End of Week Raid Reward Update - 4/13/18 [MEGA]

Replies

  • Jabba
    1033 posts Member
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    I’m giving them one last shot to make this right . Let’s see how it goes i have feeling permanent rollback is coming . It’s a bottom line issue they will lose too much revenue if it stays same. I said this before and will repeat Krakkens and whales will quit if nerf stays. I actually should include ftp in that because there effected too grind to get ready for HSTR and when get there nerfed rewards how’s that a rewarding experience.
  • Azza
    245 posts Member
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    The way CG is managing this “crisis” will just make the crisis last over several months now.

    1- bad rewards for sith raids from t1 to t6 - people complains but not the whales doing heroic
    2- promise ti improve rewards - everyone happy
    3- you make the changes neefing rewards across the boards - everyone complains
    4- you partly cancel the changes but for heroic only - heroic doer still complain cause its still less than before, non-heroic get a slap in the face again as they are shown they are not good enough for Cg to care (review number 1)
    5- in may, you re-roll the bad rewards back - people are in an uproar again

    Stop creating drama please either suck up your decision on rewards and let the heavy complaints die in 2 to 3 weeks (like you did for k-2SO) or abandon the idea of changing the rewards.

    Players are not gimmy pigs. You make around $10m a month in revenue with this game, which classifies you as a decent size business, not a small one. Start acting like it.
  • AdlerCl
    47 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    The rewards have not improved for the other tiers and the only tier being "fixed" is heroic. This will widen the gap you've been so concerned about even more.
    Post edited by AdlerCl on
  • valeo25
    14 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic. I get that people are still disappointed by the result and should absolutely be voicing that, but how about showing some humanity as well and appreciating that all this vitriol is being directed at people on the other end. You can't just roll this back in a day. Especially with how high visibility this has gotten and how complex this system is, it would be irresponsible to do so. My guess is they probably also need to go through some testing to make sure rolling back this change independent of the rest of the CU doesn't mess anything else up. Unless you all want to lose your ability to farm Nightsisters etc until this is all resolved? These guys are a decent sized organization and the turnaround time this community is expecting both from communication and from pushing updates on this is just not realistic. It's not the pace that business moves.
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    What, like mandatory overtime in a work environment? Oh the horror! Welcome to life.
  • Neo2551
    1824 posts Member
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    This might be one good point for an open beta no? Maybe players would have given you the feedback about your decisions before you change?

    More than top 1-3 in each raid, you should introduce rewards based on damage, because this is what people would call fair (look at the difference between fairness and equality, players accept fair inequality, but hate unfair equality).

    If a players does 12M in Sith raid in T7, he should get much better rewards than someone who posts 0.
  • Jeric
    271 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    valeo25 wrote: »
    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic. I get that people are still disappointed by the result and should absolutely be voicing that, but how about showing some humanity as well and appreciating that all this vitriol is being directed at people on the other end. You can't just roll this back in a day. Especially with how high visibility this has gotten and how complex this system is, it would be irresponsible to do so. My guess is they probably also need to go through some testing to make sure rolling back this change independent of the rest of the CU doesn't mess anything else up. Unless you all want to lose your ability to farm Nightsisters etc until this is all resolved? These guys are a decent sized organization and the turnaround time this community is expecting both from communication and from pushing updates on this is just not realistic. It's not the pace that business moves.

    Decomposition and interface level modular programming mean anything to you? I know that microservice architecture patterns are usually more of b2b focus, but I can roll back a complex change with negligible headaches -- it's often trivial. Unless they over-engineered the system that assigns rewards to players.

    More likely any changes to the codebase have to come with a cost analysis (likely a partner requirement) that necessitates client or partner approval. Basically, it isn't the code change that usually holds these things up as much as it is approval levels and the convincing required, especially when the change is tied to revenue.
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    unknown.png

    These rewards are totally matching my efforts and time spent...

    I have a slight feeling i'll just quit this...
  • DistavioNi
    70 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    Witness57 wrote: »
    Once most people get Traya 7* nobody will do the raid anymore.

    okc, if top 3 take tw rewards -zetas..kitten this raid, only 0 dmg post
    Post edited by Sunnie1978 on
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    unknown.png

    These rewards are totally matching my efforts and time spent...

    I have a slight feeling i'll just quit this...

    ohhhh amazing 3k guild coins wow wow gj devs
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    This means rewards will be reverted to old system? That's good, but any extra currency should stay untouched, as a compensate to this terrible change...
  • Bawz
    31 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    valeo25 wrote: »
    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic.
    CG messed it up in the first place.
    The only reason that they are "saying goodbye to their families" (not that any of them actually will be) is because they messed up & are responsible for sorting out the hot mess that they have engineered and created.

