Star Wars: The Last Jedi Spoiler thread

Replies

  • DatBoi
    3572 posts Member
    DatBoi wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    I have actually liked both of the new films. Interesting stories, and mysteries to be solved. Not everything is spoon-fed like ... some other movies I have seen.

    But Rey has not failed at anything, that makes her a Mary Sue. The only time I saw her do anything that might be considered a failure was when Kylo captured her.

    Rey better not be Luke's daughter. There is no explanation for him abandoning a five year old on Jakku and leaving her to a life of scavenging. Simply unacceptable for it to work out that way.

    Well, they already made Luke out to be a coward and feint-hearted so why not a child deserter while their at it.

    What?

    Well maybe coward was a little too much. He did run away to a secluded island without telling anyone where he was(except R2) to basically just pout.

    He went into hiding because he failed as a Jedi Master. He had one job, one responsibility, and he messed up. He's feeling an enormous amount of guilt over how he failed Ben/Kylo, Han, Leia, and the Jedi Legacy. This opens up a lot of potentially interesting aspects of his character in TLJ where Rey has to remind him who he is, and convince him that there is a battle worth fighting. And I'm excited to explore that part of his character.

    It seems like anytime any character shows any sort of weakness or realistic personality (Kylo Ren, Old Luke, characters from Rebels, etc), people automatically consider them a "bad" character. These seem to be the same people who's favorite characters are Mace Windu, General Grievous, Darth Maul, and other lifeless, emotionless "[email protected]$$es". Well the quality of a character isn't (or shouldn't) be determined by how many flips they can do, its determined by the strength, plausibility, consistency, and realism of their personalities.

    That's all well and good but the original trilogy portrayed Luke as one to never give up on anything he believes in; for instance,
    1.he goes to save his friends from a known trap against the advice of his mentors
    2.after he finds his father is one of the worst people in the known galaxy(idk about you but I would be traumatized) he continues to preserve to help his father and to stop the empire.
    Now in Tfa one of his student turns to the dark side and he just ups and leaves everyone he loves behind. I would call that pretty inconsistent.
    Btw I never said it's bad for a character to be flawed or show emotion I just can't stand a character who is written inconsistently more than anything.
    Characters that are shallow but consistent in their motivation and decisions are better and more bearable than ones that aren't imho. That is why I think R1 is a better overall movie than Tfa.
    Fair enough, but its worth mentioning that we're kidding ourselves if we think we know what happened with the knights of ren and the jedi academy.
  • No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



  • Velocitious
    276 posts Member
    edited April 2017
    DatBoi wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    I have actually liked both of the new films. Interesting stories, and mysteries to be solved. Not everything is spoon-fed like ... some other movies I have seen.

    But Rey has not failed at anything, that makes her a Mary Sue. The only time I saw her do anything that might be considered a failure was when Kylo captured her.

    Rey better not be Luke's daughter. There is no explanation for him abandoning a five year old on Jakku and leaving her to a life of scavenging. Simply unacceptable for it to work out that way.

    Well, they already made Luke out to be a coward and feint-hearted so why not a child deserter while their at it.

    What?

    Well maybe coward was a little too much. He did run away to a secluded island without telling anyone where he was(except R2) to basically just pout.

    He went into hiding because he failed as a Jedi Master. He had one job, one responsibility, and he messed up. He's feeling an enormous amount of guilt over how he failed Ben/Kylo, Han, Leia, and the Jedi Legacy. This opens up a lot of potentially interesting aspects of his character in TLJ where Rey has to remind him who he is, and convince him that there is a battle worth fighting. And I'm excited to explore that part of his character.

    It seems like anytime any character shows any sort of weakness or realistic personality (Kylo Ren, Old Luke, characters from Rebels, etc), people automatically consider them a "bad" character. These seem to be the same people who's favorite characters are Mace Windu, General Grievous, Darth Maul, and other lifeless, emotionless "[email protected]$$es". Well the quality of a character isn't (or shouldn't) be determined by how many flips they can do, its determined by the strength, plausibility, consistency, and realism of their personalities.

