I can probably delete my GAC offense and defense registers until I have a GL (im not that super far away). makes no sense to get on board. I farmed that way that I don't have such a long way to the next GL Kenobi for example.
has that been the goal now?
i am not the greatest enemy of the change i know where you come from. some hidden buffs are nice for example when GAS works with 501. that will make the team stronger in TB.
like i said most of my opponents have a GL and the rest of the roster are mostly weak.
They don't even have well-developed teams for TBs, but I've also focused on Teams for TBs.
however, I have mostly a much better overall developed roster with better mods.
i.e. they simply need to put their GL on the defensive and thats it - it will no longer be played.
where is the point for me to enter GAC in the time until I have a GL? so be it.
You could put a wall of non-GLs. No way he could break it if the rest of his roster is weak.
I can probably delete my GAC offense and defense registers until I have a GL (im not that super far away). makes no sense to get on board. I farmed that way that I don't have such a long way to the next GL Kenobi for example.
has that been the goal now?
i am not the greatest enemy of the change i know where you come from. some hidden buffs are nice for example when GAS works with 501. that will make the team stronger in TB.
like i said most of my opponents have a GL and the rest of the roster are mostly weak.
They don't even have well-developed teams for TBs, but I've also focused on Teams for TBs.
however, I have mostly a much better overall developed roster with better mods.
i.e. they simply need to put their GL on the defensive and thats it - it will no longer be played.
where is the point for me to enter GAC in the time until I have a GL? so be it.
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
It probably would, it's not like CG to introduce a non-zero floor without also introducing a ceiling. But at least from the forum, it seems that people percieve the bad runs more strongly, so there might be a potential to increase satisfaction. Even when in reality it makes no difference.
How do you add a floor and keep a drop rate without reducing/adjusting the top end?
People definitely feel/remember the bad more, but that is generally the case, from my understanding of confirmation bias. So while you can narrow the band around the average, it may not actually fo anything for the feelings.
I think Nauros put it quite well in his post. While I think not having a ceiling would ultimately help gear acquisition and potentially ease the gear crunches many are asking for, a bottom would be most welcome for me.
I can tell you from my feelings that a 5/5 on character shards feels good, but that has happened for me only a few times in my farming over the course of my play. While on the other hand I can point out multiple times in the last week where I received 0/5 on shard drops or events like this: 0/17 for Kyro Computers.
I know this is simply an anecdote and my overall farming is likely within the drop rates, this drop rate just feels bad and I don’t enjoy the RNG involved. To put it simply, I’m not a gambler; I know the house always wins. I would definitely appreciate a guarantee on drops over the RNG that happens so often. The good feeling would have to come from a 12/17+ drop to offset the bad feeling from a 0 or 1/17 drop. That’s just my opinion and I could be in the minority on wanting some form of guaranteed drops. I accept that.
I agree it would be ideal, but that's not how the math works. Adding a ceiling means something about the top end has to change or the drop rate would change.
There is a difference between asking for a higher drop rate and trying to add a bottom for a better feeling.
I'm all for more....or a guarantee drop, but again that is different than what was stated.
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
I remember this argument when CG was changing how many zetas drop in the ship challenge. There were ppl who desperately wanted to keep it 0-4 because a static 2 wasn't as many as the possible maximum. Meanwhile, ppl like me who so often pulled 0s wanted change bc getting zeroes several weeks in a row was choking our progression. But eventually we could pull 4! I never pulled a 4. Never pulled a 3. I don't know anyone who did. But man did ppl want to keep that format just bc they "might" get lucky and pull 4 zetas one day.
Different argument.
Static drop is different than a minimum drop higher than 0. (Unless I misunderstood the original requests, we are not talking about a static drop)
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
I remember this argument when CG was changing how many zetas drop in the ship challenge. There were ppl who desperately wanted to keep it 0-4 because a static 2 wasn't as many as the possible maximum. Meanwhile, ppl like me who so often pulled 0s wanted change bc getting zeroes several weeks in a row was choking our progression. But eventually we could pull 4! I never pulled a 4. Never pulled a 3. I don't know anyone who did. But man did ppl want to keep that format just bc they "might" get lucky and pull 4 zetas one day.
Different argument.
