Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
I am pretty sure that you WANT to stay competitive, and there is a wide range to what that means, which effects the timeline in which a player will personally define as "ok" to stay at the desired level.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
Pretty sure most would say it’s a NEED, based off the crystals and resources they get from it.
And yes, the gear crunch should be addressed, but not by making all new characters need an extensive amount of a new gear peace.
New shiny and powerful characters costing more is not surprising.
Also, I would guess that as part of the plan to phase out older materials, there is going to be a shift to newer ones. But that's just a guess.
Yes, because it is the same as everything CG does in this game; to make money.
And about the newer gear materials, how did they help the crunch? Adding extensive amounts of Kyros to new toons doesn’t exactly fix it.
Funny part is, I have absolutely been having an easier time getting stun guns since then, and without farming them. I generally have enough but am also running low on the kyros, but they feel like they have a more natural income, but I also farm them.
I dont find the number added to be excessive, but as many players seem to think, their WANTing of the new LV has them focused on the required toons that need a number of them.
Glad to see you have no issue. But you are just one person. I doubt this thread would be a reality if we all thought that there was no issue with the gear crunch, and CG’s attempt to fix it.
And you’ve said it yourself; as long as you have the current meta, you should be fine. So is it really a “want” when you need the new meta to succeed in most parts of this game. As @Ravens1113 has already said a little over an hour ago in a response to you, with the new changes and nerfs being added that will make it much harder to beat GLs with non-GL counters, players NEED to get GLs if they want to continue to be competitive in the game.
I've found this whole experience to be very enlightening.
Thank you for evaluating. Your feedback is appreciated.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
So.......unless your argument is no amount of change will be wholly acceptable to the entire community and therefore there should be no changes implemented bc we're lazy and greedy for wanting something other similar games have already implemented or would have implemented years ago.....I don't really get where you're going with that.
In this thread we've seen ppl very eloquently describe easing the gear bottleneck from g8/g9 to g12, to g11, and the response is to imply the community just wants GL handouts and no fix could ever be satisfactory enough. Starting a sentence with a perfectly reasonable statement, then adding on the but, completely wipes out the first part of that sentence. No one here is saying you should get r7 immediately on a fresh account. But that statement implies these +6 mil accounts are demanding something extreme after years of loyalty and in many cases decent/large sums of $$$.
Personally, I think CG's decision has been made to do nothing about the gear crunch. My evidence is quite strong. It is ALL those packs in the store featuring the gear that they keep a chokehold on and making me look at obnoxious pop up ads of everyday. With GLs becoming the new meta, they've moved the business model from crystals for character tokens to gear packs and crystal packs to be spent on gear. It's probably more profitable. But it also means they can't ease the gear crunch because if they do that, they'll start to lose money. They've created their own problem.
You mentioned that we don't NEED to stay competitive. Interesting take in a game with so much pvp content. The game even seeks to turn you against your own guild in a bid for top spots in raids. A word of advice. If you keep making that statement, eventually someone (like me, maybe) is going to turn around and point out that we don't even NEED to play the game. CG needs us to continue playing. To continue paying. Every single player, f2p or kraken, could all drop the game tomorrow and CG would be the ones suffering because of it. We'd all be fine. The way CG has been treating us recently, maybe they need a reminder of that.
I'm glad you could twist a good old dev bash in there. That is always helpful to the conversation.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
There is always a section of players that want something for nothing in every mobile game.
That's not this discussion.
Frankly, to equate that with the honest discussion of dealing with this Gear Crunch self-imposed by CG is just trying to distract the discussion at best and disingenuous at worst and not helping this discussion to progress.
Let's get back to addressing the real concerns of the choke points that affect every player, from new to day-one players...
Ok, but at no point am I talking about anything for free. There has been and always will be a pace, this will not change, and that is part of this issue, for new and day one players. Realizing that and working within it as many players are doing is the best way to deal with it. If you have a solid plan and find your happy place, then anything they add or change will only serve to make you happier.
I am being honest, and disregarding this point, is just going to make players less happy, as no change will ever be "enough", if "you" dont realize this.
This is what I was saying, and I didnt read the rest of your post. I will try to circle back around to the rest, but I'm guessing it's as constructive as the first part....
