(By the way, does anyone else occasionally see this thread marked as having "new posts" then come in and they're not there? Not like a thread got merged, I know what that looks like. But I keep seeing that the most recent post is by someone named "CantWithAU" and then when I look in the thread there's nothing. Chunt's up with that?)
@CG_SBCrumb why do I need level 85 gear 12 pilots for tier 4 fleet challenges? And can y’all let us know if you are listening as no cog has responded to any post in days.
NicWester, you’re one of the few speaking sense, looking at the overall, whereas most complaints here are mad about not being able to snipe #1 now. I get you people are angry about that, but that seems like more of a you problem, and that you should experiment with different lineups before downright calling this update the worst.
Because you run out of things to farm. The ships people are whining about not having are in Galactic War store. What have folks been doing with all that Galactic War currency for the past forever?
But, again, a lot of these are characters that you really could have and should have been working on all along. Clone Sergeant is fantastic in p2/4 HAAT, Resistance Pilot is fantastic in HAAT and Sith Inquisition, Phoenix are the all-round all-stars that all whiny brats love to hate, Sun Fac had his day in the sun and is still useful in areas. You always need more of everyone for Territory Wars/Battles.
Jump into the Wayback machine and travel to a time when we were learning about this new feature called Tournaments that would drop soon. They said then, and have said since, and have alway had the intent behind all their choices that what they want is to give you a reason to use every character on your roster. Folks act like that's some sort of sinister secret--they straight up say it! They don't want someone who built up Separatists and Clones because they really liked Clone Wars and the new trilogy to have nothing to do with their characters just because some blogs and guides say you should only ever follow their character checklist. There will always be a meta just by the nature of video games, but they have been upfront about wanting to provide things for people who don't care about that meta to do.
So go figure any time they add something that gives folks like us something to do, the metaheads go berserk...
Well not all of us have been playing since the start when maybe there was time to gear a character you wanted too. I started Jan ‘17 so for me I barely had time to gear toons I needed in between the toons required for legendary or hero events as well as the toons required for TB’s. I take first in both arenas and made sure I could participate in both TB’s for my guild. I do have all but one ship 7* however the pilots are a different matter. Which is what my beef is.
So any of these toons whose ships got buffed haven’t been important or relevant for me in my time. With the exception of RP of course but mines at gear 9 because he gets the job done there and I had more pressing projects. But I wouldn’t say he’s fantastic. With so many teams that clear phases or several phases they are fantastic. He is one of the few that has use in several aspects of the game. And single pilots aren’t my real beef here. Phoenix are not all around all stars until maybe the are g12. But with the gear requirements you could gear up almost two other teams. Special mission in TB you can do it with them g8 with a little rng. G9 no problem. They are not a top team in TW. On defense they are a liability on offence they are just okay.
Talking about Sun Facs day in the sun or tournaments means nothing to me. Wasn’t here. Glad they were relevant for you but again doesn’t help a large segment of players. Again you are missing my point. I don’t have a problem with them making every toon relevant somewhere. But needing to gear 2 or 3 toons for 1 ship is the problem. And the one ship with 2 crew people were using they nerfed. Metas roll on and change but former meta teams are still useful in other areas. This nerf took that away from ships. Now you could argue that there are some strong toons that you have a team of First Order or Phoenix you need to get them which is true. But you don’t need them at g12 in order to do so. G8 works just fine. For multi-crew ships they should lower what it takes to max the ship. Fine leave the abilities needing to be maxed and mods needing to be maxed 5*. But make the multi-crew ships easier to use. And no g8 ships do not hold up.
And man come on stop insulting people. We all like the game which is why we are here. Again I’m glad you like the update. Understand though that some people have valid arguments. Just as you have a valid argument that fleet needed a change. As you have pointed out there is more to the game then fleet arena. Here’s my beef and answer me this. How is requiring 3000 carbanti salvage for 4 ships (ghost, phantom, and the UWings) going to allow people to enjoy the rest of the game? And no those toons aren’t that useful in the rest of the game. Okay but there are many better options. And what about gearing characters I like? There is no chance of that because of what CG has decided to be important.
NicWester, you’re one of the few speaking sense, looking at the overall, whereas most complaints here are mad about not being able to snipe #1 now. I get you people are angry about that, but that seems like more of a you problem, and that you should experiment with different lineups before downright calling this update the worst.
First off what is wrong with someone being mad when they were taking first and suddenly not being able to? People are competitive and which every aspect of this game feeds on. You talk about experimenting with different lineups but dropping in under geared pilots wouldn’t show you that. Which means you have to invest in pilots hoping it will pay off. A lot of these newly relevant ships require an obscene amount of gear. Sure a handful of single pilot ships don’t but no one is really complaining about that. Geos need a lot of gear but at the end you have 3 ships not one like the Phoenix ships or Cassians Uwing. Even Bistan’s ship with two pilots is a crazy amount of gear for one ship. Please explain to me how in your mind this is a good idea?
Because you run out of things to farm. The ships people are whining about not having are in Galactic War store. What have folks been doing with all that Galactic War currency for the past forever?
But, again, a lot of these are characters that you really could have and should have been working on all along. Clone Sergeant is fantastic in p2/4 HAAT, Resistance Pilot is fantastic in HAAT and Sith Inquisition, Phoenix are the all-round all-stars that all whiny brats love to hate, Sun Fac had his day in the sun and is still useful in areas. You always need more of everyone for Territory Wars/Battles.
Jump into the Wayback machine and travel to a time when we were learning about this new feature called Tournaments that would drop soon. They said then, and have said since, and have alway had the intent behind all their choices that what they want is to give you a reason to use every character on your roster. Folks act like that's some sort of sinister secret--they straight up say it! They don't want someone who built up Separatists and Clones because they really liked Clone Wars and the new trilogy to have nothing to do with their characters just because some blogs and guides say you should only ever follow their character checklist. There will always be a meta just by the nature of video games, but they have been upfront about wanting to provide things for people who don't care about that meta to do.
So go figure any time they add something that gives folks like us something to do, the metaheads go berserk...
Well not all of us have been playing since the start when maybe there was time to gear a character you wanted too. I started Jan ‘17 so for me I barely had time to gear toons I needed in between the toons required for legendary or hero events as well as the toons required for TB’s. I take first in both arenas and made sure I could participate in both TB’s for my guild. I do have all but one ship 7* however the pilots are a different matter. Which is what my beef is.
