[MEGA] General Grievous’ Leadership and Damage Clarifications

Replies

  • Also the interaction with GG and B1 is completely detrimental. Whilst there's theory behind it in, there's also theory to say he should call more B1s in to do his bidding!
  • Gorem wrote: »
    VonZant wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »

    Always blows my mind how much love they give reddit and other media platforms over their own forum....

    Yeah. And People are so civil and nice to them here! I can't imagine why they dont post here more.

    They literally replied to a post titled “angry incoherent rant” over there...

    Not to mention the Constant thread right at the top where you can go and yell your frustrations out. So much swearing towards CG, and Reddit doesn't block it like these forums do.

    Lol at thinking Reddit is more civil then here xD Here is quite nice in comparasin, the only time people speak up is becuase people are tired of being ignored.

    if they refunded Finns lead zeta in the opener, if GG was good, if the extra crystals in the pack didn't increase the price, if they didn't go ahead with the banning TW, there would be much much less feedback here on the negative side of things.

    I doubt it. The negative feedback is a part of the forums. It doesn't matter what happens, the forum will find some fault about something.
    what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
  • The problem is that they dont shine in raids (like 3po), they dont cruss current arena meta revan/traya with high rate (at least better than our alrready developed cls with 3po chewie han trawn), and they are also bad in defense...
    And if u plain to run them as an offensive GA team u will finish short of protection and hp even if u outspeed enemy team so u will lose those 9 potential points xD
  • BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    To be fair, they wouldn't need to make a whole forum post clarifying how GG's damage works and everything if they had just said "20% of his max health" from the beginning or even put it in the description of his kit. I know they said "based" and that confused me for a while, but after seeing the test footage I assumed that they must have really meant max health = damage dealt. Some up-front clarification about what "based on" means or, again, a stipulation in his kit to clarify, would have gone a long way to avoid people feeling misled when his damage output was more lackluster in practice.

    b4ia2v3c6wix.png

    The term" based on" means they use that as a base for the calculation.

    take the example of rent. the price is based on 2 people sharing the room. meaning you take the base price and divide it by 2, getting what you should pay.

    if this was as other have expressed, the price being based on 2 people sharing the same space would be to pay double rent for 2 people sharing the same space.
    his damage is based on his max health, you take his max health and multiply by 20% to get the damage. this % could have been anything and is likely picked to keep a balance to his damage as his health stacks, but also giving decent damage if you max him out for health in every way.

    Wow, way to be condescending. I'm pretty sure I speak English okay considering it's my first and only language, but thanks for wasting your time providing the dictionary screenshot and the pedantic explanation of a simple term.

    Like I said, when they said "based on" pre-release I remember wanting some more clarification since that wording is too vague, but I assumed it would come with the kit reveal. When the kit didn't clarify and test footage showed 60k hits on a character who can be reasonably assumed to have 60k health after mods at g12+, I and many others went "huh. Guess it must be health==damage after all?"

    All I was saying was the wording is vague and clarification would've gone a long way towards preventing some of the fallout.

    Just fyi, (max health * 100%) is still a calculation that is "based on" max health per your own definition. It's not unreasonable to assume that that could have been the intent behind the wording in GG's kit. It IS unreasonable to assume that people who were expecting that are just brainless or don't understand English.

    If it was 100%, one would expect the wording to read "equal to his max health".

    At no point did I express that anyone didnt understand English, I was just trying to be thorough since there seemed to be a misunderstanding of what may not be a commonly used phrase. Also there are players from around the world, and I dotn expect everyone to be a native English speaker, some times phrases like that get lost in translation.

    Kyno, you continuing to belabor this point is the most useless discussion going on in this thread right now.

    The thing everyone is upset about is that the videos, descriptions and expectations set by the development team were extraordinarily misleading to say the least. They show a team doing something that will not be replicated in the game. Surely you understand this.

    They purposefully misled the community regarding the team’s capabilities and used Ahnalds enthusiasm for the reworks against him in order to sell us on something that was *almost* a complete fabrication.

