@Qeltar is right. There are others such as ST Han that can taunt and be reasonably fast, and do some turn meter manipulation. However equal teams, one with STH and one with Poe, POE will win 90% of the time. Poe goes first, and will expose and reduce turn meters. By the time Han can effect turn meter or taunt, POE's team will have killed one, or probably 2 of Han's teammates, giving an instant and considerable advantage. Even tho Han can effect turn meter, it won't be enough.
I just don't think this is true of evenly matched teams. I also play this game I also fight in the same GW and Arena everyone else does. I don't get too scared when I see Poe.
I know people record their fights so I would like to see one where someone loses two characters before they have a chance to act.
My argument is that their team is far inferior if they're going to lose two characters before they get a chance to act.
You have to specify that this is AI controlled to, which is why it's so frustrating at times
Is there currently anyway for two people to actively fight?
I'm sure it's coming but the arena system could've been a lot better with a matchmaking system. I wonder if they thought they might not have enough users at I wonder if they thought they might not have enough users at first?
I know people record their fights so I would like to see one where someone loses two characters before they have a chance to act.
These forums are full of said videos. Please utilize the search feature.
A first turn Poe manipulates the turn meter to allows turn 8+ toons to go before "faster" toons on the opposing side. As a result you are able to hide heavy DPS such as fotp, GS, QGJ, ig86 behind Poe allowing one hit kills of most toons commonly. This is not new and has been heavily discussed.
@Qeltar is right. There are others such as ST Han that can taunt and be reasonably fast, and do some turn meter manipulation. However equal teams, one with STH and one with Poe, POE will win 90% of the time. Poe goes first, and will expose and reduce turn meters. By the time Han can effect turn meter or taunt, POE's team will have killed one, or probably 2 of Han's teammates, giving an instant and considerable advantage. Even tho Han can effect turn meter, it won't be enough.
I just don't think this is true of evenly matched teams. I also play this game I also fight in the same GW and Arena everyone else does. I don't get too scared when I see Poe.
I know people record their fights so I would like to see one where someone loses two characters before they have a chance to act.
My argument is that their team is far inferior if they're going to lose two characters before they get a chance to act.
I use a team of lvl 67 7* phasma (L), FOO, Kylo, Lumi, and a 5 star QGJ...all have max gear except lumi is 10 blow dryers away.
I frequently lose 2 characters before I can act, regularly QGJ dies first. Please, enlighten me on what team is not inferior that one would not lose 2 characters before I could react.
Do you think it is possible you are just fighting weak ungeared poe teams?
Everyone has to get your own Poe, otherwise they won't nerf him.
They can only see a problem when they realise Poe dumbs down the game into a cowboy standoff.
Who pull first win the game 80% of the time.
First of all, max your toons and team.
Having in mind you have an equal team regarding power and level:
You can use toons like Jinn to remove the taunt.
You can use Poe yourself.
You can just full nuke him with a decent damage team. Poe is not that big of a deal, he falls fast.
Use Phasma. Apply turn-meter manipulation yourself.
Use high health toons like Kylo.
No offense, but there are ways of beating Poe teams.
And no, Poe doesn't change a mediocre team into a winning team unless the other team is mediocre too.
I tend to agree that there is no easy substitute for Poe. But I think that's especially true for FTP players. There are some pretty awesome PTW teams that don't use Poe (though even there, the best teams do). But FTP players without Poe are going to struggle, plain and simple. Doesn't mean 0 for 5 - I still win more often than I lose against Poe teams, even though I don't have him in useable form yet, and I am FTP. But my overall winning % in arena is over 80% (not awesome by any means I realize), but against Poe teams it's more like 50%.
Edit - and the above responses prove my point. Most of the suggestions for beating Poe rely upon toons not readily available for FTP players.
So that's what hiding your tail between your legs and running looks like in print! Talk about owning yourself, you rock!
Why enter a thread and pass a comment which you can't/ won't back up?!
Back on topic, it's very difficult to counter Poe without using him yourself. As discussed a dozen times, his taunt is not the problem. It's the cannons who get to shoot straight after him, all in a row. Of course he's useless if he's not guarding those damage dealers and everyone agrees he can be beat. But at similar levels of opponents, its still the luck of the draw. Who. Shoots. 1st.
Btw, I have him but not the team to complement him so haven't used him. The above thoughts are my understanding from all the threads about him. I haven't defeated a proper Poe team yet. In regular teams like mine (Sid, Phasma, Lumi et al), he's the clown. He gets laughed at every time he shows up, lol!
I am actually suprised by this thread. Compared to Chewie, Poe dies super quick. Yes Chewie doesn't have expose but at lvl 70 he has 100% revive health twice.
