@obiwan1011
relax and breath, it's just the interwebs! He might be a nice guy or girl in real life
I used the "dishonorable alternate retreat button" but never in my life cheated on my gf or stole from my parents/friends.
So we can't be all that bad...right?
I know most of us aren't. But I do see someone who will not hesitate when given the opportunity.
@Aeris, is it possible, out of curiousity, if you are a judge in some country or anything related? Infound tour post exaggerated for a game, but a very thoughtful post in hiw to approach making things right based in the concept of being just.
That being said, and being practical and using your post, here's a proposal to makenthings rught here, to GC. Feel free to postmyour own:
Award: Fair Play. It gives 20 Vader shards to anyone that did not use the exploit, plus 100 crystals (symbolict) and 2000 bronzium.
Vader 7*. You Vader char gets reset to 1*.
Vader 6*. Your Vader gets reset to 4*.
Those that knew and didn't report this early on, we cannot know. And those that get the Vader reset lower, we don't judge which intent you had. You known where you fall.
And idea...(my ither idea was to force the exploters to use Jar Jar Binks as their keader doing 1 dmg per hit for a week or month :-)
Thanks for understanding and you are certainly a very sweet person. ( you are trying to be constructive; in fact, I find that many people here in this forum are very constructive and sensible). I just hope we all give the best, and hope for the best, although sometimes misunderstanding is too much for effective communication or for understanding. That is why everyone should give their best: try to be more constructive, as well as think more critically. )
What an excellent post which essentially blames on everything else but the cheaters! I am no lawyer nor can write long, fancy paragraphs as you have done, but below would be my counter arguments to some of your points:
The community should bear some of the blame for not reporting this glitch
Since when did we have the responsibility and/or obligation to police and report things? Even if this were true, do you realise it is the people who found the glitch that exploited it rather than doing what you suggested as should have been done?
Good to hear your counter arguments.
I think as citizens, we all have responsibility to police and report things in some degree and although we don't have to and will not be hold immediately accountable if we don't, we will be accountable in long term for our negligence.
But I did try to make it clear here in terms of accountability:
In the same way, all players are more or less answerable to the month long glitch: A. those who exploited glitch.(intention 1,2,3,4)
B. those who neither exploited glitch nor reported the glitch owing to negligence.(intention 5 or 6)
C. those who knew the glitch all along but refrained from reporting it until postponing indefinitely or until recently.(intention 5 or 7)
The vague policy is equally the reason for this cheating
I would like to believe most of us (try to) live a moral life without understanding every aspect of the law. I am sad to hear that only a clear set of laws would keep you in check
I beg to differ.
If we are talking about morality, we shouldn't concern it with punishment.
Since we are talking about punishment, I think we should concern about rules instead of morality as punishment is according to rules instead of morality.
The advantage that the cheaters gained from the 7* Vader is negligble and didn't impact most people
Then why did they do it? Seriously, let me say that again. Then why did they do it? Can anyone please answer this? I would also actually argue a 6/7* would give a significant advantage especially, but not limited to an early/mid game player. If the impact of a 6/7* is minimal as you claim, why do most players spend time and/or money on acquiring shards and gears? Finally, any level of impact still cannot justify the intent or act of cheating
I thought they exploited the glitch with intentions below:
1.There are those who found glitch early and exploited the glitch without second thought, without moral.
(They basically exploit any glitch they come across.)
2. There are those who exploited the glitch owing to peer pressure in competitive gaming, for protection of their own benefit lest others exploit the glitch.
(They don't want their Vaders to be left behind lest others exploit the glitch; however, it turned out that 6/7* Vader doesn't offer more winning advantage in battle than free characters do such as 6/7* Luminara, Sidious, Luke, Daka, etc., and there was no way to tell how useful a 6/7* Vader is until you acquired 6/7* Vader)
3.There are those who exploit the glitch owing to curiosity.(They are curious of how strong Vader of higher star level would be, believing that Vader shouldn't be too weak as he is one of the greatest villains.)
4. There are those who exploit the glitch owing to Darth Vader, one of the most iconic characters in Star War.
(They want to get Vader to 6/7* as to earn a permanent spot in their 6/7* team instead of having a weaker 4* Vader, who could be replaced by many other 6/7* characters.)
It is true that level of impact of advantages acquired from exploiting glitch does not justify the intent of cheating, nor should it speak for level of punishment without referrence to the different types of intents instead of "a same universal intent of cheating".
Instead of punishing the cheaters, reward those who didn't cheat
If someone commits a crime in the real world, do the rest of us get a reward for not doing that?
To answer that question: no, we don't get reward for not commiting a crime, but we get compensation by insurance company for any loss if a crime is committed to us.
In this case, if anyone think they are robbed by exploiter of ally points, they should ask for compensation from rule maker(CG), who is supposed to ensure everyone's equal benefit.
