So I FF past that the first time. But it proves my point. At 64% in p1 he was getting 450k. Maybe if your entire guild has every character at r7 you can brute force all 4 phases. But even that is a big IF.
So I FF past that the first time. But it proves my point. At 64% in p1 he was getting 450k. Maybe if your entire guild has every character at r7 you can brute force all 4 phases. But even that is a big IF.
Still proving my point. It is not possible to brute force this raid. It absolutely requires MMO level coordination.
I didn’t say WAS coordinated, I said “could be” coordinated. Based upon P1 and P4, neither would surprise me (coordinated or YOLO). Assuming either method is incorrect as we do not know.
We’ve beat it twice now and absolutely you don’t brute your way through it. Actually only needs about 17 members to beat. But it takes math. Need to have everyone do good %.and hold. Don’t post. Once you have enough damage on hold you give the go ahead to post. Skip to next phase, rinse and repeat. Last phase is the tricky one. 2% is a minimum. 4% is better. Would love to tell you team comps that do 4%+ but I’m not allowed. With low members it makes for about the last 10% to be zerg but that’s also easy with cls and kitchen sink. Still better if you can have more members but once again it doesn’t require everyone.
We’ve beat it twice now and absolutely you don’t brute your way through it. Actually only needs about 17 members to beat. But it takes math. Need to have everyone do good %.and hold. Don’t post. Once you have enough damage on hold you give the go ahead to post. Skip to next phase, rinse and repeat. Last phase is the tricky one. 2% is a minimum. 4% is better. Would love to tell you team comps that do 4%+ but I’m not allowed. With low members it makes for about the last 10% to be zerg but that’s also easy with cls and kitchen sink. Still better if you can have more members but once again it doesn’t require everyone.
Was that bug universal? I personally wouldn’t know how to tell if these runs had the increased offense and speed or not. You could very well be right.
My main point is: any statement of impossibility about most topics (swgoh or other) simply lacks imagination. If a kraken guild COULD brute force this raid, I would not be surprised. Likewise, if it turns out that no current guild can brute force it, I also would not be surprised.
Was that bug universal? I personally wouldn’t know how to tell if these runs had the increased offense and speed or not. You could very well be right.
My main point is: any statement of impossibility about most topics (swgoh or other) simply lacks imagination. If a kraken guild COULD brute force this raid, I would not be surprised. Likewise, if it turns out that no current guild can brute force it, I also would not be surprised.
My issue at present is purely with @Kyno ’s condescension on the subject. Ranks right up there with Kozi telling us to recruit whales with marquee characters so we could fill platoons.
Was that bug universal? I personally wouldn’t know how to tell if these runs had the increased offense and speed or not. You could very well be right.
My main point is: any statement of impossibility about most topics (swgoh or other) simply lacks imagination. If a kraken guild COULD brute force this raid, I would not be surprised. Likewise, if it turns out that no current guild can brute force it, I also would not be surprised.
It was universal and was fixed I think two days ago. I think someone mentioned above that they miscalculated and was left with 3.5% left in one if the phases and it was the longest 3.5% ever. I'm almost certain it can't be done now. But I agree with starson in regards to kyno who was pushing "well maybe you are not ready for end game content" and "it can be done with brute force." Which only creates more frustration especially when we the players were most likely right and he just inflamed the situation as a moderator which is just a joke.
He'll probably come now and say "at the time I was correct." Which I wouldn't put past him......
@CG_Doja_Fett I'm happy you chime in even for off topic banter.
Aside from me getting a good vibe from it, it also shows to me that you are reading through the thread and this gives me certainty that community sentiment is noted and passed on, regardless of whether you chime in on the real topic at hand.
As for the topic, I can't see any meaning behind the 20% global health thresholds.
Any solo prevention would be more effective at lower thresholds for individual runs, which would also be more fair to all guild members and would prevent the incentive for mass coordination and problems with time zones etc.
We’ve beat it twice now and absolutely you don’t brute your way through it. Actually only needs about 17 members to beat. But it takes math. Need to have everyone do good %.and hold. Don’t post. Once you have enough damage on hold you give the go ahead to post. Skip to next phase, rinse and repeat. Last phase is the tricky one. 2% is a minimum. 4% is better. Would love to tell you team comps that do 4%+ but I’m not allowed. With low members it makes for about the last 10% to be zerg but that’s also easy with cls and kitchen sink. Still better if you can have more members but once again it doesn’t require everyone.
