@V1p3rdyn4sty I'm glad you think that Ti are the only ones who talk strategy...... I also was talking about this about 20 minutes after they released the AAT raid info that had the phase specifics.... but keep thinking you are better than everyone else if it helps you sleep at night.
@V1p3rdyn4sty I'm glad you think that Ti are the only ones who talk strategy...... I also was talking about this about 20 minutes after they released the AAT raid info that had the phase specifics.... but keep thinking you are better than everyone else if it helps you sleep at night.
You and Benacrow must bunk together. You know you didn't come up with it. You know where you got it.
@Josh_K@Maraxus@oofalong None of you think you will be able to push it into the 40K range with mods?
Not on a consistent basis at the current gear levels. While TFP has great armor pen (128) average armor is above this. Still, Palp has the lowest armor in the game at 133 so let's just assume its completely negated and you get the best possible roll in damage range (ie 1.05% of the ability's damage multiplier). You are looking at 35,521 before mods. Thus, you'd need to increase the offense by almost 13% or 339. You'll get 5.88% from the square so almost halfway there. This leaves you needing 181 offensive points from secondary stats, which is definitely possible, but again I suspect you'll go for higher crit chance secondary stats.In any event, yes its theoretically possible, but unlikely to routinely see this. (Noteworthy the defense down buff won't help in this case as we are completely negating defense already, but the offense up buff would.)
@Maraxus on a side note is there a reason no one doing Chirpatine is running echo? seems like he would be a nice dmg boost seeing as he has a 30% chance to assist on palps basic.... and it wont cause any extra tm gain or counters.....
Echos assist still causes 5% tm gain on a low damage ability. You are better off stacking an extra tank here I believe.
@Josh_K but the 5% will be wasted TM gain as B2 gains 25% per counter so Echo would have to assist him 5 times before he countered 4 times as every 4 counters fills his TM anyway.... Do you get were I'm going with this? (just don't want to explain it if you understand were I'm comming from)
but the 5% will be wasted TM gain as B2 gains 25% per counter so Echo would have to assist him 5 times before he countered 4 times as every 4 counters fills his TM anyway.... Do you get were I'm going with this?
Doesn't he gain 5% from each attack? So he'd be gaining 10% per attack, and you'd be increasing the likelihood of a counter which further increases TM.
In any event, you are talking about trading survivability (an extra tank) vs. a 30% chance for an extra attack that does ~20% of the damage of Palp's attack or a net 6% increase in damage. Without doing the math it seems like an extra 10+ turns of Palp that the extra tank provides would be better.
@ExpandPerfection haha thanks for the mention. This strat will be second rate as soon as Tie Fighter Pilot becomes farmable. EP (L) , TFP,SThan and any 2 tanks will blow this away. TFP can get set up with 90% TM per turn on the first turn and will be hitting way way harder than EP does. Even if the B2 counters TFP he will have evasion up so it wont matter. Ideally you get SThan to taunt before TFP goes than TFP will gain 100% tm every turn from hans TM gain when hit while taunting.
Funniest post I've ever read on any forum ever. This was mid October information in ti. Everyone stepping up to claim it is hilarious.
So I thought I'd share the details of this strategy to land some high damage numbers in arguably the most difficult phase of the AAT raid, p3. Credit to @Maraxus and Trillizo Y Uno for the initial brainstorm on this amazing strat.
The line up is Chirpa (L) EP and 3 tanks. I recommend ST Han, RG and SF. SF can easily be replaced by any other tank for those that don't have him.
Chirpa Lead allows EP 10% TM every time he uses his basic. EP also gains 15% TM per Shocked enemy each time he uses his basic. EP needs to shock all the adds to gain 100% TM per basic hit. At this point, no one else gains turn meter naturally. TM still can be generated by unique abilities:
The boss B2 will gain 5% TM per hit and has a 35% chance to counter, gaining 25% TM when he does so. This prevents truly unlimited turn meter, which will trivialize the phase.
RG will also gain TM when anyone in your team gets hit.
If ST Han is taunting and alive, he will also grant TM to your team.
Ideally, ST Han should have a lot of speed to move before the droids, who move at 232 speed. This gives you a big advantage as EP can shock 2 droids before the enemy even moves (Chirpa RNG is required to call EP on assist). If your ST Han cannot move that fast, this is not a deal breaker, but your ultimate damage will be slightly lower.
