Realy Instinct u cant play fair arent u? U need to exploid everything in the game? Buy everything, even the devs, get all Infos.. Tzz nr1 guild for Bug using congrat's. Feel free to copy combos from others and Feel happy to rush the raid Solo u are just jokes. Coordination for sure...
Second warning.
Stay on-topic. Personal (or guild) insults or attacks will swiftly get this thread closed.
If making a bazillion alts is okay then I'll belive it when it's posted in game development notes and it arrives in everyones in-game mailbox...till then it is something that we should be talking about like the bubonic plauge.
I am just glad that the TI folks took that tagline regarding playing with "integrity" off their SWGOH.GG post. All I could think was, "You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means!"
By integrity you mean playing within the established rule set right? Check. I think we're good then.
When I read the post about guild hopping the thought someone could make a bunch of alternate accounts with different reward times to get way more gear than CG intended didn't even cross my mind. Your guild, and others who followed are definitely exploiting, as I don't believe CG themselves saw this one coming. They didn't leave this loophole in and think it was fine. Just because you're allowed to change guilds doesn't mean you can artificially and systematically add coins to your bank and raid more than everyone else.
We specifically asked a Dev if the altfactory was allowable before we did it. They said yes.
This is a huge smoking gun. That is hugely damning of this whole thing and the trust we should put in the Devs. That they acknowledge this privately and didn't discuss it openly feels very sketchy to me.
Pretty sure anyone can send the devs a message. People have messages john for assistance when customer support screwed them over. Heck I've even sent him a message tell him to toss Loki the office dog a treat for me and he replied lol
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
I am just glad that the TI folks took that tagline regarding playing with "integrity" off their SWGOH.GG post. All I could think was, "You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means!"
By integrity you mean playing within the established rule set right? Check. I think we're good then.
When I read the post about guild hopping the thought someone could make a bunch of alternate accounts with different reward times to get way more gear than CG intended didn't even cross my mind. Your guild, and others who followed are definitely exploiting, as I don't believe CG themselves saw this one coming. They didn't leave this loophole in and think it was fine. Just because you're allowed to change guilds doesn't mean you can artificially and systematically add coins to your bank and raid more than everyone else.
We specifically asked a Dev if the altfactory was allowable before we did it. They said yes.
This is a huge smoking gun. That is hugely damning of this whole thing and the trust we should put in the Devs. That they acknowledge this privately and didn't discuss it openly feels very sketchy to me.
What he means is I specifically asked INARJ plenty of questions relating to alts and guild hopping in the post he made about it when this all came to light, and he responded directly to me. We asked questions right out in the open for everyone to see.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
We broke no rules. In fact we made sure it wasn't against the rules before we did it.
And when a leaderboard is mathematically decided by your ability to horde coins and spend them at the exact perfect time...that is a lame leaderboard. (No offense to order 66. They nailed this and deserve all the credit for maximizing the time/math needed to do it)
Well all the power to you bro. But you do realize that when everybody knows how its being done it kinda loses its sheen. Compared to the glory you guys got when you first completed heroic, this is quite petty. Nobody is applauding.
When lvl 70 was raised amd ppl alost insta jumped to 70 in 2/3 days... They did it funding energy via crystals amd hoarding.
Well here alta were funded and used.
Until this actually is prevented, i dont see what all the fuss is about. Something that anyone could do was done. Some are doing other arent. Same as hoarding energy back in the days.
This is not against TOS and is part of the game mechanics.
Laws and rules are made based on people's perception of right and wrong, fair and unfair.
The rules in this game are dictated and determined by the devs. At this current time the process of rotating alts in is 100% legal based on those who make the rules. Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant outside of a push for change.
Everything @Barrok said is spot on. We knew this would cause a stink on the forums. We were discussing the firestorm it would cause all day. We play to win. Sorry, we're not sorry about that. We will continue to push the envelope within the rules. You will find players who do this is every single competitive game you play, both online and in life. If that's something you (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically at you) cannot handle, come to terms with, or understand, then competition is not for you.
That's fine. I can appreciate the 'whatever it takes' to win attitude. But realize you have been exposed as frauds and your name is forever tarnished. I for one looked up to many of you guys as grounbreakers and leaders in the community.
