My SW theory was that the Jedi that remained after order 66 limited their force use to avoid detection by Vader, which lead to normal aging, or perhaps accelerated aging due to "holding aging at bay" for so long with the force.
My "realistic" theory is that CGI simply wasn't good enough at the time of episode 1 to capture all the wrinkles and hair that ESB yoda had, and as such he looked younger. Ironically they used a puppet in TLJ when they probably could have convincingly done an excellent CGI yoda with 2017 tech, but were likely scared off by Ep1 yoda.
Yoda was a puppet in Phantom (a terrible one). He was later replaced with a CG model.
It’s ironic that with all the money in the world, Lucas couldn’t make a better puppet than the one he had 20 years earlier.
Because the prequels are trash films that care more about fan service than consistency and quality storytelling.
Fan service?
Do enlighten me DatBoi by what you mean by that statement.
People wanted to see Yoda flipping around and doing a bunch of shallow nonsense even though it directly contradicts his character in Empire. It’s part of the running theme in the prequels where the “quality” of a character is determined by how “strong” they are (Maul, Dooku, Yoda, Windu, Sidious, etc).
It didn't contradict anything. He simply called upon the force to guide his movements and give him energy and agility in a fight - old man Dooku did the same thing and so does Palpatine in his office.
Yoda may have still been able to do this in Empire, but he had no one to fight And he was at the end of his life anyway. Just because a being may live for 900 years or whatever, does not mean they can rapidly deteriorate within the last 30 years of their life either.
Interesting. I bet Yoda, and also Obi Wan, were not as physically active as they used to be. It was almost 20 years between the time they went into hiding, to the time ANH happens. Do we really think the two of them dropped learning about the force and started a strict diet/exercise routine to keep their bodies combat ready?
I don't care what galaxy you're from, 20 years will make a body weaker.
My SW theory was that the Jedi that remained after order 66 limited their force use to avoid detection by Vader, which lead to normal aging, or perhaps accelerated aging due to "holding aging at bay" for so long with the force.
My "realistic" theory is that CGI simply wasn't good enough at the time of episode 1 to capture all the wrinkles and hair that ESB yoda had, and as such he looked younger. Ironically they used a puppet in TLJ when they probably could have convincingly done an excellent CGI yoda with 2017 tech, but were likely scared off by Ep1 yoda.
Your points are possible for sure re: limiting force. But Yoda and Mace also made the points that as the dark side grew, their ability to use the force was diminishing as well, so that could be a factor too.
As for Yoda puppets - this is nothing more than fan service because Yoda as a puppet was received so well by the audience in Empire.But once CGI got to where it is now. Lucas saw this eventually and swapped out the terrible Phantom Menace puppet with a CGI Yoda, as he was forced to use a CGI in Es 2 & 3 due to fight scenes (not able to do with a puppet).
However, this again speaks to the failure of Rian Johnson in TLJ - he brought back the puppet (which still looked worse than what we got in Empire), when he should have used CGI.
If death is natural and immortality is the dark side power, wouldn't using the force to prolong life by preventing aging also be unnatural, thus making it a dark side trait?
Because the prequels are trash films that care more about fan service than consistency and quality storytelling.
Fan service?
Do enlighten me DatBoi by what you mean by that statement.
People wanted to see Yoda flipping around and doing a bunch of shallow nonsense even though it directly contradicts his character in Empire. It’s part of the running theme in the prequels where the “quality” of a character is determined by how “strong” they are (Maul, Dooku, Yoda, Windu, Sidious, etc).
It didn't contradict anything. He simply called upon the force to guide his movements and give him energy and agility in a fight - old man Dooku did the same thing and so does Palpatine in his office.
Yoda may have still been able to do this in Empire, but he had no one to fight And he was at the end of his life anyway. Just because a being may live for 900 years or whatever, does not mean they can rapidly deteriorate within the last 30 years of their life either.
Luke: But how am I to know the good side from the bad?
Yoda: You will know... when you are calm, at peace, passive. A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, NEVER for attack.
Luke: But tell my why I can't...
Yoda: No, no! There is no "why".
For me, Yoda Proper has always been a symbol of mind over matter. His teachings were about peace, creativity, and logic. Not screaming and flipping around and getting all pi$$ed off.