    That's all well and good but the original trilogy portrayed Luke as one to never give up on anything he believes in; for instance,
    1.he goes to save his friends from a known trap against the advice of his mentors
    2.after he finds his father is one of the worst people in the known galaxy(idk about you but I would be traumatized) he continues to preserve to help his father and to stop the empire.
    Now in Tfa one of his student turns to the dark side and he just ups and leaves everyone he loves behind. I would call that pretty inconsistent.
    Btw I never said it's bad for a character to be flawed or show emotion I just can't stand a character who is written inconsistently more than anything.
    Characters that are shallow but consistent in their motivation and decisions are better and more bearable than ones that aren't imho. That is why I think R1 is a better overall movie than Tfa.

    So if Yoda leaves everyone behind and doesn't defend the whole galaxy his character is already bad? Luke ran away for a reason. What if he was actually finding stuff on how to destroy the Supreme Leader or the Knights of Ren? It would've not only saved the lives of his loved ones but the whole galaxy. Clearly he made a right choice.

    Rogue One is no way better than TFA. Just because everyone dies doesn't mean that it's the better than TFA. I hate people saying "omg r1 is gud bc every1 dies!!11!" or "tfa sucks bc the characters are so lame unlike r1".
  • DatBoi
    3572 posts Member
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
  • Gebuttersnaps
    478 posts Member
    edited April 2017
    DatBoi wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    I have actually liked both of the new films. Interesting stories, and mysteries to be solved. Not everything is spoon-fed like ... some other movies I have seen.

    But Rey has not failed at anything, that makes her a Mary Sue. The only time I saw her do anything that might be considered a failure was when Kylo captured her.

    Rey better not be Luke's daughter. There is no explanation for him abandoning a five year old on Jakku and leaving her to a life of scavenging. Simply unacceptable for it to work out that way.

    Well, they already made Luke out to be a coward and feint-hearted so why not a child deserter while their at it.

    What?

    Well maybe coward was a little too much. He did run away to a secluded island without telling anyone where he was(except R2) to basically just pout.

    He went into hiding because he failed as a Jedi Master. He had one job, one responsibility, and he messed up. He's feeling an enormous amount of guilt over how he failed Ben/Kylo, Han, Leia, and the Jedi Legacy. This opens up a lot of potentially interesting aspects of his character in TLJ where Rey has to remind him who he is, and convince him that there is a battle worth fighting. And I'm excited to explore that part of his character.

    It seems like anytime any character shows any sort of weakness or realistic personality (Kylo Ren, Old Luke, characters from Rebels, etc), people automatically consider them a "bad" character. These seem to be the same people who's favorite characters are Mace Windu, General Grievous, Darth Maul, and other lifeless, emotionless "[email protected]$$es". Well the quality of a character isn't (or shouldn't) be determined by how many flips they can do, its determined by the strength, plausibility, consistency, and realism of their personalities.

    That's all well and good but the original trilogy portrayed Luke as one to never give up on anything he believes in; for instance,
    1.he goes to save his friends from a known trap against the advice of his mentors
    2.after he finds his father is one of the worst people in the known galaxy(idk about you but I would be traumatized) he continues to preserve to help his father and to stop the empire.
    Now in Tfa one of his student turns to the dark side and he just ups and leaves everyone he loves behind. I would call that pretty inconsistent.
    Btw I never said it's bad for a character to be flawed or show emotion I just can't stand a character who is written inconsistently more than anything.
    Characters that are shallow but consistent in their motivation and decisions are better and more bearable than ones that aren't imho. That is why I think R1 is a better overall movie than Tfa.
    Fair enough, but its worth mentioning that we're kidding ourselves if we think we know what happened with the knights of ren and the jedi academy.

    True. I know this is wishful thinking, but I would love for them to make a movie covering it kinda like R1.
    DatBoi wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    I have actually liked both of the new films. Interesting stories, and mysteries to be solved. Not everything is spoon-fed like ... some other movies I have seen.

    But Rey has not failed at anything, that makes her a Mary Sue. The only time I saw her do anything that might be considered a failure was when Kylo captured her.

    Rey better not be Luke's daughter. There is no explanation for him abandoning a five year old on Jakku and leaving her to a life of scavenging. Simply unacceptable for it to work out that way.

    Well, they already made Luke out to be a coward and feint-hearted so why not a child deserter while their at it.

    What?

    Well maybe coward was a little too much. He did run away to a secluded island without telling anyone where he was(except R2) to basically just pout.