On the other hand, by offering suggestion of compensation, I wanted to mock some of those hypocrites who accuse exploiters based on the idea of unequal benefits instead of based on types of intents.
The punishment should only confine to Vader and other assets gained
So if someone robbed a bank and gets caught, does he only get confisticated of the money he stole, or would he receive other punishment, including some prison time?
Yes, he would receive other punishment because what he stole is money, which is valuable therefore has great impact. In the same way, if he goes to supermarket and steals toilet paper, he wouldn't receive severe punishment because of toilet paper being not valuable enough to have great impact to incur severe punishment.
In the same way, the level of punishment for exploiters who acquired extra Vader shards should have to do with( but not limited to ) how much impact Vader has in this game:
We are not talking about hacking the game and getting every character to 7*, which should be equivalent to the analogy of robbing a bank as you mentioned earlier; in contrast, we are talking about Vader shards, which stands for 1-3 star levels of Vader, which gives not more winning advantage than those of many other free characters such as 6/7* Luminara, Sidious, Luke, Daka, etc. and the only advantege a 6/7* Vader provides is for new players, but considering how many days of deleting/adding friends it takes to get Vader to 6/7*( assuming 10-15 shards a day, 10-15 days to get Vader to 6*, 16.6-25 days to get Vader to 7*), even new players would not have much advantage because after 10-25 days, most daily players would have already got other free characters such as Luminara, Luke, Sidious, Daka, Ventress, etc. to 4* or 5*.
Despite the sleek structure and writing, I struggle to follow and accept most of your assertions. The only one that I can concur is different level of punishment should be applied to different level of cheating. Indeed murdering someone and crossing the road during a red light should not receive equal level of punishment.
@obiwan1011
True I have these acquaintances in real life. Going a bit off topic but they're cheating on a regularly base as married guys with kids. Not my standards but they are still nice to have when around Vader cheat is unacceptable though
439-259-888 I have a bad habit of editing my typo's after posting
Maybe someone should make a poll of what should happen to the people who used the exploit and maybe the devs will do what majority voted or maybe the wont care or listen but its worth a try
Why is lowering their power a temporary change? Why not return their Vader to the 5* character it should be? Is that too difficult to implement? I don't know anything about game coding so maybe I'm wrong in thinking you can even the playing field in that way.
Or lower it to 4* for all we know they could of just went to 4*to7*... thats a another problem because devs dont know whether they went from( 4*-6* )(4*-7* )or (5*-6*) or (5*-7*)... It would be unfair if they were 4star and they got a free promote. They should ban them from using vader till most of the people get 7 *vaders or bring them back to 4*
I understand there are lots of different opinions regarding the exploit and whether or not exploiter should be punished and how hard they should be punished.
I believe all of you have your reasons for your opinions: I believe those who think they should be let go have their reasons; also I believe those who think they should be punished have their reasons.
However, I have to warn those of you who condemn others and wish ill of others, that root of wrong is at your mouth because your judgement is not true and is not based on understanding.
I just want to express my humble opinions that let us not judge with resentment but with understanding because Eternal Damantion is not because of too many evil doers but because of too many people practice wrong judgement that is not based on understanding.
Intentions and natures:
Regarding this glitch and its exploit, we are not looking at one type of nature and intention, but instead, there are many types of intentions and natures involved:
1. There are those who found glitch early and exploited the glitch without second thought, without moral.
2. There are those who exploited the glitch owing to peer pressure in competitive gaming, for protection of their own benefit lest others exploit the glitch.
3. There are those who exploit the glitch owing to curiosity.
4. There are those who exploit the glitch owing to Darth Vader, the most iconic character in Star War.
5. There are those who found the glitch but don't bother exploiting the glitch deeming the small benefit it brings.
6. There are those who neither exploited the glitch nor reported the glitch owing to negligence.
7. There are those who didn't exploit the glitch but postponed reporting the glitch indefinitely or until recently. Players' responsibility :
The Vader achievement glitch has been there since global launch, which was about one month ago, and nobody reported the glitch during that month: if someone had reported the glitch early, many people wouldn't be able to use the glitch. But nobody reported the obvious glitch for a month long time.
In order to have certain right, one has to assume responsibility accordingly; one can not demand right without practicing responsibility.
In the same way, all players are more or less answerable to the month long glitch:
A. those who exploited glitch.(intention 1,2,3,4)
B. those who neither exploited glitch nor reported the glitch owing to negligence.(intention 5 or 6)
C. those who knew the glitch all along but refrained from reporting it until postponing indefinitely or until recently.(intention 5 or 7)
Players' dilemma:
Instead of facing a simple choice of whether to exploit or report a glitch, players are facing a potential dilemma.