That’s why I love Luke’s final scene in TLJ. In that moment he is finally a true Jedi and completely embodies Yoda and Obi Wan’s teachings. He bests Kylo without using anger, offense, or even a lightsaber. He shows Kylo that true power is none of those things and that it will never be achievable by those who pursue the Dark Side.
The Original and Sequel trilogies were/are constantly expanding what the Force is, and is capable of. For Jedi, it’s never a weapon or a blunt object to be manipulated for commiting violence, it’s a mental state of peace where the Jedi elevates themself above the conflict and uses their wits to solve problems. The power of a Jedi shouldn’t be determined by how effectively they can hack people apart with a lazer sword, but rather by the strength of their character. This is fundamentally misunderstood by Lucas in the Prequels and it makes me question his creative involvement in the OT when all this was established.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
It doesn't change the fact that he created it and had the rights to do whatever he wanted.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
It doesn't change the fact that he created it and had the rights to do whatever he wanted.
And fans have the right to criticize his films and call him a hack
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
It doesn't change the fact that he created it and had the rights to do whatever he wanted.
And fans have the right to criticize his films and call him a hack
This is true, but I would dare say that disney has gone farther in destroying the franchise than Mr. Lucas.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
It doesn't change the fact that he created it and had the rights to do whatever he wanted.
And fans have the right to criticize his films and call him a hack
This is true, but I would dare say that disney has gone farther in destroying the franchise than Mr. Lucas.
I sort of agree, but probably not for all the same reasons. I think the quality of the new films (even the not-so-good ones) greatly exceeds that of the prequels, I’m just really feeling the fatigue.
This is true, but I would dare say that disney has gone farther in destroying the franchise than Mr. Lucas.[/quote]
I sort of agree, but probably not for all the same reasons. I think the quality of the new films (even the not-so-good ones) greatly exceeds that of the prequels, I’m just really feeling the fatigue.
[/quote]
Personally I would argue that the prequels hold their own, but requires a bit of thought to make it work out.
The more I think about them, the worse they get. If they have any redeeming qualities, it’s because the Clone Wars retconned so many of the plot holes.
The more I think about them, the worse they get. If they have any redeeming qualities, it’s because the Clone Wars retconned so many of the plot holes.
You'll have to remind me of what they are, because I can't think of any that actually make either trilogy bad.
Pushing content out does not equate to a golden age, it has to be good. TLJ reception and Solo bombing the box office proves that it kinda isn't.
TLJ was the top grossing movie of the year, beating its next closest competitor by over a hundred million dollars.
Solo was a dubious decision the moment it was announced, targeted at a small subsection of the audience, then went through highly publicized production problems, suffered a loss of faith from the company, received relatively little marketing push, and got put in a death slot next to Infinity War and Deadpool 2. The quality of the movie itself was almost irrelevant to its performance.
We have a Star Wars movie every year, and every one of them has been good. We had Star Wars: Rebels, which is a ton of quality content, right off the heels of Clone Wars, and we're about to get Resistance.
The comics are good. The novels are good. I can literally go to Barnes & Noble right now, close my eyes, and grab any random Star Wars novel and have faith that I grabbed a decent novel. That's never happened before. Legends was a garbage heap with a few gems. These books are actually consistently good.
There isn't just more. There's better Star Wars content right now than we've had in over a decade.
The more I think about them, the worse they get. If they have any redeeming qualities, it’s because the Clone Wars retconned so many of the plot holes.
You'll have to remind me of what they are, because I can't think of any that actually make either trilogy bad.
Why would a Trade Federation put a blockade on trade? What could Sidious possibly offer them that wouldn’t give up his identity? Why would the Republic send two monks to negotiate intergalactic trade routes? Why would Sidious order the deaths of two peaceful representatives from the Republic? If he wanted them dead, why would he use an obvious, visible gas instead of poisoning the tea that the Jedi just drank? How did Qui-Gon know what the deadly gas was without smelling it (which would kill him)? Why did the droids open the doors instead of just letting the Jedi run out of breathable air? If the assassination of the Jedi was supposed to be a covert operation (even if it makes no sense) why would the Nemoidians blow up their ship? Since when do Jedi have super speed and why is it never mentioned again?
That’s in the first ten minutes or so. Imagine three full length movies of that nonsense.
Who is Grevious and why should we care?
Why does Padme have any feelings for Anakin?
