Also, nihilus sucks so much that, as noted before, most won't fight in the raid unitl he is gone, and those of us that did are punished for not waiting by getting lower scores
Is it just me, or does Daka's 'Chant of Resurrection and Talzin's 'The Great Mother' zeta not seem to work in phase 4 of this raid??
I've made a few attempts with my Nightsister squad tonight, and neither worked multiple times. I might be unlucky, or missing something, and wanted to ask before I posted anything else about it.
What tier or tiers did you play?
T4, T5, T6, Heroic (Heroic on farm now)
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
2 guilds: 120m, 131m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
At Heroic level almost every guild uses the same squads (from the "guide" that is circulating among the players). And since most of us do not have every toon maxed and stacked with super mods there is only little opportunity to do some real test. Plus if a squad works in T5 there is no guarantee that it works on Heroic level.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
P1 is challenging and provides a mechanic that can be countered by at least two squads. I like P1, as opposed to many others. One can control DN pretty reliably actually and I even felt thrilled trying to maximize number of turns before DN took a turn. JTR and NS are the best squads so far.
P2 is ok overall but after 3 raids it became boring. The Sion mechanic is dull. It gives us a small lever to reduce the huge health pool a bit faster. Do some damage ... cleanse oneself from the cycle of whatever debuff from time to time ... do some damage ... and so on. It takes one attempt and I can do 1,5% - 2% with Troopers. Another 0,5% - 1% with Palp Meta and that´s it. I would never try to achieve more than my 2% - 3%. Never.
P3 is ... Well, I really wonder how you could ever come up with something like this. The Chexmix style of completing this phase is incedibly annoying and so far no other squad comes even close to the damage Chexmix can inflict upon Treya. Perhaps you thougt that P3 should be a milestone and the phase reminded me of the heroic tank raid: many guilds managed P1/2 and failed in P3. It took the whole guild to clear it and RNG played a huge role. Not fun.
P4 is ok, fighting DN with NS is fun. The remainder of the raid is not important once you took out DN. All guild members just mindlessly chip away at the bosses.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Generally the raid is not that bad. Of course you had to come up with something new and different. I enjoyed the first heroic attempt and how we managed to finally beat the raid. Now it is daily business and there is no sense of achievement. But it looks nice and is over after a couple hours.
Getting Treya might be nice on the one hand. On the other hand Treya is not what I want from the game. And the gear from rewards is not appropriate either. Today I got stuff I already have 1000/2000/3000+ pieces of. Where is the point?
What tier or tiers did you play?
We have done tiers 3 through 6. Tier 6 we quit because it was going nowhere and would have taken a month
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
My guild GP was 96 million but so many people hated the raid and flat out quit, so my guild GP is now 83 million.
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
JTR led resistance team, all G10-12. CLS Rebel team, all G10-12, Zeerz led IT team all gear 10-11, Phoenix Squad, all gear 9-11, Sith team with various leads and combos(but it didn’t matter).
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated - absolutely nothing
Demotivated - the pathetic rewards that were exponentially worse than the heroic Pit, which one person can clear in 10-15 minutes. The whole thing is awful.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Enjoy - absolutely nothing, it’s the single worst thing in the game and has no redeeming qualities
Dislike - Every single solitary aspect. The tedious monotony of it. The **** poor rewards that are not even close to worth the time commitment. The way it basically cost my guild it’s top 5 members because they all rage quit the game because of how horrible the entire thing is
Honestly the biggest problem is that p2 is wayyyy to easy so way to many people hold off on phase 1, thus making it take forever. Its sad that if you don't get in on phase 2 you won't make it in the top 3. Which means you get terrible rewards. Its a either screw yourself and help the guild or screw the people helping the guild and help yourself.
I pulled in 6.5 million damage in last phase 1 with all 5 attempts, no resetting no jtr, just using comps I've found work well. Next day for the first time in months I was able to compete in p2. Did nearly 5 million damage with 1 team. This is on a t4 raid. I'm now ranked #1 for my guild. Usually I am ranked around 10th. The system that was created around this raid is a huge part of the problem. Either balance the phases out better, or add ways using the mechanics already in play to do more damage. Ie unbreakable will reflects damage(max health and protection of character hit).
P4 easy fix, traya takes .5% damage to her maximum health each time a unit is killed. Each time her health falls below 90% she shipons health from all active allies to restore her own. Stratgey, keep nilhus and sion alive so they continue to summon minions and then kill minions. Something like that.
Obviously these ideas need tweaked but it wouldn't hurt to make there some ways to do bonus damage in p1 and p4. Right now its just about staying alive as long as possible in those phases without any real strategy involved.
Hello thank you for opening this but it seems a bit late.
1. doing t6 this takes 4-5 days with not many people having RJT.
2. Guild is 129m
3. Teams are a zader team and allowing the dots to roll over until the enrage hits will net 1.5m-2.5m in p1-3. Second is a FO team usually giving 1.5-2.2m in all phases. And lastly is the Imp troopers giving 2-4m each phase.
4. There were only positives in the fact that this was something new and challenging to do. The negatives are overwhelming.
First there is 1 team for p1 in heroic no other team does any dmg RTJ is a guild killer now. Second I understand high tenacity but stacking 50% on any dmg means 90% of characters are immediately useless. This should be something like a 2-4% increase for each hit it would still stack quickly and just start with a high tenacity like 70% it would open more possibilities. Thirdly the rewards are demoralizing. For all the effort and multiple days worth of effort they are horrible. And heroic is gaining so much so quickly it’s ridiculous.
