Shardchat destroys fun

Prev1345678
Noxfire27
60 posts Member
edited March 11
I know that shardchats are a thing. I denied a while ago joining the shardchat in my arena. But I can’t believe nobody (CG/EA) is doing something against that besides changing my payout-time. My situation (sorry for my english, just my second language): I was doing quite fine the last few days in Arena, could achieve rank 3 or better. Without shardchat. And obviously my good results poked someone in the eye as I got a message today from one of the megawhales of my arena asking for my payouttime. And after telling him (yes, my fault, I thought maybe they‘d see that I have a Payout which doesn’t concern them and let me be) I got crushed. Suddenly I couldn’t fight anymore as there was always a fight going on. So they swarmed against me and all I could do was to watch my sinking ship till the payout. And the guy who asked me denies now all of my messages. This is imho definitely cheating and against the rules. Now I have to change my payout time. Sounds salty but that never happened before in 4 years and I’m really frustrated atm

Replies

  • evoluza
    2066 posts Member
    OK ok ok...
    The game isn't out for 4 year....
    This is not cheating....

    You can change your payout or find there payout and kick them.
    Depends what you wanna do.
    They easily find your payout again trough swgoh.gg.
    Starting a war will cost a few crystals, but at the end they probably change there mind (if you provent them from taking first at there payout)
  • Im not a fan of it. I wish it didnt exist. Alas I hate getting knocked out of top 20 more.
  • Highest rank of day would also remove all this payout timing changes issues also. Not to mention the stress of playing for a specific hour (Which is horrible to fit into real life).

    It's just a better system & if the concern is that too many free shards go around then reduce the max payout a little to compensate. You still have to get to number 1, you still need to beat a number 1 squad so I don't see the problem.
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Highest rank of day would also remove all this payout timing changes issues also. Not to mention the stress of playing for a specific hour (Which is horrible to fit into real life).

    It's just a better system & if the concern is that too many free shards go around then reduce the max payout a little to compensate. You still have to get to number 1, you still need to beat a number 1 squad so I don't see the problem.

    There are many issues with this. Firstly, there are only 24 of any position PO a day, there are an "unlimited" number of top positions in the day, so it's a little different than just decrease the PO a little and it will all balance out.

    I see this making any issues with shard chats worse. Now instead of a 24 position based rotation, you have a rotation trying to get upwards of 30-50+ players into first. Shards will be more active, which would make shard chats more active.

    Taking a position at some point in time also takes away from the competition. You dont race to be first at some point, you race to be first at the end of the race.

    If you know there is someone you cant beat, you simply wait for someone else to beat them then take the spot from them. This would make that easier than it is now to take first, even if you cant win all the time.
    All in all, I'm not saying we couldn't have a better system, I just dont think a top rank for the day system is better.
    I agree that can create other issues but the system we have now of people taking turns to win, or simply changing payout time to the middle of the night/setting an alarm - isn't a great one either.

    There is also the huge problem of the 'fight-lock system' in which you have to fight somebody else 6.5mins before payout, hopefully leaving the opponent once you are done not enough time to snipe you in the remaining 1m30 seconds.

    This is a terrible system. it's not good gameplay & is about using 'out of game' mechanics, such as shard chat & out of combat gameplay mechanics 'lockout timers' to win. Not skill, or having a good lineup.
  • Nikoms565 wrote: »
    Shard chats are simply a way for players to work around poor game design (that makes you play at a specific time by having rewards tied to rank based on that specific time). Chat just allows players to play when they can and not have to be on at 5 minutes before payout to guarantee not being sniped.

    It also helps facilitate maximum payouts for people around "busy" payout times - since arena shards were not assigned based on "x number of players per payout times". In fact, since we can (finally) change our payout times, many shard chats actually help redistribute payout times so there is less conflict near the top, by spreading out the active payouts times.

    I am NOT defending the behavior of players who run their shard chats more like a "mafia" - join, comply or get crushed. But I would suggest two things:

    1) Shard chats can serve a greater good (better QOL for players that cooperate)
    2) It's silly for players with the same payout times NOT to try to figure out how to cooperate/work together to maximize crystals, as opposed to constantly knock each other back and forth - all that does is waste crystals in refreshing and leaves unpaid max rewards at the top during those payout times.

