Royal Guard viable in pvp now?

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    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    True. So RG will be very good but not op
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  • Triqui
    2790 posts Member
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    Ivan_Drago wrote: »
    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    He will taunt right after your first shot. The regardless of how fast your dps is (unless you one-shot, but with bariss in lead it is difficult to one-shot)

    Yes but then I still keep acting with my guys. Big difference.

    Let's take abmatch between a droid team and a pretty cookie vuttrt Sid, Dooku, Kylo, Phasma (L) FOTP team.

    Before:
    His Poe wins the Coin toss. His Poggle buff. His 88 AOE, then kill my Sid with the extra attsck from crits. His 86 one shot my Dooku. His 47 AOE and maybe block or debuff my remaining and very wounded chars, and perhaps kills FOTP or any character who got exposed if he attacks twice with the crits. In any case, I've lost, 2-3 of my chars are dead, the rest are wounded and debuffed, I have to kill his tank, and probably will lose


    Now:
    Dooku attacks, Wound 88, RG taunt for free. That's fine. My Turn. Sid AOE, damage 88 and the rest. Phasma adds adventage and TM. Kylo AOE and finish 88, maybe proc Phasma as he is FO. FOTP kills the wounded RG. Sid has maybe gained TM from the deaths too. Now it is Droid turn. They have 88 dead, RG dead, and 86 and the rest has taken 2 AOE, I still have Phasma AOE to use. His tank is dead and I can target anyone of his bsdly wounded chars. I'm in pretty good shape.

    Poe was powerful not because he taunted, but because he was a walking time bubble. In scenario 1 the droids have already won, and Poe has not been attacked yet. His skill could not have a Taunt, just the turnmeter msnipulation at fasyer speed, and he would had won the battle regardless.

    I think some people never really understood why they were winning with Poe. It was not because he had a taunt.
  • Triqui
    2790 posts Member
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    Note: that doesnt mean RG would not be useful. He will. Just that he is not going to be Poe2.0 as he lacks the thing that made Poe the strongest char in the game
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    Will he taunt right after the ally falls below 50% or at the start of RG's turn? If the former, does the taunt only last until it is RG's turn (a 1 turn taunt)?
    Triqui, I see your point, but that is just one case. If RG is hiding high speed / high dps, it changes. It also requires the other team to have decent AOE to hit behind the RG
  • Von
    119 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    Triqui wrote: »
    Ivan_Drago wrote: »
    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    He will taunt right after your first shot. The regardless of how fast your dps is (unless you one-shot, but with bariss in lead it is difficult to one-shot)

    Yes but then I still keep acting with my guys. Big difference.

    Let's take abmatch between a droid team and a pretty cookie vuttrt Sid, Dooku, Kylo, Phasma (L) FOTP team.

    Before:
    His Poe wins the Coin toss. His Poggle buff. His 88 AOE, then kill my Sid with the extra attsck from crits. His 86 one shot my Dooku. His 47 AOE and maybe block or debuff my remaining and very wounded chars, and perhaps kills FOTP or any character who got exposed if he attacks twice with the crits. In any case, I've lost, 2-3 of my chars are dead, the rest are wounded and debuffed, I have to kill his tank, and probably will lose


    Now:
    Dooku attacks, Wound 88, RG taunt for free. That's fine. My Turn. Sid AOE, damage 88 and the rest. Phasma adds adventage and TM. Kylo AOE and finish 88, maybe proc Phasma as he is FO. FOTP kills the wounded RG. Sid has maybe gained TM from the deaths too. Now it is Droid turn. They have 88 dead, RG dead, and 86 and the rest has taken 2 AOE, I still have Phasma AOE to use. His tank is dead and I can target anyone of his bsdly wounded chars. I'm in pretty good shape.

    Poe was powerful not because he taunted, but because he was a walking time bubble. In scenario 1 the droids have already won, and Poe has not been attacked yet. His skill could not have a Taunt, just the turnmeter msnipulation at fasyer speed, and he would had won the battle regardless.

    I think some people never really understood why they were winning with Poe. It was not because he had a taunt.

    After reading this RG post, I was wondering if the REBEL team could use him. The one you recommended me. I was thinking Ackbar (L), Han Stormtrooper, Leia, GS, and RG. Leia stealths first. Gs takes one cannon out or prob bring someone low. Han with Ackbar goes pretty quick, like 144 speed. Once he taughts and gets hit, turn meter manipulation and chance for RG to taunt. So even if Han can't take that many hits i'll still have RG with huge amount of health to tank it while Leia and GS with super speed taking the rest out.

    I'm still working on the REBEL team. Currently Leia is 7* with GEAR VII almost VIII after I finish that AGI +25 thingy, needs 50 of it. Ackbar almost 6* Han almost 7* . Hope it works out.

