Oh well it didn't cost me anything to get 7* executor... Saved up crystals sure but that's what they are there for. New toys for my opponent to deal with next GAC round
This already reminds me of that epic "SEE definitely needs a buff" thread.
SEE was advertised as on par of the old GLs, it was.
This was advertised to be the new meta and it's on par with old meta
Exactly. However, I'm not going to cry foul *yet*. If they tweak the performance and/or add other ships that truly make my *meta* investment worth it, I'll be ok.
If the status quo remains then I'll be asking for refunds. I don't need another fleet that cost a fortune for DSTB and GAC.
Keep in mind that adding ships means that you will need to “invest” more to get the meta you thought you were getting today.
Or you’ll have to wait to get those new ships, which really means that what you “invested” today on your 7* today was probably not necessary (since you are waiting anyway).
Either way, having new ships as the answer seems a bit dirty based on what we were told about this ship.
Yep, I hear what you are saying. Especially regarding the speed and size of investment.
It was a considerable investment. More than JMK in new crystals because I had been hoarding for a while.
To have done it in order to save time (which is the primary reason) and to then have to wait for new ships and invest further leaves a particularly bad taste in my mouth now that I think about it more.
I think that maybe we misinterpreted how powerful this ship would be.
They said that it's power would be in line with the unlock requirements. Seeing r8 toons and a bunch of relic characters, I assumed massive power jump.
But consider this: the investment to have any of the fleets up to the point where they can beat all other fleets is huge as well.
Rebels, for example. I use this as the example, as that is a "beat anything fleet" I have going.
First there is all the ships used in the fleet every time. HMF, Biggs X-Wing, Bistan U-Wing, Cassian U-Wing, Y-Wing. Third and fourth reinforcement flex, but you'll want them 7 stars with decent crew to save the bad rng runs.
Biggs, Bistan and SRP, I found needed to be relic to be reliable. Cassian crew are 2 g12 with one relic. HMF crew R7. Ackbar is r4 for the speed.
Second there is the pre-requisites for some of those characters.
To get chewy, needed 5 bounty hunters 7 star and g11 to g12.
To get HMF needed 4 bounty hunter ships and their pilots - some different to the chewy ones.
So there are 7 relic characters in there, 11 ships to 7 star. And the 4 bounty hunter ships and toons never feature in the fleet battles where I use it.
Compare to Executor
7 7 star ships, all of which could be used in the final fleet.
7 relic characters, all but one of which could be used in the final fleet.
Yes there are 2 r8 in there.
But the cost of getting this fleet up and running from scratch is not a big step up from getting any fleet up and running.
Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
I will not be fooled twice. Very disappointed with the money I have spent on this game, to have a very mediocre ship. Definitely does not feel like a "new" meta. Expected this was going to be required to compete based on all the hype, hence whaled. Won't happen again I can promise you that.
People need to remember that this game runs on people spending money. F2P does not keep the game they enjoy running; paying customers do. When you pay for something you expect to get something of value in return. This does not feel like I have gotten value, so will not be fooled again into spending so much money on something that feels so worthless.
This may well be the nail in the coffin for this game, as it slowly declines.
I get people spent to get a powerful ship, but I don’t understand everyone’s desire to have only one ship in the meta.
I hate doing mirror matches. If they buff the ship so that’s the only viable option, I imagine most people will just stop playing fleets again once they remember how tedious it is to do mirror matches every day.
One of my guild mates already has 20+ Executors in their shard. They’re not looking forward to those mirrors everyday.
Ironic we get a reminder about upcoming character changes , that are explained in part as ensuring any counter has a comparable investment to the team it is countering. The same philosophy does not seem to have been applied with Executor. The big caveat , and it is big , is we don't get to see the future like CG do. The criticism is understandable given the frustration , but let's give them time to show us the finished product. The only feedback I have for CG is, if indeed we will see new ships to take the Executor to the top of the meta on defense, why antagonize your customers and put yourself in this position. Why not announce a full roadmap ?
The investment for the other fleets is only slightly lower than what has to go into Executor. It's just people have already done it in the past.
Almost everything you put into Executor is going to be used within the finished fleet. Can't say that for a rebel fleet (chewy and HMF unlocks) for example. Or for the GET2 cap ships. Lots of investment all over roster to improve GET2 income.
I think the Executor being a bit better is about right for the comparative cost.
What if you put the 70k of GET2 on malevolence into other things? Quite a few g13 characters could have been done as a trade-off surely.
Can't really comment on Mal myself, I've left it as a 5* GAC defense for now. Saving up the GET2 just in case, but I'll probably drop the GET2 on it once I've got past the 44k more I need for it to 7*.