5. This is mostly answered in number 4 but the most disliked was probably the lack of teams that will do anything in p1. With RTJ being your only real option to get dmg done.
Well hopefully this is actually read and taken into consideration I know the community in general is not very please with how STR currently is. Looking forward to the future with this raid.
Hello, SBCrumb. Welcome to the game, and my respects for jumping straight into the deep end.
-What tier or tiers did you play?
We're currently playing T6, but wasting a lot of tickets to do it.
-What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
~105M
-What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I don't have many of the top toons/teams. Honestly, my best overall team has been Jawas.
-What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Strongly demotivated by the crazy amount of RNG requiring many many retreats and restarts to get a halfway-decent run.
-What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
I enjoy the fact that there's new content, and Traya seems to be a character worth pursuing.
What I dislike is that there's way too much RNG in the attacks, and the raid boss's abilities are far too OP and random. The fact that there is only one team really considered viable for P1 & 3 is also bad; there needs to be more diversity of options, at least 3 reasonable teams for each phase.
Also, the previously stated plan to go to equal rewards for everyone is a terrible one, and should be scrapped.
Welcome, SBCrumb. My respect for jumping straight into the deep end.
-What tier or tiers did you play?
We're currently playing T6, but wasting a lot of tickets due to being maxed.
-What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
~105M
-What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I don't have most of the meta teams; my best is usually Jawas.
-What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated: Traya seems to be worth pursuing
Demotivating: RNG is way too crazy with the boss' abilities. When you have to restart a dozen times to get a halfway-decent run, that's not worth it.
-What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Enjoy: New content to work on
Dislike: Before Heroic, being limited to 5 runs per day means you don't have a good feel for how close you really are with your full roster. Also, there only being 1 real meta team for P1-3 is too limiting; there should be at least 3 viable options (without significant overlap).
Also, please scrap the idea to go to equal rewards. Having that on a multi-day event is one thing, but on something that only takes an hour or two is demotivating.
What tier or tiers did you play?
Tiers 3, 4 and trying 5 for the first time
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
70Mil (HAAT completion in <2 hours)
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Zader, ABC (Thrawn + Ezra), Ewoks, NS, FO (low tier - Rebels, Phoenix)
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated - additional currency. Using STR as a sandbox to test teams for other areas of the game (not trying to beat STR, but using it as a tougher challenge than GW).
Demotivated - pitifully small rewards compared to time investment. The rewards for Tier 4 are worse than when I did 0 damage and finished #37 in our Heroic Pit.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Like - P2 Sion mechanic especially at Tier 5, where it's a real decision when to remove Pain or continue with high damage (my squads are strong enough that Sion is not a threat in lower tiers). Or choosing a team that heals itself - ewoks.
Dislikes - Many
1. Immense time sink. If I play STR properly it takes more time than all other aspects of SWGOH combined. I'm a guild officer, organise our TW, can solo P3/4 HAAT.
2. RNG factor. My Zader has 95% potency and it still takes 25-30 restarts to get 3DoTs on Nihilus in P1 at Tier 5 at the beginning. Either I restart, or do 1/3 damage
3. Lack of guild participation - about half the guild don't bother with more than auto for this raid. Except...
4. P2 being much easier than other phases to do damage. If you don't score big in P2, you are out of the top 10. Someone can spend 20 minutes on P2 and beat hours of time spent in other phases.
5. Big burden on those guild members with JTR. We only have a few and they really feel an unfair amount of pressure.
My guild is currently working on Heroic, but until now we moved between T5 and T4, the former for the rewards, the latter for a slight reprieve from the raid. We found that T6 simply wasn’t worth the additional time investment relative to the rewards received. Tier 4 takes less than 24 hours, T5 about 3 or 4 days, and T6 about 5 to 6 days depending on player fatigue.
We are at 127 mil GP.
For the non-heroic tiers, there is a lot of flexibility. We all practice with our RJT teams, Night Sisters, Imperial Troopers, Phoenix, and First Order teams, but we also play around with different combinations just for the fun of it like Nihilus-led Sith, Clones, and others (I especially like Boba lead with Thrawn, Wampa, Ezra, and Sabine, especially in Phase 2). For Heroic, though, there is much less flexibility. Phase 1 is RJT only. We have tried a number of different teams, but many cannot take down Nihilus’s protection, and those that do can barely break 0.5%. For the rest of the phases, we use the teams recommended in the guide that has been circulating, so little to no variation there.
Overall, beating the raid, improving our rosters, and earning Traya shards are all great motivating factors, and those are major parts of why we keep pushing forward. We do enjoy the game tremendously and don’t mind challenges being thrown our way. The difficulty is that this raid seems to go against much of what you have raised recently about quality of life for players and about your unspoken encouragement for us to have a broad and developed roster of characters (I am thinking about TBs and platoons and TWs here).
The variance in time to completion for the lower tiers of the raid, factoring in the rewards received, just make tiers 5 and 6 a chore. Though not as severe as the original AAT raid (it took some guilds a month to clear it if I remember correctly), it simply isn’t enjoyable to spend days trying to take a phase down. And while there is variety in the teams that can be effective in the non-heroic tiers, it is still not enough for a majority of guild members to keep them interested.