    BTW I have tons of shards for RG, like 283 or something. Still aint sure if I should invest in him.
  • Triqui
    2790 posts Member
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    Plasmaj wrote: »
    Will he taunt right after the ally falls below 50% or at the start of RG's turn? If the former, does the taunt only last until it is RG's turn (a 1 turn taunt)?
    Triqui, I see your point, but that is just one case. If RG is hiding high speed / high dps, it changes. It also requires the other team to have decent AOE to hit behind the RG

    It is not 1 case, it is always. The difference between RG and Poe is that RG let you use your chars. Old Poe didnt. No matter what chars you put in the example, being able to use them is better tha not. You could hide Leia, GS and friends behind RG, but I still can use my own Leía, and stealth. Or use my own Daka, and ressurrect the guy you killed. Or use my Poggle to buff, or my Yoda to give tenacity to my team. With old Poe, you clicked a button, then you did 5 things in a row, then it is my turn to try to do something with whstever half dead team you left me. That was the real power of Poe, and the reason why he had to be nerfed. There is nothing wrong with a fast tank who could taunt and protector other chars. That is expected from tanks. The problem was with a fast living Time Lord who could warp the space-time continuum in a blink.

    I think RG will be great, and add a lot to the game in forma of new options. Poe was disruptive.
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  • JoJoMo_007
    114 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    He's losing tons of hit points tho. I think it was his unique that gave him +7.5% hps per ally. So he will lose 30% of his hit points now.

    Edit: actually according to swcantina he get +11% per ally. So he's taking a 44% hit point reduction.
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    Triqui wrote: »
    Ivan_Drago wrote: »
    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    He will taunt right after your first shot. The regardless of how fast your dps is (unless you one-shot, but with bariss in lead it is difficult to one-shot)

    Yes but then I still keep acting with my guys. Big difference.

    Let's take abmatch between a droid team and a pretty cookie vuttrt Sid, Dooku, Kylo, Phasma (L) FOTP team.

    Before:
    His Poe wins the Coin toss. His Poggle buff. His 88 AOE, then kill my Sid with the extra attsck from crits. His 86 one shot my Dooku. His 47 AOE and maybe block or debuff my remaining and very wounded chars, and perhaps kills FOTP or any character who got exposed if he attacks twice with the crits. In any case, I've lost, 2-3 of my chars are dead, the rest are wounded and debuffed, I have to kill his tank, and probably will lose


    Now:
    Dooku attacks, Wound 88, RG taunt for free. That's fine. My Turn. Sid AOE, damage 88 and the rest. Phasma adds adventage and TM. Kylo AOE and finish 88, maybe proc Phasma as he is FO. FOTP kills the wounded RG. Sid has maybe gained TM from the deaths too. Now it is Droid turn. They have 88 dead, RG dead, and 86 and the rest has taken 2 AOE, I still have Phasma AOE to use. His tank is dead and I can target anyone of his bsdly wounded chars. I'm in pretty good shape.

    Poe was powerful not because he taunted, but because he was a walking time bubble. In scenario 1 the droids have already won, and Poe has not been attacked yet. His skill could not have a Taunt, just the turnmeter msnipulation at fasyer speed, and he would had won the battle regardless.

    I think some people never really understood why they were winning with Poe. It was not because he had a taunt.

    Total agree with it. Before Peo had a speed of 143 and with the turn system, Peo is equally as fast as Douku,Leia or whoever fast toon you could think of. If he moves first, it is the end of the game because of the removal of the turn meter from all enemies. Poe's second skill, to taunt, remove all turn meter and expose all enemies is purely insane in the old speed system. But Royal Guard is another story, douku and sid could easily trigger his taunt and QGJ could possibly remove it. GS, Rey Leia even poe could move before the driod team and I don't see how 3 men with low health could win 5 high speed,DPS or all rounded toons.
  • vincentlondon
    4527 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    at level 7:

    Unyielding Defender – Royal Guard gains 11% Health Up per living ally. In addition, whenever an ally falls below 30% Health, there is a 40% chance Royal Guard will Taunt for 2 turns.


    So it s only 40% chance he taunts at maximum so is not even sure this dude will taunt anyway...

    Also if members of your squads are directly killed or still above 30% health he wont even taunt either so there are a lot of IF for RG to taunt anyway...
    Post edited by vincentlondon on
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    at level 7:

    Unyielding Defender – Royal Guard gains 11% Health Up per living ally. In addition, whenever an ally falls below 30% Health, there is a 40% chance Royal Guard will Taunt for 2 turns.


    So it s only 40% chance he taunts at maximum so is not even sure this dude will taunt anyway...