Why should we care about Obi Wan and Anakin’s conflict? (We never see them as friends in the PT)
Why would the Clones turn on the Jedi?
Why was the Jedi Order so goshdarn ignorant and naive?
Was Anakin inherently evil or was he swayed by Palpatine?
Pushing content out does not equate to a golden age, it has to be good. TLJ reception and Solo bombing the box office proves that it kinda isn't.
TLJ was the top grossing movie of the year, beating its next closest competitor by over a hundred million dollars.
Solo was a dubious decision the moment it was announced, targeted at a small subsection of the audience, then went through highly publicized production problems, suffered a loss of faith from the company, received relatively little marketing push, and got put in a death slot next to Infinity War and Deadpool 2. The quality of the movie itself was almost irrelevant to its performance.
We have a Star Wars movie every year, and every one of them has been good. We had Star Wars: Rebels, which is a ton of quality content, right off the heels of Clone Wars, and we're about to get Resistance.
The comics are good. The novels are good. I can literally go to Barnes & Noble right now, close my eyes, and grab any random Star Wars novel and have faith that I grabbed a decent novel. That's never happened before. Legends was a garbage heap with a few gems. These books are actually consistently good.
There isn't just more. There's better Star Wars content right now than we've had in over a decade.
I haven't delved into the comics or books, mind you I'm just going off of the movies, so I can't comment on those. Rogue One and Solo were decent. Rebels and Clones also had good content, agreed, hopefully the same staff are involved in Resistance. They tend to write good stuff. I wish I could say the same for FA and LJ. I watched both two weeks ago. I will say that FA grew on me a bit, but not by much. The first hour forty five minutes of LJ were all over the place, it was tough to sit through. Personally I would have like to see what the crew from the shows could've done with the main series.
As for legends, there was so much content, with so many contradictions (from what I've read and heard), that the only way to avoid issues was to eliminate it.
The more I think about them, the worse they get. If they have any redeeming qualities, it’s because the Clone Wars retconned so many of the plot holes.
You'll have to remind me of what they are, because I can't think of any that actually make either trilogy bad.
Why would a Trade Federation put a blockade on trade? Bad tariffs? Sidious most likely had something on them, the Nemoidians were cowards. They would do just about anything for someone, as long as they didn't die and more so if there was a profit.
What could Sidious possibly offer them that wouldn’t give up his identity? That is something to ponder, but doesn't have much to do with the relevancy of the PT. He could've offered trade deals, their lives, large fortunes. He told them that he was a sith lord, may have made promises for these things after he took power, that would keep his identity intact until he made a move. He had the cover of war to accumulate power to keep in office, promising to lay it down once the war was over. They TF also ended up dead before that.
Why would the Republic send two monks to negotiate intergalactic trade routes? Jedi are peace keepers, though seemingly poor ones at that. The Chancellor asked them to go most likely as a third party, that is supposed to have no bias in the deal.
Why would Sidious order the deaths of two peaceful representatives from the Republic? The order to kill the jedi was only to prevent the invasion of Naboo from being prematurely discovered, nothing else. After the jedi escape, plans were pushed forward, leading to the biggest mistake, leaving Jar Jar alive.
If he wanted them dead, why would he use an obvious, visible gas instead of poisoning the tea that the Jedi just drank? Maybe the gas was invisible in universe, but only colored for the audience sake. Like the orange blob under Luke's land speeder in ANH.
How did Qui-Gon know what the deadly gas was without smelling it (which would kill him)? Different gases or substances are lethal in different quantities.
Why did the droids open the doors instead of just letting the Jedi run out of breathable air? Droids... they are better comic relief than Jar Jar.
If the assassination of the Jedi was supposed to be a covert operation (even if it makes no sense) why would the Nemoidians blow up their ship? Prevent escape, but then again, why open the door.
Since when do Jedi have super speed and why is it never mentioned again? They also have super jump abilities. Also blocking laser fire doesn't count as super speed? I would think so.
That’s in the first ten minutes or so. Imagine three full length movies of that nonsense.
Episode 1 wasn't very good, I agree. I like to think that it was done as act 1 of the trilogy, and not a self contained movie, so to speak. Lucas knew he was going to make 2 more, and had somewhere to go. At least that's how I justify 1.
Who is Grevious and why should we care? I looked at Grevious and his back story. Was interesting. But they're doing this with the main movies more, making characters with backstories you have to go elsewhere to find out about...
