Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
I gotta go do Father’s Day stuff now, I cannot continue debating that opinions are inherently neither right or wrong with you guys, just that they do have value. Everyone enjoy your father’s days. Ciao.
Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
That's a little more direct than I was aiming for, but I agree. I was only trying to change the tone a bit because we're not enemies, but fellow gamers.
what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
Unfortunately you and I never came to a mutual understanding. Happy Father's Day.
(and yes, you can be right, or be wrong on what we base opinions).
what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
You misunderstand. I'm not trying to change the mind of anyone who's actively posting in this or any other thread. For the most part, the people who post on these boards have their minds made up the second they type their first "I hate this."
I'm replying because I think this change is genuinely for the better of the game. I think if you approach ships with an open mind and as a problem to be engaged with and solved, 2.0 gives you a wealth of options. I think if you approach 2.0 with the mindset of 1.0, that you invested heavily in a dozen ships and then once you were complete you had your own personal ATM where you could withdraw a couple hundred crystals a day, then you hate this because you can't do that any more.
I'm replying because this board has more lurkers and than it has active posters, and there are lurkers out there who aren't posting because these threads become great circle jerks of negativity where everyone is competing to see who can bash it the most, then as soon as someone says "Well I like it," they're met with "LET ME TELL YOU WHY YOU ARE WRONG!" And why should they? You guys said what you had to say--RNG, limited options, don't want to farm new ships, blah, blah, blah and then I or TVF or the occasional other random poster would reply to you. Then you would repeat yourself, only louder, because your mind is made up and the idea that someone disagreeing with you might have a point is so foreign that clearly they only disagree because they don't get what you're saying.
I've posted my criticisms of 2.0 here, the other thread, in Feedback, all over the place. I'm not saying this is perfect. The last patch was a good starting point, but it's just a starting point, there's a whole lot more that needs to be done. But no one wants to talk about that, because that would mean acknowledging that you aren't 100% right. So it's much better to just repeat RNG for the umpteenth time like that's adding something new to the conversation despite all the times folks have said that you can control for randomness if you want, and relying on it is your strategic choice.
Im on a day 1 shard,I have every ship and most pilots 7 starred,out of the top 100,maybe 10 run a different capital ship.before update,I slugged anywhere from 30-60,afer update I tried other ships and dropped into the 100s forcing me to go back to the mirror teams,now i hover in the 60s bc we keep facing the same teams and dropping each other down the ladder,if I really wanted to move up the ladder,Id have to refresh 4,5 times,im sure i could finish top 10 but its not worth the RNG aggravation so I'll continue to lumber in the 50-70 range w/o refreshes,continue to work on my pilots gear which every1 is doing so honestly whats really changing?I must say,it must be nice to be on shard where no1 cared for ships,id be estactic too with the update.
Well, see, you're wrong here. There are wrong opinions. History is littered with bad opinions that formed bad laws that formed bad societies that eventually collapsed and were replaced with something better (which then collapsed and were replaced, etc) it's the historical dialectic, you see?
There are all kinds of ways to have a bad opinion. You can form an opinion without sufficient information. You can succumb to pride and defend your opinion even as new information discredits it. Your opinion can be rooted in a bias towards the status quo. There are people out there, today, in the year of our lord Tetsuya Naito two thousand and eighteen, who are of the opinion that the earth is flat. That's a wrong opinion.
Some of these arguments are inherently contradictory. Look at the folks who are saying that 2.0 is bad because Imperial TIE's dodge got halved and there are more undodgeable attacks now AND that it's bad because there's too much randomness in it dodging. There was MORE randomness before, and they were fine with that, though. Or how it's too random because you need to get the first target lock, but also there are ships with unresistable target locks. You can't have both of those opinions. You can have one or the other of each of those pairs, but not both.