    If they are having to work a few extra hours - good! If I mess up at work, I'd expect to have to stay late to fix my mess, why should these people, who have proven themselves to be liars, be any different?
    They've wasted enough hours of our time playing this garbage raid with all its bugs and issues.
    They wasted enough of our time to receive paltry rewards for playing this garbage raid.
    They wasted enough of our time with Q&A sessions pretending to listen and care.
    They've wasted enough of our time with outright lies and patently obvious attempts to divert attention away from the glaringly obvious flaws, instead of just fixing what they messed up.

    Why do these dishonest people deserve any sympathy? Please explain?
  • Bawz
    31 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    FKS - all they needed to do, in fact all that they were asked to do, was to remove Challenge gear.
    How can they possibly mess this up so badly?
    Players already find this raid an unworthy chore & do not enjoy participating in it.
    This is only going to increase the amount of those people, which will make the trash sit stinking in the corner alone, with no-one playing it.
    This is going to make players re-evaluate their recently made decision to continue playing after the last 3 debacles we've been subjected to as players.
    A lot of people were ready to leave at the last mess, quite a few did leave, then they did a week's worth of useless, frankly pathetic gifts and worthless videos with paid for shills who only serve as advertisers for their product.
    Somehow, people stopped complaining.
    Those people's complaints were not forgotten by those making them &, now seeing this, those complaints become valid & raised once again, but this time they gain momentum because of the dishonesty encountered.
    Post edited by Sunnie1978 on
  • Bawz
    31 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    This means rewards will be reverted to old system? That's good, but any extra currency should stay untouched, as a compensate to this terrible change...
    No. It does not mean that.
    What it means is that the G12 complete piece drop rate will be reverted to the old drop rate, for Heroic only.
    Heroic has also still been nerfed, to provide considerably lower rewards, with a fake offset of extra GET & Guilc Store currency, which amounts to exactly squat.
    All other tiers of the Raid have had their rewards nerfed.
    All other tiers now receive exactly the same prize box, regardless of their finishing position.
    Why should anyone bother posting anything other than a zero for this now?
    Why would I bother spending hours on each Phase in order to finish 1st if I'm going to be rewarded the same as someone who just posted a zero and did nothing to actually help progress the Raid to completion?

    In the new reward system, the person finishing 50th can potentially receive better Gear rewards than the person finishing 1st.
    I do not understand how, on any planet, this can be considered sound logic?
  • JohnnySteelAlpha
    2794 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    valeo25 wrote: »
    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic. I get that people are still disappointed by the result and should absolutely be voicing that, but how about showing some humanity as well and appreciating that all this vitriol is being directed at people on the other end. You can't just roll this back in a day. Especially with how high visibility this has gotten and how complex this system is, it would be irresponsible to do so. My guess is they probably also need to go through some testing to make sure rolling back this change independent of the rest of the CU doesn't mess anything else up. Unless you all want to lose your ability to farm Nightsisters etc until this is all resolved? These guys are a decent sized organization and the turnaround time this community is expecting both from communication and from pushing updates on this is just not realistic. It's not the pace that business moves.

    Business moves at the pace it must to meet customer demands and stave off its competition or it ceases to exist. Do you think the devs would prefer a silent crowd that, rather than demand a fair shake (make no mistake the players are in the right here), they just uninstall and play another game? There are so many mobile games, you just can't afford to make moves this drastic. Also...we all have families. I have to leave them time to time to travel and work long hours. If you want to be successful or reasonably so anyway you have to do what must be done. Don't equate players voicing concern with a big gaffe to lacking humanity; what a leap!
  • Bawz
    31 posts Member
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    CG must be literally rolling around in dollar bills on the floor, laughing their heads off at their customers who continue to believe them and pay them.

    lol we tempted them to spend a fortune on getting RJT in time. OK, now let's nerf her effects.
    Wait, isn't she already rubbish anyway?
    Yeah, but don't worry, ppl will still buy her.

    lol we tempted them to spend a fortune on getting their squads capable for STR. OK, now let's change the dynamics and effects of abilities in the raid.
    Wait, won't that mess up what they already spent their money on?
    Yeah, but don't worry, ppl will still spend on getting the new squads.

    lol we tempted them to spend a fortune on getting their squads capable for H-STR. OK, now let's lower the rewards that they worked so much to gain.
    Wait, won't that annoy them?
    Yeah, but don't worry, we'll just do another Q&A session & gift them 75k credits, maybe some crystals & they'll all shut up and stop moaning, then they'll still spend.