So your argument is that we're greedy and want something for nothing. No wonder you didn't read the rest of my post. I'm sorry that RNG doesn't give me amazing raid rewards like it does for you. I'm sorry you've decided us struggling is due to our incompetence (despite you knowing nothing about our situations) and not CG putting bad rewards into loot boxes at such a high frequency that it hinders our progression. But you should realize you sound terribly, terribly out of touch and blaming us for CG's bottlenecks that THEY created just reinforces the us vs them mentality. It's one you're wholeheartedly embracing in this thread.
Just because it's the way things are doesn't mean it's the way they should be. That they shouldn't make it easier. You keep saying you're both in favor of them making it easier and yet defending them not doing so. Don't be Schrodinger's Mod. They've been talking about alleviating the gear crunch for a very long time yet done nothing to actually do so. They've in fact made it worse time and time again with the promise of a gear economy adjustment being worked on each time.
P.S. I do love how every criticism of CG has become "dev bashing" now. Makes it so much easier to ignore you, just as you ignore us.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
I am pretty sure that you WANT to stay competitive, and there is a wide range to what that means, which effects the timeline in which a player will personally define as "ok" to stay at the desired level.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
Pretty sure most would say it’s a NEED, based off the crystals and resources they get from it.
And yes, the gear crunch should be addressed, but not by making all new characters need an extensive amount of a new gear peace.
New shiny and powerful characters costing more is not surprising.
Also, I would guess that as part of the plan to phase out older materials, there is going to be a shift to newer ones. But that's just a guess.
Yes, because it is the same as everything CG does in this game; to make money.
And about the newer gear materials, how did they help the crunch? Adding extensive amounts of Kyros to new toons doesn’t exactly fix it.
Funny part is, I have absolutely been having an easier time getting stun guns since then, and without farming them. I generally have enough but am also running low on the kyros, but they feel like they have a more natural income, but I also farm them.
I dont find the number added to be excessive, but as many players seem to think, their WANTing of the new LV has them focused on the required toons that need a number of them.
Kyno I’m shocked you still aren’t getting it. It’s not a simple “want”.
To stay relevant in this game you need to not only keep up with the current meta but also upgrade supporting teams as well to the higher progression levels.
If CG is actively making non GL toons a completely second tier and unable to beat a GL then players NEED to get a GL so their current revenue stream does not get worse than it currently is.
As it stands right now CG is increasing the gear grind by adding in new progression tiers as well as also moving the goal posts for requirements for these new toons over time while not increasing the resource income at the same rate, thus widening the gap. We’ve gone from star level, to power level, to g12, then relic levels, and having those relic levels scale higher with each new release. Now we are in the R5-R8 being the norm, except for the blip that is Beskar Armor Trashdo.
So if people are to stay relevant and not fall further behind there NEEDS to be a change in the gear economy so that getting to G12 is not a chore for those that have played the game for as long as we have. There’s no way that they haven’t found a proper balance if they’re truly trying after well more than a year. If people are falling too far behind and their current investment devalued too much then they won’t WANT to play this game anymore. That’s the thing that’s already been said quite eloquently by Inyak. CG needs us to play this game. We don’t need to play it. So if CG’s inability to properly maintain a resource economy squash’s our WANT to play the game, then they’re gonna NEED to do something to fix thing. CG NEEDS its player base to want to play this game.
Again, you dont seem to get that it's a desire to have those things and to be "competitive".
Many players play this game and consider themselves competitive but are behind where you are at, some are ahead. There is a range and how to define that is a personal decision that leads to your wants of what you need to have to meet that.
Just like 1/2 of the players who join GAC, you are going to lose matches. Just like other players on your shard, you may unlock the new meta later than others.
If you are not happy with the pace you are getting things, you will make choices based on that, but again, players behind you are also happy playing, so where you define the line of what you "need" is not everyone's position.
It 100% is a want, and desire. Correct they are raising the importance of GLs, so you may want to get them, but again, so does everyone else, and we are all at the same pace.
They are not making a sweeping change, from what they said, but they will address this over time, and that will change the way we earn thing, but I highly doubt they are going to change the pace to get the most important and high end characters by much. That has always been the name of the game. We can wait and see how things play out.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
I am pretty sure that you WANT to stay competitive, and there is a wide range to what that means, which effects the timeline in which a player will personally define as "ok" to stay at the desired level.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
Pretty sure most would say it’s a NEED, based off the crystals and resources they get from it.
