He wants optimal strategies. Something that isn’t just put your best squad in and blast away. It’s only phase 1, but I didn’t see much room for strategy either, other than the need for mod adjustments.
@Bulldog1205
Care to elaborate on that? Mostly what you mean by "strategy". Are we talking team selection and kill order for example, because it seems to me that both definately make a difference.
Heck, people are already complaining about the random combat mission bosses because the different bosses require different strategies.
Putting in your best squad and just blasting away seems very unbulldog1205y, what's up with that? haha
But that randomness is kind of what I mean though. If I’m understanding people right it’s like Hoth TB in that the enemies aren’t the same every time. Others are reporting getting bosses in different areas than I did. So that means you can’t properly prepare by bringing in a specific team to counter your opponents. You kind of just have to go with your best team.
Which is something I'm disappointed with. I'd much rather have a different boss fixed for each mission and need 11 or 12 different teams than be forced to go with my best 4 or 5 for the entire TB.
Oh my god the new content is challenging and it's harder to debuff higher level enemies? We can't have that!! I want to be able to put it on auto so the game becomes boring again!!!
Mod for potency, bring a character with tenacity down, or use a team that isn't debuff dependent.
I think I know the one you're talking about. There was ONE phase of ONE battle where they seemed to resist a bunch. I was using Bossk lead bounty hunters with Dengar on the team. Dengar gives tenacity down. On the turns they didn't have tenacity down I was at least healing anyhow because with Bossk you heal even when your debuffs are resisted. It was a near effortless 4/4 win.
Granted it took a while, and I couldn't do it on auto, but I thought the point of this new TB is that we won't destroy it on auto for at least a few months.
It's called end game content for a reason. It was also explained to be more difficult than anything we had seen before.
For sure... but in fact when a game add new end game, they make the old game content more easy. That help new player to join the old player...CG add new content and never make easy the old content.
One of the thing who made the game more easy in the near past was the 8 attempts... and it was deleted...
They made g12 more accessible and now they made g13 openly accessible, which they have stated will make old content easier.... so how are they not making old content easier?
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. ...
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. ...
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
Yeah, but as has already been pointed out on the fourms:
8 stage assault battles are lazy, it should be 4 stages and the first 3 should just be harder
Preloaded TM is lazy, instead CG should use <no definitive answer given>
"Forcing" certain characters to be used (i.e. Dengar in the Chewbacca event) is lazy, we should be able to use them all.
GP gating is lazy, we should be able to go in and fail as often as we want.
Everything CG does is lazy, so is it any surprise that tenacity loading is lazy? What the forums really want is strategy not these lazy mechanics that force us to select just the right characters, mod them differently than we might for PVP, and then go in and carefully select which abilities to use on who and when. Who has time for all that?
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. ...
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
Yeah, but as has already been pointed out on the fourms:
8 stage assault battles are lazy, it should be 4 stages and the first 3 should just be harder
Preloaded TM is lazy, instead CG should use <no definitive answer given>
"Forcing" certain characters to be used (i.e. Dengar in the Chewbacca event) is lazy, we should be able to use them all.
GP gating is lazy, we should be able to go in and fail as often as we want.
Everything CG does is lazy, so is it any surprise that tenacity loading is lazy? What the forums really want is strategy not these lazy mechanics that force us to select just the right characters, mod them differently than we might for PVP, and then go in and carefully select which abilities to use on who and when. Who has time for all that?
But your opinions are not "the forum" and are not representative of the player base as a whole.
We also dont know what other mechanics are used here as the event has just started.
I would also like to point out that "strategy" without strength (the mechanics you list as lazy) are not end game, they dont require development and they are easily bypassed, and obvious.
Most times you have to develop past the "lazy" techniques to get to the strategy, which is part of the point. Thos initial mechanics hide the battle and make it immediately difficult, without revealing the depth. IMO.
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. ...
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
Yeah, but as has already been pointed out on the fourms:
8 stage assault battles are lazy, it should be 4 stages and the first 3 should just be harder
Preloaded TM is lazy, instead CG should use <no definitive answer given>
"Forcing" certain characters to be used (i.e. Dengar in the Chewbacca event) is lazy, we should be able to use them all.
GP gating is lazy, we should be able to go in and fail as often as we want.