    How long do you think we can actually keep getting away with this?
    As long as we like, they're not smart enough to figure us out.
  • Madpup
    279 posts Member
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    valeo25 wrote: »
    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic. I get that people are still disappointed by the result and should absolutely be voicing that, but how about showing some humanity as well and appreciating that all this vitriol is being directed at people on the other end. You can't just roll this back in a day. Especially with how high visibility this has gotten and how complex this system is, it would be irresponsible to do so. My guess is they probably also need to go through some testing to make sure rolling back this change independent of the rest of the CU doesn't mess anything else up. Unless you all want to lose your ability to farm Nightsisters etc until this is all resolved? These guys are a decent sized organization and the turnaround time this community is expecting both from communication and from pushing updates on this is just not realistic. It's not the pace that business moves.

    You can roll it make immediately by just reverting rewards back to what they were. But instead there are going to get changing it but but but until we still end up with an overall Nerf and enough people stop complaining that they can get it ti stay where it's at. It's not my fault there are some ciders staying over the weekend to fix this. It's CGs fault.
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    Business moves at the pace it must to meet customer demands and stave off its competition or it ceases to exist. Do you think the devs would prefer a silent crowd that, rather than demand a fair shake (make no mistake the players are in the right here), they just uninstall and play another game? There are so many mobile games, you just can't afford to make moves this drastic. Also...we all have families. I have to leave them time to time to travel and work long hours. If you want to be successful or reasonably so anyway you have to do what must be done. Don't equate players voicing concern with a big gaffe to lacking humanity; what a leap!

    That wasn't my point. This is a definite mistake on their part and I'm not saying they shouldn't have to work harder to fix it or that players shouldn't be able to voice their opinions. My only point was that I've seen a growing trend that despite what they say or how quick they make changes, there is still a subset of this forum that just savages them for it, and wants their pound of flesh. There's a lot of players voicing concerns as you said, but there's also some going beyond that. Then again this is an Internet forum so I really shouldn't be surprised.

    And yes business moves at the need of the customer but there seems to be a gulf between how the community decides as soon as possible and CG does, and my point was just that there are business realities at play that likely limit their agility on some these things.

  • Madpup
    279 posts Member
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    Let me put it this way. I typically rank about 40- 35 in the sith raid. Because of this change I will run 1 team on auto and then just leave it be. If I rank 50 my rewards will virtually be the same as someone who ranks up to 10 or 15. Why should I waste my time trying to complete a raid and imoroving when there is zero immediate incentive to get better?
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    I started working on my nightsister team in order to rank higher higher in the Raid for better rewards. Now who the hell cares where you finish because the rewards are garbage throughout. I would like my zeta back that was placed on Ventress. That zeta could have went to a lot of different characters but was heavily influenced on Sith Raid Rewards. Do you all sit around the office sharing a good laugh at our expense every time you screw us with these ridiculous updates? Is the company motto “If it works break it, if it’s broke fix it in August.”
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    Banth wrote: »
    Kyleslater wrote: »
    Bloody awesome! While I’m never likely to place 1-3 I do think they deserve better reward. Some of those people manage way more damage then I do. I honestly was fine with the old scaling reward but that’s a different issue (this one hates participation trophies). Glad to see we as a community finally managed to get a fire under your chair big enough to make something we like happen.

    This is nothing. The raids are still horribly nerfed. It’s a classic tactic they are using to get away with taking our rewards and replacing them with gear we need real money for. They started with incredible rewards, nerfed it to oblivion, then pulled it back a hair just so people would say things like “Oh at least it’s not as bad as it was!” or “They are so awesome for putting back the rewards!” When in reality the nerf is still there and it’s still at least a 300% lower reward. Don’t let them play that game. Demand end game rewards for end game content. People spend tons of time and resources (including real money) to get to where they can do well in HSR. And they deserve to be rewarded, not tricked with a bait and switch and lied to. Roll it back.

    You have a point and to a degree I agree with you. It would have been a lot easier as a whole if they said straight up “we need to nerf drops” then we could have a discussion on how much of a nerf we could live with. If the roll back isn’t sufficient I suspect complaints to be right back to normal.