Im very disappointed and regreted after spending on this ship, on paper it looks like it is a hard counter for current fleet but it is not. Once other fleet passes HT taunt, its over. The whole fleet is the way too slow, too squishy.
I have no GLs, but I'm a huge bounty hunter fan. My guild can't beat the challenge Pit raid yet, so I decided to start buying Aeromagnifiers to unlock this ship. So far I'm $120 in with 10 Aeromagnifiers to go. Couldn't unlock it today, but I've been working on it since it was announced (which was good timing because Piett was the last requirement I needed for SEE).
Piett r5
Ig-88 1 gear slot away from g13
Dengar 2 gear slots from g13
TIE pilot g9
6* TIE Bomber
6* Razor Crest
All other requirements met.
I must say, this thread has me a little depressed about the money I've spent. for the Executor. I'm not a big spender. I think I spent $40 for Hounds Tooth and $50 to get Beskar Mando. Other than that, I've picked up maybe half a dozen flash sales fir $10-$15. So I'm not a big spender. But I saw the writing on the wall and new that if I wanted to keep collecting my 300+ crystals each day from top 5 in fleet arena, I would need this ship ASAP. Now it's looking like that was wasted money since Malevolence is already doing the job it looks like Executor will do.
I mean, at the end of this I'll be able to run bounty hunters instead of Separatists, which is what I want, but that's not worth $170 to me. I thought this was a sink-or-swim moment.
I feel like an AI change would fix most of this. That’s usually the problem with high-offense, poor-defense squads (but not always). But pulling out a new ship would be… well, depends how the ship’s released. But I would wonder why not just release it pre-Executor and make it a requirement.
What if you put the 70k of GET2 on malevolence into other things? Quite a few g13 characters could have been done as a trade-off surely.
70k will give you 700 yellow g12+. You can’t g13 a few characters with that, but you can buy the g12+ gear for about 2 characters.
Executor investment will give a 4* ship that will be 5* (at which point the ultimate cd will be low enough to see it in action) in 6 months. If you want to 5*her now, add an extra 6000 crystals to the bill.
I noticed, that i can auto a 7-Star Executor with my 5-Star-Executor. But not the other way round! Sometimes the 7-Star-Executor fails against a 5-Star-Executor manually, my shard mate told me.
And this is because, the turn order. the 7-Star-Executor is too fast for the BH! You have to set breach first on an enemy to use the mass attack and achieve your Payout! But its not possible to do this with a 7-Star-Executor. With a 5-Star-Executor it is possible! And often the opposing ships do loose breach until the next of the Executor. The hole turn order is dreadful
And 5-Star-Executor is performing better than a 7-Star-Executor in offense against any other fleet because of this fact! I dont think that this was intend
So CG need to push the Speed of the BH-Ships (perhaps with a new ship?!) or found a better solution for this.
So i will keep my 5-Star-Executor for now! its much easier in a mirror match and doesnt make a difference for Rebels or Male
Just wanted to add 1 to the disappointed people. I saved a lot to get Executor 7* day 1 and spent some money only to discover that this 'good luck' beast is easily and consistenly beaten by Male and H1 fleets. I did not expect it to be unbeatable, but I did expect at least some rng factor so that people taking on the Executor with other fleets need to take an actual risk of losing. It does not seem so now.
Being an offensiwe powerhouse is definitely not good enough with such an investment.
I don't think the standalone performance of the new ship is the issue, it is the requirement cost. If this had been released like the Finalizer/Raddus with simply ship requirements (Razor Crest alone would have blocked a lot of people for a while) there wouldn't be any where near as much negative reaction. But the requirements are half a GL, as a ftp player without access to cpit the relic 8 requirements alone mean I have to choose the Exectuor OR JMK/LV. Now if that gets me a fleet hold in GAC it is a worthy investment which offsets that I'm hampering my ability in squad zones where my opponent has better R8s than Boba and Piett and potentially now a GL advantage over me.
The problem isn't the Executor's poor performance on defense, it's CG's hype of this being the new meta and something even maxed top end fleets will have a hard time beating at 7*.
What we (appear) to have have given is another ship that can beat other fleets but can be beaten by the same fleets. That's not a new meta, that's adding to the existing meta.
I'd be completely fine with a new offensive fleet if CG hadn't hyped this as more. That let down is made worse due to the high requirements CG put on getting this fleet, because they claimed...high requirements were needed to reflect the dominance this ship would have.