Poe changes that, because if he goes first, my entire team go first. And that breaks the already fragile balance of you-me-you-me turn system. If I play 5 characters before you do, it's VERY dificult for you to win
This just flat out isn't true. What I typically see is my Sid, my Poe, enemy Sid/Dooku/Leia/Poe, then my team. If they have a Poe as well it would probably all balance out in the wash. Actually they'd be slightly ahead as turn meter reductions are a percentage of what is built up, not a flat amount.
Saw that constantly in my GW run today. My entire team did not go before their entire team.
That's flat out true if you build a team with heavy hitter speedsters like Geo, Rey, Leia, Sid, QGJ, etc..
He won't allow s team of Ashoka and Ventress go first, but in the correct team, of course he does.
Poe changes that, because if he goes first, my entire team go first. And that breaks the already fragile balance of you-me-you-me turn system. If I play 5 characters before you do, it's VERY dificult for you to win
This just flat out isn't true. What I typically see is my Sid, my Poe, enemy Sid/Dooku/Leia/Poe, then my team. If they have a Poe as well it would probably all balance out in the wash. Actually they'd be slightly ahead as turn meter reductions are a percentage of what is built up, not a flat amount.
Saw that constantly in my GW run today. My entire team did not go before their entire team.
That's flat out true if you build a team with heavy hitter speedsters like Geo, Rey, Leia, Sid, QGJ, etc..
He won't allow s team of Ashoka and Ventress go first, but in the correct team, of course he does.
Hence the issue, fast toons with high health AND high dmg, compared to slow toons with lesser health and lesser dmg.
439-259-888 I have a bad habit of editing my typo's after posting
Since this discussion is still going, can someone give an example of a lineup that would be weakend if 1 toon was exchanged with Poe? I am having a hard time coming up with such a lineup
Since this discussion is still going, can someone give an example of a lineup that would be weakend if 1 toon was exchanged with Poe? I am having a hard time coming up with such a lineup
Mine, probably. I usually run Phasma, Dooku, Daka, Asajj/Sideous and Luminara. Phasma is the leader. Dooku is there for stuns, counters and typing up opponent Lumis. Daka is there for stuns, healing and the rare revive. Lumi is there for ability block and heals, and Asajj/Sideous are for AoE/dispels/heal-block. Poe would not do a great deal for this team, and I'd have to take an essential piece out for him. He wouldn't weaken it a great deal I guess, but he wouldn't make a huge difference either.
He also wouldn't do much for a tanky counter team (not that those are very viable at the moment anyway).
Used my own Poe 4* today, boom rank 1. I change my opinion, Poe isnt OP at all, #gieffreecrystals
Power dropped from 26k to 23k but who cares if you autowin right?
439-259-888 I have a bad habit of editing my typo's after posting
I actually beat a lot of Poe teams now as long as I don't try the OP whale teams, which I couldn't beat before anyway. I just beat a Poe/Phasma/Poggle/Sid/IG-86 team. Asajj was once again the star of the show, acting as healer and AoE.
I know I'd have no chance against the FOTP/Leia monstrosities. It's still kinda fun to hang around the vicinity of the top 20 or 30 with a non-meta team I haven't changed in weeks... and they aren't even all the way powered up.
Since this discussion is still going, can someone give an example of a lineup that would be weakend if 1 toon was exchanged with Poe? I am having a hard time coming up with such a lineup
Mine, probably. I usually run Phasma, Dooku, Daka, Asajj/Sideous and Luminara. Phasma is the leader. Dooku is there for stuns, counters and typing up opponent Lumis. Daka is there for stuns, healing and the rare revive. Lumi is there for ability block and heals, and Asajj/Sideous are for AoE/dispels/heal-block. Poe would not do a great deal for this team, and I'd have to take an essential piece out for him. He wouldn't weaken it a great deal I guess, but he wouldn't make a huge difference either.
He also wouldn't do much for a tanky counter team (not that those are very viable at the moment anyway).
I think he would be quite good for a stun team because he could push daka in front of some of the high damage-dealing enemies and he will protect your daka. (My team looks a lot like yours actually). What star is your dooku?
I agree that the less glass-canony the team is the less important Poe becomes, but alas, I also feel that they become increasingly less viable for the arena
You could be right. But then someone has to go. Daka usually moves pretty fast anyway, generally after Poe does his thing and Sid AoEs. I actually usually use her first for a heal, not stun, as that keeps everyone alive long enough for Lumi to heal. If 4 or more of my guys are still standing after that, then it's game on. Otherwise I probably lose.
Again though, these aren't the A tier Poe teams with annoyances like Leia.
I still think/hope Poe will be brought back to earth in the next patch. We'll see.