    However even I can see that th original drop rate is higher then cg’s goals allow. Or even higher then is a maintainable business model for that matter. They needed to drop a bit. How much is the question and @CG_Carrie for crying out loud next time you try this straight up tell us this to start with rather then trying to sell it as a buff. Say we need to nerf this. Like you did with jtr. Granted half of us are still annoyed by that stuff and wish you’d undo that but that’s neither here nor there. Quit trying to be a politician... no one really likes them.
    I hate these new timesinks called Tb/tw. Annoying features.
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    valeo25 wrote: »
    I really can't believe some of the people here. You realize Carrie's response basically means this team is probably saying goodbye to their families until this gets released right? You don't just cut a timeline in half by sheer magic. I get that people are still disappointed by the result and should absolutely be voicing that, but how about showing some humanity as well and appreciating that all this vitriol is being directed at people on the other end. You can't just roll this back in a day. Especially with how high visibility this has gotten and how complex this system is, it would be irresponsible to do so. My guess is they probably also need to go through some testing to make sure rolling back this change independent of the rest of the CU doesn't mess anything else up. Unless you all want to lose your ability to farm Nightsisters etc until this is all resolved? These guys are a decent sized organization and the turnaround time this community is expecting both from communication and from pushing updates on this is just not realistic. It's not the pace that business moves.


    A lot of us understand what work is require. We also understand how much stupidity is required to make the poor decision in the first place. All complaints justified. While I do feel for the people working hard to fix this (it ain’t their fault) the blame for this **** mistake lies with Carrie. She admitted to it. So she’s gotta do her best to fix it end of story. As someone else pointed out it’s been a list of issues since the sith raid. So far there has been very little the community has been happy with. I personally have had loads of complaints since Tb was introduced and not one of them has been solved to any satisfying degree. Why am I still playing this game if I have so many complaints you ask? I’m a Star Wars fan and there isn’t something else I can go to. I’m stuck here. I don’t know what they would have to do to make me actually quit and that’s probably why they try to get away with so much. I doubt I’m alone.
    I hate these new timesinks called Tb/tw. Annoying features.
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    Playing the sith raid is not fun.
    It's just work.
    We should be paid a salary.
  • Stud3099
    601 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    This latest communication is terrible too. CG, you just don't get why the players are upset or if you do then you just don't care.

    1.) Killing the rewards was NOT what people wanted but that's what you did. All we wanted was no challenge gear in the rewards.
    2.) I understand flattening the rewards curve for T6 & T7. This makes sense as those tiers require full guild efforts to complete. Maybe even T5. But T4 and below does not require equal effort from all guild members. Flattened rewards do not make sense at those tiers.
    3.) I can understand slightly nerfing the rewards on the heroic tier as the quantity of g12 rewards was a little over the top and you were concerned about the long term consequences as the gap between high level and lower level players widens. But even still, there is already a large gap between top tier guilds and the rest of the player base that the additional gear won't matter that much between the two bases as a whole. Another option would have been to offer better rewards at lower tiers in the raid to help that player base improve up to the highest tier. That could easily take months or a year to reach fruition but ultimately everyone would get to the highest tier. Currently, there is no path up to HSTR if your guild is currently at Tier IV or lower. The rewards are not good enough to help these guild succeed. Your changes have forced that gap to continue to widen jeopardizing the very thing you were supposedly trying to protect.

    The ball has been dropped on this PR opportunity. You had everyone believing that you were going to do something great for the game and then you took a huge giant step back. You don't have long to figure out how to reverse the damage.

  • Broxxor
    595 posts Member
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    Sweet. "Communication" is back. Vague answers, no response to threads and then closing them to get buried, addressing 1/10 of the problem then ignoring the rest and calling it a solution.

    Man, things sure have changed here.

    In case you weren't aware, that couldn't have been anymore sarcastic @CG_Carrie

    A guess a leopard never changes its spots.
  • Nikoms565
    14242 posts Member
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    Broxxor wrote: »
    Sweet. "Communication" is back. Vague answers, no response to threads and then closing them to get buried, addressing 1/10 of the problem then ignoring the rest and calling it a solution.

    Man, things sure have changed here.

    In case you weren't aware, that couldn't have been anymore sarcastic @CG_Carrie

    A guess a leopard never changes its spots.

    Lol - so true. In 2+ years, the only thing that has changed is who tries to tell us that the moisture on our heads is rain.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • TVF
    36692 posts Member
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    Hey you got a carbanti in the bonus tier of the event today. ;)
    I need a new message here. https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
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    First of all; STR is boring especially nihilus. There is no tac no team except jtr. Just hitting auto. As a 50m guild we are finishing the raid in 3-5 days(t4). Half of my guild just participating. STR is a burden for us. So i dont care about ''rewards''. Just a death part of game, that's all. Good job!
  • Ace0187420
    104 posts Member
    edited April 2018
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    Feel free to delete this post please. Thanks
This discussion has been closed.