I. Evaluation of Illegality:
There are always an environment, a circumstance, a culture in which an instance of illegality is committed, and one can not evaluate the illegality sensibly or correctly without looking at the environment, circumstance, culture, in which instance of illegality happens. In this particular instance of glitch and its exploit, the environment is a game(as oppose to real world), where developer made the game and people play the game(as oppose to player modifying the game); circumstance is that there was a glitch made by developer, and players exploited it; culture in which this illegality happens is competitive gaming culture, where there is a competitive relationship between players.(as oppose to cooperative relationship)
II. Players' dilemma:
Thus, a dilemma happened to occur in competitive gaming culture, which is caused by unclear policy from rule maker(CG): if someone had reported the glitch early, there could be a chance where they lose benefit to those earlier exploiter who came before them, where developer would have simply fixed the glitch without taking any action to remove the benefit acquired illegally by earlier exploiter, as to spare the trouble, as it were then only a smaller number of people who exploited the glitch than that of now.
As time goes by and the glitch is not hard to come across, the number of people who exploited the glitch started to grow owing to the aforementioned dilemma; thus the smaller number of people gradually become larger and larger number of people, until finally the dilemma itself no longer exists as the number of people who exploited the glitch are so large that developer must take action to remove all benefit acquired illegally where nobody could lose benefit to others.
Conclusion:
Considerations:
In terms of just judgement, there are different natures and intentions with which players exploited the glitch, and they are punishable at different levels instead of at the same level: for example, aforementioned intention 1 and intention 2 are different; intention 2 and intention 3 are different too, and intention 4 is one of the most common intentions here.
But in practice, we can not easily distinguish who has which intention or intentions, thus it is difficult to judge.
My opinions on discretion:
However, I believe intention 1 are mostly among those who have 7* Vader; intention 2, intention 3, intention 4, are mostly among those who have 5* or 6* Vader; intention 5,6,7 are mostly among B. those who neither exploited glitch nor reported the glitch owing to negligence. and C.those who knew the glitch all along but refrained from reporting it until postponing indefinitely or until recently.
For that reason, I believe there should be a significant difference between punishments of those who had 7* Vader since Decemeber 2015 and those who had 5* or 6* Vader since January 2016.
My opinions on punishment:
I. Severity:
Exploiters in current case should Not be punished for full responsibity for two reasons: a) there is major dilemma caused by unclear policy regarding exploit from rule maker(CG), which is the main cause for the month long unreported glitch; b) some players fail to observe and report the obvious glitch in a month long time owing to negligence, while others intentionally postpone reporting the glitch indefinitely or until recently.
II. Range:
As exploition of glitch are limited to star level of Vader, punishment should only be limited to star level of Vader.
If so, only 7* Vader(intention 1) may be reduced beyond the amount of extra shards they acquired from glitch; in contrast, 5* and 6* Vader( intention 2,3,4) should Not be reduced beyond the amount of extra shards they acquired from glitch.
(Those who offer suggestions of taking away all crystals or taking away any other characters or their star levels are insidiously evil:
1. I don't think it is convincing that 7* Vader affect you personally in any way: neither galatic war nor arena, as 7* Vader is not much a threat as 7* leia, 7*Qui gon jin, or even 6* lando; further more, if you encounter 7* Vader, it means your team power level is similar to power level of the 7* Vader team, then there is little reason for you to lose to that team and complain it is because of 7* Vader. Personally I never lose to 7* Vader and I am not pay to win player.
2. If you think that they get a lot of bronze credit enough to possibly get 4* character, then I suggest that you are to be compensated with bronze credit according to how much they get from extra Vader achievements, which is more fair than to take that 4* character from them or take away star level of their other characters according to your sheer assumption.)
III. Compensation:
I think it is fit that those who did not exploit the glitch are to be compensated for their "integrity".
Last words:
In conclusion, this instance of exploition of glitch itself is not caused by players alone, but also by unclear policy regarding exploit from the rule maker(CG). However, this instance did show numerous intentions, some of which are more punishable than others, some of which are less punishable than others.
Let me make this completely clear with everyone, we ALL know that if we all found the glitch like those who did, we would not hesitate to get our Vader to 6 or 7*'s. So everyone relax and just be happy those who got Vader to 6 or 7 are doing well.
So based on your assertion, if you found a "glitch" to steal money from your friend's bank account without getting caught, you would do it. If you found a way to cheat on your girlfriend/wife without getting caught, you would do it.
Gee, I feel terribly sorry for your friends and people around you as the only thing that is stopping you from doing such terrible things are 1) you haven't found that glitch yet, and 2) the fear of getting caught. Otherwise, you "would not hesitate to" take advantage to satisfy yourself.
Oh, I am sure you are going to say cheating (or "exploiting a glitch." Whatever) in a game vs. in real life are two different things. Maybe?, but I can certainly see where the state of your mind is at. I am very glad I don't know you in real life.
