New Bug? General Skywalker - after update gets an extra counter before entering Cover

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  • Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    “No significant impact” between countering and not countering. I only have a slight issue with that, which is: what are you saying? It’s completely significant, an entire extra attack or even more than one, doing a large amount of damage.

    They are probably seeing the same thing as the meta report: GAS is not being used more in the top squads than he was a week ago, thus no significant impact.

    That has nothing to do with the effectiveness of GAS, but rather reflects star and gear progress.

    So no change in the number of GAS squads in the top of the meta report reflects advancing star and gear levels? If this were significantly altering his effectiveness, he would have gained relative representation in the meta report as less teams would be able to knock him out of the top spots.

    Yes, since the effectiveness of GAS at 6 stars G11 and 7 stars G13 is massive, even more when approaching R7. The main reason for not using GAS is not having a 7-star, not because any single team is better than a 7-star GAS. Since the event is not happening, there are no new GAS, the only increase is from stars and gear.

    So you are admitting that this change does not make GAS more effective. Good to know, glad we can agree.
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  • Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    “No significant impact” between countering and not countering. I only have a slight issue with that, which is: what are you saying? It’s completely significant, an entire extra attack or even more than one, doing a large amount of damage.

    They are probably seeing the same thing as the meta report: GAS is not being used more in the top squads than he was a week ago, thus no significant impact.

    That has nothing to do with the effectiveness of GAS, but rather reflects star and gear progress.

    So no change in the number of GAS squads in the top of the meta report reflects advancing star and gear levels? If this were significantly altering his effectiveness, he would have gained relative representation in the meta report as less teams would be able to knock him out of the top spots.

    Yes, since the effectiveness of GAS at 6 stars G11 and 7 stars G13 is massive, even more when approaching R7. The main reason for not using GAS is not having a 7-star, not because any single team is better than a 7-star GAS. Since the event is not happening, there are no new GAS, the only increase is from stars and gear.

    So you are admitting that this change does not make GAS more effective. Good to know, glad we can agree.

    I’m saying usage does not reflect effectiveness, the metric measures other things instead. Instead, percentage of successful attempts vs GAS with the variable of counter vs no counter is the best test of the significance of the change.

    To further break down the reasons for a team appearing on the meta report, we have reasons such as more people wanting GAS to be on defence vs another team (by swapping after reaching 1st but before data is captured by swgoh.gg), people helping out by weakening defensive teams to allow another to take 1st, and increasing the number of attempts to reach the spot. These do not reflect difficulty, but other behaviours that end with the same result, but with varying consequences not recorded, such as crystals or credits spent to retry or swap teams or remove mods.
  • Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    Geshtianna wrote: »
    “No significant impact” between countering and not countering. I only have a slight issue with that, which is: what are you saying? It’s completely significant, an entire extra attack or even more than one, doing a large amount of damage.

    They are probably seeing the same thing as the meta report: GAS is not being used more in the top squads than he was a week ago, thus no significant impact.

    That has nothing to do with the effectiveness of GAS, but rather reflects star and gear progress.

    So no change in the number of GAS squads in the top of the meta report reflects advancing star and gear levels? If this were significantly altering his effectiveness, he would have gained relative representation in the meta report as less teams would be able to knock him out of the top spots.

    Yes, since the effectiveness of GAS at 6 stars G11 and 7 stars G13 is massive, even more when approaching R7. The main reason for not using GAS is not having a 7-star, not because any single team is better than a 7-star GAS. Since the event is not happening, there are no new GAS, the only increase is from stars and gear.

    So you are admitting that this change does not make GAS more effective. Good to know, glad we can agree.

    I’m saying usage does not reflect effectiveness, the metric measures other things instead. Instead, percentage of successful attempts vs GAS with the variable of counter vs no counter is the best test of the significance of the change.

    To further break down the reasons for a team appearing on the meta report, we have reasons such as more people wanting GAS to be on defence vs another team (by swapping after reaching 1st but before data is captured by swgoh.gg), people helping out by weakening defensive teams to allow another to take 1st, and increasing the number of attempts to reach the spot. These do not reflect difficulty, but other behaviours that end with the same result, but with varying consequences not recorded, such as crystals or credits spent to retry or swap teams or remove mods.

    Ok, so the data we have access to shows that the usage of GAS has not changed. One interpretation is that people people have increased activities that decrease the number of GAS teams in the top ranks, which has counteracted the increased ability of the team to win on offense/defense. Another interpretation is that GAS is not performing significantly better on offense/defense, and there has been no change in the activities that decrease the number of GAS teams in the top ranks.