    But, by all means, continue arguing your point about “based on max health”... when any reasonable person reading that kit description would conclude that total max health is the number used to calculate damage.

    The only other way to interpret what happened here is that the development team had no idea that GG would perform this poorly in the wild and fail to meet the expectations they set for him. If this is true, then to @CG_Carrie I would say that the audacious 5 year plan is definitely in jeopardy.

    This rework is loosely based on max health. Names, characters, businesses, places, events, locales, and incidents are either the products of the CG's imagination or used in a fictitious manner. Any resemblance to actual persons, living or dead, or actual events is purely coincidental.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    BrtStlnd wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    To be fair, they wouldn't need to make a whole forum post clarifying how GG's damage works and everything if they had just said "20% of his max health" from the beginning or even put it in the description of his kit. I know they said "based" and that confused me for a while, but after seeing the test footage I assumed that they must have really meant max health = damage dealt. Some up-front clarification about what "based on" means or, again, a stipulation in his kit to clarify, would have gone a long way to avoid people feeling misled when his damage output was more lackluster in practice.

    b4ia2v3c6wix.png

    The term" based on" means they use that as a base for the calculation.

    take the example of rent. the price is based on 2 people sharing the room. meaning you take the base price and divide it by 2, getting what you should pay.

    if this was as other have expressed, the price being based on 2 people sharing the same space would be to pay double rent for 2 people sharing the same space.
    his damage is based on his max health, you take his max health and multiply by 20% to get the damage. this % could have been anything and is likely picked to keep a balance to his damage as his health stacks, but also giving decent damage if you max him out for health in every way.

    Wow, way to be condescending. I'm pretty sure I speak English okay considering it's my first and only language, but thanks for wasting your time providing the dictionary screenshot and the pedantic explanation of a simple term.

    Like I said, when they said "based on" pre-release I remember wanting some more clarification since that wording is too vague, but I assumed it would come with the kit reveal. When the kit didn't clarify and test footage showed 60k hits on a character who can be reasonably assumed to have 60k health after mods at g12+, I and many others went "huh. Guess it must be health==damage after all?"

    All I was saying was the wording is vague and clarification would've gone a long way towards preventing some of the fallout.

    Just fyi, (max health * 100%) is still a calculation that is "based on" max health per your own definition. It's not unreasonable to assume that that could have been the intent behind the wording in GG's kit. It IS unreasonable to assume that people who were expecting that are just brainless or don't understand English.

    If it was 100%, one would expect the wording to read "equal to his max health".

    At no point did I express that anyone didnt understand English, I was just trying to be thorough since there seemed to be a misunderstanding of what may not be a commonly used phrase. Also there are players from around the world, and I dotn expect everyone to be a native English speaker, some times phrases like that get lost in translation.

    Kyno, you continuing to belabor this point is the most useless discussion going on in this thread right now.

    The thing everyone is upset about is that the videos, descriptions and expectations set by the development team were extraordinarily misleading to say the least. They show a team doing something that will not be replicated in the game. Surely you understand this.

    They purposefully misled the community regarding the team’s capabilities and used Ahnalds enthusiasm for the reworks against him in order to sell us on something that was *almost* a complete fabrication.

    But, by all means, continue arguing your point about “based on max health”... when any reasonable person reading that kit description would conclude that total max health is the number used to calculate damage.

    The only other way to interpret what happened here is that the development team had no idea that GG would perform this poorly in the wild and fail to meet the expectations they set for him. If this is true, then to @CG_Carrie I would say that the audacious 5 year plan is definitely in jeopardy.

    @BrtStlnd

    I was debating a single point with someone, about the wording of the ability and in no way discussing the rework as a whole, or anything released or claimed by any parties.

    I agree that everyone, reasonable or not, should absolutely conclude that the calculation uses the max health. That is 100% clear and stated. The part that is being assumed is that the calculation uses 100% of it.

    When watching the videos they have shown, in the early parts of the battle he is hitting around 20-30k( which would be at his unmodded health), many seem to ignore that and jump right to the high numbers.

    That assumption would also mean that people assume his AOE is hitting per character equal to his single target attack.