It's funny because since the rise of Poe and the messing up of GW, I now enjoy Arena and hate GW, where it used to be the opposite. I just expect I will lose every game and then try to find a way to survive long enough for a comeback.
I actually beat a lot of Poe teams now as long as I don't try the OP whale teams, which I couldn't beat before anyway. I just beat a Poe/Phasma/Poggle/Sid/IG-86 team. Asajj was once again the star of the show, acting as healer and AoE.
I know I'd have no chance against the FOTP/Leia monstrosities. It's still kinda fun to hang around the vicinity of the top 20 or 30 with a non-meta team I haven't changed in weeks... and they aren't even all the way powered up.
So, asaj is broken right now right? Her heal is supposed to heal only her? What are you going to do if they fix that? What changes would you make?
I love Asajj, she is so cool and her abilities rule but she is slow as junk.
So, asaj is broken right now right? Her heal is supposed to heal only her? What are you going to do if they fix that? What changes would you make?
If they remove that they will be nerfing a character that doesn't need nerfing, and I will probably shelve her and replace her with someone else. Probably stick with Sid in the meantime, and hope some other interesting build combos come out.
Kylo would be great in this team as well, just very different. I have a fully-loaded Kylo and he just sits right now.
So, asaj is broken right now right? Her heal is supposed to heal only her? What are you going to do if they fix that? What changes would you make?
If they remove that they will be nerfing a character that doesn't need nerfing, and I will probably shelve her and replace her with someone else. Probably stick with Sid in the meantime, and hope some other interesting build combos come out.
Kylo would be great in this team as well, just very different. I have a fully-loaded Kylo and he just sits right now.
I spent 100 bucks on Kylo who knows how much on refreshes to get him to 7* and mine does the same, rides the pine.
So Asajj is really that good for heals? Seems like it would really suck face on defense, but when used on offense seems like it could be a nice tool to have.
I spent 100 bucks on Kylo who knows how much on refreshes to get him to 7* and mine does the same, rides the pine.
I didn't buy him but I think he'll fit into a team eventually. He's a great secondary in GW... amusingly, I usually use him against other Kylos.
If counter teams ever come back everyone will be using him.
So Asajj is really that good for heals? Seems like it would really suck face on defense, but when used on offense seems like it could be a nice tool to have.
If she lives long enough to use it. One reason I will 7* her if she isn't nerfed, she needs every HP she can get.
She also has that interesting "life steal" stat at 45%, highest in the game. Won't help against the one-shotters but could let her last longer otherwise.
We'll see. I think everything changes in Feb.
Just beat another Poe/Phasma team to sneak into the top 10 before the deadline.
I think these teams are actually getting easier for me because people are just taking random teams, sticking Poe in them, and thinking they will autowin. I dunno, maybe they do on offense. But this team had Fives and Dooku on it. There's not exactly great synergy between Poe and counterattackers. I mean it's not horrible, but he wasn't doing a lot to help this team.
In this fight Asajj got two AoEs off, the first one to finish off Poe and then a second one later. She got gunned down, then auto-revived courtesy of Daka's passive. Then got killed again, and a short time later I did Daka's heal and she was back again. Never got a heal off but I had it in hand by then.
Even though I was mocked for quite some time by certain individuals I shall not name, this team has held its own pretty well in the current meta.
Replies
You have to specify that this is AI controlled to, which is why it's so frustrating at times
I'm sure it's coming but the arena system could've been a lot better with a matchmaking system. I wonder if they thought they might not have enough users at I wonder if they thought they might not have enough users at first?
These forums are full of said videos. Please utilize the search feature.
A first turn Poe manipulates the turn meter to allows turn 8+ toons to go before "faster" toons on the opposing side. As a result you are able to hide heavy DPS such as fotp, GS, QGJ, ig86 behind Poe allowing one hit kills of most toons commonly. This is not new and has been heavily discussed.
@MenaceTEC
I use a team of lvl 67 7* phasma (L), FOO, Kylo, Lumi, and a 5 star QGJ...all have max gear except lumi is 10 blow dryers away.
I frequently lose 2 characters before I can act, regularly QGJ dies first. Please, enlighten me on what team is not inferior that one would not lose 2 characters before I could react.
Do you think it is possible you are just fighting weak ungeared poe teams?
They can only see a problem when they realise Poe dumbs down the game into a cowboy standoff.
Who pull first win the game 80% of the time.
Having in mind you have an equal team regarding power and level:
You can use toons like Jinn to remove the taunt.
You can use Poe yourself.
You can just full nuke him with a decent damage team. Poe is not that big of a deal, he falls fast.
Use Phasma. Apply turn-meter manipulation yourself.
Use high health toons like Kylo.