I'm not saying I'm right. What I'm saying is that there's a proper dialectical way of approaching these things, and people aren't doing that. They made the claim (whatever it may be--too much RNG, too much reliance on target lock, whatever) and folks have made the counter claim (unavoidable attacks, unresistable target locks, whatever). What's supposed to happen next is that the initial claimant revises their opinion based on that information and then evolves their stance in response. Instead what happens is they double down on their original position and then repeat themselves, only louder, because as I said--anyone disagreeing with you obviously is only disagreeing because they don't understand, and not because they genuinely mean what they're saying.
2 matches. first one, my tie adv "moves" b4 his tie adv...in the end, i lose. Second match...his tie adv moves b4 mine....****???? Did u just make TM rng based????
If two characters (or ships) have 100% turn meter at the same time (usually through one of two ways: Either they have the exact same speed, or something gives a chunk of TM to multiple characters (like breaking exposes under zeta Finn)) the game will randomly determine the order of those characters.
I mean, it's not like they can both go at the same time, right?
Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
If someone says it's impossible to win in ships 2.0, they're wrong. And lots of people are saying that.
Well, see, you're wrong here. There are wrong opinions. History is littered with bad opinions that formed bad laws that formed bad societies that eventually collapsed and were replaced with something better (which then collapsed and were replaced, etc) it's the historical dialectic, you see?
There are all kinds of ways to have a bad opinion. You can form an opinion without sufficient information. You can succumb to pride and defend your opinion even as new information discredits it. Your opinion can be rooted in a bias towards the status quo. There are people out there, today, in the year of our lord Tetsuya Naito two thousand and eighteen, who are of the opinion that the earth is flat. That's a wrong opinion.
Some of these arguments are inherently contradictory. Look at the folks who are saying that 2.0 is bad because Imperial TIE's dodge got halved and there are more undodgeable attacks now AND that it's bad because there's too much randomness in it dodging. There was MORE randomness before, and they were fine with that, though. Or how it's too random because you need to get the first target lock, but also there are ships with unresistable target locks. You can't have both of those opinions. You can have one or the other of each of those pairs, but not both.
I'm not saying I'm right. What I'm saying is that there's a proper dialectical way of approaching these things, and people aren't doing that. They made the claim (whatever it may be--too much RNG, too much reliance on target lock, whatever) and folks have made the counter claim (unavoidable attacks, unresistable target locks, whatever). What's supposed to happen next is that the initial claimant revises their opinion based on that information and then evolves their stance in response. Instead what happens is they double down on their original position and then repeat themselves, only louder, because as I said--anyone disagreeing with you obviously is only disagreeing because they don't understand, and not because they genuinely mean what they're saying.
Nic, I do think the frustration level with Ships 2.0 is pretty high. I've gotten used to winning 100% of the time under ships 1.0, and now under 2.0 I've lost a lot. It's taken some getting used to, with tons of frustration, trying to adapt to the new rules of the game. And the uncertainty of what to run, and who to max abilities, and which reinforcements to use, has made my game life difficult. Usually on weekends, I'll refresh fleet arena 3 or more times trying different combinations. I do this because the published stats don't tell the whole story. I need a test drive. But, I have found something that does work pretty good, and allows recovery from bad rng. There is rng that is real bad, that is unrecoverable though that raises its ugly head from time to time. I'm at a stage with good success, but am uncertain where to progress next. Recently, I've raised levels on abilities only to then wish I'd have done it to a different ship or held onto the resources. The investment decisions are huge and a wrong decision can set me back weeks. Couple this with different success rates on different shards, making following someone else's advice risky. What may work for them, may not work for me.
Overall, I like Ships 2.0, but honestly, it's made my gaming harder trying to overcome all the changes. I can sincerely understand others who've made huge investment decisions being left out of ships 2.0 because now it no longer works for them. Few built geonosians, or Phoenix, some of the teams now having success, to name a few. Most pursued Thrawn"s Capital ship, but in Ships 2.0 Tarkin's and Akbar's capital ships are finding success, maybe even more success. But now that I've maxed Thrawn's capital ship, and started to max out Tarkin's ship, say I wanted to switch to Akbar, it would take me 100 days to max him. The biggest obstacle is the amount of investment required to get a ship ready for Arena, just to see if it'll work. Many come here to talk about their failures in fleet, because it just happened, and it's happening everyday, but for them, maybe they know successes can't come for months away if they can just figure out a winning strategy. Some are so frustrated, they honestly believe there isn't a winning strategy, despite your's and other's assertion that we can enjoy success too just like you.