    These assumptions seem odd, since they dont line up with current mechanics.

    As some have said, they asked the question and didnt get an answer, which is very unfortunate, but that happens at times and I would always recommend airing on the side of caution when there is confusion or assumptions being made about how an ability is going to work.
  • Gannon
    1523 posts Member
    Everyone seems so focused on gg's health, my only question is why b1 doesn't die and revive each hit, like the animation shows. Seemed like that was the whole point of gg's unique zeta. I mean, the team is garbage atm, but I think that would make them function better.
    As it is now, marked or plague destroys b1, and without him they destroy themselves, and gg unique is pointless.
  • R_Val_17
    144 posts Member
    edited February 2019
    If being replaced in battle B1, the next droid shouldn't be plagued and or marked. If marked just the first two sets, in the very least like when Revan marks.
  • We can only polish a droid **** so much, the rework is garbage and wont touch the paywall meta of 90% revan everything (both pve and pvp). The videos was severely missleading and if the only time this team is even remotely worth it is full g12 maxed out even with fantasy number of health (65k ? i have yet to see one with it..) then the redesign is so extremly flawed its not even funny, but by all means lets give revan more power untill some lame darth revan or malak comes and the cups half full crowd can walletwarrior some more.
  • Enerdrizer
    263 posts Member
    edited February 2019
    I am late :sweat_smile: but GG rework was really promising

    Who would have thought that GG rework will weaken B1 (MVP in the video above) and in fact make GG more fragile before his first turn (he had 50% more health).
    I suppose losing 1 stack instead of 8 (B1) in case of damage based on percent health could help a lot in both directions.
    But whatever. I will just pick the next meta. Until then I am gonna admire the arenascape with dear Revans. (Unless revan will stay but with other color :sweat_smile:)
    Post edited by Enerdrizer on
  • CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi Holotable Heroes,

    There has been some confusion around the rework of General Grievous and several posts concerned that the damage Grievous can deal is less than what has been shown to be possible in the footage we provided for preview videos.

    @Kyno, I was reading posts in another thread, and you were wondering, whether videos were CG provided or GC test accounts, with @Nikoms565.

    Here Dev is saying there were videos provided by CG.
    what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
  • Enerdrizer wrote: »
    I am late :sweat_smile: but GG rework was really promising

    Who would have thought that GG rework will weaken B1 (MVP in the video above) and in fact make GG more fragile before his first turn (he had 50% more health).
    I suppose losing 1 stack instead of 8 (B1) in case of damage based on percent health could help a lot in both directions.
    But whatever. I will just pick the next meta. Until then I am gonna admire the arenascape with dear Revans. (Unless revan will stay but with other color :sweat_smile:)

    I think this says a lot.
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    CG_SBCrumb wrote: »
    Hi Holotable Heroes,

    There has been some confusion around the rework of General Grievous and several posts concerned that the damage Grievous can deal is less than what has been shown to be possible in the footage we provided for preview videos.

    Kyno, I was reading posts in another thread, and you were wondering, whether videos were CG provided or GC test accounts, with Nikoms565.

    Here Dev is saying there were videos provided by CG.

    Yes, we established that it was stated in other GC posts also. Thanks
  • Developers for this game are incapable of making balance for the arena in this game. That's obvious
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    To be fair, they wouldn't need to make a whole forum post clarifying how GG's damage works and everything if they had just said "20% of his max health" from the beginning or even put it in the description of his kit. I know they said "based" and that confused me for a while, but after seeing the test footage I assumed that they must have really meant max health = damage dealt. Some up-front clarification about what "based on" means or, again, a stipulation in his kit to clarify, would have gone a long way to avoid people feeling misled when his damage output was more lackluster in practice.

    b4ia2v3c6wix.png

    The term" based on" means they use that as a base for the calculation.

    take the example of rent. the price is based on 2 people sharing the room. meaning you take the base price and divide it by 2, getting what you should pay.

    if this was as other have expressed, the price being based on 2 people sharing the same space would be to pay double rent for 2 people sharing the same space.
    his damage is based on his max health, you take his max health and multiply by 20% to get the damage. this % could have been anything and is likely picked to keep a balance to his damage as his health stacks, but also giving decent damage if you max him out for health in every way.

