SEE doesn't need a buff.
What would solve the problem: Give GAS and JKL a sith tag and sinergy
Even DR is not good outside a full SE team. The last good sith was Malak. Since then we've got a Jedi who can increase cooldown, attacks twice, mass daze, shred armor and reduce 20% health even from GL and another jedi immune to stun, immune to fear, who counterattacks, has the biggest physical damage of the game and has mass stun.
That makes a huge difference.
Lets be honest here, and every Rey, SLKR, and JML I fight concretes this:
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
2. SLKR good synergy with both FO, Sith, supports like wat/hoda. Synergy is different here, as most teams support funning whatever SLKR needs. If I run SLKR, DR, Malak, BastF, SiT, you can pump SLKR to 3 turn ult. Add that him siphoning on the way there qnd hes just beasting. His teams are literally fodder as long as he can ult.
3. SEE has none of this. I have an R7 SEE with pretty good mods but no ult yea. Without ult hes pretty much anti JML tool, outside of that I get clobbered. Bast lead JML with wat tends to still time me out or jmls with ult if im not careful. The problem here is DS toons still drop like flies but do NOTHING to propel SEE to an advantage unlike SLKR. There is some synergy with triumvirate but it just doesnt compare to jedis dropping bombs.
It is what it is at this point. Im pretty hesitant about going all in on a GL again. I saw where SEE was before I finished him but was hoping for some tuning. If we get it, great. If we dont, Ill have to write off the expenditures and be more careful in the future.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Sorry Nobody will wait till "Sith month" (Rest of the year is full with Mando) to maybe get a good Sith that add Something, that cant be the Design Line for a GL!
New characters (especially the powerfull ones) are gated behind Money and/or time so they are no real choice for most Players.
As i mentioned above you can't sell that awesome Car with the hint: "Wait some months for the wheels. And you need still a bunch of extra Money in this case, sorry Dude! But If you made it so far, you can use your Car finally"
As @Kyno already mentioned, what GLs get you is a longer place in the meta. But this is a meta where SEE is at the very bottom, and SEE is just stretching out SLKR's strength in a meta that SLKR had already been dominating for about 9 months--about the duration of a normal arena meta.
Meanwhile, SEE gets what? If this is now one big meta, SEE has missed out on close to a year of providing owners with any value, and it really doesn't seem likely that a new meta sith toon will come out that will somehow make SEE great. I don't see any point in speculating towards such an event that hasn't even been hinted at all except through people thinking "there's no way SEE is supposed to be this weak." The new toon would practically have to be a non-lead GL, but you can only have one GL in a squad, and DS toons in general including Sith get more from SLKR.
This is the height of SEE's strength. This is when he's going to provide the most value, and he provides incredibly poor value for the investment. He doesn't do the things he's supposed to, and he's a distant 4th place in arena behind 2 older meta toons, can't be helpful in endgame PVE in LS TB, isn't needed in DS TB and doesn't actually seem that great in it, can't perform in HSTR, and likely will also be useless in Galactic Death Star Rancor Raid.
TLDR: there's no reason to believe SEE is ever going to be more useful than he is after CG does whatever it does now. I don't want to crap on people's ideas, but suggesting new toons in the middle of the mandalorian era is just fanfic that's more fitting in another location.
Are we sure that relic 8 will be just more stats/mastery? What if relic 8 has a direct impact on abilities? And what if those changes are curated for each character which could be a way to tweak existing sith and SEE, perhaps giving them the abilities that will make a difference. For example, what if relic 8 adds 100% base damage for all of see’s attacks and adds dark side allies gain 100% defense and 100% bonus protection at the start of the battle and for every time see links enemies.
That could make relic 8 significant, especially when they could give Kylo and other very strong characters less of a buff from relic 8. They could use it as a way to bring balance.
☮ Consular ☮American Rebel Rebel Force (Endor)JedhaYavin IV
There's no reason to think that Relic 8 will provide relic abilities and all sorts of other stuff, or to speculate about it here. The point of the game is for players to dump as many gear/relics as possible on characters, and higher relic levels just allows players to that even more. It's just that when players used to dump mad gear/relics on a bunch of neglected characters in a legendary-type event, they would get something good out of it--usually a top meta toon.
The weakest I can think of since I started playing was Chewy, but his event was fairly doable, he revolutionized CLS squad, his guard can still be used to counter SLKR, and he was a pilot of the first legendary non-CS ship and a keystone of a strong fleet meta and what's still a pretty great fleet.