Guild officers shouldn’t be officers if they can’t manage the guild
it appears you never were an officer in real life or you'll know that coordination isn't so hard - performance and the results "below the line" are hard to achieve. we, the officers (in real life), know that we shouldn't pressure unnecessary the people and putting them in a situation of impossibility. with the mechanics of this raid, you don't actually make people have fun (what playing a game was supposed to be in the past), but putting at risk their health (especially for those in multi-time zone guilds) and wellbeing, and what's worse - you don't care about it. never forget that you're also dependent from those people and as an officer - your duty also includes to make them feel better. the stupidity gone way too much and it clearly shows that a lot of people don't fully understand what actually happens in real life and what it leads to. lack of experience (i don't want to think of worse cases, which most probably will be correct). health is paramount, which includes the health of the officers in the game also. and if you already live in the virtual reality (maybe some devs also), which means that maybe your health is already damaged, it doesn't mean that others should too. even I'm astonished of the so brutal "strategy" of the devs in this case and I've seen so many in my life already. it'll eat someones' heads by the backfire
Thank you CG for this wonderful experience!
P1-P3 done in like 20 minutes, zero problems. Then came P4. Most of the guildies had used all their best toons to those early phases to get high scores and better rewards (like in all honesty you should). Then in P4 most got some **** score with secondary or worse teams. So for those guys raid took 30 mins and top places were guaranteed.
Now those who were not active during the raid start... they got to "enjoy" P4 to the fullest.
There were only a handful of those with decent teams left and the last 20% of P4... My god. SLKR gets one move and then he's dead. GL Rey gets 2 thanks to DI. Separatist lead Jango gets 2 moves thanks to DI, Rebels get to attack thanks to Han, GG droids get a hit or two in etc etc.
Those handful of people had to spend literally 5 hours on this raid doing max on those teams to make sure we actually finish it and then they are with the lowest scores in the raid even though they saved the raid for the guild with their time and effort that was 100x bigger than those who got in at the start of raid.
Sure we can coordinate this better next time but seriously those handful of people who save the guild by spending hours and hours on the raid making sure they get decent enough scores so we get a chance to finish should be rewarded and get a medal, not get 40+ rewards that are literal garbage!
Guild name: Drop 1t Like It's H0th
Guild GP: 287 million
0/2
We made it to P3 last night. Trying to get 49 other adults with RL commitments to make sure they are available for specific times so that they guild can turn in damage at the same exact time to clear a phase is an absolute nightmare for the guild & the officers.
Having the guild post their damage percentage, getting the raid coordinator to tally the numbers & keep everyone waiting around until we get to 100% of the phase before they can post their damage takes valuable time away from their families. I hope this mechanic is eliminated.
TB - group effort - same rewards
TW - group effort - same rewards
Raids - group effort - only decent rewards for top 3 (or 10). - do you not understand the pressure and strain this puts on guilds? We like the challenge, but why, with such valuable and scarce resources, do you make us fight it out?
Give more credits or GET - but not gear or slicing materials.
Everyone in this Raid plays their part. Someone might only contribute 5%, someone at the top 30% (both just examples) - but the 30% isn’t a completed raid, so their efforts are worthless without the others.
I don’t know why you as a company and game can’t fathom this for Raids when you do for TB and TW.
Guild GP: 298M
0/2
I will refrain from posting guild info here, this is my post and they do not need to be brought into it.
We are international and could finish this raid, but the right teams in the right time zones to coordinate has not been possible for us yet. Switching guilds should not be the answer to beating the raid for anyone with a “capable” roster and “capable” guild, so please do not make such suggestions.
We have a few players that hit that last straw with this raid release and are dropping the game after TB. Some of these people put a lot of money into the game and into CG’s pockets. Maybe if CG realizes that they are losing paying customers with such mechanics, perhaps a rework/change could happen.
Was thinking about B1 but even that 100 stacks will be taken before he gets a turn I guess.
