There is a difference between a counter that required some adjustement and that breaks several teams apart and a counter that is simply a classic team that everyone has.
After watching some of the videos (and multiple JML counters already viable), I think SEE is stronger. By a significant margin. If not, GLs have become a waste of resources.
sweet. Means JML should get upgraded in 2 months right?
Yeah, JML being the worst of the 4 means he'll be the one to get buffed. But I haven't seen any footage of GLEE on defense.
Too early to really make any judgments tbh.
Too early to judge GLEE, sure. Definitely not too early to judge JML, who is hot garbage on defense.
Nah it's to early. First off, almost every toon release has had several bugs, some of which have been game breaking from a toon evaluation standpoint.
In addition to that, people need time to play with the kit and then consider mods, turn order, and optimal team (rey's optimal team certainly wasn't the one CG offered up....). A few hours and a few videos shortly after release is not sufficient time to declare it "hot garbage". Come back in a month.
True, but a properly functioning beta test team would have identified that DR and JKR could beat ULT GML handily.
I think its been proven again and again that the player base is the beta test team
That still doesn't mean we enjoy it.
Well lol, you have been here the same 5 years as I! You must enjoy something
After watching some of the videos (and multiple JML counters already viable), I think SEE is stronger. By a significant margin. If not, GLs have become a waste of resources.
sweet. Means JML should get upgraded in 2 months right?
Yeah, JML being the worst of the 4 means he'll be the one to get buffed. But I haven't seen any footage of GLEE on defense.
Too early to really make any judgments tbh.
Too early to judge GLEE, sure. Definitely not too early to judge JML, who is hot garbage on defense.
Nah it's to early. First off, almost every toon release has had several bugs, some of which have been game breaking from a toon evaluation standpoint.
In addition to that, people need time to play with the kit and then consider mods, turn order, and optimal team (rey's optimal team certainly wasn't the one CG offered up....). A few hours and a few videos shortly after release is not sufficient time to declare it "hot garbage". Come back in a month.
True, but a properly functioning beta test team would have identified that DR and JKR could beat ULT GML handily.
I think its been proven again and again that the player base is the beta test team
That still doesn't mean we enjoy it.
Well lol, you have been here the same 5 years as I! You must enjoy something
I enjoy the game - not being a beta tester/bug reporter each time new content drops.
In game name: Lucas Gregory FORMER PLAYER - - - -"Whale blah grump poooop." - Ouchie
In game guild: TNR Uprising I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
There is no benefit you can get from GAC performance that would be better than being guaranteed top10 HSTR rewards.
And if you have more than 10 people in your guild soloing HSTR every time, then that's actually only MORE reason to go with the one that solos HSTR.
Any GL should get you into top 50 Arena. Even if one of the GLs guaranteed #1 and the one that solo'd HSTR guaranteed you would finish outside the top20, that's only a 350 crystal/day advantage. A guaranteed top10 HSTR toon gives you 580 crystals worth of gear per day, when averaged out - and that assumes you can't show up for every raid.
That's a 230 crystal/day advantage for maximizing raids instead of maximizing PvP. You won't make that up in GAC.
Why is JML's armor/protection pool hot trash? He's not tanky at all stats-wise. My relic 5 Stormtrooper Han has better Protection/Armor than the r7 JML that I see in the arena here... that has 4 protection primaries.
I mean hell... Malak's protection pool, statswise, crushes JML. The New GL. An 18 month old Legendary.
Why is JML's armor/protection pool hot trash? He's not tanky at all stats-wise. My relic 5 Stormtrooper Han has better Protection/Armor than the r7 JML that I see in the arena here... that has 4 protection primaries.
Armor only matters vs some characters
Armor means nothing vs SEE or Blue Milk Luke (BML) for example as both are special damage dealers
Also not sure what stats you are looking at unmodded R7 BML has higher armor than unmodded R7 STH
As for the protection, the GL unique will give BML up to 70% more protection, along with jedi legacy will give him even more, so that little ~4k more base STH has is minimal
Why is JML's armor/protection pool hot trash? He's not tanky at all stats-wise. My relic 5 Stormtrooper Han has better Protection/Armor than the r7 JML that I see in the arena here... that has 4 protection primaries.
Armor only matters vs some characters
Armor means nothing vs SEE or Blue Milk Luke (BML) for example as both are special damage dealers
Also not sure what stats you are looking at unmodded R7 BML has higher armor than unmodded R7 STH
As for the protection, the GL unique will give BML up to 70% more protection, along with jedi legacy will give him even more, so that little ~4k more base STH has is minimal
Yea, I'm just surprised at what a fully Prot modded JML has for a protection pool. It's very very low comparatively. I was comparing it to a very 'non-tanky' tank for effect. I was expecting 200K+ as a bare minimum for JML when modded for protection.