The frustration with heroic comes from the damage differential between the unique teams and all other teams for Phases 1 and 3. For example, as you know most average RJT teams (G12, but not the best mods) can do, roughly, 5-6% in an attack. Any other team struggles to get one-tenth of that. So, unless you have RJT, there really isn’t a point attacking in Phase 1, which excludes a fair number of players from a major guild event. And it is the same for Phase 3. This also means that people with RJT teams (or Chex Mix) feel greater pressure to maximize damage done, not because you want to be the top scorer in the raid (positive motivation), but because you don’t want to let your guild mates down (negative motivation), hence the number of re-tries to get good RNG.
Like I said, my guild is motivated to keep moving forward, to growing, to developing, to tackling the challenges that you throw our way, and we are mostly happy to do so. But it does feel like this raid is antithetical to your recent quality of life updates and your push for players not to neglect their rosters to develop just a few strong teams. We enjoy the strategy needed to attack in each phase of the Sith Raid, like using the specials at the right times and in the right ways, but portions of the raid seem to exclude members (because of time requirements or not having the only viable team for a phase), which makes some much less interested in participating.
Sith raid is an interesting update/new raid so far. As i noticed, you guys made tier chapters-enemies with a lot HP. So it takes a lot time to beat them. Nihilus- (instantly defeat enemy chapter) seems like invulnerable especially for players who didnt spent that much time in this game, for exmple me (4-5months). Althought we have some few members with strong gp that helps to pass it, otherwise its mainly impossible. We mainly do 2-3 tiers, but how about even higher tiers 4-7? Looks like you need to have a gp with 200mil and then you can do something but now, its waaay too strong and rewards arent that good comparing the time we spent in it.
I use leja,wedg,bigs, kylo and sion mostly for raids.
My suggest would be to do sith raid powerfullness dedicated to guild Gp. That it would be fair to spend properly time and get the rewards or just to change all rewards to more usefull ones. There are gear parts which are rare and requires sith raid 4-6 tiers which is impossible. So please make changes about it.
Cant wait for changes
We have received a wide range of feedback about the newest raid, The Sith Triumvirate and we would like to hear more about your experience. Please include the following information in addition to your feedback:
What tier or tiers did you play?
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Our guild is 83M
We play T4 primarily, but every few weeks we do a T5
The T4 takes us 2-2.5 days, T5 takes us 7-8 days. We do the 5 because it offers better rewards (*cough* Guild Event Currency) but it is a significant pain to take a week to earn SIGNIFICANTLY less GEC with similar time and effort as Territory Battles take. Also the completion discrepancy between T4 and T5 is painful. We have 7 RJT's in our guild, all between g11-13, and still Nihilus takes us 3 days alone in T5. When one phase takes that much time, it feels demoralizing (and demotivating).
So we do T4, the rewards are... okay. I'd like to see more/better drops of full gear pieces for top 10, not just top 3. The regular guild currency is nice and appropriately distributed. As a guild, we do the Sion and Treya phase pretty well. And those phases are fun, as we are working together to piece together usable teams and we often share our successes in Discord.
Suggestions:
First, we obviously need more RJT's, so offering her event in June or July would be helpful.
Second, add GEC to all levels of the STR, as this truly is a "Guild Event"
Third, a Nihilus "Nerf" would be helpful. His protection re-gen is ridiculous.
Fourth, in P4 when Treya is attackable, remove her foresight. We've made it that far... Just let us have our victory.
Thanks!
My big problem with this is 95% of the time CG takes what we ask for, twists it into something hideous, convoluted, and monstrous, and hands it back in such a mess we ask for it to just be undone, and made to the original version... I feel like we're going to get the equivalent of TW scoring, but in Raids.... then when it goes back to the original, we're 'happy' because we saw just how much worse it could be.
The other 5% of the time? Cg gives the option to Sim GW or other levels we've done hundreds of times, or gives 150 sim tickets a day - these things are ALWAYS good!
(edit; grammarzzz)
What tier or tiers did you play?- Tier 5 maximum as this takes us at minimum a week to do, mainly we do Tier 4 as this takes us 5 days to complete. We've started to do tier 3 after doing tier 4 twice to get the tokens and some average loot to gear our toons. What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?- 50mil What teams you did you attempt the raid with? Phase 1: We use nightsisters and very little JTR teams as we don't have a lot of members who have JTR
Phase 2: Phoenix, Imperial troopers and Nightsisters - plus any riff raff to get the damage dealt
Phase 3: A combination of our empire, troopers and nightsister teams
Phase 4: Everything we have, all the above and then some to get this done What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying? Motivated - learn the mechanics and guess Nilihus's annihilate! But we have the tickets so we might as well do the raid to get some drops to keep our roster going Demotivated - Phase 1 and Phase 3 plus the poor rewards! What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid? Enjoyed the different scenes of the raid graphics and the characters involved. Disliked the protection on Nilihus during Phase 1 and Phase 4 - and the rewards
1. Tiers III & IV (about to try Tier V or VI)
2. Around 32 mil
3. I use two rebel squads, a Sith, an Empire w/ CLS and an FO but others in the guild use Nightsisters and some others.
4. What motivated is how difficult the raid is. What demotivated me and our guild is the rewards. Even on tiers III and IV you do 3-4 times as much damage as an AAT tier VI and yet the rewards are equal or less than that. If you have to do that much more damage, your rewards should be at least twice as much as the rewards for Tier VI of AAT, if not more, because it takes that much longer to complete the raid.
