I personally wouldn’t care if they removed crystals from fleet as long as zetas went with them and I was able to acquire close to the same amount in their new location. That said, I don’t think it would benefit the community overall for many reasons.
First, the only two modes that would make sense are gac or tw. If it’s gac, then you are just increasing the pain of mid and new game players with opponents who routinely have significant roster advantages. I think the number of players that fall into this category is larger than the number of players with executor/profundity AND a desire to put in the effort BUT being prevented from 1st by a bad shard.
If it’s moved to tw then more guilds will feel it necessary to dictate datacron farming. This will cut into the 12k crystals per 30 days players get now from 1st in fleet. It’ll also lead to guilds adjusting to the new requirements by booting those that don’t like to engage with datacrons or bleed more players to guilds that are tw focused. 600k crystals per 30 days spread out amongst 50 players will certainly justify that change.
I sympathize with those contending with bad shard chats but I just don’t see a solution that isn’t worse for the community than it currently is even though I likely would be part of the group it’d help.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
Once again that’s shaking your fist and screaming get off my lawn. Propose a workable solution that adds value to the game.
Moving crystals and zetas to tw just increases the need for datacrons. Yeah you’ll end up with more crystals but you’ll be asked by your guild to farm more dcs especially since they are simmable now. You’ll also see players jump from non tw focused guilds to tw focused guilds.
Moving them to gac would likely work but I’ve always felt the gain to players, while friendly, is detrimental to the long term health of the game. To increase the majority of the players crystal income while minimizing the need to develop fleets cost cg a revenue stream. The money fleets generate would need to be made up somewhere and while selfish of me, I’d rather keep my 1-2 at most 4 battles a day while developing a fleet once a year than give cg an opportunity to decide I need to spend x amount of time in a different mode while spending y crystals or z money to make up for the severally diminished need of fleets.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
This isn’t really equivalent though, as GAC is weighted in its setup such that squads can render fleets irrelevant but very rarely vice versa. Yes, GAC requires multiple squads rather than just one meta, but with fleets being locked behind squads the most important factor in earning those crystals stayed as squads not fleets.
If there’s a solution which means that fleets are still the deciding factor (in a new/revised game mode) then I could easily get on board with it. At present there isn’t a mode that does this to replace Fleet Arena and so the shards should stay there.
Account started June 2020. 100% FTP. 8.2m GP. JMK, JML, SLKR, and SEE. Exe and Levi. Ally code 117-269-921. Swgoh.gg
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
Once again that’s shaking your fist and screaming get off my lawn. Propose a workable solution that adds value to the game.
Moving crystals and zetas to tw just increases the need for datacrons. Yeah you’ll end up with more crystals but you’ll be asked by your guild to farm more dcs especially since they are simmable now. You’ll also see players jump from non tw focused guilds to tw focused guilds.
Moving them to gac would likely work but I’ve always felt the gain to players, while friendly, is detrimental to the long term health of the game. To increase the majority of the players crystal income while minimizing the need to develop fleets cost cg a revenue stream. The money fleets generate would need to be made up somewhere and while selfish of me, I’d rather keep my 1-2 at most 4 battles a day while developing a fleet once a year than give cg an opportunity to decide I need to spend x amount of time in a different mode while spending y crystals or z money to make up for the severally diminished need of fleets.
Then ask CG to balance the fleet arenas that are outliers. Some shards that are 5-6 years old that still need 10-15 daily wins to stay relevant and earn 50 crystals per day is absolutely insane. People have suggested solutions, but the alternative suggestion is always, "**** you, got mine." and that's equally unhealthy as it drives away part of the player base. Additionally, those people sitting lazily at the top of dead shards have zero incentive to spend, whereas moving the rewards to a more healthy game mode would encourage them to work on fleets.
The inequity among fleet shards is a good enough reason to justify a fix.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
This isn’t really equivalent though, as GAC is weighted in its setup such that squads can render fleets irrelevant but very rarely vice versa. Yes, GAC requires multiple squads rather than just one meta, but with fleets being locked behind squads the most important factor in earning those crystals stayed as squads not fleets.