BTW, what are you running in fleets, if I may ask.
what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
Unfortunately you and I never came to a mutual understanding. Happy Father's Day.
(and yes, you can be right, or be wrong on what we base opinions).
Well, see, you're wrong here. There are wrong opinions. History is littered with bad opinions that formed bad laws that formed bad societies that eventually collapsed and were replaced with something better (which then collapsed and were replaced, etc) it's the historical dialectic, you see?
There are all kinds of ways to have a bad opinion. You can form an opinion without sufficient information. You can succumb to pride and defend your opinion even as new information discredits it. Your opinion can be rooted in a bias towards the status quo. There are people out there, today, in the year of our lord Tetsuya Naito two thousand and eighteen, who are of the opinion that the earth is flat. That's a wrong opinion.
Some of these arguments are inherently contradictory. Look at the folks who are saying that 2.0 is bad because Imperial TIE's dodge got halved and there are more undodgeable attacks now AND that it's bad because there's too much randomness in it dodging. There was MORE randomness before, and they were fine with that, though. Or how it's too random because you need to get the first target lock, but also there are ships with unresistable target locks. You can't have both of those opinions. You can have one or the other of each of those pairs, but not both.
I'm not saying I'm right. What I'm saying is that there's a proper dialectical way of approaching these things, and people aren't doing that. They made the claim (whatever it may be--too much RNG, too much reliance on target lock, whatever) and folks have made the counter claim (unavoidable attacks, unresistable target locks, whatever). What's supposed to happen next is that the initial claimant revises their opinion based on that information and then evolves their stance in response. Instead what happens is they double down on their original position and then repeat themselves, only louder, because as I said--anyone disagreeing with you obviously is only disagreeing because they don't understand, and not because they genuinely mean what they're saying.
Since you guys still don’t understand and apparently can’t goigle or own a dictionary. The definition of an opinion is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.”
Therefore an opinion cannot be inherently right or wrong.
Disagreeing on what is actually happening is not the same thing as missing the point.
That's true. You missed the point.
Without a reliable means of speeding your capital ship through strategy, it becomes either a wallet war or a coin-flip. That is a problem. Your statement of "don't use Tie Fighter" doesn't make better or even address my point that a wallet war or coin-flip is bad.
You missed the point.
Sorry, we're not missing your point, we disagree with it because your premise is correct, but you're drawing the wrong conclusion from it.
Your conclusion only holds in a mirror match of completely identical rosters. If you change anything about your fleet you change the outcome. You aren't supposed to fight mirror matches. That's why you're allowed to pick your opponent and see their starting lineup, capital ship, and the gear of every pilot.
You're supposed to change your capital ship in rection to your opponent's, and then change your starting lineup to maximise your capital ship's abilities. Take a look around and you'll find folks who finish at or near the top with Endurance. They do this by specifically not using the traditional Biggs, Vader, TIE lineup because those ships don't synergize with Endurance's abilities at all.
The one-size-fits-all fleet paradigm is dead. Work on new things, experiment, fail, rediscover the joy of not knowing.
There’s two of you defending this update ardently, the rest of the 60 pages of posters disagree with you, you’re very much in the minority but I digress continue on your crusade saying everyone is doing it wrong.
Cool story, Scoots. Thanks for contributing.
No worries, you’re doing a fantastic job defending your point of view, it just happens almost no one else agrees with it, you got this.
I realize you're not talking to me, but I am not sure of your point... I'm actually puzzled. In my view, I'd rather be right, than be in the majority. What if the majority is wrong? Then what.
Now I'm not saying who is right, but that's why you talk it out and debate. So again, why even discuss who is the majority, maybe it's best to stick to the issue's facts.
