, and when will it come out? 6 months, a year? Unless there was an announcement this argument just isn't one right now.
  • Options
    NicWester wrote: »
    Swordd wrote: »
    There is no reason this had to be one way or the other.
    There's no reason anything has to be anything, sure. But there's plenty of reasons why you should do something, for example making this a light sode event this time.

    Light is popular. Like, way more popular. Way, way, way more popular. Star Wars is the story of the Light Side beating up the Dark Side and taking its lunch money. Sure, Dark Side is cool and edgey in a "Zach Snyder makes the best movies so dark and grin" kind of way. But it's the losing side and it's the evil side. Why wouldn't the first Battle be Light-oriented?

    Star Wars is the story of Jedi v Sith. The 'rebels' would've been smacked into non-existence if not for the jedi ie Luke.
    But look at how they are treated in this 'game'.
    Star Wars: Galaxy of Rebels? Yeah, that were hopelessly outclassed until the jedi returned to save them.
  • Options
    I just want to know why I bothered farming veers? First was cause I thought he and the troopers were going to be useful (they aren't). Then I see TB is in hoth, a battle the DS won and left the rebels scrambling, so figured fo' sure veers will be in TB. :neutral:
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
    edited August 2017
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    warmonkey wrote: »
    I just want to know why I bothered farming veers? First was cause I thought he and the troopers were going to be useful (they aren't). Then I see TB is in hoth, a battle the DS won and left the rebels scrambling, so figured fo' sure veers will be in TB. :neutral:

    i remember a mention of a Veers boost/buff in TB, thought by a dev. Can't find it anymore unfortunately, so i'm probably wrong.
    Veers + troopers should be an awesome team for when a DS TB comes around. (wich inevitably will come around, right? right?! ;) ) It's one of the reasons i'll finish my Veers farm, also because i think it's a cool team ofcourse.
    Save water, drink champagne!
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    Mzee wrote: »
    It was poor timing. Dark side already are getting stomped on, and this makes it worse. Dark Side are inferior in every aspect of the game already, and dark side users in my guild (including me) are understandably very upset.

    And, for everyone saying DS will get their event in the future, it seems likely, but there is no guarantee, and when will it come out? 6 months, a year? Unless there was an announcement this argument just isn't one right now.

    Exactly. Saying “well you’ll get one in the future” isn’t a valid response because 1) you don’t know that 2) am I supposed to be not disappointed because MAYBE in another year I can finally use the best characters on my roster?

    The fact that dark side characters are not up to par competitively with light side is already frustrating enough, but they seem intent on not just maintaining that gap, but making the it bigger.
  • Options
    Since developers took the time to explain their thinking on the 12h window, I would love to hear the justification for excluding DS completely.
  • leef
    13458 posts Member
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    BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Mzee wrote: »
    It was poor timing. Dark side already are getting stomped on, and this makes it worse. Dark Side are inferior in every aspect of the game already, and dark side users in my guild (including me) are understandably very upset.

    And, for everyone saying DS will get their event in the future, it seems likely, but there is no guarantee, and when will it come out? 6 months, a year? Unless there was an announcement this argument just isn't one right now.

    Exactly. Saying “well you’ll get one in the future” isn’t a valid response because 1) you don’t know that 2) am I supposed to be not disappointed because MAYBE in another year I can finally use the best characters on my roster?

    The fact that dark side characters are not up to par competitively with light side is already frustrating enough, but they seem intent on not just maintaining that gap, but making the it bigger.

    Well, if you think dark side is that much worse than light side already, wouldn't that also mean that it's very fortunate that TB is light side?
    I'm one of the people who believes there's bound to be a DS TB, so making the first 1 LS makes perfect sence to me. More LS characters ingame, large rebel faction so that alot of players meet the restrictions for specific battles rather easily (obviously not the cpt han, HRsoldier ones ofcourse). Pretty much just easier across the board for your average player than a DS TB map.
    I can only guess why they didn't just make it DS and LS, wich is kinda lame that they didn't, but maybe they thought having to have DS teams aswell would make it too difficult to get a team together for DS restrictions aswell. I don't know. One thing is for sure though, DS is gonna suck for a whole lot more people than LS.
    Save water, drink champagne!
  • Onark
    104 posts Member
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    BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Since developers took the time to explain their thinking on the 12h window, I would love to hear the justification for excluding DS completely.