    Also if members of your squads are directly killed or still above 30% health he wont even taunt either so there are a lot of IF for RG to taunt anyway...

    https://forums.galaxy-of-heroes.starwars.ea.com/discussion/14624/notes-for-2-23-2016-update#latest

    Dawg. Read the patch notes t.t
  • Triqui
    2790 posts Member
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    at level 7:

    Unyielding Defender – Royal Guard gains 11% Health Up per living ally. In addition, whenever an ally falls below 30% Health, there is a 40% chance Royal Guard will Taunt for 2 turns.


    So it s only 40% chance he taunts at maximum so is not even sure this dude will taunt anyway...

    Also if members of your squads are directly killed or still above 30% health he wont even taunt either so there are a lot of IF for RG to taunt anyway...

    You missed the post with the updates that go live this week, didn't you?
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    Qeltar wrote: »
    He's a 2-node mission farm, so even if he's good, only whales are going to use him. By the time any of us can get him to a decent star level, the meta will have shifted again.

    I have him at 58/65 to 5* and I've never farmed him, just had a slew of Bronzium drops.
    Ally Code: 945-699-762
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    Oh thanks for the link. Yes i was not aware of those new changes :|

    Yes it seems abilities of RG will be improved
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    Telaan wrote: »
    All that defense up and taunt will be delicious for QGJ to get the team offense up. I can't wait. I hope people run him.

    not so fast. You would have to remove QGJ from being leader for this.
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    CyciumX wrote: »
    Still hits for nothing, but this might screw a bit with the current meta.

    ....glad he's at 4 for me and can get to 5 easily enough!

    His basic will have 50% stun chance. A stun can save you from receiving 10k damage. Stun is important if the char does something else great.

  • Qeltar
    4326 posts Member
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    Telaan wrote: »
    All that defense up and taunt will be delicious for QGJ to get the team offense up. I can't wait. I hope people run him.

    You read my mind on this one. Everyone seems to think this instant taunt is some sort of automatic game-winner. All I could think was, "okay, move Jinn out of the leader slot, use DPS guys to get someone down to 50% just before Jinn's turn, BOOM".
    I think some folks are in for a rude surprise.
    Quit 7/14/16. Best of luck to all of you.
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    Qeltar wrote: »
    Telaan wrote: »
    All that defense up and taunt will be delicious for QGJ to get the team offense up. I can't wait. I hope people run him.

    You read my mind on this one. Everyone seems to think this instant taunt is some sort of automatic game-winner. All I could think was, "okay, move Jinn out of the leader slot, use DPS guys to get someone down to 50% just before Jinn's turn, BOOM".
    I think some folks are in for a rude surprise.

    So many toons can get stuff popping up to trigger, it's at the point I'm ready to say "darn the torpedoes". Not playing playing him because of QGJ is like saying "don't play GS because of QGJ". Phasma leader or anyone calling GS for an assist gives GS offense up, then QGJ hits him and BOOM.
    You guys had a riot? On account o' me? My very own riot?
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    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    True. So RG will be very good but not op

    Metschina, you yourself claimed that he is going to be the new poe. Rg is not going to make a time bubble, but he certainly is an enabler for many dps, aoe characters as well as for other characters with potent abilities like ability block/offense down.We both know he's going to be OP because every single time a character's hp drops below 50% hp, RG taunts out of turn and saves that character's bacon. This can be done multiple times which is why some people don't see how OP it is, even when you use a toon that can dispel taunt. RG has 17758 hp before including the 11% heath up per ally. That is a ton of hits/specials wasted before RG dies. The only reason why you are saying it is not OP/trying to find reasons why it is not OP is because you have a 5* RG which you want to abuse

    Unavailability is not a valid reason to let OP characters remain as they are.
  • Zekex
    474 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    Qeltar wrote: »
    Telaan wrote: »
    All that defense up and taunt will be delicious for QGJ to get the team offense up. I can't wait. I hope people run him.

    You read my mind on this one. Everyone seems to think this instant taunt is some sort of automatic game-winner. All I could think was, "okay, move Jinn out of the leader slot, use DPS guys to get someone down to 50% just before Jinn's turn, BOOM".
    I think some folks are in for a rude surprise.

    That's assuming you can get a character who's fast enough to move before the enemy team and do just enough damage to not trigger taunt and allow your other fast toons to follow up. And you have to do it for all the enemy characters.And you're assuming nothing happens to your toons while you're carrying out this process.

    A Qgj that's not in the leader slot is an easy prey.One less dps to move before my team.They could also focus fire your QGJ if you don't have RG/QGJ leader

    What about high hp characters?trying to get a character to 50%, and then 0%. Do too little, and you will have trouble one-shotting with the second hit. Do too much and you trigger taunt.