If there’s a solution which means that fleets are still the deciding factor (in a new/revised game mode) then I could easily get on board with it. At present there isn’t a mode that does this to replace Fleet Arena and so the shards should stay there.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
Account started June 2020. 100% FTP. 8.2m GP. JMK, JML, SLKR, and SEE. Exe and Levi. Ally code 117-269-921. Swgoh.gg
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I would agree with this part except CG has clearly taken actions that do increase payouts over what they were before. Moving crystals from SA to GAC is one example. Another would be allowing players to set their own payout times. It may not be likely, but it certainly isn’t out of the realm os possibility.
And it’s even harder for CG to take direct action against mafias IMO than it is for cheating, because the fleet shard chats exist outside of the game. For starters, what qualifies as a mafia exactly? How would they identify it? They can’t rely solely on accusation, and it’s not like they could partner with discord because that would be a pretty big invasion of privacy. And the chats would just move somewhere else.
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for life.
Just as a counterpoint on the gac aspect: many players have had great success by focusing on fleets over squads first. It’s not what I did but if you can good fleets at a lower level, it can make the squads much less important for a long time.
Just as a counterpoint on the gac aspect: many players have had great success by focusing on fleets over squads first. It’s not what I did but if you can good fleets at a lower level, it can make the squads much less important for a long time.
You can succeed with fleets focus in GAC if your opponent doesn't see their disadvantage. But, if they have stronger squads they can make it so that fleets are irrelevant. You can't make it the other way around because fleets are behind.
Account started June 2020. 100% FTP. 8.2m GP. JMK, JML, SLKR, and SEE. Exe and Levi. Ally code 117-269-921. Swgoh.gg
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
The difference is that in fleet only top 50 gets crystals.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
I mean.. fleets only GAC is a thing. Not how I choose to play and I think it’s a bit cheesy but it’s still a thing. But really only because so many people don’t like engaging with fleets.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
This isn’t really equivalent though, as GAC is weighted in its setup such that squads can render fleets irrelevant but very rarely vice versa. Yes, GAC requires multiple squads rather than just one meta, but with fleets being locked behind squads the most important factor in earning those crystals stayed as squads not fleets.
If there’s a solution which means that fleets are still the deciding factor (in a new/revised game mode) then I could easily get on board with it. At present there isn’t a mode that does this to replace Fleet Arena and so the shards should stay there.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
I mean.. fleets only GAC is a thing. Not how I choose to play and I think it’s a bit cheesy but it’s still a thing. But really only because so many people don’t like engaging with fleets.
A well thought out fleet shard will see you doing as few battles as possible.. certainly doesn't require 2 hours...
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
Except there are some fleet shards that are so full of active players it is 100% necessary to start your climb around 2 hours before payout.
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
This isn’t really equivalent though, as GAC is weighted in its setup such that squads can render fleets irrelevant but very rarely vice versa. Yes, GAC requires multiple squads rather than just one meta, but with fleets being locked behind squads the most important factor in earning those crystals stayed as squads not fleets.
If there’s a solution which means that fleets are still the deciding factor (in a new/revised game mode) then I could easily get on board with it. At present there isn’t a mode that does this to replace Fleet Arena and so the shards should stay there.
Yes, and that relies on your opponent not setting all of their best squads on defence. Fleets only defences rely on two things. You having enough to beat their best X squads which would be placed in front of their fleets, and/or them not placing their best squads on defence. I regularly used to play fleets-only when I had the advantage in exe over my opponent, but if they had JMK or LV and set it in front of their fleets I was almost guaranteed a loss. All they had to do was clear my three squad zones and I wouldn't be able to clear theirs.
If player A has decent squads and a GL advantage, and player B has weaker squads but has Executor/Profundity player A can almost guarantee a win by simply placing their best squads in front of fleets. That way player B's advantage in fleets means sweet f**k all. This is why fleets are less important (but not completely irrelevant) in GAC. Crystals could be moved somewhere else, but shouldn't be moved to GAC as it is.
Account started June 2020. 100% FTP. 8.2m GP. JMK, JML, SLKR, and SEE. Exe and Levi. Ally code 117-269-921. Swgoh.gg
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
Tell me again how they increased the rewards?
Except rank 1 was 500 crystals/day, so 15,000 over a 30 day month, so you should average slightly more rewards in K2. And I've already addressed my issues with moving fleet arena rewards to GAC because I don't want to slow the progress of newer accounts that are doing well.