The fact is the overwhelming majority of players posting on these forums, disagree with Nic Wester on his point of view of ships 2.0 and yet he constantly incessantly continues to beat the proverbial dead horse like it’s going to change anyones opinion. It won’t, it hasn’t. He seems to like to demean players for their point of view proclaiming the rest of the posters are playing ships wrong to discredit their opinions or to devalue those opinions in some way. However there is no right or wrong in this case only opinion as we’re discussing the quality of the update and the overwhelming majority of players disagree with him, that they dislike the update, their reasons do not matter.
Out of curiosity, how would you expect the majority to respond, if Nic is actually right? Do you even allow that possibility? I don't think Nic is lying about his experiences. Nor do I think the majority of forum members are either.
Now I can see your point of view. Even if Nic is right, I think I see most didn't like the shuffling of winning/losing ships in 2.0. Is that it? What ships worked before don't now, and the best ships with the limited resources we have forces everyone into an RNG mirror match where you're not guaranteed to win like we did in ships 1.0? And even if Nic is right, that there are other options to break the RNG cycle and win consistently, the fact that it'll be months to get there is too discouraging? Is that it? Or is it you just flat out disagree with Nic, that his facts don't represent the facts on your shard or players you compete against, and you know this because you have 1st hand experiences with Nic's squad but have different outcomes? Or is it just Nic's personality/style?
Just curious really, not trying to fight you.
There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. If I didn’t make that clear in my last post i’ll lead with it in this one. There is no right or wrong, it’s all opinions. I’ll say it twice to make sure it’s understood. I finish 1st still, just like before, did I have to make adjustments, sure, do I like it, no. That’s the point. It didn’t effect my outcome and I don’t like the update, others have their own reasons. It doesn’t matter why I don’t like it, it doesn’t matter that he does. My point is why attack other people for having an opinion like he’s doing? It makes no sense. There’s so many people who have a difference in opinion with him he’ll never run out of sparring partners. Like I said before the overming opinion is people don’t like the update, I don’t see the point in attacking other people for their opinions, regardless of how they arrived at their conclusions.
If in your point of view there isn't a right or wrong, then why bother debating. You both win, right? Debates over.
I also don't think there's a right or wrong. Instead I think there are winners, and we'll.... not winners. Nic claims knowledge you don't have, claims to be a winner. Isn't worth investigating? Despite his charming personality?
What’s your point here, I’ve made mine, I’m winning to, he has no knowledge that isn’t readily available to the rest of the community and it still hasn’t changed anyone’s opinion. But if it requires further investigation, I would suggest reading the 60 pages in the other thread where most people disagree with him, again it doesn’t matter how they’ve reached their conclusions as it’s their opinion, and you can go back in this thread and read all the comments from people who also disagree with him. Investigate to your hearts content.
to be brutally honest, most people are noobs. On top of that, most people only come on the forum to complain. So the fact that people disagree with him in that whinefest doesn't necessarily means he's wrong.
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
Unfortunately you and I never came to a mutual understanding. Happy Father's Day.
(and yes, you can be right, or be wrong on what we base opinions).
Well, see, you're wrong here. There are wrong opinions. History is littered with bad opinions that formed bad laws that formed bad societies that eventually collapsed and were replaced with something better (which then collapsed and were replaced, etc) it's the historical dialectic, you see?
There are all kinds of ways to have a bad opinion. You can form an opinion without sufficient information. You can succumb to pride and defend your opinion even as new information discredits it. Your opinion can be rooted in a bias towards the status quo. There are people out there, today, in the year of our lord Tetsuya Naito two thousand and eighteen, who are of the opinion that the earth is flat. That's a wrong opinion.
Some of these arguments are inherently contradictory. Look at the folks who are saying that 2.0 is bad because Imperial TIE's dodge got halved and there are more undodgeable attacks now AND that it's bad because there's too much randomness in it dodging. There was MORE randomness before, and they were fine with that, though. Or how it's too random because you need to get the first target lock, but also there are ships with unresistable target locks. You can't have both of those opinions. You can have one or the other of each of those pairs, but not both.