    As to what CG's statement means, they obviously have even more data than we do, including the win rate of GAS on offense and defense, and so I would assume that "no significant change" means that the metrics for GAS have not changed outside of an acceptable range.
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  • TVF wrote: »
    Whatelse73 wrote: »
    TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    Dryff wrote: »
    Anyone else concerned with the phrasing of the Dev update on this bug?

    The subtext tells me that they will see how much it helps GAS stay at the top of Arena, and leave the bug in there if it helps the whales. :o

    The wording says ‘we fixed GS, for the Sith Raid, And he is acting differently in other areas too’.” we will look into it”.

    Seems like one correction led to another. He should be finishing the turn and counter attacking before covering. That’s how the kit reads. Don’t be embarrassed iif you need help understanding the novella of skills and mechanics on most new chars. There are classes you can take.

    Why they "fixed" him is more likely to do with how easy Padme and CLS and even DR Malak teams could take him down than anything else.

    The same thing happened with Traya, Malak, DR, JKR, etc etc. "Uh oh, that unit has a way to defeat our latest Meta, fix something!!!!"

    So you think this was intentional, and then they pretended it was unintended, then pretended to investigate it, before finally pretending to make a decision on it?

    Ok.

    Call me a sceptic, but I said to shard mates when it changed that this is deliberate 100%...not changing it back doesn’t do anything to alleviate that opinion

    To those wanting it to stay for the TB, did it help out at all?
  • To say the least, the official response on this bug is disappointing.

    The new extra counters bug essentially makes any counter other than mirror significantly harder, and is more of a general push to increase the difficulty across all game content, to continue to push hard on the $pend incentive.

    Great for the monthly numbers, horrible for the 99% of the player base, forcing them out of the top 20 for most arena shards unless significant concessions are made by the ones leaving GAS in.

    CG's idea of kit balance is ludicrous at best. There is no such thing, just every increasing highs that make any prior investments invalid, and more incentive to keep $pending, when it's already far out of hand.

    If a couple extra counters are ruining your counter, it probably wasn't very good

    Doesn’t really impact gr counter, but I found se counter got blown apart by the change...whether with zolo or with wat...gba helps to have a perma taunt but lose a lot of fire power...so back to gr to counter, which is fine, enjoyed having options (gac or tw)
  • TVF wrote: »
    Let's see a video where he doesn't counter. I've never seen it.

    Doesn’t cbm from bsf have negative 30% counter chance...so gas would reduce to 70% chance? I’ve seen it, v SE only...if I bother trying SE again I will record it
  • DJT1 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Let's see a video where he doesn't counter. I've never seen it.

    Doesn’t cbm from bsf have negative 30% counter chance...so gas would reduce to 70% chance? I’ve seen it, v SE only...if I bother trying SE again I will record it

    Corrupted Battle Meditation: -30% Critical Hit Chance and -30% Counter Chance (doubled against non-Jedi and non-Sith)
  • TVF
    25693 posts Member
    DJT1 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Let's see a video where he doesn't counter. I've never seen it.

    Doesn’t cbm from bsf have negative 30% counter chance...so gas would reduce to 70% chance? I’ve seen it, v SE only...if I bother trying SE again I will record it

    The claim was that he's not working correctly. My point was let's see a video showing him not countering when he should. In that case, yes, he might not counter.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • TVF
    25693 posts Member
    DJT1 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Whatelse73 wrote: »
    TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    Dryff wrote: »
    Anyone else concerned with the phrasing of the Dev update on this bug?

    The subtext tells me that they will see how much it helps GAS stay at the top of Arena, and leave the bug in there if it helps the whales. :o

    The wording says ‘we fixed GS, for the Sith Raid, And he is acting differently in other areas too’.” we will look into it”.

    Seems like one correction led to another. He should be finishing the turn and counter attacking before covering. That’s how the kit reads. Don’t be embarrassed iif you need help understanding the novella of skills and mechanics on most new chars. There are classes you can take.

    Why they "fixed" him is more likely to do with how easy Padme and CLS and even DR Malak teams could take him down than anything else.

    The same thing happened with Traya, Malak, DR, JKR, etc etc. "Uh oh, that unit has a way to defeat our latest Meta, fix something!!!!"

    So you think this was intentional, and then they pretended it was unintended, then pretended to investigate it, before finally pretending to make a decision on it?

    Ok.

    Call me a sceptic, but I said to shard mates when it changed that this is deliberate 100%...not changing it back doesn’t do anything to alleviate that opinion

    It's a conspiracy theory, but ok.
    The CGDF is recruiting. Say hi in our Discord! https://discord.gg/AmStGTH
  • Gas not countering when going to Cover today when I climb arena. BSF basic attack and he not counter it. I forgot CBM was there or not.
  • Whatelse73 wrote: »
    TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    Dryff wrote: »
    Anyone else concerned with the phrasing of the Dev update on this bug?