SEE is an immense investment and most players who put in those relics get shockingly little out of it. I agree with @Kyno that CG is unlikely to make an announcement explaining his value, but absent a serious touchup across SEE's mechanics, I insist that this is a good way to get players to see SEE as something other than a bait-and-switch. That's not normal for them, but it's probably in their interest and these are unprecedented times in the context of this being an expensive brand new GL where you have to squint to see good stuff.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Sorry Nobody will wait till "Sith month" (Rest of the year is full with Mando) to maybe get a good Sith that add Something, that cant be the Design Line for a GL!
New characters (especially the powerfull ones) are gated behind Money and/or time so they are no real choice for most Players.
As i mentioned above you can't sell that awesome Car with the hint: "Wait some months for the wheels. And you need still a bunch of extra Money in this case, sorry Dude! But If you made it so far, you can use your Car finally"
But this is exactly the problem we're facing. SEE must be overpowered against other GL's because he doesn't have companions. So, he must be far better (and now, 1v1 he ducks) in order o overcome the absolute garbage sith are. Outside SE, who works better as full SE what we have left? 3 years old triumvirate and what? Nothing. Sidious ducks, Maul ducks a lot Savage ducks a lot more, assassin, marauder.... pure garbage.
Put 's' wherever you feel it will be worthwhile.
@GJO yes as i mentioned SEE should have something IF paired with Maul, Dooku or even RG it is such an easy way to Upgrade old toons a bit and give Players something to do with that reliced toons. I mean even EP and Vader share something. Triumvirat too, Sith Empire too (DR with FB and HK), small but Welcome Updates that make sure you still can Mix Sith in other ways If you want. Also not every Player have all toons reliced etc.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Sorry Nobody will wait till "Sith month" (Rest of the year is full with Mando) to maybe get a good Sith that add Something, that cant be the Design Line for a GL!
New characters (especially the powerfull ones) are gated behind Money and/or time so they are no real choice for most Players.
As i mentioned above you can't sell that awesome Car with the hint: "Wait some months for the wheels. And you need still a bunch of extra Money in this case, sorry Dude! But If you made it so far, you can use your Car finally"
But this is exactly the problem we're facing. SEE must be overpowered against other GL's because he doesn't have companions. So, he must be far better (and now, 1v1 he ducks) in order o overcome the absolute garbage sith are. Outside SE, who works better as full SE what we have left? 3 years old triumvirate and what? Nothing. Sidious ducks, Maul ducks a lot Savage ducks a lot more, assassin, marauder.... pure garbage.
Put 's' wherever you feel it will be worthwhile.
Whe I broadly agree with you on the sad state of Sith in the game, disagree about Marauder. Absolute wrecking ball under DR.
There hasn't been one solid argument that I've seen explaining why this garbage character shouldn't be buffed. He's trash. And I'm glad I waited instead of whaling on every single character needed for SEE, because I could have easily gotten him day 1, with ultimate and all. But after seeing multiple videos of just how trash the character is, I'm so very glad I haven't spent a dime towards getting him. I'm sorry, but making a character this bad, and calling him a Galactic Legend is a bad joke, and if I was a new whale or Kraken, there'd be nothing you could do or show me right now to make me want to buy SEE. He offers nothing to a sith team, he's just dead weight.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Maybe they could add Darth Glovoc? He could kinda be like hoda, and have him wake up to check on his followers.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Maybe they could add Darth Glovoc? He could kinda be like hoda, and have him wake up to check on his followers.
Still don't know why we'd have to pay, farm, grind, and waste time on another sith supporting character for a galactic legend.
So far for the other 3 gls (Red and hux for slkr, heros for rey, JKL for JML) all got their supporting cast. What did SEE get? Piet... a non sith that does nothing for the Emperor. and.... NO REWORKS...
CG isn't getting my money for a character that should have been useful and worked from day 1.. pending minor tweaks.. so far SEE needs MAJOR tweaks
We can’t even test too much SEE to give Kyno the videos with data because noone uses SEE in arena because he is too trash.
All we see in arena is full of Rey, SLKR and JML.
But SEE we hardly see it. Like almost this GL doesn’t exist
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Maybe they could add Darth Glovoc? He could kinda be like hoda, and have him wake up to check on his followers.
Still don't know why we'd have to pay, farm, grind, and waste time on another sith supporting character for a galactic legend.
So far for the other 3 gls (Red and hux for slkr, heros for rey, JKL for JML) all got their supporting cast. What did SEE get? Piet... a non sith that does nothing for the Emperor. and.... NO REWORKS...
CG isn't getting my money for a character that should have been useful and worked from day 1.. pending minor tweaks.. so far SEE needs MAJOR tweaks
Well, the other GLs have newer, better supporting characters; SEE has mostly older (some ancient) supporting Sith.