    Wow, way to be condescending. I'm pretty sure I speak English okay considering it's my first and only language, but thanks for wasting your time providing the dictionary screenshot and the pedantic explanation of a simple term.

    Like I said, when they said "based on" pre-release I remember wanting some more clarification since that wording is too vague, but I assumed it would come with the kit reveal. When the kit didn't clarify and test footage showed 60k hits on a character who can be reasonably assumed to have 60k health after mods at g12+, I and many others went "huh. Guess it must be health==damage after all?"

    All I was saying was the wording is vague and clarification would've gone a long way towards preventing some of the fallout.

    Just fyi, (max health * 100%) is still a calculation that is "based on" max health per your own definition. It's not unreasonable to assume that that could have been the intent behind the wording in GG's kit. It IS unreasonable to assume that people who were expecting that are just brainless or don't understand English.

    If it was 100%, one would expect the wording to read "equal to his max health".

    At no point did I express that anyone didnt understand English, I was just trying to be thorough since there seemed to be a misunderstanding of what may not be a commonly used phrase. Also there are players from around the world, and I dotn expect everyone to be a native English speaker, some times phrases like that get lost in translation.

    Honestly, the way the kit is worded is too vague. FOE also gains damage for stacking max health, but its clearly stated that he gains bonus offense equal to 5% max health.

    Something similar could have been said in grievous' kit
  • Developers for this game are incapable of making balance for the arena in this game. That's obvious

    Hanlon's razor? After 3+ years? No, I don't think so. It's clear that CG is content to manipulate the meta to be single-team dominant. Apparently, it's the simplest way to milk the meta-chasing whales....every 3-4 months.
    In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie

    In game guild: TNR Uprising
    I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
    *This space left intentionally blank*
  • If Grievous had a “Call for Reinforcements” ability with a high cooldown that got lowered when enemies call assists, the Separatist Droids would’ve been a lot more interesting. That way, Grievous could revive B1 if it gets marked by Revan, and they’d have a chance to hold on defense and be a bit less RNG-dependent.
  • shows the mods from the promo tape. from both teams
  • VladoVD
    22 posts Member
    edited February 2019
    I think that the best decision in this situation is the one where everyone receives back his gear and mats invested in separatists (especially zetas). will add also that revan meta became REALLY BORING (as we all know). what's the point to play both GA and SQ (even TW) if you don't have it? games without balance are BORING. and about misleading videos.. better leave it without comment
  • Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    To be fair, they wouldn't need to make a whole forum post clarifying how GG's damage works and everything if they had just said "20% of his max health" from the beginning or even put it in the description of his kit. I know they said "based" and that confused me for a while, but after seeing the test footage I assumed that they must have really meant max health = damage dealt. Some up-front clarification about what "based on" means or, again, a stipulation in his kit to clarify, would have gone a long way to avoid people feeling misled when his damage output was more lackluster in practice.

    b4ia2v3c6wix.png

    The term" based on" means they use that as a base for the calculation.

    take the example of rent. the price is based on 2 people sharing the room. meaning you take the base price and divide it by 2, getting what you should pay.

    if this was as other have expressed, the price being based on 2 people sharing the same space would be to pay double rent for 2 people sharing the same space.
    his damage is based on his max health, you take his max health and multiply by 20% to get the damage. this % could have been anything and is likely picked to keep a balance to his damage as his health stacks, but also giving decent damage if you max him out for health in every way.

    Wow, way to be condescending. I'm pretty sure I speak English okay considering it's my first and only language, but thanks for wasting your time providing the dictionary screenshot and the pedantic explanation of a simple term.

    Like I said, when they said "based on" pre-release I remember wanting some more clarification since that wording is too vague, but I assumed it would come with the kit reveal. When the kit didn't clarify and test footage showed 60k hits on a character who can be reasonably assumed to have 60k health after mods at g12+, I and many others went "huh. Guess it must be health==damage after all?"