    He went into hiding because he failed as a Jedi Master. He had one job, one responsibility, and he messed up. He's feeling an enormous amount of guilt over how he failed Ben/Kylo, Han, Leia, and the Jedi Legacy. This opens up a lot of potentially interesting aspects of his character in TLJ where Rey has to remind him who he is, and convince him that there is a battle worth fighting. And I'm excited to explore that part of his character.

    It seems like anytime any character shows any sort of weakness or realistic personality (Kylo Ren, Old Luke, characters from Rebels, etc), people automatically consider them a "bad" character. These seem to be the same people who's favorite characters are Mace Windu, General Grievous, Darth Maul, and other lifeless, emotionless "[email protected]$$es". Well the quality of a character isn't (or shouldn't) be determined by how many flips they can do, its determined by the strength, plausibility, consistency, and realism of their personalities.

    That's all well and good but the original trilogy portrayed Luke as one to never give up on anything he believes in; for instance,
    1.he goes to save his friends from a known trap against the advice of his mentors
    2.after he finds his father is one of the worst people in the known galaxy(idk about you but I would be traumatized) he continues to preserve to help his father and to stop the empire.
    Now in Tfa one of his student turns to the dark side and he just ups and leaves everyone he loves behind. I would call that pretty inconsistent.
    Btw I never said it's bad for a character to be flawed or show emotion I just can't stand a character who is written inconsistently more than anything.
    Characters that are shallow but consistent in their motivation and decisions are better and more bearable than ones that aren't imho. That is why I think R1 is a better overall movie than Tfa.

    So if Yoda leaves everyone behind and doesn't defend the whole galaxy his character is already bad? Luke ran away for a reason. What if he was actually finding stuff on how to destroy the Supreme Leader or the Knights of Ren? It would've not only saved the lives of his loved ones but the whole galaxy. Clearly he made a right choice.

    Rogue One is no way better than TFA. Just because everyone dies doesn't mean that it's the better than TFA. I hate people saying "omg r1 is gud bc every1 dies!!11!" or "tfa sucks bc the characters are so lame unlike r1".

    Haha did I touch a nerve there? Ok firstly, I said it didn't fit Luke's character to run and hide from a problem I didn't say that every character should be the same way. Secondly, Yoda went to hide because the entire galaxy was ruled by his enemy and they would do everything in their power to kill him. Luke on the other hand could go pretty much anywhere in the galaxy freely. I think you're trying too hard to justify him running away if you're saying he was finding out how to defeat the Knight of Ren on that tiny little island, at best he was just meditating for who knows how long.
    You obviously didn't read what I said about R1 so heres a recap for you. I enjoyed R1 more because the motivation and decisions of the character were consistent throughout the entire movie. Idk where you got the whole "R1 is better just because everyone dies" argument, I said nothing of the kind. There are plenty of reason to like or dislike a movie, obviously you enjoy wholesome characters that are not flat but dynamic and good for you. I on the other hand enjoy movies whose characters are consistent above all else.
    So please, next time you call someone out at least argue what they actually said and not whatever crap you put in their mouth.
    Post edited by Gebuttersnaps on
  • No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?




    "They let us go. It's the only explanation for the ease of our escape. ... They're tracking us!" -- Princess Leia Yes, the Princess and her hooligans were allowed to escape so that the Empire could track the Millenium Falcon to the Rebel base on Yavin 4. It was orchestrated. "Are they away? ... You're sure the homing beacon is secure aboard their ship? I'm taking an awful risk, Vader. This had better work." -- Grand Moff Tarkin Our esteemed Moff even said so himself. Time to go watch it again, perhaps.

    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"

    Boom. Luke was far from a novice pilot. And then there's the whole part about allowing the Force to guide his attack. It was not enough for a skilled veteran pilot to target the exhaust port; Red Leader tried that and failed. No, they needed a skilled pilot tuned into the Force to hit the port.

    It's not a complicated film (one of the reasons it was great). I can easily sum it up
    • Leia hides Death Star plans on R2D2 and sends him to Tattoine
    • Leia captured by Vader
    • Luke acquires R2D2 from jawas
    • Luke learns about the Force from Obi-Wan
    • Luke & Obi-Wan hire Han Solo to take them to Alderaan
    • Luke & company "rescue" Leia from the Death Star
    • Luke uses the Force to destroy the Death Star
  • CL_Chaos
    67 posts Member
    She's related to Revan nuff said :p that's why he wasn't allowed to appear in Rebels Disney wanted him for a movie reveal.
  • Hey guys i saw we were doing rey origins but it was made within another thread so it's jumbled. Who do you guys think it is?