    Now, I also realize that not everyone who just got a new Revan, and has now decided after 3 years of ignoring shard chats and disregarding other players' payouts times, is going to warmly welcomed by their respective shard chats now. Honestly, them's the berries.

    Funny that you say you don’t like chats which operate like a „mafia“ and your last sentence/paragraph (correct me if I am wrong) tells that you are NEVER allowed to be stronger at some point in this game because you HAVE to be a whale and join the shardchat. As if it was their right.
  • The simple fact is, to get to 1st - it doesn't take skill in beating enemies - it takes collusion between enemies. This can't be the intended system. Nobody would design it like this knowing it would turn out that way.

    I refuse to believe that was how it was meant to be played. It's simply the monster they created & the devs can't think of a better solution.
  • The simple fact is, to get to 1st - it doesn't take skill in beating enemies - it takes collusion between enemies. This can't be the intended system. Nobody would design it like this knowing it would turn out that way.

    I refuse to believe that was how it was meant to be played. It's simply the monster they created & the devs can't think of a better solution.

    Correct. That’s why I asked before why CG/EA isn’t thinking about a better solution. I think it’s because they want the players to refresh for crystals. And yes, I know that’s the reason why shardchats exist.
  • I don't blame people for using shard chats mind, it's a required evil based on the rubbish system in place. It's up to CG to provide a better one mind, but due to how long it's gone on I don't think they even seem to think it's a problem sadly.
  • I don't blame people for using shard chats mind, it's a required evil based on the rubbish system in place. It's up to CG to provide a better one mind, but due to how long it's gone on I don't think they even seem to think it's a problem sadly.

    But I am not willing to „just accept our fate“. And I am sure a lot of people think the same.
  • GunnerFCm
    92 posts Member
    edited March 11
    I like to think of shard chats as an extension of the cooperative multiplayer that guilds enjoy in TB/TW. And (at least in my experience) it isn't just about climbing as high as you can. I've met some cool people and had good game-centric discussions on Discord. It's a place to discuss theory-crafting and ask for help without all the negativity that can sometimes pervade the official forums. Still, sorry that OP is having a tough time with their shard. It shouldn't be a strong-arm tactic. Everyone gets better together if we willingly help each other get better.

    (Edit for clarity: by negativity in the forums I'm not saying anything about this thread. Everyone here has so far been civil and constructive. We can disagree and still get along. Much appreciated! Carry on!)
  • mvmss
    213 posts Member
    Noxfire27 wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    No, it doesn't.

    What would you have lost, by joining the shard chat?

    It's simply a way to be gregarious, cooperate and maximize returns, to stay competitive. There are plenty of people to hit when climbing and I see nothing wrong in being civil about it.

    I had an issue in fleet, with a Russian guy always attacking me on my payout, which was the same as his. We were the only ones on the same payout and, yet, he would always attack me while climbing. He would not reply in game, nor on Discord. I reached out to his guild leader, who was quite nice, and no reply from him. One day, I got fed up and I locked him at 17, I think. We could both be #1 and #2, but since he would always attack me, I burned crystals to hell and locked him there. On the 3rd day of this back and forth nonsense, both of us missing out on hundreds of crystals, he reached out swearing at me. And he, at this moment, understood that cooperating was more benefitial to both of us and it has been this way, ever since.

    You may have learned a lesson for life right there. In the end, you are the one who did not join when invited, so now you live with the consequences of your choices.

    This is just a game, but, in real life, certain doors will only open to you once.

    Bad excuses like this that you make up for yourself because you cheat are the main problem, not a solution. Lesson for life? Are you serious? „You have to cheat because we do, otherwise we will punish you“? It’s ridiculous that you want me to play against the rules and when I decline it’s my fault and I have to „live with the consequences“? That’s a new level of being a hypocrite. Wow.

    I am not condoning them bunching up against you and I don't ever do that. If you interpreted that from what I said, sorry for the misunderatanding.

    But, YOU were invited to the shard chat, YOU denied the invitation, so now YOU will live with the consequences of your choice, until they invite you again. It doesn't get any more clear than this. Yes, it sucks they are now picking on you, but you call them cheaters and wanna play lone wolf against a pack, good luck. They are getting to the top and it seems you are not.