I'm not saying I'm right. What I'm saying is that there's a proper dialectical way of approaching these things, and people aren't doing that. They made the claim (whatever it may be--too much RNG, too much reliance on target lock, whatever) and folks have made the counter claim (unavoidable attacks, unresistable target locks, whatever). What's supposed to happen next is that the initial claimant revises their opinion based on that information and then evolves their stance in response. Instead what happens is they double down on their original position and then repeat themselves, only louder, because as I said--anyone disagreeing with you obviously is only disagreeing because they don't understand, and not because they genuinely mean what they're saying.
Since you guys still don’t understand and apparently can’t goigle or own a dictionary. The definition of an opinion is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.”
Therefore an opinion cannot be inherently right or wrong.
So then it follows there can't be a wrong judgment?
If someone wants to debate you on that more power to them. Lol my point was made.
@Dark_Light I'm stepping out of this conversation because you're not willing to listen. Take care.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
@Dark_Light I'm stepping out of this conversation because you're not willing to listen. Take care.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
Fair enough. You gave a good description of your opinion on opinions. Here's my opinion, I skated easy peazy to 1st place, and didn't drop below 16 the past week in an aggressive active shard. So I'm quite happy being a winner and all.
what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
@Dark_Light I'm stepping out of this conversation because you're not willing to listen. Take care.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
Fair enough. You gave a good description of your opinion on opinions. Here's my opinion, I skated easy peazy to 1st place, and didn't drop below 16 the past week in an aggressive active shard. So I'm quite happy being a winner and all.
Congratulations, I wish you continued success, I also as previously stated finish first still, for like 2 years now, Glad they made some other pilots useful again, still don’t like the update.
@Dark_Light I'm stepping out of this conversation because you're not willing to listen. Take care.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
Fair enough. You gave a good description of your opinion on opinions. Here's my opinion, I skated easy peazy to 1st place, and didn't drop below 16 the past week in an aggressive active shard. So I'm quite happy being a winner and all.
Congratulations, I wish you continued success, I also as previously stated finish first still, for like 2 years now, Glad they made some other pilots useful again, still don’t like the update.
Fair enough. We're winners together, proving anyone can win in Ships 2.0 validating my opinion as being based on solid facts.
what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
@Dark_Light I'm stepping out of this conversation because you're not willing to listen. Take care.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
Fair enough. You gave a good description of your opinion on opinions. Here's my opinion, I skated easy peazy to 1st place, and didn't drop below 16 the past week in an aggressive active shard. So I'm quite happy being a winner and all.
Congratulations, I wish you continued success, I also as previously stated finish first still, for like 2 years now, Glad they made some other pilots useful again, still don’t like the update.
Fair enough. We're winners together, proving anyone can win in Ships 2.0 validating my opinion as being based on solid facts.
Except we didn’t do anything together, you didn’t prove anyone can win and you’re opinion is yours no matter what it’s based on (like the “facts”, or lack thereof), other than that, we’re in total agreement.
I guess I lost haha. Have a good night. Happy Father’s Day.
BTW, what are you running in fleets, if I may ask.
My leaderboard lives and dies by Thrawn, it seems, so I'm using Home One as my capital ship right now. Ackbar was g9 when 2.0 hit, but I've been working on him and he's nearly g12 now, but maaaaaaan do I hate those gold stun guns... I've also been working on Thrawn and Tarkin, but they're still only g8/9 because of how many Thrawns I'm up against.
My starting three are Biggs, Vader, and 5s. I use 5s because he's very fast and his target lock is guaranteed if it hits.
My reserves are Jedi Consular, Poe, Clone Sgt, and use my fourth as a flex that is currently Asohka, but has been basically everything.