5. For example, it usually takes us about 2 days to finish AAT Tier VI and about 10 days to finish Tier IV of Sith. On top of this, like I said earlier, the rewards is about equal, so that makes the point of doing the raid rather diminished.
--What tier or tiers did you play?
-Our Guild has played one Tier 3 and one Tier 5, the rest have been Tier 4
-Note that we finish The Pit Tier 7 in < 20 minutes and can easily finish Heroic AAT
--What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
-We are currently at 79,000,000 GP
--What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
-Various - mostly a CLS led team, a Vader led team, a Thrawn led team (with DT), and either Clones, Resistance, Ewoks, Sith, Rebels, etc....depending on what Phase we are in
-Our guild has poor participation in the Raid, but I've been consistent so I get five attempts per day in the same phase
-We typically require 1-2 days for Phase 1, 3/4 day each for Phases 2 & 3, and 1-2 days for Phase 4 (Tier 4)
--What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
-I continue to play because I need tons of Carbanti and Stun Cuffs.
--What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
-The art and graphics are amazing. I feel that this is one area where the game has really improved over the past 6-9 months, in general.
-Phases 2 & 3 are decent, Phases 1 & 4 are just brutal to play. I get that the raid is supposed to be a puzzle and challenging, but I don't think this should come at the expense of it being fun.
-The Pit and AAT raids have been my favorite part of the game. But honestly, I really don't enjoy this raid. It feels like work, especially Phase 1. It simply isn't fun.
The Sith Raid is so un-fun that it is honestly hard to imagine that feedback is even close to the balance of positive and negative implied by the "wide range" suggested in the question.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
The Sith Raid is so un-fun that it is honestly hard to imagine that feedback is even close to the balance of positive and negative implied by the "wide range" suggested in the question.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
This is not a game. It’s a gambling business model put behind a game-like user interface.
The Sith Raid is so un-fun that it is honestly hard to imagine that feedback is even close to the balance of positive and negative implied by the "wide range" suggested in the question.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
This is not a game. It’s a gambling business model put behind a game-like user interface.
One way of looking at it. There is absolutely no secret that the very existence of the game is to make money. This is not some kind of dark and forbidden secret. It is plain and obvious. But this forum, and thread, is about that game interface. The one that so many enjoy using, for fun. And a great deal of people with no expenditure whatsoever.
The Sith Raid is so un-fun that it is honestly hard to imagine that feedback is even close to the balance of positive and negative implied by the "wide range" suggested in the question.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
This is not a game. It’s a gambling business model put behind a game-like user interface.
One way of looking at it. There is absolutely no secret that the very existence of the game is to make money. This is not some kind of dark and forbidden secret. It is plain and obvious. But this forum, and thread, is about that game interface. The one that so many enjoy using, for fun. And a great deal of people with no expenditure whatsoever.
Back to the Sith Raid comments -
If you browse through this thread you will find that I gave feedback. Much more positive feedback than average by the way. And if you read the whole thread you will find that most people complain about the gambling mechanics. What they miss is strict and transparent rules, options and worthwhile goals and a stable environment.
1 mostly t3 we were doing t4 but takes a long time so quited to t3. Guild GP is 55m
2 cls bb8 thrawn chirrut and og han is my favorite team. Rest is random
3 ıts a boring and painfull raid. Guild participation is not good btw. People doesnt want to fight with that boring "thing"
4 not really p2 is not bad maybe little bit p3
The Sith Raid is so un-fun that it is honestly hard to imagine that feedback is even close to the balance of positive and negative implied by the "wide range" suggested in the question.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
Eloquently put. This game could be amazing, but for reasons unknown, it has become a gaming deadzone. Sometimes I wonder what the depth of gaming experience is that the developers have. Do they play RPGs, have they ever played any mmo's? it sounds crazy I suppose but being a game developer does not mean they are an avid gamer (developers in general). The previous Lead Producer stated a while back "It's supposed to be hard" (the game).He must have forgotten to include "..fun is irrelevant" because it is clear that is a matter of opinion. One the players do not share. Star Wars fans are known to be very vocal. It's sad knowing most of those that were fiercely loyal to CG and SWGOH, have moved on. Many were banned for voicing any opinion other than positive. It really seems like they want the game to end. Which is hopefully not the case. But nothing makes sense about this raid. I really, really wish the developers could explain thier view and reasons, but I won't hold my bresth.
1. It is nonsense that players need to use airplane mode to control the quality of their runs. Just modify the raid defeat interface to show your final score and add two buttons "Post Score" and "Restart Run". This is how people play your game, so instead of requiring nonsense metahacks, just make this how the game is played.
2. It is disappointing that one of the most clever components of raids, conditional topples, are barely used in STR. Topple only exists in P3, and it is arguably nearly pointless (it doesn't last very long at all, and the price of toppling is that the lightsabers get back up and you have to kill them again). Why not topple Nihilus when Annihilate gets blocked? Why not take off the RNG dependent pain accumulation on Sion (make it guaranteed) but make it possible to topple him and reset the pain level?
3. It is awful when this raid is literally running all the time (when it finally gets beaten, it immediately gets started again because tickets caked up). This is another reason I advocate for a 48 hour time limit on all tiers, and a mass rebalance of T1 - T6.