Don't translate. When you kill a char in the game, does it mean tou are likely to grab a laser an kill anyone? Not at all. So stop the analogy train. better just say teach them by removing their gains in excess.
I've been playing since the full launch, yet I'm not even aware what the Vader exploit was (I have only been on this forum for a month, though, and have never looked for it)
How intentional did the players have to be to use the exploit? Is it possible that some were receiving shards they shouldn't have without knowing they were exploiting the system? If this is possible then I would think that they should have their Vader's reset to 4* and move on. I can't really imagine a way to quantify what benefit they've received by having a 6* or 7* Vader vs having a 4* or 5*, so not sure how that would be enforced - which is why I'd think a Vader reset would be sufficient in this case.
If there was no way for them to do the exploit, except for knowingly exploiting something they should have known was against the rules of the game, then perhaps more drastic measures. Banning Vader from their account all together, or resetting him to 1* and / or perhaps some sort of crystal penalty.
I've been playing since the full launch, yet I'm not even aware what the Vader exploit was (I have only been on this forum for a month, though, and have never looked for it)
How intentional did the players have to be to use the exploit? Is it possible that some were receiving shards they shouldn't have without knowing they were exploiting the system? If this is possible then I would think that they should have their Vader's reset to 4* and move on. I can't really imagine a way to quantify what benefit they've received by having a 6* or 7* Vader vs having a 4* or 5*, so not sure how that would be enforced - which is why I'd think a Vader reset would be sufficient in this case.
If there was no way for them to do the exploit, except for knowingly exploiting something they should have known was against the rules of the game, then perhaps more drastic measures. Banning Vader from their account all together, or resetting him to 1* and / or perhaps some sort of crystal penalty.
Im pretty sure for the exploit it was something like deleting allys and adding more. When you did that you got a few vador shards so to be able to get 100 shards for 7* and i think 80?shards for 6*.... they had to do it alot and to do it that many times they were definitely aware of what they did...
Im pretty sure for the exploit it was something like deleting allys and adding more. When you did that you got a few vador shards so to be able to get 100 shards for 7* and i think 80?shards for 6*.... they had to do it alot and to do it that many times they were definitely aware of what they did...
Hm. I had some allies come and go - and there were times that I deleted ones that weren't progressing and were still low level after a week or so. I just unlocked Vader a week and a half ago, though, so I'm pretty sure I didn't receive any extra shards or anything :-P
Its really just sad because i spent alot of time getting mine to 4* and they took advantage and got it 5* 6* and 7* in a matter of hours while it took me atleast a month or two to get 4*..... i really hope they do somthing about it and not let them stay at 5* vader for cheating
Its really just sad because i spent alot of time getting mine to 4* and they took advantage and got it 5* 6* and 7* in a matter oh hurs while it took me atleast a month or two to get 4*..... i really hope they do somthing about it and not let them stay at 5* vader for cheating
I think based on a few things they said at the beginning of the post that they are planning some other penalties for it. I would think that resetting the Vader to 4* would at least be one of them.
Good to hear your counter arguments.
I think as citizens, we all have responsibility to police and report things in some degree and although we don't have to and will not be hold immediately accountable if we don't, we will be accountable in long term for our negligence.
Based on your over-arching rationale that there is no accountability or ways to punish offenders unless there is a clear set of rules, I don't see how the "I think as citizen, we all have responsibility to police and report things" statement stands. You are contradicting what you said below.
I beg to differ.
If we are talking about morality, we shouldn't concern it with punishment.
Since we are talking about punishment, I think we should concern about rules instead of morality as punishment is according to rules instead of morality.
I think the current rule on what is a bannable act is clear enough, but even a lack of clear rules does not limit from giving out punishment. Any new cases which cannot be judged by the current set of rules will take references from past verdicts on similar offenses.
I thought they exploited the glitch with intentions below:
It is true that level of impact of advantages acquired from exploiting glitch does not justify the intent of cheating, nor should it speak for level of punishment without referrence to the different types of intents instead of "a same universal intent of cheating".
I think we agreed that different severity on the intent on cheating requires different level of punishment. Case closed.
To answer that question: no, we don't get reward for not commiting a crime, but we get compensation by insurance company for any loss if a crime is committed to us.
In this case, if anyone think they are robbed by exploiter of ally points, they should ask for compensation from rule maker(CG), who is supposed to ensure everyone's equal benefit.
On the other hand, by offering suggestion of compensation, I wanted to mock some of those hypocrites who accuse exploiters based on the idea of unequal benefits instead of based on types of intents.
CG is not an insurance company that needs to provide compensation for any crime committed to us. If CG needs to compensate as the rule maker to ensure everyone's equal benefit, then I guess the government or the constitutional court would have to reward us for not committing a crime - which obviously is quite silly.