    My current theories....reys parents are Luke's students
    Other theory is she is anakin reincarnated . I haven't seen anyone talk about it here but that's what i believe
  • Drazz127
    769 posts Member
    I thought it's pretty obvious she's Luke's biological daughter. Luke means light giving. She's Rey... like a ray of light.
  • DatBoi
    3572 posts Member
    Nobody's being reincarnated
  • JeffVader
    88 posts Member
    She's a Palpatine.
  • Nich0142
    71 posts Member
    edited May 2017
  • Gebuttersnaps
    478 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Rey is obviously the daughter of Snoke. The real question is, who is Snoke?

    There has been new found evidence that Mace Windu is alive and well.
    dDYK48D.gif?s=sms
    You decide for yourself, but I think this is indisputable proof that Mace is in fact Snoke.
  • Syrath
    129 posts Member
    DatBoi wrote: »
    Nobody's being reincarnated

    Agree, with the flack the prequels received for Annakins birth there is no way they go anywhere near that.

    The obvious answer is most likely the correct answer here. Disney clearly doesn't want to move very far from established movie more and characters for the movies as such it makes the most sense in the context of the current cannon that Rey is a Skywalker.

    Kenobi takes too much retconning the devotee Jedi Knight that followed the code in the movies for her to be his off spring.

    Kennedy has said these are space soap operas about the Skywalker family. Now Kylo could be the actually protagonist however after his act last movie most viewers will never forgive him. Plus they fracked it up by not allowing Luke, Leia, Han and Chewy to share the screen again. Side note not a fan of recasting Han. These side movies should branch into Old Republic territory or Darth Bane to explain the Rule of 2.
  • CL_Chaos
    67 posts Member
    she is the great great great great granddaughter of Revan
  • Boo
    3591 posts Member
    @abentwookiee

    I totally agree with you. The only thing I hope is that (as per some speculation) Rey is Anakin - the next Chosen One reincarnated, which to me is another stupid idea.

    If Rey is another Chosen One, which is supposed to be such a rare event - an ancient prophecy predicted Anakin, now Rey spits out of the "force" a generation later?

    That would be like Jesus **** coming to Earth to save everyone from sin every few decades - absolutely stupid.

    Anyway - part of that prophecy has been fulfilled at least, in that the sith have been exterminated. Kylo Ren is a knight of ren and most certainly not a sith lord. Snoke is also not a sith lord, as he was in existence at the time of Vader and Palp which would conflict the Rule of Two. Snoke may have been a sith lord earlier in his life (coug, cough Darth Plagueis, cough) but that's another argument, lol

    Great theory - personally I never really broke it down like you have, and this makes total sense, along with many other hints that she is a Skywalker/Luke's daughter.
  • Boo
    3591 posts Member
    USAmazing wrote: »
    I will bet money on the fact that Rey is not going to be Luke's long lost daughter...

    I can't wait until the movie comes out just so I can read all the hate threads about how she "should" be Luke's daughter...

    I bet she will be a Skywalker... And related to Luke, but NOT his child...

    Who then? Luke and Leia's secret sibling "Lobwab"?
  • Supercat
    3250 posts Member
    Boo wrote: »
    @abentwookiee

    I totally agree with you. The only thing I hope is that (as per some speculation) Rey is Anakin - the next Chosen One reincarnated, which to me is another **** idea.

    If Rey is another Chosen One, which is supposed to be such a rare event - an ancient prophecy predicted Anakin, now Rey spits out of the "force" a generation later?

    That would be like Jesus **** coming to Earth to save everyone from sin every few decades - absolutely ****.

    Anyway - part of that prophecy has been fulfilled at least, in that the sith have been exterminated. Kylo Ren is a knight of ren and most certainly not a sith lord. Snoke is also not a sith lord, as he was in existence at the time of Vader and Palp which would conflict the Rule of Two. Snoke may have been a sith lord earlier in his life (coug, cough Darth Plagueis, cough) but that's another argument, lol

    Great theory - personally I never really broke it down like you have, and this makes total sense, along with many other hints that she is a Skywalker/Luke's daughter.