Static drop is different than a minimum drop higher than 0. (Unless I misunderstood the original requests, we are not talking about a static drop)
It wasn't a request, just an idea that might be worth thinking about. I know how statistics work, so I don't care whether there is a floor or not as long as the overall rate is the same. And in the end, the only one who could benefit from it is CG by better player sentiment, so you being a contrarian makes even less sense than usually.
There don't need to be any random drop rates at all, though. Consider shards. They could make the drop rate 100%, triple the returns in the stores (or cut prices to 1/3), and make it require 1000 shards to 7*.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
It probably would, it's not like CG to introduce a non-zero floor without also introducing a ceiling. But at least from the forum, it seems that people percieve the bad runs more strongly, so there might be a potential to increase satisfaction. Even when in reality it makes no difference.
How do you add a floor and keep a drop rate without reducing/adjusting the top end?
People definitely feel/remember the bad more, but that is generally the case, from my understanding of confirmation bias. So while you can narrow the band around the average, it may not actually fo anything for the feelings.
I think Nauros put it quite well in his post. While I think not having a ceiling would ultimately help gear acquisition and potentially ease the gear crunches many are asking for, a bottom would be most welcome for me.
I can tell you from my feelings that a 5/5 on character shards feels good, but that has happened for me only a few times in my farming over the course of my play. While on the other hand I can point out multiple times in the last week where I received 0/5 on shard drops or events like this: 0/17 for Kyro Computers.
I know this is simply an anecdote and my overall farming is likely within the drop rates, this drop rate just feels bad and I don’t enjoy the RNG involved. To put it simply, I’m not a gambler; I know the house always wins. I would definitely appreciate a guarantee on drops over the RNG that happens so often. The good feeling would have to come from a 12/17+ drop to offset the bad feeling from a 0 or 1/17 drop. That’s just my opinion and I could be in the minority on wanting some form of guaranteed drops. I accept that.
I agree it would be ideal, but that's not how the math works. Adding a ceiling means something about the top end has to change or the drop rate would change.
There is a difference between asking for a higher drop rate and trying to add a bottom for a better feeling.
I'm all for more....or a guarantee drop, but again that is different than what was stated.
Agreed it is different than what was stated. I think the combination of guaranteed low end without a cap would increase drop rates (easing gear crunch for everyone) AND have a better feeling. Shoot even TVF would get more gear for his hoard under this scenario…
There don't need to be any random drop rates at all, though. Consider shards. They could make the drop rate 100%, triple the returns in the stores (or cut prices to 1/3), and make it require 1000 shards to 7*.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
I agree with this 100%. Any number of methods could account for a static/guaranteed drop rate, but you are probably most accurate with the “business reasons” for the variability.
There don't need to be any random drop rates at all, though. Consider shards. They could make the drop rate 100%, triple the returns in the stores (or cut prices to 1/3), and make it require 1000 shards to 7*.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
Yes. If you get frustrated with your drops you're more likely to spend crystals on shards or gear.
For a 20% drop rate on kyro, of course you will get more 1/17s than a 12/17.
As I said, I understand that my drop rate over time is on par.
The point: I feel frustration from a 0 or 1/17 drop but do not feel a “rush” for let’s say 7 or 8/17 drop (taking a 40% drop instead of 0% for the offset). To feel that “rush” would require something in the realm of 12/17 (a highly unlikely drop). My preference would be to reduce variability.
There don't need to be any random drop rates at all, though. Consider shards. They could make the drop rate 100%, triple the returns in the stores (or cut prices to 1/3), and make it require 1000 shards to 7*.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
Yes. If you get frustrated with your drops you're more likely to spend crystals on shards or gear.
For a 20% drop rate on kyro, of course you will get more 1/17s than a 12/17.
As I said, I understand that my drop rate over time is on par.
The point: I feel frustration from a 0 or 1/17 drop but do not feel a “rush” for let’s say 7 or 8/17 drop (taking a 40% drop instead of 0% for the offset). To feel that “rush” would require something in the realm of 12/17 (a highly unlikely drop). My preference would be to reduce variability.
I have no feelings, being dead inside, so it doesn't matter to me.
For a 20% drop rate on kyro, of course you will get more 1/17s than a 12/17.
As I said, I understand that my drop rate over time is on par.
The point: I feel frustration from a 0 or 1/17 drop but do not feel a “rush” for let’s say 7 or 8/17 drop (taking a 40% drop instead of 0% for the offset). To feel that “rush” would require something in the realm of 12/17 (a highly unlikely drop). My preference would be to reduce variability.