    Multiple passive taunts from a high hp tank is not healthy for the game.
  • Qeltar
    4326 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    The point about him being able to do it multiple times is valid. I hadn't considered that.
    I'm sure people will find ways to make him effective. But I do think it will also be exploited in various ways. Giving Rey a somewhat reliable Offense Up for her first attack is a pretty scary thought. AoEs are also a problem for this setup.
    Anyway it has no real impact for me, I am not likely to start farming him from 2 hard nodes while I am already doing 3 other characters that way. So I may miss the next meta shift. :)
    Quit 7/14/16. Best of luck to all of you.
  • Nonemo
    1656 posts Member
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    I for one will be happy to try out my new shiny 7* crayola next week. ^^

    The HP removal made me sad. But the 5% speed buff whenever an ally is attacked translates into a whole lot of extra speed, especially since so many attacks nowadays can trigger ally assists or double attacks. Not to mention AOE.

    Let's say the opponent throw out one Sid AOE and one GS assist attack. That's +30% turn meter right there, which brings Royal Guard to act next (he's at 75% turn meter when GS acts), with a decent chance to stun the next attacker (even more importantly, he'd act before Poe), possibly changing the entire dynamic of the battle.

    Many mention QGJ being a problem. Yeah, sure. QGJ is always a problem. But there are options for counters, of course. Dooku can rather reliably ability block, for instance.

    Or if you are feeling like walking off the beaten track and adding Asajj Ventress, now that her ability is fixed and ERG will make it at least somewhat harder to one-shot toons. If she's been badly beaten, nothing would be better to remedy that than a fully buffed opponent team.

    I can see good things coming out of this.
  • Qeltar
    4326 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    It's also another mini buff for whales because us non-chromium people will have a hard time getting him to a decent star level even if we want to. I rarely get him even in bronzium packs.
    Anyway, we'll see. I do like the idea of the auto-taunt. I'm not sure having him be able to do it multiple times is great, but realistically, unless it gets dispelled, he's not going to live long even with 17k HP.
    Quit 7/14/16. Best of luck to all of you.
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    Qeltar wrote: »
    It's also another mini buff for whales because us non-chromium people will have a hard time getting him to a decent star level even if we want to. I rarely get him even in bronzium packs.

    Anyway, we'll see. I do like the idea of the auto-taunt. I'm not sure having him be able to do it multiple times is great, but realistically, unless it gets dispelled, he's not going to live long even with 17k HP.

    That's unfortunate for us, agreed.With 17k hp, if he can eat two assists/specials for me, it's good enough. Otherwise they're probably going to take 3 or more shots to finish him.

  • vincentlondon
    4527 posts Member
    edited February 2016
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    I think we should try to start starring him
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    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    True. So RG will be very good but not op
    Zekex wrote: »
    Triqui wrote: »
    Zekex wrote: »
    He is going to be the new Poe, you hear it here first

    no worries, like the new poe, it will be nerfed/reworked/rebalanced soon.

    He is a much tougher farm than Poe though. I don't think most of the players are able to abuse him for a while.

    He can't do a time bubble at the fastest speed either. Taunt was not the reason why Poe was strong. It was because of the ability to move your entire team before enemy blinked

    True. So RG will be very good but not op

    Metschina, you yourself claimed that he is going to be the new poe. Rg is not going to make a time bubble, but he certainly is an enabler for many dps, aoe characters as well as for other characters with potent abilities like ability block/offense down.We both know he's going to be OP because every single time a character's hp drops below 50% hp, RG taunts out of turn and saves that character's bacon. This can be done multiple times which is why some people don't see how OP it is, even when you use a toon that can dispel taunt. RG has 17758 hp before including the 11% heath up per ally. That is a ton of hits/specials wasted before RG dies. The only reason why you are saying it is not OP/trying to find reasons why it is not OP is because you have a 5* RG which you want to abuse

    Unavailability is not a valid reason to let OP characters remain as they are.

    Lol, you foiled my evil plan
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    Reyia wrote: »
    Hopefully we are not Royally Disappointed when the patch is released.

    Set your puns to Guard.
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    Hopefully RG does not become OP. It is strange to see such a massive buff. 100% to taunt is already pretty extreme but then they are also giving him stun on his basic. I'm a little concerned.

    Will the new meta be tanky AOE types plus RG? The damage dealers can not be one shot but will fall below 50%, triggering RG. This type of team may be able to deal with the high speed high DPS teams currently dominating.

    Then there may be other options to deal with the tanky AOE. Possibly droid+GS teams that include Ig100. His new counter will be useful against teams utilizing AOE especially with HK leader ability, and his offense down debuff. Plus he gives another AOE to hit behind RG.

    Or possibly other counter teams.

    Maybe we will finally get to a rock/paper/scissors situation.
    But right now I'm a little worried.
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