When Zaul was crushing everyone in arena, many users complained that it was an OP team with too many zetas and too much synergy. The response from those Zaul teams? Suck it up, and find a new team or way to counter. Zaul can be beat, you just need to re-think your strategy. Yada, yada, yada.
Well, now people HAVE found a way to do it...and the same users who said "go find a new strategy" are wanting to nerf the ability that makes that strategy work? Seriously? Try your own advice; find a new team. The game evolves constantly, so what works today to keep you at rank 1 won't necessarily work tomorrow.
The problem is not Tenacity Up. That's been in the game since Yoda was introduced and hasn't been a problem. It's only a problem now because 1) the Sith meta is countered by it and Sith meta users are not happy about it, and 2) it's being combined with triple cleanse. To me, that says the problem is the triple cleanse...not the Tenacity Up.
Chaze is the only truly OP character combo the game has had, and I do think they should be nerfed. Stacking dozens of HOT dots is just stupid; surely they can't think that people wouldn't have a problem with that. So let's fix the real problem, and quit trying to "fix" something that isn't broken. Either that, or take your own advice and start trying to use a new team. Others beat the Chaze/Rex teams frequently, so it can be done.
When Zaul was crushing everyone in arena, many users complained that it was an OP team with too many zetas and too much synergy. The response from those Zaul teams? Suck it up, and find a new team or way to counter. Zaul can be beat, you just need to re-think your strategy. Yada, yada, yada.
Well, now people HAVE found a way to do it...and the same users who said "go find a new strategy" are wanting to nerf the ability that makes that strategy work? Seriously? Try your own advice; find a new team. The game evolves constantly, so what works today to keep you at rank 1 won't necessarily work tomorrow.
The problem is not Tenacity Up. That's been in the game since Yoda was introduced and hasn't been a problem. It's only a problem now because 1) the Sith meta is countered by it and Sith meta users are not happy about it, and 2) it's being combined with triple cleanse. To me, that says the problem is the triple cleanse...not the Tenacity Up.
Chaze is the only truly OP character combo the game has had, and I do think they should be nerfed. Stacking dozens of HOT dots is just ****; surely they can't think that people wouldn't have a problem with that. So let's fix the real problem, and quit trying to "fix" something that isn't broken. Either that, or take your own advice and start trying to use a new team. Others beat the Chaze/Rex teams frequently, so it can be done.
Nicely said. I'll have to agree with what you said. Tenacity Up isn't the core problem (IE: Yoda), the problem lies with overtuned characters in the game. And that's not a speculation anymore: https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/#all
Still bitter @Jedi_Reach_ the major OP character is zavage and zylo who can win in 3/4 on 1 situations unless you have nihilus. So your argument is completely invalid. Chaze isn't OP, too just obviously are incapable of building a team to beat it. Suck it up
Still bitter @Jedi_Reach_ the major OP character is zavage and zylo who can win in 3/4 on 1 situations unless you have nihilus. So your argument is completely invalid. Chaze isn't OP, too just obviously are incapable of building a team to beat it. Suck it up
Still bitter @Jedi_Reach_ the major OP character is zavage and zylo who can win in 3/4 on 1 situations unless you have nihilus. So your argument is completely invalid. Chaze isn't OP, too just obviously are incapable of building a team to beat it. Suck it up
Zylo and Zavage are tough, sure...no doubt. But both can be beat with heal block. Chaze with the dozens of HOTs is worse, to me. I've managed to beat both at times, but Chaze is the harder duo, in my experience.
Seems like the counter to a mass Tenacity Up would probably be a mass Tenacity Down. So the counter to Chaze Rex is... Dengar, Jawa Scavenger, and either a Scoundrel tank or a Jawa Tank to get some faction synergy going with one of the first two guys. Yeah?
Or at least they would neutralize each other since they're opposing equals.
Seems like the counter to a mass Tenacity Up would probably be a mass Tenacity Down. So the counter to Chaze Rex is... Dengar, Jawa Scavenger, and either a Scoundrel tank or a Jawa Tank to get some faction synergy going with one of the first two guys. Yeah?
Or at least they would neutralize each other since they're opposing equals.