Yes, he would receive other punishment because what he stole is money, which is valuable therefore has great impact. In the same way, if he goes to supermarket and steals toilet paper, he wouldn't receive severe punishment because of toilet paper being not valuable enough to have great impact to incur severe punishment.
In the same way, the level of punishment for exploiters who acquired extra Vader shards should have to do with( but not limited to ) how much impact Vader has in this game:
We are not talking about hacking the game and getting every character to 7*, which should be equivalent to the analogy of robbing a bank as you mentioned earlier; in contrast, we are talking about Vader shards, which stands for 1-3 star levels of Vader, which gives not more winning advantage than those of many other free characters such as 6/7* Luminara, Sidious, Luke, Daka, etc. and the only advantege a 6/7* Vader provides is for new players, but considering how many days of deleting/adding friends it takes to get Vader to 6/7*( assuming 10-15 shards a day, 10-15 days to get Vader to 6*, 16.6-25 days to get Vader to 7*), even new players would not have much advantage because after 10-25 days, most daily players would have already got other free characters such as Luminara, Luke, Sidious, Daka, Ventress, etc. to 4* or 5*.
Not true. So are you suggesting a murderer is open to more punishment if he killed a more influential person vs. an average person? Impact is secondary to the intent or act of crime.
Furthermore, the offenders obtained an asset which is not obtainable in the current boundary as CG has stated a 5* Vader is the max that anyone can achieve. Someone has also made a post about how long it would take to obtain just 20 Vader shards. Circumventing all that grind to obtain a non-obtainable hero sounds like a pretty bad offense to me as you have cheated the system and the very business model that this game is based on (pay to avoid grinding and gain exclusive characters)
Finally, how would a player with a 7* hero not have advantage over most daily players who would have "other free characters... (only) to 4* or 5*?" I struggle to follow your logic.
it would be nice if we see some feedback from ea or cg about our comments thus far, i myself truly hope justice prevails, and they get punished in a proper and fair way, at least lose their vader, or it has to be at 4* and maybe remove some of their stolen toons from bronze packs they got, not to mention all the credits and other items/resources they got from cheating.
Don't translate. When you kill a char in the game, does it mean tou are likely to grab a laser an kill anyone? Not at all. So stop the analogy train. better just say teach them by removing their gains in excess.
1. I know. As some people try hard to assert, it's just a game right? They say it's not real and not a big deal. I guess that's why some people exhibit and justify wrong behaviours such as cheating that they wouldn't/couldn't do it in the real life
2. Of course most people wouldn't do it. But that's not the point. He is claiming that anyone (including himself) would cheat if he/she knew a way to do so
it would be nice if we see some feedback from ea or cg about our comments thus far, i myself truly hope justice prevails, and they get punished in a proper and fair way, at least lose their vader, or it has to be at 4* and maybe remove some of their stolen toons from bronze packs they got, not to mention all the credits and other items/resources they got from cheating.
They repeated one achievement repeatedly until they received enough shards for 7* Vader. They also got 5k in gems and several ally points.......
^^ Someone else said thats above ^^If thats true everyone who didnt cheat or use the exploit should get some crystals and ally points to compensate us and i agree they should get there vader brought back to 4*
They repeated one achievement repeatedly until they received enough shards for 7* Vader. They also got 5k in gems and several ally points.......
If that is accurate it would make sense to simply penalize them that amount then - reset their Vaders to 4* and penalize them whatever amount of gems / ally points they received. Obviously they may not have that many but it would simply put them into negative amounts. They'd have to earn back that amount before they could spend any.
Not that I would mind receiving gems / points otherwise as a player who didn't do the exploit, but I don't think us honest players are entitled to anything.
Finally, how would a player with a 7* hero not have advantage over most daily players who would have "other free characters... (only) to 4* or 5*?" I struggle to follow your logic.
Sorry for being so clumsy that I skipped some process between cause and effect, but let me add it back to my former assertion that 6/7* is not much advantage for a 4/5* team.
A. The advantage I mentioned earlier is based on exploiting of the glitch from day one instead of from one week or two weeks after joining the game, in which case they would have their team about 6* by the time they acquired 6/7* Vader, which is very close to star level of Vader they finally acquired.
On the other hand, when exploiting glitch from day one, by the time they acquired 6* Vader, their team would be 4*; similarly, by the time they acquired 7* Vader, their team would be 5*. As a result, there is only 2 stars difference.
B. Even then, in galatic war, they don't have advantage because galatic war assigns opponents based on team power: if they have higher team power owing to a 6/7* Vader, they would be assigned opponents with same amount of total power; if one encounters Vader in galatic war, one should have same amount of power yet Vader is easy to defeat when AI controls him.
C. On the other hand, in arena, their rewards wouldn't change significantly:
1. if their ranks are moving between top 5 and top 500,
a) they can't affect you as to kick you out of top 500 since only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.
b) their rewards between top 5 and top 500 are not significantly different.( for them, in average 100/800 token, potential +12.5% token gained, potential +90 crystal gained; for you, they don't affect your rank prize since only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.)