In a game where your cash investment dictates s large amount of your success, why in gods name are you looking up to anyone? Lol
'Look up to:' Have a great deal of respect for
In terms of right and wrong being subjective. A guild mate posted this:
This takes me back to college Philosophy and Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative. Notwithstanding artificial laws, there are higher truths and higher laws. For example, even if one society condones murder, the Categorical Imperative points to a higher respect for life. The basis of this imperative stems from the ineffable, that we call our conscience. Puru is absolutely right that the moral compass should rise higher than what 'rules created by devs' would allow. What's right is right. Sorry to go heavy on you guys. As I said, I feel strongly about this topic.
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
I am just glad that the TI folks took that tagline regarding playing with "integrity" off their SWGOH.GG post. All I could think was, "You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means!"
By integrity you mean playing within the established rule set right? Check. I think we're good then.
When I read the post about guild hopping the thought someone could make a bunch of alternate accounts with different reward times to get way more gear than CG intended didn't even cross my mind. Your guild, and others who followed are definitely exploiting, as I don't believe CG themselves saw this one coming. They didn't leave this loophole in and think it was fine. Just because you're allowed to change guilds doesn't mean you can artificially and systematically add coins to your bank and raid more than everyone else.
We specifically asked a Dev if the altfactory was allowable before we did it. They said yes.
One of your guildmates already said this was not the case. so you are saying they made a vague post about people getting banned for exploiting guild hopping and then told one guild that guild hopping was an ok way of exploiting the 600 a day guild coin contribution? CG is the one sounding the worst here
INRAJ made more than one vague post. I find it amusing that people are jumping to conclusions that I or someone else had a private conversation with a Dev about this. If I had meant this I would have said this. These discussions all occurred on this forum with INRAJ. It caused a huge stink and people attacked him over it, sometimes personally. I'm not sure how anyone can forget that or interpret his comments as "vague".
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
Realy Instinct u cant play fair arent u? U need to exploid everything in the game? Buy everything, even the devs, get all Infos.. Tzz nr1 guild for Bug using congrat's. Feel free to copy combos from others and Feel happy to rush the raid Solo u are just jokes. Coordination for sure...
Second warning.
Stay on-topic. Personal (or guild) insults or attacks will swiftly get this thread closed.
FashionFett.
Or you could keep the thread going and moderate by editing posts
We broke no rules. In fact we made sure it wasn't against the rules before we did it.
And when a leaderboard is mathematically decided by your ability to horde coins and spend them at the exact perfect time...that is a lame leaderboard. (No offense to order 66. They nailed this and deserve all the credit for maximizing the time/math needed to do it)
Well all the power to you bro. But you do realize that when everybody knows how its being done it kinda loses its sheen. Compared to the glory you guys got when you first completed heroic, this is quite petty. Nobody is applauding.
When lvl 70 was raised amd ppl alost insta jumped to 70 in 2/3 days... They did it funding energy via crystals amd hoarding.
Well here alta were funded and used.
Until this actually is prevented, i dont see what all the fuss is about. Something that anyone could do was done. Some are doing other arent. Same as hoarding energy back in the days.
This is not against TOS and is part of the game mechanics.
Laws and rules are made based on people's perception of right and wrong, fair and unfair.
The rules in this game are dictated and determined by the devs. At this current time the process of rotating alts in is 100% legal based on those who make the rules. Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant outside of a push for change.
Everything @Barrok said is spot on. We knew this would cause a stink on the forums. We were discussing the firestorm it would cause all day. We play to win. Sorry, we're not sorry about that. We will continue to push the envelope within the rules. You will find players who do this is every single competitive game you play, both online and in life. If that's something you (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically at you) cannot handle, come to terms with, or understand, then competition is not for you.
That's fine. I can appreciate the 'whatever it takes' to win attitude. But realize you have been exposed as frauds and your name is forever tarnished. I for one looked up to many of you guys as grounbreakers and leaders in the community.
In a game where your cash investment dictates s large amount of your success, why in gods name are you looking up to anyone? Lol
'Look up to:' Have a great deal of respect for
In terms of right and wrong being subjective. A guild mate posted this:
This takes me back to college Philosophy and Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative. Notwithstanding artificial laws, there are higher truths and higher laws. For example, even if one society condones murder, the Categorical Imperative points to a higher respect for life. The basis of this imperative stems from the ineffable, that we call our conscience. Puru is absolutely right that the moral compass should rise higher than what 'rules created by devs' would allow. What's right is right. Sorry to go heavy on you guys. As I said, I feel strongly about this topic.