And yes, the gear crunch should be addressed, but not by making all new characters need an extensive amount of a new gear peace.
New shiny and powerful characters costing more is not surprising.
Also, I would guess that as part of the plan to phase out older materials, there is going to be a shift to newer ones. But that's just a guess.
Yes, because it is the same as everything CG does in this game; to make money.
And about the newer gear materials, how did they help the crunch? Adding extensive amounts of Kyros to new toons doesn’t exactly fix it.
Funny part is, I have absolutely been having an easier time getting stun guns since then, and without farming them. I generally have enough but am also running low on the kyros, but they feel like they have a more natural income, but I also farm them.
I dont find the number added to be excessive, but as many players seem to think, their WANTing of the new LV has them focused on the required toons that need a number of them.
Glad to see you have no issue. But you are just one person. I doubt this thread would be a reality if we all thought that there was no issue with the gear crunch, and CG’s attempt to fix it.
And you’ve said it yourself; as long as you have the current meta, you should be fine. So is it really a “want” when you need the new meta to succeed in most parts of this game. As Ravens1113 has already said a little over an hour ago in a response to you, with the new changes and nerfs being added that will make it much harder to beat GLs with non-GL counters, players NEED to get GLs if they want to continue to be competitive in the game.
I never said no issue, and my statement is completely anecdotal.
I never said anything like that or say there is no problem, I have said the opposite many times.
Yes the timeline at which you get the current meta is a desire, some do it day one, some do it only weeks before the next and even others later on. People will want to be faster at the meta, and it is possible without $$, through good planning and working a plan. That may not be for everyone, but still this all a desire, a want, and not a need. You can define it as a need and use that to drive you, thats great, but it doesnt mean you need it to be happy and/or enjoy yourself.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
So.......unless your argument is no amount of change will be wholly acceptable to the entire community and therefore there should be no changes implemented bc we're lazy and greedy for wanting something other similar games have already implemented or would have implemented years ago.....I don't really get where you're going with that.
In this thread we've seen ppl very eloquently describe easing the gear bottleneck from g8/g9 to g12, to g11, and the response is to imply the community just wants GL handouts and no fix could ever be satisfactory enough. Starting a sentence with a perfectly reasonable statement, then adding on the but, completely wipes out the first part of that sentence. No one here is saying you should get r7 immediately on a fresh account. But that statement implies these +6 mil accounts are demanding something extreme after years of loyalty and in many cases decent/large sums of $$$.
Personally, I think CG's decision has been made to do nothing about the gear crunch. My evidence is quite strong. It is ALL those packs in the store featuring the gear that they keep a chokehold on and making me look at obnoxious pop up ads of everyday. With GLs becoming the new meta, they've moved the business model from crystals for character tokens to gear packs and crystal packs to be spent on gear. It's probably more profitable. But it also means they can't ease the gear crunch because if they do that, they'll start to lose money. They've created their own problem.
You mentioned that we don't NEED to stay competitive. Interesting take in a game with so much pvp content. The game even seeks to turn you against your own guild in a bid for top spots in raids. A word of advice. If you keep making that statement, eventually someone (like me, maybe) is going to turn around and point out that we don't even NEED to play the game. CG needs us to continue playing. To continue paying. Every single player, f2p or kraken, could all drop the game tomorrow and CG would be the ones suffering because of it. We'd all be fine. The way CG has been treating us recently, maybe they need a reminder of that.
I'm glad you could twist a good old dev bash in there. That is always helpful to the conversation.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
There is always a section of players that want something for nothing in every mobile game.
That's not this discussion.
Frankly, to equate that with the honest discussion of dealing with this Gear Crunch self-imposed by CG is just trying to distract the discussion at best and disingenuous at worst and not helping this discussion to progress.
Let's get back to addressing the real concerns of the choke points that affect every player, from new to day-one players...
Ok, but at no point am I talking about anything for free. There has been and always will be a pace, this will not change, and that is part of this issue, for new and day one players. Realizing that and working within it as many players are doing is the best way to deal with it. If you have a solid plan and find your happy place, then anything they add or change will only serve to make you happier.