2.if their ranks are moving below top 500,
a)they can't affect you if your ranks are top 500.
b) if your ranks are also below top 500, they won't be able to stop you from moving up to top 500 because only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.
3. if their ranks are top 5, they only affect you if you are about top 20 or so instead of top 200 or so because 6/7* Vader is not many comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank; nevertheless, 6/7* Vader is not hard to defeat when he is controlled by AI, meaning you will have no big problem defeating the team which has 6/7* anyway as to snip them for arena reward.
D. Dark side mission:
Usefulness of 6/7* Vader is negligible in DS missions without a complete 6/7* team since accomplishing level 5 and above hard DS missions requires a complete 6/7* team.
even new players would not have much advantage because after 10-25 days, most daily players would have already got other free characters such as Luminara, Luke, Sidious, Daka, Ventress, etc. to 4* or 5*
Completely wrong^^ Were not comparing vader to other toons... You have to compare 4*vader to 6*-7* vader. If you have a 4 star vader and you vsing a 6 or 7* vader they have the advantage.You cant compare vader to different toons because they are achieved very differently.
What would you rather have 4* - 5* vader or 6*-7* vader?
You would choose 6 or 7 because you will be stronger and you will have an advantage over the 4 and 5 one..
I've been playing since the full launch, yet I'm not even aware what the Vader exploit was (I have only been on this forum for a month, though, and have never looked for it)
How intentional did the players have to be to use the exploit? Is it possible that some were receiving shards they shouldn't have without knowing they were exploiting the system? If this is possible then I would think that they should have their Vader's reset to 4* and move on. I can't really imagine a way to quantify what benefit they've received by having a 6* or 7* Vader vs having a 4* or 5*, so not sure how that would be enforced - which is why I'd think a Vader reset would be sufficient in this case.
If there was no way for them to do the exploit, except for knowingly exploiting something they should have known was against the rules of the game, then perhaps more drastic measures. Banning Vader from their account all together, or resetting him to 1* and / or perhaps some sort of crystal penalty.
I ran into this without knowing and have a 4* level 15 vader. It flagged me as suspicious. No help from ea or cg on the fault either.
I wonder though, with the recent update, most likely new achievements were added, how many extra shards could those represent? I doubt enough to get an extra star. Makes me wonder how many more extra content we'll need to get Vader to a full 7* and what would happen afterwards.
When there are enough achievements to 7 star Vader, would achievement rewards afterwards be for another character? Please if so, just don't make it Yoda in any case, lol. That'd mean A LOT of time to wait for him and even more unlock him.
Any update on this? CG should have certainly reached a conclusion by now given it has been two weeks since Jesse posted this.
Due to the recent level increase, GW change and Poe/FOTP, this has silently slipped away from people's attention...
Im wondering the same thing they had plenty of time to make a decision yet they haven't made any announcement about it and even worst is they almost tried to hide this thread by moving it from announcement
The list of sticky threads was becoming too long anyway, and I suppose they didn't have anything more to announce. I too am wondering what will happen though. I suppose we'll learn in time.
Replies
I know most of us aren't. But I do see someone who will not hesitate when given the opportunity.
Thanks for understanding and you are certainly a very sweet person. ( you are trying to be constructive; in fact, I find that many people here in this forum are very constructive and sensible). I just hope we all give the best, and hope for the best, although sometimes misunderstanding is too much for effective communication or for understanding. That is why everyone should give their best: try to be more constructive, as well as think more critically. )
Good to hear your counter arguments.
I think as citizens, we all have responsibility to police and report things in some degree and although we don't have to and will not be hold immediately accountable if we don't, we will be accountable in long term for our negligence.
But I did try to make it clear here in terms of accountability:
In the same way, all players are more or less answerable to the month long glitch:
A. those who exploited glitch.(intention 1,2,3,4)
B. those who neither exploited glitch nor reported the glitch owing to negligence.(intention 5 or 6)
C. those who knew the glitch all along but refrained from reporting it until postponing indefinitely or until recently.(intention 5 or 7)
I beg to differ.
If we are talking about morality, we shouldn't concern it with punishment.
Since we are talking about punishment, I think we should concern about rules instead of morality as punishment is according to rules instead of morality.
I thought they exploited the glitch with intentions below:
1.There are those who found glitch early and exploited the glitch without second thought, without moral.
(They basically exploit any glitch they come across.)
2. There are those who exploited the glitch owing to peer pressure in competitive gaming, for protection of their own benefit lest others exploit the glitch.