I have no feelings, being dead inside, so it doesn't matter to me.
Lol.. you'd have to be dead inside to resist the endorphin rush of spending your stash
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
I remember this argument when CG was changing how many zetas drop in the ship challenge. There were ppl who desperately wanted to keep it 0-4 because a static 2 wasn't as many as the possible maximum. Meanwhile, ppl like me who so often pulled 0s wanted change bc getting zeroes several weeks in a row was choking our progression. But eventually we could pull 4! I never pulled a 4. Never pulled a 3. I don't know anyone who did. But man did ppl want to keep that format just bc they "might" get lucky and pull 4 zetas one day.
Different argument.
Static drop is different than a minimum drop higher than 0. (Unless I misunderstood the original requests, we are not talking about a static drop)
It wasn't a request, just an idea that might be worth thinking about. I know how statistics work, so I don't care whether there is a floor or not as long as the overall rate is the same. And in the end, the only one who could benefit from it is CG by better player sentiment, so you being a contrarian makes even less sense than usually.
You said nothing about the rate being the same. I pointed out what would need to happen to keep the rate the same. I never said it was a bad idea, just that in the end its literally the same and from the general consensus on how the human brain works when having a drop rate, people will still focus on the low end, and this may lead to no real change in the feelings.
For a 20% drop rate on kyro, of course you will get more 1/17s than a 12/17.
As I said, I understand that my drop rate over time is on par.
The point: I feel frustration from a 0 or 1/17 drop but do not feel a “rush” for let’s say 7 or 8/17 drop (taking a 40% drop instead of 0% for the offset). To feel that “rush” would require something in the realm of 12/17 (a highly unlikely drop). My preference would be to reduce variability.
I have no feelings, being dead inside, so it doesn't matter to me.
With the hoard you have, I wouldn’t “feel” much about drop rates either.
There don't need to be any random drop rates at all, though. Consider shards. They could make the drop rate 100%, triple the returns in the stores (or cut prices to 1/3), and make it require 1000 shards to 7*.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
That would be interesting, but yes, I'm sure there are reasons to get in the way of that kind of change across the board.
Hard to tell from such a vague statement. Bouts of super bad RNG are definitely real (as are bouts of super good RNG), so maybe Avinash was getting at that? Some "guaranteed minimum drops" to reduce feel bad moments might be an idea worth investigating.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
I remember this argument when CG was changing how many zetas drop in the ship challenge. There were ppl who desperately wanted to keep it 0-4 because a static 2 wasn't as many as the possible maximum. Meanwhile, ppl like me who so often pulled 0s wanted change bc getting zeroes several weeks in a row was choking our progression. But eventually we could pull 4! I never pulled a 4. Never pulled a 3. I don't know anyone who did. But man did ppl want to keep that format just bc they "might" get lucky and pull 4 zetas one day.
Different argument.
Static drop is different than a minimum drop higher than 0. (Unless I misunderstood the original requests, we are not talking about a static drop)
It wasn't a request, just an idea that might be worth thinking about. I know how statistics work, so I don't care whether there is a floor or not as long as the overall rate is the same. And in the end, the only one who could benefit from it is CG by better player sentiment, so you being a contrarian makes even less sense than usually.
You said nothing about the rate being the same. I pointed out what would need to happen to keep the rate the same. I never said it was a bad idea, just that in the end its literally the same and from the general consensus on how the human brain works when having a drop rate, people will still focus on the low end, and this may lead to no real change in the feelings.
I would feel better about guaranteed 1/17 than 0/17 from my screenshot example (both are low, but at least 1 is something toward progress). Maybe I’m in the minority here and can accept that. I still think Ragnarok and TVF hit the nail on the head with “business reasons” and frustration spending.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
Balance Kyno? You mean like when they said they wanted to ensure tanks being more survivable and not dying in one hit? Even as they released a character in CAT who one hit kills all but GL's with her first force leap? Hell Cubs Fan Han even showed a video today of CAT under JMK doing a 900K hit on like her 5th force leap to GL Rey one shot killing her also.. so exactly what balance are you talking about here? I feel our definition of balance is two different things.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
Balance Kyno? You mean like when they said they wanted to ensure tanks being more survivable and not dying in one hit? Even as they released a character in CAT who one hit kills all but GL's with her first force leap? Hell Cubs Fan Han even showed a video today of CAT under JMK doing a 900K hit on like her 5th force leap to GL Rey one shot killing her also.. so exactly what balance are you talking about here? I feel our definition of balance is two different things.