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
Heck we're making an alt factory separate guild to build up coins too so we can jump over and do some extra heroics now and then.
But using alts and bringing them into your own guild to increase your own guild coin count to more than 30k each day then booting those alts out is something entirely different. That's an exploit.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
They have already lost all their credibility.
The entire SWGOH universe now knows who they are.
They got greedy and now it will back-fire.
Backfire how?
So many people make all these posts like "They gonna regret this now! You just watch! This is gonna backfire on them so hard! Oh man!"
I'm pretty sure we aren't reaching our hands out for anything any time soon. We just do our own thing, man. We didn't go poking anyone with sticks over this. We didn't try to throw up gang signs or beat war drums over this. We just did our thing, people noticed, flipped out and now we're defending our actions.
What's the full recourse over this backfiring though? I'm very curious what fate we're all doomed to suffer now!
Realy Instinct u cant play fair arent u? U need to exploid everything in the game? Buy everything, even the devs, get all Infos.. Tzz nr1 guild for Bug using congrat's. Feel free to copy combos from others and Feel happy to rush the raid Solo u are just jokes. Coordination for sure...
Second warning.
Stay on-topic. Personal (or guild) insults or attacks will swiftly get this thread closed.
FashionFett.
Or you could keep the thread going and moderate by editing posts
This isn't the first nor will it be the last thread on the topic and all with the similar flames and spam. Again, stay on topic and keep personal (or Guild) insults or attacks or accusations out of it.
We broke no rules. In fact we made sure it wasn't against the rules before we did it.
And when a leaderboard is mathematically decided by your ability to horde coins and spend them at the exact perfect time...that is a lame leaderboard. (No offense to order 66. They nailed this and deserve all the credit for maximizing the time/math needed to do it)
Well all the power to you bro. But you do realize that when everybody knows how its being done it kinda loses its sheen. Compared to the glory you guys got when you first completed heroic, this is quite petty. Nobody is applauding.
When lvl 70 was raised amd ppl alost insta jumped to 70 in 2/3 days... They did it funding energy via crystals amd hoarding.
Well here alta were funded and used.
Until this actually is prevented, i dont see what all the fuss is about. Something that anyone could do was done. Some are doing other arent. Same as hoarding energy back in the days.
This is not against TOS and is part of the game mechanics.
Laws and rules are made based on people's perception of right and wrong, fair and unfair.
The rules in this game are dictated and determined by the devs. At this current time the process of rotating alts in is 100% legal based on those who make the rules. Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant outside of a push for change.
Everything @Barrok said is spot on. We knew this would cause a stink on the forums. We were discussing the firestorm it would cause all day. We play to win. Sorry, we're not sorry about that. We will continue to push the envelope within the rules. You will find players who do this is every single competitive game you play, both online and in life. If that's something you (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically at you) cannot handle, come to terms with, or understand, then competition is not for you.
That's fine. I can appreciate the 'whatever it takes' to win attitude. But realize you have been exposed as frauds and your name is forever tarnished. I for one looked up to many of you guys as grounbreakers and leaders in the community.
In a game where your cash investment dictates s large amount of your success, why in gods name are you looking up to anyone? Lol
'Look up to:' Have a great deal of respect for
In terms of right and wrong being subjective. A guild mate posted this:
This takes me back to college Philosophy and Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative. Notwithstanding artificial laws, there are higher truths and higher laws. For example, even if one society condones murder, the Categorical Imperative points to a higher respect for life. The basis of this imperative stems from the ineffable, that we call our conscience. Puru is absolutely right that the moral compass should rise higher than what 'rules created by devs' would allow. What's right is right. Sorry to go heavy on you guys. As I said, I feel strongly about this topic.
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
Heck we're making an alt factory separate guild to build up coins too so we can jump over and do some extra heroics now and then.
But using alts and bringing them into your own guild to increase your own guild coin count to more than 30k each day then booting those alts out is something entirely different. That's an exploit.
Can you explain to me the definition of exploit? To me, an exploit would be this: 300,000/150,000. If we were able to go around the hard cap by destroying ingame barricades designed to prevent anyone from going above the cap, I'd agree.
Everyone says there is a cap of 30,000 a day. Please point me to this bylaw. There is a 50 member cap. We don't have 100/50 members. We don't have member contribution 1200/600 daily currency.