I am being honest, and disregarding this point, is just going to make players less happy, as no change will ever be "enough", if "you" dont realize this.
This is what I was saying, and I didnt read the rest of your post. I will try to circle back around to the rest, but I'm guessing it's as constructive as the first part....
So your argument is that we're greedy and want something for nothing. No wonder you didn't read the rest of my post. I'm sorry that RNG doesn't give me amazing raid rewards like it does for you. I'm sorry you've decided us struggling is due to our incompetence (despite you knowing nothing about our situations) and not CG putting bad rewards into loot boxes at such a high frequency that it hinders our progression. But you should realize you sound terribly, terribly out of touch and blaming us for CG's bottlenecks that THEY created just reinforces the us vs them mentality. It's one you're wholeheartedly embracing in this thread.
Just because it's the way things are doesn't mean it's the way they should be. That they shouldn't make it easier. You keep saying you're both in favor of them making it easier and yet defending them not doing so. Don't be Schrodinger's Mod. They've been talking about alleviating the gear crunch for a very long time yet done nothing to actually do so. They've in fact made it worse time and time again with the promise of a gear economy adjustment being worked on each time.
P.S. I do love how every criticism of CG has become "dev bashing" now. Makes it so much easier to ignore you, just as you ignore us.
When did I say want something for nothing? I don't recall saying that.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
I am pretty sure that you WANT to stay competitive, and there is a wide range to what that means, which effects the timeline in which a player will personally define as "ok" to stay at the desired level.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
Pretty sure most would say it’s a NEED, based off the crystals and resources they get from it.
And yes, the gear crunch should be addressed, but not by making all new characters need an extensive amount of a new gear peace.
New shiny and powerful characters costing more is not surprising.
Also, I would guess that as part of the plan to phase out older materials, there is going to be a shift to newer ones. But that's just a guess.
Yes, because it is the same as everything CG does in this game; to make money.
And about the newer gear materials, how did they help the crunch? Adding extensive amounts of Kyros to new toons doesn’t exactly fix it.
Funny part is, I have absolutely been having an easier time getting stun guns since then, and without farming them. I generally have enough but am also running low on the kyros, but they feel like they have a more natural income, but I also farm them.
I dont find the number added to be excessive, but as many players seem to think, their WANTing of the new LV has them focused on the required toons that need a number of them.
Kyno I’m shocked you still aren’t getting it. It’s not a simple “want”.
To stay relevant in this game you need to not only keep up with the current meta but also upgrade supporting teams as well to the higher progression levels.
If CG is actively making non GL toons a completely second tier and unable to beat a GL then players NEED to get a GL so their current revenue stream does not get worse than it currently is.
As it stands right now CG is increasing the gear grind by adding in new progression tiers as well as also moving the goal posts for requirements for these new toons over time while not increasing the resource income at the same rate, thus widening the gap. We’ve gone from star level, to power level, to g12, then relic levels, and having those relic levels scale higher with each new release. Now we are in the R5-R8 being the norm, except for the blip that is Beskar Armor Trashdo.
So if people are to stay relevant and not fall further behind there NEEDS to be a change in the gear economy so that getting to G12 is not a chore for those that have played the game for as long as we have. There’s no way that they haven’t found a proper balance if they’re truly trying after well more than a year. If people are falling too far behind and their current investment devalued too much then they won’t WANT to play this game anymore. That’s the thing that’s already been said quite eloquently by Inyak. CG needs us to play this game. We don’t need to play it. So if CG’s inability to properly maintain a resource economy squash’s our WANT to play the game, then they’re gonna NEED to do something to fix thing. CG NEEDS its player base to want to play this game.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
I am pretty sure that you WANT to stay competitive, and there is a wide range to what that means, which effects the timeline in which a player will personally define as "ok" to stay at the desired level.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
Pretty sure most would say it’s a NEED, based off the crystals and resources they get from it.
And yes, the gear crunch should be addressed, but not by making all new characters need an extensive amount of a new gear peace.
New shiny and powerful characters costing more is not surprising.
Also, I would guess that as part of the plan to phase out older materials, there is going to be a shift to newer ones. But that's just a guess.
Yes, because it is the same as everything CG does in this game; to make money.
And about the newer gear materials, how did they help the crunch? Adding extensive amounts of Kyros to new toons doesn’t exactly fix it.