Why does Padme have any feelings for Anakin? Stockholmes syndrome. (attempt at humor). It was creepy how he revealed that he killed a bunch of innocent sand people and shes like ok. That was bad writting. Maybe jedi mind trick too?
Why should we care about Obi Wan and Anakin’s conflict? (We never see them as friends in the PT)They didn't interact much. But AOTC established that Anakin was the padawan, didn't see the missing back story.
Why would the Clones turn on the Jedi? Thankfully the Clone Wars answered this. Each clone had a biochip that could "override" free will. Fives figured it out and dies because of it. Also why Rex didn't kill a jedi.
Why was the Jedi Order so goshdarn ignorant and naive? That was explained as the dark side clouding their judgement, but it does undermine how powerful the force is supposed to be. But we did hear the force was powerful from a jedi, so...
Was Anakin inherently evil or was he swayed by Palpatine? This has become more on my thoughts lately. I recently found out I was going to be a dad, so I'm worried about a million different things. I can't imagine adding a war, secret marriage and having the only group of people I know as family, the jedi, ask me to do something against my morals. The jedi forbid attachment, Anakin is attached to Padme and Palpatine is a silver tongued fox, metaphorically speaking. I think he just snapped big time. The life he wanted was forbidden by the jedi, he felt they were responsible.
Etc
Thank you for posting some questions, I hope you took this as more of a fun exercise and not me being aggressive or anything. Typically the reasons why are more with social issues, and then people get rude. I enjoyed talking about the movies themselves, and not real life issues. Thanks!!
Pushing content out does not equate to a golden age, it has to be good. TLJ reception and Solo bombing the box office proves that it kinda isn't.
TLJ was the top grossing movie of the year, beating its next closest competitor by over a hundred million dollars.
Solo was a dubious decision the moment it was announced, targeted at a small subsection of the audience, then went through highly publicized production problems, suffered a loss of faith from the company, received relatively little marketing push, and got put in a death slot next to Infinity War and Deadpool 2. The quality of the movie itself was almost irrelevant to its performance.
We have a Star Wars movie every year, and every one of them has been good. We had Star Wars: Rebels, which is a ton of quality content, right off the heels of Clone Wars, and we're about to get Resistance.
The comics are good. The novels are good. I can literally go to Barnes & Noble right now, close my eyes, and grab any random Star Wars novel and have faith that I grabbed a decent novel. That's never happened before. Legends was a garbage heap with a few gems. These books are actually consistently good.
There isn't just more. There's better Star Wars content right now than we've had in over a decade.
The truth! Personally, I didn't like TFA, but the rest has been dynamite. It's funny to me that critics rated TLJ so well and then the trolls destroyed the audience score. So many people were so caught up that any semblance of social issues were entwined into the movie that they didn't even bother really watching the movie. They saw it, but they didn't watch it.
People protesting Solo is their own loss.
The last 2 seasons of Rebels was some of the best Star Wars ever made.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
and Kathleen Kennedy or Rian Johnson hasn't done those things???
Pushing content out does not equate to a golden age, it has to be good. TLJ reception and Solo bombing the box office proves that it kinda isn't.
TLJ was the top grossing movie of the year, beating its next closest competitor by over a hundred million dollars.
Solo was a dubious decision the moment it was announced, targeted at a small subsection of the audience, then went through highly publicized production problems, suffered a loss of faith from the company, received relatively little marketing push, and got put in a death slot next to Infinity War and Deadpool 2. The quality of the movie itself was almost irrelevant to its performance.
We have a Star Wars movie every year, and every one of them has been good. We had Star Wars: Rebels, which is a ton of quality content, right off the heels of Clone Wars, and we're about to get Resistance.
The comics are good. The novels are good. I can literally go to Barnes & Noble right now, close my eyes, and grab any random Star Wars novel and have faith that I grabbed a decent novel. That's never happened before. Legends was a garbage heap with a few gems. These books are actually consistently good.
There isn't just more. There's better Star Wars content right now than we've had in over a decade.
Wow - there are many reasons Solo flopped and why TLJ was a terrible movie. Only critics and Disney shills seem to like it - I am sure there are some strange opinions of why individuals seem to have liked it, I like parts, not all is bad, but overall terrible.