Unless there's additional ships which will change its defensive holds, or some AI changes made, then CG isn't living up to their promise of this being a new meta. At best, they've given the Executor owners an easier arena climb. If that's the case...then for me, I'll wish I hadn't bloated my roster and diverted all that gear/relic material away from my Lord Vader farm since my fleet climb would have remained possible without the Executor.
That said, I'm hopeful there's more to come in terms of ships or AI changes to justify CG's hype....because let's face it....if CG hadn't plugged this as much, it wouldn't be as big a deal.
Just for reference when we were being hard sold this ship @CG_Miller said (in actual recorded words out of his mouth) the following things:
"There was a long overdue need for a meta refresh"
"We wanted to shake up the meta"
"This has been planned since Piett came out"
"The team knocked it out of the park on this ship"
"You'll be able to stick it on Defense, it'll hold its own on the defensive side"
"This ship is coming into the top of the meta"
"We wanted to ensure players who were investing in this ship were investing in a top of the meta ship and being rewarded for their investment"
"Spent days thinking about the ultimate and what this ship could do as a top of the meta ship"
"You're really just bringing Empire ships to kinda fill out the rest of the reinforcements"
"Making a top of the meta ship is a lot easier than say something in the top-5"
"This is going to be the top of the meta for a while"
"Existing top of the meta fleets against a 4-star Executor should have a chance...when there are 7-star Executors out there hopefully you'll have yours too!"
"We're requiring pilots are relic levels so If you're getting the Executor your pilots and Piett are something you don't then have to worry about"
"It is a very powerful top of the meta ship"
...So, yeah, ooh wonder why people invested in this requirement-heavy ship expecting it to be able to hold on defense and be worthy of the title of a meta changing investment (...that many of us chose instead of GL Lord Vader since we couldn't afford to do both!)
Replies
Yep, I hear what you are saying. Especially regarding the speed and size of investment.
It was a considerable investment. More than JMK in new crystals because I had been hoarding for a while.
To have done it in order to save time (which is the primary reason) and to then have to wait for new ships and invest further leaves a particularly bad taste in my mouth now that I think about it more.
They said that it's power would be in line with the unlock requirements. Seeing r8 toons and a bunch of relic characters, I assumed massive power jump.
But consider this: the investment to have any of the fleets up to the point where they can beat all other fleets is huge as well.
Rebels, for example. I use this as the example, as that is a "beat anything fleet" I have going.
First there is all the ships used in the fleet every time. HMF, Biggs X-Wing, Bistan U-Wing, Cassian U-Wing, Y-Wing. Third and fourth reinforcement flex, but you'll want them 7 stars with decent crew to save the bad rng runs.
Biggs, Bistan and SRP, I found needed to be relic to be reliable. Cassian crew are 2 g12 with one relic. HMF crew R7. Ackbar is r4 for the speed.
Second there is the pre-requisites for some of those characters.
To get chewy, needed 5 bounty hunters 7 star and g11 to g12.
To get HMF needed 4 bounty hunter ships and their pilots - some different to the chewy ones.
So there are 7 relic characters in there, 11 ships to 7 star. And the 4 bounty hunter ships and toons never feature in the fleet battles where I use it.
Compare to Executor
7 7 star ships, all of which could be used in the final fleet.
7 relic characters, all but one of which could be used in the final fleet.
Yes there are 2 r8 in there.
But the cost of getting this fleet up and running from scratch is not a big step up from getting any fleet up and running.
So it's only that much more powerful.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
I will not be fooled twice. Very disappointed with the money I have spent on this game, to have a very mediocre ship. Definitely does not feel like a "new" meta. Expected this was going to be required to compete based on all the hype, hence whaled. Won't happen again I can promise you that.
People need to remember that this game runs on people spending money. F2P does not keep the game they enjoy running; paying customers do. When you pay for something you expect to get something of value in return. This does not feel like I have gotten value, so will not be fooled again into spending so much money on something that feels so worthless.
This may well be the nail in the coffin for this game, as it slowly declines.
Just my 2 cents.
You’re still missing it!
I hate doing mirror matches. If they buff the ship so that’s the only viable option, I imagine most people will just stop playing fleets again once they remember how tedious it is to do mirror matches every day.
One of my guild mates already has 20+ Executors in their shard. They’re not looking forward to those mirrors everyday.
I do negotiator mirrors (R7 vs R8) everyday. Couldn't be much worse with Executor mirror.
well that's your decision. I find malevolence much more fun than negotiators.
The investment for the other fleets is only slightly lower than what has to go into Executor. It's just people have already done it in the past.
Almost everything you put into Executor is going to be used within the finished fleet. Can't say that for a rebel fleet (chewy and HMF unlocks) for example. Or for the GET2 cap ships. Lots of investment all over roster to improve GET2 income.