Everything CG does is lazy, so is it any surprise that tenacity loading is lazy? What the forums really want is strategy not these lazy mechanics that force us to select just the right characters, mod them differently than we might for PVP, and then go in and carefully select which abilities to use on who and when. Who has time for all that?
But your opinions are not "the forum" and are not representative of the player base as a whole.
We also dont know what other mechanics are used here as the event has just started.
I would also like to point out that "strategy" without strength (the mechanics you list as lazy) are not end game, they dont require development and they are easily bypassed, and obvious.
Most times you have to develop past the "lazy" techniques to get to the strategy, which is part of the point. Thos initial mechanics hide the battle and make it immediately difficult, without revealing the depth. IMO.
I was being facetious. Pointing out that every mechanic CG introduces is almost immediately labeled as lazy by the forum. It's not my opinion, just an observation.
I was also pointing out that these mechanics generally achieve what the forums claim they want - strategy rather than brute force.
Guess it didn't come across as well in print as it did in my head.
Upping stats like regen or tenacity is the laziest possible design philosophy for creating difficulty.
Look, they didn't think ahead when they blew the power level out of the universe with traya. They tried to fix it with revan by making the same mistake. They did the same again with malak, and guess what? They still have not learned and will do it again with the negotiator. As long as every new journey has to directly counter every existing mechanic in the game this is not going to change.
The fake difficulty of geo TB is an attempt to cater the content to the mistakes they made with power creep. The tragedy isn't how difficult it is. The tragedy is that they have already creeped right around it with g13. The cycle will continue until it is absolutely pointless for new people to join... and that threshold was very likely crossed with Malak
Can you please describe what you think a real difficulty increase would be. This has been asked of the OP too.
General difficulty increases are a good thing. If they get too specific, then it becomes less "develop around this" and more "you need X toon/team". I would rather have a level or design of difficulty that makes it very hard at my current level and easier as I develop my roster, than just have it be difficult until you get "this toon/team".
Honestly bro you would rather have whatever the devs make it and that's fine. You have a certain bias which is understandable and I don't blame you for it. I know for a fact if difficulty made it so that you required a certain character you would defend it too by saying how they have to incentivize players to farm more characters, and the alternative is bad because it requires less work and anyone's current roster is good etc. I understand where you're coming from and again, I don't blame you, this is your job.
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. And honestly I'm tired of them keeping punishing characters who rely on debuffs like the wampa, NS, Vader, Sith, basically most DS toons.
Maybe this wasn't clear:
What are you suggesting?
Saying it's broken and should be better is not the same as actually producing ideas. You say there is no strategy and this is lazy just brute force.... that is every raid that we have for the first little bit. In the end there is always a team that develops or a toon that makes a team work better. It always plays out that we end up with one thing that fors better and makes things fall into place.
I'm not doing a job, I'm here because (unlike you) I love this game. I do this in my free time, because I want to be here and enjoy this and the game, you should try that some time. I have spent money here and still can say without a wavering thought, it's just a game and I am here to have fun.
I think this was a missed opportunity for something greater. All we got is Hoth on steroids with alot more tenacity. I was expecting more from the TB, like actual mechanics that matter. Specific kill order, required dispellers, required cleansers for certain debuffs. Perhaps mini boss flights where the whole guild contributes like a small raid. Added abilities that have to be well timed and used in a specific manner.
So now you want required toons?
I don’t think that’s what he’s saying. He wants optimal strategies. Something that isn’t just put your best squad in and blast away. It’s only phase 1, but I didn’t see much room for strategy either, other than the need for mod adjustments.
See I disagree. I like TBs because they are "just put your best squad in and blast away". TBs are pretty much the only source of PvE content that lets me use my best squad. If I want to build specific teams to overcome mechanics I already have raids for that.
So I am hoping one day you will find something you like in this game so you can have fun, like the rest of us. From the way you post, you seem to be truly exercising the definition of insanity.
It's called end game content for a reason. It was also explained to be more difficult than anything we had seen before.
As for no strategy, dont worry someone else will figure it out for you and you can follow them.
The strategy being spend $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and upgrade to g13?
I mean the OP post was pointless, but let's not pretend there is strategy involved in this TB or any past TB.
Y'all are the trolls not me, I literally said I was hoping for more creative ways to make it hard. I didn't say it should be easy. I just wanted it to be mechanically challenging not straight up 200% tenacity, tons of protection recovery with huge health pools and defense.