    Jar jar?
    Don't be a ****(4), and follow forum guidelines.
  • NicWester
    6770 posts Member
    Easier way to shut down the argument:
    "Yeah, sure, she's a Mary Sue. But so was Luke, Gilgamesh, Odysseus, and Liu Bei. Who cares? Go away."
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • NicWester
    6770 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.
    It was not enough for a skilled veteran pilot to target the exhaust port; Red Leader tried that and failed. No, they needed a skilled pilot tuned into the Force to hit the port.
    So... It took magic powers that no other character in the movie has? A forgotten art rediscovered by one brave soul who believed it despite all evidence to the contrary?

    ...I don't think you're making the point you think you are...
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • Boo
    3591 posts Member
    Supercat wrote: »
    Boo wrote: »
    @abentwookiee

    I totally agree with you. The only thing I hope is that (as per some speculation) Rey is Anakin - the next Chosen One reincarnated, which to me is another **** idea.

    If Rey is another Chosen One, which is supposed to be such a rare event - an ancient prophecy predicted Anakin, now Rey spits out of the "force" a generation later?

    That would be like Jesus **** coming to Earth to save everyone from sin every few decades - absolutely ****.

    Anyway - part of that prophecy has been fulfilled at least, in that the sith have been exterminated. Kylo Ren is a knight of ren and most certainly not a sith lord. Snoke is also not a sith lord, as he was in existence at the time of Vader and Palp which would conflict the Rule of Two. Snoke may have been a sith lord earlier in his life (coug, cough Darth Plagueis, cough) but that's another argument, lol

    Great theory - personally I never really broke it down like you have, and this makes total sense, along with many other hints that she is a Skywalker/Luke's daughter.

    Jar jar?

    No - she's not Jar Jar's daughter, lol
  • Boo
    3591 posts Member
    edited May 2017
    Quite frankly it would be crazy dumb if Rey turns out to be the next chosen one / Anakin Skywalker reincarnated - for the force to personify itself in the galaxy is obviously an extremely rare event. Anakin was the product of an ancient old prophecy - for Rey to be the next chosen one a generation later, then that is like Jesus coming to Earth every few decades to save the world from its sins - ridiculous.

    Rey has to be Luke's daughter:

    1. Similar backgrounds to Anakin and Luke himself (natural affinity to the force, grew up on desert planets, essentially "orphans" and skills within force - piloting, mechanics etc). She also pulls the lightsaber from snow - reminiscent of Luke on Hoth.
    2. Anakin/Luke's lightsaber called to Rey - her vision involved Luke and Anakin/Vader
    3. Rey was able to resist Kylo's mind probe in the force, out match him in lightsaber combat and pull the saber out of Kylo's grasp - Kylo (other than Luke and Leia) should be the 3rd most powerful being in the force, following the lineage of the Chosen One. How could Rey beat that???
    4. Kylo was outraged at a "girl" from Jakku helping Finn and BB8's escape because he left her there, believed dead by others but Kylo, because she is his cousin and the light within him prevented him from killing her at the destruction of Luke's jedi order.
    5. Luke was puzzled, confused and relieved when he looked upon Rey holding his lightsaber at the end of TFA, because she is HIS daughter.
    6. Han knew her to be Luke's daughter, after the scene cuts away when Maz asks him "who's the girl". She is not a Solo as Han would have told her who he was and same with Leia when they met Rey - being Luke's daughter it was not their place, but they both recognized her as their niece. This is why Han offered her a "job" and why Leia hugged someone she barely knows. This is another reason why Han was not overly concerned Rey was abducted by Kylo - ultimately believing in the light within Kylo and that Rey was essentially "safe" with her cousin.
    7. Star Wars is essentially the story of the Skywalker family.

    Thank you.

    Rey is not a Mary Sue, nor a Kenobi - as those ideas are ridiculous as well.

    But ultimately - time will tell I suppose.
  • Boo
    3591 posts Member
    CL_Chaos wrote: »
    she is the great great great great granddaughter of Revan

    Revan was not born from the force as Anakin was and the skywalker lineage of the chosen one is Kylo (Kylo, Luke and Leia - being the most attune force sensitives possible in the galaxy).