So any of these toons whose ships got buffed haven’t been important or relevant for me in my time. With the exception of RP of course but mines at gear 9 because he gets the job done there and I had more pressing projects. But I wouldn’t say he’s fantastic. With so many teams that clear phases or several phases they are fantastic. He is one of the few that has use in several aspects of the game. And single pilots aren’t my real beef here. Phoenix are not all around all stars until maybe the are g12. But with the gear requirements you could gear up almost two other teams. Special mission in TB you can do it with them g8 with a little rng. G9 no problem. They are not a top team in TW. On defense they are a liability on offence they are just okay.
Talking about Sun Facs day in the sun or tournaments means nothing to me. Wasn’t here. Glad they were relevant for you but again doesn’t help a large segment of players. Again you are missing my point. I don’t have a problem with them making every toon relevant somewhere. But needing to gear 2 or 3 toons for 1 ship is the problem. And the one ship with 2 crew people were using they nerfed. Metas roll on and change but former meta teams are still useful in other areas. This nerf took that away from ships. Now you could argue that there are some strong toons that you have a team of First Order or Phoenix you need to get them which is true. But you don’t need them at g12 in order to do so. G8 works just fine. For multi-crew ships they should lower what it takes to max the ship. Fine leave the abilities needing to be maxed and mods needing to be maxed 5*. But make the multi-crew ships easier to use. And no g8 ships do not hold up.
And man come on stop insulting people. We all like the game which is why we are here. Again I’m glad you like the update. Understand though that some people have valid arguments. Just as you have a valid argument that fleet needed a change. As you have pointed out there is more to the game then fleet arena. Here’s my beef and answer me this. How is requiring 3000 carbanti salvage for 4 ships (ghost, phantom, and the UWings) going to allow people to enjoy the rest of the game? And no those toons aren’t that useful in the rest of the game. Okay but there are many better options. And what about gearing characters I like? There is no chance of that because of what CG has decided to be important.
I believe your definition of enjoyment involves having the best stuff. You don’t need to farm that carb anti crap, and you don’t HAVE to farm the best stuff unless you’re competitive. But just cause I’m not competitive and you are, doesn’t mean you’re having more fun. I SUCK at this game. But I run a decently upgraded Nihilus team, and it is a lot of fun because of all those debuffs, and it’s fun to crush people. Even if I lose, I still have fun. (Basic life skill) And yeah I want to be the best, but as a f2p who started last year with little time, it’s unrealistic. My fleet: even worse. They’re just bad, and it was hard to have fun with them before this update because it was all power and no skill. But my point is, CG wants to show you a diverse game, where you have to upgrade all characters to be the best and to be most prepared, but they also along the way show you teams that are more FUN to play with, and if you stop there for enjoyment, that’s where you’ll have the most FUN. So no, the new fleet update is not perfect, it will take time to adapt, and competitive people with all the best stuff may not find it fun, but it’s for the better of the game.
@SG_Tophat why do I need lvl 85 gear 12 pilots to do tier 4 fleets ? Do you even test lower levels as this is the same node that still required 6 ships and had to be patched. So obviously the rest of the content in that node needs some work too.
NicWester, you’re one of the few speaking sense, looking at the overall, whereas most complaints here are mad about not being able to snipe #1 now. I get you people are angry about that, but that seems like more of a you problem, and that you should experiment with different lineups before downright calling this update the worst.
First off what is wrong with someone being mad when they were taking first and suddenly not being able to? People are competitive and which every aspect of this game feeds on. You talk about experimenting with different lineups but dropping in under geared pilots wouldn’t show you that. Which means you have to invest in pilots hoping it will pay off. A lot of these newly relevant ships require an obscene amount of gear. Sure a handful of single pilot ships don’t but no one is really complaining about that. Geos need a lot of gear but at the end you have 3 ships not one like the Phoenix ships or Cassians Uwing. Even Bistan’s ship with two pilots is a crazy amount of gear for one ship. Please explain to me how in your mind this is a good idea?
What’s wrong with your first question is that #1 has no right to say the new update sucks and should be reversed because they lost they’re position. Other people are rising up why? Because they are adapting quicker, are probably more strategic, and have a wider roster. #1 has to fall at some point, CG is giving strategy a chance.
So no, the new fleet update is not perfect, it will take time to adapt, and competitive people with all the best stuff may not find it fun, but it’s for the better of the game.
Let's not confuse the situation here.
The better of YOUR game, does not equate to the better of THE game.
What’s wrong with your first question is that #1 has no right to say the new update sucks and should be reversed because they lost they’re position. Other people are rising up why? Because they are adapting quicker, are probably more strategic, and have a wider roster. #1 has to fall at some point, CG is giving strategy a chance.
This statement could not contain any more utter tosh.
If someone has earned their No 1 spot and now cannot compete for it anymore, then they are justified in being upset at not receiving what they earned.
People are not happy because the mode is reduced, abilities which they worked on and earned have been reduced &, as a result, so has the position they had earned.
More strategic is a complete misnomer.
Wider roster, the same.
This does nothing to encourage a wider roster, whatsoever.
Chimaera is still king, Vader, TFP & Biggs are still in the starting line-up for most.
They've actually had their usable roster reduced, as you used to need 9 Ships + Cap.
Now you need 7 Ships + Cap.
What’s wrong with your first question is that #1 has no right to say the new update sucks and should be reversed because they lost they’re position. Other people are rising up why? Because they are adapting quicker, are probably more strategic, and have a wider roster. #1 has to fall at some point, CG is giving strategy a chance.
People can say how they feel. You telling people to they have no right to say the update sucks eliminates your right to say it doesn’t. I’m not asking for a reversal back to the way it was. What I am saying is people have a legit gripe. The balance of the game is way off because of gearing issues. I understand you don’t have to be first to enjoy the game.
And no people aren’t rising up because they were more strategic. If anyone is thriving in the new environment and were not before is actually the opposite of strategic. Strategic means preparing to succeed in the future. With limited resources gearing up the pilots and ships that now look relevant would be pure luck.