My leaderboard is very basic, so it's mostly Thrawn, Vader, Biggs, Imperial TIE, with Boba and Scimitar as their first reserves. So I open up by hitting their Biggs with 5s' special for a guaranteed target lock, that will push their Biggs' TM above their Vader's, so he uses his basic instead of his special and my Biggs will survive. Home One uses its AoE and all ships always attack their Biggs until he's dead. If their Biggs survives until Home One's next turn I'll bring in Jedi Consular and use his special to have him and Vader finish Biggs off. If their Biggs is dead or very low on life, I bring in Poe and either one-shot their TIE or finish off their Biggs with Poe's basic and save the special for the TIE.
From there I'm in a good position and usually go on to win, but the exact moves to get there are fuzzy because the situation is always different.
That's good enough to gain rank, but I'm kind of busy lately so I don't have time for more than a handful of attacks each day So I've broken the top 100 (which isn't that impressive, I know, but my only g12 pilot is Poe, and my omegas and reinforcement abilities are spread all over the place since I've been trying different things out) but have fallen pretty far back. I think I'll have enough time to commit by late July or early August, but my job is weird.
I'm working on the Geonosian trio because they seem really solid, but I'm ready for everything to change once the pve board comes out. I have an idea for a really wicked Resistance fleet, but it needs at least one more Resistance ship, a tank that isn't Biggs, and would be better with a Resistance capital ship, but can get by with Home One. But, for now, it's all just a work on paper.
Since you guys still don’t understand and apparently can’t goigle or own a dictionary. The definition of an opinion is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.”
Therefore an opinion cannot be inherently right or wrong.
Well then in my opinion the sky is green and I have a hard time mowing my lawn because I never know where to stop.
opinions huh....
okay here is my opinion....ships 2.0 made catching up to old players even harder now for new players....challenges are now way more difficult, those who maxed out ships and 3 started all the challenges are gonna have an easier time than those who can't do tier 3 of challenges because of ghost, phantom II, biggs start up...and you have to drop every farming you do to work on one ship that may or may not make a difference and it will take a lot of time
you wouldn't be saying ''I enjoy ships 2.0'' now would you
Since you guys still don’t understand and apparently can’t goigle or own a dictionary. The definition of an opinion is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.”
Therefore an opinion cannot be inherently right or wrong.
Well then in my opinion the sky is green and I have a hard time mowing my lawn because I never know where to stop.
The forum software is broken because it won't let me like this post more than once.
We have also heard your feedback that the Level 60 Ship Challenges are too difficult. We are making these significantly easier in today’s update and the first challenge tier should be completable by players who reached this tier recently. This should also make the daily activity to complete this challenge more achievable.
Although this is a step in the right direction, it seems you haven't heard our feedback that the executrix challenge tier 4 especially is way too difficult.
It is designed for players in their early stages still, with 4* ships lvl 75 required.
But it just isn't manageable with those.
Some people say that the next tier is doable but they already have won their tier 4 before.
Without 5* executrix we cannot get ship materials tier 3, and therefore we can't upgrade the ships beyond a certain point.
So we need way better ships to go through tier 4 but we can't upgrade skills anymore.
Is it intended that we have to get like 7* ships and maxed out 7* pilots to pass that challenge?
I mean considering the requirements and the idea that this is still a tier for newer players.
Replies
Guys, it’s impossible for someone to be right. You’re devaluing other people’s experience by saying they’re wrong or he’s right. These are OPINIONS. Opinions based on experience. Overwhelmingly negative in perspective.
That's a little more direct than I was aiming for, but I agree. I was only trying to change the tone a bit because we're not enemies, but fellow gamers.
Unfortunately you and I never came to a mutual understanding. Happy Father's Day.
(and yes, you can be right, or be wrong on what we base opinions).
I'm replying because I think this change is genuinely for the better of the game. I think if you approach ships with an open mind and as a problem to be engaged with and solved, 2.0 gives you a wealth of options. I think if you approach 2.0 with the mindset of 1.0, that you invested heavily in a dozen ships and then once you were complete you had your own personal ATM where you could withdraw a couple hundred crystals a day, then you hate this because you can't do that any more.