4. Unbreakable will should make the unit functionally immune to all status affects (including, importantly, cooldown reduction). It is terrible when you drop this on a unit, then get annihilated, then come off of unbreakable will and their cooldowns have been reduced and you cannot use self-heals to preserve them.
Replies
I've made a few attempts with my Nightsister squad tonight, and neither worked multiple times. I might be unlucky, or missing something, and wanted to ask before I posted anything else about it.
T4, T5, T6, Heroic (Heroic on farm now)
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
2 guilds: 120m, 131m
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
At Heroic level almost every guild uses the same squads (from the "guide" that is circulating among the players). And since most of us do not have every toon maxed and stacked with super mods there is only little opportunity to do some real test. Plus if a squad works in T5 there is no guarantee that it works on Heroic level.
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
P1 is challenging and provides a mechanic that can be countered by at least two squads. I like P1, as opposed to many others. One can control DN pretty reliably actually and I even felt thrilled trying to maximize number of turns before DN took a turn. JTR and NS are the best squads so far.
P2 is ok overall but after 3 raids it became boring. The Sion mechanic is dull. It gives us a small lever to reduce the huge health pool a bit faster. Do some damage ... cleanse oneself from the cycle of whatever debuff from time to time ... do some damage ... and so on. It takes one attempt and I can do 1,5% - 2% with Troopers. Another 0,5% - 1% with Palp Meta and that´s it. I would never try to achieve more than my 2% - 3%. Never.
P3 is ... Well, I really wonder how you could ever come up with something like this. The Chexmix style of completing this phase is incedibly annoying and so far no other squad comes even close to the damage Chexmix can inflict upon Treya. Perhaps you thougt that P3 should be a milestone and the phase reminded me of the heroic tank raid: many guilds managed P1/2 and failed in P3. It took the whole guild to clear it and RNG played a huge role. Not fun.
P4 is ok, fighting DN with NS is fun. The remainder of the raid is not important once you took out DN. All guild members just mindlessly chip away at the bosses.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Generally the raid is not that bad. Of course you had to come up with something new and different. I enjoyed the first heroic attempt and how we managed to finally beat the raid. Now it is daily business and there is no sense of achievement. But it looks nice and is over after a couple hours.
Getting Treya might be nice on the one hand. On the other hand Treya is not what I want from the game. And the gear from rewards is not appropriate either. Today I got stuff I already have 1000/2000/3000+ pieces of. Where is the point?
"Say something I'm giving up on you.." lol
Yes, this is clear. This kind of choices results mass quit from the game. They have all the data to check this (I saw this in our Guild)
We have done tiers 3 through 6. Tier 6 we quit because it was going nowhere and would have taken a month
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
My guild GP was 96 million but so many people hated the raid and flat out quit, so my guild GP is now 83 million.
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
JTR led resistance team, all G10-12. CLS Rebel team, all G10-12, Zeerz led IT team all gear 10-11, Phoenix Squad, all gear 9-11, Sith team with various leads and combos(but it didn’t matter).
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated - absolutely nothing
Demotivated - the pathetic rewards that were exponentially worse than the heroic Pit, which one person can clear in 10-15 minutes. The whole thing is awful.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Enjoy - absolutely nothing, it’s the single worst thing in the game and has no redeeming qualities
Dislike - Every single solitary aspect. The tedious monotony of it. The **** poor rewards that are not even close to worth the time commitment. The way it basically cost my guild it’s top 5 members because they all rage quit the game because of how horrible the entire thing is
Do I hear Page 13???
Maybe page 12
I’m not that optimistic
I pulled in 6.5 million damage in last phase 1 with all 5 attempts, no resetting no jtr, just using comps I've found work well. Next day for the first time in months I was able to compete in p2. Did nearly 5 million damage with 1 team. This is on a t4 raid. I'm now ranked #1 for my guild. Usually I am ranked around 10th. The system that was created around this raid is a huge part of the problem. Either balance the phases out better, or add ways using the mechanics already in play to do more damage. Ie unbreakable will reflects damage(max health and protection of character hit).
P4 easy fix, traya takes .5% damage to her maximum health each time a unit is killed. Each time her health falls below 90% she shipons health from all active allies to restore her own. Stratgey, keep nilhus and sion alive so they continue to summon minions and then kill minions. Something like that.
Obviously these ideas need tweaked but it wouldn't hurt to make there some ways to do bonus damage in p1 and p4. Right now its just about staying alive as long as possible in those phases without any real strategy involved.
1. doing t6 this takes 4-5 days with not many people having RJT.
2. Guild is 129m
3. Teams are a zader team and allowing the dots to roll over until the enrage hits will net 1.5m-2.5m in p1-3. Second is a FO team usually giving 1.5-2.2m in all phases. And lastly is the Imp troopers giving 2-4m each phase.
4. There were only positives in the fact that this was something new and challenging to do. The negatives are overwhelming.
First there is 1 team for p1 in heroic no other team does any dmg RTJ is a guild killer now. Second I understand high tenacity but stacking 50% on any dmg means 90% of characters are immediately useless. This should be something like a 2-4% increase for each hit it would still stack quickly and just start with a high tenacity like 70% it would open more possibilities. Thirdly the rewards are demoralizing. For all the effort and multiple days worth of effort they are horrible. And heroic is gaining so much so quickly it’s ridiculous.