What I find most interesting from those of you saying this is the best update is that you are in know way trying to help people enjoy it. All you are doing is arguing they are wrong. I’m at least trying to show what is angering people and givin options to correct it. I’ve need said go back to the way it was. In fact the day of the update I went from Chimera to Home One. I’ve also been arguing that Chimera is the third best capital ship now. I’ve adapted and I was strategic so all my eggs weren’t in one basket. I am everything you are talking about. And I’m saying these multi-crew ships will prevent anyone from being strategic. So CG just wrecked strategy by not giving the information ahead of time for people to be strategic. This update will hold back f2p way more then any other update or marguee toon ever has. Which is why I’m raising a compliant. I like competition and have no problem loosing. So to have more competition I need people to have a chance. But if you don’t want to help that. Just keep saying everything is perfect.
Well not all of us have been playing since the start when maybe there was time to gear a character you wanted too. I started Jan ‘17 so for me I barely had time to gear toons I needed in between the toons required for legendary or hero events as well as the toons required for TB’s. I take first in both arenas and made sure I could participate in both TB’s for my guild. I do have all but one ship 7* however the pilots are a different matter. Which is what my beef is.
Then let me say it again: Then you are up against people who also started in january 2017 and are in the same situation.
I told you, if you have a pilot at g7 or g8 that's good enough so long as the rest of your kit is up to snuff--give them crummy 5-dot mods, get them to 7*, omega their abilities. If you don't think it's worth the effort, then fine--finish in the top 500 and still get very good rewards. You won't get crystals, but you've been getting a boatload of those for the past couple months and that's allowed you to grow exponentially faster. If you don't think it's worth the investment, then it's time to cede your position to people who do think it's worth the investment.
Would you be this mad if they'd introduced a brand new ship with a brand new pilot that you had to farm both of and gear both of? Something that really shook the existing meta to its core? That would be 50 times the "cash grab" this is. What they've done is reworked several ships that already existed but weren't very good and made them competitive. You already have the ship, you already have the pilot, you might need some more gear, fine, whatever.
The game is about deciding where to allocate your resources. If Arena and Fleet Arena are supposed to be competitive, it doesn't stand to reason that it should be as easy as it is for so many people to rank 1st in both simultaneously. Allocate towards Squad Arena if you want, go with God, I don't care. Allocate towards Fleet Arena if you want, again, be my guest, I don't care. But you were profiting--fairly, I want to be clear, I'm not suggesting that people were exploiting or taking advantage of anything unfairly--you were profiting from a broken game system that didn't work. It was bad. People didn't like it from a gameplay standpoint, and maybe 30 people per leaderboard liked it from a rewards standpoint. There was a clearly-defined, solid meta that didn't change because the system was so broken that nothing could be added to it without breaking it further.
Now we have a system that the people who actually use it seem to enjoy. Creating a starting line-up is finding a combination of ships that can hold on long enough for reinforcements to arrive, while choosing reinforcements is a matter of picking the right effect that can turn things in your favor. ......And waiting for Imperial Assault to come off cooldown because, again, that ability is broken in this system and needs to be rebalanced along with other capital ship ultimates and abilities. It's not a perfect system right now, nothing ever is, but it will never improve if the feedback is "I hate this it sucks because I don't want to farm new stuff to hold the position I onec had." Stop being in denial, metas change--the old meta lasted since when TIE Reaper was added in February of 2017. We've had 15 months of this meta, it needed to be broken for the health of the game and it's never coming back. Focus on the things that actually need to change--rebalance existing capital ships, adding more ships. Learn the new abilities and why TIE Fighter actually kind of sucks and you should stop using it.
As I said. Determine for yourself if it's worth the effort to hold your rank. If not, then cede it to someone who does.
The update is awful.
There are 2 people patting each other on the back here who like it & seem to enjoy telling everyone else that they're wrong for disliking it.
No-one cares about you 2 loving it. Good for you.
We all care about ships being an even bigger POS now, than it was before.
NicWester, you’re one of the few speaking sense, looking at the overall, whereas most complaints here are mad about not being able to snipe #1 now. I get you people are angry about that, but that seems like more of a you problem, and that you should experiment with different lineups before downright calling this update the worst.
First off what is wrong with someone being mad when they were taking first and suddenly not being able to?
Nothing. But griping about it is not legitimate feedback, and those doing the griping seem to think it is.
Saying this or that ship is OP, or that a certain game mechanic isn't working how it should...that's legitimate feedback. Complaining that you can no longer attain #1 or that you don't understand the new mechanics is not legitimate feedback.
What’s wrong with your first question is that #1 has no right to say the new update sucks and should be reversed because they lost they’re position. Other people are rising up why? Because they are adapting quicker, are probably more strategic, and have a wider roster. #1 has to fall at some point, CG is giving strategy a chance.
This statement could not contain any more utter tosh.
If someone has earned their No 1 spot and now cannot compete for it anymore, then they are justified in being upset at not receiving what they earned.
People are not happy because the mode is reduced, abilities which they worked on and earned have been reduced &, as a result, so has the position they had earned.
More strategic is a complete misnomer.
Wider roster, the same.
This does nothing to encourage a wider roster, whatsoever.
Chimaera is still king, Vader, TFP & Biggs are still in the starting line-up for most.
They've actually had their usable roster reduced, as you used to need 9 Ships + Cap.
Now you need 7 Ships + Cap.
Less ships = less roster used.
While I agree with your point, that less ships used does mean that you actually need less of a roster now, not more.
However, calling someone's opinion "utter tosh" is not a good start if you're trying to get a point across?
Nothing. But griping about it is not legitimate feedback, and those doing the griping seem to think it is.
Saying this or that ship is OP, or that a certain game mechanic isn't working how it should...that's legitimate feedback. Complaining that you can no longer attain #1 or that you don't understand the new mechanics is not legitimate feedback.
I agree with your point, criticism should be constructive.
Although, to be fair, people should not have to learn new mechanics for an existing feature which they had already learned the mechanics for, only for a new one where the mechanics are newly introduced.
The devs should not be messing with established items, this is guaranteed to irritate people.
It's like going and buying a product, then buying a load of (necessary) add-ons for it, only for those add-ons to then have their functionality changed after you bought them.
It is not legally allowed, there are laws against this sort of situation for any retailer.