The problem, as I see it, not everyone has a clue what is an exploit vs what is playing the game as the rules allow. The difference is significant and is muddied up with emotion.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Man, this is a game on a phone and an action the people who made the game have posted on this forum that they are OK with. Agree with their decision or not, a player or guilds "moral compass " has nothing to do with this
Some of these statements about how ftp should be on a level playing field with people who spend thousands are absolutely mind boggling to me
At the end of the day, we just want to raid to gear up our characters. The developers gave the ok for a way to be able to do this more often, so we engaged in the action . ANY PERSON, reading this could do this same thing, so we are not getting an advantage. Everyone knows we're doing it, so if we have somehow misinterpreted INRAJ'S post on the topic (which I doubt), the devs know now as well.
If your moral compass is wound so tight that you can't take advantage of a game mechanic that is out in the open and you've been told doesn't violate game rules, that's fine. If you don't like this mechanic and want to complain in hopes that the devs change it, I wish you the best of luck and, in fact, fully support you. I don't know of anyone in our guild that actually wants this to remain part of the game. But please, enough of the high and might, sadly misplaced, moral judgements.
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
They have already lost all their credibility.
The entire SWGOH universe now knows who they are.
They got greedy and now it will back-fire.
Backfire how?
So many people make all these posts like "They gonna regret this now! You just watch! This is gonna backfire on them so hard! Oh man!"
I'm pretty sure we aren't reaching our hands out for anything any time soon. We just do our own thing, man. We didn't go poking anyone with sticks over this. We didn't try to throw up gang signs or beat war drums over this. We just did our thing, people noticed, flipped out and now we're defending our actions.
What's the full recourse over this backfiring though? I'm very curious what fate we're all doomed to suffer now!
It is not like that TI will get punished, it is that TI's reckless actions will punish every single player in the future. Personally I don't have any problems with TI being this game's top guild, but such abusing of the system should not be tolarented by any players who truly love this game.
We broke no rules. In fact we made sure it wasn't against the rules before we did it.
And when a leaderboard is mathematically decided by your ability to horde coins and spend them at the exact perfect time...that is a lame leaderboard. (No offense to order 66. They nailed this and deserve all the credit for maximizing the time/math needed to do it)
Well all the power to you bro. But you do realize that when everybody knows how its being done it kinda loses its sheen. Compared to the glory you guys got when you first completed heroic, this is quite petty. Nobody is applauding.
When lvl 70 was raised amd ppl alost insta jumped to 70 in 2/3 days... They did it funding energy via crystals amd hoarding.
Well here alta were funded and used.
Until this actually is prevented, i dont see what all the fuss is about. Something that anyone could do was done. Some are doing other arent. Same as hoarding energy back in the days.
This is not against TOS and is part of the game mechanics.
Laws and rules are made based on people's perception of right and wrong, fair and unfair.
The rules in this game are dictated and determined by the devs. At this current time the process of rotating alts in is 100% legal based on those who make the rules. Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant outside of a push for change.
Everything @Barrok said is spot on. We knew this would cause a stink on the forums. We were discussing the firestorm it would cause all day. We play to win. Sorry, we're not sorry about that. We will continue to push the envelope within the rules. You will find players who do this is every single competitive game you play, both online and in life. If that's something you (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically at you) cannot handle, come to terms with, or understand, then competition is not for you.
That's fine. I can appreciate the 'whatever it takes' to win attitude. But realize you have been exposed as frauds and your name is forever tarnished. I for one looked up to many of you guys as grounbreakers and leaders in the community.
In a game where your cash investment dictates s large amount of your success, why in gods name are you looking up to anyone? Lol
'Look up to:' Have a great deal of respect for
In terms of right and wrong being subjective. A guild mate posted this:
This takes me back to college Philosophy and Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative. Notwithstanding artificial laws, there are higher truths and higher laws. For example, even if one society condones murder, the Categorical Imperative points to a higher respect for life. The basis of this imperative stems from the ineffable, that we call our conscience. Puru is absolutely right that the moral compass should rise higher than what 'rules created by devs' would allow. What's right is right. Sorry to go heavy on you guys. As I said, I feel strongly about this topic.
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
Heck we're making an alt factory separate guild to build up coins too so we can jump over and do some extra heroics now and then.
But using alts and bringing them into your own guild to increase your own guild coin count to more than 30k each day then booting those alts out is something entirely different. That's an exploit.
Why is this in any way different?
In what scenario is one breaking rules where the other isn't?