So before you start attacking me, understand what I'm saying
I dunno - I ran MT and managed to stun everyone in P4 (hint, her leadership provides a potency boost).
I've actually understood some of your positions in the past, but complaining about the difficulty of endgame content on the first day is pretty childish. I don't find myself agreeing with TVF much, but in this regard, you might want to heed his advice and find a different game as there really doesn't appear to be a single thing in this one you enjoy.
So I am hoping one day you will find something you like in this game so you can have fun, like the rest of us. From the way you post, you seem to be truly exercising the definition of insanity.
It's called end game content for a reason. It was also explained to be more difficult than anything we had seen before.
As for no strategy, dont worry someone else will figure it out for you and you can follow them.
The strategy being spend $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and upgrade to g13?
I mean the OP post was pointless, but let's not pretend there is strategy involved in this TB or any past TB.
So just kill whatever and don't worry about the enemy abilities?
It's called end game content for a reason. It was also explained to be more difficult than anything we had seen before.
For sure... but in fact when a game add new end game, they make the old game content more easy. That help new player to join the old player...CG add new content and never make easy the old content.
One of the thing who made the game more easy in the near past was the 8 attempts... and it was deleted...
They made g12 more accessible and now they made g13 openly accessible, which they have stated will make old content easier.... so how are they not making old content easier?
They have made some things more accessible. I noticed that they added more gear 12 to being farmable, but this does not necessarily help much. If they want to make it more accessible they would increase the drop rates or increase our energy intake. Just sharing a valuable currency for more things does not really address that. I'll see over time how things go and if our currency intake increases for guild event tokens and such with the new TB, and GA mode.
“This you have to understand. There's only one way to hurt a man who's lost everything. Give him back something broken..” -Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever
But let's face it, it is a lazy way of doing it. I saw virtually no diversity in the characters, kill order basically didn't matter up until maybe wave 4. No cooldowns to track, just a matter of brute force. Whatever man, I just wanted to point that out. ...
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
Yeah, but as has already been pointed out on the fourms:
8 stage assault battles are lazy, it should be 4 stages and the first 3 should just be harder
Preloaded TM is lazy, instead CG should use <no definitive answer given>
"Forcing" certain characters to be used (i.e. Dengar in the Chewbacca event) is lazy, we should be able to use them all.
GP gating is lazy, we should be able to go in and fail as often as we want.
Everything CG does is lazy, so is it any surprise that tenacity loading is lazy? What the forums really want is strategy not these lazy mechanics that force us to select just the right characters, mod them differently than we might for PVP, and then go in and carefully select which abilities to use on who and when. Who has time for all that?
But your opinions are not "the forum" and are not representative of the player base as a whole.
We also dont know what other mechanics are used here as the event has just started.
I would also like to point out that "strategy" without strength (the mechanics you list as lazy) are not end game, they dont require development and they are easily bypassed, and obvious.
Most times you have to develop past the "lazy" techniques to get to the strategy, which is part of the point. Thos initial mechanics hide the battle and make it immediately difficult, without revealing the depth. IMO.
I was being facetious. Pointing out that every mechanic CG introduces is almost immediately labeled as lazy by the forum. It's not my opinion, just an observation.
I was also pointing out that these mechanics generally achieve what the forums claim they want - strategy rather than brute force.
Guess it didn't come across as well in print as it did in my head.
So I am hoping one day you will find something you like in this game so you can have fun, like the rest of us. From the way you post, you seem to be truly exercising the definition of insanity.
It's called end game content for a reason. It was also explained to be more difficult than anything we had seen before.
As for no strategy, dont worry someone else will figure it out for you and you can follow them.
The strategy being spend $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and upgrade to g13?
I mean the OP post was pointless, but let's not pretend there is strategy involved in this TB or any past TB.
There are strategies to the battles.
$$$ only speeds things up, it doesnt help you win. A guild with all G13 CUP doesnt mean you will win or beat TB. This game is about strategy, part of that is who you develop and how you set them up.
You dont have to spend anything dude, as your shard ages you will get pushed out even if you did
All of these things are optional, its a f2p mobile game
Our guild got killed and we may still 6* p1
"and i will show you ... where the iron crosses grow..."