Funny part is, I have absolutely been having an easier time getting stun guns since then, and without farming them. I generally have enough but am also running low on the kyros, but they feel like they have a more natural income, but I also farm them.
I dont find the number added to be excessive, but as many players seem to think, their WANTing of the new LV has them focused on the required toons that need a number of them.
Kyno I’m shocked you still aren’t getting it. It’s not a simple “want”.
To stay relevant in this game you need to not only keep up with the current meta but also upgrade supporting teams as well to the higher progression levels.
If CG is actively making non GL toons a completely second tier and unable to beat a GL then players NEED to get a GL so their current revenue stream does not get worse than it currently is.
As it stands right now CG is increasing the gear grind by adding in new progression tiers as well as also moving the goal posts for requirements for these new toons over time while not increasing the resource income at the same rate, thus widening the gap. We’ve gone from star level, to power level, to g12, then relic levels, and having those relic levels scale higher with each new release. Now we are in the R5-R8 being the norm, except for the blip that is Beskar Armor Trashdo.
So if people are to stay relevant and not fall further behind there NEEDS to be a change in the gear economy so that getting to G12 is not a chore for those that have played the game for as long as we have. There’s no way that they haven’t found a proper balance if they’re truly trying after well more than a year. If people are falling too far behind and their current investment devalued too much then they won’t WANT to play this game anymore. That’s the thing that’s already been said quite eloquently by Inyak. CG needs us to play this game. We don’t need to play it. So if CG’s inability to properly maintain a resource economy squash’s our WANT to play the game, then they’re gonna NEED to do something to fix thing. CG NEEDS its player base to want to play this game.
Again, you dont seem to get that it's a desire to have those things and to be "competitive".
Many players play this game and consider themselves competitive but are behind where you are at, some are ahead. There is a range and how to define that is a personal decision that leads to your wants of what you need to have to meet that.
Just like 1/2 of the players who join GAC, you are going to lose matches. Just like other players on your shard, you may unlock the new meta later than others.
If you are not happy with the pace you are getting things, you will make choices based on that, but again, players behind you are also happy playing, so where you define the line of what you "need" is not everyone's position.
It 100% is a want, and desire. Correct they are raising the importance of GLs, so you may want to get them, but again, so does everyone else, and we are all at the same pace.
They are not making a sweeping change, from what they said, but they will address this over time, and that will change the way we earn thing, but I highly doubt they are going to change the pace to get the most important and high end characters by much. That has always been the name of the game. We can wait and see how things play out.
Behind me in terms of progression or time? You’re talking about two totally different things.
And you just admitted to being anecdotal lol. Yet you keep saying needing a GL to stay at a current level of progression is a desire, not a need. Again, you’re wrong. If people were using non GL counters to get through conquest, GAC or TW, they NEED to get a GL now to keep up that same level of progression. Especially with R9 coming out.
You also keep refusing to acknowledge how every other collection game like this one eases earlier gear bottlenecks and transfers them to pinch points as the player progresses. If they are unwilling to do so, they need to stop saying gear economy relief is coming. If they don’t know how, simply look to competitors. It’s actually far more simple than you keep painting it to be
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
So.......unless your argument is no amount of change will be wholly acceptable to the entire community and therefore there should be no changes implemented bc we're lazy and greedy for wanting something other similar games have already implemented or would have implemented years ago.....I don't really get where you're going with that.
In this thread we've seen ppl very eloquently describe easing the gear bottleneck from g8/g9 to g12, to g11, and the response is to imply the community just wants GL handouts and no fix could ever be satisfactory enough. Starting a sentence with a perfectly reasonable statement, then adding on the but, completely wipes out the first part of that sentence. No one here is saying you should get r7 immediately on a fresh account. But that statement implies these +6 mil accounts are demanding something extreme after years of loyalty and in many cases decent/large sums of $$$.
Personally, I think CG's decision has been made to do nothing about the gear crunch. My evidence is quite strong. It is ALL those packs in the store featuring the gear that they keep a chokehold on and making me look at obnoxious pop up ads of everyday. With GLs becoming the new meta, they've moved the business model from crystals for character tokens to gear packs and crystal packs to be spent on gear. It's probably more profitable. But it also means they can't ease the gear crunch because if they do that, they'll start to lose money. They've created their own problem.