I think the Executor being a bit better is about right for the comparative cost.
What if you put the 70k of GET2 on malevolence into other things? Quite a few g13 characters could have been done as a trade-off surely.
Can't really comment on Mal myself, I've left it as a 5* GAC defense for now. Saving up the GET2 just in case, but I'll probably drop the GET2 on it once I've got past the 44k more I need for it to 7*.
Piett r5
Ig-88 1 gear slot away from g13
Dengar 2 gear slots from g13
TIE pilot g9
6* TIE Bomber
6* Razor Crest
All other requirements met.
I must say, this thread has me a little depressed about the money I've spent. for the Executor. I'm not a big spender. I think I spent $40 for Hounds Tooth and $50 to get Beskar Mando. Other than that, I've picked up maybe half a dozen flash sales fir $10-$15. So I'm not a big spender. But I saw the writing on the wall and new that if I wanted to keep collecting my 300+ crystals each day from top 5 in fleet arena, I would need this ship ASAP. Now it's looking like that was wasted money since Malevolence is already doing the job it looks like Executor will do.
I mean, at the end of this I'll be able to run bounty hunters instead of Separatists, which is what I want, but that's not worth $170 to me. I thought this was a sink-or-swim moment.
Not sell the problem and then sell the solution.
I feel like an AI change would fix most of this. That’s usually the problem with high-offense, poor-defense squads (but not always). But pulling out a new ship would be… well, depends how the ship’s released. But I would wonder why not just release it pre-Executor and make it a requirement.
Executor investment will give a 4* ship that will be 5* (at which point the ultimate cd will be low enough to see it in action) in 6 months. If you want to 5*her now, add an extra 6000 crystals to the bill.
And this is because, the turn order. the 7-Star-Executor is too fast for the BH! You have to set breach first on an enemy to use the mass attack and achieve your Payout! But its not possible to do this with a 7-Star-Executor. With a 5-Star-Executor it is possible! And often the opposing ships do loose breach until the next of the Executor. The hole turn order is dreadful
And 5-Star-Executor is performing better than a 7-Star-Executor in offense against any other fleet because of this fact! I dont think that this was intend
So CG need to push the Speed of the BH-Ships (perhaps with a new ship?!) or found a better solution for this.
So i will keep my 5-Star-Executor for now! its much easier in a mirror match and doesnt make a difference for Rebels or Male
Being an offensiwe powerhouse is definitely not good enough with such an investment.
Easier then Exe? common, its completely diferrent amount of gear
What we (appear) to have have given is another ship that can beat other fleets but can be beaten by the same fleets. That's not a new meta, that's adding to the existing meta.
I'd be completely fine with a new offensive fleet if CG hadn't hyped this as more. That let down is made worse due to the high requirements CG put on getting this fleet, because they claimed...high requirements were needed to reflect the dominance this ship would have.
Unless there's additional ships which will change its defensive holds, or some AI changes made, then CG isn't living up to their promise of this being a new meta. At best, they've given the Executor owners an easier arena climb. If that's the case...then for me, I'll wish I hadn't bloated my roster and diverted all that gear/relic material away from my Lord Vader farm since my fleet climb would have remained possible without the Executor.
That said, I'm hopeful there's more to come in terms of ships or AI changes to justify CG's hype....because let's face it....if CG hadn't plugged this as much, it wouldn't be as big a deal.
"There was a long overdue need for a meta refresh"
"We wanted to shake up the meta"
"This has been planned since Piett came out"
"The team knocked it out of the park on this ship"
"You'll be able to stick it on Defense, it'll hold its own on the defensive side"
"This ship is coming into the top of the meta"
"We wanted to ensure players who were investing in this ship were investing in a top of the meta ship and being rewarded for their investment"
"Spent days thinking about the ultimate and what this ship could do as a top of the meta ship"
"You're really just bringing Empire ships to kinda fill out the rest of the reinforcements"
"Making a top of the meta ship is a lot easier than say something in the top-5"
"This is going to be the top of the meta for a while"
"Existing top of the meta fleets against a 4-star Executor should have a chance...when there are 7-star Executors out there hopefully you'll have yours too!"
"We're requiring pilots are relic levels so If you're getting the Executor your pilots and Piett are something you don't then have to worry about"
"It is a very powerful top of the meta ship"
...So, yeah, ooh wonder why people invested in this requirement-heavy ship expecting it to be able to hold on defense and be worthy of the title of a meta changing investment (...that many of us chose instead of GL Lord Vader since we couldn't afford to do both!)