I'm replying because this board has more lurkers and than it has active posters, and there are lurkers out there who aren't posting because these threads become great circle jerks of negativity where everyone is competing to see who can bash it the most, then as soon as someone says "Well I like it," they're met with "LET ME TELL YOU WHY YOU ARE WRONG!" And why should they? You guys said what you had to say--RNG, limited options, don't want to farm new ships, blah, blah, blah and then I or TVF or the occasional other random poster would reply to you. Then you would repeat yourself, only louder, because your mind is made up and the idea that someone disagreeing with you might have a point is so foreign that clearly they only disagree because they don't get what you're saying.
I've posted my criticisms of 2.0 here, the other thread, in Feedback, all over the place. I'm not saying this is perfect. The last patch was a good starting point, but it's just a starting point, there's a whole lot more that needs to be done. But no one wants to talk about that, because that would mean acknowledging that you aren't 100% right. So it's much better to just repeat RNG for the umpteenth time like that's adding something new to the conversation despite all the times folks have said that you can control for randomness if you want, and relying on it is your strategic choice.
There are all kinds of ways to have a bad opinion. You can form an opinion without sufficient information. You can succumb to pride and defend your opinion even as new information discredits it. Your opinion can be rooted in a bias towards the status quo. There are people out there, today, in the year of our lord Tetsuya Naito two thousand and eighteen, who are of the opinion that the earth is flat. That's a wrong opinion.
Some of these arguments are inherently contradictory. Look at the folks who are saying that 2.0 is bad because Imperial TIE's dodge got halved and there are more undodgeable attacks now AND that it's bad because there's too much randomness in it dodging. There was MORE randomness before, and they were fine with that, though. Or how it's too random because you need to get the first target lock, but also there are ships with unresistable target locks. You can't have both of those opinions. You can have one or the other of each of those pairs, but not both.
I'm not saying I'm right. What I'm saying is that there's a proper dialectical way of approaching these things, and people aren't doing that. They made the claim (whatever it may be--too much RNG, too much reliance on target lock, whatever) and folks have made the counter claim (unavoidable attacks, unresistable target locks, whatever). What's supposed to happen next is that the initial claimant revises their opinion based on that information and then evolves their stance in response. Instead what happens is they double down on their original position and then repeat themselves, only louder, because as I said--anyone disagreeing with you obviously is only disagreeing because they don't understand, and not because they genuinely mean what they're saying.
I mean, it's not like they can both go at the same time, right?
If someone says it's impossible to win in ships 2.0, they're wrong. And lots of people are saying that.
Nic, I do think the frustration level with Ships 2.0 is pretty high. I've gotten used to winning 100% of the time under ships 1.0, and now under 2.0 I've lost a lot. It's taken some getting used to, with tons of frustration, trying to adapt to the new rules of the game. And the uncertainty of what to run, and who to max abilities, and which reinforcements to use, has made my game life difficult. Usually on weekends, I'll refresh fleet arena 3 or more times trying different combinations. I do this because the published stats don't tell the whole story. I need a test drive. But, I have found something that does work pretty good, and allows recovery from bad rng. There is rng that is real bad, that is unrecoverable though that raises its ugly head from time to time. I'm at a stage with good success, but am uncertain where to progress next. Recently, I've raised levels on abilities only to then wish I'd have done it to a different ship or held onto the resources. The investment decisions are huge and a wrong decision can set me back weeks. Couple this with different success rates on different shards, making following someone else's advice risky. What may work for them, may not work for me.
Overall, I like Ships 2.0, but honestly, it's made my gaming harder trying to overcome all the changes. I can sincerely understand others who've made huge investment decisions being left out of ships 2.0 because now it no longer works for them. Few built geonosians, or Phoenix, some of the teams now having success, to name a few. Most pursued Thrawn"s Capital ship, but in Ships 2.0 Tarkin's and Akbar's capital ships are finding success, maybe even more success. But now that I've maxed Thrawn's capital ship, and started to max out Tarkin's ship, say I wanted to switch to Akbar, it would take me 100 days to max him. The biggest obstacle is the amount of investment required to get a ship ready for Arena, just to see if it'll work. Many come here to talk about their failures in fleet, because it just happened, and it's happening everyday, but for them, maybe they know successes can't come for months away if they can just figure out a winning strategy. Some are so frustrated, they honestly believe there isn't a winning strategy, despite your's and other's assertion that we can enjoy success too just like you.