I agree re-works of the sith faction is better, but re-works do not make EA money, so we have to be realistic.
We can’t even test too much SEE to give Kyno the videos with data because noone uses SEE in arena because he is too trash.
All we see in arena is full of Rey, SLKR and JML.
But SEE we hardly see it. Like almost this GL doesn’t exist
Yep that's the problem I'm facing.
At 6m GP and nearly 70 relics I have a lot of teams I could test against SEE, but alas there are no SEE anywhere for me to battle...
There hasn't been one solid argument that I've seen explaining why this garbage character shouldn't be buffed.
SEE is the "encouraged" follow-up to SLKR and if we compare SLKR + SEE pair vs. Rey + JML we see that SLKR + SEE provides a lot more value. Given that this path is the most popular choice among the population while also being cheaper it would not make much sense to give any serious buff to SEE. The only edge-case is people who as their 1st GL went for SEE but that is also justified with his lower requirements, besides he will remain very useful in taking out any and all Jedi in the game.
There hasn't been one solid argument that I've seen explaining why this garbage character shouldn't be buffed.
SEE is the "encouraged" follow-up to SLKR and if we compare SLKR + SEE pair vs. Rey + JML we see that SLKR + SEE provides a lot more value. Given that this path is the most popular choice among the population while also being cheaper it would not make much sense to give any serious buff to SEE. The only edge-case is people who as their 1st GL went for SEE but that is also justified with his lower requirements, besides he will remain very useful in taking out any and all Jedi in the game.
There hasn't been one solid argument that I've seen explaining why this garbage character shouldn't be buffed.
SEE is the "encouraged" follow-up to SLKR and if we compare SLKR + SEE pair vs. Rey + JML we see that SLKR + SEE provides a lot more value. Given that this path is the most popular choice among the population while also being cheaper it would not make much sense to give any serious buff to SEE. The only edge-case is people who as their 1st GL went for SEE but that is also justified with his lower requirements, besides he will remain very useful in taking out any and all Jedi in the game.
Replies
What would solve the problem: Give GAS and JKL a sith tag and sinergy
Even DR is not good outside a full SE team. The last good sith was Malak. Since then we've got a Jedi who can increase cooldown, attacks twice, mass daze, shred armor and reduce 20% health even from GL and another jedi immune to stun, immune to fear, who counterattacks, has the biggest physical damage of the game and has mass stun.
That makes a huge difference.
1. Jedi are in a superior place in terms of synergy. JKL is a serious assist here. He can kill GLs on his own let alone as part of the team. Rey creates a very strong offensive team, and JML can be a beast as support or lead.
2. SLKR good synergy with both FO, Sith, supports like wat/hoda. Synergy is different here, as most teams support funning whatever SLKR needs. If I run SLKR, DR, Malak, BastF, SiT, you can pump SLKR to 3 turn ult. Add that him siphoning on the way there qnd hes just beasting. His teams are literally fodder as long as he can ult.
3. SEE has none of this. I have an R7 SEE with pretty good mods but no ult yea. Without ult hes pretty much anti JML tool, outside of that I get clobbered. Bast lead JML with wat tends to still time me out or jmls with ult if im not careful. The problem here is DS toons still drop like flies but do NOTHING to propel SEE to an advantage unlike SLKR. There is some synergy with triumvirate but it just doesnt compare to jedis dropping bombs.
It is what it is at this point. Im pretty hesitant about going all in on a GL again. I saw where SEE was before I finished him but was hoping for some tuning. If we get it, great. If we dont, Ill have to write off the expenditures and be more careful in the future.
So maybe we need a new sith hero to spend money on, something comparable to JKL, but as a support for SEE. Some contenders:
Darth Plagueis. Along with Palpatine, they set out to uncover the secrets of immortality. However, when Palpatine saw no more reason for a teacher, was ultimately betrayed by his apprentice. He had the powerful ability to save others from death, but couldn’t save himself. Make him a support that gives SEE damage immunity like Rey?
Darth Bane. His power took on many different forms, from being the only Sith to survive the Jedi-Sith war (an impressive feat) to single-handedly establishing the rule of two in order to rise up and destroy the Jedi in secret. He could be an impressive tank in the game that turns into a devastating attacker when only he and SEE are left?
Rey beats SEE
SUCH A DEVASTATING ATTACKER!!!! those 60 to 70k hits on rey... 4 minutes into the battle. sooooo good...
mastery stacking is a joooooke
Sorry Nobody will wait till "Sith month" (Rest of the year is full with Mando) to maybe get a good Sith that add Something, that cant be the Design Line for a GL!