The ship rework for the ship challenges: Capital Ship Upgrades seem to have increase in difficulty for newer players. Usually I would have a turn to call in a ship in for reinforcement with the 5v5 but now with 3v3 it looks like the enemy capital ship has most of its abilities or stats maxed. I just don't see how to upgrade capital ship as a newer player besides waiting to buy the shards from the store. Is this intended because I really think it was manageable before the rework.
@CG_SBCrumb why do I need level 85 gear 12 pilots for tier 4 fleet challenges? And can y’all let us know if you are listening as no cog has responded to any post in days.
@SG_Tophat why do I need lvl 85 gear 12 pilots to do tier 4 fleets ? Do you even test lower levels as this is the same node that still required 6 ships and had to be patched. So obviously the rest of the content in that node needs some work too.
This has to be addressed.
The ship challenges were definitely designed for 5v5.
With the awful 3v3 mode they're way to hard.
I know those of you already having everything don't care, especially the 5% that like ships 2.0.
But newer players got a slap into the face.
That's not at a way to keep people interested in fleet battles and this used to be my favorite part of the game.
Well not all of us have been playing since the start when maybe there was time to gear a character you wanted too. I started Jan ‘17 so for me I barely had time to gear toons I needed in between the toons required for legendary or hero events as well as the toons required for TB’s. I take first in both arenas and made sure I could participate in both TB’s for my guild. I do have all but one ship 7* however the pilots are a different matter. Which is what my beef is.
Then let me say it again: Then you are up against people who also started in january 2017 and are in the same situation.
I told you, if you have a pilot at g7 or g8 that's good enough so long as the rest of your kit is up to snuff--give them crummy 5-dot mods, get them to 7*, omega their abilities. If you don't think it's worth the effort, then fine--finish in the top 500 and still get very good rewards. You won't get crystals, but you've been getting a boatload of those for the past couple months and that's allowed you to grow exponentially faster. If you don't think it's worth the investment, then it's time to cede your position to people who do think it's worth the investment.
Would you be this mad if they'd introduced a brand new ship with a brand new pilot that you had to farm both of and gear both of? Something that really shook the existing meta to its core? That would be 50 times the "cash grab" this is. What they've done is reworked several ships that already existed but weren't very good and made them competitive. You already have the ship, you already have the pilot, you might need some more gear, fine, whatever.
The game is about deciding where to allocate your resources. If Arena and Fleet Arena are supposed to be competitive, it doesn't stand to reason that it should be as easy as it is for so many people to rank 1st in both simultaneously. Allocate towards Squad Arena if you want, go with God, I don't care. Allocate towards Fleet Arena if you want, again, be my guest, I don't care. But you were profiting--fairly, I want to be clear, I'm not suggesting that people were exploiting or taking advantage of anything unfairly--you were profiting from a broken game system that didn't work. It was bad. People didn't like it from a gameplay standpoint, and maybe 30 people per leaderboard liked it from a rewards standpoint. There was a clearly-defined, solid meta that didn't change because the system was so broken that nothing could be added to it without breaking it further.
Now we have a system that the people who actually use it seem to enjoy. Creating a starting line-up is finding a combination of ships that can hold on long enough for reinforcements to arrive, while choosing reinforcements is a matter of picking the right effect that can turn things in your favor. ......And waiting for Imperial Assault to come off cooldown because, again, that ability is broken in this system and needs to be rebalanced along with other capital ship ultimates and abilities. It's not a perfect system right now, nothing ever is, but it will never improve if the feedback is "I hate this it sucks because I don't want to farm new stuff to hold the position I onec had." Stop being in denial, metas change--the old meta lasted since when TIE Reaper was added in February of 2017. We've had 15 months of this meta, it needed to be broken for the health of the game and it's never coming back. Focus on the things that actually need to change--rebalance existing capital ships, adding more ships. Learn the new abilities and why TIE Fighter actually kind of sucks and you should stop using it.
As I said. Determine for yourself if it's worth the effort to hold your rank. If not, then cede it to someone who does.
Let's not use all caps, please. - EA_Cian
Seriously man you aren’t reading anything I’m saying. I’ve never said that I am entitled to 1st. I don’t have a problem with them buffing a bunch of ships or even bringing damage down across the board. My main issue is requiring 3 geared pilots for one ship. And no g8 pilots in 7* ships don’t hold up well at all. I have a fleet that’s working. There are a bunch in my fleet arena that are struggling. They are trying new setups but g8 pilots don’t hold up. Again I’m not complaining about holding 1st because I am. I’ve adapted. But to really enjoy this new content they have gone overboard with the requirements for some ships. What I am trying to get through to you is that these gear requirements are daunting and will not increase participation while driving others away. Your precious update that you love is going to make it worse not better. I want to make it better so I am trying to bring up areas people are struggling with or driving them away.
As far as CG introducing new toons that shake the current meta to its core. Well that happens all the time. I get there are cash grabs and congrats to everyone who goes for those toons. But when they do that they don’t NERF the current meta. When CLS came out they didn’t need anyone. When JTR came out they didn’t nerf CLS. When Palp was reworked they didn’t need JTR. Tons of examples of adding and not taking away. Here they nerfed some of the strong ships and buffed a bunch of non used ships. So to gear up the Phoenix ships and UWings I have to gear 11 toons to use 4 ships. So nothing gradual here. Harder to work on because they just made a bunch of your current ships weaker. So therefore much bigger cash grab that has blown any other cash grab CG has done. They stripped peoples hard work and the ships they have to use until they can gear different ships. They don’t do that in arena. You can use the old meta team until you have the new one geared.
Man those of you who love fleet 2.0 think every critique is saying they hate the new system so you go off on them. Let me spell it out for you. I LIKE the new system but it has a serious flaw that will prevent it from taking hold. I don’t have a problem farming new characters. I enjoy having more teams to use in the game. But that’s like saying it is okay in squad arena that one toon who is awesome only needs a certain amount of gear but this other toon who is awesome needs 3x the gear. How is that going to get people to start using that toon effectively??
The funny thing is you have more complaints about the rework then I do. I think the ultimates for Executrix, Chimera and Home One are balanced and just fine. None of them will change the outcome of the battle if your opponent has 4 or 5 ships. Endurance I’m not sure on as I haven’t had a chance to use it much. I don’t have Mace geared. More ships would be good. Especially if they are single pilot ships. Then people could actually be able to use them effectively. As for ITF maybe you should read the abilities better. It’s not the standout it was before the update but it’s still a good ship. Just have to use the right team and mechanics with it. For all those saying Biggs should be nerfed. He’s just the Rex of fleet. Will be good in just about every meta. No problem with that.