General Strategy
At the start of the encounter St Han should taunt and ideally grant enough TM to EP and Chirpa.
EP should start shocking the adds one by one.
Use Chirpa's assist, best case it should call EP for a 2nd shock.
Use RG to stun the adds, especially the one with the green triangle.
Do not use Chirpa's retribution. This will cause unwanted hits on the boss raising his TM and can also grant Chirpa TM (this is undesired).
While the adds still have hp left, unload the off-hits onto them to minimise the B2 counters. DO NOT KILL ANY OF THE ADDS.
When ST Han's protection is depleted, get SF to taunt (he will still gain TM from ST Han getting hits). If you go too early, SF could potentially have his taunt fall off near the end of the encounter, since he also gains 10% TM from counters. If you go too late, SF will not get a chance to taunt once TM is frozen.
Once all adds are shocked, spam EP's basic on the boss.
Do not kill any adds.
Please see the below video for a sample run. Note the RNG wasn't the greatest here and I also apologize for the choppy animations. Had to run this on power save during a live zerg raid.
(Heavily edited and scrubbed by people for those that have lurked here for months--like me--you understand )
I have asked the guys over at mighty chlorians and the strategy was originally envisioned by @taramel
It's nice your guys also thought of it and shared it second. Once @Taramel and his crew had shared it.
It's possible this was thought about and talked elsewhere, but yes, we have it starting to go public in TI Oct 24, and guarded quietly before then. Besides the time stamps we have of it in chat, I think our 3 guilds having it on farm early on is proof enough
@Maraxus on a side note is there a reason no one doing Chirpatine is running echo? seems like he would be a nice dmg boost seeing as he has a 30% chance to assist on palps basic.... and it wont cause any extra tm gain or counters.....
Echos assist still causes 5% tm gain on a low damage ability. You are better off stacking an extra tank here I believe.
@Josh_K but the 5% will be wasted TM gain as B2 gains 25% per counter so Echo would have to assist him 5 times before he countered 4 times as every 4 counters fills his TM anyway.... Do you get were I'm going with this? (just don't want to explain it if you understand were I'm comming from)
Yeah I see your point.
An EP basic will grant B2 5% TM and has a 35% chance for him to gain 25% TM. So average 5 % + 8.75% = 13.75% TM per basic.
An echo assist will grant B2 5% TM and has a 0% chance for him to gain 25% TM. Echo will assist EP 30% of the time. So for each EP hit with echo in the team, the average TM gain is now, 13.75% + 1.5 % = 15.25% TM, an increase of roughly just over 10%. Echo on average will do about 3.5k damage per assist (216% CD, 50% CC), at 30% roughly add 1k to EP's average damage (EP's average damage is about 10k when maxed).
So at a very coarse level, the damage you are doing now per TM% gain of the boss is roughly on par, with and without Echo. Now if you factor in the opportunity cost of a full tank's worth of hp to extend the fight as long as possible, triple tank should win by a considerable margin.
There are 2 main points to maximizing this strategy:
Maximise damage dealt per %TM gain of B2. This is purely related to EP's stats/gear/mods.
Maximise effective hp of tanks to soak damage and keep the fight going. Increasing gear/stats/mods of tanks will help this one.
Of course, RNG also plays a big part here. The initial set up also matters quite significantly.
Just a toss up but anyone thought of using dathcha as lead for that team, especially if you don't have Chirpa yet? I know Teebo is a somewhat replacement for Chirps but the 80% chance of tm removal when EP attacks B2 seems highly effective.
Just a toss up but anyone thought of using dathcha as lead for that team, especially if you don't have Chirpa yet? I know Teebo is a somewhat replacement for Chirps but the 80% chance of tm removal when EP attacks B2 seems highly effective.
Yeah I've tried this one. The problem here is that background cannon. EP usually gets killed much earlier as soon as it goes off. Between that and the bosses AOEs. Its a pretty good 2nd option though.
Plus, 90% of the tank damage gets taken from counters. Lowering B2's TM doesn't affect the counter rate.
P.S. Its 80% chance of defense down and 25% chance of TMR.
Oh I read that wrong thought it said 80% chance to remove 25%.
I guess I'll try that next raid because I don't have chirpa to seven stars yet. I've been using teebo for a couple weeks with moderate success but I think my biggest problem is my tanks. I only have two tanks viable, need sun fac but can't squeeze that one out of my FTP roster.