Jango with the dmg immunity is a smart call though to throw in some extra 100k dmg.
Ahh, but you have to actually finish the raid first.
In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie
In game guild: TNR Uprising I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
We were able to beat it fine the first time w/ good teams and a little coordination in P1-3, then burning P4 to above 80%, coordinating one "big shot" from about 80 - 30%, then ffa the remainder. However, with the recent "fix", it's not possible to duplicate results because the Rancor takes 9+ turns and your whole team is dead. Even using Malak, we get 1 life drain, we can sometimes get 2 with the right RNG and enough attempts. But we can't clear it because of the stacking speed and he just slaughters full R7 teams.
With the current state of the raid, this is going to be absolute murder on international guilds like ours -- this is a mobile game -- it shouldn't require 50 people on *at the same time* in order to beat it.
My suggestion would be to make the stacking offense/speed *individual* instead of guild-wide. That would allow our members to go in when their schedule permits and do what their roster can do. Instead of what it is now -- which isn't more challenging -- it's just more tedious and requires holding players hostage (having to hold damage and calculate until you reach 100%).
It was actually incredibly discouraging when we improved so much in P1-3 this second try, only to slam against the brick wall in P4. Incredibly demoralizing.
It’s bad enough to make it a r5 requirement to even use toons in the event (r1 would at least be bearable) but to have a mechanic that the guild is required to post damage at the same time for each phase is just a kitten move.
It would be a chore and a pain to coordinate even if you don’t have an international guild with different time zone to take into consideration. Just scrap this feature and let ppl zerg it down. It will still be hard to beat for most guilds.
Was thinking about B1 but even that 100 stacks will be taken before he gets a turn I guess.
Jango with the dmg immunity is a smart call though to throw in some extra 100k dmg.
p3-p4 was quite easy and we blew it apart by bursting through it on fast mode.
2nd run
p1: 8 ppl
p2: 10 ppl
We are holding for p3-p4 run which we chose a time where both european+us folk can possibly attend in 5 hours. Doubt we'll have more than 30 actives. Seeing how many guilds are on 400 (succeeded 2 runs) it will probably be doable, but we rather err on the side of caution.
I'll bring up another issue with the raid. The 20% mechanic sucks but that has already been addressed.
I think the raid itself is flawed in that even on a good run, you get a couple turns and your team is dead.
I have an alt account and have played the original pit with less than ideal characters and even at g8 or so you can get to enrage. You still don't get massive damage without the tm removal but you at least get to take turns.
I think it would have been much better to boost the boss's health or defense to achieve the same results rather than having it one shot relic toons. At least then you get to play until enrage.
Add that to the ramping damage if your guildmates knock it below 80% health and you get the boss killing you without getting a turn. That isn't a fun experience.
I'll bring up another issue with the raid. The 20% mechanic sucks but that has already been addressed.
I think the raid itself is flawed in that even on a good run, you get a couple turns and your team is dead.
I have an alt account and have played the original pit with less than ideal characters and even at g8 or so you can get to enrage. You still don't get massive damage without the tm removal but you at least get to take turns.
I think it would have been much better to boost the boss's health or defense to achieve the same results rather than having it one shot relic toons. At least then you get to play until enrage.
Add that to the ramping damage if your guildmates knock it below 80% health and you get the boss killing you without getting a turn. That isn't a fun experience.
This depends on the team very much. Rey+clones consistently gets to enrage which is what I like about it compared to initial hstr times where a team can go under very fast after losing an integral toon.
Now that the stacking speed/damage mechanic has been "fixed", I am curious, was it working on the test server? In other words, what was CG expecting our experience to be: the first run or the most recent one?
If the first, I think the difficulty is somewhat defensible (albeit a horrible mechanic). If it's what we're seeing now, blah.
Replies
So I FF past that the first time. But it proves my point. At 64% in p1 he was getting 450k. Maybe if your entire guild has every character at r7 you can brute force all 4 phases. But even that is a big IF.
Still proving my point. It is not possible to brute force this raid. It absolutely requires MMO level coordination.
I didn’t say WAS coordinated, I said “could be” coordinated. Based upon P1 and P4, neither would surprise me (coordinated or YOLO). Assuming either method is incorrect as we do not know.