CG’s biggest mistake in this update was not adjust how ships become maxed. Since they completely redid it. They should have only required one pilots gear to affect the stats of the ship. This will deter as many or more people from spending time in fleet. My SUGGESTION to allow people to actually use a bunch of the new ships is to have one pilots gear affect ship stats. Since these ships have extra abilities then they can have those abilities tied to it as they do now. That way people can use a complete ship minus a few abilities. This would be an effective way to get people in fleet arena and able to test out these new ships to see if they should go all in. Not your way of trying out ineffective ships so people get discouraged or spending a whole bunch of gear to realize it may not be that good.
So you live fleet 2.0. Why don’t you try to help it succeed. People here are frustrated and rightly so. Nerfing of any type way after a toon or ship is released is always going to cause complaints. And don’t use everyone is in the same boat because they aren’t. Those who didn’t invest in ships before were able to use those resources elsewhere to strengthen themselves can now come into fleet and just build the current good ships. Those who participated in fleet before just had their investments hit Black Friday and they watched their assessts shrink. Find a solution to help those that have an issue become happy. I presented one about multi-crew ships. I think that alone would help people be able to take part in the new ships. Maybe giving a bunch of resources to people based on what they have invested in fleet already. That way it’s scaled and fair. What are your thoughts to help people adjust to fleet 2.0?
NicWester, you’re one of the few speaking sense, looking at the overall, whereas most complaints here are mad about not being able to snipe #1 now. I get you people are angry about that, but that seems like more of a you problem, and that you should experiment with different lineups before downright calling this update the worst.
First off what is wrong with someone being mad when they were taking first and suddenly not being able to?
Nothing. But griping about it is not legitimate feedback, and those doing the griping seem to think it is.
Saying this or that ship is OP, or that a certain game mechanic isn't working how it should...that's legitimate feedback. Complaining that you can no longer attain #1 or that you don't understand the new mechanics is not legitimate feedback.
Now that statement I can agree with. But coming back and telling people that’s your problem is also not legitimate feedback and does nothing to further the conversation. I get it some people love this update and some people don’t. But telling people there feelings are wrong is pointless and makes you no different then them. Instead of telling people they are wrong ask them what issue they have a problem with. And no I can’t get 1st is not answering that question. Why can’t you get first? What are you struggling with? Maybe some little adjustments can be suggested that would make most people happy. Now that’s a win. That’s getting somewhere.
How is this even true? Ships 1.0, everyone ran the same squad. Say what you want about the update, ship arena being less diverse now simply isn’t true.
How is this even true? Ships 1.0, everyone ran the same squad. Say what you want about the update, ship arena being less diverse now simply isn’t true.
I dont know about that, i have seen pretty much the same squads: biggs with 2 ties. There is some diversity with their reinforcements but that is pretty much it
What used to be a fun thing to do has turned into something that's a train wreck. You completely messed up what was a good thing. People who didn't like ships before really hate it now, and those like myself who absolutely LOVED ships and dedicated a lot of time into maxing every ship and pilot had driven us away. 95% of the community hates it now, and have personally known over a dozen who have quit because of them.
You really dropped the ball on this. Instead of improving the ships or anything else we've asked for, you've completely ruined them.
It was already RNG dependant before, but now with only 3 starting ships it's more so, and you have the AI set to ignorant levels. TFP got a dodge nerf? I haven't noticed theirs being nerfed while mine is hit by every ship in the game with ease. I've lost twice already today due to a TFP on 2 separate teams dodging 4+ attacks when it was alone, speeding their capital ship up and costing me the battle. The only ship I've had that consistently has hit it is Vader's. Bringing Poe out is a moot point when I can't get to TFP, which is fine, but when I'm able to he can't be hit.
Were you all on drugs when you redesigned these ships? Instead of adding variety by adding more ships, you completely **** up the entire system by adding a slew of stuff that should've been brought in waves. Instead, you do everything at once and completely screw over all the ones who have maintained a top rank for over a year just to let some half **** people who don't care be able to climb.
I lost a battle to a fleet from some guy I've never seen with 110k less power because of not being able to hit his TFP one time. Had Biggs knocked out in the first salvo and then worked on his Vader and Boba after he was called in, only to miss his TFP with every single attack I made.
Either you need to fix what YOU messed up or you'll lose a lot more players than you already have.
It's no wonder Marvel Strike Force is taking off, it doesn't seem to want to screw players who have been here since day 1. You're catering to people who don't give a **** and that's where you're messing up.
I've only been playing for about 3 months, but ships are no fun at all for me. I can't get through any ship battles because my ships are too weak now, but I can't get them stronger because I can't win anymore.
Nothing. But griping about it is not legitimate feedback, and those doing the griping seem to think it is.
Saying this or that ship is OP, or that a certain game mechanic isn't working how it should...that's legitimate feedback. Complaining that you can no longer attain #1 or that you don't understand the new mechanics is not legitimate feedback.
I agree with your point, criticism should be constructive.
Although, to be fair, people should not have to learn new mechanics for an existing feature which they had already learned the mechanics for, only for a new one where the mechanics are newly introduced.
The devs should not be messing with established items, this is guaranteed to irritate people.
It's like going and buying a product, then buying a load of (necessary) add-ons for it, only for those add-ons to then have their functionality changed after you bought them.
It is not legally allowed, there are laws against this sort of situation for any retailer.
First of all, what? I’m pretty sure the devs know the law... also, if I get a new TV, I have to relearn the TV’s mechanics...
Second, Nomad. I don’t understand your point about gear. Do you just not think people should put in the work to get there? Do you think every ship should have one pilot with similar gear? I feel like that’s what makes characters and ships different. And I know you assume that because I’m defending certain aspects of the new update means I love it, but I don’t. I’m not strategic enough to be good, but I’m working on it, and honestly, I’m winning more battles now because of how I play my reinforcements compared to the AI. But I still suck, I don’t like having three ships. Yet I agree that this update is for the better of the game, and well I’m trying to give constructive criticism, it’s hard to see where you are coming from. I don’t hate you, I just want to work with you.