No offense, but there are ways of beating Poe teams.
And no, Poe doesn't change a mediocre team into a winning team unless the other team is mediocre too.
Edit - and the above responses prove my point. Most of the suggestions for beating Poe rely upon toons not readily available for FTP players.
haha, nicely put. I'll 2nd that!
So that's what hiding your tail between your legs and running looks like in print! Talk about owning yourself, you rock!
Why enter a thread and pass a comment which you can't/ won't back up?!
Back on topic, it's very difficult to counter Poe without using him yourself. As discussed a dozen times, his taunt is not the problem. It's the cannons who get to shoot straight after him, all in a row. Of course he's useless if he's not guarding those damage dealers and everyone agrees he can be beat. But at similar levels of opponents, its still the luck of the draw. Who. Shoots. 1st.
Btw, I have him but not the team to complement him so haven't used him. The above thoughts are my understanding from all the threads about him. I haven't defeated a proper Poe team yet. In regular teams like mine (Sid, Phasma, Lumi et al), he's the clown. He gets laughed at every time he shows up, lol!
That's flat out true if you build a team with heavy hitter speedsters like Geo, Rey, Leia, Sid, QGJ, etc..
He won't allow s team of Ashoka and Ventress go first, but in the correct team, of course he does.
Hence the issue, fast toons with high health AND high dmg, compared to slow toons with lesser health and lesser dmg.
Mine, probably. I usually run Phasma, Dooku, Daka, Asajj/Sideous and Luminara. Phasma is the leader. Dooku is there for stuns, counters and typing up opponent Lumis. Daka is there for stuns, healing and the rare revive. Lumi is there for ability block and heals, and Asajj/Sideous are for AoE/dispels/heal-block. Poe would not do a great deal for this team, and I'd have to take an essential piece out for him. He wouldn't weaken it a great deal I guess, but he wouldn't make a huge difference either.
He also wouldn't do much for a tanky counter team (not that those are very viable at the moment anyway).
Power dropped from 26k to 23k but who cares if you autowin right?
I know I'd have no chance against the FOTP/Leia monstrosities. It's still kinda fun to hang around the vicinity of the top 20 or 30 with a non-meta team I haven't changed in weeks... and they aren't even all the way powered up.
I think he would be quite good for a stun team because he could push daka in front of some of the high damage-dealing enemies and he will protect your daka. (My team looks a lot like yours actually). What star is your dooku?
I agree that the less glass-canony the team is the less important Poe becomes, but alas, I also feel that they become increasingly less viable for the arena
Again though, these aren't the A tier Poe teams with annoyances like Leia.
I still think/hope Poe will be brought back to earth in the next patch. We'll see.
It's funny because since the rise of Poe and the messing up of GW, I now enjoy Arena and hate GW, where it used to be the opposite. I just expect I will lose every game and then try to find a way to survive long enough for a comeback.
So, asaj is broken right now right? Her heal is supposed to heal only her? What are you going to do if they fix that? What changes would you make?
I love Asajj, she is so cool and her abilities rule but she is slow as junk.
Kylo would be great in this team as well, just very different. I have a fully-loaded Kylo and he just sits right now.
I spent 100 bucks on Kylo who knows how much on refreshes to get him to 7* and mine does the same, rides the pine.
So Asajj is really that good for heals? Seems like it would really suck face on defense, but when used on offense seems like it could be a nice tool to have.
If counter teams ever come back everyone will be using him.
If she lives long enough to use it. One reason I will 7* her if she isn't nerfed, she needs every HP she can get.
She also has that interesting "life steal" stat at 45%, highest in the game. Won't help against the one-shotters but could let her last longer otherwise.
We'll see. I think everything changes in Feb.
you got mace to do 600 damage? Wow, was he buffed with offense up and 2x critical strike?
You guys are so full of it, I borrowed a level 70, GL 8 mace and he broke 1k in damage.. I think I even saw it as high as 1100 with crits.
.. All I could think was... "Wow, he really does blow".
I think these teams are actually getting easier for me because people are just taking random teams, sticking Poe in them, and thinking they will autowin. I dunno, maybe they do on offense. But this team had Fives and Dooku on it. There's not exactly great synergy between Poe and counterattackers. I mean it's not horrible, but he wasn't doing a lot to help this team.
In this fight Asajj got two AoEs off, the first one to finish off Poe and then a second one later. She got gunned down, then auto-revived courtesy of Daka's passive. Then got killed again, and a short time later I did Daka's heal and she was back again.
Even though I was mocked for quite some time by certain individuals I shall not name, this team has held its own pretty well in the current meta.
anyway on defense she probably uses her heal on inapropriate moments but she is a powerhouse