Both involve using alts to collect coins and moving them in and out of a guild for full production.
What part of the separate processes do you feel is in some way different?
We broke no rules. In fact we made sure it wasn't against the rules before we did it.
And when a leaderboard is mathematically decided by your ability to horde coins and spend them at the exact perfect time...that is a lame leaderboard. (No offense to order 66. They nailed this and deserve all the credit for maximizing the time/math needed to do it)
Well all the power to you bro. But you do realize that when everybody knows how its being done it kinda loses its sheen. Compared to the glory you guys got when you first completed heroic, this is quite petty. Nobody is applauding.
When lvl 70 was raised amd ppl alost insta jumped to 70 in 2/3 days... They did it funding energy via crystals amd hoarding.
Well here alta were funded and used.
Until this actually is prevented, i dont see what all the fuss is about. Something that anyone could do was done. Some are doing other arent. Same as hoarding energy back in the days.
This is not against TOS and is part of the game mechanics.
Laws and rules are made based on people's perception of right and wrong, fair and unfair.
The rules in this game are dictated and determined by the devs. At this current time the process of rotating alts in is 100% legal based on those who make the rules. Your personal opinion on the matter is irrelevant outside of a push for change.
Everything @Barrok said is spot on. We knew this would cause a stink on the forums. We were discussing the firestorm it would cause all day. We play to win. Sorry, we're not sorry about that. We will continue to push the envelope within the rules. You will find players who do this is every single competitive game you play, both online and in life. If that's something you (and I mean that in a general sense, not specifically at you) cannot handle, come to terms with, or understand, then competition is not for you.
That's fine. I can appreciate the 'whatever it takes' to win attitude. But realize you have been exposed as frauds and your name is forever tarnished. I for one looked up to many of you guys as grounbreakers and leaders in the community.
In a game where your cash investment dictates s large amount of your success, why in gods name are you looking up to anyone? Lol
'Look up to:' Have a great deal of respect for
In terms of right and wrong being subjective. A guild mate posted this:
This takes me back to college Philosophy and Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative. Notwithstanding artificial laws, there are higher truths and higher laws. For example, even if one society condones murder, the Categorical Imperative points to a higher respect for life. The basis of this imperative stems from the ineffable, that we call our conscience. Puru is absolutely right that the moral compass should rise higher than what 'rules created by devs' would allow. What's right is right. Sorry to go heavy on you guys. As I said, I feel strongly about this topic.
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
Heck we're making an alt factory separate guild to build up coins too so we can jump over and do some extra heroics now and then.
But using alts and bringing them into your own guild to increase your own guild coin count to more than 30k each day then booting those alts out is something entirely different. That's an exploit.
Can you explain to me the definition of exploit? To me, an exploit would be this: 300,000/150,000. If we were able to go around the hard cap by destroying ingame barricades designed to prevent anyone from going above the cap, I'd agree.
Everyone says there is a cap of 30,000 a day. Please point me to this bylaw. There is a 50 member cap. We don't have 100/50 members. We don't have member contribution 1200/600 daily currency.
The problem, as I see it, not everyone has a clue what is an exploit vs what is playing the game as the rules allow. The difference is significant and is muddied up with emotion.
Until it is clarified whether earning more than 30k a day by a single guild is 'working as intended', I will continue to claim that it is an exploit. If this turns out to be ok'd by the devs like guild hopping was, then I'll change my opinion.
What I find so ironic is that a lot of players who had so vehemently protested guild hopping and alts are saying one thing and doing the exact opposite.
Forum mates sit down, pull up a chair, I want to discuss winning at this game.
CG has given us a very flawed exploitable guild system.
1) Many are using it to guild hop and grab extra raids. Due to cooldowns can effectively double raid loot.
This is smart. Running two raids at once is an exploit brought up that does pay. Pays double.
But people have to like you and want you to join in. Which brings me to...
2) Many are apparently running alts to make 1400 currency this month instead of 1200. That is a 16.6% increase.
This allows a guild to be at the top of a largely nonproductive leaderboard.
It is a very heavy and taxing usage of manpower. It is actually sadly pathetic cost of human capital. I wish they paid mining squads...
Fortunately no one wants any members of a guild who does this to hop into their raid so they stand on the sidelines and get hungry and jealous at the players around them with better gear and Han shards.
Guilds w alts also have very high level players getting bottom 5 rewards which is a fraction of what they could be in mixed guilds.