Also, shout out to our boy @benacrow for the hook ups we give him out of TI chat
Aww you guys are thinking of me
lol I almost wish I was in your guys chat but can't say I've had the privilege.
You ripped it. You posted it as if it was your strategy. We all got a good laugh out of it.
If you'd like to think so, then sure. I guess it's not possible for other guilds to come up with a good strategy now is it.
I really don't care who you think the credit belongs to, so if you guys want it, then sure. What matters to me is showing the best strategies that my guild found for the AAT to the community so that everyone can beat it.
Also, shout out to our boy @benacrow for the hook ups we give him out of TI chat
Aww you guys are thinking of me
lol I almost wish I was in your guys chat but can't say I've had the privilege.
You ripped it. You posted it as if it was your strategy. We all got a good laugh out of it.
How was it ripped? It wasn't posted anywhere.
It's was posted in a Team Instinct chat. The 'Cantina'. This is the closest chat we have to being a public chat. It's private, but all 250 members have access to it. Ten miutes later, Benacrow came out with his 'guide'. Most members laughed it off. Then wild grunt (who I absolutely love and watch all his videos) came out with a video. Some wanted to speak up about the leak and that credit should be given to Maraxus in these threads. Ultimately, it was decided to just blow it off and let the community benefit from it. The only reason I even brought it up in this thread is because, well... scroll up. We were called out.
The reason it was posted when it was is because that was the first heroic we cleared, and our first real attempt to find out how it worked in heroic. Taramel started posting about EP in our squad and character strategy channel the day pictures of p3 surfaced showing 7 adds. His initial focus was on his TFP idea but we eventually figured out how to get 100% tm with EP. I believe you TI came up with this strartegy on their own, perhaps before us, but we didn't rip this strategy, TI has some great theory crafters (some).Also, you posted in benacrow's guide that the entire guide was ripped, which makes no sense as it was a guide geared toward mixed and FTP guilds. We just told the community some of the strategies we used, not claiming them as exclusively ours.
Also, shout out to our boy @benacrow for the hook ups we give him out of TI chat
Aww you guys are thinking of me
lol I almost wish I was in your guys chat but can't say I've had the privilege.
You ripped it. You posted it as if it was your strategy. We all got a good laugh out of it.
How was it ripped? It wasn't posted anywhere.
It's was posted in a Team Instinct chat. The 'Cantina'. This is the closest chat we have to being a public chat. It's private, but all 250 members have access to it. Almost instantly Benacrow came out with his 'guide'. Most members laughed it off. Then wild grunt (who I absolutely love and watch all his videos) came out with a video. Some wanted to speak up about the leak and that credit should be given to Maraxus in these threads. Ultimately, it was decided to just blow it off and let the community benefit from it. The only reason I even brought it up in this thread is because, well... scroll up. We were called out.
If it was in TI's chat then how can you claim another guild ripped it?
Just curious, it sounds like you guys came up with something similar, but it doesn't necessarily mean you were the only ones or even the first. It just sounds like sour grapes.
TI was the first to clear a heroic AAT, so you have nothing to be ashamed of, but it is pretty low class to say a strategy was copied by you when you held it in private.
At least with @benacrow 's guide he was trying to share what we learned immediately after we cleared our first heroic.
It should be known that there were discussions held within Mighty Chlorians if the strategy should be made public, most fell on the side that for the health of the game, to prevent a lot of frustration quitting that the strategy would be shared so that non-whale guilds might have a chance and not abandon the game. It seems that if TI did have the strategy when they first cleared that they did not value the health of the game enough to share it.
Ok should we go back to the theocraft? Or we prefer going back to what 99.9% of the post in this forum are which is finger pointing or bad mouthing others?
Ok should we go back to the theocraft? Or we prefer going back to what 99.9% of the post in this forum are which is finger pointing or bad mouthing others?
Agreed, there were some great discussions in here before.
Ok should we go back to the theocraft? Or we prefer going back to what 99.9% of the post in this forum are which is finger pointing or bad mouthing others?
Indeed. On that note, we've had some discussions about leaving STH out of P3 teams (and including SRP or HRS instead) because when sth is hit, he gives everyone else TM, sometimes causing the other taunts to expire before they're dead. Not sure which is more beneficial, but I'd think a fast EP would make up for a fast STH in the long run.