    The subtext tells me that they will see how much it helps GAS stay at the top of Arena, and leave the bug in there if it helps the whales. :o

    The wording says ‘we fixed GS, for the Sith Raid, And he is acting differently in other areas too’.” we will look into it”.

    Seems like one correction led to another. He should be finishing the turn and counter attacking before covering. That’s how the kit reads. Don’t be embarrassed iif you need help understanding the novella of skills and mechanics on most new chars. There are classes you can take.

    Why they "fixed" him is more likely to do with how easy Padme and CLS and even DR Malak teams could take him down than anything else.

    The same thing happened with Traya, Malak, DR, JKR, etc etc. "Uh oh, that unit has a way to defeat our latest Meta, fix something!!!!"

    They fixed him because in HSTR if he lost his protection and then didn't counter, the turn wasn't ending. The result was that the buttons would never appear and the raid would freeze. Remember we had something similar with the Geonosis territory battle with Dooku and Greedo where the turn wouldn't end. They were game breaking bugs.
  • So this change had no effect because more people have not unlocked ga$ since this change. Good to know.
  • TVF wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »
    TVF wrote: »
    Let's see a video where he doesn't counter. I've never seen it.

    Doesn’t cbm from bsf have negative 30% counter chance...so gas would reduce to 70% chance? I’ve seen it, v SE only...if I bother trying SE again I will record it

    The claim was that he's not working correctly. My point was let's see a video showing him not countering when he should. In that case, yes, he might not counter.

    Just had him not counter v a padme basic on topple...weird...no recording as wasn’t expecting it being non SE...but I wouldn’t make it up for the sake of it...don’t think that has happened before for me v non SE counter
  • Banmeong wrote: »
    Gas not countering when going to Cover today when I climb arena. BSF basic attack and he not counter it. I forgot CBM was there or not.

    There was no CBM when the same thing happened to me. Malak attacks him, he counters. HK attacks. He counters. DRevs attacks, he counters. Badsty attacks....he just stands there. In the next GAS battle, same circumstances, he counters my Badsty. But don't worry! He works now! CG says so so all is good. :D
  • Banmeong wrote: »
    Gas not countering when going to Cover today when I climb arena. BSF basic attack and he not counter it. I forgot CBM was there or not.

    There was no CBM when the same thing happened to me. Malak attacks him, he counters. HK attacks. He counters. DRevs attacks, he counters. Badsty attacks....he just stands there. In the next GAS battle, same circumstances, he counters my Badsty. But don't worry! He works now! CG says so so all is good. :D

    So you grabbed proof of this right? showing he doesn't have CBM? and submitted a bug report?
    Looking for a new guild? Come check out the Underworld Alliance on Discord:https://discord.gg/wvrYb4Q
  • Banmeong wrote: »
    Gas not countering when going to Cover today when I climb arena. BSF basic attack and he not counter it. I forgot CBM was there or not.

    There was no CBM when the same thing happened to me. Malak attacks him, he counters. HK attacks. He counters. DRevs attacks, he counters. Badsty attacks....he just stands there. In the next GAS battle, same circumstances, he counters my Badsty. But don't worry! He works now! CG says so so all is good. :D

    So you grabbed proof of this right? showing he doesn't have CBM? and submitted a bug report?

    LOL
    But reports get submitted for things we don’t like...I’m guessing you submitted bug reports for the 4 months he wasn’t countering before topple?
  • DJT1 wrote: »
    Banmeong wrote: »
    Gas not countering when going to Cover today when I climb arena. BSF basic attack and he not counter it. I forgot CBM was there or not.

    There was no CBM when the same thing happened to me. Malak attacks him, he counters. HK attacks. He counters. DRevs attacks, he counters. Badsty attacks....he just stands there. In the next GAS battle, same circumstances, he counters my Badsty. But don't worry! He works now! CG says so so all is good. :D

    So you grabbed proof of this right? showing he doesn't have CBM? and submitted a bug report?

    LOL
    But reports get submitted for things we don’t like...I’m guessing you submitted bug reports for the 4 months he wasn’t countering before topple?

    so no, you didn't. Guess that means we don't know if he is countering when he should be.
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  • Second gas v gr today, this time gas countered a jka hit before entering cover and killed him...so 1 from 2 today...have shard mate who has also not been countered using gr...no recording from him unfortunately
  • TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »

    Thanks Zap, maybe if he posts proof of not being simple I’ll apologise then?

    It's easy to forget in this day an age that verifying sources is usually the action of a simple people. We appreciate your vigilance in this matter.