BTW, what are you running in fleets, if I may ask.
Since you guys still don’t understand and apparently can’t goigle or own a dictionary. The definition of an opinion is “a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.”
Therefore an opinion cannot be inherently right or wrong.
If someone wants to debate you on that more power to them. Lol my point was made.
See, above
Bye
I would say bye back, but I don't think you're being sincere. If you want to win the argument, that's OK. I pronounce you the winner. No biggie.
I did win, by defending everyone’s opinion, and characterizing them as such. Something some of you are unwilling to do.
Here's a browny button for you. Good job.
So let me get this straight. We're all talking about 'opinions' here, which can't be right or wrong. And you feel you won? .
No validation required, I would say thanks but I don’t think you were being sincere.
The definition of opinion is not debatable, and for that reason no one’s opinion is right or wrong, it is simply someone’s opinion. My original comment was to imply people should stop trying to change each other’s opinions, and it led to me having to explain what an opinion is to the point I had to give a dictionary description. I feel like I won if you learned today what an opinion actually is because that means I taught someone something and perhaps made the world a slightly better place. And p.s. you will always be my huckleberry.
Fair enough. You gave a good description of your opinion on opinions. Here's my opinion, I skated easy peazy to 1st place, and didn't drop below 16 the past week in an aggressive active shard. So I'm quite happy being a winner and all.
Congratulations, I wish you continued success, I also as previously stated finish first still, for like 2 years now, Glad they made some other pilots useful again, still don’t like the update.
Fair enough. We're winners together, proving anyone can win in Ships 2.0 validating my opinion as being based on solid facts.
Except we didn’t do anything together, you didn’t prove anyone can win and you’re opinion is yours no matter what it’s based on (like the “facts”, or lack thereof), other than that, we’re in total agreement.
I guess I lost haha. Have a good night. Happy Father’s Day.
My starting three are Biggs, Vader, and 5s. I use 5s because he's very fast and his target lock is guaranteed if it hits.
My reserves are Jedi Consular, Poe, Clone Sgt, and use my fourth as a flex that is currently Asohka, but has been basically everything.
My leaderboard is very basic, so it's mostly Thrawn, Vader, Biggs, Imperial TIE, with Boba and Scimitar as their first reserves. So I open up by hitting their Biggs with 5s' special for a guaranteed target lock, that will push their Biggs' TM above their Vader's, so he uses his basic instead of his special and my Biggs will survive. Home One uses its AoE and all ships always attack their Biggs until he's dead. If their Biggs survives until Home One's next turn I'll bring in Jedi Consular and use his special to have him and Vader finish Biggs off. If their Biggs is dead or very low on life, I bring in Poe and either one-shot their TIE or finish off their Biggs with Poe's basic and save the special for the TIE.
From there I'm in a good position and usually go on to win, but the exact moves to get there are fuzzy because the situation is always different.
That's good enough to gain rank, but I'm kind of busy lately so I don't have time for more than a handful of attacks each day
I'm working on the Geonosian trio because they seem really solid, but I'm ready for everything to change once the pve board comes out. I have an idea for a really wicked Resistance fleet, but it needs at least one more Resistance ship, a tank that isn't Biggs, and would be better with a Resistance capital ship, but can get by with Home One. But, for now, it's all just a work on paper.
okay here is my opinion....ships 2.0 made catching up to old players even harder now for new players....challenges are now way more difficult, those who maxed out ships and 3 started all the challenges are gonna have an easier time than those who can't do tier 3 of challenges because of ghost, phantom II, biggs start up...and you have to drop every farming you do to work on one ship that may or may not make a difference and it will take a lot of time
you wouldn't be saying ''I enjoy ships 2.0'' now would you
The forum software is broken because it won't let me like this post more than once.
Thanks for the laugh.