It did fairly well at the box office but under performed greatly by what it was meant to rake in. Solo was nothing more than a huge backlash from the star wars community regarding TLJ and fallout there after such as political agendas and Disney, Johnson etc. attacking fans across the media.
I cannot go into detail about it. I have done so before and was warned on the forums about it - but all the reasons I listed are valid.
So simply spouting off nonsense such as poor marketing a star wars fatigue for Solo's failure is just plain and simple crazy.
Why would a Trade Federation put a blockade on trade?
Sidious wanted to cause the dispute as a stranglehold over Naboo - causing unrest in the senate and a sympathy vote, where a new chancellor election would be inevitable. That sympathy vote (as he was Senator for Naboo) would ensure his election as chancellor - he likely had to alter his plans a little but got what he wanted in the end.
What could Sidious possibly offer them that wouldn’t give up his identity?
Niemodians only knew him as a Sith Lord, who was promising them more wealth out of the deal once the new chancellor was elected, such as exclusive trade routes etc.
Why would the Republic send two monks to negotiate intergalactic trade routes?
The current chancellor's powers to do anything were blocked in the Senate by the Bureaucrats. Off the record he dispatched 2 Jedi (not monks - keepers of the galactic peace) to investigate the issue and resolve the trade dispute.
Why would Sidious order the deaths of two peaceful representatives from the Republic?
Because he was angered by the Chancellor involving the jedi that could foil his plan - dispatch them quickly and quietly, cover it up and they never arrived. Since it was an off the books mission anyway, there would have been no follow-up from the Republic.
If he wanted them dead, why would he use an obvious, visible gas instead of poisoning the tea that the Jedi just drank?
Sidious did not tell the trade federation how to kill the jedi, he just told them to kill them immediately. The trade federation are ****
How did Qui-Gon know what the deadly gas was without smelling it (which would kill him)?
he saw the gas and sensed danger? He was already skeptical as to how he and Obi wan were being treated as ambassaders of the republic
Why did the droids open the doors instead of just letting the Jedi run out of breathable air?
Again they are **** - if droids could think there would be none of us here.
If the assassination of the Jedi was supposed to be a covert operation (even if it makes no sense) why would the Nemoidians blow up their ship?
Because it was to be a cover up - they never arrived, as explained above.
Since when do Jedi have super speed and why is it never mentioned again?
Speed? Does Luke not jump at an incredible speed in TESB? Force speed is a standard force power. Before Disney came along and scrapped the EU the novel Shadows of the Empire was canon at that time uinder Lucas' control of the franchise. Luke trains in speed and many other force techniques
That’s in the first ten minutes or so. Imagine three full length movies of that nonsense.
Don't get me wrong though - there are some gaping plot holes in the PT, the above are not them though.
Any plot holes covered through the Clone Wars animated series is just poor story telling and writing of the PT movies in my opinion - any plot holes should have been covered within those movies and should not have needed a cartoon to clean up any loose ends.
Wow - there are many reasons Solo flopped and why TLJ was a terrible movie. Only critics and Disney shills seem to like it - I am sure there are some strange opinions of why individuals seem to have liked it, I like parts, not all is bad, but overall terrible.
Defining those who disagree with you as automatically irrelevant is also not discussing the topic in good faith. Folks can just have different opinions than you.
I am not a movie critic. I am not a Disney shill. I am a person, a moviegoer, and I am lifelong Star Wars fan who loved The Last Jedi, and liked Solo.
Degenerating into name calling to write me out of your worldview is terribly rude.
I would argue that whatever George Lucas deemed the force to be in any of the films is more or less gospel, since it is his creation.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
and Kathleen Kennedy or Rian Johnson hasn't done those things???
Not to the same degree. There are parts of the new films I truly love and consider some of the best star wars we’ve ever seen (Poe + Finn in TFA, Luke’s final scene in TLJ, Kylo betraying Snoke, the climax of Solo, the new droid characters, everything to do with the Force).
Any plot holes covered through the Clone Wars animated series is just poor story telling and writing of the PT movies in my opinion - any plot holes should have been covered within those movies and should not have needed a cartoon to clean up any loose ends.
Amen. I’m tired of people giving credit to the Prequels for things the Clone Wars did.
Because the prequels are trash films that care more about fan service than consistency and quality storytelling.
Fan service?
Do enlighten me DatBoi by what you mean by that statement.
