When do we have GL Rey buffed too?

Replies

  • Starslayer
    405 posts Member
    edited July 21
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  • Daishi
    710 posts Member
    Here's the thing. Rey IS the 2nd best character in the game. But that's like comparing DR and Traya, or DR and EP as the first and second best sith lord leaders. Sure Traya or EP might be the 2nd best sith lord leader, but that's a HUGE step down from DR. Are they still useful? HECK YES they are. But if you had a choice to take DR team, or EP/Traya team as a gift to a new account, only a fool would pick anything except DR. Sure the others are 2nd best, but by such a large margin that it almost isn't comparable.

    There have been SO MANY ideas proposed in this thread, and the overall goal being, buff Rey to make her competitive again. Currently Rey is beaten for 60 banners by several counter teams, SLKR has a few counters, but none at 60 banners and none as cheap in investments as Rey's counters. The secondary goal is to see Resistance characters made viable with Rey.

    Ideas mostly float around a few key concepts.
    1) Some type of locked buff immunity. Either from Rey's kit, or from inspire mechanics.
    2) More immediate damage from Rey to at least steal some banners, or other ways to make some of the cheap counters less reliable
    3) Blocking taunt effects on Rey, similar to how Kylo is

    The 2 problems are
    1) Rey is VERY unreliable against SLKR unless you use leaders from several other meta teams
    2) Rey with Resistance is useless, while SLKR with FO is his top team.

    So I propose a way to knock out 2 birds with 1 stone. Add a unique to Rose (yes, Rose). Call it Down with the Order. Have it read, "If the leader is Resistance, and all enemies are First Order at the start of battle, enemies cannot gain bonus turns, or turn meter, cannot swap turn meter, cannot reduce cooldowns. Enemies that critically hit a resistance ally have buff immunity applied and dispel their own buffs."

    Cause here's the thing, the FO issue is that they can TM swap and reset cooldowns to SLKR allowing him to quickly ramp up, while Rey ramps slow. They can also dispel all enemy buffs, which removes any crit immunity. They gain TM, which SHOULD be bad for SLKR, but his gain from Siphon is so much more than any loss from his unique. They also have an undispellable taunt, can remove all debuffs from their own team so you can't even stick buff immunity to block the taunt. Also SLKR is immune to taunt effects so you can't mark him to try to burn him down before he can ramp up.

    So give Rose that unique. It'll stop the full FO teams, which will at least force SLKR teams to use non-standard teams to avoid the Rose counter. They'll still dominate (I got a guy who runs vader in my shard and he's HARD to beat). But at least it would be a single step in a better direction. Then make REY dominate in the new galactic challenges and make SLKR team fall apart... somehow.
  • Nihion
    3009 posts Member
    That unique would make Rose a much more valuable character, not Rey. Secondary Resistance teams could be able to pull a lot more weight, especially for new players.

    Also, “the secondary sith team” is not comparable to Rey as the second best character in the game.
  • As soon as I saw rose as a requirement for gl Rey I knew she wasnt worth it, after I found out you didnt even have to use her in the event I knew I made the right choice. If they released jar jar binks he would be relic7 before rose ever goes above gear 5. Only reason I have her 7* is for platoons lol.
  • Ultra
    6787 posts Member
    As soon as I saw rose as a requirement for gl Rey I knew she wasnt worth it, after I found out you didnt even have to use her in the event I knew I made the right choice. If they released jar jar binks he would be relic7 before rose ever goes above gear 5. Only reason I have her 7* is for platoons lol.

    Guessing you aren't going for Jedi Luke either because ROLO / Lando aren't that useful enough to push to g13 either
  • TVF
    25898 posts Member
    As soon as I saw rose as a requirement for gl Rey I knew she wasnt worth it, after I found out you didnt even have to use her in the event I knew I made the right choice. If they released jar jar binks he would be relic7 before rose ever goes above gear 5. Only reason I have her 7* is for platoons lol.

    Cool
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  • Larx
    175 posts Member
    Ultra wrote: »
    As soon as I saw rose as a requirement for gl Rey I knew she wasnt worth it, after I found out you didnt even have to use her in the event I knew I made the right choice. If they released jar jar binks he would be relic7 before rose ever goes above gear 5. Only reason I have her 7* is for platoons lol.

    Guessing you aren't going for Jedi Luke either because ROLO / Lando aren't that useful enough to push to g13 either

    more use than rose
  • Mirkraag
    438 posts Member
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute
  • TVF
    25898 posts Member
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    I did really think you were being truthful when you said you were giving up because we were impossible to reason with and you were leaving the thread.