Google search swgoh nicwester and look at his ships. Of course he is happy. He also would not be in a top 50 guild. He is rocking a 6* tie reaper. No disrespect but you are not in a high level top end shard with whales and what not to even be commenting on this level. I am sure you are enjoying it with a g12 poe. But for people who prioritize free crystals in the top end Poe was never a priority. Nor was bistan. Do uber whales have them sure. Did most people who want Traya almost free, probably not.
So Nic man let us determine how we feel and let us have our place to vent.
First of all, what? I’m pretty sure the devs know the law... also, if I get a new TV, I have to relearn the TV’s mechanics...
There's a difference between legal and ethical and I don't think your example works. This isn't similar to having one TV and then buying another. Using your paradigm, an example would be if you bought a TV and then 6 months later the manufacturer pushes a firmware update that disables the channel up button. You complain but they say you can still accomplish your goal, just use the channel down button and rotate all the way through the channels. Or, they would be happy to re-enable the channel up button if you want to pay extra.
I don't honestly know whether nerfing content that people have paid for is legal or not. There may be strong potential for a class action case if a lawyer wanted to take it on but I think that's really beside the point. Most people would view this type of action as unethical regardless of whether it is legal or not.
There's a big difference between introducing a new meta (and not degrading existing characters) and forcefully changing stats to degrade existing content. If the intent was truly to "rebalance" then you can accomplish that goal by boosting less valuable ships, you don't have to neuter good ones.
Replies
Well not all of us have been playing since the start when maybe there was time to gear a character you wanted too. I started Jan ‘17 so for me I barely had time to gear toons I needed in between the toons required for legendary or hero events as well as the toons required for TB’s. I take first in both arenas and made sure I could participate in both TB’s for my guild. I do have all but one ship 7* however the pilots are a different matter. Which is what my beef is.
So any of these toons whose ships got buffed haven’t been important or relevant for me in my time. With the exception of RP of course but mines at gear 9 because he gets the job done there and I had more pressing projects. But I wouldn’t say he’s fantastic. With so many teams that clear phases or several phases they are fantastic. He is one of the few that has use in several aspects of the game. And single pilots aren’t my real beef here. Phoenix are not all around all stars until maybe the are g12. But with the gear requirements you could gear up almost two other teams. Special mission in TB you can do it with them g8 with a little rng. G9 no problem. They are not a top team in TW. On defense they are a liability on offence they are just okay.
Talking about Sun Facs day in the sun or tournaments means nothing to me. Wasn’t here. Glad they were relevant for you but again doesn’t help a large segment of players. Again you are missing my point. I don’t have a problem with them making every toon relevant somewhere. But needing to gear 2 or 3 toons for 1 ship is the problem. And the one ship with 2 crew people were using they nerfed. Metas roll on and change but former meta teams are still useful in other areas. This nerf took that away from ships. Now you could argue that there are some strong toons that you have a team of First Order or Phoenix you need to get them which is true. But you don’t need them at g12 in order to do so. G8 works just fine. For multi-crew ships they should lower what it takes to max the ship. Fine leave the abilities needing to be maxed and mods needing to be maxed 5*. But make the multi-crew ships easier to use. And no g8 ships do not hold up.
And man come on stop insulting people. We all like the game which is why we are here. Again I’m glad you like the update. Understand though that some people have valid arguments. Just as you have a valid argument that fleet needed a change. As you have pointed out there is more to the game then fleet arena. Here’s my beef and answer me this. How is requiring 3000 carbanti salvage for 4 ships (ghost, phantom, and the UWings) going to allow people to enjoy the rest of the game? And no those toons aren’t that useful in the rest of the game. Okay but there are many better options. And what about gearing characters I like? There is no chance of that because of what CG has decided to be important.
First off what is wrong with someone being mad when they were taking first and suddenly not being able to? People are competitive and which every aspect of this game feeds on. You talk about experimenting with different lineups but dropping in under geared pilots wouldn’t show you that. Which means you have to invest in pilots hoping it will pay off. A lot of these newly relevant ships require an obscene amount of gear. Sure a handful of single pilot ships don’t but no one is really complaining about that. Geos need a lot of gear but at the end you have 3 ships not one like the Phoenix ships or Cassians Uwing. Even Bistan’s ship with two pilots is a crazy amount of gear for one ship. Please explain to me how in your mind this is a good idea?
I believe your definition of enjoyment involves having the best stuff. You don’t need to farm that carb anti crap, and you don’t HAVE to farm the best stuff unless you’re competitive. But just cause I’m not competitive and you are, doesn’t mean you’re having more fun. I SUCK at this game. But I run a decently upgraded Nihilus team, and it is a lot of fun because of all those debuffs, and it’s fun to crush people. Even if I lose, I still have fun. (Basic life skill) And yeah I want to be the best, but as a f2p who started last year with little time, it’s unrealistic. My fleet: even worse. They’re just bad, and it was hard to have fun with them before this update because it was all power and no skill. But my point is, CG wants to show you a diverse game, where you have to upgrade all characters to be the best and to be most prepared, but they also along the way show you teams that are more FUN to play with, and if you stop there for enjoyment, that’s where you’ll have the most FUN. So no, the new fleet update is not perfect, it will take time to adapt, and competitive people with all the best stuff may not find it fun, but it’s for the better of the game.
What’s wrong with your first question is that #1 has no right to say the new update sucks and should be reversed because they lost they’re position. Other people are rising up why? Because they are adapting quicker, are probably more strategic, and have a wider roster. #1 has to fall at some point, CG is giving strategy a chance.
The better of YOUR game, does not equate to the better of THE game.
If someone has earned their No 1 spot and now cannot compete for it anymore, then they are justified in being upset at not receiving what they earned.
People are not happy because the mode is reduced, abilities which they worked on and earned have been reduced &, as a result, so has the position they had earned.
More strategic is a complete misnomer.
Wider roster, the same.
This does nothing to encourage a wider roster, whatsoever.
Chimaera is still king, Vader, TFP & Biggs are still in the starting line-up for most.
They've actually had their usable roster reduced, as you used to need 9 Ships + Cap.
Now you need 7 Ships + Cap.
Less ships = less roster used.
People can say how they feel. You telling people to they have no right to say the update sucks eliminates your right to say it doesn’t. I’m not asking for a reversal back to the way it was. What I am saying is people have a legit gripe. The balance of the game is way off because of gearing issues. I understand you don’t have to be first to enjoy the game.