Too bad Dengar relies heavily on Crits to deliver his debuffs. GK (in any team) and Maul lead neuter his much needed crit synergy, so he's basically worthless.
I like Dengar's kit, a lot. In practice, he's just terrible.
When Zaul was crushing everyone in arena, many users complained that it was an OP team with too many zetas and too much synergy. The response from those Zaul teams? Suck it up, and find a new team or way to counter. Zaul can be beat, you just need to re-think your strategy. Yada, yada, yada.
Well, now people HAVE found a way to do it...and the same users who said "go find a new strategy" are wanting to nerf the ability that makes that strategy work? Seriously? Try your own advice; find a new team. The game evolves constantly, so what works today to keep you at rank 1 won't necessarily work tomorrow.
The problem is not Tenacity Up. That's been in the game since Yoda was introduced and hasn't been a problem. It's only a problem now because 1) the Sith meta is countered by it and Sith meta users are not happy about it, and 2) it's being combined with triple cleanse. To me, that says the problem is the triple cleanse...not the Tenacity Up.
Chaze is the only truly OP character combo the game has had, and I do think they should be nerfed. Stacking dozens of HOT dots is just ****; surely they can't think that people wouldn't have a problem with that. So let's fix the real problem, and quit trying to "fix" something that isn't broken. Either that, or take your own advice and start trying to use a new team. Others beat the Chaze/Rex teams frequently, so it can be done.
I agree that tenacity up isn't broken. It's basically the same as the thousands of threads a while back about speed on mods being broken and needed tuning.
I do however disagree about chaze being broken. Like you said, others beat the team frequently, so how is that different than the zMaul meta? Started out OP, then people realized it was beatable (sure R2 helped out a bunch aswell). Nowadays if you complain about zMaul you'll get laughed at. Maybe one day people abandon their chaze crusade and will start laughing at others who can't consistandly beat chaze. Lets face it, even chaze, even in a tripple cleanse team, has its weaknesses.
Anyway, thrawn might be the next best character ingame. So this whole discussion might be obsolete in a few weeks
I m not maxed so I do not understand the zRex or Zaul, etc. but in my level I just remove tenacity up using Ventress, once down Rex (without Z) is squishy he dies fast. Is he inmune to her when Z?
No, her dispel works just fine. However, at max level, top end arena shards a lot of people run teams with Rex, kenobi, and Chirrut which makes it near impossible to get debuffs to stick because those teams have three characters who both cleanse and provide tenacity up.
Rather than admit that two of those characters might be overtuned and in need of a nerf, a lot of players have taken to the forums to complain that the tenacity up mechanic itself needs a nerf (which it doesn't)
Thanks I get it, the problem is not the mechanic but the combo, thats why nobody argues about Ackbar or Yoda. The real opposite to Rex/Chase's skill would be something like a Ventress' cleanse that also applies buff inmunity at the same time.
B2 applies a mass dispel as well as buff immunity at the same time. The problem is that he'll remove
the tenacity up that Rex provides the team, only to watch kenobi cleanse the buff immunity from the team and give tenacity up to those characters that he didn't cleanse. B2 also has low damage and no other utility, so even though you can make him work out on a team, you have to think harder about how to fit him in than you would if you just built your team around chaze and kenobi.
Tenacity up needs to be changed to act like any other buff. At a bare minimum there should be the standard 15% chance to apply debuffs. The game has changed since this skill was introduced, it needs to be adjusted accordingly.
Tenacity up needs to be changed to act like any other buff. At a bare minimum there should be the standard 15% chance to apply debuffs. The game has changed since this skill was introduced, it needs to be adjusted accordingly.
And just introduce more RNG into the game? No thanks..
From a logical consistency standpoint, Tenacity Up/Dn should be an exact or near mirror of a Potency Up/Dn style buff... If they want de-buff immunity, they should make one that mirrors buff immunity. The problem with triple cleanse teams is the defacto "buff immunity" that they get in ADDITION to a cleanse. I think debuff immunity should be limited to characters that don't also cleanse, like a yoda.
Yes, I run that triple cleanse team. Yes, it's OP compared to other setups. Yes, it's beatable, all teams are beatable, that's not the point here.