People wanted to see Yoda flipping around and doing a bunch of shallow nonsense even though it directly contradicts his character in Empire. It’s part of the running theme in the prequels where the “quality” of a character is determined by how “strong” they are (Maul, Dooku, Yoda, Windu, Sidious, etc).
It didn't contradict anything. He simply called upon the force to guide his movements and give him energy and agility in a fight - old man Dooku did the same thing and so does Palpatine in his office.
Yoda may have still been able to do this in Empire, but he had no one to fight And he was at the end of his life anyway. Just because a being may live for 900 years or whatever, does not mean they can rapidly deteriorate within the last 30 years of their life either.
Luke: But how am I to know the good side from the bad?
Yoda: You will know... when you are calm, at peace, passive. A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, NEVER for attack.
Luke: But tell my why I can't...
Yoda: No, no! There is no "why".
For me, Yoda Proper has always been a symbol of mind over matter. His teachings were about peace, creativity, and logic. Not screaming and flipping around and getting all pi$$ed off.
That’s why I love Luke’s final scene in TLJ. In that moment he is finally a true Jedi and completely embodies Yoda and Obi Wan’s teachings. He bests Kylo without using anger, offense, or even a lightsaber. He shows Kylo that true power is none of those things and that it will never be achievable by those who pursue the Dark Side.
The Original and Sequel trilogies were/are constantly expanding what the Force is, and is capable of. For Jedi, it’s never a weapon or a blunt object to be manipulated for commiting violence, it’s a mental state of peace where the Jedi elevates themself above the conflict and uses their wits to solve problems. The power of a Jedi shouldn’t be determined by how effectively they can hack people apart with a lazer sword, but rather by the strength of their character. This is fundamentally misunderstood by Lucas in the Prequels and it makes me question his creative involvement in the OT when all this was established.
But now we have:
Force-skyping
Mary poppins astronauts
Force users who are completely unaware of there surroundings (Luke wasn't beaten by rey... he slipped on pebbles hahahahaha... that's now canon)
Thank god RJ put a stop to all that "adding to the force" nonsense.
Replies
Now this I wholeheartedly agree with, lol
Interesting. I bet Yoda, and also Obi Wan, were not as physically active as they used to be. It was almost 20 years between the time they went into hiding, to the time ANH happens. Do we really think the two of them dropped learning about the force and started a strict diet/exercise routine to keep their bodies combat ready?
I don't care what galaxy you're from, 20 years will make a body weaker.
Your points are possible for sure re: limiting force. But Yoda and Mace also made the points that as the dark side grew, their ability to use the force was diminishing as well, so that could be a factor too.
As for Yoda puppets - this is nothing more than fan service because Yoda as a puppet was received so well by the audience in Empire.But once CGI got to where it is now. Lucas saw this eventually and swapped out the terrible Phantom Menace puppet with a CGI Yoda, as he was forced to use a CGI in Es 2 & 3 due to fight scenes (not able to do with a puppet).
However, this again speaks to the failure of Rian Johnson in TLJ - he brought back the puppet (which still looked worse than what we got in Empire), when he should have used CGI.
Luke: But how am I to know the good side from the bad?
Yoda: You will know... when you are calm, at peace, passive. A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, NEVER for attack.
Luke: But tell my why I can't...
Yoda: No, no! There is no "why".
For me, Yoda Proper has always been a symbol of mind over matter. His teachings were about peace, creativity, and logic. Not screaming and flipping around and getting all pi$$ed off.
That’s why I love Luke’s final scene in TLJ. In that moment he is finally a true Jedi and completely embodies Yoda and Obi Wan’s teachings. He bests Kylo without using anger, offense, or even a lightsaber. He shows Kylo that true power is none of those things and that it will never be achievable by those who pursue the Dark Side.
The Original and Sequel trilogies were/are constantly expanding what the Force is, and is capable of. For Jedi, it’s never a weapon or a blunt object to be manipulated for commiting violence, it’s a mental state of peace where the Jedi elevates themself above the conflict and uses their wits to solve problems. The power of a Jedi shouldn’t be determined by how effectively they can hack people apart with a lazer sword, but rather by the strength of their character. This is fundamentally misunderstood by Lucas in the Prequels and it makes me question his creative involvement in the OT when all this was established.