5. This is mostly answered in number 4 but the most disliked was probably the lack of teams that will do anything in p1. With RTJ being your only real option to get dmg done.
Well hopefully this is actually read and taken into consideration I know the community in general is not very please with how STR currently is. Looking forward to the future with this raid.
-What tier or tiers did you play?
We're currently playing T6, but wasting a lot of tickets to do it.
-What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
~105M
-What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I don't have many of the top toons/teams. Honestly, my best overall team has been Jawas.
-What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Strongly demotivated by the crazy amount of RNG requiring many many retreats and restarts to get a halfway-decent run.
-What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
I enjoy the fact that there's new content, and Traya seems to be a character worth pursuing.
What I dislike is that there's way too much RNG in the attacks, and the raid boss's abilities are far too OP and random. The fact that there is only one team really considered viable for P1 & 3 is also bad; there needs to be more diversity of options, at least 3 reasonable teams for each phase.
Also, the previously stated plan to go to equal rewards for everyone is a terrible one, and should be scrapped.
-What tier or tiers did you play?
We're currently playing T6, but wasting a lot of tickets due to being maxed.
-What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
~105M
-What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
I don't have most of the meta teams; my best is usually Jawas.
-What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated: Traya seems to be worth pursuing
Demotivating: RNG is way too crazy with the boss' abilities. When you have to restart a dozen times to get a halfway-decent run, that's not worth it.
-What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Enjoy: New content to work on
Dislike: Before Heroic, being limited to 5 runs per day means you don't have a good feel for how close you really are with your full roster. Also, there only being 1 real meta team for P1-3 is too limiting; there should be at least 3 viable options (without significant overlap).
Also, please scrap the idea to go to equal rewards. Having that on a multi-day event is one thing, but on something that only takes an hour or two is demotivating.
https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/169799/what-if-they-remove-gear-from-raids-and#latest
Tiers 3, 4 and trying 5 for the first time
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
70Mil (HAAT completion in <2 hours)
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Zader, ABC (Thrawn + Ezra), Ewoks, NS, FO (low tier - Rebels, Phoenix)
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated - additional currency. Using STR as a sandbox to test teams for other areas of the game (not trying to beat STR, but using it as a tougher challenge than GW).
Demotivated - pitifully small rewards compared to time investment. The rewards for Tier 4 are worse than when I did 0 damage and finished #37 in our Heroic Pit.
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Like - P2 Sion mechanic especially at Tier 5, where it's a real decision when to remove Pain or continue with high damage (my squads are strong enough that Sion is not a threat in lower tiers). Or choosing a team that heals itself - ewoks.
Dislikes - Many
1. Immense time sink. If I play STR properly it takes more time than all other aspects of SWGOH combined. I'm a guild officer, organise our TW, can solo P3/4 HAAT.
2. RNG factor. My Zader has 95% potency and it still takes 25-30 restarts to get 3DoTs on Nihilus in P1 at Tier 5 at the beginning. Either I restart, or do 1/3 damage
3. Lack of guild participation - about half the guild don't bother with more than auto for this raid. Except...
4. P2 being much easier than other phases to do damage. If you don't score big in P2, you are out of the top 10. Someone can spend 20 minutes on P2 and beat hours of time spent in other phases.
5. Big burden on those guild members with JTR. We only have a few and they really feel an unfair amount of pressure.
We are at 127 mil GP.
For the non-heroic tiers, there is a lot of flexibility. We all practice with our RJT teams, Night Sisters, Imperial Troopers, Phoenix, and First Order teams, but we also play around with different combinations just for the fun of it like Nihilus-led Sith, Clones, and others (I especially like Boba lead with Thrawn, Wampa, Ezra, and Sabine, especially in Phase 2). For Heroic, though, there is much less flexibility. Phase 1 is RJT only. We have tried a number of different teams, but many cannot take down Nihilus’s protection, and those that do can barely break 0.5%. For the rest of the phases, we use the teams recommended in the guide that has been circulating, so little to no variation there.
Overall, beating the raid, improving our rosters, and earning Traya shards are all great motivating factors, and those are major parts of why we keep pushing forward. We do enjoy the game tremendously and don’t mind challenges being thrown our way. The difficulty is that this raid seems to go against much of what you have raised recently about quality of life for players and about your unspoken encouragement for us to have a broad and developed roster of characters (I am thinking about TBs and platoons and TWs here).
The variance in time to completion for the lower tiers of the raid, factoring in the rewards received, just make tiers 5 and 6 a chore. Though not as severe as the original AAT raid (it took some guilds a month to clear it if I remember correctly), it simply isn’t enjoyable to spend days trying to take a phase down. And while there is variety in the teams that can be effective in the non-heroic tiers, it is still not enough for a majority of guild members to keep them interested.
The frustration with heroic comes from the damage differential between the unique teams and all other teams for Phases 1 and 3. For example, as you know most average RJT teams (G12, but not the best mods) can do, roughly, 5-6% in an attack. Any other team struggles to get one-tenth of that. So, unless you have RJT, there really isn’t a point attacking in Phase 1, which excludes a fair number of players from a major guild event. And it is the same for Phase 3. This also means that people with RJT teams (or Chex Mix) feel greater pressure to maximize damage done, not because you want to be the top scorer in the raid (positive motivation), but because you don’t want to let your guild mates down (negative motivation), hence the number of re-tries to get good RNG.