You mentioned that we don't NEED to stay competitive. Interesting take in a game with so much pvp content. The game even seeks to turn you against your own guild in a bid for top spots in raids. A word of advice. If you keep making that statement, eventually someone (like me, maybe) is going to turn around and point out that we don't even NEED to play the game. CG needs us to continue playing. To continue paying. Every single player, f2p or kraken, could all drop the game tomorrow and CG would be the ones suffering because of it. We'd all be fine. The way CG has been treating us recently, maybe they need a reminder of that.
I'm glad you could twist a good old dev bash in there. That is always helpful to the conversation.
Did I miss something? You keep saying “options”. No kyno, their recent nerfs to non GL counters and explicit statement that they don’t want non GL counters bearing GL’s makes it a demand. A demand that if we are to stay competitive in arena, GAC, TW and possibly even conquest, we need as many GL’s as we can get.
You don’t need as many GLs as you can get to stay competitive in arena, gac, tw, or conquest. In arena you need to follow meta, so far getting 1 every 2 GLs was enough to be very confortable (so far). In gac there is a matchmaking system; if you have an efficient roster with zero or one GL, you don’t need an extra one to stay competitive; you can stop farming altogether and you’ll stay as competitive as you are now for a long time. As Conquest could be finished, you didn’t need as many as you can get. You need enough to finish it. So far, 2 seemed quite enough, maybe even 1 was (so far. It doesn’t seem far fetch what we’ll need more later on, via a mythic difficulty or something).
So to stay competitive in arena you NEED one of the new GL’s when each pair is released.
With the nerfs coming you NEED more GL’s to beat an opponent who has more since non GL counters are being systematically nerfed. So no, once the nerfs go into effect, with no changes to matchmaking, you need to get as many GL’s as you can. Beating GL’s in conquest will now require GL’s as well with the changes
You dont need to stay competitive, you WANT to stay competitive. There is a difference.
GAC you will WANT as many GLs as you can get to try to get an advantage and ensure victory.
Conquest, much like arena, as long as you have a good roster and the current meta, you are probably fine.
But you NEED to stay competitive to stay successful in the PvP modes. And for the current meta, that brings us back to the gear crunch issue. And if you NEED the current meta to stay competitive (which seems like it will be requiring R9 in the future), with all the prerequisites, the gear crunch seriously needs to be addressed.
The gear crunch does need to be addressed, but there is probably a section of this that needs to be addressed by what a player thinks they should get in what timeline, because even if it is addressed, that part may still not be "fast enough" and will still be blamed on the gear economy.
There is always a section of players that want something for nothing in every mobile game.
That's not this discussion.
Frankly, to equate that with the honest discussion of dealing with this Gear Crunch self-imposed by CG is just trying to distract the discussion at best and disingenuous at worst and not helping this discussion to progress.
Let's get back to addressing the real concerns of the choke points that affect every player, from new to day-one players...
Ok, but at no point am I talking about anything for free. There has been and always will be a pace, this will not change, and that is part of this issue, for new and day one players. Realizing that and working within it as many players are doing is the best way to deal with it. If you have a solid plan and find your happy place, then anything they add or change will only serve to make you happier.
I am being honest, and disregarding this point, is just going to make players less happy, as no change will ever be "enough", if "you" dont realize this.
This is what I was saying, and I didnt read the rest of your post. I will try to circle back around to the rest, but I'm guessing it's as constructive as the first part....
So your argument is that we're greedy and want something for nothing. No wonder you didn't read the rest of my post. I'm sorry that RNG doesn't give me amazing raid rewards like it does for you. I'm sorry you've decided us struggling is due to our incompetence (despite you knowing nothing about our situations) and not CG putting bad rewards into loot boxes at such a high frequency that it hinders our progression. But you should realize you sound terribly, terribly out of touch and blaming us for CG's bottlenecks that THEY created just reinforces the us vs them mentality. It's one you're wholeheartedly embracing in this thread.
Just because it's the way things are doesn't mean it's the way they should be. That they shouldn't make it easier. You keep saying you're both in favor of them making it easier and yet defending them not doing so. Don't be Schrodinger's Mod. They've been talking about alleviating the gear crunch for a very long time yet done nothing to actually do so. They've in fact made it worse time and time again with the promise of a gear economy adjustment being worked on each time.