    Guess you were just being cute.
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  • Nihion
    3009 posts Member
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.
  • Daishi
    710 posts Member
    Thats what some of you don't understand, when we have #buffRey doesnt mean we want everything to be in Reys kit. We are calling for resistance to be able to more easily counter SLKR. So build it into the kit of the various resistance members to directly counter FO (like it was before GL/Hux). Then Rey will need to be run with those resistance members to beat SLKR, but will make Rey/Res more easily countered by SLKR with Sith.

    That would be balance
  • Mirkraag
    438 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Yes you are totally right, I can't prove it. It just seems so practical to buff the one that less people went for and make him number 1 one month after the choice was clear. And then say look at the global stat, this is perfectly balanced.

    Maybe it was just a coincidence, but as lots of people say here, it is a business company, not a game and fun company. Seems a greedy move that they can make easily and it won't be that surprising (but disgusting however)
  • Nikoms565
    13080 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Except the buff that is really the issue is NOT the one that was explained or was due to "unintended interactions". The buff on June 3rd had no explanation and were these two things that make a significant difference:

    Updated Supreme Leader Kylo Ren's leader ability, Supreme Leader, with the following:
    -Added "All Dark Side allies gain +30 Speed" to all tiers
    -Added "Dark Side allies can't be critically hit while they have Advantage" to the final tier
    In game name: Lucas Gregory - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • Nihion
    3009 posts Member
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Yes you are totally right, I can't prove it. It just seems so practical to buff the one that less people went for and make him number 1 one month after the choice was clear. And then say look at the global stat, this is perfectly balanced.

    Maybe it was just a coincidence, but as lots of people say here, it is a business company, not a game and fun company. Seems a greedy move that they can make easily and it won't be that surprising (but disgusting however)

    Why would CG think that making all Rey owners angry is going to make them more money. These devs aren’t evil for the fun of it. If they purposely wanted to make you pay for both of them, they wouldn’t make everyone angry. That’s not going to go over well, and the proof is this thread. People would rather stop spending and claim that it’s unfair rather than accept that they got screwed over and pay more. It just doesn’t make business sense or yay happy sense fir CG to make that move based on anything that wasn’t just “fixing unintended problems.”
  • Mirkraag
    438 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Yes you are totally right, I can't prove it. It just seems so practical to buff the one that less people went for and make him number 1 one month after the choice was clear. And then say look at the global stat, this is perfectly balanced.

    Maybe it was just a coincidence, but as lots of people say here, it is a business company, not a game and fun company. Seems a greedy move that they can make easily and it won't be that surprising (but disgusting however)

    Why would CG think that making all Rey owners angry is going to make them more money. These devs aren’t evil for the fun of it. If they purposely wanted to make you pay for both of them, they wouldn’t make everyone angry. That’s not going to go over well, and the proof is this thread. People would rather stop spending and claim that it’s unfair rather than accept that they got screwed over and pay more. It just doesn’t make business sense or yay happy sense fir CG to make that move based on anything that wasn’t just “fixing unintended problems.”

    I think they dont care making some people angry. Some are perfectly fine with it according to this forum. And a lot of people will have to go through Kylo at the end because now he is mandatory. So more money has rey spenders already spent on Rey and will spend on Kylo because of classic purchasing behavior. Some of the buff like nikom said are totally unjustified but by the fact to make him stronger in PvP against Rey. He was meant by his kit design to be king of PvE. They alter the deal and made him the King of everything. I will not be mad if they didnt sold us the gl as equal. But here we are. I really think it is just another money grab
  • Ultra
    6787 posts Member
    Larx wrote: »
    Ultra wrote: »
    As soon as I saw rose as a requirement for gl Rey I knew she wasnt worth it, after I found out you didnt even have to use her in the event I knew I made the right choice. If they released jar jar binks he would be relic7 before rose ever goes above gear 5. Only reason I have her 7* is for platoons lol.

    Guessing you aren't going for Jedi Luke either because ROLO / Lando aren't that useful enough to push to g13 either

    more use than rose
    So you’re willing to invest enough resources on 2 toons which you might use once in a blue moon over 1 toon you won’t ever use?