Oh I read that wrong thought it said 80% chance to remove 25%.
I guess I'll try that next raid because I don't have chirpa to seven stars yet. I've been using teebo for a couple weeks with moderate success but I think my biggest problem is my tanks. I only have two tanks viable, need sun fac but can't squeeze that one out of my FTP roster.
Thanks for the reply
I tried Datcha as leader since I don't have chirpa. I found with the rocket droids counter, reducing turn meter added nothing to the EP infinite turn strategy. Without chirpa it's best to go with an EP lead. With EP lead, use AOE stun first as opposed to the chirpa lead where it has been said to never use AOE stun.
Ok should we go back to the theocraft? Or we prefer going back to what 99.9% of the post in this forum are which is finger pointing or bad mouthing others?
Indeed. On that note, we've had some discussions about leaving STH out of P3 teams (and including SRP or HRS instead) because when sth is hit, he gives everyone else TM, sometimes causing the other taunts to expire before they're dead. Not sure which is more beneficial, but I'd think a fast EP would make up for a fast STH in the long run.
I've never lost a taunt due to sthan... U just need to taunt right before ep is almost done, sf will have 2 turn taunt, so should be more than enough, RG taunts automatically and sthan is dead before loosing taunt
Oh I read that wrong thought it said 80% chance to remove 25%.
I guess I'll try that next raid because I don't have chirpa to seven stars yet. I've been using teebo for a couple weeks with moderate success but I think my biggest problem is my tanks. I only have two tanks viable, need sun fac but can't squeeze that one out of my FTP roster.
Thanks for the reply
I tried Datcha as leader since I don't have chirpa. I found with the rocket droids counter, reducing turn meter added nothing to the EP infinite turn strategy. Without chirpa it's best to go with an EP lead. With EP lead, use AOE stun first as opposed to the chirpa lead where it has been said to never use AOE stun.
@Insufferable_camper Did you notice whether the adds tm were also reduced by dathcha's leader when they took passive damage from EP?
Ok should we go back to the theocraft? Or we prefer going back to what 99.9% of the post in this forum are which is finger pointing or bad mouthing others?
Indeed. On that note, we've had some discussions about leaving STH out of P3 teams (and including SRP or HRS instead) because when sth is hit, he gives everyone else TM, sometimes causing the other taunts to expire before they're dead. Not sure which is more beneficial, but I'd think a fast EP would make up for a fast STH in the long run.
I've never lost a taunt due to sthan... U just need to taunt right before ep is almost done, sf will have 2 turn taunt, so should be more than enough, RG taunts automatically and sthan is dead before loosing taunt
Sun Fac is not an option for quite a few though. Who would be the most viable alternative?
Replies
You and Benacrow must bunk together. You know you didn't come up with it. You know where you got it.
Not on a consistent basis at the current gear levels. While TFP has great armor pen (128) average armor is above this. Still, Palp has the lowest armor in the game at 133 so let's just assume its completely negated and you get the best possible roll in damage range (ie 1.05% of the ability's damage multiplier). You are looking at 35,521 before mods. Thus, you'd need to increase the offense by almost 13% or 339. You'll get 5.88% from the square so almost halfway there. This leaves you needing 181 offensive points from secondary stats, which is definitely possible, but again I suspect you'll go for higher crit chance secondary stats.In any event, yes its theoretically possible, but unlikely to routinely see this. (Noteworthy the defense down buff won't help in this case as we are completely negating defense already, but the offense up buff would.)
@Josh_K but the 5% will be wasted TM gain as B2 gains 25% per counter so Echo would have to assist him 5 times before he countered 4 times as every 4 counters fills his TM anyway.... Do you get were I'm going with this? (just don't want to explain it if you understand were I'm comming from)
Doesn't he gain 5% from each attack? So he'd be gaining 10% per attack, and you'd be increasing the likelihood of a counter which further increases TM.
In any event, you are talking about trading survivability (an extra tank) vs. a 30% chance for an extra attack that does ~20% of the damage of Palp's attack or a net 6% increase in damage. Without doing the math it seems like an extra 10+ turns of Palp that the extra tank provides would be better.
It's possible this was thought about and talked elsewhere, but yes, we have it starting to go public in TI Oct 24, and guarded quietly before then. Besides the time stamps we have of it in chat, I think our 3 guilds having it on farm early on is proof enough
Yeah I see your point.