The one extra exploitative raid is a sad mechanism that is unproductive in terms of time used to do it. Cost to make alts and loot generated.
Before we all freak out look how weakly geared squads they post are (Rhymes with Naraxus). This is not winning.
I call that a Gaming Scrub. Once a scrub always a scrub.
Calm down with your rhetoric. Cg will fix it and the results speak for themselves. They are alone where the rest of us are frolicking in a multi raid EASB world.
Now if they have something else in store for us using unintentional exploits maybe I will actually make issue of it when it impresses me in terms of time consumption and yield. This ratio is flat out weak here. Bots aren't doing this. Gamers eating Doritos are in dark basements.
This is so bull. When I saw TI went up with 1400, the first thing I thought about is, "wow, this guild is really cool, they were willing to sacrifice the progress of the other guild they own just to put their name on top". I knew one can use Alts to boost GC to do more raid, but that's clearly exploitive, and possibly bannable practices in any other games, and can't believe TI actually does it. If they did it by sacrificing the other guild they own, I would have been saying "hats off to them". But when I saw the other TI guild they own clearly didn't suffer from less raid points, and now TI members came to forums to defend such clearly exploitive practices, all the reputation that they have accumulated just went down to the drain. "Great jobs" to whoever made that decision at TI, don't even try to sugar dress what you have done, such as "we tried to raise the awareness now, we could have waited until end of month type of bull".
If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.
people clearly need a place to voice their feelings on this subject, but a lot of these posts are on the line of personal attacks, outright trolling, and spam. feel free to be upset, but i'd rather this thread not end up getting closed because a few individuals can't keep things civil.
What are your thoughts Miss 80? It seems like youre not on here defending this because maybe inside you feel wrong about it right??
I am just glad that the TI folks took that tagline regarding playing with "integrity" off their SWGOH.GG post. All I could think was, "You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means!"
By integrity you mean playing within the established rule set right? Check. I think we're good then.
When I read the post about guild hopping the thought someone could make a bunch of alternate accounts with different reward times to get way more gear than CG intended didn't even cross my mind. Your guild, and others who followed are definitely exploiting, as I don't believe CG themselves saw this one coming. They didn't leave this loophole in and think it was fine. Just because you're allowed to change guilds doesn't mean you can artificially and systematically add coins to your bank and raid more than everyone else.
We specifically asked a Dev if the altfactory was allowable before we did it. They said yes.
This is a huge smoking gun. That is hugely damning of this whole thing and the trust we should put in the Devs. That they acknowledge this privately and didn't discuss it openly feels very sketchy to me.
Pretty sure anyone can send the devs a message. People have messages john for assistance when customer support screwed them over. Heck I've even sent him a message tell him to toss Loki the office dog a treat for me and he replied lol
Replies
Second warning.
Stay on-topic. Personal (or guild) insults or attacks will swiftly get this thread closed.
FashionFett.
Once again make a decision.
Pretty sure anyone can send the devs a message. People have messages john for assistance when customer support screwed them over. Heck I've even sent him a message tell him to toss Loki the office dog a treat for me and he replied lol
Don't you see that there's nothing about f2p or p2p?People didn't get jealous/mad when GG was firstly obtained by TI, because that was done fairly without exploiting. Alt acc is different. I believe that I have spent more money on this game than an average TI member, and I used to admire TI for its hardcore gaming spirit. However, I am beginning to question TI's legitimacy as SWGoH's best/most respected guild, as what you are doing today will jeopardize the future of this game and it's players.
What he means is I specifically asked INARJ plenty of questions relating to alts and guild hopping in the post he made about it when this all came to light, and he responded directly to me. We asked questions right out in the open for everyone to see.
How much money we talking bout here lol
The artificial law is that the Bringing alts into the guild is harmful. That would be aritificial because it would be crafted. Alts are not bad by virtue. Adding alts isn't harmful to society. You really used a quote working against your own backing.
Mala en se and mala prohibita. That's what we are talking about here. Alt factory isn't bad by its nature.
INRAJ made more than one vague post. I find it amusing that people are jumping to conclusions that I or someone else had a private conversation with a Dev about this. If I had meant this I would have said this. These discussions all occurred on this forum with INRAJ. It caused a huge stink and people attacked him over it, sometimes personally. I'm not sure how anyone can forget that or interpret his comments as "vague".
The arrogance on this one is unreal.