    I mean, you do you but pushing two toons to g13 is more costly and the end toon you are getting is not better than the other ( Rey > JKL )
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Except the buff that is really the issue is NOT the one that was explained or was due to "unintended interactions". The buff on June 3rd had no explanation and were these two things that make a significant difference:

    Updated Supreme Leader Kylo Ren's leader ability, Supreme Leader, with the following:
    -Added "All Dark Side allies gain +30 Speed" to all tiers
    -Added "Dark Side allies can't be critically hit while they have Advantage" to the final tier

    That change resulted from Kylo being beaten by GAS + 1 (and undersizing being better than using a full team).
  • Jarvind
    3729 posts Member
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    The buff on June 3rd had no explanation and were these two things that make a significant difference:

    Updated Supreme Leader Kylo Ren's leader ability, Supreme Leader, with the following:
    -Added "All Dark Side allies gain +30 Speed" to all tiers
    -Added "Dark Side allies can't be critically hit while they have Advantage" to the final tier

    It was pretty clearly to prevent the "kill a full Kylo team with GAS + one other 501st" cheese. GAS's cooldown increase on crit prevented Kylo using anything but his basic, so he couldn't charge up his ult and he couldn't kill GAS with just non-critting basics.

    I'm not sure why the speed was added specifically, but given that Rey has it and leaderships that don't grant speed or turn meter are often difficult to make useful, that probably should've just been there to begin with anyway.
    u58t4vkrvnrz.png



  • Daishi
    710 posts Member
    Liath wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Except the buff that is really the issue is NOT the one that was explained or was due to "unintended interactions". The buff on June 3rd had no explanation and were these two things that make a significant difference:

    Updated Supreme Leader Kylo Ren's leader ability, Supreme Leader, with the following:
    -Added "All Dark Side allies gain +30 Speed" to all tiers
    -Added "Dark Side allies can't be critically hit while they have Advantage" to the final tier

    That change resulted from Kylo being beaten by GAS + 1 (and undersizing being better than using a full team).

    Which could have been fixed with several other things. For instance (kylo starts with 10% ultimate for each empty spot on enemy team at the start of battle) or (Kylo is immune to counterattacks when there is only 1 surviving enemy). Plenty of fixes that would have stopped that very specific interaction. Giving all Dark side allies nearly permanent crit immunity was overkill of the highest degree
  • TVF
    25898 posts Member
    Daishi wrote: »
    Liath wrote: »
    Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Except the buff that is really the issue is NOT the one that was explained or was due to "unintended interactions". The buff on June 3rd had no explanation and were these two things that make a significant difference:

    Updated Supreme Leader Kylo Ren's leader ability, Supreme Leader, with the following:
    -Added "All Dark Side allies gain +30 Speed" to all tiers
    -Added "Dark Side allies can't be critically hit while they have Advantage" to the final tier

    That change resulted from Kylo being beaten by GAS + 1 (and undersizing being better than using a full team).

    Which could have been fixed with several other things. For instance (kylo starts with 10% ultimate for each empty spot on enemy team at the start of battle) or (Kylo is immune to counterattacks when there is only 1 surviving enemy). Plenty of fixes that would have stopped that very specific interaction. Giving all Dark side allies nearly permanent crit immunity was overkill of the highest degree

    That's not the argument that was made though.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Daishi
    710 posts Member
    It kinda is. The argument is that Kylo has been buffed repeatedly above what he was advertised as at first, making him take the top spot in PVE and PVP, so now Rey needs a buff or resistance allies need a buff to make her more easily and reliably beat SLKR teams
  • Liath
    5140 posts Member
    Daishi wrote: »
    It kinda is. The argument is that Kylo has been buffed repeatedly above what he was advertised as at first, making him take the top spot in PVE and PVP, so now Rey needs a buff or resistance allies need a buff to make her more easily and reliably beat SLKR teams

    That might be your argument, but the argument I was responding to is that he was buffed with no explanation and unrelated to any unintended interactions.
  • Jarvind
    3729 posts Member
    Daishi wrote: »
    It kinda is. The argument is that Kylo has been buffed repeatedly above what he was advertised as at first

    The argument was that Kylo's buff (and he's only been buffed once, people need to stop pretending minor AI tweaks to prevent obvious cheese counts as a "buff") was "not explained."
    u58t4vkrvnrz.png



  • Nihion
    3009 posts Member
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    Nihion wrote: »
    Mirkraag wrote: »
    So you really think Kylo was buffed because of unintended interactions but not because more people went for Rey so they wanted to force people to pay for Kylo

    That s cute

    Prove it. I love conspiracy theories, but some evidence would be nice.