We are talking math, please feel free to move onto what ever topic you want, but that's not what I am talking about.
Balance in that quote is to keep the drop rate the same, if you bring in the bottom you have to adjust the top to keep the same rate.
We are talking math, please feel free to move onto what ever topic you want, but that's not what I am talking about.
Balance in that quote is to keep the drop rate the same, if you bring in the bottom you have to adjust the top to keep the same rate.
My point exactly is that for you or anyone at CG to try to discuss proper balance in the game is a bad joke at best. There are hypocrisies abound this game. Look.. all I am saying is if CG and all of you just grabbed your stones and just came out and said.. "We want GL's and our new characters over powered so we can profit off them better.. we need to increase our profit margin.. so we need to widen the gap between older characters and newer characters." Yeah.. you admit its all about $$$ but in that circumstance at most I just shrug my shoulders and at least respect you all for your honesty. I know the game is not designed to be a fair game, I am fine with that, just do not insult my intelligence by trying to pretend it actually is a fair game and we will get along fine.
But wouldnt that then also reduce the feel good moments to keep the balance on the average?
Balance Kyno? You mean like when they said they wanted to ensure tanks being more survivable and not dying in one hit? Even as they released a character in CAT who one hit kills all but GL's with her first force leap? Hell Cubs Fan Han even showed a video today of CAT under JMK doing a 900K hit on like her 5th force leap to GL Rey one shot killing her also.. so exactly what balance are you talking about here? I feel our definition of balance is two different things.
Cat’s annihilate turn 1 is only when she’s paired with a gl. GLs are on a whole other level of power, they stated it pretty clearly in the road ahead, as I’m pretty sure you noticed.
Edit: follow-up question: what is a ‘fair game’ for you ?
We are talking math, please feel free to move onto what ever topic you want, but that's not what I am talking about.
Balance in that quote is to keep the drop rate the same, if you bring in the bottom you have to adjust the top to keep the same rate.
My point exactly is that for you or anyone at CG to try to discuss proper balance in the game is a bad joke at best. There are hypocrisies abound this game. Look.. all I am saying is if CG and all of you just grabbed your stones and just came out and said.. "We want GL's and our new characters over powered so we can profit off them better.. we need to increase our profit margin.. so we need to widen the gap between older characters and newer characters." Yeah.. you admit its all about $$$ but in that circumstance at most I just shrug my shoulders and at least respect you all for your honesty. I know the game is not designed to be a fair game, I am fine with that, just do not insult my intelligence by trying to pretend it actually is a fair game and we will get along fine.
That is fine if you want to discuss this, but then dont quote a different topic that is not what you are saying and trying to twist it.
You are discussing something different than what was being discussed.
SEE sucks as it is right now. Might as well relic CUP lol and they are going screw his squad up. Explain if I'm wrong
Running SeE sith tri with vader. Was going to add WAT once geared.
I'm not asking to be in the top 50. I just want to have fun. Stinks to have done all that work to watch it crumble. The fun part is mixing squads to see the results. After this it will seem to be pretty much limited.
The game pace reminds me of mobile strike. Fun for the first year. Then the pace went straight p2p and I mean $200 a week to stay relevant. Destroyed the game. Usually happens when they are close to ending the game. Sad
Replies
You could put a wall of non-GLs. No way he could break it if the rest of his roster is weak.
You can 2-shot it. That’s the point
I agree it would be ideal, but that's not how the math works. Adding a ceiling means something about the top end has to change or the drop rate would change.
There is a difference between asking for a higher drop rate and trying to add a bottom for a better feeling.
I'm all for more....or a guarantee drop, but again that is different than what was stated.
Different argument.
Static drop is different than a minimum drop higher than 0. (Unless I misunderstood the original requests, we are not talking about a static drop)
It wasn't a request, just an idea that might be worth thinking about. I know how statistics work, so I don't care whether there is a floor or not as long as the overall rate is the same. And in the end, the only one who could benefit from it is CG by better player sentiment, so you being a contrarian makes even less sense than usually.
Just the possibility, I don't have the data to assume anything more. And neither do you.
My data is the forums.