From a logical consistency standpoint, Tenacity Up/Dn should be an exact or near mirror of a Potency Up/Dn style buff... If they want de-buff immunity, they should make one that mirrors buff immunity. The problem with triple cleanse teams is the defacto "buff immunity" that they get in ADDITION to a cleanse. I think debuff immunity should be limited to characters that don't also cleanse, like a yoda.
Yes, I run that triple cleanse team. Yes, it's OP compared to other setups. Yes, it's beatable, all teams are beatable, that's not the point here.
That's because it's only recently being seen as an issue. I'm sure it will change down the road and they'll add a new skill that gives debuff immunity... then they'll be able to make money off of the toon that gives that buff.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
Yea because you are looking at the number one player in every shard only. come on I looked at the top 100 and said so. The thing about the number one players are that 90% are whales slash dolphins so not an accurate depiction of true viability because up there there is very little variation while in the top 100 you have to work against more different squads and you see a combo of what is moderately easy to gear and what is viable at lower star lvls if that is what they have assess to. Nihlius is way too easy to gear for how powerful he is same with EP and same with Kylo. while on the other hand the good light side characters are crazy hard to gear. GK is one of if not THE HARDEST CHARACTER IN THE GAME TO GEAR AND EXTREMELY HARD TO GET IN THE FIRST PLACE both Chirrut and Baze are VERY difficult to gear and star R2-D2 IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO GEAR AND SEMI DIFFICULT TO STAR as you really need 5, 7 star gear 11 empire characters to get him. Rex is also very high on gear Requirements and takes a good while to star. Nihilus the only charater in the game with an insta kill and he is crazy tanky was given to everyone at 3* were he is ultra viable. EP is much easier than R2 to get I unlocked him with Akbar lead Leia Lando STH and biggs all at gear 9 or lower. Kylo is also ultra easy to farm. my point is the good good guy characters are hard to get while the supper OP/Supper powerful bad guys are there for the taking. So if you were to change the Tan up it would only plunge the Meta back to the dark side nexus that we have only begun to clime out of. So just Shut up and Let the Good guys beat the bad guys like they are supposed to and stop acting so Evil loving.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
Yea because you are looking at the number one player in every shard only. come on I looked at the top 100 and said so. The thing about the number one players are that 90% are whales slash dolphins so not an accurate depiction of true viability because up there there is very little variation while in the top 100 you have to work against more different squads and you see a combo of what is moderately easy to gear and what is viable at lower star lvls if that is what they have assess to. Nihlius is way too easy to gear for how powerful he is same with EP and same with Kylo. while on the other hand the good light side characters are crazy hard to gear. GK is one of if not THE HARDEST CHARACTER IN THE GAME TO GEAR AND EXTREMELY HARD TO GET IN THE FIRST PLACE both Chirrut and Baze are VERY difficult to gear and star R2-D2 IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO GEAR AND SEMI DIFFICULT TO STAR as you really need 5, 7 star gear 11 empire characters to get him. Rex is also very high on gear Requirements and takes a good while to star. Nihilus the only charater in the game with an insta kill and he is crazy tanky was given to everyone at 3* were he is ultra viable. EP is much easier than R2 to get I unlocked him with Akbar lead Leia Lando STH and biggs all at gear 9 or lower. Kylo is also ultra easy to farm. my point is the good good guy characters are hard to get while the supper OP/Supper powerful bad guys are there for the taking. So if you were to change the Tan up it would only plunge the Meta back to the dark side nexus that we have only begun to clime out of. So just Shut up and Let the Good guys beat the bad guys like they are supposed to and stop acting so Evil loving.
You are so out of touch with reality I have to wonder if you're being serious or trolling.
From the jump, this game at lower tiers gives you easy access to rebel characters. EP requires rebels and to get him, so naturally, most jump on the Wiggs / Lando / Boba bandwagon in lower tiers. From there, they'd invest into Chaze and very few trot into DS. With the exception of DN, who's practically needed due to the overabundance of Chaze, DS is generally lacking.
The very last part of your post shows an obvious bias.