Also, you go back to SA to GAC, but entirely fail to address the suggested changes for FLEET ARENA rewards in a thread about FLEET ARENA rewards. So, tell me again how rewarding crystals on fleet arena wins while in the top 50 where 5 wins means max rewards would yield less rewards for you?
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
Tell me again how they increased the rewards?
Except rank 1 was 500 crystals/day, so 15,000 over a 30 day month, so you should average slightly more rewards in K2. And I've already addressed my issues with moving fleet arena rewards to GAC because I don't want to slow the progress of newer accounts that are doing well.
Also, you go back to SA to GAC, but entirely fail to address the suggested changes for FLEET ARENA rewards in a thread about FLEET ARENA rewards. So, tell me again how rewarding crystals on fleet arena wins while in the top 50 where 5 wins means max rewards would yield less rewards for you?
Fair enough (I thought it was 600, but will take your word for it)....
The bottom line is I see no reason that they should move crystals from fleet arena just because there are some terrible fleet shards out there.... I proposed a solution for you earlier...
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
Tell me again how they increased the rewards?
Because there were more payouts than first place in squad arena. As far as I am aware, it’s generally accepted that CG is paying out more crystals to people now than under the old SA system.
Fair enough (I thought it was 600, but will take your word for it)....
The bottom line is I see no reason that they should move crystals from fleet arena just because there are some terrible fleet shards out there.... I proposed a solution for you earlier...
Pretty simple google search.
And what was your proposed solution again? Breaking ToS by creating a competing mafia? Again, I find it wildly disgusting to suggest breaking ToS. Bad fleet shards are a problem that CG unwillingly created. The game mode is currently flawed. The problem is the inequity found in fleet shards. It's not something for players to solve, it's a problem for CG to fix.
/e And again, I made a suggestion to keep rewards in fleet arena, just change how the reward system works, and you have completely ignored it again to just say, "well, I don't want rewards moved."
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
The difference is that in fleet only top 50 gets crystals.
That makes the fleet mafia worse than the old arena mafias. It is easier for a mafia to control all crystals.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
Tell me again how they increased the rewards?
For those of, the vast majority, who were not in arena mafia getting 1st every day, our crystals dramatically increased.
Replies
@AlexanderG great to hear you signed up... It sounds like your shard rocks..
First, the only two modes that would make sense are gac or tw. If it’s gac, then you are just increasing the pain of mid and new game players with opponents who routinely have significant roster advantages. I think the number of players that fall into this category is larger than the number of players with executor/profundity AND a desire to put in the effort BUT being prevented from 1st by a bad shard.
If it’s moved to tw then more guilds will feel it necessary to dictate datacron farming. This will cut into the 12k crystals per 30 days players get now from 1st in fleet. It’ll also lead to guilds adjusting to the new requirements by booting those that don’t like to engage with datacrons or bleed more players to guilds that are tw focused. 600k crystals per 30 days spread out amongst 50 players will certainly justify that change.
I sympathize with those contending with bad shard chats but I just don’t see a solution that isn’t worse for the community than it currently is even though I likely would be part of the group it’d help.
And a well set up mafia can force 10 battles to maybe get top 20. That's why the game mode sucks. It's not a uniform set of rules for every player.
Sounds like a well set up and poorly executed "Mafia" to me... .
It's absolutely uniform for every player.... I, and a few others, already told you exactly what to do....
It’s definitely not uniform for everyone.
Right. The bad shards have people with 10-15 wins per day on average since fleets came out. Some of these people in good shards have no idea and yet think the solutions they offer are valid.
Eh I guess I just figure fixing the extremes is far more likely to make things worse for most even if it does fix the issue for those outside of the bad shard chat.
I also haven’t really seen a solution proposed that is reasonable by those that are affected. Sympathize with you but don’t think you’ve really done more than shake your fist at the issue muttering get off my lawn.
Except it won't for most people. They've proved it with SA to GAC. And the extremes shouldn't exist.
Once again that’s shaking your fist and screaming get off my lawn. Propose a workable solution that adds value to the game.