An EP basic will grant B2 5% TM and has a 35% chance for him to gain 25% TM. So average 5 % + 8.75% = 13.75% TM per basic.
An echo assist will grant B2 5% TM and has a 0% chance for him to gain 25% TM. Echo will assist EP 30% of the time. So for each EP hit with echo in the team, the average TM gain is now, 13.75% + 1.5 % = 15.25% TM, an increase of roughly just over 10%. Echo on average will do about 3.5k damage per assist (216% CD, 50% CC), at 30% roughly add 1k to EP's average damage (EP's average damage is about 10k when maxed).
So at a very coarse level, the damage you are doing now per TM% gain of the boss is roughly on par, with and without Echo. Now if you factor in the opportunity cost of a full tank's worth of hp to extend the fight as long as possible, triple tank should win by a considerable margin.
There are 2 main points to maximizing this strategy:
Of course, RNG also plays a big part here. The initial set up also matters quite significantly.
Yeah I've tried this one. The problem here is that background cannon. EP usually gets killed much earlier as soon as it goes off. Between that and the bosses AOEs. Its a pretty good 2nd option though.
Plus, 90% of the tank damage gets taken from counters. Lowering B2's TM doesn't affect the counter rate.
P.S. Its 80% chance of defense down and 25% chance of TMR.
I guess I'll try that next raid because I don't have chirpa to seven stars yet. I've been using teebo for a couple weeks with moderate success but I think my biggest problem is my tanks. I only have two tanks viable, need sun fac but can't squeeze that one out of my FTP roster.
Thanks for the reply
Aww you guys are thinking of me
lol I almost wish I was in your guys chat but can't say I've had the privilege.
You ripped it. You posted it as if it was your strategy. We all got a good laugh out of it.
If you'd like to think so, then sure. I guess it's not possible for other guilds to come up with a good strategy now is it.
I really don't care who you think the credit belongs to, so if you guys want it, then sure. What matters to me is showing the best strategies that my guild found for the AAT to the community so that everyone can beat it.
How was it ripped? It wasn't posted anywhere.
It's was posted in a Team Instinct chat. The 'Cantina'. This is the closest chat we have to being a public chat. It's private, but all 250 members have access to it. Ten miutes later, Benacrow came out with his 'guide'. Most members laughed it off. Then wild grunt (who I absolutely love and watch all his videos) came out with a video. Some wanted to speak up about the leak and that credit should be given to Maraxus in these threads. Ultimately, it was decided to just blow it off and let the community benefit from it. The only reason I even brought it up in this thread is because, well... scroll up. We were called out.
If it was in TI's chat then how can you claim another guild ripped it?
Just curious, it sounds like you guys came up with something similar, but it doesn't necessarily mean you were the only ones or even the first. It just sounds like sour grapes.
TI was the first to clear a heroic AAT, so you have nothing to be ashamed of, but it is pretty low class to say a strategy was copied by you when you held it in private.
At least with @benacrow 's guide he was trying to share what we learned immediately after we cleared our first heroic.
It should be known that there were discussions held within Mighty Chlorians if the strategy should be made public, most fell on the side that for the health of the game, to prevent a lot of frustration quitting that the strategy would be shared so that non-whale guilds might have a chance and not abandon the game. It seems that if TI did have the strategy when they first cleared that they did not value the health of the game enough to share it.
Agreed, there were some great discussions in here before.
Indeed. On that note, we've had some discussions about leaving STH out of P3 teams (and including SRP or HRS instead) because when sth is hit, he gives everyone else TM, sometimes causing the other taunts to expire before they're dead. Not sure which is more beneficial, but I'd think a fast EP would make up for a fast STH in the long run.
I tried Datcha as leader since I don't have chirpa. I found with the rocket droids counter, reducing turn meter added nothing to the EP infinite turn strategy. Without chirpa it's best to go with an EP lead. With EP lead, use AOE stun first as opposed to the chirpa lead where it has been said to never use AOE stun.
I've never lost a taunt due to sthan... U just need to taunt right before ep is almost done, sf will have 2 turn taunt, so should be more than enough, RG taunts automatically and sthan is dead before loosing taunt
@Insufferable_camper Did you notice whether the adds tm were also reduced by dathcha's leader when they took passive damage from EP?
Sun Fac is not an option for quite a few though. Who would be the most viable alternative?