EDIT: I stand corrected since you said "player sentiment" which is much more than just the loudest people.
I would prefer this method as I hate variability. I'm no conspiracy monger. I've tracked drop rates before when I'm planning farms. They average out in the end. So while this wouldn't actually help me in the long run. It would make me feel better.
However, I'm pretty sure there are "business reasons" to keep the variability in play.
You are one of the loudest people on the forums, mate. Check a mirror once in awhile before passing judgment.
I think it might be time for Buddy the Elf to retire (you’ve dropped the schtick anyway) and the Cubans to be lit.
Agreed it is different than what was stated. I think the combination of guaranteed low end without a cap would increase drop rates (easing gear crunch for everyone) AND have a better feeling. Shoot even TVF would get more gear for his hoard under this scenario…
Nevermind, now I hate it. 😂 jk
I agree with this 100%. Any number of methods could account for a static/guaranteed drop rate, but you are probably most accurate with the “business reasons” for the variability.
Yes. If you get frustrated with your drops you're more likely to spend crystals on shards or gear.
As I said, I understand that my drop rate over time is on par.
The point: I feel frustration from a 0 or 1/17 drop but do not feel a “rush” for let’s say 7 or 8/17 drop (taking a 40% drop instead of 0% for the offset). To feel that “rush” would require something in the realm of 12/17 (a highly unlikely drop). My preference would be to reduce variability.
That would be the "business reasons" :]
I have no feelings, being dead inside, so it doesn't matter to me.
Lol.. you'd have to be dead inside to resist the endorphin rush of spending your stash
You said nothing about the rate being the same. I pointed out what would need to happen to keep the rate the same. I never said it was a bad idea, just that in the end its literally the same and from the general consensus on how the human brain works when having a drop rate, people will still focus on the low end, and this may lead to no real change in the feelings.
With the hoard you have, I wouldn’t “feel” much about drop rates either.
That would be interesting, but yes, I'm sure there are reasons to get in the way of that kind of change across the board.
I would feel better about guaranteed 1/17 than 0/17 from my screenshot example (both are low, but at least 1 is something toward progress). Maybe I’m in the minority here and can accept that. I still think Ragnarok and TVF hit the nail on the head with “business reasons” and frustration spending.
Balance Kyno? You mean like when they said they wanted to ensure tanks being more survivable and not dying in one hit? Even as they released a character in CAT who one hit kills all but GL's with her first force leap? Hell Cubs Fan Han even showed a video today of CAT under JMK doing a 900K hit on like her 5th force leap to GL Rey one shot killing her also.. so exactly what balance are you talking about here? I feel our definition of balance is two different things.
We are talking math, please feel free to move onto what ever topic you want, but that's not what I am talking about.
Balance in that quote is to keep the drop rate the same, if you bring in the bottom you have to adjust the top to keep the same rate.
We don’t know yet. If we do, then I’ve missed something.
Thank you for evaluating. Your feedback is appreciated.
My point exactly is that for you or anyone at CG to try to discuss proper balance in the game is a bad joke at best. There are hypocrisies abound this game. Look.. all I am saying is if CG and all of you just grabbed your stones and just came out and said.. "We want GL's and our new characters over powered so we can profit off them better.. we need to increase our profit margin.. so we need to widen the gap between older characters and newer characters." Yeah.. you admit its all about $$$ but in that circumstance at most I just shrug my shoulders and at least respect you all for your honesty. I know the game is not designed to be a fair game, I am fine with that, just do not insult my intelligence by trying to pretend it actually is a fair game and we will get along fine.
Cat’s annihilate turn 1 is only when she’s paired with a gl. GLs are on a whole other level of power, they stated it pretty clearly in the road ahead, as I’m pretty sure you noticed.
Edit: follow-up question: what is a ‘fair game’ for you ?
That is fine if you want to discuss this, but then dont quote a different topic that is not what you are saying and trying to twist it.
You are discussing something different than what was being discussed.
Running SeE sith tri with vader. Was going to add WAT once geared.
I'm not asking to be in the top 50. I just want to have fun. Stinks to have done all that work to watch it crumble. The fun part is mixing squads to see the results. After this it will seem to be pretty much limited.
The game pace reminds me of mobile strike. Fun for the first year. Then the pace went straight p2p and I mean $200 a week to stay relevant. Destroyed the game. Usually happens when they are close to ending the game. Sad