Are you in the guild from the video?
As I thought, that was a week ago before the update which fixed the stacking offence and speed. I'd say it's impossible without coordination now.
My main point is: any statement of impossibility about most topics (swgoh or other) simply lacks imagination. If a kraken guild COULD brute force this raid, I would not be surprised. Likewise, if it turns out that no current guild can brute force it, I also would not be surprised.
My issue at present is purely with @Kyno ’s condescension on the subject. Ranks right up there with Kozi telling us to recruit whales with marquee characters so we could fill platoons.
It was universal and was fixed I think two days ago. I think someone mentioned above that they miscalculated and was left with 3.5% left in one if the phases and it was the longest 3.5% ever. I'm almost certain it can't be done now. But I agree with starson in regards to kyno who was pushing "well maybe you are not ready for end game content" and "it can be done with brute force." Which only creates more frustration especially when we the players were most likely right and he just inflamed the situation as a moderator which is just a joke.
He'll probably come now and say "at the time I was correct." Which I wouldn't put past him......
As for the other 40 they get 2-3 so thats many many raids for a R8.
And the majority of mid tier guilds can not even beat this raid.
or you can buy packs if they come back and drop 100 dollars for one relic 8.
And I thought getting relic 7 was hard but it's actually very doable unlike this relic 8 update.
so in conclusion, relic 8 is for whales?
Aside from me getting a good vibe from it, it also shows to me that you are reading through the thread and this gives me certainty that community sentiment is noted and passed on, regardless of whether you chime in on the real topic at hand.
As for the topic, I can't see any meaning behind the 20% global health thresholds.
Any solo prevention would be more effective at lower thresholds for individual runs, which would also be more fair to all guild members and would prevent the incentive for mass coordination and problems with time zones etc.
Why keep raid teams proprietary?
it appears you never were an officer in real life or you'll know that coordination isn't so hard - performance and the results "below the line" are hard to achieve. we, the officers (in real life), know that we shouldn't pressure unnecessary the people and putting them in a situation of impossibility. with the mechanics of this raid, you don't actually make people have fun (what playing a game was supposed to be in the past), but putting at risk their health (especially for those in multi-time zone guilds) and wellbeing, and what's worse - you don't care about it. never forget that you're also dependent from those people and as an officer - your duty also includes to make them feel better. the stupidity gone way too much and it clearly shows that a lot of people don't fully understand what actually happens in real life and what it leads to. lack of experience (i don't want to think of worse cases, which most probably will be correct). health is paramount, which includes the health of the officers in the game also. and if you already live in the virtual reality (maybe some devs also), which means that maybe your health is already damaged, it doesn't mean that others should too. even I'm astonished of the so brutal "strategy" of the devs in this case and I've seen so many in my life already. it'll eat someones' heads by the backfire
P1-P3 done in like 20 minutes, zero problems. Then came P4. Most of the guildies had used all their best toons to those early phases to get high scores and better rewards (like in all honesty you should). Then in P4 most got some **** score with secondary or worse teams. So for those guys raid took 30 mins and top places were guaranteed.
Now those who were not active during the raid start... they got to "enjoy" P4 to the fullest.
There were only a handful of those with decent teams left and the last 20% of P4... My god. SLKR gets one move and then he's dead. GL Rey gets 2 thanks to DI. Separatist lead Jango gets 2 moves thanks to DI, Rebels get to attack thanks to Han, GG droids get a hit or two in etc etc.
Those handful of people had to spend literally 5 hours on this raid doing max on those teams to make sure we actually finish it and then they are with the lowest scores in the raid even though they saved the raid for the guild with their time and effort that was 100x bigger than those who got in at the start of raid.
Sure we can coordinate this better next time but seriously those handful of people who save the guild by spending hours and hours on the raid making sure they get decent enough scores so we get a chance to finish should be rewarded and get a medal, not get 40+ rewards that are literal garbage!
FIX THE REWARDS! @CG_SBCrumb @CG_TopHat @CG_Doja_Fett
Guild GP: 287 million
0/2
We made it to P3 last night. Trying to get 49 other adults with RL commitments to make sure they are available for specific times so that they guild can turn in damage at the same exact time to clear a phase is an absolute nightmare for the guild & the officers.