Nope. I’ll give him credit for the initial spark of inspiration, but no more. I credit my love of Star Wars to Gary Kurtz, Marcia Lucas, John Williams, Lawrence Kasden, and Irvin Kershner. Those are the folks who elevated a simple sci fi flick into an epic masterpiece of character drama, heart, fun, and moral insightfulness.
Everything Lucas has done with SW since Empire has only strengthened my doubts over his creative abilities. He’s consistently shown a complete disregard for fans and what the first films established in tone, quality, and lore.
It doesn't change the fact that he created it and had the rights to do whatever he wanted.
And fans have the right to criticize his films and call him a hack
This is true, but I would dare say that disney has gone farther in destroying the franchise than Mr. Lucas.
You are not discussing this topic in anything remotely resembling good faith. Good day. We're in a golden age of Star Wars content right now.
I sort of agree, but probably not for all the same reasons. I think the quality of the new films (even the not-so-good ones) greatly exceeds that of the prequels, I’m just really feeling the fatigue.
Pushing content out does not equate to a golden age, it has to be good. TLJ reception and Solo bombing the box office proves that it kinda isn't.
I sort of agree, but probably not for all the same reasons. I think the quality of the new films (even the not-so-good ones) greatly exceeds that of the prequels, I’m just really feeling the fatigue.
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Personally I would argue that the prequels hold their own, but requires a bit of thought to make it work out.
You'll have to remind me of what they are, because I can't think of any that actually make either trilogy bad.
Solo was a dubious decision the moment it was announced, targeted at a small subsection of the audience, then went through highly publicized production problems, suffered a loss of faith from the company, received relatively little marketing push, and got put in a death slot next to Infinity War and Deadpool 2. The quality of the movie itself was almost irrelevant to its performance.
We have a Star Wars movie every year, and every one of them has been good. We had Star Wars: Rebels, which is a ton of quality content, right off the heels of Clone Wars, and we're about to get Resistance.
The comics are good. The novels are good. I can literally go to Barnes & Noble right now, close my eyes, and grab any random Star Wars novel and have faith that I grabbed a decent novel. That's never happened before. Legends was a garbage heap with a few gems. These books are actually consistently good.
There isn't just more. There's better Star Wars content right now than we've had in over a decade.
Why would a Trade Federation put a blockade on trade? What could Sidious possibly offer them that wouldn’t give up his identity? Why would the Republic send two monks to negotiate intergalactic trade routes? Why would Sidious order the deaths of two peaceful representatives from the Republic? If he wanted them dead, why would he use an obvious, visible gas instead of poisoning the tea that the Jedi just drank? How did Qui-Gon know what the deadly gas was without smelling it (which would kill him)? Why did the droids open the doors instead of just letting the Jedi run out of breathable air? If the assassination of the Jedi was supposed to be a covert operation (even if it makes no sense) why would the Nemoidians blow up their ship? Since when do Jedi have super speed and why is it never mentioned again?
That’s in the first ten minutes or so. Imagine three full length movies of that nonsense.
Who is Grevious and why should we care?
Why does Padme have any feelings for Anakin?
Why should we care about Obi Wan and Anakin’s conflict? (We never see them as friends in the PT)
Why would the Clones turn on the Jedi?
Why was the Jedi Order so goshdarn ignorant and naive?
Was Anakin inherently evil or was he swayed by Palpatine?
Etc
I haven't delved into the comics or books, mind you I'm just going off of the movies, so I can't comment on those. Rogue One and Solo were decent. Rebels and Clones also had good content, agreed, hopefully the same staff are involved in Resistance. They tend to write good stuff. I wish I could say the same for FA and LJ. I watched both two weeks ago. I will say that FA grew on me a bit, but not by much. The first hour forty five minutes of LJ were all over the place, it was tough to sit through. Personally I would have like to see what the crew from the shows could've done with the main series.
As for legends, there was so much content, with so many contradictions (from what I've read and heard), that the only way to avoid issues was to eliminate it.
Thank you for posting some questions, I hope you took this as more of a fun exercise and not me being aggressive or anything. Typically the reasons why are more with social issues, and then people get rude. I enjoyed talking about the movies themselves, and not real life issues. Thanks!!
The truth! Personally, I didn't like TFA, but the rest has been dynamite. It's funny to me that critics rated TLJ so well and then the trolls destroyed the audience score. So many people were so caught up that any semblance of social issues were entwined into the movie that they didn't even bother really watching the movie. They saw it, but they didn't watch it.