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
Yea because you are looking at the number one player in every shard only. come on I looked at the top 100 and said so. The thing about the number one players are that 90% are whales slash dolphins so not an accurate depiction of true viability because up there there is very little variation while in the top 100 you have to work against more different squads and you see a combo of what is moderately easy to gear and what is viable at lower star lvls if that is what they have assess to. Nihlius is way too easy to gear for how powerful he is same with EP and same with Kylo. while on the other hand the good light side characters are crazy hard to gear. GK is one of if not THE HARDEST CHARACTER IN THE GAME TO GEAR AND EXTREMELY HARD TO GET IN THE FIRST PLACE both Chirrut and Baze are VERY difficult to gear and star R2-D2 IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO GEAR AND SEMI DIFFICULT TO STAR as you really need 5, 7 star gear 11 empire characters to get him. Rex is also very high on gear Requirements and takes a good while to star. Nihilus the only charater in the game with an insta kill and he is crazy tanky was given to everyone at 3* were he is ultra viable. EP is much easier than R2 to get I unlocked him with Akbar lead Leia Lando STH and biggs all at gear 9 or lower. Kylo is also ultra easy to farm. my point is the good good guy characters are hard to get while the supper OP/Supper powerful bad guys are there for the taking. So if you were to change the Tan up it would only plunge the Meta back to the dark side nexus that we have only begun to clime out of. So just Shut up and Let the Good guys beat the bad guys like they are supposed to and stop acting so Evil loving.
You are so out of touch with reality I have to wonder if you're being serious or trolling.
From the jump, this game at lower tiers gives you easy access to rebel characters. EP requires rebels and to get him, so naturally, most jump on the Wiggs / Lando / Boba bandwagon in lower tiers. From there, they'd invest into Chaze and very few trot into DS. With the exception of DN, who's practically needed due to the overabundance of Chaze, DS is generally lacking.
The very last part of your post shows an obvious bias.
he's talking about the top100. https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/100/#all According to this link the top100 is dominated by DS characters, not the "very few that trot into DS". Maybe the majority of the players in the top100 will eventually move on to chaze, wich seems like that is going to happen based on what happened in the top 1/10. But until then, if you're in the top 100 you're facing mostly DS characters. (that is if the meta report is accurate ofcourse)
Given the fact that there are way more players in the top100 than there are in the top10, one could conclude that DS characters are actually used more in arena than the current "LS meta", just not in the ranks that matter to most people on this forum.
So maybe he isn't out of touch with "reality" per se, his reality might just be different than yours because you're arguing from a whole different perspective.
and oh yea, you're also obviously biased
They could keep it as is, but just add aoe cleanse to the best toons in the game - like tenacity is currently - and watch cleanse teams die fast. Triple debuff - Imagine if EP's zeta does enemy buff removal + buff block, new thrawn also has aoe buff removal - one an aoe and one a specific target that also inflicts buff block for 3 rounds ... and run that with DT...add in a zDV zeta on a unique that any time he attacks a rebel he removes a buff and bam....quadruple debuff!!!. Oh...and the debuffs they inflict check AFTER the buff / ten up removal. MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
No just No Tan up should be kept as is the Dark side of the Force already clouds the arena too much and has ruled the arena since almost forever please just let the good guys have there turn for once.
I take it you've never fought a Rebel squad before
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
Yea because you are looking at the number one player in every shard only. come on I looked at the top 100 and said so. The thing about the number one players are that 90% are whales slash dolphins so not an accurate depiction of true viability because up there there is very little variation while in the top 100 you have to work against more different squads and you see a combo of what is moderately easy to gear and what is viable at lower star lvls if that is what they have assess to. Nihlius is way too easy to gear for how powerful he is same with EP and same with Kylo. while on the other hand the good light side characters are crazy hard to gear. GK is one of if not THE HARDEST CHARACTER IN THE GAME TO GEAR AND EXTREMELY HARD TO GET IN THE FIRST PLACE both Chirrut and Baze are VERY difficult to gear and star R2-D2 IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO GEAR AND SEMI DIFFICULT TO STAR as you really need 5, 7 star gear 11 empire characters to get him. Rex is also very high on gear Requirements and takes a good while to star. Nihilus the only charater in the game with an insta kill and he is crazy tanky was given to everyone at 3* were he is ultra viable. EP is much easier than R2 to get I unlocked him with Akbar lead Leia Lando STH and biggs all at gear 9 or lower. Kylo is also ultra easy to farm. my point is the good good guy characters are hard to get while the supper OP/Supper powerful bad guys are there for the taking. So if you were to change the Tan up it would only plunge the Meta back to the dark side nexus that we have only begun to clime out of. So just Shut up and Let the Good guys beat the bad guys like they are supposed to and stop acting so Evil loving.