(They don't want their Vaders to be left behind lest others exploit the glitch; however, it turned out that 6/7* Vader doesn't offer more winning advantage in battle than free characters do such as 6/7* Luminara, Sidious, Luke, Daka, etc., and there was no way to tell how useful a 6/7* Vader is until you acquired 6/7* Vader)
3.There are those who exploit the glitch owing to curiosity.(They are curious of how strong Vader of higher star level would be, believing that Vader shouldn't be too weak as he is one of the greatest villains.)
4. There are those who exploit the glitch owing to Darth Vader, one of the most iconic characters in Star War.
(They want to get Vader to 6/7* as to earn a permanent spot in their 6/7* team instead of having a weaker 4* Vader, who could be replaced by many other 6/7* characters.)
It is true that level of impact of advantages acquired from exploiting glitch does not justify the intent of cheating, nor should it speak for level of punishment without referrence to the different types of intents instead of "a same universal intent of cheating".
To answer that question: no, we don't get reward for not commiting a crime, but we get compensation by insurance company for any loss if a crime is committed to us.
In this case, if anyone think they are robbed by exploiter of ally points, they should ask for compensation from rule maker(CG), who is supposed to ensure everyone's equal benefit.
On the other hand, by offering suggestion of compensation, I wanted to mock some of those hypocrites who accuse exploiters based on the idea of unequal benefits instead of based on types of intents.
Yes, he would receive other punishment because what he stole is money, which is valuable therefore has great impact. In the same way, if he goes to supermarket and steals toilet paper, he wouldn't receive severe punishment because of toilet paper being not valuable enough to have great impact to incur severe punishment.
In the same way, the level of punishment for exploiters who acquired extra Vader shards should have to do with( but not limited to ) how much impact Vader has in this game:
We are not talking about hacking the game and getting every character to 7*, which should be equivalent to the analogy of robbing a bank as you mentioned earlier; in contrast, we are talking about Vader shards, which stands for 1-3 star levels of Vader, which gives not more winning advantage than those of many other free characters such as 6/7* Luminara, Sidious, Luke, Daka, etc. and the only advantege a 6/7* Vader provides is for new players, but considering how many days of deleting/adding friends it takes to get Vader to 6/7*( assuming 10-15 shards a day, 10-15 days to get Vader to 6*, 16.6-25 days to get Vader to 7*), even new players would not have much advantage because after 10-25 days, most daily players would have already got other free characters such as Luminara, Luke, Sidious, Daka, Ventress, etc. to 4* or 5*.
win what exactly.. Status? Women? Free groceries at your local supermarket?
True I have these acquaintances in real life. Going a bit off topic but they're cheating on a regularly base as married guys with kids. Not my standards but they are still nice to have when around
Or lower it to 4* for all we know they could of just went to 4*to7*... thats a another problem because devs dont know whether they went from( 4*-6* )(4*-7* )or (5*-6*) or (5*-7*)... It would be unfair if they were 4star and they got a free promote. They should ban them from using vader till most of the people get 7 *vaders or bring them back to 4*
Don't translate. When you kill a char in the game, does it mean tou are likely to grab a laser an kill anyone? Not at all. So stop the analogy train. better just say teach them by removing their gains in excess.
How intentional did the players have to be to use the exploit? Is it possible that some were receiving shards they shouldn't have without knowing they were exploiting the system? If this is possible then I would think that they should have their Vader's reset to 4* and move on. I can't really imagine a way to quantify what benefit they've received by having a 6* or 7* Vader vs having a 4* or 5*, so not sure how that would be enforced - which is why I'd think a Vader reset would be sufficient in this case.
If there was no way for them to do the exploit, except for knowingly exploiting something they should have known was against the rules of the game, then perhaps more drastic measures. Banning Vader from their account all together, or resetting him to 1* and / or perhaps some sort of crystal penalty.
Im pretty sure for the exploit it was something like deleting allys and adding more. When you did that you got a few vador shards so to be able to get 100 shards for 7* and i think 80?shards for 6*.... they had to do it alot and to do it that many times they were definitely aware of what they did...
Hm. I had some allies come and go - and there were times that I deleted ones that weren't progressing and were still low level after a week or so. I just unlocked Vader a week and a half ago, though, so I'm pretty sure I didn't receive any extra shards or anything :-P
I think based on a few things they said at the beginning of the post that they are planning some other penalties for it. I would think that resetting the Vader to 4* would at least be one of them.
Based on your over-arching rationale that there is no accountability or ways to punish offenders unless there is a clear set of rules, I don't see how the "I think as citizen, we all have responsibility to police and report things" statement stands. You are contradicting what you said below.
I think the current rule on what is a bannable act is clear enough, but even a lack of clear rules does not limit from giving out punishment. Any new cases which cannot be judged by the current set of rules will take references from past verdicts on similar offenses.
I think we agreed that different severity on the intent on cheating requires different level of punishment. Case closed.