They have already lost all their credibility.
The entire SWGOH universe now knows who they are.
They got greedy and now it will back-fire.
Or you could keep the thread going and moderate by editing posts
Heck we're making an alt factory separate guild to build up coins too so we can jump over and do some extra heroics now and then.
But using alts and bringing them into your own guild to increase your own guild coin count to more than 30k each day then booting those alts out is something entirely different. That's an exploit.
Backfire how?
So many people make all these posts like "They gonna regret this now! You just watch! This is gonna backfire on them so hard! Oh man!"
I'm pretty sure we aren't reaching our hands out for anything any time soon. We just do our own thing, man. We didn't go poking anyone with sticks over this. We didn't try to throw up gang signs or beat war drums over this. We just did our thing, people noticed, flipped out and now we're defending our actions.
What's the full recourse over this backfiring though? I'm very curious what fate we're all doomed to suffer now!
Just imagine of the leaderboards actually had some kind of end of the month reward lol.
This isn't the first nor will it be the last thread on the topic and all with the similar flames and spam. Again, stay on topic and keep personal (or Guild) insults or attacks or accusations out of it.
FashionFett.
So why bother exploiting your way to the top of it? CG already makes sure the coding works so that your name appears first anyways.
Completely agree. It's actually quite sad.
Can you explain to me the definition of exploit? To me, an exploit would be this: 300,000/150,000. If we were able to go around the hard cap by destroying ingame barricades designed to prevent anyone from going above the cap, I'd agree.
Everyone says there is a cap of 30,000 a day. Please point me to this bylaw. There is a 50 member cap. We don't have 100/50 members. We don't have member contribution 1200/600 daily currency.
The problem, as I see it, not everyone has a clue what is an exploit vs what is playing the game as the rules allow. The difference is significant and is muddied up with emotion.
What? How can the game be coded for us to always be in first AND for us have to work our way back to the top?
It is not like that TI will get punished, it is that TI's reckless actions will punish every single player in the future. Personally I don't have any problems with TI being this game's top guild, but such abusing of the system should not be tolarented by any players who truly love this game.
Tiebreaker code...duh
Why is this in any way different?
In what scenario is one breaking rules where the other isn't?
Both involve using alts to collect coins and moving them in and out of a guild for full production.
What part of the separate processes do you feel is in some way different?
They seem identical to me.
This alt crud is like insider trading on wall street.
Personally im not gonna invest the time and effort into it. But having a clear statement on issue from EA would be appropriate about now.
Until it is clarified whether earning more than 30k a day by a single guild is 'working as intended', I will continue to claim that it is an exploit. If this turns out to be ok'd by the devs like guild hopping was, then I'll change my opinion.
"the lady doth protest too much... "
Forum mates sit down, pull up a chair, I want to discuss winning at this game.
CG has given us a very flawed exploitable guild system.
1) Many are using it to guild hop and grab extra raids. Due to cooldowns can effectively double raid loot.
This is smart. Running two raids at once is an exploit brought up that does pay. Pays double.
But people have to like you and want you to join in. Which brings me to...
2) Many are apparently running alts to make 1400 currency this month instead of 1200. That is a 16.6% increase.
This allows a guild to be at the top of a largely nonproductive leaderboard.
It is a very heavy and taxing usage of manpower. It is actually sadly pathetic cost of human capital. I wish they paid mining squads...
Fortunately no one wants any members of a guild who does this to hop into their raid so they stand on the sidelines and get hungry and jealous at the players around them with better gear and Han shards.
Guilds w alts also have very high level players getting bottom 5 rewards which is a fraction of what they could be in mixed guilds.
The one extra exploitative raid is a sad mechanism that is unproductive in terms of time used to do it. Cost to make alts and loot generated.
Before we all freak out look how weakly geared squads they post are (Rhymes with Naraxus). This is not winning.
I call that a Gaming Scrub. Once a scrub always a scrub.
Calm down with your rhetoric. Cg will fix it and the results speak for themselves. They are alone where the rest of us are frolicking in a multi raid EASB world.
Now if they have something else in store for us using unintentional exploits maybe I will actually make issue of it when it impresses me in terms of time consumption and yield. This ratio is flat out weak here. Bots aren't doing this. Gamers eating Doritos are in dark basements.
If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.
What are your thoughts Miss 80? It seems like youre not on here defending this because maybe inside you feel wrong about it right??
Lol