    What’s clear is that there were unintended interactions. That’s evidence against you.

    Yes you are totally right, I can't prove it. It just seems so practical to buff the one that less people went for and make him number 1 one month after the choice was clear. And then say look at the global stat, this is perfectly balanced.

    Maybe it was just a coincidence, but as lots of people say here, it is a business company, not a game and fun company. Seems a greedy move that they can make easily and it won't be that surprising (but disgusting however)

    Why would CG think that making all Rey owners angry is going to make them more money. These devs aren’t evil for the fun of it. If they purposely wanted to make you pay for both of them, they wouldn’t make everyone angry. That’s not going to go over well, and the proof is this thread. People would rather stop spending and claim that it’s unfair rather than accept that they got screwed over and pay more. It just doesn’t make business sense or yay happy sense fir CG to make that move based on anything that wasn’t just “fixing unintended problems.”

    I think they dont care making some people angry. Some are perfectly fine with it according to this forum. And a lot of people will have to go through Kylo at the end because now he is mandatory. So more money has rey spenders already spent on Rey and will spend on Kylo because of classic purchasing behavior. Some of the buff like nikom said are totally unjustified but by the fact to make him stronger in PvP against Rey. He was meant by his kit design to be king of PvE. They alter the deal and made him the King of everything. I will not be mad if they didnt sold us the gl as equal. But here we are. I really think it is just another money grab

    Two things:
    You are angry and so are others. If you don’t stop spending, why would CG ever stop pushing you around?

    CG buffing Kylo to make Rey owners mad still makes no sense, but let’s keep assuming they are. Obviously people like you are mad, and even if getting Kylo is now mandatory to do well, why would you ever spend more money after just thinking that CG doesn’t care about you? Why would anyone? If you want to make a statement, do it with your money. If the statement isn’t loud enough, then either not that many people care, or CG knows they can just push the line further. It’s only a money grab if people keep choosing to give them money.

    That being said, the buffs all took place because of unintended interactions, just like always, including the June buff. They aren’t just out to get you and all they’re other loyal spenders.

    So my conclusion: Does Rey need a buff? It depends on whether or not people will keep spending. I’ve seen many issues fly by that people claim will “end the game in an uproar of customer complaints,” which has never once happened. Rarely do these problems last long enough or push hard enough to make the developers care, which shows me that no push has been hard enough yet, and that the game is running fine. Maybe this will change that, and you will all get your buff. Don’t waste everyone’s time claiming that it’s unfair unless you’re actually going to do what matters.
  • Slaveen
    476 posts Member
    Another Rey issue that is rarely mentioned in here is the fact that her mirrors are literally the worst mirrors by far in the game. They make JKR mirrors look like child's play.
  • Mirkraag
    438 posts Member
    I am totally agree with you on the fact that people are not mad enough on CG practice to make the company change its practices. I am still convinced it was a business move and not a game balance move.

    Fyi I am f2p but believe it or not I just care about spenders and game health and ethics. I am especially interested in game design and CG does is clearly lazy on this part. But there is still hope, they got few very good ideas ^^
  • Jarvind
    3729 posts Member
    Nihion wrote: »
    If you don’t stop spending, why would CG ever stop pushing you around?

    I always wonder why people don't seem to understand this. "But we complained a lot on a forum!" So what? They're still raking in cash, which tells them people are willing to accept what they've been offered.
    u58t4vkrvnrz.png



  • Ragnarok_COTF
    85 posts Member
    edited July 22
    Jarvind wrote: »
    I'm not sure why the speed was added specifically, but given that Rey has it and leaderships that don't grant speed or turn meter are often difficult to make useful, that probably should've just been there to begin with anyway.

    SLK already had the TM boosts to supports every time they gain Advantage. SLK teams were already essentially faster than (or at least on par with) GLR teams without the +30.

    Even if they gave GLR the TM boosts, zHux would just shut it down anyway. So I originally saw Rey's +30 as compensation for SLK's bonus TM.
  • Slaveen wrote: »
    Another Rey issue that is rarely mentioned in here is the fact that her mirrors are literally the worst mirrors by far in the game. They make JKR mirrors look like child's play.

    No they aren't. Rey V Rey are winnable 100% of the time in roughly 3min or less. The problem comes in if you actually use a "mirror". Every Rey setup I have encountered so far has an easy way to beat it and the way to beat it definitely does not include all the same team members as the enemy team.
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