Then he wasn't balanced by having high Resistance/Armor. Its very surprising.
Rey and Kylo both have non GL counters. They stated that they would likely be of a similar power to Rey and Kylo.
So why is anyone surprised that JML has a counter?
he seems to have multiple non gl counters though. SE, jkr, now it looks like ep/vader as well. Few days in and he's getting buried pretty quick
We'll have to see what comps come out. It could be that the ones being tried aren't the best one yet.
Vader and Darth Revan with wat also counter Rey. Thrawn lead counters Kylo. They said that they would be comparable in power to Rey and Kylo so it makes sense that there would be non GL counters.
Also of note, the jedi revan counters use both gas and jkl so they are fairly resource intensive counters as well.
Also those counter teams don't hold very well so it's not like it's game breaking.
It seems pretty clear they want it where you can compete in arena with any GL a few more counters just makes climbing less hassle for most people.
Day 2 climbing arena- sith empire beating JML. 2/2 fighting this comp. I hope they are going to atleast acknowledge there is a slight underperformance problem. I mean the highest requirement toon in the game - beat without any theory crafting- on day 2 of seeing it. By last years meta. https://youtu.be/eP3iY9nTnyM
Right now people are making assumptions based on two videos where we see JML is on defense. We don't even know how good he would do on offense yet since there hasn't been much proof.
Also one video doesn't count as proof, there would have to be multiple videos with multiple attempts in each with different squads and making sure the mods are decent mods.
There are several videos. He is good on offense.
Then why are people sitting here complaining about him getting beat on defense if he is used as an offensive team?
Because as the most expensive character to date he should be able to hold in arena against characters that were meta over 2 years ago?
Replies
So why is anyone surprised that JML has a counter?
I don't think they design these teams to necessarily hold on defense. Yes, they probably hold better than non GL teams since there are fewer counters.
If that is a deal breaker, then don't go for a GL. It's really that simple.
It is so obvious
Well lol, you have been here the same 5 years as I! You must enjoy something
I enjoy the game - not being a beta tester/bug reporter each time new content drops.
In game guild: TNR Uprising
I beat the REAL T7 Yoda (not the nerfed one) and did so before mods were there to help
*This space left intentionally blank*
You nailed it!!
I mean hell... Malak's protection pool, statswise, crushes JML. The New GL. An 18 month old Legendary.
Armor only matters vs some characters
Armor means nothing vs SEE or Blue Milk Luke (BML) for example as both are special damage dealers
Also not sure what stats you are looking at unmodded R7 BML has higher armor than unmodded R7 STH
As for the protection, the GL unique will give BML up to 70% more protection, along with jedi legacy will give him even more, so that little ~4k more base STH has is minimal
Shouldn't BML be the Farmboy?
Discuss.
Should that be it's own topic?
Also it doesn't matter he will always be BML because of the great and powerful @Sunnie1978
Yea, I'm just surprised at what a fully Prot modded JML has for a protection pool. It's very very low comparatively. I was comparing it to a very 'non-tanky' tank for effect. I was expecting 200K+ as a bare minimum for JML when modded for protection.
Then he wasn't balanced by having high Resistance/Armor. Its very surprising.
It should be Farmboy as Blue Milk. Hermit Luke makes more sense.
he seems to have multiple non gl counters though. SE, jkr, now it looks like ep/vader as well. Few days in and he's getting buried pretty quick
We'll have to see what comps come out. It could be that the ones being tried aren't the best one yet.
Vader and Darth Revan with wat also counter Rey. Thrawn lead counters Kylo. They said that they would be comparable in power to Rey and Kylo so it makes sense that there would be non GL counters.
Also of note, the jedi revan counters use both gas and jkl so they are fairly resource intensive counters as well.
Also those counter teams don't hold very well so it's not like it's game breaking.
It seems pretty clear they want it where you can compete in arena with any GL a few more counters just makes climbing less hassle for most people.
Why ?
He is garbage
Yeah that makes no sense.
no they do not
Every team needs a counter. If not DR then who?
The op may be looking at this mastery instead
it's +45 - the bonus they get from their relic amplifiers
15 base mastery at g13 + 45 at r7 = 60
Open character stats- all the other GLs have 60. GL Luke has 45 and his AI doesn’t play him well at all on defense.
So in game when it says max level for a Stat that is the Stat without bonuses? This is unnecessarily confusing.
it's the base stats bonus the char receives from the relic amplifier before modding is taken into account, nothing confusing about it
no, it's 15%
R7: 60 (all other GL's) - 45 (JML) = 15
R0: 15 (all other GL's) - 0 (JML) = 15
Not logical, and if you add the absurd prerequesite compared to SEE. CG is clearly doing no sense at all
Well if you already come to that conclusion a few days after release you can go for another GL then in good conscience, right?