New characters (especially the powerfull ones) are gated behind Money and/or time so they are no real choice for most Players.
As i mentioned above you can't sell that awesome Car with the hint: "Wait some months for the wheels. And you need still a bunch of extra Money in this case, sorry Dude! But If you made it so far, you can use your Car finally"
Meanwhile, SEE gets what? If this is now one big meta, SEE has missed out on close to a year of providing owners with any value, and it really doesn't seem likely that a new meta sith toon will come out that will somehow make SEE great. I don't see any point in speculating towards such an event that hasn't even been hinted at all except through people thinking "there's no way SEE is supposed to be this weak." The new toon would practically have to be a non-lead GL, but you can only have one GL in a squad, and DS toons in general including Sith get more from SLKR.
This is the height of SEE's strength. This is when he's going to provide the most value, and he provides incredibly poor value for the investment. He doesn't do the things he's supposed to, and he's a distant 4th place in arena behind 2 older meta toons, can't be helpful in endgame PVE in LS TB, isn't needed in DS TB and doesn't actually seem that great in it, can't perform in HSTR, and likely will also be useless in Galactic Death Star Rancor Raid.
TLDR: there's no reason to believe SEE is ever going to be more useful than he is after CG does whatever it does now. I don't want to crap on people's ideas, but suggesting new toons in the middle of the mandalorian era is just fanfic that's more fitting in another location.
That could make relic 8 significant, especially when they could give Kylo and other very strong characters less of a buff from relic 8. They could use it as a way to bring balance.
The weakest I can think of since I started playing was Chewy, but his event was fairly doable, he revolutionized CLS squad, his guard can still be used to counter SLKR, and he was a pilot of the first legendary non-CS ship and a keystone of a strong fleet meta and what's still a pretty great fleet.
SEE is an immense investment and most players who put in those relics get shockingly little out of it. I agree with @Kyno that CG is unlikely to make an announcement explaining his value, but absent a serious touchup across SEE's mechanics, I insist that this is a good way to get players to see SEE as something other than a bait-and-switch. That's not normal for them, but it's probably in their interest and these are unprecedented times in the context of this being an expensive brand new GL where you have to squint to see good stuff.
But this is exactly the problem we're facing. SEE must be overpowered against other GL's because he doesn't have companions. So, he must be far better (and now, 1v1 he ducks) in order o overcome the absolute garbage sith are. Outside SE, who works better as full SE what we have left? 3 years old triumvirate and what? Nothing. Sidious ducks, Maul ducks a lot Savage ducks a lot more, assassin, marauder.... pure garbage.
Put 's' wherever you feel it will be worthwhile.
Whe I broadly agree with you on the sad state of Sith in the game, disagree about Marauder. Absolute wrecking ball under DR.
This short video posted 1 day ago summarizes everything wrong with the "devastating attacker" named SEE (lol)
Dear lord. The roll call of ignominy. 🤦♂️
Excellent summary regarding SEE's miserable state now, it would be great to forward this video to Devs. So they could realize what trash was released.
Brilliant.
Maybe they could add Darth Glovoc? He could kinda be like hoda, and have him wake up to check on his followers.
Still don't know why we'd have to pay, farm, grind, and waste time on another sith supporting character for a galactic legend.
So far for the other 3 gls (Red and hux for slkr, heros for rey, JKL for JML) all got their supporting cast. What did SEE get? Piet... a non sith that does nothing for the Emperor. and.... NO REWORKS...
CG isn't getting my money for a character that should have been useful and worked from day 1.. pending minor tweaks.. so far SEE needs MAJOR tweaks
All we see in arena is full of Rey, SLKR and JML.
But SEE we hardly see it. Like almost this GL doesn’t exist
Well, the other GLs have newer, better supporting characters; SEE has mostly older (some ancient) supporting Sith.
I agree re-works of the sith faction is better, but re-works do not make EA money, so we have to be realistic.
Yep that's the problem I'm facing.
At 6m GP and nearly 70 relics I have a lot of teams I could test against SEE, but alas there are no SEE anywhere for me to battle...
SEE is the "encouraged" follow-up to SLKR and if we compare SLKR + SEE pair vs. Rey + JML we see that SLKR + SEE provides a lot more value. Given that this path is the most popular choice among the population while also being cheaper it would not make much sense to give any serious buff to SEE. The only edge-case is people who as their 1st GL went for SEE but that is also justified with his lower requirements, besides he will remain very useful in taking out any and all Jedi in the game.
SLKR is lower than SEE for investments
Unless they use Bastilla lead...