P.S. I do love how every criticism of CG has become "dev bashing" now. Makes it so much easier to ignore you, just as you ignore us.
When did I say want something for nothing? I don't recall saying that.
Probably somewhere in the past eight pages when you were answering our statements.
I've found this whole experience to be very enlightening.
Thank you for evaluating. Your feedback is appreciated.
Replies
Glad to see you have no issue. But you are just one person. I doubt this thread would be a reality if we all thought that there was no issue with the gear crunch, and CG’s attempt to fix it.
And you’ve said it yourself; as long as you have the current meta, you should be fine. So is it really a “want” when you need the new meta to succeed in most parts of this game. As @Ravens1113 has already said a little over an hour ago in a response to you, with the new changes and nerfs being added that will make it much harder to beat GLs with non-GL counters, players NEED to get GLs if they want to continue to be competitive in the game.
Thank you for evaluating. Your feedback is appreciated.
So your argument is that we're greedy and want something for nothing. No wonder you didn't read the rest of my post. I'm sorry that RNG doesn't give me amazing raid rewards like it does for you. I'm sorry you've decided us struggling is due to our incompetence (despite you knowing nothing about our situations) and not CG putting bad rewards into loot boxes at such a high frequency that it hinders our progression. But you should realize you sound terribly, terribly out of touch and blaming us for CG's bottlenecks that THEY created just reinforces the us vs them mentality. It's one you're wholeheartedly embracing in this thread.
Just because it's the way things are doesn't mean it's the way they should be. That they shouldn't make it easier. You keep saying you're both in favor of them making it easier and yet defending them not doing so. Don't be Schrodinger's Mod. They've been talking about alleviating the gear crunch for a very long time yet done nothing to actually do so. They've in fact made it worse time and time again with the promise of a gear economy adjustment being worked on each time.
P.S. I do love how every criticism of CG has become "dev bashing" now. Makes it so much easier to ignore you, just as you ignore us.
Again, you dont seem to get that it's a desire to have those things and to be "competitive".
Many players play this game and consider themselves competitive but are behind where you are at, some are ahead. There is a range and how to define that is a personal decision that leads to your wants of what you need to have to meet that.
Just like 1/2 of the players who join GAC, you are going to lose matches. Just like other players on your shard, you may unlock the new meta later than others.
If you are not happy with the pace you are getting things, you will make choices based on that, but again, players behind you are also happy playing, so where you define the line of what you "need" is not everyone's position.
It 100% is a want, and desire. Correct they are raising the importance of GLs, so you may want to get them, but again, so does everyone else, and we are all at the same pace.
They are not making a sweeping change, from what they said, but they will address this over time, and that will change the way we earn thing, but I highly doubt they are going to change the pace to get the most important and high end characters by much. That has always been the name of the game. We can wait and see how things play out.
I never said no issue, and my statement is completely anecdotal.
I never said anything like that or say there is no problem, I have said the opposite many times.
Yes the timeline at which you get the current meta is a desire, some do it day one, some do it only weeks before the next and even others later on. People will want to be faster at the meta, and it is possible without $$, through good planning and working a plan. That may not be for everyone, but still this all a desire, a want, and not a need. You can define it as a need and use that to drive you, thats great, but it doesnt mean you need it to be happy and/or enjoy yourself.
When did I say want something for nothing? I don't recall saying that.
This is so so accurate
Behind me in terms of progression or time? You’re talking about two totally different things.
And you just admitted to being anecdotal lol. Yet you keep saying needing a GL to stay at a current level of progression is a desire, not a need. Again, you’re wrong. If people were using non GL counters to get through conquest, GAC or TW, they NEED to get a GL now to keep up that same level of progression. Especially with R9 coming out.
You also keep refusing to acknowledge how every other collection game like this one eases earlier gear bottlenecks and transfers them to pinch points as the player progresses. If they are unwilling to do so, they need to stop saying gear economy relief is coming. If they don’t know how, simply look to competitors. It’s actually far more simple than you keep painting it to be
Probably somewhere in the past eight pages when you were answering our statements.
Thank you for evaluating. Your feedback is appreciated.