    A long descendant of another force user - not as powerful in the force, outmatching Kylo is preposterous.
  • NicWester wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.
    It was not enough for a skilled veteran pilot to target the exhaust port; Red Leader tried that and failed. No, they needed a skilled pilot tuned into the Force to hit the port.
    So... It took magic powers that no other character in the movie has? A forgotten art rediscovered by one brave soul who believed it despite all evidence to the contrary?

    ...I don't think you're making the point you think you are...

    Uh, yeah. That was literally the whole point of the Force, and why Luke was such an important character.
  • NicWester wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.

    Lol what? If anything that's a better analogy for what Rey did in Tfa rather than Luke.
  • NicWester
    6770 posts Member
    NicWester wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.

    Lol what? If anything that's a better analogy for what Rey did in Tfa rather than Luke.
    Read what I've said in this thread elsewhere and you'll find that what I'm saying is internally consistent logic.

    It's the people who are saying that Luke's rad, Rey's bad that are trying to have their cake and eat it, too.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • NicWester
    6770 posts Member
    NicWester wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.
    It was not enough for a skilled veteran pilot to target the exhaust port; Red Leader tried that and failed. No, they needed a skilled pilot tuned into the Force to hit the port.
    So... It took magic powers that no other character in the movie has? A forgotten art rediscovered by one brave soul who believed it despite all evidence to the contrary?

    ...I don't think you're making the point you think you are...

    Uh, yeah. That was literally the whole point of the Force, and why Luke was such an important character.
    Honestly, if you can't tell what part of being the only magic person in a world of muggles makes you a Mary Sue, then I don't think you actually know what that term means and you should probably stop using it. You're bad and you should feel bad.
    Ceterum censeo Patientia esse meliat.
  • Supercat
    3250 posts Member
    NicWester wrote: »
    Easier way to shut down the argument:
    "Yeah, sure, she's a Mary Sue. But so was Luke, Gilgamesh, Odysseus, and Liu Bei. Who cares? Go away."

    You did not go there.
    You did not just offend the coolest character in the Iliad and Odyssey.

    How was he a Rey?
    He trained for war.
    Don't be a ****(4), and follow forum guidelines.
  • NicWester wrote: »
    NicWester wrote: »
    DatBoi wrote: »
    No one complained when Luke was a Gary Stu. No one complained when little Anakin was a Gary Stu. Everyone complained when Rey was a Mary Sue even if she wasn't.

    Sigh. Don't wish to rant really, but here we go ...

    Luke was a Gary Stu? Luke, the guy who
    • Got cold-**** by a sneaky Tusken Raider and rescued by an old man
    • Half drowned by a dionaga and nearly pancaked in a trash compacter, rescued by a droid
    • Narrowly avoided getting blowed up by Vader in the DS trench thanks to Han's intervention
    • Face-slapped and captured by a wampa, rescued himself this time!
    • Shot down in a snow-speeder defending Hoth base
    • Beaten within an inch of his life by Vader in a light saber duel, lost his hand, rescued by Leia
    • Lightning-roasted by the Emperor, rescued by Vader in an epic moment of redemption

    I'm talking about ANH Luke.

    How come Luke saved a princess from a station that is heavily guarded by officers?
    How come Luke destroyed the exhaust port without piloting a single ship in his whole life?



    "I used to bullseye womp rats in my T16 back home"
    I used to play the New Hope arcade game where you had a cockpit and flew the trench run.

    That doesn't make me qualified to fly an A-10 Warthog, buddy.
    It was not enough for a skilled veteran pilot to target the exhaust port; Red Leader tried that and failed. No, they needed a skilled pilot tuned into the Force to hit the port.
    So... It took magic powers that no other character in the movie has? A forgotten art rediscovered by one brave soul who believed it despite all evidence to the contrary?

    ...I don't think you're making the point you think you are...

    Uh, yeah. That was literally the whole point of the Force, and why Luke was such an important character.
    Honestly, if you can't tell what part of being the only magic person in a world of muggles makes you a Mary Sue, then I don't think you actually know what that term means and you should probably stop using it. You're bad and you should feel bad.

    giphy.gif
  • NicWester wrote: »
    Easier way to shut down the argument:
    "Yeah, sure, she's a Mary Sue. But so was Luke, Gilgamesh, Odysseus, and Liu Bei. Who cares? Go away."

    Honest reply. I love how people put Luke on an equal scale and call him a Mary Sue but not Rey. The hypocrisy is strong in this thread.
This discussion has been closed.