    All I was saying was the wording is vague and clarification would've gone a long way towards preventing some of the fallout.

    Just fyi, (max health * 100%) is still a calculation that is "based on" max health per your own definition. It's not unreasonable to assume that that could have been the intent behind the wording in GG's kit. It IS unreasonable to assume that people who were expecting that are just brainless or don't understand English.

    If it was 100%, one would expect the wording to read "equal to his max health".

    At no point did I express that anyone didnt understand English, I was just trying to be thorough since there seemed to be a misunderstanding of what may not be a commonly used phrase. Also there are players from around the world, and I dotn expect everyone to be a native English speaker, some times phrases like that get lost in translation.

    Oh man just stop already Kyno. You know as well as everyone else how misleading their description is. Sad, you aren't even getting paid to defend them.

    There's no need to be condescending to Kyno. He provides a great 'service' to the community, and as you say donated time. In no way does he deserve what you just gave him. I am utterly floored. I understand your passion for the game, but personal attacks are absolutely uncalled for. @Crazygone510 @Kyno
    what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore?
  • Kyno
    32087 posts Moderator
    Kyno wrote: »
    Kyno wrote: »
    To be fair, they wouldn't need to make a whole forum post clarifying how GG's damage works and everything if they had just said "20% of his max health" from the beginning or even put it in the description of his kit. I know they said "based" and that confused me for a while, but after seeing the test footage I assumed that they must have really meant max health = damage dealt. Some up-front clarification about what "based on" means or, again, a stipulation in his kit to clarify, would have gone a long way to avoid people feeling misled when his damage output was more lackluster in practice.

    b4ia2v3c6wix.png

    The term" based on" means they use that as a base for the calculation.

    take the example of rent. the price is based on 2 people sharing the room. meaning you take the base price and divide it by 2, getting what you should pay.

    if this was as other have expressed, the price being based on 2 people sharing the same space would be to pay double rent for 2 people sharing the same space.
    his damage is based on his max health, you take his max health and multiply by 20% to get the damage. this % could have been anything and is likely picked to keep a balance to his damage as his health stacks, but also giving decent damage if you max him out for health in every way.

    Wow, way to be condescending. I'm pretty sure I speak English okay considering it's my first and only language, but thanks for wasting your time providing the dictionary screenshot and the pedantic explanation of a simple term.

    Like I said, when they said "based on" pre-release I remember wanting some more clarification since that wording is too vague, but I assumed it would come with the kit reveal. When the kit didn't clarify and test footage showed 60k hits on a character who can be reasonably assumed to have 60k health after mods at g12+, I and many others went "huh. Guess it must be health==damage after all?"

    All I was saying was the wording is vague and clarification would've gone a long way towards preventing some of the fallout.

    Just fyi, (max health * 100%) is still a calculation that is "based on" max health per your own definition. It's not unreasonable to assume that that could have been the intent behind the wording in GG's kit. It IS unreasonable to assume that people who were expecting that are just brainless or don't understand English.

    If it was 100%, one would expect the wording to read "equal to his max health".

    At no point did I express that anyone didnt understand English, I was just trying to be thorough since there seemed to be a misunderstanding of what may not be a commonly used phrase. Also there are players from around the world, and I dotn expect everyone to be a native English speaker, some times phrases like that get lost in translation.

    Oh man just stop already Kyno. You know as well as everyone else how misleading their description is. Sad, you aren't even getting paid to defend them.

    Confusing, sure. Misleading is a stretch. With general knowledge of the game and the wording used, it seems clear that it is not 100%. I understand that not everyone may see it that way, but I find it hard to believe that many believes the assumtion that it was 100% more than they are upset and are directing that here. But that is just my opinion and I'm sure people think a lot of things are true, that others do not.
  • Exar_Kunbaya
    5 posts Member
    edited February 2019
    You're right, the wording in the kit is confusing, it should say:

    Gain Health Steal up AND GENTLY CARESS THE TARGET for a percentage not specified Based on Grievous Max Health

    That should make the kit wording more accurate

    Geez... 😏
    Post edited by Exar_Kunbaya on
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