You are so out of touch with reality I have to wonder if you're being serious or trolling.
From the jump, this game at lower tiers gives you easy access to rebel characters. EP requires rebels and to get him, so naturally, most jump on the Wiggs / Lando / Boba bandwagon in lower tiers. From there, they'd invest into Chaze and very few trot into DS. With the exception of DN, who's practically needed due to the overabundance of Chaze, DS is generally lacking.
The very last part of your post shows an obvious bias.
he's talking about the top100. https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/100/#all According to this link the top100 is dominated by DS characters, not the "very few that trot into DS". Maybe the majority of the players in the top100 will eventually move on to chaze, wich seems like that is going to happen based on what happened in the top 1/10. But until then, if you're in the top 100 you're facing mostly DS characters. (that is if the meta report is accurate ofcourse)
So they eventually become LS and LS domination ensues anyway? Thanks, I know.
Given the fact that there are way more players in the top100 than there are in the top10, one could conclude that DS characters are actually used more in arena than the current "LS meta", just not in the ranks that matter to most people on this forum.
Considering that most eventually copy the top on the leaderboard (it's logical - if it's working at the top then it'd naturally entice lower ranked players to copy) it eventually moves to LS / Rebel domination with a few DS in between. I've seen this happen on my shard, myself to play as an influence for specific DS teams while my Chaze guildies clearly inspired others.
So maybe he isn't out of touch with "reality" per se, his reality might just be different than yours because you're arguing from a whole different perspective.
A perspective that comes to the conclusion of mines, sooner or later.
You're missing the point, as usual. Your problems aren't the same as everyone else's problems because they aren't in the same situation as you are, not just because they happen to like a different faction than you do.
I can understand that you have a problem with LS just the same as i can understand a guy in the top100 is finally enjoying the fact that his LS squad can beat the more common DS characters.
You're missing the point, as usual. Your problems aren't the same as everyone else's problems because they aren't in the same situation as you are, not just because they happen to like a different faction than you do.
I can understand that you have a problem with LS just the same as i can understand a guy in the top100 is finally enjoying the fact that his LS squad can beat the more common DS characters.
No, I get the point. You are just 'as usual' resorting to red herring.
Your problems aren't the same as everyone else's problems because they aren't in the same situation as you are...
That's a broad statement that can apply for many people, even fellow DS users (IE: Bounty Hunters vs Empire)
...not just because they happen to like a different faction than you do.
Regardless of if you or I like X faction, there's an obvious faction imbalance leaning in favor of LS; particularly rebels. You can try to twist numbers, words and opinions all you want, even if they happen to be correct but they are nevertheless misdirected points. Fact is the execution of the game and majority of gamer's choices requires LS (sometimes forced, IE: EP, a DS user requires rebels. Are there any specific Sith required events or challenges?)
The irony is my favorite faction isn't even the one I use. My favorite faction is Jedi. I use Sith because it has a fighting chance against the dominant rebel force while maintaining a respectable defense without GK. That might eventually change as well.
I can understand that you have a problem with LS just the same as i can understand a guy in the top100 is finally enjoying the fact that his LS squad can beat the more common DS characters.
We can understand many side points that are totally correct, but ultimately, what role does it play with the elephant in the room? (LS / Rebels)
Replies
When Zaul was crushing everyone in arena, many users complained that it was an OP team with too many zetas and too much synergy. The response from those Zaul teams? Suck it up, and find a new team or way to counter. Zaul can be beat, you just need to re-think your strategy. Yada, yada, yada.