    +1
  • Options
    leef wrote: »
    BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Mzee wrote: »
    It was poor timing. Dark side already are getting stomped on, and this makes it worse. Dark Side are inferior in every aspect of the game already, and dark side users in my guild (including me) are understandably very upset.

    And, for everyone saying DS will get their event in the future, it seems likely, but there is no guarantee, and when will it come out? 6 months, a year? Unless there was an announcement this argument just isn't one right now.

    Exactly. Saying “well you’ll get one in the future” isn’t a valid response because 1) you don’t know that 2) am I supposed to be not disappointed because MAYBE in another year I can finally use the best characters on my roster?

    The fact that dark side characters are not up to par competitively with light side is already frustrating enough, but they seem intent on not just maintaining that gap, but making the it bigger.

    Well, if you think dark side is that much worse than light side already, wouldn't that also mean that it's very fortunate that TB is light side?
    I'm one of the people who believes there's bound to be a DS TB, so making the first 1 LS makes perfect sence to me. More LS characters ingame, large rebel faction so that alot of players meet the restrictions for specific battles rather easily (obviously not the cpt han, HRsoldier ones ofcourse). Pretty much just easier across the board for your average player than a DS TB map.
    I can only guess why they didn't just make it DS and LS, wich is kinda lame that they didn't, but maybe they thought having to have DS teams aswell would make it too difficult to get a team together for DS restrictions aswell. I don't know. One thing is for sure though, DS is gonna suck for a whole lot more people than LS.

    this was the exact reason behind the OP.
  • Options
    I would've preferred if they were going to do an LS focused TB if wouldn't be Hoth.

    Pretty much the only on screen battle in history where the DS won, they could've waited and done Hoth second and made it DS focused.

    What TB are we going to have in the future that is DS focused when the best option is already taken.

    As mention above not sure why it isn't mixed (though I guess it could be and we just haven't seen the one or two parts of the TB that need them.

    In my opinion, Hoth should've either been mixed - some LS battles that need HRS's and such, but also battles that need GV, DV, Snowtrooper, etc. or been strictly DS.


    ... Defending the death star?
  • Options
    I think we keep getting rammed with Rebels because of Disney / marketing focus - not anything that's really based in lore. The R1 movie was Rebel-focused, the Rebels cartoon series is rebel focused - Disney pushes the good guys for profit. This game is a big commercial that we are playing.

    Looking at it a different way, the movies (and therefore much of the marketing) is good guy focused because people like watching and rooting for an underdog good guy crushing evil. It starts with what sells in the box office long before what sells in toys (usually).
  • Mzee
    1777 posts Member
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    leef wrote: »
    BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Mzee wrote: »
    It was poor timing. Dark side already are getting stomped on, and this makes it worse. Dark Side are inferior in every aspect of the game already, and dark side users in my guild (including me) are understandably very upset.

    And, for everyone saying DS will get their event in the future, it seems likely, but there is no guarantee, and when will it come out? 6 months, a year? Unless there was an announcement this argument just isn't one right now.

    Exactly. Saying “well you’ll get one in the future” isn’t a valid response because 1) you don’t know that 2) am I supposed to be not disappointed because MAYBE in another year I can finally use the best characters on my roster?

    The fact that dark side characters are not up to par competitively with light side is already frustrating enough, but they seem intent on not just maintaining that gap, but making the it bigger.

    Well, if you think dark side is that much worse than light side already, wouldn't that also mean that it's very fortunate that TB is light side?
    I'm one of the people who believes there's bound to be a DS TB, so making the first 1 LS makes perfect sence to me. More LS characters ingame, large rebel faction so that alot of players meet the restrictions for specific battles rather easily (obviously not the cpt han, HRsoldier ones ofcourse). Pretty much just easier across the board for your average player than a DS TB map.
    I can only guess why they didn't just make it DS and LS, wich is kinda lame that they didn't, but maybe they thought having to have DS teams aswell would make it too difficult to get a team together for DS restrictions aswell. I don't know. One thing is for sure though, DS is gonna suck for a whole lot more people than LS.

    Amplify an existing imbalance issue between the 2 sides sounds like a good decision... This is the way I see it. I'd rather they work on lessening the issue instead.
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