    Arena is like the hunger games. Cooperation is key for maximizing rewards on a competitive environment. What you call cheating I call being smart and gregarious.

    By the way, out of curiosity, how many people are there per shard?
  • GunnerFCm wrote: »
    I like to think of shard chats as an extension of the cooperative multiplayer that guilds enjoy in TB/TW. And (at least in my experience) it isn't just about climbing as high as you can. I've met some cool people and had good game-centric discussions on Discord. It's a place to discuss theory-crafting and ask for help without all the negativity that can sometimes pervade the official forums. Still, sorry that OP is having a tough time with their shard. It shouldn't be a strong-arm tactic. Everyone gets better together if we willingly help each other get better.

    You talk about Discord-channels in general as a „social-media-platform“. I am with you with this, joined a few on my own and running one for my guild. But don’t mix it with a „mafia“-like shardchat where „you have to be in otherwise we will crush you“-thing.
  • It may not be “cheating” but it’s definitely not in the spirit of the game.

    I’m sorry but the devs should change the payout mechanic to “highest rank achieved in a day” not, where you happen to land at a specific time.

    People shouldn’t have to change their payout time to 3am to be competitive.

    Hearthstone has a good system where you a rewarded based on your highest rank in a season.
  • Nauros
    2614 posts Member
    Noxfire27 wrote: »
    GunnerFCm wrote: »
    I like to think of shard chats as an extension of the cooperative multiplayer that guilds enjoy in TB/TW. And (at least in my experience) it isn't just about climbing as high as you can. I've met some cool people and had good game-centric discussions on Discord. It's a place to discuss theory-crafting and ask for help without all the negativity that can sometimes pervade the official forums. Still, sorry that OP is having a tough time with their shard. It shouldn't be a strong-arm tactic. Everyone gets better together if we willingly help each other get better.

    You talk about Discord-channels in general as a „social-media-platform“. I am with you with this, joined a few on my own and running one for my guild. But don’t mix it with a „mafia“-like shardchat where „you have to be in otherwise we will crush you“-thing.

    You can't make such general statements about all shard chats, though. It seems yours is hellbent on stomping anyone who isn't in (though declining their invitation might play a role as well), which sucks. Others, such as my fleet chat, are more relaxed, fun, and make little difference between outsiders and members with distant payout.
    Revive the stores, the game needs it.
  • mvmss wrote: »
    Noxfire27 wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    No, it doesn't.

    What would you have lost, by joining the shard chat?

    It's simply a way to be gregarious, cooperate and maximize returns, to stay competitive. There are plenty of people to hit when climbing and I see nothing wrong in being civil about it.

    I had an issue in fleet, with a Russian guy always attacking me on my payout, which was the same as his. We were the only ones on the same payout and, yet, he would always attack me while climbing. He would not reply in game, nor on Discord. I reached out to his guild leader, who was quite nice, and no reply from him. One day, I got fed up and I locked him at 17, I think. We could both be #1 and #2, but since he would always attack me, I burned crystals to hell and locked him there. On the 3rd day of this back and forth nonsense, both of us missing out on hundreds of crystals, he reached out swearing at me. And he, at this moment, understood that cooperating was more benefitial to both of us and it has been this way, ever since.

    You may have learned a lesson for life right there. In the end, you are the one who did not join when invited, so now you live with the consequences of your choices.

    This is just a game, but, in real life, certain doors will only open to you once.

    Bad excuses like this that you make up for yourself because you cheat are the main problem, not a solution. Lesson for life? Are you serious? „You have to cheat because we do, otherwise we will punish you“? It’s ridiculous that you want me to play against the rules and when I decline it’s my fault and I have to „live with the consequences“? That’s a new level of being a hypocrite. Wow.

    I am not condoning them bunching up against you and I don't ever do that. If you interpreted that from what I said, sorry for the misunderatanding.

    But, YOU were invited to the shard chat, YOU denied the invitation, so now YOU will live with the consequences of your choice, until they invite you again. It doesn't get any more clear than this. Yes, it sucks they are now picking on you, but you call them cheaters and wanna play lone wolf against a pack, good luck. They are getting to the top and it seems you are not.

    Arena is like the hunger games. Cooperation is key for maximizing rewards on a competitive environment. What you call cheating I call being smart and gregarious.