Well, now people HAVE found a way to do it...and the same users who said "go find a new strategy" are wanting to nerf the ability that makes that strategy work? Seriously? Try your own advice; find a new team. The game evolves constantly, so what works today to keep you at rank 1 won't necessarily work tomorrow.
The problem is not Tenacity Up. That's been in the game since Yoda was introduced and hasn't been a problem. It's only a problem now because 1) the Sith meta is countered by it and Sith meta users are not happy about it, and 2) it's being combined with triple cleanse. To me, that says the problem is the triple cleanse...not the Tenacity Up.
Chaze is the only truly OP character combo the game has had, and I do think they should be nerfed. Stacking dozens of HOT dots is just stupid; surely they can't think that people wouldn't have a problem with that. So let's fix the real problem, and quit trying to "fix" something that isn't broken. Either that, or take your own advice and start trying to use a new team. Others beat the Chaze/Rex teams frequently, so it can be done.
Baze Malbus: 1346 - 52%
CT-7567 "Rex": 1302 - 50%
Chirrut Îmwe: 1292 - 50%
And just for giggles.
Savage Opress: 464 - 18%
You can continue dancing around delusional or face reality. Your choice.
PS: I beat Chaze.
Zylo and Zavage are tough, sure...no doubt. But both can be beat with heal block. Chaze with the dozens of HOTs is worse, to me. I've managed to beat both at times, but Chaze is the harder duo, in my experience.
Or at least they would neutralize each other since they're opposing equals.
Too bad Dengar relies heavily on Crits to deliver his debuffs. GK (in any team) and Maul lead neuter his much needed crit synergy, so he's basically worthless.
I like Dengar's kit, a lot. In practice, he's just terrible.
I agree that tenacity up isn't broken. It's basically the same as the thousands of threads a while back about speed on mods being broken and needed tuning.
I do however disagree about chaze being broken. Like you said, others beat the team frequently, so how is that different than the zMaul meta? Started out OP, then people realized it was beatable (sure R2 helped out a bunch aswell). Nowadays if you complain about zMaul you'll get laughed at. Maybe one day people abandon their chaze crusade and will start laughing at others who can't consistandly beat chaze. Lets face it, even chaze, even in a tripple cleanse team, has its weaknesses.
Anyway, thrawn might be the next best character ingame. So this whole discussion might be obsolete in a few weeks
B2 applies a mass dispel as well as buff immunity at the same time. The problem is that he'll remove
the tenacity up that Rex provides the team, only to watch kenobi cleanse the buff immunity from the team and give tenacity up to those characters that he didn't cleanse. B2 also has low damage and no other utility, so even though you can make him work out on a team, you have to think harder about how to fit him in than you would if you just built your team around chaze and kenobi.
And just introduce more RNG into the game? No thanks..
Yes, I run that triple cleanse team. Yes, it's OP compared to other setups. Yes, it's beatable, all teams are beatable, that's not the point here.
That's because it's only recently being seen as an issue. I'm sure it will change down the road and they'll add a new skill that gives debuff immunity... then they'll be able to make money off of the toon that gives that buff.
Yes I have fought lots of rebel squads but all you have to do is go to SWGOH.gg and look at the top 100 meta report to see that the dark side dominates and has since forever.
https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/#squads
Rex · GK · Chirrut · Baze · Darth Nihilus // 280 80%
Rex · Chirrut · Baze · Darth Nihilus · R2-D2 // 83 24%
QGJ · JKA · GM Yoda · GK · R2-D2 // 66 19%
Rex · Kylo Ren · Chirrut · Baze · Darth Nihilus // 56 16%
no go to Meta report top 100 top Characters
EP 52%
Darth Nihulis 48%
Darth Vader 36%
Rex 30%
Darth Maul 30%
Kylo Ren 29%
O yea the top 6 most used toons in the game and 5 of them are dark side like I said Dark side rules arena
You are a garbage person.