Having the guild post their damage percentage, getting the raid coordinator to tally the numbers & keep everyone waiting around until we get to 100% of the phase before they can post their damage takes valuable time away from their families. I hope this mechanic is eliminated.
TB - group effort - same rewards
TW - group effort - same rewards
Raids - group effort - only decent rewards for top 3 (or 10). - do you not understand the pressure and strain this puts on guilds? We like the challenge, but why, with such valuable and scarce resources, do you make us fight it out?
Give more credits or GET - but not gear or slicing materials.
Everyone in this Raid plays their part. Someone might only contribute 5%, someone at the top 30% (both just examples) - but the 30% isn’t a completed raid, so their efforts are worthless without the others.
I don’t know why you as a company and game can’t fathom this for Raids when you do for TB and TW.
0/2
I will refrain from posting guild info here, this is my post and they do not need to be brought into it.
We are international and could finish this raid, but the right teams in the right time zones to coordinate has not been possible for us yet. Switching guilds should not be the answer to beating the raid for anyone with a “capable” roster and “capable” guild, so please do not make such suggestions.
We have a few players that hit that last straw with this raid release and are dropping the game after TB. Some of these people put a lot of money into the game and into CG’s pockets. Maybe if CG realizes that they are losing paying customers with such mechanics, perhaps a rework/change could happen.
Was thinking about B1 but even that 100 stacks will be taken before he gets a turn I guess.
Jango with the dmg immunity is a smart call though to throw in some extra 100k dmg.
In game guild: TNR Uprising
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
1/2
We were able to beat it fine the first time w/ good teams and a little coordination in P1-3, then burning P4 to above 80%, coordinating one "big shot" from about 80 - 30%, then ffa the remainder. However, with the recent "fix", it's not possible to duplicate results because the Rancor takes 9+ turns and your whole team is dead. Even using Malak, we get 1 life drain, we can sometimes get 2 with the right RNG and enough attempts. But we can't clear it because of the stacking speed and he just slaughters full R7 teams.
With the current state of the raid, this is going to be absolute murder on international guilds like ours -- this is a mobile game -- it shouldn't require 50 people on *at the same time* in order to beat it.
My suggestion would be to make the stacking offense/speed *individual* instead of guild-wide. That would allow our members to go in when their schedule permits and do what their roster can do. Instead of what it is now -- which isn't more challenging -- it's just more tedious and requires holding players hostage (having to hold damage and calculate until you reach 100%).
It was actually incredibly discouraging when we improved so much in P1-3 this second try, only to slam against the brick wall in P4. Incredibly demoralizing.
It would be a chore and a pain to coordinate even if you don’t have an international guild with different time zone to take into consideration. Just scrap this feature and let ppl zerg it down. It will still be hard to beat for most guilds.
B1 gets 1 turn.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/kfc27l/fun_raid/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3
350m+ gp international guild
First run
p1: 8 ppl
p2: 9 ppl
p3-p4 was quite easy and we blew it apart by bursting through it on fast mode.
2nd run
p1: 8 ppl
p2: 10 ppl
We are holding for p3-p4 run which we chose a time where both european+us folk can possibly attend in 5 hours. Doubt we'll have more than 30 actives. Seeing how many guilds are on 400 (succeeded 2 runs) it will probably be doable, but we rather err on the side of caution.
I think the raid itself is flawed in that even on a good run, you get a couple turns and your team is dead.
I have an alt account and have played the original pit with less than ideal characters and even at g8 or so you can get to enrage. You still don't get massive damage without the tm removal but you at least get to take turns.
I think it would have been much better to boost the boss's health or defense to achieve the same results rather than having it one shot relic toons. At least then you get to play until enrage.
Add that to the ramping damage if your guildmates knock it below 80% health and you get the boss killing you without getting a turn. That isn't a fun experience.
This depends on the team very much. Rey+clones consistently gets to enrage which is what I like about it compared to initial hstr times where a team can go under very fast after losing an integral toon.
If the first, I think the difficulty is somewhat defensible (albeit a horrible mechanic). If it's what we're seeing now, blah.