And no people aren’t rising up because they were more strategic. If anyone is thriving in the new environment and were not before is actually the opposite of strategic. Strategic means preparing to succeed in the future. With limited resources gearing up the pilots and ships that now look relevant would be pure luck.
What I find most interesting from those of you saying this is the best update is that you are in know way trying to help people enjoy it. All you are doing is arguing they are wrong. I’m at least trying to show what is angering people and givin options to correct it. I’ve need said go back to the way it was. In fact the day of the update I went from Chimera to Home One. I’ve also been arguing that Chimera is the third best capital ship now. I’ve adapted and I was strategic so all my eggs weren’t in one basket. I am everything you are talking about. And I’m saying these multi-crew ships will prevent anyone from being strategic. So CG just wrecked strategy by not giving the information ahead of time for people to be strategic. This update will hold back f2p way more then any other update or marguee toon ever has. Which is why I’m raising a compliant. I like competition and have no problem loosing. So to have more competition I need people to have a chance. But if you don’t want to help that. Just keep saying everything is perfect.
I told you, if you have a pilot at g7 or g8 that's good enough so long as the rest of your kit is up to snuff--give them crummy 5-dot mods, get them to 7*, omega their abilities. If you don't think it's worth the effort, then fine--finish in the top 500 and still get very good rewards. You won't get crystals, but you've been getting a boatload of those for the past couple months and that's allowed you to grow exponentially faster. If you don't think it's worth the investment, then it's time to cede your position to people who do think it's worth the investment.
Would you be this mad if they'd introduced a brand new ship with a brand new pilot that you had to farm both of and gear both of? Something that really shook the existing meta to its core? That would be 50 times the "cash grab" this is. What they've done is reworked several ships that already existed but weren't very good and made them competitive. You already have the ship, you already have the pilot, you might need some more gear, fine, whatever.
The game is about deciding where to allocate your resources. If Arena and Fleet Arena are supposed to be competitive, it doesn't stand to reason that it should be as easy as it is for so many people to rank 1st in both simultaneously. Allocate towards Squad Arena if you want, go with God, I don't care. Allocate towards Fleet Arena if you want, again, be my guest, I don't care. But you were profiting--fairly, I want to be clear, I'm not suggesting that people were exploiting or taking advantage of anything unfairly--you were profiting from a broken game system that didn't work. It was bad. People didn't like it from a gameplay standpoint, and maybe 30 people per leaderboard liked it from a rewards standpoint. There was a clearly-defined, solid meta that didn't change because the system was so broken that nothing could be added to it without breaking it further.
Now we have a system that the people who actually use it seem to enjoy. Creating a starting line-up is finding a combination of ships that can hold on long enough for reinforcements to arrive, while choosing reinforcements is a matter of picking the right effect that can turn things in your favor. ......And waiting for Imperial Assault to come off cooldown because, again, that ability is broken in this system and needs to be rebalanced along with other capital ship ultimates and abilities. It's not a perfect system right now, nothing ever is, but it will never improve if the feedback is "I hate this it sucks because I don't want to farm new stuff to hold the position I onec had." Stop being in denial, metas change--the old meta lasted since when TIE Reaper was added in February of 2017. We've had 15 months of this meta, it needed to be broken for the health of the game and it's never coming back. Focus on the things that actually need to change--rebalance existing capital ships, adding more ships. Learn the new abilities and why TIE Fighter actually kind of sucks and you should stop using it.
As I said. Determine for yourself if it's worth the effort to hold your rank. If not, then cede it to someone who does.
Let's not use all caps, please. - EA_Cian
There are 2 people patting each other on the back here who like it & seem to enjoy telling everyone else that they're wrong for disliking it.
No-one cares about you 2 loving it. Good for you.
We all care about ships being an even bigger POS now, than it was before.
Nothing. But griping about it is not legitimate feedback, and those doing the griping seem to think it is.
Saying this or that ship is OP, or that a certain game mechanic isn't working how it should...that's legitimate feedback. Complaining that you can no longer attain #1 or that you don't understand the new mechanics is not legitimate feedback.
However, calling someone's opinion "utter tosh" is not a good start if you're trying to get a point across?
Although, to be fair, people should not have to learn new mechanics for an existing feature which they had already learned the mechanics for, only for a new one where the mechanics are newly introduced.
The devs should not be messing with established items, this is guaranteed to irritate people.
It's like going and buying a product, then buying a load of (necessary) add-ons for it, only for those add-ons to then have their functionality changed after you bought them.
It is not legally allowed, there are laws against this sort of situation for any retailer.
This has to be addressed.
The ship challenges were definitely designed for 5v5.
With the awful 3v3 mode they're way to hard.
I know those of you already having everything don't care, especially the 5% that like ships 2.0.
But newer players got a slap into the face.
That's not at a way to keep people interested in fleet battles and this used to be my favorite part of the game.
Seriously man you aren’t reading anything I’m saying. I’ve never said that I am entitled to 1st. I don’t have a problem with them buffing a bunch of ships or even bringing damage down across the board. My main issue is requiring 3 geared pilots for one ship. And no g8 pilots in 7* ships don’t hold up well at all. I have a fleet that’s working. There are a bunch in my fleet arena that are struggling. They are trying new setups but g8 pilots don’t hold up. Again I’m not complaining about holding 1st because I am. I’ve adapted. But to really enjoy this new content they have gone overboard with the requirements for some ships. What I am trying to get through to you is that these gear requirements are daunting and will not increase participation while driving others away. Your precious update that you love is going to make it worse not better. I want to make it better so I am trying to bring up areas people are struggling with or driving them away.
As far as CG introducing new toons that shake the current meta to its core. Well that happens all the time. I get there are cash grabs and congrats to everyone who goes for those toons. But when they do that they don’t NERF the current meta. When CLS came out they didn’t need anyone. When JTR came out they didn’t nerf CLS. When Palp was reworked they didn’t need JTR. Tons of examples of adding and not taking away. Here they nerfed some of the strong ships and buffed a bunch of non used ships. So to gear up the Phoenix ships and UWings I have to gear 11 toons to use 4 ships. So nothing gradual here. Harder to work on because they just made a bunch of your current ships weaker. So therefore much bigger cash grab that has blown any other cash grab CG has done. They stripped peoples hard work and the ships they have to use until they can gear different ships. They don’t do that in arena. You can use the old meta team until you have the new one geared.