That is all.
https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/#all
Character Count %
Darth Nihilus 1914 74%
General Kenobi 1602 62%
Baze Malbus 1346 52%
CT-7567 "Rex" 1302 50%
Chirrut Îmwe 1292 50%
R2-D2 1032 40%
Kylo Ren 591 23%
Emperor Palpatine 556 21%
Yea because you are looking at the number one player in every shard only. come on I looked at the top 100 and said so. The thing about the number one players are that 90% are whales slash dolphins so not an accurate depiction of true viability because up there there is very little variation while in the top 100 you have to work against more different squads and you see a combo of what is moderately easy to gear and what is viable at lower star lvls if that is what they have assess to. Nihlius is way too easy to gear for how powerful he is same with EP and same with Kylo. while on the other hand the good light side characters are crazy hard to gear. GK is one of if not THE HARDEST CHARACTER IN THE GAME TO GEAR AND EXTREMELY HARD TO GET IN THE FIRST PLACE both Chirrut and Baze are VERY difficult to gear and star R2-D2 IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO GEAR AND SEMI DIFFICULT TO STAR as you really need 5, 7 star gear 11 empire characters to get him. Rex is also very high on gear Requirements and takes a good while to star. Nihilus the only charater in the game with an insta kill and he is crazy tanky was given to everyone at 3* were he is ultra viable. EP is much easier than R2 to get I unlocked him with Akbar lead Leia Lando STH and biggs all at gear 9 or lower. Kylo is also ultra easy to farm. my point is the good good guy characters are hard to get while the supper OP/Supper powerful bad guys are there for the taking. So if you were to change the Tan up it would only plunge the Meta back to the dark side nexus that we have only begun to clime out of. So just Shut up and Let the Good guys beat the bad guys like they are supposed to and stop acting so Evil loving.
From the jump, this game at lower tiers gives you easy access to rebel characters. EP requires rebels and to get him, so naturally, most jump on the Wiggs / Lando / Boba bandwagon in lower tiers. From there, they'd invest into Chaze and very few trot into DS. With the exception of DN, who's practically needed due to the overabundance of Chaze, DS is generally lacking.
The very last part of your post shows an obvious bias.
he's talking about the top100. https://swgoh.gg/meta-report/100/#all According to this link the top100 is dominated by DS characters, not the "very few that trot into DS". Maybe the majority of the players in the top100 will eventually move on to chaze, wich seems like that is going to happen based on what happened in the top 1/10. But until then, if you're in the top 100 you're facing mostly DS characters. (that is if the meta report is accurate ofcourse)
Given the fact that there are way more players in the top100 than there are in the top10, one could conclude that DS characters are actually used more in arena than the current "LS meta", just not in the ranks that matter to most people on this forum.
So maybe he isn't out of touch with "reality" per se, his reality might just be different than yours because you're arguing from a whole different perspective.
and oh yea, you're also obviously biased
Considering that most eventually copy the top on the leaderboard (it's logical - if it's working at the top then it'd naturally entice lower ranked players to copy) it eventually moves to LS / Rebel domination with a few DS in between. I've seen this happen on my shard, myself to play as an influence for specific DS teams while my Chaze guildies clearly inspired others.
A perspective that comes to the conclusion of mines, sooner or later.
k.
I can understand that you have a problem with LS just the same as i can understand a guy in the top100 is finally enjoying the fact that his LS squad can beat the more common DS characters.
thank you for being reasonable
That's a broad statement that can apply for many people, even fellow DS users (IE: Bounty Hunters vs Empire)
Regardless of if you or I like X faction, there's an obvious faction imbalance leaning in favor of LS; particularly rebels. You can try to twist numbers, words and opinions all you want, even if they happen to be correct but they are nevertheless misdirected points. Fact is the execution of the game and majority of gamer's choices requires LS (sometimes forced, IE: EP, a DS user requires rebels. Are there any specific Sith required events or challenges?)
The irony is my favorite faction isn't even the one I use. My favorite faction is Jedi. I use Sith because it has a fighting chance against the dominant rebel force while maintaining a respectable defense without GK. That might eventually change as well.
We can understand many side points that are totally correct, but ultimately, what role does it play with the elephant in the room? (LS / Rebels)
top 1 most used characters:
Top 10 most used characters:
top 100 most used characters:
Turns out sith are the real problem?