    You are correct, someone’s word doesn’t seem to mean much in this day and age...I’m guilty of it, see my post re thinking the gas change was deliberate from cg...but there is form from them changing their collective mind on things and backtracking on what they’ve said...whereas I don’t have form and try to be honest in my conduct. But thanks for your quip

    Someone’s word often times doesn’t mean much because more times than not that person is confused or wrong about what is happening in game.

    It’s nothing personal when others ask for proof. It’s common that many of these “bugs”/issues are working as intended and when proof is applied it becomes apparent Why it happened that way.
    (There is a current thread about Kru not stunning DR... is it a bug? When JKR first dropped the forums were ablaze with confusion about why Jolee kept counter attacking and how could he keep reviving when the cooldown should’ve been longer.) Proof would’ve shown the details that were missed.

    Okay please explain why padme using her basic would not allow gas to counter? If there is a reason I haven’t thought of I am man enough to say, yes that explains it
  • DJT1 wrote: »
    TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »

    Thanks Zap, maybe if he posts proof of not being simple I’ll apologise then?

    It's easy to forget in this day an age that verifying sources is usually the action of a simple people. We appreciate your vigilance in this matter.

    You are correct, someone’s word doesn’t seem to mean much in this day and age...I’m guilty of it, see my post re thinking the gas change was deliberate from cg...but there is form from them changing their collective mind on things and backtracking on what they’ve said...whereas I don’t have form and try to be honest in my conduct. But thanks for your quip

    Someone’s word often times doesn’t mean much because more times than not that person is confused or wrong about what is happening in game.

    It’s nothing personal when others ask for proof. It’s common that many of these “bugs”/issues are working as intended and when proof is applied it becomes apparent Why it happened that way.
    (There is a current thread about Kru not stunning DR... is it a bug? When JKR first dropped the forums were ablaze with confusion about why Jolee kept counter attacking and how could he keep reviving when the cooldown should’ve been longer.) Proof would’ve shown the details that were missed.

    Okay please explain why padme using her basic would not allow gas to counter? If there is a reason I haven’t thought of I am man enough to say, yes that explains it

    Post the evidence and we will try to figure it out .
    Did you read the quote you used please read it again, your asking questions/making claims and the community had asked for evidence so we can see what's going on .
    "It’s nothing personal when others ask for proof. It’s common that many of these “bugs”/issues are working as intended and when proof is applied it becomes apparent Why it happened that way."

    Help me help you.
  • DJT1 wrote: »
    TheRHOMBUS wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »

    Thanks Zap, maybe if he posts proof of not being simple I’ll apologise then?

    It's easy to forget in this day an age that verifying sources is usually the action of a simple people. We appreciate your vigilance in this matter.

    You are correct, someone’s word doesn’t seem to mean much in this day and age...I’m guilty of it, see my post re thinking the gas change was deliberate from cg...but there is form from them changing their collective mind on things and backtracking on what they’ve said...whereas I don’t have form and try to be honest in my conduct. But thanks for your quip

    Someone’s word often times doesn’t mean much because more times than not that person is confused or wrong about what is happening in game.

    It’s nothing personal when others ask for proof. It’s common that many of these “bugs”/issues are working as intended and when proof is applied it becomes apparent Why it happened that way.
    (There is a current thread about Kru not stunning DR... is it a bug? When JKR first dropped the forums were ablaze with confusion about why Jolee kept counter attacking and how could he keep reviving when the cooldown should’ve been longer.) Proof would’ve shown the details that were missed.

    Okay please explain why padme using her basic would not allow gas to counter? If there is a reason I haven’t thought of I am man enough to say, yes that explains it
    The most obvious one to me is that GK had spread retribution and that Padme “using her basic” was actually Padme countering, which you maybe didn’t observe at the time.
  • DJT1 wrote: »
    DJT1 wrote: »
    ZAP wrote: »
    When someone posts proof will lil mac apologize for calling them liars...

    We all have to wait and see

    Yes, but doubtful anyone will apologize for calling me simple

    He didn’t call you simple, he asked you if you were simple. 😁

    Thanks Zap, maybe if he posts proof of not being simple I’ll apologise then?

    What type of proof would you like? Unlike some in this thread I am willing to provide evidence of claims.

    You’re funny mate...do you record every battle you have? Ffs

    I will patiently await you to state the necessary evidence to disprove your insinuation that I am simple.

    Amd no, i dont record every battle, but i do record/take screenshots when i think i may have encountered a bug.
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  • EA_Joz
    3129 posts EA Moderator
    Hello everyone! We've gone ahead and closed the thread due to it derailing into arguments and insults between each other. There is no need to argue back and forth to the point where it starts to get personal. Keep things respectful and constructive. Please review our Posting Rules & Guidelines here:

    https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/127295/forum-guidelines

    ~EA_Joz
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