Man those of you who love fleet 2.0 think every critique is saying they hate the new system so you go off on them. Let me spell it out for you. I LIKE the new system but it has a serious flaw that will prevent it from taking hold. I don’t have a problem farming new characters. I enjoy having more teams to use in the game. But that’s like saying it is okay in squad arena that one toon who is awesome only needs a certain amount of gear but this other toon who is awesome needs 3x the gear. How is that going to get people to start using that toon effectively??
The funny thing is you have more complaints about the rework then I do. I think the ultimates for Executrix, Chimera and Home One are balanced and just fine. None of them will change the outcome of the battle if your opponent has 4 or 5 ships. Endurance I’m not sure on as I haven’t had a chance to use it much. I don’t have Mace geared. More ships would be good. Especially if they are single pilot ships. Then people could actually be able to use them effectively. As for ITF maybe you should read the abilities better. It’s not the standout it was before the update but it’s still a good ship. Just have to use the right team and mechanics with it. For all those saying Biggs should be nerfed. He’s just the Rex of fleet. Will be good in just about every meta. No problem with that.
CG’s biggest mistake in this update was not adjust how ships become maxed. Since they completely redid it. They should have only required one pilots gear to affect the stats of the ship. This will deter as many or more people from spending time in fleet. My SUGGESTION to allow people to actually use a bunch of the new ships is to have one pilots gear affect ship stats. Since these ships have extra abilities then they can have those abilities tied to it as they do now. That way people can use a complete ship minus a few abilities. This would be an effective way to get people in fleet arena and able to test out these new ships to see if they should go all in. Not your way of trying out ineffective ships so people get discouraged or spending a whole bunch of gear to realize it may not be that good.
So you live fleet 2.0. Why don’t you try to help it succeed. People here are frustrated and rightly so. Nerfing of any type way after a toon or ship is released is always going to cause complaints. And don’t use everyone is in the same boat because they aren’t. Those who didn’t invest in ships before were able to use those resources elsewhere to strengthen themselves can now come into fleet and just build the current good ships. Those who participated in fleet before just had their investments hit Black Friday and they watched their assessts shrink. Find a solution to help those that have an issue become happy. I presented one about multi-crew ships. I think that alone would help people be able to take part in the new ships. Maybe giving a bunch of resources to people based on what they have invested in fleet already. That way it’s scaled and fair. What are your thoughts to help people adjust to fleet 2.0?
Now that statement I can agree with. But coming back and telling people that’s your problem is also not legitimate feedback and does nothing to further the conversation. I get it some people love this update and some people don’t. But telling people there feelings are wrong is pointless and makes you no different then them. Instead of telling people they are wrong ask them what issue they have a problem with. And no I can’t get 1st is not answering that question. Why can’t you get first? What are you struggling with? Maybe some little adjustments can be suggested that would make most people happy. Now that’s a win. That’s getting somewhere.
How is this even true? Ships 1.0, everyone ran the same squad. Say what you want about the update, ship arena being less diverse now simply isn’t true.
I dont know about that, i have seen pretty much the same squads: biggs with 2 ties. There is some diversity with their reinforcements but that is pretty much it
You really dropped the ball on this. Instead of improving the ships or anything else we've asked for, you've completely ruined them.
It was already RNG dependant before, but now with only 3 starting ships it's more so, and you have the AI set to ignorant levels. TFP got a dodge nerf? I haven't noticed theirs being nerfed while mine is hit by every ship in the game with ease. I've lost twice already today due to a TFP on 2 separate teams dodging 4+ attacks when it was alone, speeding their capital ship up and costing me the battle. The only ship I've had that consistently has hit it is Vader's. Bringing Poe out is a moot point when I can't get to TFP, which is fine, but when I'm able to he can't be hit.
Were you all on drugs when you redesigned these ships? Instead of adding variety by adding more ships, you completely **** up the entire system by adding a slew of stuff that should've been brought in waves. Instead, you do everything at once and completely screw over all the ones who have maintained a top rank for over a year just to let some half **** people who don't care be able to climb.
I lost a battle to a fleet from some guy I've never seen with 110k less power because of not being able to hit his TFP one time. Had Biggs knocked out in the first salvo and then worked on his Vader and Boba after he was called in, only to miss his TFP with every single attack I made.
Either you need to fix what YOU messed up or you'll lose a lot more players than you already have.
It's no wonder Marvel Strike Force is taking off, it doesn't seem to want to screw players who have been here since day 1. You're catering to people who don't give a **** and that's where you're messing up.
Keep it up and there won't be a swgoh to play.
First of all, what? I’m pretty sure the devs know the law... also, if I get a new TV, I have to relearn the TV’s mechanics...
Second, Nomad. I don’t understand your point about gear. Do you just not think people should put in the work to get there? Do you think every ship should have one pilot with similar gear? I feel like that’s what makes characters and ships different. And I know you assume that because I’m defending certain aspects of the new update means I love it, but I don’t. I’m not strategic enough to be good, but I’m working on it, and honestly, I’m winning more battles now because of how I play my reinforcements compared to the AI. But I still suck, I don’t like having three ships. Yet I agree that this update is for the better of the game, and well I’m trying to give constructive criticism, it’s hard to see where you are coming from. I don’t hate you, I just want to work with you.
So Nic man let us determine how we feel and let us have our place to vent.
Thanks.
There's a difference between legal and ethical and I don't think your example works. This isn't similar to having one TV and then buying another. Using your paradigm, an example would be if you bought a TV and then 6 months later the manufacturer pushes a firmware update that disables the channel up button. You complain but they say you can still accomplish your goal, just use the channel down button and rotate all the way through the channels. Or, they would be happy to re-enable the channel up button if you want to pay extra.
I don't honestly know whether nerfing content that people have paid for is legal or not. There may be strong potential for a class action case if a lawyer wanted to take it on but I think that's really beside the point. Most people would view this type of action as unethical regardless of whether it is legal or not.
There's a big difference between introducing a new meta (and not degrading existing characters) and forcefully changing stats to degrade existing content. If the intent was truly to "rebalance" then you can accomplish that goal by boosting less valuable ships, you don't have to neuter good ones.