So something I'd add that i think was a mistake is releasing the tb before all required toons are available. I see one of the fleet missions requires the yet to be released vulture droid.
I don't think it's cool to limit how many stars we can earn by making it literally impossible to do certain missions because the toon doesn't exist in game yet.
Also from what i could see the GET 1 token imcome isn't superior to the Hoth Tbs by a noticeable margin. I don't think it's cool to not let us do Hoth TB and reduce our GET 1 token income. Maybe I'm mistaken but it sure looks like I'll be earning less GET 1 tokens this time around than I'd get from the Hoth TB (and those tokens remain a useful source for farming g12 gear)
So something I'd add that i think was a mistake is releasing the tb before all required toons are available. I see one of the fleet missions requires the yet to be released vulture droid.
I don't think it's cool to limit how many stars we can earn by making it literally impossible to do certain missions because the toon doesn't exist in game yet.
Also from what i could see the GET 1 token imcome isn't superior to the Hoth Tbs by a noticeable margin. I don't think it's cool to not let us do Hoth TB and reduce our GET 1 token income. Maybe I'm mistaken but it sure looks like I'll be earning less GET 1 tokens this time around than I'd get from the Hoth TB (and those tokens remain a useful source for farming g12 gear)
The Vulture droid is an event unit. It is automatically provided to you.
Also from what i could see the GET 1 token imcome isn't superior to the Hoth Tbs by a noticeable margin. I don't think it's cool to not let us do Hoth TB and reduce our GET 1 token income. Maybe I'm mistaken but it sure looks like I'll be earning less GET 1 tokens this time around than I'd get from the Hoth TB (and those tokens remain a useful source for farming g12 gear)
Based on their projections in the previews, you are most likely going to receive about half of the GET1 tokens from GEO as you would at Hoth. But the tradeoff is getting GET2, since that is what you need to purchase the new capital ship, the G12 finisher salvage, and Kyrotech salvage. They are not looking to increase your GET income, but transition it to more useful endgame currency.
@Hortus
Almost everything you listed were innovative ideas incorporated into the Tank Raid, lol... perhaps I missed the point you were trying to make, but those are prime examples of creative ideas being incorporated into new content (at the time). We still have to see what previous game mechanics they will incorporate in the future phases.
@BaldingHead90 ,
Are you seriously trying to tell me that you’re not excited for the Acklay Mission? I’m stoked. I proposed a new raid idea ages ago regarding the three main Geo Arena beasts for shared damage control amongst the guild, but I’m glad it’s here instead. Very interested to see the uniqueness in action after reading the descriptions around it.
"I am a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar." ~ Hoban Washburne
Replies
Which is something I'm disappointed with. I'd much rather have a different boss fixed for each mission and need 11 or 12 different teams than be forced to go with my best 4 or 5 for the entire TB.
I think I know the one you're talking about. There was ONE phase of ONE battle where they seemed to resist a bunch. I was using Bossk lead bounty hunters with Dengar on the team. Dengar gives tenacity down. On the turns they didn't have tenacity down I was at least healing anyhow because with Bossk you heal even when your debuffs are resisted. It was a near effortless 4/4 win.
Granted it took a while, and I couldn't do it on auto, but I thought the point of this new TB is that we won't destroy it on auto for at least a few months.
They made g12 more accessible and now they made g13 openly accessible, which they have stated will make old content easier.... so how are they not making old content easier?
While I am paid by the post, I get a bonus per thread posted in. So of course. I like money.
This is all on paper though.
Still waiting on an actual paycheck @Kyno
Let's discuss this a bit, in every event they use different styles or combinations of mechanics to set the stage. They will use multiple stages, TM loading, or other things/combinations to make the end more difficult. These "stage settings" are used to catch the player off guard and show weaknesses in the player setup, and then the real battle is the last stage. Even hear you are saying you start to see that. Not sure if you realize that.
This is also early in the game mode and you may be jumping to conclusions, just because you dont like a single technique they use. You dont know what else is coming.
As we progress and develop that mechanic will fade and you will see more to this later, the mechanics you see right now are just a layer to the difficulty, not the end all be all.
Yeah, but as has already been pointed out on the fourms:
8 stage assault battles are lazy, it should be 4 stages and the first 3 should just be harder
Preloaded TM is lazy, instead CG should use <no definitive answer given>
"Forcing" certain characters to be used (i.e. Dengar in the Chewbacca event) is lazy, we should be able to use them all.