Moving crystals and zetas to tw just increases the need for datacrons. Yeah you’ll end up with more crystals but you’ll be asked by your guild to farm more dcs especially since they are simmable now. You’ll also see players jump from non tw focused guilds to tw focused guilds.
Moving them to gac would likely work but I’ve always felt the gain to players, while friendly, is detrimental to the long term health of the game. To increase the majority of the players crystal income while minimizing the need to develop fleets cost cg a revenue stream. The money fleets generate would need to be made up somewhere and while selfish of me, I’d rather keep my 1-2 at most 4 battles a day while developing a fleet once a year than give cg an opportunity to decide I need to spend x amount of time in a different mode while spending y crystals or z money to make up for the severally diminished need of fleets.
This isn’t really equivalent though, as GAC is weighted in its setup such that squads can render fleets irrelevant but very rarely vice versa. Yes, GAC requires multiple squads rather than just one meta, but with fleets being locked behind squads the most important factor in earning those crystals stayed as squads not fleets.
If there’s a solution which means that fleets are still the deciding factor (in a new/revised game mode) then I could easily get on board with it. At present there isn’t a mode that does this to replace Fleet Arena and so the shards should stay there.
Then ask CG to balance the fleet arenas that are outliers. Some shards that are 5-6 years old that still need 10-15 daily wins to stay relevant and earn 50 crystals per day is absolutely insane. People have suggested solutions, but the alternative suggestion is always, "**** you, got mine." and that's equally unhealthy as it drives away part of the player base. Additionally, those people sitting lazily at the top of dead shards have zero incentive to spend, whereas moving the rewards to a more healthy game mode would encourage them to work on fleets.
The inequity among fleet shards is a good enough reason to justify a fix.
I'm not saying crystals need moved to GAC. But if they were, it's still more fair and balanced than the current reward system. People have suggested moving fleets to the front, giving crystals for fleet wins in GAC, etc.
Heck, give crystals on wins in fleet arena, lock it to 5 battles with no refreshes, and scale the rewards for wins based on where you are located. Top 50? 80 crystals per win in fleet arena. Top 100? 50 crystals per win. This would be fair because now people on dead shards still have to do battles. Everyone has to do 5 to maximize their rewards. You still need to work on fleets to climb to better rewards. And it's harder to game the system.
I’d disagree that immediately moving the crystals to GAC is a fairer system as it is. Particularly in lower leagues, investing in fleets can mean having underpowered meta squads, as often crews aren’t the best units in themselves even if part of a great ship (looking at you Saxon and ISC). When players are anything other than end game that pulls resources away from developing good squads, and so with GAC as it stands it would negatively impact those who’ve focused on fleets over squads disproportionately which seems wrong IMO.
Having crystals for wins seems like a good idea on the face of it, but CG won’t implement it as it could massively boost the total number of crystals entering the player pool. That’s just not in their interests, which is a shame but that’s just reality.
As such, the best solution would seem to be that if a toxic shard like yours appears, and it seems like that’s clearly the case, that shard should be broken up ASAP. I’m surprised there isn’t a mechanism for enabling it if I’m honest.
I would agree with this part except CG has clearly taken actions that do increase payouts over what they were before. Moving crystals from SA to GAC is one example. Another would be allowing players to set their own payout times. It may not be likely, but it certainly isn’t out of the realm os possibility.
And it’s even harder for CG to take direct action against mafias IMO than it is for cheating, because the fleet shard chats exist outside of the game. For starters, what qualifies as a mafia exactly? How would they identify it? They can’t rely solely on accusation, and it’s not like they could partner with discord because that would be a pretty big invasion of privacy. And the chats would just move somewhere else.
You can succeed with fleets focus in GAC if your opponent doesn't see their disadvantage. But, if they have stronger squads they can make it so that fleets are irrelevant. You can't make it the other way around because fleets are behind.
lol no. So many people ignore fleets because they don't like the content that getting a decent fleet and dropping it on defense can flat out win GAC matches with nothing else on the board because you can save everything else for offense. The thing I dislike about moving it to GAC is that it would likely reduce the income for accounts in lower leagues, which in turn would reduce the rate of progress for early accounts. And that's a bad thing.