Like I said, my guild is motivated to keep moving forward, to growing, to developing, to tackling the challenges that you throw our way, and we are mostly happy to do so. But it does feel like this raid is antithetical to your recent quality of life updates and your push for players not to neglect their rosters to develop just a few strong teams. We enjoy the strategy needed to attack in each phase of the Sith Raid, like using the specials at the right times and in the right ways, but portions of the raid seem to exclude members (because of time requirements or not having the only viable team for a phase), which makes some much less interested in participating.
My guild is 11 mil gp.
Sith raid is an interesting update/new raid so far. As i noticed, you guys made tier chapters-enemies with a lot HP. So it takes a lot time to beat them. Nihilus- (instantly defeat enemy chapter) seems like invulnerable especially for players who didnt spent that much time in this game, for exmple me (4-5months). Althought we have some few members with strong gp that helps to pass it, otherwise its mainly impossible. We mainly do 2-3 tiers, but how about even higher tiers 4-7? Looks like you need to have a gp with 200mil and then you can do something but now, its waaay too strong and rewards arent that good comparing the time we spent in it.
I use leja,wedg,bigs, kylo and sion mostly for raids.
My suggest would be to do sith raid powerfullness dedicated to guild Gp. That it would be fair to spend properly time and get the rewards or just to change all rewards to more usefull ones. There are gear parts which are rare and requires sith raid 4-6 tiers which is impossible. So please make changes about it.
Cant wait for changes
Our guild is 83M
We play T4 primarily, but every few weeks we do a T5
The T4 takes us 2-2.5 days, T5 takes us 7-8 days. We do the 5 because it offers better rewards (*cough* Guild Event Currency) but it is a significant pain to take a week to earn SIGNIFICANTLY less GEC with similar time and effort as Territory Battles take. Also the completion discrepancy between T4 and T5 is painful. We have 7 RJT's in our guild, all between g11-13, and still Nihilus takes us 3 days alone in T5. When one phase takes that much time, it feels demoralizing (and demotivating).
So we do T4, the rewards are... okay. I'd like to see more/better drops of full gear pieces for top 10, not just top 3. The regular guild currency is nice and appropriately distributed. As a guild, we do the Sion and Treya phase pretty well. And those phases are fun, as we are working together to piece together usable teams and we often share our successes in Discord.
Suggestions:
First, we obviously need more RJT's, so offering her event in June or July would be helpful.
Second, add GEC to all levels of the STR, as this truly is a "Guild Event"
Third, a Nihilus "Nerf" would be helpful. His protection re-gen is ridiculous.
Fourth, in P4 when Treya is attackable, remove her foresight. We've made it that far... Just let us have our victory.
Thanks!
The other 5% of the time? Cg gives the option to Sim GW or other levels we've done hundreds of times, or gives 150 sim tickets a day - these things are ALWAYS good!
(edit; grammarzzz)
What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid? - 50mil
What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
Phase 1: We use nightsisters and very little JTR teams as we don't have a lot of members who have JTR
Phase 2: Phoenix, Imperial troopers and Nightsisters - plus any riff raff to get the damage dealt
Phase 3: A combination of our empire, troopers and nightsister teams
Phase 4: Everything we have, all the above and then some to get this done
What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
Motivated - learn the mechanics and guess Nilihus's annihilate! But we have the tickets so we might as well do the raid to get some drops to keep our roster going
Demotivated - Phase 1 and Phase 3 plus the poor rewards!
What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
Enjoyed the different scenes of the raid graphics and the characters involved.
Disliked the protection on Nilihus during Phase 1 and Phase 4 - and the rewards
2. Around 32 mil
3. I use two rebel squads, a Sith, an Empire w/ CLS and an FO but others in the guild use Nightsisters and some others.
4. What motivated is how difficult the raid is. What demotivated me and our guild is the rewards. Even on tiers III and IV you do 3-4 times as much damage as an AAT tier VI and yet the rewards are equal or less than that. If you have to do that much more damage, your rewards should be at least twice as much as the rewards for Tier VI of AAT, if not more, because it takes that much longer to complete the raid.
5. For example, it usually takes us about 2 days to finish AAT Tier VI and about 10 days to finish Tier IV of Sith. On top of this, like I said earlier, the rewards is about equal, so that makes the point of doing the raid rather diminished.
-Our Guild has played one Tier 3 and one Tier 5, the rest have been Tier 4
-Note that we finish The Pit Tier 7 in < 20 minutes and can easily finish Heroic AAT
--What GP is your Guild that is attempting the raid?
-We are currently at 79,000,000 GP
--What teams you did you attempt the raid with?
-Various - mostly a CLS led team, a Vader led team, a Thrawn led team (with DT), and either Clones, Resistance, Ewoks, Sith, Rebels, etc....depending on what Phase we are in
-Our guild has poor participation in the Raid, but I've been consistent so I get five attempts per day in the same phase
-We typically require 1-2 days for Phase 1, 3/4 day each for Phases 2 & 3, and 1-2 days for Phase 4 (Tier 4)
--What part of the raid motivated or demotivated you to continue trying?
-I continue to play because I need tons of Carbanti and Stun Cuffs.
--What about the raid did you enjoy? What did you dislike about the raid?
-The art and graphics are amazing. I feel that this is one area where the game has really improved over the past 6-9 months, in general.
-Phases 2 & 3 are decent, Phases 1 & 4 are just brutal to play. I get that the raid is supposed to be a puzzle and challenging, but I don't think this should come at the expense of it being fun.