    By the way, out of curiosity, how many people are there per shard?

    I see you are already so deep into this cheatsystem that you blame the victim and defend the mafia-system. Nice. Maybe think about that.

    Heard shardsize is 20.000. but I think max. up to 5000 active players after a while
  • Kyno
    21028 posts Moderator
    The simple fact is, to get to 1st - it doesn't take skill in beating enemies - it takes collusion between enemies. This can't be the intended system. Nobody would design it like this knowing it would turn out that way.

    I refuse to believe that was how it was meant to be played. It's simply the monster they created & the devs can't think of a better solution.

    Anyone who doesnt think it takes skill to make a proper setup, have strategies in place to have the right materials, kill order, and turn order, should look at the multitude of threads that popped up about the current meta and time outs and compare that to the number of threads after his first release.

    There is some skill involved in this game.

    Also, not every shard hands out wins. Our shard doesnt swap teams so someone can win. Each shard chat is different and shouldnt all be considered to be the worst example people have heard of.
  • In general, just to clarify this, I can live next to the shard chat. If your shard chat turns out to get in touch with nice people, exchange each other, nice for you and I don’t see quite a big problem with that. Even when you „bend“ the rules with it. The problem is that you can’t change your shard and when there is a mafia-style chat in your arena and, as I do, consider it cheating, you have a problem where you shouldn’t. Live and let live. But a system where others can punish a player who plays the game as it’s intended has to be changed imho
  • mvmss
    213 posts Member
    Noxfire27 wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    Noxfire27 wrote: »
    mvmss wrote: »
    No, it doesn't.

    What would you have lost, by joining the shard chat?

    It's simply a way to be gregarious, cooperate and maximize returns, to stay competitive. There are plenty of people to hit when climbing and I see nothing wrong in being civil about it.

    I had an issue in fleet, with a Russian guy always attacking me on my payout, which was the same as his. We were the only ones on the same payout and, yet, he would always attack me while climbing. He would not reply in game, nor on Discord. I reached out to his guild leader, who was quite nice, and no reply from him. One day, I got fed up and I locked him at 17, I think. We could both be #1 and #2, but since he would always attack me, I burned crystals to hell and locked him there. On the 3rd day of this back and forth nonsense, both of us missing out on hundreds of crystals, he reached out swearing at me. And he, at this moment, understood that cooperating was more benefitial to both of us and it has been this way, ever since.

    You may have learned a lesson for life right there. In the end, you are the one who did not join when invited, so now you live with the consequences of your choices.

    This is just a game, but, in real life, certain doors will only open to you once.

    Bad excuses like this that you make up for yourself because you cheat are the main problem, not a solution. Lesson for life? Are you serious? „You have to cheat because we do, otherwise we will punish you“? It’s ridiculous that you want me to play against the rules and when I decline it’s my fault and I have to „live with the consequences“? That’s a new level of being a hypocrite. Wow.

    I am not condoning them bunching up against you and I don't ever do that. If you interpreted that from what I said, sorry for the misunderatanding.

    But, YOU were invited to the shard chat, YOU denied the invitation, so now YOU will live with the consequences of your choice, until they invite you again. It doesn't get any more clear than this. Yes, it sucks they are now picking on you, but you call them cheaters and wanna play lone wolf against a pack, good luck. They are getting to the top and it seems you are not.

    Arena is like the hunger games. Cooperation is key for maximizing rewards on a competitive environment. What you call cheating I call being smart and gregarious.

    By the way, out of curiosity, how many people are there per shard?

    I see you are already so deep into this cheatsystem that you blame the victim and defend the mafia-system. Nice. Maybe think about that.

    Heard shardsize is 20.000. but I think max. up to 5000 active players after a while

    Thanks for the info. That's quite a lot of players, tbh.

    You talk about shard chats like you've been to many of them. Well, I have only been to 2, my fleet and arena, both have very cool people from all over the world. We share strategies, recruit players, talk about other stuff other than the game. It became a little like a guild discord channel.

    What exactly would you have lost by joining the shard chat? Take a step back and rethink how things got to this point.
  • They just need to scramble shards with other shards created around the same time every once in a while, or at least with older shards. It would help break up the mafias that control some shards.
This discussion has been closed.