Wins in fleet GAC matches giving crystals has the same issue, the number of fleets in lower leagues vs higher leagues. And putting the reward on clearing the fleet zone doesn't seem like a good idea because it invalidates the work made on clearing a couple of the fleets in Kyber, but not all. Having a mix with crystals on win and on clearing the zone is maybe a decent way to balance it out, but I think it's still not ideal.
The crystals moving from SA to GAC massively increased the amount of crystals entering the pool and the game seems to be doing fine. Sure, crystals for wins would likely increase crystal output, but it would go to people who actually play the game instead of those who have gone complacent on dead shards collecting a free payment. It would go to people who work on fleets instead of those who don't.
The only issue I can see with granting crystals on wins for fleet arena is the case where you are at the bottom of the active player pool (everyone above you plays and everyone below you has quit the game), the people above all have Leviathan, and no non-Leviathan counter exists to Leviathan, and it's a position which is currently rewarded crystals. In which case, maybe half rewards on a loss and/or allow people to battle below them for reduced crystals.
Do you have any evidence that supports that moving crystals to GAC increased the crystal pool?.... I really don't think it did...
Cool, then you and others should have no issues with increasing crystal pools from fleet arena. Thanks!
The difference is that in fleet only top 50 gets crystals.
So you don't have any evidence?.... And no, why would I want to lose more crystals than I already did when they made the squad arena change?
Somehow increasing rewards means you're losing some. Can you elaborate? I really never understand your logic.
You don't understand my logic because you keep insisting they increased rewards when they didn't... I will use myself as an example... I am in the bottom of K2 currently...
Under the old system first place in squad arena rewarded me 600 crystals daily... in a 30 day month, that's 18.000 crystals
30 days of base crystal rewards = 240 * 30 = 7200 crystals
There are 9 match-ups every month so lets say I win better than 50% (5) = 4125 crystals (825 / win)
Now lets add the crystals for the 4 matchups I lose = 800 crystals (200 / loss)
And, lets be generous and say I finish top 4 every event = 1500 crystals
Now add the 2050 end of championship rewards = 2050
Total monthly crystals from GAC = 15675
So yes, I personally am losing 2325 crystals a month with GAC vs the old system, and I am in kyber... Those in lower divisions are losing more (sometimes a LOT more) if they previously took the initiative to be competitive in SA....
Tell me again how they increased the rewards?
Yes, and that relies on your opponent not setting all of their best squads on defence. Fleets only defences rely on two things. You having enough to beat their best X squads which would be placed in front of their fleets, and/or them not placing their best squads on defence. I regularly used to play fleets-only when I had the advantage in exe over my opponent, but if they had JMK or LV and set it in front of their fleets I was almost guaranteed a loss. All they had to do was clear my three squad zones and I wouldn't be able to clear theirs.
If player A has decent squads and a GL advantage, and player B has weaker squads but has Executor/Profundity player A can almost guarantee a win by simply placing their best squads in front of fleets. That way player B's advantage in fleets means sweet f**k all. This is why fleets are less important (but not completely irrelevant) in GAC. Crystals could be moved somewhere else, but shouldn't be moved to GAC as it is.
Fair enough (I thought it was 600, but will take your word for it)....
The bottom line is I see no reason that they should move crystals from fleet arena just because there are some terrible fleet shards out there.... I proposed a solution for you earlier...
Because there were more payouts than first place in squad arena. As far as I am aware, it’s generally accepted that CG is paying out more crystals to people now than under the old SA system.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SWGalaxyOfHeroes/comments/r5h1wl/squadgrand_arena_crystal_income_analysis/
Pretty simple google search.
And what was your proposed solution again? Breaking ToS by creating a competing mafia? Again, I find it wildly disgusting to suggest breaking ToS. Bad fleet shards are a problem that CG unwillingly created. The game mode is currently flawed. The problem is the inequity found in fleet shards. It's not something for players to solve, it's a problem for CG to fix.
/e And again, I made a suggestion to keep rewards in fleet arena, just change how the reward system works, and you have completely ignored it again to just say, "well, I don't want rewards moved."
It absolutely is not uniform for every player.
That makes the fleet mafia worse than the old arena mafias. It is easier for a mafia to control all crystals.
For those of, the vast majority, who were not in arena mafia getting 1st every day, our crystals dramatically increased.