People protesting Solo is their own loss.
The last 2 seasons of Rebels was some of the best Star Wars ever made.
and Kathleen Kennedy or Rian Johnson hasn't done those things???
You brought up Legends in your points, so I did the same - ????????????????
Wow - there are many reasons Solo flopped and why TLJ was a terrible movie. Only critics and Disney shills seem to like it - I am sure there are some strange opinions of why individuals seem to have liked it, I like parts, not all is bad, but overall terrible.
It did fairly well at the box office but under performed greatly by what it was meant to rake in. Solo was nothing more than a huge backlash from the star wars community regarding TLJ and fallout there after such as political agendas and Disney, Johnson etc. attacking fans across the media.
I cannot go into detail about it. I have done so before and was warned on the forums about it - but all the reasons I listed are valid.
So simply spouting off nonsense such as poor marketing a star wars fatigue for Solo's failure is just plain and simple crazy.
Why would a Trade Federation put a blockade on trade?
Sidious wanted to cause the dispute as a stranglehold over Naboo - causing unrest in the senate and a sympathy vote, where a new chancellor election would be inevitable. That sympathy vote (as he was Senator for Naboo) would ensure his election as chancellor - he likely had to alter his plans a little but got what he wanted in the end.
What could Sidious possibly offer them that wouldn’t give up his identity?
Niemodians only knew him as a Sith Lord, who was promising them more wealth out of the deal once the new chancellor was elected, such as exclusive trade routes etc.
Why would the Republic send two monks to negotiate intergalactic trade routes?
The current chancellor's powers to do anything were blocked in the Senate by the Bureaucrats. Off the record he dispatched 2 Jedi (not monks - keepers of the galactic peace) to investigate the issue and resolve the trade dispute.
Why would Sidious order the deaths of two peaceful representatives from the Republic?
Because he was angered by the Chancellor involving the jedi that could foil his plan - dispatch them quickly and quietly, cover it up and they never arrived. Since it was an off the books mission anyway, there would have been no follow-up from the Republic.
If he wanted them dead, why would he use an obvious, visible gas instead of poisoning the tea that the Jedi just drank?
Sidious did not tell the trade federation how to kill the jedi, he just told them to kill them immediately. The trade federation are ****
How did Qui-Gon know what the deadly gas was without smelling it (which would kill him)?
he saw the gas and sensed danger? He was already skeptical as to how he and Obi wan were being treated as ambassaders of the republic
Why did the droids open the doors instead of just letting the Jedi run out of breathable air?
Again they are **** - if droids could think there would be none of us here.
If the assassination of the Jedi was supposed to be a covert operation (even if it makes no sense) why would the Nemoidians blow up their ship?
Because it was to be a cover up - they never arrived, as explained above.
Since when do Jedi have super speed and why is it never mentioned again?
Speed? Does Luke not jump at an incredible speed in TESB? Force speed is a standard force power. Before Disney came along and scrapped the EU the novel Shadows of the Empire was canon at that time uinder Lucas' control of the franchise. Luke trains in speed and many other force techniques
That’s in the first ten minutes or so. Imagine three full length movies of that nonsense.
Don't get me wrong though - there are some gaping plot holes in the PT, the above are not them though.
Any plot holes covered through the Clone Wars animated series is just poor story telling and writing of the PT movies in my opinion - any plot holes should have been covered within those movies and should not have needed a cartoon to clean up any loose ends.
I am not a movie critic. I am not a Disney shill. I am a person, a moviegoer, and I am lifelong Star Wars fan who loved The Last Jedi, and liked Solo.
Degenerating into name calling to write me out of your worldview is terribly rude.
Not to the same degree. There are parts of the new films I truly love and consider some of the best star wars we’ve ever seen (Poe + Finn in TFA, Luke’s final scene in TLJ, Kylo betraying Snoke, the climax of Solo, the new droid characters, everything to do with the Force).
I can’t say the same for the prequels.
Amen. I’m tired of people giving credit to the Prequels for things the Clone Wars did.
But now we have:
Force-skyping
Mary poppins astronauts
Force users who are completely unaware of there surroundings (Luke wasn't beaten by rey... he slipped on pebbles hahahahaha... that's now canon)
Thank god RJ put a stop to all that "adding to the force" nonsense.