-The Pit and AAT raids have been my favorite part of the game. But honestly, I really don't enjoy this raid. It feels like work, especially Phase 1. It simply isn't fun.
For reference on my perspective, even after making games professionally for many years, I'm just not the sort of player who will read forums, or develop spreadsheets, or watch videos of hardcore players to develop strategies for how to play a game. In my opinion, a game should provide clear feedback to the player for what works and does not work. A players strategic options should be limited sufficiently that consequences and benefits are legible (again, without spreadsheets and other research). A player should have options available at any time that allow them to overcome challenges. Unlike most of this game which is generally superbly balanced, the Sith Raid does none of these thing and seems designed to push players away from it.
First of all, it's so tedious, at least at Tier IV that my 103m GP guild plays, and takes so long to complete that it's ALWAYS running. Even if everything else was great, which is far from the case, the grind of playing every single day to make no perceivable progress is simply awful. As its always running, the event feels like a chore... And would even with dramatically better rewards. Rewards don't make something fun... They are just the bonus you get for competing a journey that itself is (presumably) fun. Incredibly, after one of the most tedious, repetitive experiences I can think of in a game I've spent a lot of time with (and I've played this game as much as any in my life), the rewards are so poor and out of alignment with effort that the grueling, frustrating and utterly uninteresting event ends with rewards so meaningless as to actually enhance the sense of pointlessness.
The majority of ppl in my guild don't want to bother to even auto the event, which speaks volumes to how it is both utterly unfun as well as lacking in meaningful reward.
Many people have given feedback on specific mechanics that I don't think it's necessary to go much further, but one thing that blows my mind is the unique addition of a mechanic to make a player invulnerable, such that they can survive the (infuriating repetitive) Nilalus instakill, yet almost immediately afterwards, all toons are hit with what appears to be unavoidable damage that kills these "protected" toons anyways! What!!?? It's like the raid goes out of its way to makes its mechanics both pointless, repetitive and infuriating! If this is somehow supposed to motivate the player to find a solution, in a battle where virtually none of our (hard earned) abilities have any effect, speaking for myself I can only say that it completely fails to do so.
In my opinion, raids are WAY cooler when the enemy is special... The Rancor... The tank (I suppose), Jabba on his ship maybe... Wampa (before it was inexplicably made a player character), an AT-AT, even holding off the thing in the trash compactor until you can get the door open... Special moments... Intended to be played infrequently such that they are special in both atmosphere, reward and time... And this Sith Raid seems to be intentionally designed to be the opposite of that.
This is not a game. It’s a gambling business model put behind a game-like user interface.
One way of looking at it. There is absolutely no secret that the very existence of the game is to make money. This is not some kind of dark and forbidden secret. It is plain and obvious. But this forum, and thread, is about that game interface. The one that so many enjoy using, for fun. And a great deal of people with no expenditure whatsoever.
Back to the Sith Raid comments -
If you browse through this thread you will find that I gave feedback. Much more positive feedback than average by the way. And if you read the whole thread you will find that most people complain about the gambling mechanics. What they miss is strict and transparent rules, options and worthwhile goals and a stable environment.
2 cls bb8 thrawn chirrut and og han is my favorite team. Rest is random
3 ıts a boring and painfull raid. Guild participation is not good btw. People doesnt want to fight with that boring "thing"
4 not really p2 is not bad maybe little bit p3
Eloquently put. This game could be amazing, but for reasons unknown, it has become a gaming deadzone. Sometimes I wonder what the depth of gaming experience is that the developers have. Do they play RPGs, have they ever played any mmo's? it sounds crazy I suppose but being a game developer does not mean they are an avid gamer (developers in general). The previous Lead Producer stated a while back "It's supposed to be hard" (the game).He must have forgotten to include "..fun is irrelevant" because it is clear that is a matter of opinion. One the players do not share. Star Wars fans are known to be very vocal. It's sad knowing most of those that were fiercely loyal to CG and SWGOH, have moved on. Many were banned for voicing any opinion other than positive. It really seems like they want the game to end. Which is hopefully not the case. But nothing makes sense about this raid. I really, really wish the developers could explain thier view and reasons, but I won't hold my bresth.
1. It is nonsense that players need to use airplane mode to control the quality of their runs. Just modify the raid defeat interface to show your final score and add two buttons "Post Score" and "Restart Run". This is how people play your game, so instead of requiring nonsense metahacks, just make this how the game is played.
2. It is disappointing that one of the most clever components of raids, conditional topples, are barely used in STR. Topple only exists in P3, and it is arguably nearly pointless (it doesn't last very long at all, and the price of toppling is that the lightsabers get back up and you have to kill them again). Why not topple Nihilus when Annihilate gets blocked? Why not take off the RNG dependent pain accumulation on Sion (make it guaranteed) but make it possible to topple him and reset the pain level?
3. It is awful when this raid is literally running all the time (when it finally gets beaten, it immediately gets started again because tickets caked up). This is another reason I advocate for a 48 hour time limit on all tiers, and a mass rebalance of T1 - T6.
4. Unbreakable will should make the unit functionally immune to all status affects (including, importantly, cooldown reduction). It is terrible when you drop this on a unit, then get annihilated, then come off of unbreakable will and their cooldowns have been reduced and you cannot use self-heals to preserve them.