CG is not an insurance company that needs to provide compensation for any crime committed to us. If CG needs to compensate as the rule maker to ensure everyone's equal benefit, then I guess the government or the constitutional court would have to reward us for not committing a crime - which obviously is quite silly.
Not true. So are you suggesting a murderer is open to more punishment if he killed a more influential person vs. an average person? Impact is secondary to the intent or act of crime.
Furthermore, the offenders obtained an asset which is not obtainable in the current boundary as CG has stated a 5* Vader is the max that anyone can achieve. Someone has also made a post about how long it would take to obtain just 20 Vader shards. Circumventing all that grind to obtain a non-obtainable hero sounds like a pretty bad offense to me as you have cheated the system and the very business model that this game is based on (pay to avoid grinding and gain exclusive characters)
Finally, how would a player with a 7* hero not have advantage over most daily players who would have "other free characters... (only) to 4* or 5*?" I struggle to follow your logic.
1. I know. As some people try hard to assert, it's just a game right? They say it's not real and not a big deal. I guess that's why some people exhibit and justify wrong behaviours such as cheating that they wouldn't/couldn't do it in the real life
2. Of course most people wouldn't do it. But that's not the point. He is claiming that anyone (including himself) would cheat if he/she knew a way to do so
They repeated one achievement repeatedly until they received enough shards for 7* Vader. They also got 5k in gems and several ally points.......
^^ Someone else said thats above ^^If thats true everyone who didnt cheat or use the exploit should get some crystals and ally points to compensate us and i agree they should get there vader brought back to 4*
If that is accurate it would make sense to simply penalize them that amount then - reset their Vaders to 4* and penalize them whatever amount of gems / ally points they received. Obviously they may not have that many but it would simply put them into negative amounts. They'd have to earn back that amount before they could spend any.
Not that I would mind receiving gems / points otherwise as a player who didn't do the exploit, but I don't think us honest players are entitled to anything.
A. The advantage I mentioned earlier is based on exploiting of the glitch from day one instead of from one week or two weeks after joining the game, in which case they would have their team about 6* by the time they acquired 6/7* Vader, which is very close to star level of Vader they finally acquired.
On the other hand, when exploiting glitch from day one, by the time they acquired 6* Vader, their team would be 4*; similarly, by the time they acquired 7* Vader, their team would be 5*. As a result, there is only 2 stars difference.
B. Even then, in galatic war, they don't have advantage because galatic war assigns opponents based on team power: if they have higher team power owing to a 6/7* Vader, they would be assigned opponents with same amount of total power; if one encounters Vader in galatic war, one should have same amount of power yet Vader is easy to defeat when AI controls him.
C. On the other hand, in arena, their rewards wouldn't change significantly:
1. if their ranks are moving between top 5 and top 500,
a) they can't affect you as to kick you out of top 500 since only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.
b) their rewards between top 5 and top 500 are not significantly different.( for them, in average 100/800 token, potential +12.5% token gained, potential +90 crystal gained; for you, they don't affect your rank prize since only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.)
2.if their ranks are moving below top 500,
a)they can't affect you if your ranks are top 500.
b) if your ranks are also below top 500, they won't be able to stop you from moving up to top 500 because only a minority of players have 6/7* Vader comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank.
3. if their ranks are top 5, they only affect you if you are about top 20 or so instead of top 200 or so because 6/7* Vader is not many comparing to the broad expanse of individual ranks in each arena prize-rank; nevertheless, 6/7* Vader is not hard to defeat when he is controlled by AI, meaning you will have no big problem defeating the team which has 6/7* anyway as to snip them for arena reward.
D. Dark side mission:
Usefulness of 6/7* Vader is negligible in DS missions without a complete 6/7* team since accomplishing level 5 and above hard DS missions requires a complete 6/7* team.
Completely wrong^^ Were not comparing vader to other toons... You have to compare 4*vader to 6*-7* vader. If you have a 4 star vader and you vsing a 6 or 7* vader they have the advantage.You cant compare vader to different toons because they are achieved very differently.
What would you rather have 4* - 5* vader or 6*-7* vader?
You would choose 6 or 7 because you will be stronger and you will have an advantage over the 4 and 5 one..
What if, while we argue EA's action to be too slight; they've actually found and violently murdered each exploiter IRL.
That would be HILARIOUS.
I ran into this without knowing and have a 4* level 15 vader. It flagged me as suspicious. No help from ea or cg on the fault either.
Due to the recent level increase, GW change and Poe/FOTP, this has silently slipped away from people's attention...
When there are enough achievements to 7 star Vader, would achievement rewards afterwards be for another character? Please if so, just don't make it Yoda in any case, lol. That'd mean A LOT of time to wait for him and even more unlock him.
Im wondering the same thing they had plenty of time to make a decision yet they haven't made any announcement about it and even worst is they almost tried to hide this thread by moving it from announcement