GP gating is lazy, we should be able to go in and fail as often as we want.
Everything CG does is lazy, so is it any surprise that tenacity loading is lazy? What the forums really want is strategy not these lazy mechanics that force us to select just the right characters, mod them differently than we might for PVP, and then go in and carefully select which abilities to use on who and when. Who has time for all that?
The only thing I dislike so far is Clone Commander's Tough Terrain ability. Doesn't make much sense to me to have something like that.
But your opinions are not "the forum" and are not representative of the player base as a whole.
We also dont know what other mechanics are used here as the event has just started.
I would also like to point out that "strategy" without strength (the mechanics you list as lazy) are not end game, they dont require development and they are easily bypassed, and obvious.
Most times you have to develop past the "lazy" techniques to get to the strategy, which is part of the point. Thos initial mechanics hide the battle and make it immediately difficult, without revealing the depth. IMO.
I was being facetious. Pointing out that every mechanic CG introduces is almost immediately labeled as lazy by the forum. It's not my opinion, just an observation.
I was also pointing out that these mechanics generally achieve what the forums claim they want - strategy rather than brute force.
Guess it didn't come across as well in print as it did in my head.
See I disagree. I like TBs because they are "just put your best squad in and blast away". TBs are pretty much the only source of PvE content that lets me use my best squad. If I want to build specific teams to overcome mechanics I already have raids for that.
The strategy being spend $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and upgrade to g13?
I mean the OP post was pointless, but let's not pretend there is strategy involved in this TB or any past TB.
I dunno - I ran MT and managed to stun everyone in P4 (hint, her leadership provides a potency boost).
I've actually understood some of your positions in the past, but complaining about the difficulty of endgame content on the first day is pretty childish. I don't find myself agreeing with TVF much, but in this regard, you might want to heed his advice and find a different game as there really doesn't appear to be a single thing in this one you enjoy.
please....ideas....do not give them
So just kill whatever and don't worry about the enemy abilities?
Ok.
They have made some things more accessible. I noticed that they added more gear 12 to being farmable, but this does not necessarily help much. If they want to make it more accessible they would increase the drop rates or increase our energy intake. Just sharing a valuable currency for more things does not really address that. I'll see over time how things go and if our currency intake increases for guild event tokens and such with the new TB, and GA mode.
Except the dang danga 36 hour thing
*popcorn*
*binoculars*
*more popcorn*
Sorry, it's hard to read sarcasm.
There are strategies to the battles.
$$$ only speeds things up, it doesnt help you win. A guild with all G13 CUP doesnt mean you will win or beat TB. This game is about strategy, part of that is who you develop and how you set them up.
All of these things are optional, its a f2p mobile game
Our guild got killed and we may still 6* p1
I don't think it's cool to limit how many stars we can earn by making it literally impossible to do certain missions because the toon doesn't exist in game yet.
Also from what i could see the GET 1 token imcome isn't superior to the Hoth Tbs by a noticeable margin. I don't think it's cool to not let us do Hoth TB and reduce our GET 1 token income. Maybe I'm mistaken but it sure looks like I'll be earning less GET 1 tokens this time around than I'd get from the Hoth TB (and those tokens remain a useful source for farming g12 gear)
The Vulture droid is an event unit. It is automatically provided to you.
Based on their projections in the previews, you are most likely going to receive about half of the GET1 tokens from GEO as you would at Hoth. But the tradeoff is getting GET2, since that is what you need to purchase the new capital ship, the G12 finisher salvage, and Kyrotech salvage. They are not looking to increase your GET income, but transition it to more useful endgame currency.
Almost everything you listed were innovative ideas incorporated into the Tank Raid, lol... perhaps I missed the point you were trying to make, but those are prime examples of creative ideas being incorporated into new content (at the time). We still have to see what previous game mechanics they will incorporate in the future phases.
@BaldingHead90 ,
Are you seriously trying to tell me that you’re not excited for the Acklay Mission? I’m stoked. I proposed a new raid idea ages ago regarding the three main Geo Arena beasts for shared damage control amongst the guild, but I’m glad it’s here instead. Very interested to see the uniqueness in action after reading the descriptions around it.